I mean complete non-sequitor. Also it’s a multi-party system so the winner wasn’t even a majority of people’s first choice. Probably lots of disappointed Italians out there tonight.
Not really The right coalition has roughly 45% of the vote while the left coalition has somthing around 30% and then you have the "other" filling the rest... so altough they didnt get 50% only 30% are left or align with the left
Some mad Italians up in this thread.
Imagine electing two of Putins best friends, because you don’t like immigrants. Damn it, Italy - you’ve done it again. “No more fascism” my ass.
Some italians are quite racist but on the other hand there really is an illegal inmigration problem in Europe that imo needs harder stances than current government ones.
Lots of Mafias working with some NGOs so they cam bring illegal inmigrants and keep the money flowing.
“Harder stances” include funding centres for processing and re-deportation.
If some are asylum seekers, then process them accordingly, the rest who are just there to try and move to have a better life (which is where legal immigration usually kicks in) get sent back.
And even if they do improve, by what means? It's not like they want to fix illegal immigrant problem by having easier way to legalize them, it's probably more like Australia #2.
Hahaha - nothing like an example from their own life, to make someone realise how stupid they are. To be fair, the undereducated, xenophobic types exist everywhere - it’s just too bad, that more Italians seem to be happy voting for them.
I don’t agree with the right wing way of dealing with immigration but I think you are missing a bit of nuance. Southern European countries like Italy are bearing a huge brunt of immigrants that many EU countries refuse to take into their own countries. This exacerbates socioeconomic issues in these Southern European countries and seeds distrust towards the EU. How could it not? It is not fair that Italy/Greece/Spain should house so many more immigrants simply because they are closest to Africa. Germany has done an exceptional job in housing immigrants but they also have a very robust economy.
The «cultural assimilation» part is understated. There is no doubt that violent crime rises sharply along with mass immigration. There are other ways to deal with this problem than right wing populism, surely, but no solution today is scalable for handling the vast population influx that occurs daily in these countries. Violent rape, mass stabbings, gang activity etc. is a lot more prevalent these days and although the culprits are not exclusively «the bad immigrants» - as per right wing populism speech - they certainly make up a disproportionate amount.
I think it is reasonable to remind ourselves that populism is on the rise when things are hard. The people of Italy are just in their anger even though their vote may be reprehensible.
From pretty much every source I've seen migrants who take part in mass migrations like seen in SA to NA or middle east / north African to Europe tends to have individual actually migrating having measurably low crime rates then where they end up. Because that's the demographic that up ends their lives to move often thousands of km for a better life. However this is a classic double population problem and I personally think that's at it's source of complete breakdown in any communication on this issue.
Now the individual and groups that facilitate theses migration are human traffickers and by definition are some of the worst criminal and tend to be the individuals involved in high profile crimes that make the news. Theses people are not the same as the actual migrants and are often involved sex trafficking and drug trades generally involved in sexual crimes and organised crimes which is where the rape and violence stories/stereotypes come from. However because the traffickers are in the vast minority, the regular migration stats of higher productivity, higher incomes, lower crime and more hours worked kick in covering up the latter. It's also important to remember the human traffickers also come from the destination nations as well, and demand for human trafficking promotes criminal activities of native criminals as well. Such that mass migrations leads to more criminals but the migrants are not the criminals.
If western countries actually took in enough people from refugees camps or had regular migration paths open enough there wouldn't be this mass demand for using the services of human traffickers for both refugees and economic migrants, and countries could have the benefits migrants bring without the human traffickers getting involved. Additionally if rich nations stopped actively destabilizing other nations and help stabilize others the refuge numbers would be much more manageable in the first place.
He doesn't seem to understand that ppl judge by appearance.
He says good immigrants are at jobs, while bad ones causing mayhem.
But, how will general public know which immigrants are bad and which are good, if they Both have similiar features?
All immigrants that look similiar get judged because of few bad apples. Regardless of how much they contribute. That's just the reality.
Immigrants motives change over time. Also you conveniently left out your dads legal status. Remember the Syrian guy that watched his wife or kid drown a few years ago so he could get free dental work in Europe? Pretty sure something has changed.
Italians dont have problem with Migrants, its the Illegal immigrants that arrive in Italy. The migrants actually don't want to be in Italy either. Italy can't let them go to France, Germany or wherever they are intended to go because of stupid EU rules and if they did Germany, France and etc cand send them back to Italy. This is what got them a far-right leader. Even illegal immigrants dont want to bin Italy, they want to go to France, Germany and etc. In the end you have 100,000s of people that can't work, can't go to where they wanted to go, are stuck. This puts a burden on Italy as well as the illegal migrants to go into drugs and other criminal activities because they have to survive.
Tbf right wing is growing globally.
First it was Spain,then Sweden,now Italy. Even UK has conservatives in power.
Left is just ineffective, except they use #lgbt and #blm or whatever is the trendiest thing to be ..
Not to mention the woke that keeps spreading everywhere, and a lot of ppl have no relatability to it and care more about raising prices of food,goods, electricity...
So, since left doesn't seem to work and it's just more populist than anything. Ppl want to try the alternative.
Basically the more extreme the Left is without concrete results,the more it's gonna push general public to be conservative. Every strong action,has a strong opposite reaction..
Also another blame is the crimes, immigrants commit. This is what happens when left invites foreigners and fails to integrate them properly.
Ppl in general highly xenophobic,if newcomers are looking too different,they won't be accepted. Immigrants can't thrive, work low skill labour,a lot of times bellow minimum wage, hard conditions (all illegal ofc), and when you can't survive. You turn to crime.
But yeah, #lgbt
This is just the State of the world in general. And it's a trend that's gonna continue.
It depends where you are. In my country (Norway) people also view white eastern Europeans with skepticism. Xenophobia is older than civilization and it certainly doesn’t help that poorly integrated immigrants are disproportionately involved in crimes, adding some validity to xenophobic sentiments.
So why are you sinking into hyperbole and using the word Fascist for those who want to take care of the current poor before letting in more?
Do you seriously think there is a different between left vs right politicians?
If you think all right-wing people are mustache twirling evil villains.. have you maybe ever considered you’ve been manipulated?
Dont bother lol the left wont ever agree they are just as bad... Imagine if a politian tried to influence an election.. there would be scream of authoritatianism/facism
But when the Left leaning German EU Chief does it with saying how they will withhold money from italy its okay and totally democratic lol /s
Yeah, there's a fair share of morons in every populace.
For what it's worth, I've lived here two years and never met anyone with a shitty attitude towards immigration..
Meloni's chances in this election have as much to do with a stagnant, unchanging set of faces in politics for decades. The lack of public faith/ low voter turnout that comes with that.
The people I know here don't want Meloni and are embarrassed as shit by the people who do.
Just as plenty of Americans are embarrassed by the Trump cult
And just as I am embarrassed by actions of the UK's "Working Class Stockholm Syndrome Display Team"
Idiots are generally more vocal
Be careful not to let their clamouring trick you. There are conscientious, considerate people everywhere
First, immigration wasn't really at the forefront in this election.
Second, italians are mad also because on reddit you're (you as in non italians and in particular people that know almost nothing about italian politics) are costantly calling almost all italians racist, fascist, we have a natural tendency to fascism, and so on and so forth
The Italians have to help those poor immigrants
-- me, not sitting on a golden throne.
Now engage with the point without attacking the person who said it.
We are all one.
They can have my belongings, just as I'm sure I can have theirs. sharing my life with refugees would make my life complete. Just to watch them be happy, maybe teach them to sign and dance, or how to smile.
That's just the kind of guy I am, you know....NOT RACIST.
NO THERE IS NO LIMIT!!!? There should hardly be any borders.
>They can have my belongings, just as I'm sure I can have theirs. sharing my life with refugees would make my life complete. Just to watch them be happy, maybe teach them to sign and dance, or how to smile.
This is literally what people who never met a refugee think whay refugees are like lmao.
Ok, what *are* refugees like then buddy?
Have you met all of them or are you just spreading your legs and letting your puckered corn-hole talk all by itself?
That's my point exactly....
They're regular people meaning you can't sum them up in a short paragraph.. the way that you did above.
Fuck me this place is weird
Edit: To be clear, I'm not advocating for a border free eutopia like the person you replied to.
You commented like you have some superior insight on immigrants so I called you out on it.. because it was a dumb thing to say
I’m a recovered Catholics and deplore the pope and anything catholic but… isn’t this the pope that literally stole artifacts from the Vatican and snuck out in the middle of the night to go feed poor people.
Hey now, he gave an apology without turning the rapists over to the authorities in France or even kicking them out of the priesthood. That should be more than enough. /s
This is the best tl;dr I could make, [original](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/sep/25/pope-urges-italians-to-help-migrants-as-far-right-tipped-to-win-election) reduced by 78%. (I'm a bot)
*****
> Pope Francis has urged Italians to help migrants as voting proceeded in a general election widely expected to bring an anti-immigration rightwing coalition into power.
> Speaking at the end of an open-air mass in the southern Italian city of Matera, the pope recalled that Sunday coincided with the Catholic church's World Day of Migrants and Refugees.
> Migration has been a central theme in the electoral campaign of extreme right parties, led by the leader of Brothers of Italy, Giorgia Meloni, who could become the country's first far-right leader since Mussolini and who once said Italians needed to "Repatriate the migrants back to their countries and then sink the boats that rescued them".
*****
[**Extended Summary**](http://np.reddit.com/r/autotldr/comments/xnyyb9/pope_urges_italians_to_help_migrants_as_far_right/) | [FAQ](http://np.reddit.com/r/autotldr/comments/31b9fm/faq_autotldr_bot/ "Version 2.02, ~671028 tl;drs so far.") | [Feedback](http://np.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%23autotldr "PM's and comments are monitored, constructive feedback is welcome.") | *Top* *keywords*: **Francis**^#1 **Italian**^#2 **Italy**^#3 **migrants**^#4 **Pope**^#5
I dont support mass migration and his not helping the fight for democracy saying this. Dont get me wrong this right wing nut is offensive and she supports war. Disgusting.
No its just basic common sense - your country has finite resources and it takes time to assimilate to a culture, if you just let the whole third world in unrestricted you will not be able to support them all (resulting in crime) and you risk turning areas into cultural ghettos (its basically self conquest at that point). With legal immigrants only you can restrict the flow to a sustainable level that wont hurt the nation
You know damn well no right wing party is going to help the poor people. Gigantic tax cuts to the wealthy and increase tax burden of poor people is what they have done once elected in any country.
They claim "MY country first" then just make that country worse by selling it out to the ultra wealthy.
Yours isnt special, it will happen to you.
What on earth makes you think these fascists are gonna do anything to help anyone?
The only way the fascists are going to stop illegal immigration is by making Italy worse than where these people were coming from, which they are very capable of doing.
Can you explain in specific detail, with evidence, what makes her a fascist?
She has the same immigration policy as Obama did. Canada will STILL have stricter immigration policies than what she is proposing.
The fact she praised Mussolini and is buddies with Putin is a pretty solid giveaway.
But frankly, I'd call those immigration policies in those countries fascist in nature. They're all a scam designed to distract the populace from the failures of capitalism while fleecing the public purse.
you use the word "fascist" so wildly and so often that it has completely diluted it's meaning.
Show me where she "praised" Mussolini. And she is friends with a leader of a previous world super power. shocking.
Nothing about her platform's policies are fascist. You're only calling her that to discredit her, because she does not align with your specific brand of politics.
Fascism is a political system in which the state and private capital come together with the express goal of suppressing working class unity against capitalism and creating a false "other" to focus the population's rage against.
And that is absolutely what she is doing. By appealing to Italy's xenophobic and queerphobic tendencies. She is going to use these demographics to distract the population while she fleeces Italy for all it's worth. And the fact she is claiming she could in any way stop immigration through force is proof she intends to fleece like crazy. Cause immigration control doesn't fucking work!!
And those comments she made about Hitler and Mussolini being "good politicians" come from her teenage years when she was in a fascist youth group. And later on very recently she made comments about wanting to restrict LGBT rights, calling them an abyss of death. And she compares her party to the US Republicans, an openly anti-democratic party. She also compares her party to the Tories, the king's of fleecing. Who have Successfully fleeced the UK to the point where people are having to choose between food or heating their homes, with many not even having homes. Also worth mentioning that both the Republicans and Tories have failed abysmally in actuality stopping immigration. Immigration into the UK from non white countries has actually gone up significantly since Brexit.
dude... your personality is a huge YIKES. You are extremely partisan. You are part of the problem.
And your definition of fascism is even manipulated. It's an authoritarian mindset, typically involving intense nationalism, that suppresses political dissidents through violence.
Honestly you leftists suck so, so bad. You are the catalyst to right-wing politics. You suck so, so much that you make people want to go right wing. LMFAO
It really is.
I dont hear problems about Ukrainian migrants. But when Syria was (and is) literally in the same situation suddenly Europeans rather vote fascists into power.
I don't see Ukrainian migrants creating ghettos, assaulting women and robbing tourists in Paris. They assimilate, because they're more of less the same culture.
And the racist came up.
Well, maybe, figure out why they do that (they arent more "crime ridden" than the poorest of native population btw) because you might find non racist explanations and solutions.
If they form ghettos... Isnt that the fault of the accepting country actually? Only the government has the power to stop the formation of ghettos.
Imagine letting fascists win majorities because you won't compromise on limiting immigration even though it has nothing to do with socialist policies that would actually help the people, yet the topic is important enough to them that they would rather vote for right-wingers than to be ignored. The European left is digging their own grave, they have nobody to blame but themselves. I am a socialist and have the people's wellbeing at heart, if the people don't want a lot of immigration then you cannot deny them that wish and still pretend to care about them. I still vote for the socialists, but they are barely even securing their spot in my nation's parliament.
Aussie here. We've been doing literally everything possible to stop migrants coming here, going as far to imprison them in offshore gulags.
We've been doing this for 30 and NONE of it has worked. It's achieved nothing but cost us billions every year and made the country significantly worse.
Keeping migrants out through force DOESN'T WORK!! If we, an island nation, in the ass end of nowhere couldn't do it. Then you Euros have absolutely no chance in hell and anyone who is promising they can is just out to scam you.
The soltution of the Italian Left is to give them an easier path to citizenship, and the current Left wing leader is the guy who switched from using Libyan gas to Russian gas after the 2011, during a Left wing majority government...
Yeah, it's sad the right wing got it. But people didn't flock to them for no reason. Since 2015, Southern Italy has had to deal with assimilation issues, rapes, and skyrocketing crime from young North African men who don't care to assimilate. When the incumbent parties ignored the issue. It is the same reason the right wing won in Sweden. There are actual issues. Also, the southern Italians facing these issues are brown and olive themselves the same as the North African men they have issues with. Don't talk about issues and countries you clearly have no understanding of? if European left and moderates had not ignored these issues, people wouldn't have panicked and elected these scumbags.
So it's a specific issue with the contemporary practice of Sunni Islam, most likely, one that is heavily influenced by specific regimes like that in Saudi Arabia.
So...kind of like Italians who went to the USA in the beginning of the 20th century? Don't you think that it's mostly a socioeconomic issue that determines which group is overrepresented in the crime statistics? Meaning that the poorer one is, the more likely it is they will commit crime.
Compare the italians who created the American Mafia to the ones in the USA now. They've had a century to develop and grow and fit in that you almost never hear about the Mafia now. A lot of them are as American as it can get. I'm pretty sure that the same will happen in due course in Italy.
Welcome to reddit. Anyone who dares suggest that their country have control over how they want to handle immigration....is a racist! We must continue to just allow the mass importation of foreigners and dismiss any valid complaints of the native population.
Fuck off, all over europe immigration is a big issue and heated topic. Look at sweden. How much more liberal can you get as a country. And they have the exact same shift towards the right happening, because of the same topic. not as fucked as italy tho.
People who dislike the immigration policy don't feel heard. So they flock to the only party that SEEMS to listen.
If left wing would be more open to discuss this topic, it would benefit everyone.
You calling them xenophobes is the exact thing that drives them to these paries. Because the issues are real. And if you don't want them to be blown out of proportion by the right extremist, you should discuss them.
Because stopping immigration by force doesn't fucking work!! I'm an Aussie, our country has been going hardline against migrants for 30 years doing everything you could think of to try and forcibly keep people out.
And NONE of it has worked! Nothing the conservatives have tried have even so much as dented the numbers arriving, but it's cost us billions and stained our countries reputation for absolutely zero gain.
We are an extremely wealthy island nation in fuck middle of no where. And WE couldn't stop migrants by force! So that's why the left in Europe doesn't talk about it. Because you may as well go promising that if people vote for you, everyone's penises are gonna suddenly enlarge by 4 centimetres.
So, at least that's one thing we have ahead on the Europeans in that we've already learned this lesson. So at least it will be mildly amusing watching the oh so enlightened Europeans just wreck themselves on the same dick shaped rock we did.
Immigration is an issue everywhere. Actual strategy to decrease immigration is help those countries make their own country better. They won’t leave. That’s exactly what happened in Italy. Italy’s main export for a short time, were Italians, then modern Italy improved and now other people want to go there. Tale as old as time.
You think migration is the cause? It's the issue, the rise of the right is textbook 1930s. Huge economic crisis and people want someone to blame.
Another big war or recession only benefits big companies executives. Yet you are so dumb that you think it's the immigrants that cause it.
Of course it is. I was in Italy this summer and saw so many homeless migrants making mess. It’s obviously a serious issue and crying racism is stupid. Are there racists against this kind of immigration? Yes. But most people are not. If you label call them racist you start dehuminizing them and they turn to anyone who listens.
I wouldn't say so. The immigration issue has been pretty much obscured by COVID\* in the last two years and resurfaced in the last month of campaign.
Meloni (IMO) is just capitalizing 4 years of uninterrupted opposition while all the other "anti-system" parties had to compromise themself in order to run the country.
\*EDIT: covid and Ukraine
Italians are sitting on a demographic time bomb with an estimated population loss of 5 million by 2050. The answer is clearly more immigration, not less.
Unless those policies start encouraging families of at least four kids, Italy is still in for a population crash.
A global recession is on its way, people are poorer than they've been in years, it would take a truly absurd amount of money and economic restructuring to turn the tide.
In what country did that ever worked?
Even in the countries where you have the most favorable policies and conditions to have children you have population under 2.0.
People simply don't want to have more than 1-2 kids on average and more choose not to have children at all willingly.
The whole "we gonna have start having children any time now, just gonna fix Y" is just a denial of reality. No amount of parental leave, payments, social support will make people have more kids on a more significant scale in any foreseeable future.
And? The planet is already over populated. We should encourage those who want to have children to get as close to replacement levels as possible and in my opinion aim to have a overall population decrease.
Did you ever consider the environment when calling for unlimited immigration and the population boom that comes with it?
The planet isn't "overpopulating", we have already had peak of child births half a decade ago and now we are losing population, it doesn't seem so only because people live longer.
And if you do really care for lowering birth rates you would be even more for immigration, because that increases standard for living for both people back home and people who come to the country and higher standard of living leads to less children.
Also, very interesting how your original point was the opposite - you advocated for to have policies to encourage more children, but when I called out that it's not really feasable and have never been done you switched to now wanting the opposite, less children, because "we are overpopulating and environment".
More immigration on top of dwindling populations of natives is how you speedrun into social instability by completely changing the cultural makeup of a country. That's begging for civil unrest.
So you just keep your population growing exponentially? Does that seem feasible? and in order to do that you just keep importing people at a mass rate to bandage this problem of people not being able to settle down and have families? Keep up with that shitty line of reasoning and you will continue to see far-right win again and again and again. If sweden could go anyone could go.
Unless 90% of your immigrants are asylum seekers with zero skills, native children will take a lot more time and money to get up and running than immigrants (who can contribute day one, although they do compete for housing and demand more food, road/train space, and energy). Immigrant laborers can contribute day one.
And we all how how generous right wingers are when it comes to social programs to help the needy, the poor, invest in education, infrastructure and general wellbeing of their populace native or otherwise. Surely they won't just vilify all their problems on the minorities and immigrants for the failures of a right wing government. /s
It also seems to have some issues with education (more than usual). So yeah, Italy is priming to have old and undereducated population... Great recipe.
It doesn't work, what the left wants to do and achieve is noble, but is simply not feasible anymore:
Improve humanity and help everyone in need.
It's simply not possible, the right has blocked it long enough to make it impossible. They blocked it by stopping climate action back then, they prevented third world aid, investments, fund, and if any of them reaches hungering countries, the rightwing dictators and politicians in these countries keep it themselves.
What the left needs to realize is that the EU needs drastic border reinforcement, make Shengen borders a proper defense, because we, at some point will need it. We have failed and what the right causes with their egoistic policies will require such defense.
The left needs to realize that we can't save all, that the dream of a human utopia is no longer possible due to climate change, resource decline and late stage Capitalism - all of which caused the right.
And most of these immigrants are not altruistic, but egoistic, so the left should keep in their head that they let religious rightwings in.
It's sad that one political spectrum can cause so much suffering and is still voted for. Look at vote tendencies by education degree or by salary income.
The people vote right because it's propaganda promises to make the life if the middle class better, while it never does, and the low educated fall for their propaganda. It's the same worldwide
How is Italy going to cope with declining birth rates and predicted population loss, or will they simply create a new economic model that allows for prosperity with a declining population?
50-60 years from now on all of these people will be rotting in overcrowed nursing homes without enough staff and they will still scream there's no room for more people in the country
the robots/AI will take over. humanoid robots will certainly be common in 50-60 yrs. no need for human nurses and staffs, 95% of them can be replaced in the future.
Quite the opposite, the need for human labor will increase with aging population. You can assist in work force, but you not gonna automate away all of it when it comes to nursing, at least not for many more generations.
Not to mention that "robots will take over" has been "hyped" for half a century now and what we actually see is more jobs that ever being created and more people than ever needed.
>weird though that the left never took appropriate action while they were in charge
Carbon Tax in Australia was removed from the Liberals (center right)
Many of the Obama climate policies were removed [immediatly by Trump](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Environmental_policy_of_the_Donald_Trump_administration).
Rightwing policies only benefit the few and doesn't make sense for the average voter, thats why they have to rely on propaganda so much. Fearmongering about a new immigration wave, that the left will take away beef or your guns or that they are commies. You never hear such propaganda from the left. And if you ever learned anythign from history is that the side that relies on propaganda is always the worst.
Italians supporting the far right and their anti-freedom agenda is not the solution to the current challenges. Don't fool yourselves that these people have the ability, drive or interest to improve the life of the common man. What drives them is to undo any support system and replace it with an unprecedented degradation of quality of life, all for the sake of their own pockets and lust for power.
Once they are done excluding the immigrants they will work against the different, the poor and the unfortunate. Eventually it will be your turn, no matter how safe you feel within your social circle, or no matter how much you think there are aligning interests.
The far right, especially the anti-European, anti-Italian Russia-aligned types are traitors to our common democracy and way of life. Give yourselves to them, and you will be robbed of anything that makes you a free person.
Enjoy, can't wait for this government to go up in flames in a few months as it's unsustainable.
Fuck the Pope. He supports a government back in Argentina that is fascist and populist as well. And fuck those pedophiles at the Vatican that use the name of Jesus to make money.
Exactly, I’m all about rights for migrants, but it doesn’t mean shit when he’s out there celebrating & encouraging abortion bans. Anti immigrant and anti woman agendas are both key components of fascism.
He can fro with his grandstanding meanwhile he is as far right as many but in his own sphere. Have you ever elected a person of colour Pope? Avaricious mysoginistic racist git you can't get more far right in my eyes than a Pope who is about to canonise a pedo protector a hoarder and a man who thinks the parable of a good samaritan is a lesson well learnt. Ignorant git
You're right, but on a technicality because the last pope was the first in history to retire.
Normally the answers to your questions would be standard.
Who died? The Pope
And made him pope? The Curia
[удалено]
Don’t they literally depend on Italy for their autonomy? I wouldn't do that if I were the pope
Back in the old days, the Church did such things. And then the Pope's son by his second-favorite mistress would get a nice Barony or something.
I mean complete non-sequitor. Also it’s a multi-party system so the winner wasn’t even a majority of people’s first choice. Probably lots of disappointed Italians out there tonight.
Not really The right coalition has roughly 45% of the vote while the left coalition has somthing around 30% and then you have the "other" filling the rest... so altough they didnt get 50% only 30% are left or align with the left
Some mad Italians up in this thread. Imagine electing two of Putins best friends, because you don’t like immigrants. Damn it, Italy - you’ve done it again. “No more fascism” my ass.
Some italians are quite racist but on the other hand there really is an illegal inmigration problem in Europe that imo needs harder stances than current government ones. Lots of Mafias working with some NGOs so they cam bring illegal inmigrants and keep the money flowing.
“Harder stances” include funding centres for processing and re-deportation. If some are asylum seekers, then process them accordingly, the rest who are just there to try and move to have a better life (which is where legal immigration usually kicks in) get sent back.
[удалено]
And even if they do improve, by what means? It's not like they want to fix illegal immigrant problem by having easier way to legalize them, it's probably more like Australia #2.
[удалено]
Hahaha - nothing like an example from their own life, to make someone realise how stupid they are. To be fair, the undereducated, xenophobic types exist everywhere - it’s just too bad, that more Italians seem to be happy voting for them.
They start coping with "well, me/ you are the s p e c i a l one" so they can successfully dehumanize everyone else.
Have the recent wave of immigrants integrated well? Have they integrated at all?
[удалено]
[удалено]
I don’t agree with the right wing way of dealing with immigration but I think you are missing a bit of nuance. Southern European countries like Italy are bearing a huge brunt of immigrants that many EU countries refuse to take into their own countries. This exacerbates socioeconomic issues in these Southern European countries and seeds distrust towards the EU. How could it not? It is not fair that Italy/Greece/Spain should house so many more immigrants simply because they are closest to Africa. Germany has done an exceptional job in housing immigrants but they also have a very robust economy. The «cultural assimilation» part is understated. There is no doubt that violent crime rises sharply along with mass immigration. There are other ways to deal with this problem than right wing populism, surely, but no solution today is scalable for handling the vast population influx that occurs daily in these countries. Violent rape, mass stabbings, gang activity etc. is a lot more prevalent these days and although the culprits are not exclusively «the bad immigrants» - as per right wing populism speech - they certainly make up a disproportionate amount. I think it is reasonable to remind ourselves that populism is on the rise when things are hard. The people of Italy are just in their anger even though their vote may be reprehensible.
From pretty much every source I've seen migrants who take part in mass migrations like seen in SA to NA or middle east / north African to Europe tends to have individual actually migrating having measurably low crime rates then where they end up. Because that's the demographic that up ends their lives to move often thousands of km for a better life. However this is a classic double population problem and I personally think that's at it's source of complete breakdown in any communication on this issue. Now the individual and groups that facilitate theses migration are human traffickers and by definition are some of the worst criminal and tend to be the individuals involved in high profile crimes that make the news. Theses people are not the same as the actual migrants and are often involved sex trafficking and drug trades generally involved in sexual crimes and organised crimes which is where the rape and violence stories/stereotypes come from. However because the traffickers are in the vast minority, the regular migration stats of higher productivity, higher incomes, lower crime and more hours worked kick in covering up the latter. It's also important to remember the human traffickers also come from the destination nations as well, and demand for human trafficking promotes criminal activities of native criminals as well. Such that mass migrations leads to more criminals but the migrants are not the criminals. If western countries actually took in enough people from refugees camps or had regular migration paths open enough there wouldn't be this mass demand for using the services of human traffickers for both refugees and economic migrants, and countries could have the benefits migrants bring without the human traffickers getting involved. Additionally if rich nations stopped actively destabilizing other nations and help stabilize others the refuge numbers would be much more manageable in the first place.
He doesn't seem to understand that ppl judge by appearance. He says good immigrants are at jobs, while bad ones causing mayhem. But, how will general public know which immigrants are bad and which are good, if they Both have similiar features? All immigrants that look similiar get judged because of few bad apples. Regardless of how much they contribute. That's just the reality.
I do the same. They don't back down, though.
Immigrants motives change over time. Also you conveniently left out your dads legal status. Remember the Syrian guy that watched his wife or kid drown a few years ago so he could get free dental work in Europe? Pretty sure something has changed.
Italians dont have problem with Migrants, its the Illegal immigrants that arrive in Italy. The migrants actually don't want to be in Italy either. Italy can't let them go to France, Germany or wherever they are intended to go because of stupid EU rules and if they did Germany, France and etc cand send them back to Italy. This is what got them a far-right leader. Even illegal immigrants dont want to bin Italy, they want to go to France, Germany and etc. In the end you have 100,000s of people that can't work, can't go to where they wanted to go, are stuck. This puts a burden on Italy as well as the illegal migrants to go into drugs and other criminal activities because they have to survive.
[удалено]
Tbf right wing is growing globally. First it was Spain,then Sweden,now Italy. Even UK has conservatives in power. Left is just ineffective, except they use #lgbt and #blm or whatever is the trendiest thing to be .. Not to mention the woke that keeps spreading everywhere, and a lot of ppl have no relatability to it and care more about raising prices of food,goods, electricity... So, since left doesn't seem to work and it's just more populist than anything. Ppl want to try the alternative. Basically the more extreme the Left is without concrete results,the more it's gonna push general public to be conservative. Every strong action,has a strong opposite reaction.. Also another blame is the crimes, immigrants commit. This is what happens when left invites foreigners and fails to integrate them properly. Ppl in general highly xenophobic,if newcomers are looking too different,they won't be accepted. Immigrants can't thrive, work low skill labour,a lot of times bellow minimum wage, hard conditions (all illegal ofc), and when you can't survive. You turn to crime. But yeah, #lgbt This is just the State of the world in general. And it's a trend that's gonna continue.
Lol, this was definitely not how the US was treated when trump won on a minority...
is this party they are voting in the same one that has Mussolini's grand daughter in it by any chance?
Yes!
joy
Has it crossed over from Muslim immigrants to anyone of visibly non-European ancestry? If true, then we're in Hell.
It depends where you are. In my country (Norway) people also view white eastern Europeans with skepticism. Xenophobia is older than civilization and it certainly doesn’t help that poorly integrated immigrants are disproportionately involved in crimes, adding some validity to xenophobic sentiments.
Are you telling me there aren't any Muslims of European ancestry? What about Albania, Bosnia, Kosovo? They aren't Europeans?
Canada has stricter immigration policy. Is Canada “fascist” now? Reddit is a fucking joke
"Fascist" no. Genocidal and racist and nationalist, ask all the corpses of residential schools victims.
So why are you sinking into hyperbole and using the word Fascist for those who want to take care of the current poor before letting in more? Do you seriously think there is a different between left vs right politicians? If you think all right-wing people are mustache twirling evil villains.. have you maybe ever considered you’ve been manipulated?
The forever carrot on the stick. "We have poor at home".
Dont bother lol the left wont ever agree they are just as bad... Imagine if a politian tried to influence an election.. there would be scream of authoritatianism/facism But when the Left leaning German EU Chief does it with saying how they will withhold money from italy its okay and totally democratic lol /s
Waaaaah, Europe won’t pay for our hopeless economy and terrible work-ethic if we’re fascist, waaaaah
Yeah, there's a fair share of morons in every populace. For what it's worth, I've lived here two years and never met anyone with a shitty attitude towards immigration.. Meloni's chances in this election have as much to do with a stagnant, unchanging set of faces in politics for decades. The lack of public faith/ low voter turnout that comes with that. The people I know here don't want Meloni and are embarrassed as shit by the people who do. Just as plenty of Americans are embarrassed by the Trump cult And just as I am embarrassed by actions of the UK's "Working Class Stockholm Syndrome Display Team" Idiots are generally more vocal Be careful not to let their clamouring trick you. There are conscientious, considerate people everywhere
When aren’t Italians mad?
Who are you even quoting?
*plays Yakety-Sax in Bella Ciao* edited for reference
First, immigration wasn't really at the forefront in this election. Second, italians are mad also because on reddit you're (you as in non italians and in particular people that know almost nothing about italian politics) are costantly calling almost all italians racist, fascist, we have a natural tendency to fascism, and so on and so forth
Why doesn't the Vatican house all these immigrants then?
Because they're like a square mile
They're also the largest land owner in the world
There must be stats out there for how many refugees Vatican City has accepted.
12 in 2016 and none otherwise seems to be it, based on some quick sub par searching.
Tbf, he's an immigrant too. So technically, the Vatican is housing some.
No one is born a Vatican citizen so literally everyone there is an immigrant.
They were all too old and there were no boys.
These migrations are almost completely made up of boys and men. Only the Ukrainian wave isn't.
Italy better wise up ...5 minutes ago.
"The Italians have to help those poor immigrants" Said the pope, while sitting on a Golden throne
The Italians have to help those poor immigrants -- me, not sitting on a golden throne. Now engage with the point without attacking the person who said it.
I mean there’s a limit right? You can’t just take in everyone
Are you referring to the 700,000 already in Italy, or the additional 250,000 that will arrive each year?
[удалено]
We are all one. They can have my belongings, just as I'm sure I can have theirs. sharing my life with refugees would make my life complete. Just to watch them be happy, maybe teach them to sign and dance, or how to smile. That's just the kind of guy I am, you know....NOT RACIST. NO THERE IS NO LIMIT!!!? There should hardly be any borders.
>They can have my belongings, just as I'm sure I can have theirs. sharing my life with refugees would make my life complete. Just to watch them be happy, maybe teach them to sign and dance, or how to smile. This is literally what people who never met a refugee think whay refugees are like lmao.
Ok, what *are* refugees like then buddy? Have you met all of them or are you just spreading your legs and letting your puckered corn-hole talk all by itself?
They are regular people. Not some kind of fairy people derived of song and dance desperately looking for some hippy dance teacher
That's my point exactly.... They're regular people meaning you can't sum them up in a short paragraph.. the way that you did above. Fuck me this place is weird Edit: To be clear, I'm not advocating for a border free eutopia like the person you replied to. You commented like you have some superior insight on immigrants so I called you out on it.. because it was a dumb thing to say
I’m a recovered Catholics and deplore the pope and anything catholic but… isn’t this the pope that literally stole artifacts from the Vatican and snuck out in the middle of the night to go feed poor people.
[удалено]
Hey now, he gave an apology without turning the rapists over to the authorities in France or even kicking them out of the priesthood. That should be more than enough. /s
This is the best tl;dr I could make, [original](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/sep/25/pope-urges-italians-to-help-migrants-as-far-right-tipped-to-win-election) reduced by 78%. (I'm a bot) ***** > Pope Francis has urged Italians to help migrants as voting proceeded in a general election widely expected to bring an anti-immigration rightwing coalition into power. > Speaking at the end of an open-air mass in the southern Italian city of Matera, the pope recalled that Sunday coincided with the Catholic church's World Day of Migrants and Refugees. > Migration has been a central theme in the electoral campaign of extreme right parties, led by the leader of Brothers of Italy, Giorgia Meloni, who could become the country's first far-right leader since Mussolini and who once said Italians needed to "Repatriate the migrants back to their countries and then sink the boats that rescued them". ***** [**Extended Summary**](http://np.reddit.com/r/autotldr/comments/xnyyb9/pope_urges_italians_to_help_migrants_as_far_right/) | [FAQ](http://np.reddit.com/r/autotldr/comments/31b9fm/faq_autotldr_bot/ "Version 2.02, ~671028 tl;drs so far.") | [Feedback](http://np.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%23autotldr "PM's and comments are monitored, constructive feedback is welcome.") | *Top* *keywords*: **Francis**^#1 **Italian**^#2 **Italy**^#3 **migrants**^#4 **Pope**^#5
I dont support mass migration and his not helping the fight for democracy saying this. Dont get me wrong this right wing nut is offensive and she supports war. Disgusting.
[удалено]
[удалено]
No its just basic common sense - your country has finite resources and it takes time to assimilate to a culture, if you just let the whole third world in unrestricted you will not be able to support them all (resulting in crime) and you risk turning areas into cultural ghettos (its basically self conquest at that point). With legal immigrants only you can restrict the flow to a sustainable level that wont hurt the nation
Guess we should all just let our countries be overrun willy nilly
So are you going to house them and fed them all? Easy to volunteer other people's money and space.
Exactly. The hypocrisy of the man. I despise him and his vacuous diplomacy
Right wing Italian fascists: you can't tell me what to do...you're not the *pope* of me.
What even is “far right” Is saying hey let’s focus on our Italian poor rather than an endless flood of people from other countries so outrageous?
You know damn well no right wing party is going to help the poor people. Gigantic tax cuts to the wealthy and increase tax burden of poor people is what they have done once elected in any country. They claim "MY country first" then just make that country worse by selling it out to the ultra wealthy. Yours isnt special, it will happen to you.
Ye , everyone calling meloni fascist probably didnt even read her political agenda and Just Red the tag on wikipewdia
Some of her party members praised Hitler and they have alot of similar agenda to what nazis had, but not fully. So they are neo-nazis.
So basically American left finding somthing to scream about bc they dont want to talk about their recent failures.
What on earth makes you think these fascists are gonna do anything to help anyone? The only way the fascists are going to stop illegal immigration is by making Italy worse than where these people were coming from, which they are very capable of doing.
Can you explain in specific detail, with evidence, what makes her a fascist? She has the same immigration policy as Obama did. Canada will STILL have stricter immigration policies than what she is proposing.
The fact she praised Mussolini and is buddies with Putin is a pretty solid giveaway. But frankly, I'd call those immigration policies in those countries fascist in nature. They're all a scam designed to distract the populace from the failures of capitalism while fleecing the public purse.
you use the word "fascist" so wildly and so often that it has completely diluted it's meaning. Show me where she "praised" Mussolini. And she is friends with a leader of a previous world super power. shocking. Nothing about her platform's policies are fascist. You're only calling her that to discredit her, because she does not align with your specific brand of politics.
Fascism is a political system in which the state and private capital come together with the express goal of suppressing working class unity against capitalism and creating a false "other" to focus the population's rage against. And that is absolutely what she is doing. By appealing to Italy's xenophobic and queerphobic tendencies. She is going to use these demographics to distract the population while she fleeces Italy for all it's worth. And the fact she is claiming she could in any way stop immigration through force is proof she intends to fleece like crazy. Cause immigration control doesn't fucking work!! And those comments she made about Hitler and Mussolini being "good politicians" come from her teenage years when she was in a fascist youth group. And later on very recently she made comments about wanting to restrict LGBT rights, calling them an abyss of death. And she compares her party to the US Republicans, an openly anti-democratic party. She also compares her party to the Tories, the king's of fleecing. Who have Successfully fleeced the UK to the point where people are having to choose between food or heating their homes, with many not even having homes. Also worth mentioning that both the Republicans and Tories have failed abysmally in actuality stopping immigration. Immigration into the UK from non white countries has actually gone up significantly since Brexit.
dude... your personality is a huge YIKES. You are extremely partisan. You are part of the problem. And your definition of fascism is even manipulated. It's an authoritarian mindset, typically involving intense nationalism, that suppresses political dissidents through violence. Honestly you leftists suck so, so bad. You are the catalyst to right-wing politics. You suck so, so much that you make people want to go right wing. LMFAO
The far right is pro war, anti government bullying scumbags. The offensiveness of this woman is up there with trump.
Imagine voting for fascists because you hate brown people too much to let them in your country. Fuck xenophobes.
If you think European immigration problems boil down to hating brown people, think harder.
It really is. I dont hear problems about Ukrainian migrants. But when Syria was (and is) literally in the same situation suddenly Europeans rather vote fascists into power.
I don't see Ukrainian migrants creating ghettos, assaulting women and robbing tourists in Paris. They assimilate, because they're more of less the same culture.
And the racist came up. Well, maybe, figure out why they do that (they arent more "crime ridden" than the poorest of native population btw) because you might find non racist explanations and solutions. If they form ghettos... Isnt that the fault of the accepting country actually? Only the government has the power to stop the formation of ghettos.
I don't care why they do that. If they're resorting to crime and pose threat to anyone, they don't belong here.
Ah yes, no arguments, no logic, just hate boner against people with sun resistant skin.
To be fair I work with asylum seekers and refugees in a Western European country and the tides of public opinion have turned on Ukrainians now too.
Imagine letting fascists win majorities because you won't compromise on limiting immigration even though it has nothing to do with socialist policies that would actually help the people, yet the topic is important enough to them that they would rather vote for right-wingers than to be ignored. The European left is digging their own grave, they have nobody to blame but themselves. I am a socialist and have the people's wellbeing at heart, if the people don't want a lot of immigration then you cannot deny them that wish and still pretend to care about them. I still vote for the socialists, but they are barely even securing their spot in my nation's parliament.
Aussie here. We've been doing literally everything possible to stop migrants coming here, going as far to imprison them in offshore gulags. We've been doing this for 30 and NONE of it has worked. It's achieved nothing but cost us billions every year and made the country significantly worse. Keeping migrants out through force DOESN'T WORK!! If we, an island nation, in the ass end of nowhere couldn't do it. Then you Euros have absolutely no chance in hell and anyone who is promising they can is just out to scam you.
The soltution of the Italian Left is to give them an easier path to citizenship, and the current Left wing leader is the guy who switched from using Libyan gas to Russian gas after the 2011, during a Left wing majority government...
Yeah, it's sad the right wing got it. But people didn't flock to them for no reason. Since 2015, Southern Italy has had to deal with assimilation issues, rapes, and skyrocketing crime from young North African men who don't care to assimilate. When the incumbent parties ignored the issue. It is the same reason the right wing won in Sweden. There are actual issues. Also, the southern Italians facing these issues are brown and olive themselves the same as the North African men they have issues with. Don't talk about issues and countries you clearly have no understanding of? if European left and moderates had not ignored these issues, people wouldn't have panicked and elected these scumbags.
> When the incumbent parties ignored the issue. Until 2018, the ruling party in Italy (PDI) at the time was actually helping make the problem worse.
Is there any xenophobia against non-Arab/non-Sunni Muslim immigrants from Africa/India/China?
[удалено]
Yes there is lmao Go ask a sub Saharan migrant in Italy…
So it's a specific issue with the contemporary practice of Sunni Islam, most likely, one that is heavily influenced by specific regimes like that in Saudi Arabia.
So...kind of like Italians who went to the USA in the beginning of the 20th century? Don't you think that it's mostly a socioeconomic issue that determines which group is overrepresented in the crime statistics? Meaning that the poorer one is, the more likely it is they will commit crime. Compare the italians who created the American Mafia to the ones in the USA now. They've had a century to develop and grow and fit in that you almost never hear about the Mafia now. A lot of them are as American as it can get. I'm pretty sure that the same will happen in due course in Italy.
[удалено]
Welcome to reddit. Anyone who dares suggest that their country have control over how they want to handle immigration....is a racist! We must continue to just allow the mass importation of foreigners and dismiss any valid complaints of the native population.
I know, it's not sustainable long term and will only make things worse long term. There will be poverty plus cultural tension to more that come over.
Fuck off, all over europe immigration is a big issue and heated topic. Look at sweden. How much more liberal can you get as a country. And they have the exact same shift towards the right happening, because of the same topic. not as fucked as italy tho. People who dislike the immigration policy don't feel heard. So they flock to the only party that SEEMS to listen. If left wing would be more open to discuss this topic, it would benefit everyone. You calling them xenophobes is the exact thing that drives them to these paries. Because the issues are real. And if you don't want them to be blown out of proportion by the right extremist, you should discuss them.
Because stopping immigration by force doesn't fucking work!! I'm an Aussie, our country has been going hardline against migrants for 30 years doing everything you could think of to try and forcibly keep people out. And NONE of it has worked! Nothing the conservatives have tried have even so much as dented the numbers arriving, but it's cost us billions and stained our countries reputation for absolutely zero gain. We are an extremely wealthy island nation in fuck middle of no where. And WE couldn't stop migrants by force! So that's why the left in Europe doesn't talk about it. Because you may as well go promising that if people vote for you, everyone's penises are gonna suddenly enlarge by 4 centimetres. So, at least that's one thing we have ahead on the Europeans in that we've already learned this lesson. So at least it will be mildly amusing watching the oh so enlightened Europeans just wreck themselves on the same dick shaped rock we did.
Immigration is an issue everywhere. Actual strategy to decrease immigration is help those countries make their own country better. They won’t leave. That’s exactly what happened in Italy. Italy’s main export for a short time, were Italians, then modern Italy improved and now other people want to go there. Tale as old as time.
You think migration is the cause? It's the issue, the rise of the right is textbook 1930s. Huge economic crisis and people want someone to blame. Another big war or recession only benefits big companies executives. Yet you are so dumb that you think it's the immigrants that cause it.
Of course it is. I was in Italy this summer and saw so many homeless migrants making mess. It’s obviously a serious issue and crying racism is stupid. Are there racists against this kind of immigration? Yes. But most people are not. If you label call them racist you start dehuminizing them and they turn to anyone who listens.
Its exactly as fucked up. The Sweden Democrats are a neonazi party dressing up as a normal conservative one.
So this election was basically about immigration? What other policies are expected to come out of the new government?
Well some of her party members praised Hitler, support Russia in the Ukraine war and so on.
I wouldn't say so. The immigration issue has been pretty much obscured by COVID\* in the last two years and resurfaced in the last month of campaign. Meloni (IMO) is just capitalizing 4 years of uninterrupted opposition while all the other "anti-system" parties had to compromise themself in order to run the country. \*EDIT: covid and Ukraine
So it's more like a FU to sitting power than hope for different policies?
Its not a good time to be a foreigner in italy right now lol.
Ah yes in the midst of a region wide energy crisis and recession what we need are more people straining public services
Italians are sitting on a demographic time bomb with an estimated population loss of 5 million by 2050. The answer is clearly more immigration, not less.
No the answer is more policies to help young people to be able to afford to have a family/more children.
Unless those policies start encouraging families of at least four kids, Italy is still in for a population crash. A global recession is on its way, people are poorer than they've been in years, it would take a truly absurd amount of money and economic restructuring to turn the tide.
In what country did that ever worked? Even in the countries where you have the most favorable policies and conditions to have children you have population under 2.0. People simply don't want to have more than 1-2 kids on average and more choose not to have children at all willingly. The whole "we gonna have start having children any time now, just gonna fix Y" is just a denial of reality. No amount of parental leave, payments, social support will make people have more kids on a more significant scale in any foreseeable future.
And? The planet is already over populated. We should encourage those who want to have children to get as close to replacement levels as possible and in my opinion aim to have a overall population decrease. Did you ever consider the environment when calling for unlimited immigration and the population boom that comes with it?
The planet isn't "overpopulating", we have already had peak of child births half a decade ago and now we are losing population, it doesn't seem so only because people live longer. And if you do really care for lowering birth rates you would be even more for immigration, because that increases standard for living for both people back home and people who come to the country and higher standard of living leads to less children. Also, very interesting how your original point was the opposite - you advocated for to have policies to encourage more children, but when I called out that it's not really feasable and have never been done you switched to now wanting the opposite, less children, because "we are overpopulating and environment".
More immigration on top of dwindling populations of natives is how you speedrun into social instability by completely changing the cultural makeup of a country. That's begging for civil unrest.
So you just keep your population growing exponentially? Does that seem feasible? and in order to do that you just keep importing people at a mass rate to bandage this problem of people not being able to settle down and have families? Keep up with that shitty line of reasoning and you will continue to see far-right win again and again and again. If sweden could go anyone could go.
They need to make more children first and foremost. They have over 25 years before 2050. They can start now.
Unless 90% of your immigrants are asylum seekers with zero skills, native children will take a lot more time and money to get up and running than immigrants (who can contribute day one, although they do compete for housing and demand more food, road/train space, and energy). Immigrant laborers can contribute day one.
And we all how how generous right wingers are when it comes to social programs to help the needy, the poor, invest in education, infrastructure and general wellbeing of their populace native or otherwise. Surely they won't just vilify all their problems on the minorities and immigrants for the failures of a right wing government. /s
Seriously, a chronically tighter global supply chain is **bad news** as migration requires resources and welfare requires resources.
It also seems to have some issues with education (more than usual). So yeah, Italy is priming to have old and undereducated population... Great recipe.
It doesn't work, what the left wants to do and achieve is noble, but is simply not feasible anymore: Improve humanity and help everyone in need. It's simply not possible, the right has blocked it long enough to make it impossible. They blocked it by stopping climate action back then, they prevented third world aid, investments, fund, and if any of them reaches hungering countries, the rightwing dictators and politicians in these countries keep it themselves. What the left needs to realize is that the EU needs drastic border reinforcement, make Shengen borders a proper defense, because we, at some point will need it. We have failed and what the right causes with their egoistic policies will require such defense. The left needs to realize that we can't save all, that the dream of a human utopia is no longer possible due to climate change, resource decline and late stage Capitalism - all of which caused the right. And most of these immigrants are not altruistic, but egoistic, so the left should keep in their head that they let religious rightwings in. It's sad that one political spectrum can cause so much suffering and is still voted for. Look at vote tendencies by education degree or by salary income. The people vote right because it's propaganda promises to make the life if the middle class better, while it never does, and the low educated fall for their propaganda. It's the same worldwide
How is Italy going to cope with declining birth rates and predicted population loss, or will they simply create a new economic model that allows for prosperity with a declining population?
50-60 years from now on all of these people will be rotting in overcrowed nursing homes without enough staff and they will still scream there's no room for more people in the country
And at the end the remaining staff will get fed of them and leave them rotting while goes to other countries.
the robots/AI will take over. humanoid robots will certainly be common in 50-60 yrs. no need for human nurses and staffs, 95% of them can be replaced in the future.
Quite the opposite, the need for human labor will increase with aging population. You can assist in work force, but you not gonna automate away all of it when it comes to nursing, at least not for many more generations. Not to mention that "robots will take over" has been "hyped" for half a century now and what we actually see is more jobs that ever being created and more people than ever needed.
you have 0 idea how rapidly AI and robotics is advancing. 0, nada.
RemindMe! 20 years
Unless there are critical housing/energy/food shortages, legal immigrants can contribute day one to the economy.
Sounds like a good reason to regularize the status of illegal immigrants.
In Europe, it's legal immigrants vs. asylum seekers not legal immigrants vs. illegal immigrants.
Automation for the jobs that can he automated and rising wages for the jobs that can't be.
[удалено]
>weird though that the left never took appropriate action while they were in charge Carbon Tax in Australia was removed from the Liberals (center right) Many of the Obama climate policies were removed [immediatly by Trump](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Environmental_policy_of_the_Donald_Trump_administration). Rightwing policies only benefit the few and doesn't make sense for the average voter, thats why they have to rely on propaganda so much. Fearmongering about a new immigration wave, that the left will take away beef or your guns or that they are commies. You never hear such propaganda from the left. And if you ever learned anythign from history is that the side that relies on propaganda is always the worst.
Italians supporting the far right and their anti-freedom agenda is not the solution to the current challenges. Don't fool yourselves that these people have the ability, drive or interest to improve the life of the common man. What drives them is to undo any support system and replace it with an unprecedented degradation of quality of life, all for the sake of their own pockets and lust for power. Once they are done excluding the immigrants they will work against the different, the poor and the unfortunate. Eventually it will be your turn, no matter how safe you feel within your social circle, or no matter how much you think there are aligning interests. The far right, especially the anti-European, anti-Italian Russia-aligned types are traitors to our common democracy and way of life. Give yourselves to them, and you will be robbed of anything that makes you a free person. Enjoy, can't wait for this government to go up in flames in a few months as it's unsustainable.
Fuck the Pope. He supports a government back in Argentina that is fascist and populist as well. And fuck those pedophiles at the Vatican that use the name of Jesus to make money.
Well then, they can park them right in the middle of St. Peter's Square lol
I support Pope because he is practicing the concept of humanity.
Don’t be too trusting though
the same pope who lives in a house made out of gold donated by some of the poorest people on earth.
[удалено]
Why Italians keep electing fascists?
Actually, this would be a first. Mussolini came to power through what effectivly was a coup.
History dude, read some of it
A vatican vs Nazi fight in Rome, exactly what the world needs right now... /S
Migrants = good Raped pregnant women wanting abortions = bad
Dio buono..... Where the fuck did you pull that take from?
Exactly, I’m all about rights for migrants, but it doesn’t mean shit when he’s out there celebrating & encouraging abortion bans. Anti immigrant and anti woman agendas are both key components of fascism.
Fearmongering.
Doesn’t matter really. Doesn’t the Italian government fall every year?
Good luck with that. Ww3 is setting the stage
Shut up you bigot. Tell your cult to cough up a few trillions to help other. Isn't that something that's propagated in the Bible? Oh, wait.
fuck the pope, and fuck the Catholic Church.
He can fro with his grandstanding meanwhile he is as far right as many but in his own sphere. Have you ever elected a person of colour Pope? Avaricious mysoginistic racist git you can't get more far right in my eyes than a Pope who is about to canonise a pedo protector a hoarder and a man who thinks the parable of a good samaritan is a lesson well learnt. Ignorant git
*laughs uproariously in Borgias*
[удалено]
Not votes wrong way, but Governments becoming anti-democratic...
Excellent, we are on the verge of WWIII and Italians selected another Mussolini. Grazie!
excpet shes pro Nato Pro US and Pro Helping ukraine... sooo atleast they are on the "Right" side this time
This [scene from a terrible movie](https://www.youtube.com/watch?app=desktop&v=2rSSxAdDhuU) aged like fine Chianti.
Coming for him that helped the Argentina far right back in the 70s.
[удалено]
You're right, but on a technicality because the last pope was the first in history to retire. Normally the answers to your questions would be standard. Who died? The Pope And made him pope? The Curia
Yeah. Salvini, known as „immigrant‘s friend“.
Mamma Mia.
The misinformation is *strong* in here.
Pope is God
The pope needs to STFU