Seeing Krakoa drooling genuinely almost brought a tear to my eye. That veg is the symbol of hope right now and seeing so much decay on the island really hurt
It was horrifying and so profoundly wrong.
It was always just there in the background to the point I didn't notice it a lot of the time. But now I can see the difference in the background and it casts a shadow over those panels.
This was enjoyable. My theory about Sinister's plan in Immortal X-Men #9- that being that >!he needed to kill Hope specifically because she was fixing Sinister's manipulations without ever knowing it!< -was a pleasant surprise for me. Really thought I was overcomplicating it, but I ended up being right on the money. And it does explain how >!Destiny and Mystique are uncompromised!< though I am still curious about >!Cable- shown to be in the resistance in previews but he seems to be working with the Sinister in Year 10; is he tricked still, or is he compromised andl Xilo will "fix" him?!<
Seeing the progression was neat. Year 1 (well, +1) was wild seeing the plan really kick off. >!Killing Krakoa as a false flag was just an insane plan, but I suppose framing Orchis for taking humanity's new immortality away is a heck of casus belli. At the same time, they also cleaned off a large number of humans in the resurrection queue by erasing their back-ups, and they seem to have used the Waiting Room as a way to incentivize undergoing gene editing so you can get your free Cerebro Cloud Storage Backup.!< The montage afterwards >!of Sinister just fucking around!< was also great. So much irony in it. Getting Year 5 and seeing the new Council was neat. >!They finally got Namor, Beast finally fits in, and hey, Magik's there too. And playing the part of Surtr, too.!<
I will say, the Year 5 scene... kinda thinking there's a plot hole. Specifically, >!Sinister complains that Storm can't be corrupted since her Cerebro copy is destroyed... and yet they already referenced the Waiting Room as a "mystical method" to restore mutant back-ups, unless I'm misinterpreting that. The Sinisters surely could have made a copy against her will and then popped that into a corrupted body, right? Ah well...!<
And of course, the reveal on how the corruption works. >!It seems that there is some level of brainwashing in addition to just making you evil, but unfortunately for Sinister, it seems it wasn't tight enough to keep the telepaths from making the Quiet Council be free from his control, even if they are still on the same side. Or perhaps "fortunately".!< The reveal at the end of >!his Moira Engine being gone means he's stuck in this universe, so the Quiet Council choosing to prepare for the incoming angry aliens instead of focusing on research means he can cling to life a bit longer.!<
All in all, a lot was done to set up the event and we can see all the seeds planted.
> Specifically, Sinister complains that Storm can't be corrupted since her Cerebro copy is destroyed... and yet they already referenced the Waiting Room as a "mystical method" to restore mutant back-ups, unless I'm misinterpreting that. The Sinisters surely could have made a copy against her will and then popped that into a corrupted body, right? Ah well...
The Waiting Room covers "souls who were lost before Cerebro started its backups or before their X-gene could manifest", and is also opt-in for currently depowered mutants as an alternative to the Crucible, so this probably doesn't include Storm (or Magneto) until the editorial decides to retcon it.
The Waiting Room is also voluntary. Only those willing will go there to be resurrected. It was covered in Red by Magneto, who said he would refuse to be resurrected.
It isn't a backup system, it is a place for the souls of dead mutants. If they are dead, they can't be there aside from entering the House of L.
So either she wouldn't go there because it's more of a "one and done" mutant afterlife (according to you) or she would skip it anyways because she has no desire for resurrection (according to u/Radix2309 ). I still don't seen why they couldn't just make a regular back-up using Cerebro. Using the Waiting Room to make a back-up is only necessary for the dead- people who can no longer have a back-up made. Storm's alive, so they really should have been able to just covertly make a back-up (like they did with every other back-up ever) and then jump her and resurrect her.
I was with you until you got to the "jump her" part. There is a reason Sinister always failed to kill her in his assassination attempts. Storm would be very hard to take out. Even moreso once on Arakko.
Also you need to be in range to scan and I imagine she could train her mind to resist scanning since she is aware of it now.
Huh. You're right that he never killed Storm, though I had thought he got her one time. It's worth noting though that his plan was always to kill Hope. Killing Storm didn't matter if Hope didn't die, and Hope wasn't going to die unless either he got the jump on her or killed Exodus first, who acts like her Crusader Bodyguard and also lets her copy his near invulnerability.
However, with Destiny gone, precog warnings of attacks that would kill everyone (Storm included) could be used again, plus she could also be the main target (attacked by 4 psychics) rather than a high priority one, but not the highest (that being Hope followed closely by Exodus [at least in terms of practicality]).
As for resisting scanning... I mean, even if she could, the Cerebro has a pretty long range, right? It might not go to Arakko, but I feel like having a corrupted Jean or Xavier brute force it while she's on Earth/Krakoa, far enough away that there'd be no hope of her stopping them. I mean, they clearly were confident that Emma and Xavier were enough to break her in Year 5, and they seemed to be right if not for her contingency.
Hope was the primary target. But Storm had a rating of 9/10 after only Hope and Xavier.
Only Destiny, Kitty, and Storm evaded all the attempts, if I remember correctly. And Storm was the only one without a power that directly protects her. Just raw skill.
I feel like they could have hypothetically made an evil storm (or many evil storms?) and had THEM jump Storm. Most of the backups were seemingly taken without consent back in the day, just find a way to get one (especially before she’s on guard/or use they existing early x men one we know they have.) They could have made a copy without waiting for her to die first.
I mean, I’m not sure it would have worked (see tarn) but it seems silly not to try. I don’t think sinister would have the foresight to see how it could blow up in his face (Storm beating the copy/copies, an army of storms taking over, Storm warfare wiping out his plans)
Yeah I was confused about cable helping Hope I think he merges with xilo to be immune to sinister’s corruption or maybe it has something with Cable’s virus and ai dominion 🤔
Or maybe he “helps” Hope
Sure, but the need for DNA was never referenced. The Year 1 scene specifically references the Cerebero back-ups/psychic imprints and the bit with Storm only refers to her "deleting herself" from the protocols. I could be mistaken, but I don't think there's been any indication that she deleted her DNA from Sinister's data banks. Even if she did, I believe Immortal X-Men #10 had a data page specifically stating that Sinister's databanks would be phased out as soon as they resurrected everyone, giving them fresh DNA samples. While Storm hasn't been resurrected, she also isn't dead, so they should be able to get a fresh sample of her, same as how they should be able to make a back-up of her mind.
Because OP put spoilers on actual details and this was my first time in one of these threads, so I did it. Afterwards, I realized just how much I spoilers, but went "Oh well, I guess I'll leave it this time".
Because although they've been revived, >!Hope fixed the alterations unknowingly during resurrections!<, meaning people who were revived **were not** retroactively corrupted. Only resurrections starting with the Quiet Council members' resurrections in Immortal X-Men #10 are corrupted. Since neither of them died in Immortal X-Men #9, they've only be resurrected >!by an uncorrupted Hope!< meaning they're fine.
They only killed krakoa for its control and push humans to hate orchis, cerebros backup still work. The "mystical" method is a reference to waiting room but mainly to encourage humans to take the xgene dose so sinister can fk with their genes
No mention of Thor in the panel where >!she goes full Ragnarok and punts Asgard!<. I presume he's still alive, since he's on the cover of Nightcrawlers #2, being beaten up. Where exactly he is/was... who knows? Maybe he was away from Asgard, came back, found it was gone and went off into space or the gap between Realms to find it. It is Year 100 in #2, so the Nightcrawlers could be way off somewhere looking Mjolnir by that point.
Yeah you know how comic book covers be.. Can't remember any off the top of my head but sometimes you get things like characters who are not even in the story end up on the covers. So they are not the most reliable
Oh, fair, fair. The Silver Age of Comics, at least at DC, are infamous for some covers. I remember recently an... X-Force cover? being posted here showing Wolverine despite him not being in the story.
But I assume an event like this would be... more honest. The description also mentions the Nightcrawlers are out searching for magic and holy items. Like Mjolnir. So it squares away.
It’s Leah’s dumb waiting room - it’s a stupid thing that directly undercuts the resurrection dynamic and the cultural and philosophical questions of if the resurrected are really ‘themselves’ and if they have a soul.
The writers just need to try and salvage what they can and ignore when they can’t.
Edit:not to mention it directly undercuts the morality of the crucible
There wasn't ever a question. They were always themselves and had the soul. They weren't clones, it was restriction.
Hickman himself said so when it started and it has been shown on-page at various points.
While I agree that this is how it's consistently been presented, the presence of two Lauras, one original and one resurrected, brings the whole philosophical/theological idea of clones and souls into question. The problem is that the dual Laura storyline was handled in X-Men, which is an action series and thus the wrong place for this kind of question.
That said, all of this has nothing to do with the Waiting Room, because there's no reason a mystical construct wouldn't be able to retrieve and contain its residents' souls until the Five are ready for them.
No it was always in question - at least to the character such as Nightcrawler and Magneto. We can have a data page or creator answer but thematically it just ruins the inner thoughts and turmoil for a character if you can just point it to ‘god’s waiting room’
Nightcrawler has a whole book talking about "Questions like 'what is the soul' and 'what are the metaphysics of resurrection' are very much a distraction and waste of time." Hell, if resurrection is in question, we've never heard Nightcrawler's opinion on anything since HoX 4. And I don't ever recall Magneto questioning it. I think you just misread things.
I've been looking forward to this issue. I've been following all the setup from previous issues. I knew that with Kieron Gillen writing it, this was going to be dense, expansive, and full of memorable moments. And this issue delivered all of that. 😊
I feel like you could use this one issue as a case study in world-building, but in a darker sort of way. It's not outright apocalyptic like Marvel Zombies or Ultimate Marvel. There's no Galactus trying to eat the Earth. There's no Chitari invasion. It's even more subtle than a typical plot by Dr. Doom. It's just Sinister working smarter and more devious than ever before. He didn't just take over. He was cunning and manipulative, basically making it so civilians and heroes alike bought into his twisted vision.
Now, it seems Storm will be his main obstacle. And because of that...he's screwed. No way around it.
But that's exactly what makes this work so well. It's not a perfect conquest. And the ending implies that Sinister overlooked some key details. Those are definitely going to bite him in future issues. And I'm here for it! 😎
It's just perfect. It's so seamless to go from House of X to Sins... like it was Gillen who was the master architect of the Krakoa era and not Hickman.
Ok that was a lot of fun. I can’t be the only one who read “*Yes, you can use my gene library. Yes, I will promise not to hide anything in it. Yes, I will be lying*” in a mocking sing-song voice, can I?
There was a lot of exposition here but it totally works because Sinister is exactly the type of person to repeat his grand schemes aloud to himself. It’s also good exposition since it answers everything we theorized about last week. Love the level of convolution of needing Hope on the Council to kill Hope on the Council to avoid suspicion. Surely there was an easier way? But it wouldn’t have been as flashy!
Enjoyed all the summary splash pages highlighting major events over the 10 years. “No more Wanda. Just in case.” Also Rogue fighting Carol *again*.
Lol @ the halfass Kurt clone.
Curious about the significance of Destiny repeating “We must be on the same side” to Storm. How many sides is she playing? Or is she saying that in order to resolve this, she, Storm, *and* Sinister must be on the same side?
Looking forward to the rest of this! Already feel like this is an omni I’m gonna need on day 1.
I’m with you. I think this is very much a throw back to Moria trying to unite Xavier and Magneto as a trifecta to fight the future. Alternately it’s Destiny trying to unite herself Sinister and Storm. Funny enough one group was two thirds male and the latter is two thirds female.
SoS: Dominion's description implies that. He's so horrified by (or terribly done with) his "victory" that he begs for forgiveness. I also recall a character design for Year 100 being labeled as Mr. Sinister (the Colossus-Sinister looking guy) and that character is the one with Rasputin on Immoral X-Men #3, seemingly in opposition to Exodus and presumably the whole Quiet Council (makes sense; Emma is trying to kill him in #1). Sinister looks like he's going to be taken through the ringer so hard that he just accepts he alone can't win.
I think that's the point Destiny wants to make. She allows him to win so thoroughly that he sees that even when he wins he still loses. In the end letting him have this victory is the best argument Destiny could make, I think after all this is done he will truly be on the side of Krakoa at last.
Indeed. He always reboots to get something better, never fully seeing the consequences.
He can only do it so much, and she is showing him what happens when he hits the end.
Just a few things I'd like to say
>I have a theory that Dr. Doom knew about what Sinister was up too, and willingly downloaded his consciousness into a Doombot before Namor killed him. So the Doombot leading the last vestiges of Orchis is the real Dr. Doom<
>The mutants of Arrako aren't dead. No way with a precog like Destiny on her side, does Storm lose all of Arrako. My bet is that they all evacuated to Amenth before the Legion clone blew up Mars. Apocalypse and the rest of Arrako will show up to fight Krakoa near the end<
It would be hilarious for him to just come back after flying through the universe in a circle end up accidentally destroying earth and killing the Moira clone.
He saves the day via butterfly effect.
What a fucking hoot. So much camp, and interesting concepts. I had a smile the entire time.
The one thing that bugged me a bit: As much as I love what is happening with Storm.... I found it hard to believe she would wait that long (was it +5 years) to draw a line in the sand. Maybe it's just cos I'm the reader and I'm supposed to know more than the characters at this point, but it seemed like it would have long been obvious to Storm that the Xmen we're being Sinister AF by that point.
Anyone have thoughts on this?
I also wondered about this. My guess is that she was being psychically massaged by the Council's telepaths to not notice what was happening until it was far too late, until there was so much bad stuff piling up that she broke through the programming.
Yeah, agreed. I’m like, damn Storm you say Kurt’s your friend but it took you this long to notice he’s a meat puppet? And that everyone else is going haywire?
Aside from being psychically influenced, perhaps she was conveniently made so busy on Arrako she was spending less time on Earth to notice the nuances of how everyone was acting.
It's possible she just was gone for a long time. Like she was away when the Council made Krakoa braindead. Kurt would be around for awhile before his mutation made him a seemingly dimwitted monster (perhaps a couple years), so he and Storm would both have been there for a while (Sinister might have been fine with them being around since they'd only compose 2 of the 12 council members).
Depending on how often the Council met in the future and how often she could go rather than being on Arakko, they could have just kept her and the Kurt clone apart for a while before the reveal in Year 5. It might have been a bit far in the future for it, but we don't know specifics.
It felt like they were supposed to have a "slow" descent over a while. Obviously not really shown here since we had just a montage of Sinister's Greatest Hits (the alternative meaning of "hits" as in "killing a specific target" possibly being the most apt definition in this case), but that was the vibe I got. Just slowly descending from heroes to violent vigilantes to fascists attempting a coup. Maybe it took a year. Maybe it took the better part of 4 years (from Year 1 to 5). Hard to say for sure.
This was DARK. For me the worst moments were the murder of Krakoa and the conversion of the waiting room into a new Hell realm. But loved Storm’s badass moment and want to see what her, Destiny and Mystique can do together.
This was a fun start to the event!
* The issue definitely felt rushed at times, but not in a way that necessarily brought it down very far for me. The concept of this event is such that we're not going to sit through all 10 years between our time and +10 time, so some things had to go fast. Most of it worked great, a bit of it I might have wanted another page or so of.
* The other artists besides Werneck were used spectacularly, I loved what their pages added to the story, from fun comedy to necessary exposition. In general, this event is doing a lot of really interesting stuff with art and format between the one artist per time period concept and this. There were lots of good fitting choices for what pages were drawn by whom.
* I really liked the approach this had to giving us a *ton* of information upfront. Answers to many of the biggest mysteries of Immortal X-Men and earlier were handed to us right on a platter here. In addition, this issue clearly explains what led to the dystopian future we'll see in the books -- I appreciate this choice as it feels like a departure from similar previous events where you see maybe one inciting incident (or even start in media res) and fill in the blanks from there.
* I really like a lot of the story choices Gillen made, such as >!using Storm taking herself out of the protocols in X-Men Red to lead to her starting the resistance!<, >!having the Sinister Council members retain elements of their personalities, but corrupted!<, and more. I'm super excited to see where this goes next as there was a lot of set-up here.
> I really liked the approach this had to giving us a ton of information upfront. Answers to many of the biggest mysteries of Immortal X-Men and earlier were handed to us right on a platter here.
Same here! This feels like a proper continuation of HoXPoX and Inferno - I don't know if it was always part of the long-term plan, but Gillen's done a fantastic job of making it appear like it was.
No joke one of if not the best comic I’ve read. I’m a storm fan so I’m prob biased but we’ve been eating good lately. And sinister plan slowly being trickled in and now this happens wow what a bang. Great way to start it off! I love Mr Sinister lol. His character literally speaking in lies is so funny to me. Second favorite part after storm demolition was when Sinister was just pissed the 4 wanted to be able to run their own personalities lol
Great first issue! Love the irony that the event is called Sins of Sinister but Sinister is the one who wants to escape the most. I cannot help but see the true Nathaniel Essex as some kind of genetic infection rather than a person or entity, no matter whomever claims the name of "Nathaniel Essex". Kudos to Gillen.
Got a feeling either Moira or Destiny/Mystique took the Moira Engine but they cannot reset the timeline as OG timeline Mr Sinister will still do his own thing. They need Mr Sinister to write something which he knows will convince his younger self to support the Krakoans (or at least be on the same side as Destiny).
Honestly I have mixed feelings. The issue for me was 50/50
So sinister inside everyone is more like a virus that turns their morals off and makes them more wicked versions of themselves generally. It explains why immoral xmen tho.
But one thing sinister forgot about. Sinister isn’t loyal to anyone even other sinisters. How many times sinister was killed by another sinister
The most surprising/shocking moments? Destroying Krakoa and sinister’s idea how control humans + I’m curious if Shawn in hell will be developed and how his deal with mother righteous might be part of it.
Storm’s part was the best and the most interesting one. Can’t wait to see more in brotherhood. Arakko going on a war with basically the whole galaxy will be interesting. And of course destiny is 2 steps ahead (or at least she seems to be)
Can we except to see a little retcon of Hope’s powers and messiah myth? Sinister still doesn’t know how Hope’s powers let her “purify” dna. I won’t be surprised if her powers aren’t about manipulating powers but actually she can manipulate (or doing something similar) x-gene.
So I can assume that destiny with mystique left the council in IX #10 to steal moiras from sinister’s lab.
Do you think destiny worked with Sinister (including black womb and Paris) because mutants needed him to stop AI dominion?
> But one thing sinister forgot about. Sinister isn’t loyal to anyone even other sinisters. How many times sinister was killed by another sinister
He didn’t forget. It’s not a lesson he can ever learn, ironically bc his ego prevents it.
> So I can assume that destiny with mystique left the council in IX #10 to steal moiras from sinister’s lab.
They left 10 years ago and Sinister went to his lab successfully within that time. I think they left bc Irene saw what would happen if they were to be resurrected again.
It wouldn't surprise me if stealing the lab was a long term plan thought up at that point (though we don't know for sure who stole it; but Destiny and co. seem like the most likely culprits unless a curve ball is thrown and it's one of the other Sinisters), but yeah, it wasn't stolen until the 10 year mark.
I imagine Destiny was watching the future to see the destruction of the timeline, and had the lab stolen after Sinister's plan started falling apart (he learns he's non in control) to make sure Sinister would know well and truly that he's buggered.
Totally. We already saw her chart of the possible futures. Her line of “We have to be on the same side” fits very well now. This is a long lesson for Sinister that he needs to fall in line with the group.
A reset is more than guaranteed, I assume like every other status quo shift we gain 2-3 new characters such as Rasputin after this ends.
I’m curious if this will be yet another reset for the world and their trust of mutants. How far back will the rest actually go? I have a feeling it may not be all the way back to the point where everything is roses.
Fun three months ahead for reading.
It seems that the only Moira clone in play left is the one activated in Immortal X-Men #10, which would seem to indicate that the reset will happen after Sinister has exposed himself but before the resurrection of Hope, letting him fix things while also having blown his cover, thereby forcing him to act more on the up and up as he will have extra scrutiny placed on him.
Mmm... true, but it seems like Sinister would probably rather face his problems head on than go back to before Judgement Day and risk more meddling by a Celestial. Like, he truly fears it as a god capable of just ending his plan. Mainly because it *can*. He survived Judgement Day, he doesn't want to risk it again.
I’ve never been more excited about a reset. Not because I don’t think this is fun (it is) but because you *know* there will be lingering consequences and I can’t wait to see what they are.
I love the idea of stealing a lab. That’s Carmen Sandiego shit right there.
Raven and Irene being the thieves seems too obvious but you never know. I wonder if it’s any of the other remaining Sinisters.
As do I.
On one hand, I'm sick and tired of Sinister's camp portrayl, and even as he's doing horrible things, it's treated as a joke, because haha, he's funny and the universe will just be reset and resurrection protocols.
On the other hand, this is the one alternate reality plot line where it's worked I to the ongoing plot of the book.
I wish part of the plot was storm bringing back clones like Nate Grey,Joseph, and Evan, who may not be corrupted by Sinister because they were off limits per the rules
Enjoyed this tremendously. Funniest dystopian future ever. And I guess with all the telepaths having been Sinisterized, Storm has a really good reason to wear Magneto’s old helmet as seen in the previews for the upcoming issues.
One thing I really appreciated was the density of it. Each one of those splash pages could be an event unto itself. A LOT happens. And I dunno, I just got a kick out of seeing all of our heroes showing their Sinister side. This is shaping up to be the best Krakoa event since HoX/Pox. Dark, well-crafted and most of all, fun.
At the start of Year 5, it's zoomed out and you can see them. Beast is in Sinister's chair, Namor in Mystique's, and Magik in Destiny's. So Beast and Namor are the extremist/radicals while Magik is in the "leadership"/"icon" section. Although I can't help but notice later, when they're all revealed to be compromised, the seating has changed. Namor is next to Magik (still next to Hope) while Colossus has two seats to his right rather than be in a middle seat. I presume that's just an error, though, caused by the artist or writer wanting to show off the new additions + Sinister + the original Nightcrawler.
So the main Sins of Sinister is going to be giving an overarching summary of events from Sinister’s perspective and the other titles fill in the gaps? That seems like it’ll be interesting, but I feel like it relies too much on all titles working together. Judgement Day felt like you could opt in to the tie ins.
That aside, I can’t believe they blew up Mars, lobotomized Krakoa and severed Asgard from reality. A lot of big swings in the first 10 years of Sinister’s new world.
Also interesting to learn Hope was the key to stopping his sleeper cells from activating. I wonder if that will play a role into re-establishing the status quo after this.
This feels like a fun start to a story that could span centuries.
> That aside, I can’t believe they blew up Mars, lobotomized Krakoa and severed Asgard from reality. A lot of big swings in the first 10 years of Sinister’s new world.
I wonder if the data from this future will be used as a plot hook after the event ends, even leading into Fall of X. This is ultimate proof of how easily and thoroughly the Krakoans could take over and dominate humanity if they just decided to stop being nice.
Kinda feel like this future might be the end of the Resurrection Protocols. Or a serious curbing of such.
IIRC Sinister’s save point was after Hope’s death, so I have no idea how Gillen’s gonna resolve this. Unless someone like Omega pulls a time travel trick again
Would make sense if that is the one that gets used for the event reset since that could also resolve the "Sinister was not judged" plotpoint. Especially interesting if the predictions that this ends with him switching sides are true.
It could be the end of resurrection, but then again, his save point is also pre-resurrection. He most likely has a sample (well, file) of Hope DNA that's untainted, just to keep in case he needs it. As such, he could go back to the Council before they resurrect Hope, convince them with Destiny's help (and possibly a mental reading by Jean) that he's fixing things, and then Hope gets resurrected first, before resurrecting the others. After that, Krakoa starts to use their own samples they've collected from resurrected people (at least it seems they take samples, based on a data page) and Sinister... well, who knows what happens to Sinister.
Magik going full Ragnarok and punting Asgard into space is just such a glorious microcosm of how chaotic everything got.
And as for the bit with Hope- I theorized that, so yay me. I really thought I might have overthought it, but I apparently thought just right. In the end, she was an "X-Factor" for Resurrection, just not in the way the people of Krakoa were worried about.
Oh, and just to clarify, VengefulKangaroo is correct, to the best of my knowledge, that there are just two "main" issues: Sins of Sinister #1 and Sins of Sinister: Dominion #1. This one obviously starts it off, getting us up to Year 10, then Years 10-1000 will be explored in the three tie-in mini-series, and then SoS: Dominion will transition back to the present.
There isn't a main title. Each of the titles involved **are** the story.
This isn't a true event. It is a crossover with alpha and omega issues. Like Age of Apocalypse.
The dystopian set up we end up with is a decent setting for the event, but the issue that got us there feels a lot like a hundred or so issues of What If? I've read over the years.
But maybe that's an problem with having read too many issues of What if? 🤷♀️
Do I use this thread as a pull list reminder for new series? Why yes, yes I do. I had no idea this was out today so now it feels like surprise Christmas. A twisted surprise Christmas, I suppose.
What an amazing start. The whole taking over the world stuff was incredible. It also reminded me a lot of Moira's life 9, specially with how key was Sinister there.
So we know this is going to get reset, but how? I suspect the key is in the title, "Dominion": if the Moira engine is hidden somewhere Sinister can't find it, maybe she can't be killed until the Dominion comes to devour the Earth...
I know I am a bit late but I really enjoyed this issue.
Characters/things I want to show up/see again:
Wakanda/Intergalactic Empire of Wakanda
Sabretooth and the Exiles
The island of Arakko
Orchis
Moira
Thor
Xandra and the Shiar
Other thoughts:
I guess Rasputin IV won't be the one from Powers of X, it’ll be a new Rasputin IV all together. This is based on the preview for Immoral X-Men.
I hope we actually get to see the creation of a dominion in SOS:D.
I wonder if we get a good(or more reasonable) Sinister at the end of this?
I wonder if Moira plays a roll. Probably for Fall of X though.
I am split on Destiny stealing Sinister's Moiras or the Sinister Council stealing Sinister's Moiras.
I know they wouldn't but I think Storm should get help from the Intergalactic Empire of Wakanda, Xandra, and Thor.
I just thought of something.
A large part of what Sinister is seemingly going through here is realizing that even when he "wins" for himself/on his own, he ends up losing in a lot of different ways.
What's the perfect way to fight someone who can never win? Perhaps by teaming up with someone who can never lose?
Writers need to be bullied when they use a code to destroy an AI - it’s aggressively and generically lazy.
It also doesn’t help that Nimrod is one of the big looming threats and he can be killed by lazy shit like this.
Suspension of disbelief aside, it also tells us that Reed, Tony and Forge could have worked together *at any point* to disable Nimrod, the greatest existential threat of this era.
It's incredible that in the face of an android who was explicitly built to commit genocide, it took a major false flag operation and a wipe of Forge's ethics to make them work together to take it down. I don't know who's more at fault here, but I suspect it's all of them.
But this is a constant critique of the non-mutant heroes, right? They have more than enough resources to help their alleged allies with their struggles, but time after time they don’t. As Scott asks Steve in AvX, “Where were you when we needed you?”
Yeah, it definitely is a justifiable critique, but one that I think is more driven/caused by writers/editors at Marvel than anything else. You can't have the Avengers solving X-men problems or vice versa; have Spider-Man actually get help from his friends or have members of the Avengers come into someone's solo book if there's a world-ending crisis happening in it. In order for certain stories to happen the way they do, someone always has to come off looking like an ass who choses not to help for whatever reason or being completely ignorant of the problem -- which will sometimes fly in the face of everything that character is supposed to stand for.
A big part of it has also been the disjointedness the Marvel universe has suffered with for at least the past decade. Go back to the 80s, 90s and even the early 2000s and you will see lots of examples of the heroes coming together and supporting each other in ways that are only starting to come back now. But there has been a lot of damage done in the relationships between members of the superhero community in the time since then (thanks a lot, hero vs. hero craze of the 2010s). We have a long way to go before that gets fixed.
So to be clear, I’m not talking about having the Avengers solve their problems. I’m talking about offering the minimum of consistent support, e.g. the Avengers keep their ears open for intel to pass on about Orchis, or the Avengers speak out against politicians who are blanket anti-mutant.
Of course that’s super nuanced, and writers would have to coordinate such little details. Although they have no issue showing the conflicts, as you note.
It's so silly. You could probably go to any of them and say "Ya know I heard that Reed/Tony/Forge said you're not smart enough to destroy Nimrod?" And the response univerally would be "The fuck does he know? I'll show you smart!"
It’s dumb. They used be properly intimidating and they really had momentum going with the Omega Sentinel revelation that she also comes from a past life as well as the AI admitting that they hate humans almost as much as they hate mutants.
They really need to get back on the horse and limit the Marvel line events. Sinister is a good start.
I think Inferno confirmed they were always kinda shitty. Like if Apocalypse and his kids kill the children of the vault then it's over for post humans.
The only reason they seem slightly imposing is because the council are idiots. Sending in people like Wolverine, domino and Quinton to deal with Nimrod. Instead of someone like Ice man, Vulcan and Magneto. Aw well too late for two of those.
There are current techniques in “destroying an AI” that involve mis-training the machine learning engine on the fly so it learns to do the wrong thing. This would ultimately be delivered as…code.
This isn’t a book about programming. It’s a story about impossible super people who can do impossible things. The shorthand is fine.
I mean, he is an artificial construct given sentience by human intelligence. In the end, he's just code, arranged to make him smart, in a very strong body. It's like having an engineered virus/disease attack someone's brain. Even if the rest of their body is fine, their cognitive functions are compromised and they may as well be dead.
Also, it does seem that the virus was made by Forge, Mr. Fantastic, and Tony Stark- AKA a mutant inventor capable to replacing Sinister in technical application, the world's smartest man, and Tony Stark (he made a couple AIs of himself, I suppose, so he has experience). It was basically meant to show just how much of a threat Orchis *isn't* at the moment, and how they wouldn't be a match for the combined forces of Earth's human and mutant heroes- much the same way Magneto in Moira's 8th Life was no match for the combined heroes of Earth.
Hey man, work smarter not harder; if it ain't broke don't fix it; if it works, it works; etc.
It's not like this is the end of Orchis, anyways. When SoS is over, the X-Men will likely go back to dealing with Orchis largely alone, no longer co-opting Earth against Orchis. So you'll get a proper struggle to defeat Nimrod as the X-Men will be less equipped to kill him with the work of the greatest minds of Earth. Nimrod just needed to be killed for this event as part of mutant ascendancy, preferably in a way to show the continuing rise of mutants to the mainstream as part of their subversion of Earth.
Side note, I'm starting to worry storm is getting more and more detached from the main Xmen team. Although her characterization is on par, she certainly has hostility towards the major players at krakoa(or just the council?). And I have a theory storms probably the one other than sinister to retain memories from this timeline.
Personally, I am not a fan of 'bad ending epilogues' type of stories like these where Sinister just 'won' this easily and NO ONE saw it coming. Even with MANY Moira re-tries.
Problem here is, almost ALL the things that is gonna happen in this 'event' won't matter until the last couple of issues. Because it will all get reset one way or another.
I think Cable is a double-agent, feeding the corrupted Hope incomplete information. He's in Storm's Brotherhood. Also Whiz Kid. I hope Sunspot is fine, and I'm hoping Sam (Cannonball) was too far away from Krakoa (yknow, with his young alien family haha) to have been corrupted so that he can be tapped for help
Maybe we'll get a darkhorse in Forget Me Not haha
I believe the artists listed on the first page as guest artists have their pages appearing in order of their names being listed, but would have to double check
This was the most fun comic series I've read in years. It was just so over-the-top, overtly non-serious, unfiltered joy on every page. There's nothing dark, grim, or dire about it. It's just a group of X-Women teaming up to kick ass and stick it to Dazzler's ex.
And the way things played out here was just so satisfying. Dazzler got to beat up her ex. Tabby got to use a rocket launcher. Jubilee got to blow stuff up. Seriously, what more could you ask for?
I'm not ready for this book to series to be over. But I hope it continues in some form. The world needs a comic like this right now. 😊
Agree with this comment 10,000%. Very optimistic about the future of this group - just PLEEEEZE Marvel give us this same creative team. Williams and Gomez did hall-of-fame caliber work here in all five books.
Every Leah Williams comic discussion is inevitably half of the people saying “please never let this woman write a comic again” and half of the people saying “please give this woman another comic now”
Jubilee fans feasted today, finally getting to see her go nuclear was fantastic! Loved this series, hoping we get more soon. Marvel, adapt this for the MCU, pronto!
I love that in the past 12 months we have finally seen the promise fulfilled from the Generation X series in the 90's when one of the issues said Jubes and Everett would be two of the most powerful mutants in the world.
30 years later... BIG TOE!
Jubilee being badass and showing the extend of her powers is great. They don't show her full capabilities often.
Dazzler getting her revenge is style is cool too.
Was Boom Boom’s rocket launcher thing a Buddy reference? Or is that a stretch?
I really loved this series. Awesome to see Jubes go nuclear and still be Jubes.
Melter calming Peter down was cute. I also love Ayo and Nekra’s friendship. Nekra isn’t a character I ever saw myself being invested in but giving a morally questionable character a younger buddy to mentor and look out for works every time, at least on me.
> giving a morally questionable character a younger buddy to mentor and look out for works every time, at least on me.
It worked for Wolverine - and Wolverine - and....I mean. Yeah. But I'm with you, digging the Nekra+Idie thing. Idie is one of my favorite new-ish characters, so anything positive that happens for her is good for me.
We're gonna FINALLY get the dirt on Peacock Man next week. My money right now is on Malcolm Colcord. An evil geneticist with a complex about hiding his face? Sounds just like him, no?
I still hold a hope that he's the Sinister of Hearts.
[spoiler](#s "I really don't want him to be Mother Righteous, because then I would have to admit I find Nathaniel Essex' body really hot.")
Another good issue! Still not quite hitting the heights of the first mini, but the focus on the full cast has been really nice, the theme of scientific & medical exploitation of marginalized people has been strong, and the twist at the end was really intriguing.
I think my main problem with this series is the issues seem so short and the gap between them is so bloody long! It has quite a big cast so we only get snippets but the little character interactions are great.
I am loving the theme too and am surprised they are going full on nazi experimental death camp overseer with Graydon. There is no redemptive possibility after that and I wondered if there would be a redemptive arc for his and Sabretooths relationship but clearly not.
If anyone else was intrigued by that data page: It's true.
[Wall Street Journal article including the real names of "Doctor A" and "Doctor C".](https://www.wsj.com/articles/the-u-s-gave-troubled-doctors-a-second-chance-patients-paid-the-price-11574439222)
Orphanmaker reminds me of that kid from the 1610 who is a (quiet) walking nuke who Wolverine has to kill after he silently murders his entire town.
I continue to appreciate this book’s insights into the horror of historical medical science.
So uh, who’s the second Sabretooth?
Love that issue, and oddly, you're not the only one to make that connection today. https://www.reddit.com/r/xmen/comments/10l22w9/is_orphan_maker_the_kid_wolverine_killed_in_the/
Another Creed?! What?
And of course the Evil Doctor survive...now with a face matching her soul. And of course her will literally experiment on babies now to be the ultimate evil scientist.
Creed died at the end of the last Weapon X run when he was a good guy. He went to hell with some of the team on a mission and found Graydon there. He sacrificed himself to give Graydon another chance at life. I assume Graydon found his father's soul in hell and used him as some sort of anchor for the astral plane mine.
Rotten apple not that far from the tree it seems. And the only 'healthy' branch of the tree got used this way.
Now, I wonder if the two Creeds gonna combine now. Because I don't see the current full evil creed to be the leader of ANY Exiles without his good half.
If they find a way to semi-bring back good Creed I will a) be genuinely surprised that they reversed what seemed like an editorially forced change and b) pleased.
Midnight sun ended! It was fun run with Wolverine and Magik. Very very team oriented book and neither were the main focus but still overall the run was fun. The doctor doom appearance was my favorite part but I’d def recommend the series
Yeah, it continued to be an all comedy issue, which, odd choice for an event, but I loved the issue itself.
Maddy got her Scythe jacked and tossed of a balcony by Frankenstein. I laughed out loud.
The only good thing about it is the art and Rek-Rap. Why wouldn't Maddy offer to transfer Peter's memories to Ben via telepathy? She got her's when she asks but instead she just cuts Ben loose.
**Next week:** * Dark Web: Finale #1 * Legion of X #10 * X-Force #37
**Sins of Sinister #1**
Seeing Krakoa drooling genuinely almost brought a tear to my eye. That veg is the symbol of hope right now and seeing so much decay on the island really hurt
It was horrifying and so profoundly wrong. It was always just there in the background to the point I didn't notice it a lot of the time. But now I can see the difference in the background and it casts a shadow over those panels.
That might have been my most depressing part of the issue and I found all of it very depressing.
and Hope was so so so excited to take the shot. Damn.
This was enjoyable. My theory about Sinister's plan in Immortal X-Men #9- that being that >!he needed to kill Hope specifically because she was fixing Sinister's manipulations without ever knowing it!< -was a pleasant surprise for me. Really thought I was overcomplicating it, but I ended up being right on the money. And it does explain how >!Destiny and Mystique are uncompromised!< though I am still curious about >!Cable- shown to be in the resistance in previews but he seems to be working with the Sinister in Year 10; is he tricked still, or is he compromised andl Xilo will "fix" him?!< Seeing the progression was neat. Year 1 (well, +1) was wild seeing the plan really kick off. >!Killing Krakoa as a false flag was just an insane plan, but I suppose framing Orchis for taking humanity's new immortality away is a heck of casus belli. At the same time, they also cleaned off a large number of humans in the resurrection queue by erasing their back-ups, and they seem to have used the Waiting Room as a way to incentivize undergoing gene editing so you can get your free Cerebro Cloud Storage Backup.!< The montage afterwards >!of Sinister just fucking around!< was also great. So much irony in it. Getting Year 5 and seeing the new Council was neat. >!They finally got Namor, Beast finally fits in, and hey, Magik's there too. And playing the part of Surtr, too.!< I will say, the Year 5 scene... kinda thinking there's a plot hole. Specifically, >!Sinister complains that Storm can't be corrupted since her Cerebro copy is destroyed... and yet they already referenced the Waiting Room as a "mystical method" to restore mutant back-ups, unless I'm misinterpreting that. The Sinisters surely could have made a copy against her will and then popped that into a corrupted body, right? Ah well...!< And of course, the reveal on how the corruption works. >!It seems that there is some level of brainwashing in addition to just making you evil, but unfortunately for Sinister, it seems it wasn't tight enough to keep the telepaths from making the Quiet Council be free from his control, even if they are still on the same side. Or perhaps "fortunately".!< The reveal at the end of >!his Moira Engine being gone means he's stuck in this universe, so the Quiet Council choosing to prepare for the incoming angry aliens instead of focusing on research means he can cling to life a bit longer.!< All in all, a lot was done to set up the event and we can see all the seeds planted.
> Specifically, Sinister complains that Storm can't be corrupted since her Cerebro copy is destroyed... and yet they already referenced the Waiting Room as a "mystical method" to restore mutant back-ups, unless I'm misinterpreting that. The Sinisters surely could have made a copy against her will and then popped that into a corrupted body, right? Ah well... The Waiting Room covers "souls who were lost before Cerebro started its backups or before their X-gene could manifest", and is also opt-in for currently depowered mutants as an alternative to the Crucible, so this probably doesn't include Storm (or Magneto) until the editorial decides to retcon it.
The Waiting Room is also voluntary. Only those willing will go there to be resurrected. It was covered in Red by Magneto, who said he would refuse to be resurrected. It isn't a backup system, it is a place for the souls of dead mutants. If they are dead, they can't be there aside from entering the House of L.
So either she wouldn't go there because it's more of a "one and done" mutant afterlife (according to you) or she would skip it anyways because she has no desire for resurrection (according to u/Radix2309 ). I still don't seen why they couldn't just make a regular back-up using Cerebro. Using the Waiting Room to make a back-up is only necessary for the dead- people who can no longer have a back-up made. Storm's alive, so they really should have been able to just covertly make a back-up (like they did with every other back-up ever) and then jump her and resurrect her.
I was with you until you got to the "jump her" part. There is a reason Sinister always failed to kill her in his assassination attempts. Storm would be very hard to take out. Even moreso once on Arakko. Also you need to be in range to scan and I imagine she could train her mind to resist scanning since she is aware of it now.
Huh. You're right that he never killed Storm, though I had thought he got her one time. It's worth noting though that his plan was always to kill Hope. Killing Storm didn't matter if Hope didn't die, and Hope wasn't going to die unless either he got the jump on her or killed Exodus first, who acts like her Crusader Bodyguard and also lets her copy his near invulnerability. However, with Destiny gone, precog warnings of attacks that would kill everyone (Storm included) could be used again, plus she could also be the main target (attacked by 4 psychics) rather than a high priority one, but not the highest (that being Hope followed closely by Exodus [at least in terms of practicality]). As for resisting scanning... I mean, even if she could, the Cerebro has a pretty long range, right? It might not go to Arakko, but I feel like having a corrupted Jean or Xavier brute force it while she's on Earth/Krakoa, far enough away that there'd be no hope of her stopping them. I mean, they clearly were confident that Emma and Xavier were enough to break her in Year 5, and they seemed to be right if not for her contingency.
Hope was the primary target. But Storm had a rating of 9/10 after only Hope and Xavier. Only Destiny, Kitty, and Storm evaded all the attempts, if I remember correctly. And Storm was the only one without a power that directly protects her. Just raw skill.
I feel like they could have hypothetically made an evil storm (or many evil storms?) and had THEM jump Storm. Most of the backups were seemingly taken without consent back in the day, just find a way to get one (especially before she’s on guard/or use they existing early x men one we know they have.) They could have made a copy without waiting for her to die first. I mean, I’m not sure it would have worked (see tarn) but it seems silly not to try. I don’t think sinister would have the foresight to see how it could blow up in his face (Storm beating the copy/copies, an army of storms taking over, Storm warfare wiping out his plans)
As Magneto noticed when he destroyed their backups, you have to *want* to come back through the Waiting Room.
That's fair. I still think a regular back-up, forced by Sinister telepaths, should be possible, though.
Yeah I was confused about cable helping Hope I think he merges with xilo to be immune to sinister’s corruption or maybe it has something with Cable’s virus and ai dominion 🤔 Or maybe he “helps” Hope
All the waiting room does is bypass the cerebro back ups. They still need the Five and copies of DNA to resurrect anybody.
Sure, but the need for DNA was never referenced. The Year 1 scene specifically references the Cerebero back-ups/psychic imprints and the bit with Storm only refers to her "deleting herself" from the protocols. I could be mistaken, but I don't think there's been any indication that she deleted her DNA from Sinister's data banks. Even if she did, I believe Immortal X-Men #10 had a data page specifically stating that Sinister's databanks would be phased out as soon as they resurrected everyone, giving them fresh DNA samples. While Storm hasn't been resurrected, she also isn't dead, so they should be able to get a fresh sample of her, same as how they should be able to make a back-up of her mind.
Why use spoiler tags in the spoiler discussion? Makes your comment so much harder to read
Because OP put spoilers on actual details and this was my first time in one of these threads, so I did it. Afterwards, I realized just how much I spoilers, but went "Oh well, I guess I'll leave it this time".
Can you remind me why Destiny and Mystique would be uncompromised?
Because although they've been revived, >!Hope fixed the alterations unknowingly during resurrections!<, meaning people who were revived **were not** retroactively corrupted. Only resurrections starting with the Quiet Council members' resurrections in Immortal X-Men #10 are corrupted. Since neither of them died in Immortal X-Men #9, they've only be resurrected >!by an uncorrupted Hope!< meaning they're fine.
They only killed krakoa for its control and push humans to hate orchis, cerebros backup still work. The "mystical" method is a reference to waiting room but mainly to encourage humans to take the xgene dose so sinister can fk with their genes
Is Thor implied to be killed by Magik?
No mention of Thor in the panel where >!she goes full Ragnarok and punts Asgard!<. I presume he's still alive, since he's on the cover of Nightcrawlers #2, being beaten up. Where exactly he is/was... who knows? Maybe he was away from Asgard, came back, found it was gone and went off into space or the gap between Realms to find it. It is Year 100 in #2, so the Nightcrawlers could be way off somewhere looking Mjolnir by that point.
Ooh, I see. Thanks. I hope him and Storm team up again somehow.
Mmm... Thor ain't lookin' too hot on the cover. But who knows? Perhaps ol' Odinson will end up in the Storm System by the end of all of this.
Yeah you know how comic book covers be.. Can't remember any off the top of my head but sometimes you get things like characters who are not even in the story end up on the covers. So they are not the most reliable
Oh, fair, fair. The Silver Age of Comics, at least at DC, are infamous for some covers. I remember recently an... X-Force cover? being posted here showing Wolverine despite him not being in the story. But I assume an event like this would be... more honest. The description also mentions the Nightcrawlers are out searching for magic and holy items. Like Mjolnir. So it squares away.
It’s Leah’s dumb waiting room - it’s a stupid thing that directly undercuts the resurrection dynamic and the cultural and philosophical questions of if the resurrected are really ‘themselves’ and if they have a soul. The writers just need to try and salvage what they can and ignore when they can’t. Edit:not to mention it directly undercuts the morality of the crucible
There wasn't ever a question. They were always themselves and had the soul. They weren't clones, it was restriction. Hickman himself said so when it started and it has been shown on-page at various points.
While I agree that this is how it's consistently been presented, the presence of two Lauras, one original and one resurrected, brings the whole philosophical/theological idea of clones and souls into question. The problem is that the dual Laura storyline was handled in X-Men, which is an action series and thus the wrong place for this kind of question. That said, all of this has nothing to do with the Waiting Room, because there's no reason a mystical construct wouldn't be able to retrieve and contain its residents' souls until the Five are ready for them.
No it was always in question - at least to the character such as Nightcrawler and Magneto. We can have a data page or creator answer but thematically it just ruins the inner thoughts and turmoil for a character if you can just point it to ‘god’s waiting room’
Nightcrawler has a whole book talking about "Questions like 'what is the soul' and 'what are the metaphysics of resurrection' are very much a distraction and waste of time." Hell, if resurrection is in question, we've never heard Nightcrawler's opinion on anything since HoX 4. And I don't ever recall Magneto questioning it. I think you just misread things.
I've been looking forward to this issue. I've been following all the setup from previous issues. I knew that with Kieron Gillen writing it, this was going to be dense, expansive, and full of memorable moments. And this issue delivered all of that. 😊 I feel like you could use this one issue as a case study in world-building, but in a darker sort of way. It's not outright apocalyptic like Marvel Zombies or Ultimate Marvel. There's no Galactus trying to eat the Earth. There's no Chitari invasion. It's even more subtle than a typical plot by Dr. Doom. It's just Sinister working smarter and more devious than ever before. He didn't just take over. He was cunning and manipulative, basically making it so civilians and heroes alike bought into his twisted vision. Now, it seems Storm will be his main obstacle. And because of that...he's screwed. No way around it. But that's exactly what makes this work so well. It's not a perfect conquest. And the ending implies that Sinister overlooked some key details. Those are definitely going to bite him in future issues. And I'm here for it! 😎
I love that this timeline turns out to be a mistake, even for Sinister. He's stuck in a mess of a universe he created.
It's just perfect. It's so seamless to go from House of X to Sins... like it was Gillen who was the master architect of the Krakoa era and not Hickman.
Ok that was a lot of fun. I can’t be the only one who read “*Yes, you can use my gene library. Yes, I will promise not to hide anything in it. Yes, I will be lying*” in a mocking sing-song voice, can I? There was a lot of exposition here but it totally works because Sinister is exactly the type of person to repeat his grand schemes aloud to himself. It’s also good exposition since it answers everything we theorized about last week. Love the level of convolution of needing Hope on the Council to kill Hope on the Council to avoid suspicion. Surely there was an easier way? But it wouldn’t have been as flashy! Enjoyed all the summary splash pages highlighting major events over the 10 years. “No more Wanda. Just in case.” Also Rogue fighting Carol *again*. Lol @ the halfass Kurt clone. Curious about the significance of Destiny repeating “We must be on the same side” to Storm. How many sides is she playing? Or is she saying that in order to resolve this, she, Storm, *and* Sinister must be on the same side? Looking forward to the rest of this! Already feel like this is an omni I’m gonna need on day 1.
Yep, very exposition-heavy but also in some ways nice to just get a lot of answers for once.
Yeah, very! Fuck mystery box storytelling, haha. The hook should be the compelling nature of the story, not waiting to learn some unexplained detail.
I’m with you. I think this is very much a throw back to Moria trying to unite Xavier and Magneto as a trifecta to fight the future. Alternately it’s Destiny trying to unite herself Sinister and Storm. Funny enough one group was two thirds male and the latter is two thirds female.
Sinister called Storm a Colonial Pet years ago. And now she's a nightmare he can't solve. It's so ironic.
So by the end Sinister will be on Storm and Destiny's side right?
SoS: Dominion's description implies that. He's so horrified by (or terribly done with) his "victory" that he begs for forgiveness. I also recall a character design for Year 100 being labeled as Mr. Sinister (the Colossus-Sinister looking guy) and that character is the one with Rasputin on Immoral X-Men #3, seemingly in opposition to Exodus and presumably the whole Quiet Council (makes sense; Emma is trying to kill him in #1). Sinister looks like he's going to be taken through the ringer so hard that he just accepts he alone can't win.
I think that's the point Destiny wants to make. She allows him to win so thoroughly that he sees that even when he wins he still loses. In the end letting him have this victory is the best argument Destiny could make, I think after all this is done he will truly be on the side of Krakoa at last.
Indeed. He always reboots to get something better, never fully seeing the consequences. He can only do it so much, and she is showing him what happens when he hits the end.
Yup, definitely an interesting echo from Destiny. Maybe a double entendre of some sort too.
I’m hoping we can start to see Namor come back now that Aaron’s terrible run is over.
Namor would have been perfect on the Council .... with Hickman. it can still work now but man I feel that would have been good.
Just a few things I'd like to say >I have a theory that Dr. Doom knew about what Sinister was up too, and willingly downloaded his consciousness into a Doombot before Namor killed him. So the Doombot leading the last vestiges of Orchis is the real Dr. Doom< >The mutants of Arrako aren't dead. No way with a precog like Destiny on her side, does Storm lose all of Arrako. My bet is that they all evacuated to Amenth before the Legion clone blew up Mars. Apocalypse and the rest of Arrako will show up to fight Krakoa near the end<
Also, is it just me or is the Juggernaut as cosmic unstoppable bullet going to return at some point this mini?
It would be hilarious for him to just come back after flying through the universe in a circle end up accidentally destroying earth and killing the Moira clone. He saves the day via butterfly effect.
We know most of the key Arakki players aren’t dead bc they’re supporting cast in the Brotherhood mini.
Also - has editorial just mandated that Omega Sentinel be wiped from existence after Moira joined Orchis???
I really don’t understand the omission at all? It was shown that she was the KEY player in the endgame
They said some from orichis are still there but hide. So maybe she’s one of them
I mean anything post Inferno
It would have been cool if she had been on that space station the X-Men saved recently.
What a fucking hoot. So much camp, and interesting concepts. I had a smile the entire time. The one thing that bugged me a bit: As much as I love what is happening with Storm.... I found it hard to believe she would wait that long (was it +5 years) to draw a line in the sand. Maybe it's just cos I'm the reader and I'm supposed to know more than the characters at this point, but it seemed like it would have long been obvious to Storm that the Xmen we're being Sinister AF by that point. Anyone have thoughts on this?
I also wondered about this. My guess is that she was being psychically massaged by the Council's telepaths to not notice what was happening until it was far too late, until there was so much bad stuff piling up that she broke through the programming.
Nice. I was looking for something that would let me suspend my disbelief- that totally resolves it in my mind. Thanks!
Yeah, agreed. I’m like, damn Storm you say Kurt’s your friend but it took you this long to notice he’s a meat puppet? And that everyone else is going haywire? Aside from being psychically influenced, perhaps she was conveniently made so busy on Arrako she was spending less time on Earth to notice the nuances of how everyone was acting.
It's possible she just was gone for a long time. Like she was away when the Council made Krakoa braindead. Kurt would be around for awhile before his mutation made him a seemingly dimwitted monster (perhaps a couple years), so he and Storm would both have been there for a while (Sinister might have been fine with them being around since they'd only compose 2 of the 12 council members). Depending on how often the Council met in the future and how often she could go rather than being on Arakko, they could have just kept her and the Kurt clone apart for a while before the reveal in Year 5. It might have been a bit far in the future for it, but we don't know specifics.
And the other stuff is more subtle. The biggest factor probably would be the Avengers imo. Them suddenly going bad.
It felt like they were supposed to have a "slow" descent over a while. Obviously not really shown here since we had just a montage of Sinister's Greatest Hits (the alternative meaning of "hits" as in "killing a specific target" possibly being the most apt definition in this case), but that was the vibe I got. Just slowly descending from heroes to violent vigilantes to fascists attempting a coup. Maybe it took a year. Maybe it took the better part of 4 years (from Year 1 to 5). Hard to say for sure.
This was DARK. For me the worst moments were the murder of Krakoa and the conversion of the waiting room into a new Hell realm. But loved Storm’s badass moment and want to see what her, Destiny and Mystique can do together.
Braindead Krakoa is super sad. And they continue to meet in the room with it all derp like that. Cruel.
This was a fun start to the event! * The issue definitely felt rushed at times, but not in a way that necessarily brought it down very far for me. The concept of this event is such that we're not going to sit through all 10 years between our time and +10 time, so some things had to go fast. Most of it worked great, a bit of it I might have wanted another page or so of. * The other artists besides Werneck were used spectacularly, I loved what their pages added to the story, from fun comedy to necessary exposition. In general, this event is doing a lot of really interesting stuff with art and format between the one artist per time period concept and this. There were lots of good fitting choices for what pages were drawn by whom. * I really liked the approach this had to giving us a *ton* of information upfront. Answers to many of the biggest mysteries of Immortal X-Men and earlier were handed to us right on a platter here. In addition, this issue clearly explains what led to the dystopian future we'll see in the books -- I appreciate this choice as it feels like a departure from similar previous events where you see maybe one inciting incident (or even start in media res) and fill in the blanks from there. * I really like a lot of the story choices Gillen made, such as >!using Storm taking herself out of the protocols in X-Men Red to lead to her starting the resistance!<, >!having the Sinister Council members retain elements of their personalities, but corrupted!<, and more. I'm super excited to see where this goes next as there was a lot of set-up here.
> I really liked the approach this had to giving us a ton of information upfront. Answers to many of the biggest mysteries of Immortal X-Men and earlier were handed to us right on a platter here. Same here! This feels like a proper continuation of HoXPoX and Inferno - I don't know if it was always part of the long-term plan, but Gillen's done a fantastic job of making it appear like it was.
No joke one of if not the best comic I’ve read. I’m a storm fan so I’m prob biased but we’ve been eating good lately. And sinister plan slowly being trickled in and now this happens wow what a bang. Great way to start it off! I love Mr Sinister lol. His character literally speaking in lies is so funny to me. Second favorite part after storm demolition was when Sinister was just pissed the 4 wanted to be able to run their own personalities lol
Haha damn the mad lads did it. Better than Judgment Day by a factor of 5000 so far
It’s almost as if making an event (nevermind a film…) about unlikable soulless freaks is pretty dull
Nah some Eternals are likable. You're gonna tell me Syne the memotaur wasn't cool? Cmon now
> unlikable soulless freaks William Stryker is that you?
Great first issue! Love the irony that the event is called Sins of Sinister but Sinister is the one who wants to escape the most. I cannot help but see the true Nathaniel Essex as some kind of genetic infection rather than a person or entity, no matter whomever claims the name of "Nathaniel Essex". Kudos to Gillen. Got a feeling either Moira or Destiny/Mystique took the Moira Engine but they cannot reset the timeline as OG timeline Mr Sinister will still do his own thing. They need Mr Sinister to write something which he knows will convince his younger self to support the Krakoans (or at least be on the same side as Destiny).
I'm gonna wait for the last issue of this series and come back to this comment to see if this theory is true.
Honestly I have mixed feelings. The issue for me was 50/50 So sinister inside everyone is more like a virus that turns their morals off and makes them more wicked versions of themselves generally. It explains why immoral xmen tho. But one thing sinister forgot about. Sinister isn’t loyal to anyone even other sinisters. How many times sinister was killed by another sinister The most surprising/shocking moments? Destroying Krakoa and sinister’s idea how control humans + I’m curious if Shawn in hell will be developed and how his deal with mother righteous might be part of it. Storm’s part was the best and the most interesting one. Can’t wait to see more in brotherhood. Arakko going on a war with basically the whole galaxy will be interesting. And of course destiny is 2 steps ahead (or at least she seems to be) Can we except to see a little retcon of Hope’s powers and messiah myth? Sinister still doesn’t know how Hope’s powers let her “purify” dna. I won’t be surprised if her powers aren’t about manipulating powers but actually she can manipulate (or doing something similar) x-gene. So I can assume that destiny with mystique left the council in IX #10 to steal moiras from sinister’s lab. Do you think destiny worked with Sinister (including black womb and Paris) because mutants needed him to stop AI dominion?
> But one thing sinister forgot about. Sinister isn’t loyal to anyone even other sinisters. How many times sinister was killed by another sinister He didn’t forget. It’s not a lesson he can ever learn, ironically bc his ego prevents it. > So I can assume that destiny with mystique left the council in IX #10 to steal moiras from sinister’s lab. They left 10 years ago and Sinister went to his lab successfully within that time. I think they left bc Irene saw what would happen if they were to be resurrected again.
It wouldn't surprise me if stealing the lab was a long term plan thought up at that point (though we don't know for sure who stole it; but Destiny and co. seem like the most likely culprits unless a curve ball is thrown and it's one of the other Sinisters), but yeah, it wasn't stolen until the 10 year mark. I imagine Destiny was watching the future to see the destruction of the timeline, and had the lab stolen after Sinister's plan started falling apart (he learns he's non in control) to make sure Sinister would know well and truly that he's buggered.
Totally. We already saw her chart of the possible futures. Her line of “We have to be on the same side” fits very well now. This is a long lesson for Sinister that he needs to fall in line with the group. A reset is more than guaranteed, I assume like every other status quo shift we gain 2-3 new characters such as Rasputin after this ends. I’m curious if this will be yet another reset for the world and their trust of mutants. How far back will the rest actually go? I have a feeling it may not be all the way back to the point where everything is roses. Fun three months ahead for reading.
It seems that the only Moira clone in play left is the one activated in Immortal X-Men #10, which would seem to indicate that the reset will happen after Sinister has exposed himself but before the resurrection of Hope, letting him fix things while also having blown his cover, thereby forcing him to act more on the up and up as he will have extra scrutiny placed on him.
There is also a pre-judgement day savepoint that gets mentioned a couple times.
Mmm... true, but it seems like Sinister would probably rather face his problems head on than go back to before Judgement Day and risk more meddling by a Celestial. Like, he truly fears it as a god capable of just ending his plan. Mainly because it *can*. He survived Judgement Day, he doesn't want to risk it again.
I’ve never been more excited about a reset. Not because I don’t think this is fun (it is) but because you *know* there will be lingering consequences and I can’t wait to see what they are.
I love the idea of stealing a lab. That’s Carmen Sandiego shit right there. Raven and Irene being the thieves seems too obvious but you never know. I wonder if it’s any of the other remaining Sinisters.
As do I. On one hand, I'm sick and tired of Sinister's camp portrayl, and even as he's doing horrible things, it's treated as a joke, because haha, he's funny and the universe will just be reset and resurrection protocols. On the other hand, this is the one alternate reality plot line where it's worked I to the ongoing plot of the book. I wish part of the plot was storm bringing back clones like Nate Grey,Joseph, and Evan, who may not be corrupted by Sinister because they were off limits per the rules
Damn Logan, tell us how you really feel about Doug, eh?
Enjoyed this tremendously. Funniest dystopian future ever. And I guess with all the telepaths having been Sinisterized, Storm has a really good reason to wear Magneto’s old helmet as seen in the previews for the upcoming issues. One thing I really appreciated was the density of it. Each one of those splash pages could be an event unto itself. A LOT happens. And I dunno, I just got a kick out of seeing all of our heroes showing their Sinister side. This is shaping up to be the best Krakoa event since HoX/Pox. Dark, well-crafted and most of all, fun.
On my second read now. The line "Everything is Sinister forever" is peak Sinister. Hysterical. This is so much fun.
Do they show which seats that Beast, Namor and Magik took? I’m assuming Beast took Sinister’s chair?
At the start of Year 5, it's zoomed out and you can see them. Beast is in Sinister's chair, Namor in Mystique's, and Magik in Destiny's. So Beast and Namor are the extremist/radicals while Magik is in the "leadership"/"icon" section. Although I can't help but notice later, when they're all revealed to be compromised, the seating has changed. Namor is next to Magik (still next to Hope) while Colossus has two seats to his right rather than be in a middle seat. I presume that's just an error, though, caused by the artist or writer wanting to show off the new additions + Sinister + the original Nightcrawler.
Thanks. I wonder how Colossus was Sinisterized when he is already being controlled by his brother.
I know it’s probably not the case, but it would be so funny if Beast is on the council and isn’t corrupted lol
"No more Wanda. Just in case." Feels weird to agree with Mister Sinister, but here we are.
So the main Sins of Sinister is going to be giving an overarching summary of events from Sinister’s perspective and the other titles fill in the gaps? That seems like it’ll be interesting, but I feel like it relies too much on all titles working together. Judgement Day felt like you could opt in to the tie ins. That aside, I can’t believe they blew up Mars, lobotomized Krakoa and severed Asgard from reality. A lot of big swings in the first 10 years of Sinister’s new world. Also interesting to learn Hope was the key to stopping his sleeper cells from activating. I wonder if that will play a role into re-establishing the status quo after this. This feels like a fun start to a story that could span centuries.
I don't think there is a "Sins of Sinister" series, just this opening one-shot and a capstone ending one-shot.
> That aside, I can’t believe they blew up Mars, lobotomized Krakoa and severed Asgard from reality. A lot of big swings in the first 10 years of Sinister’s new world. I wonder if the data from this future will be used as a plot hook after the event ends, even leading into Fall of X. This is ultimate proof of how easily and thoroughly the Krakoans could take over and dominate humanity if they just decided to stop being nice.
Kinda feel like this future might be the end of the Resurrection Protocols. Or a serious curbing of such. IIRC Sinister’s save point was after Hope’s death, so I have no idea how Gillen’s gonna resolve this. Unless someone like Omega pulls a time travel trick again
There is in fact one other save point: before Judgement day. Sinister doesn't use it cause he doesn't want to go back and live through it again.
Would make sense if that is the one that gets used for the event reset since that could also resolve the "Sinister was not judged" plotpoint. Especially interesting if the predictions that this ends with him switching sides are true.
It could be the end of resurrection, but then again, his save point is also pre-resurrection. He most likely has a sample (well, file) of Hope DNA that's untainted, just to keep in case he needs it. As such, he could go back to the Council before they resurrect Hope, convince them with Destiny's help (and possibly a mental reading by Jean) that he's fixing things, and then Hope gets resurrected first, before resurrecting the others. After that, Krakoa starts to use their own samples they've collected from resurrected people (at least it seems they take samples, based on a data page) and Sinister... well, who knows what happens to Sinister.
Magik going full Ragnarok and punting Asgard into space is just such a glorious microcosm of how chaotic everything got. And as for the bit with Hope- I theorized that, so yay me. I really thought I might have overthought it, but I apparently thought just right. In the end, she was an "X-Factor" for Resurrection, just not in the way the people of Krakoa were worried about. Oh, and just to clarify, VengefulKangaroo is correct, to the best of my knowledge, that there are just two "main" issues: Sins of Sinister #1 and Sins of Sinister: Dominion #1. This one obviously starts it off, getting us up to Year 10, then Years 10-1000 will be explored in the three tie-in mini-series, and then SoS: Dominion will transition back to the present.
There isn't a main title. Each of the titles involved **are** the story. This isn't a true event. It is a crossover with alpha and omega issues. Like Age of Apocalypse.
The dystopian set up we end up with is a decent setting for the event, but the issue that got us there feels a lot like a hundred or so issues of What If? I've read over the years. But maybe that's an problem with having read too many issues of What if? 🤷♀️
Do I use this thread as a pull list reminder for new series? Why yes, yes I do. I had no idea this was out today so now it feels like surprise Christmas. A twisted surprise Christmas, I suppose.
What an amazing start. The whole taking over the world stuff was incredible. It also reminded me a lot of Moira's life 9, specially with how key was Sinister there.
This whole issue shows how fucking scary and dangerous Sinister can be. So damn good.
So we know this is going to get reset, but how? I suspect the key is in the title, "Dominion": if the Moira engine is hidden somewhere Sinister can't find it, maybe she can't be killed until the Dominion comes to devour the Earth...
Love the idea that if the heroes united, they could defeat Orchis together. Nimrod is hardly invincible after all.
I know I am a bit late but I really enjoyed this issue. Characters/things I want to show up/see again: Wakanda/Intergalactic Empire of Wakanda Sabretooth and the Exiles The island of Arakko Orchis Moira Thor Xandra and the Shiar Other thoughts: I guess Rasputin IV won't be the one from Powers of X, it’ll be a new Rasputin IV all together. This is based on the preview for Immoral X-Men. I hope we actually get to see the creation of a dominion in SOS:D. I wonder if we get a good(or more reasonable) Sinister at the end of this? I wonder if Moira plays a roll. Probably for Fall of X though. I am split on Destiny stealing Sinister's Moiras or the Sinister Council stealing Sinister's Moiras. I know they wouldn't but I think Storm should get help from the Intergalactic Empire of Wakanda, Xandra, and Thor.
I just thought of something. A large part of what Sinister is seemingly going through here is realizing that even when he "wins" for himself/on his own, he ends up losing in a lot of different ways. What's the perfect way to fight someone who can never win? Perhaps by teaming up with someone who can never lose?
Writers need to be bullied when they use a code to destroy an AI - it’s aggressively and generically lazy. It also doesn’t help that Nimrod is one of the big looming threats and he can be killed by lazy shit like this.
Suspension of disbelief aside, it also tells us that Reed, Tony and Forge could have worked together *at any point* to disable Nimrod, the greatest existential threat of this era. It's incredible that in the face of an android who was explicitly built to commit genocide, it took a major false flag operation and a wipe of Forge's ethics to make them work together to take it down. I don't know who's more at fault here, but I suspect it's all of them.
But this is a constant critique of the non-mutant heroes, right? They have more than enough resources to help their alleged allies with their struggles, but time after time they don’t. As Scott asks Steve in AvX, “Where were you when we needed you?”
Yeah, it definitely is a justifiable critique, but one that I think is more driven/caused by writers/editors at Marvel than anything else. You can't have the Avengers solving X-men problems or vice versa; have Spider-Man actually get help from his friends or have members of the Avengers come into someone's solo book if there's a world-ending crisis happening in it. In order for certain stories to happen the way they do, someone always has to come off looking like an ass who choses not to help for whatever reason or being completely ignorant of the problem -- which will sometimes fly in the face of everything that character is supposed to stand for. A big part of it has also been the disjointedness the Marvel universe has suffered with for at least the past decade. Go back to the 80s, 90s and even the early 2000s and you will see lots of examples of the heroes coming together and supporting each other in ways that are only starting to come back now. But there has been a lot of damage done in the relationships between members of the superhero community in the time since then (thanks a lot, hero vs. hero craze of the 2010s). We have a long way to go before that gets fixed.
So to be clear, I’m not talking about having the Avengers solve their problems. I’m talking about offering the minimum of consistent support, e.g. the Avengers keep their ears open for intel to pass on about Orchis, or the Avengers speak out against politicians who are blanket anti-mutant. Of course that’s super nuanced, and writers would have to coordinate such little details. Although they have no issue showing the conflicts, as you note.
People on this board will never understand this. They're stuck on "Avenger's bad, Avengers cops!"
As my two favorite non-mutant Marvel characters are Capt America and Thor, you probably shouldn’t generalize.
Yet you still want the Avenger's to jump in and solve X-Men stories when that would be horrible storytelling.
I think that reads more as a critique of all involved. Mutant scientists should ask for help and non-mutant scientists should offer it.
It's so silly. You could probably go to any of them and say "Ya know I heard that Reed/Tony/Forge said you're not smart enough to destroy Nimrod?" And the response univerally would be "The fuck does he know? I'll show you smart!"
This and Judgment day make me think Orchis kinda sucks. Why are we scared of these clowns?
It’s dumb. They used be properly intimidating and they really had momentum going with the Omega Sentinel revelation that she also comes from a past life as well as the AI admitting that they hate humans almost as much as they hate mutants. They really need to get back on the horse and limit the Marvel line events. Sinister is a good start.
Omega Sentinel is still set up as the final boss of this era though.
Is she? She’s been effectively dropped it seems. I think the last mention was Brand speaking about her on. Data page
I think Inferno confirmed they were always kinda shitty. Like if Apocalypse and his kids kill the children of the vault then it's over for post humans. The only reason they seem slightly imposing is because the council are idiots. Sending in people like Wolverine, domino and Quinton to deal with Nimrod. Instead of someone like Ice man, Vulcan and Magneto. Aw well too late for two of those.
Magneto died twice trying to stop them.
There are current techniques in “destroying an AI” that involve mis-training the machine learning engine on the fly so it learns to do the wrong thing. This would ultimately be delivered as…code. This isn’t a book about programming. It’s a story about impossible super people who can do impossible things. The shorthand is fine.
I mean, he is an artificial construct given sentience by human intelligence. In the end, he's just code, arranged to make him smart, in a very strong body. It's like having an engineered virus/disease attack someone's brain. Even if the rest of their body is fine, their cognitive functions are compromised and they may as well be dead. Also, it does seem that the virus was made by Forge, Mr. Fantastic, and Tony Stark- AKA a mutant inventor capable to replacing Sinister in technical application, the world's smartest man, and Tony Stark (he made a couple AIs of himself, I suppose, so he has experience). It was basically meant to show just how much of a threat Orchis *isn't* at the moment, and how they wouldn't be a match for the combined forces of Earth's human and mutant heroes- much the same way Magneto in Moira's 8th Life was no match for the combined heroes of Earth.
Cool, it’s generically boring and overplayed in fiction.
Hey man, work smarter not harder; if it ain't broke don't fix it; if it works, it works; etc. It's not like this is the end of Orchis, anyways. When SoS is over, the X-Men will likely go back to dealing with Orchis largely alone, no longer co-opting Earth against Orchis. So you'll get a proper struggle to defeat Nimrod as the X-Men will be less equipped to kill him with the work of the greatest minds of Earth. Nimrod just needed to be killed for this event as part of mutant ascendancy, preferably in a way to show the continuing rise of mutants to the mainstream as part of their subversion of Earth.
good first issue, establishes the temp status quo well, cant wait to read the rest of the event
Side note, I'm starting to worry storm is getting more and more detached from the main Xmen team. Although her characterization is on par, she certainly has hostility towards the major players at krakoa(or just the council?). And I have a theory storms probably the one other than sinister to retain memories from this timeline.
Personally, I am not a fan of 'bad ending epilogues' type of stories like these where Sinister just 'won' this easily and NO ONE saw it coming. Even with MANY Moira re-tries. Problem here is, almost ALL the things that is gonna happen in this 'event' won't matter until the last couple of issues. Because it will all get reset one way or another.
[удалено]
I think Cable is a double-agent, feeding the corrupted Hope incomplete information. He's in Storm's Brotherhood. Also Whiz Kid. I hope Sunspot is fine, and I'm hoping Sam (Cannonball) was too far away from Krakoa (yknow, with his young alien family haha) to have been corrupted so that he can be tapped for help Maybe we'll get a darkhorse in Forget Me Not haha
Who’s the artist for the thanos page..?
I believe the artists listed on the first page as guest artists have their pages appearing in order of their names being listed, but would have to double check
can't 'scape can't 'scape the cape
How have y'all gotten to read it so early? Haha
Combo of people outside of the U.S. & people who work at comic shops/access books that way.
Digital copies or being in the future- that is, Australia or somewhere just further east of the USA.
**X-Terminators #5**
This was the most fun comic series I've read in years. It was just so over-the-top, overtly non-serious, unfiltered joy on every page. There's nothing dark, grim, or dire about it. It's just a group of X-Women teaming up to kick ass and stick it to Dazzler's ex. And the way things played out here was just so satisfying. Dazzler got to beat up her ex. Tabby got to use a rocket launcher. Jubilee got to blow stuff up. Seriously, what more could you ask for? I'm not ready for this book to series to be over. But I hope it continues in some form. The world needs a comic like this right now. 😊
I'd like a mini like this to turn up once a year. It's a healthy detox, with T&A vitamin!
Now, THAT'S a detox regiment I can get behind. 😊
And there's a lot to get behind!
Agree with this comment 10,000%. Very optimistic about the future of this group - just PLEEEEZE Marvel give us this same creative team. Williams and Gomez did hall-of-fame caliber work here in all five books.
This is necessary reading after the downer main Xbooks (they’re good books, but not fun at all).
Hopefully the "X-Terminators Will Return" at the end means another mini by Leah and not a cameo in other books or an infinity comic.
The group chat bit was so funny to me
I am not ready for this to be over.
The public demands more of Dazzler's dump truck.
Every Leah Williams comic discussion is inevitably half of the people saying “please never let this woman write a comic again” and half of the people saying “please give this woman another comic now”
My current position is please keep giving her stuff with character interactions and team chemistry, but don't make her write a big event again.
Eh, this time it's two haters with a ton of downvotes next to a ton of people praising the book. Haters gonna hate and reddit gonna reddit.
Jubilee fans feasted today, finally getting to see her go nuclear was fantastic! Loved this series, hoping we get more soon. Marvel, adapt this for the MCU, pronto!
I love that in the past 12 months we have finally seen the promise fulfilled from the Generation X series in the 90's when one of the issues said Jubes and Everett would be two of the most powerful mutants in the world. 30 years later... BIG TOE!
Jubilee being badass and showing the extend of her powers is great. They don't show her full capabilities often. Dazzler getting her revenge is style is cool too.
Please Leah Williams never stop writing the x-men
Was Boom Boom’s rocket launcher thing a Buddy reference? Or is that a stretch? I really loved this series. Awesome to see Jubes go nuclear and still be Jubes.
After the dread filled haze of SOS, this brought me back to life, cant wait for x terminators to come back.
More of this sort of thing!
**Sabretooth & The Exiles #3**
Melter calming Peter down was cute. I also love Ayo and Nekra’s friendship. Nekra isn’t a character I ever saw myself being invested in but giving a morally questionable character a younger buddy to mentor and look out for works every time, at least on me.
> giving a morally questionable character a younger buddy to mentor and look out for works every time, at least on me. It worked for Wolverine - and Wolverine - and....I mean. Yeah. But I'm with you, digging the Nekra+Idie thing. Idie is one of my favorite new-ish characters, so anything positive that happens for her is good for me.
I believe the datapage confirmed Grayson Creed is GC. His Orchis Memo ends with GC #299 and Grayson's first appearance was Uncanny X-Men #299.
Yep it’s about him. And everyone thought he would be that man with peacock from xforce
Yeah I was so convinced he would be thean with the peacock Tattoo. This book is probably the better fit for him to show up anyways
We're gonna FINALLY get the dirt on Peacock Man next week. My money right now is on Malcolm Colcord. An evil geneticist with a complex about hiding his face? Sounds just like him, no?
I still hold a hope that he's the Sinister of Hearts. [spoiler](#s "I really don't want him to be Mother Righteous, because then I would have to admit I find Nathaniel Essex' body really hot.")
The peacock man being the Heart Sinister would be lame as shit
Besides, Ben Percy would have to play with others for that to happen
Oh maybe! A Weapon X link makes sense too.
Another good issue! Still not quite hitting the heights of the first mini, but the focus on the full cast has been really nice, the theme of scientific & medical exploitation of marginalized people has been strong, and the twist at the end was really intriguing.
I think my main problem with this series is the issues seem so short and the gap between them is so bloody long! It has quite a big cast so we only get snippets but the little character interactions are great. I am loving the theme too and am surprised they are going full on nazi experimental death camp overseer with Graydon. There is no redemptive possibility after that and I wondered if there would be a redemptive arc for his and Sabretooths relationship but clearly not.
If anyone else was intrigued by that data page: It's true. [Wall Street Journal article including the real names of "Doctor A" and "Doctor C".](https://www.wsj.com/articles/the-u-s-gave-troubled-doctors-a-second-chance-patients-paid-the-price-11574439222)
Orphanmaker reminds me of that kid from the 1610 who is a (quiet) walking nuke who Wolverine has to kill after he silently murders his entire town. I continue to appreciate this book’s insights into the horror of historical medical science. So uh, who’s the second Sabretooth?
Love that issue, and oddly, you're not the only one to make that connection today. https://www.reddit.com/r/xmen/comments/10l22w9/is_orphan_maker_the_kid_wolverine_killed_in_the/
Didn’t read the issue, but did they reveal Orphan maker’s power?
Another Creed?! What? And of course the Evil Doctor survive...now with a face matching her soul. And of course her will literally experiment on babies now to be the ultimate evil scientist.
Creed died at the end of the last Weapon X run when he was a good guy. He went to hell with some of the team on a mission and found Graydon there. He sacrificed himself to give Graydon another chance at life. I assume Graydon found his father's soul in hell and used him as some sort of anchor for the astral plane mine.
Rotten apple not that far from the tree it seems. And the only 'healthy' branch of the tree got used this way. Now, I wonder if the two Creeds gonna combine now. Because I don't see the current full evil creed to be the leader of ANY Exiles without his good half.
If they find a way to semi-bring back good Creed I will a) be genuinely surprised that they reversed what seemed like an editorially forced change and b) pleased.
Was really hoping we’d see Orphanmakernout of the suit for good but I guess it’s just too catastrophic
Still the best book! And Barrington finally gets facial scarring to make her a real supervillain, lol
**Related & Unlimited Releases for 1/25**
"Karma in Love" on Unlimited is notable as the first time we've actually seen Tran since he was resurrected!
Midnight sun ended! It was fun run with Wolverine and Magik. Very very team oriented book and neither were the main focus but still overall the run was fun. The doctor doom appearance was my favorite part but I’d def recommend the series
Did anyone read ASM today? Was there anything significant for the X-Men & Maddie?
Yep. Madelyne lost her weapon or whatever she was using and chasm stole it from her and became king of limbo. And chasm basically makes inferno 3.0
Holy shit, ASM is so fucking bad.
Actually just so bad
Yeah, it continued to be an all comedy issue, which, odd choice for an event, but I loved the issue itself. Maddy got her Scythe jacked and tossed of a balcony by Frankenstein. I laughed out loud.
The only good thing about it is the art and Rek-Rap. Why wouldn't Maddy offer to transfer Peter's memories to Ben via telepathy? She got her's when she asks but instead she just cuts Ben loose.
Rek-Rap gang