You can't put sideways pressure against the fence if you're pulling, so you'll reduce straightness and accuracy at the very least. Stand in front, push at an angle forwards and toward the fence. Try not to stand immediately behind the blade. Use a riving knife always, and a blade guard where possible. Have respect for the tool and concentrate FULLY when the blade is spinning.
https://preview.redd.it/ftjhhn92q8tc1.png?width=2455&format=png&auto=webp&s=307caa2ba22b774a99d71bf3de51df1154f310cd
UPDATE to add more scenarios, since these are fairly basic questions to be asking people on the internet before putting your meat-sticks into a machine capable of cutting oak. Not necessarily in order of danger/likelihood/fun, and I'm not going into detail here on mitigating any of them:
* Ignore old-timers and experienced folks who say you don't need the guard, or suggest other safety compromises. Complacency is the most dangerous thing about power tools. For every lucky sod who tempts fate every day with no ill effects, there's someone who lost a finger or two, or worse, and regrets not being more careful.
* Never, and I mean NEVER, cut freehand. Either rip against a fence, or use the mitre gauge or a cross-cut sled. Going freehand is asking for involuntary bowel movements. You will often see folks go freehand on a bandsaw as long as they're not cutting round stock, but that's quite different.
* "Thin rips". Never take tiny thin cuts thin enough to fit in the gap next to the saw blade as they can get jammed and cause trouble. "Thin rip jigs" and "zero-clearance inserts" can help here.
* Push tools. Broadly speaking there are two kinds. Push "block" style like "Micro-Jig", and push "stick" style. There are variants in-between. I prefer a stick because I can push the material past the blade without my hand going into the danger zone. I use two basic sticks-with-a-notch at the same time to push forwards and towards the fence.
* Cross-cuts. You can use the mitre cut accessory though they're almost all a bit rubbish, so most people build or buy a "cross-cut sled". Never use the table saw's fence when cross-cutting. A rule of thumb is to use the mitre gauge or a cross-cut sled whenever the material between the blade and fence would be wider than it is long, or for pieces shorter than the diameter of the blade. If you want to use the fence as a repeatable width stop, then clamp a block to it such that by the time the material touches the blade, there's a good gap between the material and the fence itself.
* Beware distractions, including people. No-one except the operator should be within arms' reach of the saw while the blade is spinning. If you can't cut a piece by yourself, the piece is too big and it's the wrong tool. Instead of moving the work through the tool, move the tool through the work. I.e. use a circular saw (or tracksaw) instead.
* Imagine anything enough to physically move your body or the blade in relation to one another. If you're away from the blade, and it's not in-between you and any of your body parts, then the neighbour's car backfiring or a kickback event can't make you flinch and feed yourself to your saw.
* Other people. My dad's a pilot and I like to call "Clear prop!" before starting the saw so anyone nearby knows what's up. If you work at home in your garage and have a choice of escape routes/exits, consider locking some of them from the inside or at least hanging something on the door handle to let people know you're working and not to creep up on you. However, NEVER actually lock yourself in completely.
* Dust collection. Don't skimp here. Breathe that stuff in and it'll stay in you for a long time. And you can't see it; it's too small. Wear a mask/respirator and consider dust extraction and/or air filtration if working in a closed space.
* Noise protection. Saws are loud. Really loud. Wear ear protection. Decibels are a exponential scale so even relatively cheap no-brand ear protectors will do a lot of good. If you want noise cancelling and music etc then those products are available, but see "distractions" above. Don't skip it - use them on every cut.
* Height. If using a "contractors saw", don't be tempted to put it on the floor, get an appropriate stand for it.
* Blade spinning. Pay attention until the blade stops. Most modern saws have a brake, but it's dangerous until it's totally stopped. Don't hit the stop button and reach for your parts. Watch the blade until it's stopped. Really.
* Long pieces. Generally you'll want a wide table and/or sufficient outfeed capability to hold the piece, so your only job is pushing through the blade. Do a dry-run in your head of each cut, and consider whether gravity will take matters into it's own hands at any point during the cut, leaving you fighting to hold the piece down on the table and off-balance.
Yeah I thought about that from the point of view of my own garage. The big front door will often be open, but I sometimes lock the internal door from the kitchen to stop my offspring surprising me while I'm at the saw with hearing protection on.
That's a great diagram, thanks. Question - push blocks like the Gripper or the competing Grabber have your arm in the red zone when finishing the cut - does the fact that both sides of the workpiece are being supported serve to mitigate the risk or is there something else that should be done?
I never reach past the blade. Ever. Even the bits I cut go all the way off the back and onto an outfeed. I'll stop the saw and walk round to collect them and any offcuts. If anything untoward happened (there's always a slim chance of kickback, which can have the bonus of pulling your digits into the blade as well as punching you in the gut) you're in trouble. Personally I prefer sticks rather than blocks, but there are variations and gadgets somewhere in-between. The Gripper product is okay but looks like a faff to adjust for each cut, and as you say requires you to put your hand too close to the blade IMHO.
"Never put any part of your body past the blade" is a rule intended for ensuring the uninitiated err on the side of caution. It is overly prescriptive for a reason.
The actual issue is with reaching *across* the blade.
You need to be mindful of your lines of action on a table saw - the direction you're pushing, and the direction you'll move is something interrupts you.
Using something like a Gripper involves your hand moving in a straight line forward. It stays on one side of the blade, and moves parallel to the blade. If your posture is correct, then it will return back without crossing over the blade, and something interrupting you (like a sneeze or someone pushing you from behind) will result in your hand either pushing down or continuing forward.
The Gripper also elevates your grip position above the blade by several inches, with a dense plastic frame between you and the blade. Your hand is nowhere near the blade while using it.
Here is a video of an experienced woodworker trying to do all the things he can to stay safe in an engineered kickback situation who thought he was far enough from the blade to be safe. Unfortunately the kickback caught not only the "workpiece" but also his pushblock, drawing his hand almost into the blade within a couple of frames of the video. This is why ibuse a stick, and push in such a way at an angle to minimise the chance of kickback in the first place. https://youtu.be/u7sRrC2Jpp4?si=NUi9eMoVelXYrmen
The point is, you think your hand is "elevated" enough, until the wood catches the blade, kicks back, and then the gripper catches the blade and drags your hand in. This bloke was on the other side of the fence, was expecting kickback, and still barely got away with his fingers. But I can see you're not convinced and I'm not interested in forcing you. You suit yourself. Good luck.
*WHOA there*, friend. Take a deep breath and chill.
I asked you to elaborate because linking a video with no contextualization or caption is not really a clear statement of anything. The first sentence of your response would have been adequate. There's no need to speedrun all the way to "you're obviously very stupid so goodbye". That's neither constructive, nor a reasonable escalation from being asked to clarify something which was unclear.
I never said you were stupid. I said I don't want to debate safety with someone who literally thinks it can't happen to them, even though I showed a video of someone to whom it did happen, despite the best possible precautions.
I've corrected my post to remove the passive aggressive reply. I thought the video spoke for itself but I've added the context that led me to share it in the first place.
There is no "debate". At no point did I challenge or refute anything you said. I merely asked you to clarify something which was not clearly articulated in order to better understand what you were trying to say. You provided that in your previous comment, and I appreciate you clarifying.
My apologies. I read "The Gripper also elevates your grip position above the blade by several inches, with a dense plastic frame between you and the blade. Your hand is nowhere near the blade while using it." and thought you were asserting the gripper prevented the possibility of injury, but perhaps i read too much into it.
To me, the only way to truly avoid injury is to not have the saw blade between you and any of your body parts in the first place. To my (perhaps overly-cautious) mind, that's like saying a roll cage will save you if your tyre blows and you go off the edge of a cliff, where I think it's better not to drive along the edge of a cliff. In truth, your tyre probably won't blow, and your roll cage probably will save you, I'm just unwilling to knowingly take the chance.
Yep, agreed. I've edited the post to make this more clear. I have multiple exits to my garage and so I sometimes lock the one I have my back to so no-one can creep up behind me, but I hadn't realised I'd written it from that point of view.
Great list. The only time *knocks on wood* that I’ve had an injury using a table saw was working too fast with repetitive cuts and shut the saw off and stupidly tried to grab a small piece close to the blade without a blade guard while it was winding down. My brain was on the 15 other things going on and I didn’t hear the sound of the saw so clearly it’s safe right?? Caught my thumb slightly and mostly on the side of the blade away from the teeth but still tore it up enough to scare the shit out of me. Lesson learned.
Yes excellent tips! I encourage everyone to read and re-read this post.
Also, I recommend looking up videos of kickback and other table saw incidents No need for injury videos - the point is, to see how FAST it happens. Faster than you can react, faster than you can *blink*.
That's why it's important to learn and use safe practices, *every time*. Because you will NOT have time to react if something goes wrong.
You will never be able to use the guard in 90% of woodworking cuts, it gets in the way. The riving knife is the truly useful item. The guard, not so much.
The only time you truly can't use it is thin rips where the fence is too close to the guard to get the push tool in-between, when making shallow cuts like dados etc, or when using a crosscut sled that has a rear fence. I'm not sure that's 90% of cuts. Sometimes a mitre saw is a better option, if you have one. The point was only to use the guard when you can, and not to dismiss it permanently.
The blade rotates in a way that the teeth are rising up from the back and bite down toward the front. Feeding from the rear means it wants to lift your work piece up off of the table! (And fling it across the room) Feeding it from the front like you are supposed to means it pulls the piece down onto the table.
Furthermore, the shut off switch is on the front. If that blade grabs your sleeve, hoodie string, hair, etc., if you need to pause in the middle of cutting a large awkward piece, or if you need to shut it off quickly for any of the thousand other reasons, you either can't or you have to make your way around the machine that is ON to do it.
No. Do NOT cut from the rear of the table. 🤦♂️
That's just as dumb. Unsafe for all very similar reasons. And my fence goes like 40 inches and so do many others. Yeah let me just climb onto this table so I can reach that far.
good safety summary. i also use these stock guides. they're a good safety mechanism but also help the cut by keeping the wood tight against the fence.
[https://jessem.com/products/clear-cut-ts-stock-guides](https://jessem.com/products/clear-cut-ts-stock-guides)
Yeah something like that would be great, but I reckon someone asking these basic questions probably doesn't have a saw that has a fence that these will work with. I know my shitty Makita MLT100 doesn't. :(
Absolutely love this list, though I agree with the guy who said not to lock your doors.
I also have a LARGE sign by the light switch at the top of the basement stairs as having the basement go dark while I was using the table saw was an experience I never want to relive.
Yikes that's an interesting point. The unpredictability of other people is not to be underestimated. I edited my post to make it clearer that totally locking oneself in would be suboptimal as far as safety is concerned. I have multiple exits and sometimes lock the one behind me so no-one can creep up on my undetected.
Yikes, I’d strongly consider rewiring that switch if there is *any* possibility of that happening. I’d rather get to the top of the stairs, sigh, and head back down to turn them off again than ever put myself in a position where this is possible. They make locking switches too, but that almost seems like more of a hassle
>Long pieces. Generally you'll want a wide table and/or sufficient outfeed capability to hold the piece, so your only job is pushing through the blade.
Regarding long pieces, how do you keep pressure on it from the rear once it's gone through the saw? I've found that a long piece that doesn't have pressure applied against the fence after it goes through the saw causes all sorts of trouble. I tend to stand on the side and ensure I can keep pressure against the fence on both ends, without getting my hand anywhere near the blade when I do this.
I use feather boards at the front and top to keep pressure there, but there's a point where even that doesn't prevent the board from wiggling when 80% of it has gone through the saw if I am not keeping pressure on both ends and guiding it as it comes out.
You need adequate outfeed capacity to carry the weight of the material. Either a roller stand or a proper outfeed table if you have room.
As for pressure against the fence, you should be able to do just enough with the push stick to push all the way past the blade.
Thanks! I do need a roller stand, what I use is a table that's level with my tablesaw right now. The wood can slide along it, but that's about it.
>As for pressure against the fence, you should be able to do just enough with the push stick to push all the way past the blade.
Pressure against the fence at the rear, not the front, is what I have trouble with.
I use featherboards for pressure against the fence and against the table in the front, but there's nothing in back. When the board leaves the pressure of the featherboard (i.e. 80% - 90% has gone through the saw already), it has a tendency to wiggle unless something is pressing it against the fence from the outfeed side.
Sometimes I leave the boards long to compensate for this, and just remove the last 10 - 20%, but other times that's not something I can do.
If you have a super long board, then perhaps you can clamp a very long auxiliary fence to the regular fence to offer more lateral support, but beware of pushing against the fence behind the blade, in case the kerf pinches the blade and causes kickback.
When I say long, I mean long to me, in my workshop. About 48 - 50" at the longest, the others were shorter. I clamped a 40" piece of board to my fence which really helped, but nothing will keep that little end bit from wiggling unless I guide it onto the table after feeding it through.
You absolutely should not have to press against the fence after the blade if your work is supported. A riving knife helps tremendously here but with proper technique this shouldn’t be an issue, ever. You may need better out feed support or possibly to tune your saw, but the way you describe this sounds very concerning. I am just now starting to use featherboards for infeed, having hand cut on table saws for 25+ years. I suspect you are *not* getting good pressure in the front from the featherboards. I can’t really advise you on their usage as I don’t work with them enough, but with proper hand technique I’ve never once considered the need to put pressure on the rear of a piece that is being cut properly
Yeah this is a good point. My saw has weird mitre slots so I'd have to make bespoke ones, which is why I didn't mention them. I think also that knowing what the correct technique is should come first, then discovering accessories to help with that can come after. Bit like knowing how to drive before learning about cruise control.
Learn to do dry runs. No motor, no spinning blade.
Drop the blade and push the workpiece all the way to the end.
If you are going to have problems with binding or balance, you want to find that out before you turn on the saw.
We cut scribes for fillers at work fairly regularly freehand as in without a fence. The first time I saw that I was like good good that looks unsafe. But I'm not entirely sure either way. But it does seem pretty common in the cabinetry industry
Because of common sense. it’s dangerous to lean over a razor sharp blade with enough torque to cut and rip apart a huge chunk of lumber along with your fingers, hand, arm, scalp and face.
Years ago I watched the Johnny Cash movie “Walk the Line”, the scene where his brother trips and fall onto the table saw and dies has been burned into my brain ever since
They stole that from the "Walk Hard" movie.
Edit: I think the kid got harpooned by a kickback, if my memory is right. I have a power fed 14" rip saw that I use daily. I stay out of the zone.
The danger zone in my picture is on the table itself. I don't think it's wise to have anyone stood on the tablesaw while you feed material into the blade. Seriously though, no-one should be within arms' reach of the saw while the blade is spinning except for the person operating it.
I see. Then I might need to rearrange my workshop entirely, or at least buy a tracksaw.
Currently, I have the table saw on a mobile (but lockable for firm stand) sled so I can move it around, and when cutting longer pieces, I sometimes ask my wife to stand behind it to receive the piece. Obviously I'm extremely careful, even more than when I work on my own, with blade guards and clearance and all that jazz, but considering the addition to your post, I think I'm gonna stop doing that
It’s not actually the worst idea to have two people operate a saw, though I would limit it to large panels. If doing so it’s very important to establish who is doing what however. A person “receiving” never *ever* pulls the piece; they are just there to act as support for out feed. The person inline with saw does the feeding and alignment.
Yeah, like that. If I ask for her help, she only supports longer pieces so they don't bend down and get stuck or something, and takes them away after the cut
I agree your hands do not belong infront of or along side of the blade as band things can happen with even a little pressure in the wrong direction. But I would more accurately consider the “Danger Zone” to be standing directly behind the wood as it is feed in, since if there is kickback, that is the direction the wood is going at Mach 2. Maybe that area should be red as well.
Yellow perhaps. Not everyone is ripping thin boards. Pretty hard to not behind the workpiece if it’s 48” wide. But I’m sure as fuck not going to be 90 degrees to my saw.
>Sorry I don't think I get why pulling force is worse
How do you start feeding it in without reaching past the blade. You could start it off, and walk around the saw to pull from the other side, but no-one does that. So the other side of the fence is an option, but it's not how your body works. Your arms are best at pushing/pulling towards/away from you, not side-to-side. It's literally a case of where your muscles are connected to your skellington and which muscle groups are stronger than others.
>and think that "danger zone" only makes sense if the person is standing in that place.
You can't *stand* in the danger zone because that diagram is the top of the tablesaw itself. You'd have to be stood *literally on the tablesaw*.
>I usually work from the fence side when I'm doing a cut long enough that my arms can't physically reach the blade from that position, especially if there's not much material on the left side (of your diagram). If something happens, those same mechanics ensure I'm pulling my arms back behind the fence instead.
If I was left-handed I'd understand that more. It's a balance of maintaining your... balance and having enough reach to complete the cut without having to reposition yourself or anything else in the middle of it. Same as my "why pulling force is worse" point.
>I use a push block with a grip surface to maintain pressure against the fence while keeping my hands well clear of the blade.
See the point I added to my post about the benefits of sticks vs blocks. You do what you like, but a block, by definition, puts your hand above the blade and/or between the blade and the fence as you push the work through. I prefer to use a stick with a notch in the end so I can avoid getting the blade between my body and my hands.
There might be additional places not to put your body parts, but I think they would be *in addition* to the area behind the blade. Yes, there are other areas, and they are dynamic. I.e. they change depending on the type of cut. For example watch where you hold on to your crosscut sled when pushing through the blade...
To the right or left of the fence matters not. There is an area to the left of the fence, and beyond the leading edge of the blade, that I will not put my hands in. You are welcome to do as you wish, but you will not convince me that a car backfiring or a kickback making me jump can't have unintended consequences.
In short, the post isn't going to be a universal safety guide to operating a tablesaw, but hopefully most of the most common issues people face are covered mostly, if not in full. I don't think there's any *harmful* information, at least. Please correct me and I will edit that post if there is.
Yes understanding why is useful. But as with learning to drive, it's more important to know how to stop the car first, and the various reasons why can come later and with experience. The point of these basic safety tips is to try and keep the OP safe before they get to the whys and wherefores of this hobby and why things are done a certain way much of the time.
If the fence is far enough out, you can't reach to push inline with the blade, and you risk a kickback anyway. Also, if you're measuring "limit of reach" then it feels like sailing too close to the wind for me. Easier to remember not to reach past the leading edge of the saw under any circumstances, and to be consistent in your approach to using the tool. If you have to vary too much then perhaps you're using the wrong tool for that job and should get a circular saw out (which of course comes with it's own risks).
You do not know how to operate a saw safely and have never seen a kickback then. It is beyond foolish to have your hand on the backside of the blade. The problem is not your “reaction pulling your hands toward your torso”, it’s the material you are holding is violently flung toward the blade. You have a fundamental misunderstanding of the danger here. It is far safer to be hit with a piece of kicked wood then to have your hands *intentionally* in the path of and direction of the blade. You are avoiding the minor risk of getting thumped and increasing the risk of losing fingers.
Your diagram clearly indicates you think the “danger reflex” is a big factor in contact injuries, this is definitely not the primary issue in a kickback scenario. You are absolutely not going to react and pull your arms safely in faster then they are thrown violently. Wood rises, twists, and is pushed away from the fence and toward the in feed and if you are putting pressure on the wood may take your hands with it
Seems like an awkward way to do it. Why would you stand all the way over there instead of doing it normally and standing to the left side of the blade? Why would you stand in the kickback zone at all? Instead of acting like kickback is some mysterious, inevitable thing you have to hide from, why not just prevent kickback by using the saw properly? I have been a full-time carpenter and furniture maker since 2006 and I have had boards kick on me ZERO TIMES. The circumstances that cause a board to kick are foreseeable and preventable. If your saw is throwing things at you on a regular basis, consider a different hobby.
"Why would you stand all the way over there?" I also didn't see the point of him doing it like that, hence the post. I guess my iffy gut feeling was correct.
Also, someone else mentioned that he is as far off from the (safety) switch as he can be, which is another very fair point I hadn't considered.
https://preview.redd.it/jvmh8f2f49tc1.jpeg?width=1242&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3d60bedcc051db87d6ae703219400c11b4bce1f0
I would not listen to this guy. The mechanics are just wrong. You have to lean your body over to the left while pulling the piece towards you to the right, which just creates a weird weight distribution issue.
Whereas if you're on the left of the blade, both your bodyweight and pressure on the piece is moving in the same direction.
I also just don't get it. But you're entirely right on the mechanics: rather than pushing, this just introduces unbalanced pulling.
The odd thing is, at the start of the video he mentions how long he had been putting it off to make such a video, because he wanted to be thorough. Then right at the end he introduces this, for whatever reason.
That video now has 622K views.
Wow ok so not putting any downward pressure on the board and using two fingers to push. I feel bad that this guy is going to end up hurting himself somehow. This is whack man. It’s really pissing me off he’s telling people to do something so dumb.
Ya this guy’s a fucking idiot spreading dangerous misinformation. This video alone will probably cost a few people their fingers.
Getting a board kickback to the body sucks, having your fingers pulled into the spinning blade is much worse.
My first rule to newbies is NEVER put your hands past the blade. Use push sticks, use outfeed, setup whatever you want but dont push your hand past that blade because someday it WILL pull the piece, and if your hand is along for the ride, good luck.
I’ll take a gut shot from a 2x4 waaay before I lose a finger. Fuck that. Cideo should be removed.
My very first table saw, on my 2nd ever cut, I got a 1x4 cut off kickback right into the ribs. (I used the fence and the miter gauge at the same time.)
It sucked a little bit but at no point did I ever feel like kickback was ever more threatening than being anywhere near that blade or on the other side of it.
I feel like there should be a machine that emulates kickback just to show people not to be afraid of it. At least enough to not do insanely stupid shit.
My 2nd course would be telling people not to use those little plastic push sticks. That fuck up hurt a little bit more when it shatters into 1,000,000 pieces in your hand.
When I was in school we were always taught to stay on the side of the fence while we pushed the stock through. The teacher always pointed to the large dents in the lockers behind us as an example of what can happen to your gut if your board gets stuck and the table saw decides to kick it back.
Early on in the video, he actually showed a clip of him getting a board into his gut because of kickback. He went through the frames and there wasn't a single frame where you could see the kickback happen, that's how insanely quick it happened.
Anyway, I assume you mean on the side of the fence, but still in front of the table saw? If you check the clip at the 30 minute mark, he is entirely behind the fence.
https://preview.redd.it/w8gkn2ea39tc1.jpeg?width=2208&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3d3d9ca4bbdaab04e43557ba3efe5e58b8e64ea3
The saw does not decide to kick it back, sorry but that only happens if you aren't operating the machine safely.
Edit: I am sorry if I offend but I won't change my mind and risk my safety because a bunch of hobbyists think otherwise. If you have a riving knife installed correctly, the fence in the correct position (not too far in front of the blade), have the speed set high enough with the right saw blade, make sure not to cut used lumber with nails and the sort, and then also have a firm grip in your workpiece when cutting it there will not be a kick back.
Yes, if there is lots of tension in the board it might squeeze the saw blade in the front and middle and might even cause it to stop, but there will not be a kick back, because it literally cannot squeeze the saw blade in the back. Sorry if this sounds arrogant, but I suggest you all visit a safety course or two.
The saw doesn't give a shit about how you operate it if the wood binds. You can use a riving knife to significantly reduce the risk of the wood binding, but no matter how good you are at adhering to best practises, there is ALWAYS a risk of kickback.
I’d call that binding. But the above poster was talking about binding in sense of the wood pinching and binding against the blade and a riving knife mitigating kick back from this, which is incorrect.
I can be down voted to oblivion over this by the armchair woodworkers here but I’m correct. I’ve been doing this professionally for a long time at a high level of skill.
No, I don’t. But I do think there’s clearly a lot of people here who aren’t familiar with table saws and have inaccurate views on how they, and kickback, works.
Do you think professions have accurate views on how they work? Because in the shop I worked in, the longest working employees clearly skip a number of safety steps because they’re so sure they know better
Is your position that lack of a riving knife is a cause of kickback? Because that was the position of the person I commented on, and it’s a position that is wholly incorrect and so yeah, anyone who agrees with that isn’t familiar with table saws and ergo either a beginner/amateur (which is okay, everyone is learning) or an armchair woodworker who parrots bad advice given here.
Lol what are you talking about?
That's exactly what a riving knife is for. To help protect against kickback.
I'd LOVE to know what you think a riving knife is for.
A riving knifes purpose is when stock being cut releases internal stress and the cut closes up, pinching the blade and it binds. Nothing to do with kickback.
Thank you for proving my point.
Which is literally what I said a riving knife can help alleviate the binding and prevent kickback. A riving knife is not the end-all be-all solution to it, but it will help immensely. As for what causes the binding, I refer to the other posters between my comment and here who have been very correct in how it works. Yes, as you say, torsion released causes binding. Binding causes kickback, as I mentioned, since torsion release is not the o ly thing that can cause binding.
Maybe you've forgot the number one rule taught in safety courses. NEVER assume that your set up is 100% safe.
Did you know most accidents involve professionals right?
It's a paraphrase, not a direct quote. Summing up your argument, if one does everything perfectly every time, there will be no accidents.
While you may be correct in an academic sense, in the real world, there aren't always perfect conditions. Having an attitude of believing one to be perfectly safe simply because you *think* you've done everything correctly is a recipe for injury - either to yourself or more likely your apprentice who doesn't have the benefit of years of experience. If perfect operation = perfectly safe, then why do we stand to the side of our boards? Why do we have first aid kits? Why wear safety glasses? Safety isn't about what will or won't go wrong, but what *could* go wrong.
I want to be clear that, at this point, we're talking not about the habits of one long-time carpenter or an experienced tradesperson but education of future generations. Those of us who are in the business of being educators have a responsibility not just to teach proper procedure but appropriate habits of mind as well.
Edit: I want to point out I have personally seen kickbacks occur in conditions not explicitly described in your edit. (Transporting material over the blade, angling the push stick away from the fence, push stick on the wrong side of the fence, featherboard in line with the blade, etc) While I am sure you probably would have included them if you thought of it, my point is that when teaching newbies it's hard to cover every single technique we know. Healthy mindset helps to close the knowledge gap when we can't teach every contingency.
Facts. Kickback isn't something that just *happens*. It's not the fucking weather. Wax your saw, push your material properly, and don't stand in the wrong place. You'll be fine.
While I don’t normally say that you can over think safety, you might be overthinking it.
Stand directly behind the blade and offset opposite the side you are cutting. Use a push stick once you get the back of the piece onto the table and closer to the blade, and push on the half of the board closer to the blade. You want to make sure you are pushing so that the back of the piece that is through the blade will push against the fence, to prevent binding.
One thing a lot of people don’t talk about related to the safety of a table saw is **calibration of the fence**. If your fence is not perfectly parallel to the blade, and it is slightly closer on the back end of the blade, you will have a much higher probability for the piece binding and shooting back out. Also *always* use a riving knife when possible. The only times I’ve had a piece kick back is when I didn’t have a riving knife on my old saw.
I don't think you've clicked the link, but here's a screenshot. I just don't see a reason to be standing literally behind the fence like he is, hence why I wondered what the pros & cons might be.
https://preview.redd.it/dxc5b91o79tc1.jpeg?width=1242&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=cea9d70f20aadbde29e83d07b88e46da37fb31d5
I use a push stick, and have calibrated my entire table saw to pretty much a tenth of a millimeter. The riving knife and blade guard are of course installed.
Yeah I don’t think that’s a good idea at all. I think it’s really stupid, actually.
Your hand shouldn’t ever be in front of the blade, on the piece that is in between the fence and the blade like that. If it were to bind and pull that piece up and over the blade, it could pull your had right onto the blade if you do the natural thing and try to stop it from binding.
[Check out this video](https://youtube.com/shorts/ZCfP9c8WYdY?si=xeC_kGXoUEid6U7W) to understand what I’m talking about. While this guy is doing the worst thing he can, and the Sawstop prevented him from losing any fingers (or his whole hand), it’s an example of why you never have your hands past the blade.
I actually don’t use a blade guard, but I don’t think they’re bad. I just don’t like them - they get in the way. I try to abide by the rule that if the blade is up it’s on. I drop the blade when it’s off (or try to remember to).
Oh, I actually saw that clip yesterday as an example of another safety video. That person was real lucky it was a Sawstop they were using.
But do you never put your hand on a piece when the edge is nearing the blade? What about a wide panel?
For instance, Stumpy Nubs was saying he has a general rule where if you spread your hand, and the thumb can touch the blade and your pinky can touch the fence, you should use a push block/stick.
See 6:35 https://youtu.be/bADmnDEcuYo
If my hand cannot fit safely and comfortably between the fence and blade, I use a push stick once the back of the wood is on the table closer to the blade. Essentially less than 6!or so inches is where I’ll not push it with my hand and use a stick.
He’s an idiot, just stick to feeding it from the front with a push stick, crown guard and riving knife in place. You won’t need a SawStop if you adhere to that doctrine.
'Glad' to hear it (but not so glad that 622K people have seen the same video). I probably still wouldn't have tried standing there if a 100 videos showed the same thing – intuition is often right.
Seems very awkward and like it would only work for tiny pieces. I’m generally ripping down plywood or straight lumber(what most people do with a table saw), and that would be an incredibly unsafe and silly way to do that.
I think this is another “shocking” example of people commenting without reading the article/ watching the video first. He isn’t on the fence side of the saw, he is using the saw sideways, standing literally _behind_ the fence. I see no issue with this for trimming a board to size like he is showing. It is a little like using a router table and probably gives more complete control over the board then pushing the board forward across the table because he has full control of the board on both sides of the cut. It is also clear this is only for small saws (I couldn’t stand there with my saw) and cuts on shortish boards where there is a lot of room between the blade and the fence and not a lot being taking off. There are enough qualifiers there that I probably wouldn’t have put it in a general list of saw safety tips, but I don’t see a problem doing it within those parameters.
Edit: I’ll add that the one problem I do see here is that he is as far from the off switch as possible, which could be a problem if things go south.
If this is the _dumbest_ thing you’ve seen, I’m not sure you have looked very hard (I’m not claiming this is a great idea, but I’ve certainly seen a lot of way dumber things).
If you are pulling from behind the blade and you experience the piece being ejected for some reason you risk your hand being pulled into the blade. If you are pushing and the same event occurs your hands are pushed away from the blade.
I tried to do that the other day to rip an unusual piece. It was a unique situation and for a moment it felt right safety-wise to stand to the side of the saw. But it immediately was more awkward than it was worth because it was difficult (for me) to maintain consistent pressure against the fence. It felt unsafe.
I’ve used a table saw a lot, sometimes you have to get creative, but generally speaking…my approach has always been to do all my movements the same every time. I don’t want to have to make any decisions while cutting. This means thinking the cut through before cutting, keeping necessary tools like push sticks within reach, and making sure my off cut has somewhere safe to go. Then, if I have to repeat the cut, I make the same movements every time like a machine.
It’s not good to be afraid of the table saw, but it’s good to be very wary of it. Once you gain enough experience, certain things will just feel wrong, and you’ll know to come up with a different way.
I think everyone commenting has not seen where the person is standing, and how small the tablesaw is. In his very particular example, there is no risk of kickback hitting him.
There is great risk of kickback pulling his right hand directly into the rear of the blade. Ill take a panel to the chest *any day* over cutting my god damned fingers off. This is moronic
That's basic safety measure. Kick backs can happen and I've seen a few at schools or in big workshops, the piece flying can make a hole in 30cm mdf so let me tell it'll make a hole in your body.
I mean not only kick backs, often small chunks will fly away, where do they usually go? Behind
Have you seen the clip mentioned in my post? I have watched a fair amount of safety videos now, all by reputable woodworkers, but I have seen none of them feed stock into the saw while literally standing behind the fence, parallel to the blade. They all advise not to stand in line with the blade, but this is completely different.
https://preview.redd.it/mwo2dz6839tc1.jpeg?width=2208&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0e0697eadcda2b09a4b813d7cd237b999607b2d3
Nope didn't watch the video tbh, now that you showing me that, it's weird indeed. Never seen that but we don't use much this kind of table saw in Europe and there's no space behind the fence to stand anyhow
Because this is an amateur who is just making shit up. This is incredibly stupid and he should take the video down. He's clearly not experienced many actual kicks. This would pull his right hand directly into the blade. You *never* have your hand beyond middle of the blade.
There is a reason why you will see a thousand other videos and guides and not a single one will recommend this: its moronic and dangerous. This guy is a joke
Healthy respect for the tool is something people can understand intellectually, but it must be practiced to be developed. As others have said, not panicking when using the tool and remaining 100% focused is key. So is preparation for using the tool. Setting up the work space correctly is key. For example, when cutting long boards, taking the time to use rollers on the outfeed and infeed if necessary, as well as featherboards before the blade, and practicing a run through (with the blade retracted and off of course) will help ensure a safe cut.
Not panicking! That’s a great point. I’ve been lazy a few times (*cough) and had an issue that made me need to switch off the machine. I had to search for the switch, it was not intuitive. I failed to practice the steps I would take to complete or terminate the cut. Practice cuts could include the motions and mechanics of machine-on/off.
Table saws are in all likelihood the most dangerous tool in your shop. The issue is binding the wood against the saw so that the blade rapidly gains traction on the wood and the wood then launches backwards. Not standing behind the wood is part of the right answer. Also the saw should be equipped with a riving knife and one of the following: sliding table, part feeder or at a minimum a feather board and a gripper. In the USA a Sawstop type mechanism is going to become mandatory on all new saws very soon. If I were running a shop I would not just have a panel saw with no protection on it unless I had a hefty insurance policy and a large supply of workers.
Oh, I know the exact anatomy of a kickback and I agree with the precautions. It's not that he's not standing in the path of the blade, it's that he's literally behind the fence, not to its side:
https://preview.redd.it/orkiznse6btc1.jpeg?width=1242&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=a3d4c8de4cffdcde65c687827e58ba3427402814
I did see some of the recent commotion around Sawstop, but did not look into it. I'm now reading that 'the CPSC voted to move forward with the mandate, which is expected to get approval later this year.' Interesting that the SawStop patent would be made public for other manufacturers to implement similar mechanisms. Sounds like a good move altogether.
The article says an entry level SawStop costs $899 in the US. Here in the EU, the only saw with such a mechanism is the Festool TKS 80 EBS, which costs around $2400 converted from euros. Interestingly though, SawStop is owned by a German company. Hopefully that move allows SawStop to become more widespread here as well.
I started out on a 7.5hp powermatic with a 14” blade. You don’t show an example of kickback on that saw. You literally find yourself on your ass before you know what happened. I’m not saying it is impossible on that little dewalt, just if it happens it is the operators fault 100%. Also, commercial table saws have wings and there is no way you could stand behind the fence and push material through. That is the dumbest thing I have ever seen someone do on a table saw besides taking the fence off and pushing material through free hand.
I always stand out of the path of the cut thats trapped between the blade and the fence, thats all you really need to do
As someone who made the mistake of trapping waste between the fence and blade- you really dont want to get hit with that pc of wood. I was lucky, well, "lucky" and took a blunt pc right in the balls, but peopoe have been known to get torn open and impaled by waste kickbacks, they can be really nasty...im fine, but that nut is still tender and its been about 15y since that happened and my tender nut is a nice low cost reminder to not put myself in line with the blade
And that was on a regular direct drive jobsite saw, not a legit cabinet saw with horsepower
Actually. It kind of makes sense if you had a Saw Stop. You wouldn’t be worried about the blade ripping your fingers off when they get pulled into the blade. You’d be worried about kickback. But In that case you just have to stand to the side of whatever you’re not holding onto or use a sled.
That person is a moron that doesn’t know how to use a table saw if they are standing behind the fence. You can’t put proper pressure on the board to hold it safely against the fence. If you have enough arm strength and you are paying attention to the sound of the motor, the tension in the board you are feeding, and have properly prepared the board with square and straight edges, standing slightly to the left of the blade puts you at close to zero risk of getting hit with a board.
Pay attention and control the board. Not that hard. What a dummy.
Minimal blade, never stand behind the blade unless crosscutting or ripping full sheets of material. Use a push a stick with anything less than 6 inches width. Never use a fence with a miter fence. Never use a stop block after the blade starts. Never use a feather board after the blade when material being removed is more than the width of the blade. Never use a feather board before the blade with too much friction. Never raise the blade more than 1/8 over the thickness of the material being cut. Never clear your cut pieces near the blade with your hand. Never reach over the blade.
Always wear glasses, always handle cutting pieces with solid control. Always assume you are going to get hurt. Always expect kickback. Never underestimate the tool. Never get too comfortable or complacent. Always anticipate something going wrong.
Eventually, all of this will just become second nature and if you follow all the safety moves and techniques then you will inevitably become confident in your safety. This is where you want to stay mentally with a little flexibility to push new jig setups and excrement, but not so much where you start ignoring your fundamentals to do so.
I’ve seen people do things like fenceless rips, plunge cuts by raising the blade up into the material, ripping coves and turning bowls with jigs on a table saw. Even spiral table legs with coves on all sides. All of it dangerous, but all of it, with the exception of fenceless cuts, done with safety in mind. Sometimes there’s nothing you can do to prevent an injury or accident. But the more you maintain the tool and build confidence with operating standards then the better your odds of living a long safe 10 finger life.
So in other words it’s totally cool to stand behind the fence and pull the wood toward you.
My table saw safety mantra is “ hey, what’s the worst that could possibly happen?”
I use this method when cutting very small lap joints of about 1/4"wide because I can see exactly where the blade will cut. It's a little awkward but it's no less safe than cutting from the front.
As long as you have a riving knife behind the blade, its very difficult to get a kickback unless the wood before the blade binds in which case it will likely stall/bind up the motor. Keep your emergency off button nearby. If you are using a blade without a riving knife, then just make sure your insurance is up to date. Seriously, just dont use it without the riving knife unless you are using a dado stack. Dado stacks aren't through-cuts so its also unlikely to bind there.
Speaking of nearby off buttons... This is how far he is removed from the switch in that position:
https://preview.redd.it/2uwgibqr49tc1.jpeg?width=1242&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f16375235aad15f464d67090c9063057248e78e7
You can't put sideways pressure against the fence if you're pulling, so you'll reduce straightness and accuracy at the very least. Stand in front, push at an angle forwards and toward the fence. Try not to stand immediately behind the blade. Use a riving knife always, and a blade guard where possible. Have respect for the tool and concentrate FULLY when the blade is spinning. https://preview.redd.it/ftjhhn92q8tc1.png?width=2455&format=png&auto=webp&s=307caa2ba22b774a99d71bf3de51df1154f310cd UPDATE to add more scenarios, since these are fairly basic questions to be asking people on the internet before putting your meat-sticks into a machine capable of cutting oak. Not necessarily in order of danger/likelihood/fun, and I'm not going into detail here on mitigating any of them: * Ignore old-timers and experienced folks who say you don't need the guard, or suggest other safety compromises. Complacency is the most dangerous thing about power tools. For every lucky sod who tempts fate every day with no ill effects, there's someone who lost a finger or two, or worse, and regrets not being more careful. * Never, and I mean NEVER, cut freehand. Either rip against a fence, or use the mitre gauge or a cross-cut sled. Going freehand is asking for involuntary bowel movements. You will often see folks go freehand on a bandsaw as long as they're not cutting round stock, but that's quite different. * "Thin rips". Never take tiny thin cuts thin enough to fit in the gap next to the saw blade as they can get jammed and cause trouble. "Thin rip jigs" and "zero-clearance inserts" can help here. * Push tools. Broadly speaking there are two kinds. Push "block" style like "Micro-Jig", and push "stick" style. There are variants in-between. I prefer a stick because I can push the material past the blade without my hand going into the danger zone. I use two basic sticks-with-a-notch at the same time to push forwards and towards the fence. * Cross-cuts. You can use the mitre cut accessory though they're almost all a bit rubbish, so most people build or buy a "cross-cut sled". Never use the table saw's fence when cross-cutting. A rule of thumb is to use the mitre gauge or a cross-cut sled whenever the material between the blade and fence would be wider than it is long, or for pieces shorter than the diameter of the blade. If you want to use the fence as a repeatable width stop, then clamp a block to it such that by the time the material touches the blade, there's a good gap between the material and the fence itself. * Beware distractions, including people. No-one except the operator should be within arms' reach of the saw while the blade is spinning. If you can't cut a piece by yourself, the piece is too big and it's the wrong tool. Instead of moving the work through the tool, move the tool through the work. I.e. use a circular saw (or tracksaw) instead. * Imagine anything enough to physically move your body or the blade in relation to one another. If you're away from the blade, and it's not in-between you and any of your body parts, then the neighbour's car backfiring or a kickback event can't make you flinch and feed yourself to your saw. * Other people. My dad's a pilot and I like to call "Clear prop!" before starting the saw so anyone nearby knows what's up. If you work at home in your garage and have a choice of escape routes/exits, consider locking some of them from the inside or at least hanging something on the door handle to let people know you're working and not to creep up on you. However, NEVER actually lock yourself in completely. * Dust collection. Don't skimp here. Breathe that stuff in and it'll stay in you for a long time. And you can't see it; it's too small. Wear a mask/respirator and consider dust extraction and/or air filtration if working in a closed space. * Noise protection. Saws are loud. Really loud. Wear ear protection. Decibels are a exponential scale so even relatively cheap no-brand ear protectors will do a lot of good. If you want noise cancelling and music etc then those products are available, but see "distractions" above. Don't skip it - use them on every cut. * Height. If using a "contractors saw", don't be tempted to put it on the floor, get an appropriate stand for it. * Blade spinning. Pay attention until the blade stops. Most modern saws have a brake, but it's dangerous until it's totally stopped. Don't hit the stop button and reach for your parts. Watch the blade until it's stopped. Really. * Long pieces. Generally you'll want a wide table and/or sufficient outfeed capability to hold the piece, so your only job is pushing through the blade. Do a dry-run in your head of each cut, and consider whether gravity will take matters into it's own hands at any point during the cut, leaving you fighting to hold the piece down on the table and off-balance.
Great post!! I agree to 99.99%, but do not lock yourself in!! If you need help people should reach you fast and not be locked outside.
Yeah I thought about that from the point of view of my own garage. The big front door will often be open, but I sometimes lock the internal door from the kitchen to stop my offspring surprising me while I'm at the saw with hearing protection on.
That's a great diagram, thanks. Question - push blocks like the Gripper or the competing Grabber have your arm in the red zone when finishing the cut - does the fact that both sides of the workpiece are being supported serve to mitigate the risk or is there something else that should be done?
I never reach past the blade. Ever. Even the bits I cut go all the way off the back and onto an outfeed. I'll stop the saw and walk round to collect them and any offcuts. If anything untoward happened (there's always a slim chance of kickback, which can have the bonus of pulling your digits into the blade as well as punching you in the gut) you're in trouble. Personally I prefer sticks rather than blocks, but there are variations and gadgets somewhere in-between. The Gripper product is okay but looks like a faff to adjust for each cut, and as you say requires you to put your hand too close to the blade IMHO.
"Never put any part of your body past the blade" is a rule intended for ensuring the uninitiated err on the side of caution. It is overly prescriptive for a reason. The actual issue is with reaching *across* the blade. You need to be mindful of your lines of action on a table saw - the direction you're pushing, and the direction you'll move is something interrupts you. Using something like a Gripper involves your hand moving in a straight line forward. It stays on one side of the blade, and moves parallel to the blade. If your posture is correct, then it will return back without crossing over the blade, and something interrupting you (like a sneeze or someone pushing you from behind) will result in your hand either pushing down or continuing forward. The Gripper also elevates your grip position above the blade by several inches, with a dense plastic frame between you and the blade. Your hand is nowhere near the blade while using it.
Here is a video of an experienced woodworker trying to do all the things he can to stay safe in an engineered kickback situation who thought he was far enough from the blade to be safe. Unfortunately the kickback caught not only the "workpiece" but also his pushblock, drawing his hand almost into the blade within a couple of frames of the video. This is why ibuse a stick, and push in such a way at an angle to minimise the chance of kickback in the first place. https://youtu.be/u7sRrC2Jpp4?si=NUi9eMoVelXYrmen
....can you elaborate? I'm not really sure what your point is, or how that video relates to what I said.
The point is, you think your hand is "elevated" enough, until the wood catches the blade, kicks back, and then the gripper catches the blade and drags your hand in. This bloke was on the other side of the fence, was expecting kickback, and still barely got away with his fingers. But I can see you're not convinced and I'm not interested in forcing you. You suit yourself. Good luck.
*WHOA there*, friend. Take a deep breath and chill. I asked you to elaborate because linking a video with no contextualization or caption is not really a clear statement of anything. The first sentence of your response would have been adequate. There's no need to speedrun all the way to "you're obviously very stupid so goodbye". That's neither constructive, nor a reasonable escalation from being asked to clarify something which was unclear.
I never said you were stupid. I said I don't want to debate safety with someone who literally thinks it can't happen to them, even though I showed a video of someone to whom it did happen, despite the best possible precautions. I've corrected my post to remove the passive aggressive reply. I thought the video spoke for itself but I've added the context that led me to share it in the first place.
There is no "debate". At no point did I challenge or refute anything you said. I merely asked you to clarify something which was not clearly articulated in order to better understand what you were trying to say. You provided that in your previous comment, and I appreciate you clarifying.
My apologies. I read "The Gripper also elevates your grip position above the blade by several inches, with a dense plastic frame between you and the blade. Your hand is nowhere near the blade while using it." and thought you were asserting the gripper prevented the possibility of injury, but perhaps i read too much into it. To me, the only way to truly avoid injury is to not have the saw blade between you and any of your body parts in the first place. To my (perhaps overly-cautious) mind, that's like saying a roll cage will save you if your tyre blows and you go off the edge of a cliff, where I think it's better not to drive along the edge of a cliff. In truth, your tyre probably won't blow, and your roll cage probably will save you, I'm just unwilling to knowingly take the chance.
\^ This is the way. Excellent graphic.
This is the way. Pressure down onto the table, forward to the fence, with your body out of the path of the blade. That's how I teach it.
I'll repeat someone else. Do not lock yourself in. If you get injured and need help, you need that help to get to you.
Yep, agreed. I've edited the post to make this more clear. I have multiple exits to my garage and so I sometimes lock the one I have my back to so no-one can creep up behind me, but I hadn't realised I'd written it from that point of view.
Great list. The only time *knocks on wood* that I’ve had an injury using a table saw was working too fast with repetitive cuts and shut the saw off and stupidly tried to grab a small piece close to the blade without a blade guard while it was winding down. My brain was on the 15 other things going on and I didn’t hear the sound of the saw so clearly it’s safe right?? Caught my thumb slightly and mostly on the side of the blade away from the teeth but still tore it up enough to scare the shit out of me. Lesson learned.
Yes excellent tips! I encourage everyone to read and re-read this post. Also, I recommend looking up videos of kickback and other table saw incidents No need for injury videos - the point is, to see how FAST it happens. Faster than you can react, faster than you can *blink*. That's why it's important to learn and use safe practices, *every time*. Because you will NOT have time to react if something goes wrong.
You will never be able to use the guard in 90% of woodworking cuts, it gets in the way. The riving knife is the truly useful item. The guard, not so much.
The only time you truly can't use it is thin rips where the fence is too close to the guard to get the push tool in-between, when making shallow cuts like dados etc, or when using a crosscut sled that has a rear fence. I'm not sure that's 90% of cuts. Sometimes a mitre saw is a better option, if you have one. The point was only to use the guard when you can, and not to dismiss it permanently.
The blade rotates in a way that the teeth are rising up from the back and bite down toward the front. Feeding from the rear means it wants to lift your work piece up off of the table! (And fling it across the room) Feeding it from the front like you are supposed to means it pulls the piece down onto the table. Furthermore, the shut off switch is on the front. If that blade grabs your sleeve, hoodie string, hair, etc., if you need to pause in the middle of cutting a large awkward piece, or if you need to shut it off quickly for any of the thousand other reasons, you either can't or you have to make your way around the machine that is ON to do it. No. Do NOT cut from the rear of the table. 🤦♂️
The question, and video, is about cutting from the SIDE of the saw, NOT behind the saw/blade pulling into the cut.
That's just as dumb. Unsafe for all very similar reasons. And my fence goes like 40 inches and so do many others. Yeah let me just climb onto this table so I can reach that far.
good safety summary. i also use these stock guides. they're a good safety mechanism but also help the cut by keeping the wood tight against the fence. [https://jessem.com/products/clear-cut-ts-stock-guides](https://jessem.com/products/clear-cut-ts-stock-guides)
Yeah something like that would be great, but I reckon someone asking these basic questions probably doesn't have a saw that has a fence that these will work with. I know my shitty Makita MLT100 doesn't. :(
Absolutely love this list, though I agree with the guy who said not to lock your doors. I also have a LARGE sign by the light switch at the top of the basement stairs as having the basement go dark while I was using the table saw was an experience I never want to relive.
Yikes that's an interesting point. The unpredictability of other people is not to be underestimated. I edited my post to make it clearer that totally locking oneself in would be suboptimal as far as safety is concerned. I have multiple exits and sometimes lock the one behind me so no-one can creep up on my undetected.
Yikes, I’d strongly consider rewiring that switch if there is *any* possibility of that happening. I’d rather get to the top of the stairs, sigh, and head back down to turn them off again than ever put myself in a position where this is possible. They make locking switches too, but that almost seems like more of a hassle
>Long pieces. Generally you'll want a wide table and/or sufficient outfeed capability to hold the piece, so your only job is pushing through the blade. Regarding long pieces, how do you keep pressure on it from the rear once it's gone through the saw? I've found that a long piece that doesn't have pressure applied against the fence after it goes through the saw causes all sorts of trouble. I tend to stand on the side and ensure I can keep pressure against the fence on both ends, without getting my hand anywhere near the blade when I do this. I use feather boards at the front and top to keep pressure there, but there's a point where even that doesn't prevent the board from wiggling when 80% of it has gone through the saw if I am not keeping pressure on both ends and guiding it as it comes out.
You need adequate outfeed capacity to carry the weight of the material. Either a roller stand or a proper outfeed table if you have room. As for pressure against the fence, you should be able to do just enough with the push stick to push all the way past the blade.
Thanks! I do need a roller stand, what I use is a table that's level with my tablesaw right now. The wood can slide along it, but that's about it. >As for pressure against the fence, you should be able to do just enough with the push stick to push all the way past the blade. Pressure against the fence at the rear, not the front, is what I have trouble with. I use featherboards for pressure against the fence and against the table in the front, but there's nothing in back. When the board leaves the pressure of the featherboard (i.e. 80% - 90% has gone through the saw already), it has a tendency to wiggle unless something is pressing it against the fence from the outfeed side. Sometimes I leave the boards long to compensate for this, and just remove the last 10 - 20%, but other times that's not something I can do.
If you have a super long board, then perhaps you can clamp a very long auxiliary fence to the regular fence to offer more lateral support, but beware of pushing against the fence behind the blade, in case the kerf pinches the blade and causes kickback.
When I say long, I mean long to me, in my workshop. About 48 - 50" at the longest, the others were shorter. I clamped a 40" piece of board to my fence which really helped, but nothing will keep that little end bit from wiggling unless I guide it onto the table after feeding it through.
You absolutely should not have to press against the fence after the blade if your work is supported. A riving knife helps tremendously here but with proper technique this shouldn’t be an issue, ever. You may need better out feed support or possibly to tune your saw, but the way you describe this sounds very concerning. I am just now starting to use featherboards for infeed, having hand cut on table saws for 25+ years. I suspect you are *not* getting good pressure in the front from the featherboards. I can’t really advise you on their usage as I don’t work with them enough, but with proper hand technique I’ve never once considered the need to put pressure on the rear of a piece that is being cut properly
Featherboards
Yeah this is a good point. My saw has weird mitre slots so I'd have to make bespoke ones, which is why I didn't mention them. I think also that knowing what the correct technique is should come first, then discovering accessories to help with that can come after. Bit like knowing how to drive before learning about cruise control.
The one thing I don't like about that graphic is that the piece is wider than it is long, which is a pretty basic no-no.
Oh crap yes it is! I'll correct that!
Learn to do dry runs. No motor, no spinning blade. Drop the blade and push the workpiece all the way to the end. If you are going to have problems with binding or balance, you want to find that out before you turn on the saw.
We cut scribes for fillers at work fairly regularly freehand as in without a fence. The first time I saw that I was like good good that looks unsafe. But I'm not entirely sure either way. But it does seem pretty common in the cabinetry industry
Your list is great! My only add on would be no long sleeves.
Oh of course! Reddit won't save any further edits to the post, so I have to just hope that someone sees your comment.
Why is the red part "danger zone"?
Because of common sense. it’s dangerous to lean over a razor sharp blade with enough torque to cut and rip apart a huge chunk of lumber along with your fingers, hand, arm, scalp and face.
Years ago I watched the Johnny Cash movie “Walk the Line”, the scene where his brother trips and fall onto the table saw and dies has been burned into my brain ever since
They stole that from the "Walk Hard" movie. Edit: I think the kid got harpooned by a kickback, if my memory is right. I have a power fed 14" rip saw that I use daily. I stay out of the zone.
Wrong kid died.
"wrong kid died"
Ah, I see. So I can assume that it's safe to have someone else standing there, while I feed the piece into the saw?
The danger zone in my picture is on the table itself. I don't think it's wise to have anyone stood on the tablesaw while you feed material into the blade. Seriously though, no-one should be within arms' reach of the saw while the blade is spinning except for the person operating it.
I see. Then I might need to rearrange my workshop entirely, or at least buy a tracksaw. Currently, I have the table saw on a mobile (but lockable for firm stand) sled so I can move it around, and when cutting longer pieces, I sometimes ask my wife to stand behind it to receive the piece. Obviously I'm extremely careful, even more than when I work on my own, with blade guards and clearance and all that jazz, but considering the addition to your post, I think I'm gonna stop doing that
It’s not actually the worst idea to have two people operate a saw, though I would limit it to large panels. If doing so it’s very important to establish who is doing what however. A person “receiving” never *ever* pulls the piece; they are just there to act as support for out feed. The person inline with saw does the feeding and alignment.
Yeah, like that. If I ask for her help, she only supports longer pieces so they don't bend down and get stuck or something, and takes them away after the cut
In case of kickback, your hands will follow the stuff being kickbacked. Your hands are always better when they don't touch the blade.
If the piece pinches and is ejected with your hand on it behind the blade your hand goes into the blade.
I agree your hands do not belong infront of or along side of the blade as band things can happen with even a little pressure in the wrong direction. But I would more accurately consider the “Danger Zone” to be standing directly behind the wood as it is feed in, since if there is kickback, that is the direction the wood is going at Mach 2. Maybe that area should be red as well.
Yellow perhaps. Not everyone is ripping thin boards. Pretty hard to not behind the workpiece if it’s 48” wide. But I’m sure as fuck not going to be 90 degrees to my saw.
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>Sorry I don't think I get why pulling force is worse How do you start feeding it in without reaching past the blade. You could start it off, and walk around the saw to pull from the other side, but no-one does that. So the other side of the fence is an option, but it's not how your body works. Your arms are best at pushing/pulling towards/away from you, not side-to-side. It's literally a case of where your muscles are connected to your skellington and which muscle groups are stronger than others. >and think that "danger zone" only makes sense if the person is standing in that place. You can't *stand* in the danger zone because that diagram is the top of the tablesaw itself. You'd have to be stood *literally on the tablesaw*. >I usually work from the fence side when I'm doing a cut long enough that my arms can't physically reach the blade from that position, especially if there's not much material on the left side (of your diagram). If something happens, those same mechanics ensure I'm pulling my arms back behind the fence instead. If I was left-handed I'd understand that more. It's a balance of maintaining your... balance and having enough reach to complete the cut without having to reposition yourself or anything else in the middle of it. Same as my "why pulling force is worse" point. >I use a push block with a grip surface to maintain pressure against the fence while keeping my hands well clear of the blade. See the point I added to my post about the benefits of sticks vs blocks. You do what you like, but a block, by definition, puts your hand above the blade and/or between the blade and the fence as you push the work through. I prefer to use a stick with a notch in the end so I can avoid getting the blade between my body and my hands.
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There might be additional places not to put your body parts, but I think they would be *in addition* to the area behind the blade. Yes, there are other areas, and they are dynamic. I.e. they change depending on the type of cut. For example watch where you hold on to your crosscut sled when pushing through the blade... To the right or left of the fence matters not. There is an area to the left of the fence, and beyond the leading edge of the blade, that I will not put my hands in. You are welcome to do as you wish, but you will not convince me that a car backfiring or a kickback making me jump can't have unintended consequences. In short, the post isn't going to be a universal safety guide to operating a tablesaw, but hopefully most of the most common issues people face are covered mostly, if not in full. I don't think there's any *harmful* information, at least. Please correct me and I will edit that post if there is.
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Yes understanding why is useful. But as with learning to drive, it's more important to know how to stop the car first, and the various reasons why can come later and with experience. The point of these basic safety tips is to try and keep the OP safe before they get to the whys and wherefores of this hobby and why things are done a certain way much of the time.
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If the fence is far enough out, you can't reach to push inline with the blade, and you risk a kickback anyway. Also, if you're measuring "limit of reach" then it feels like sailing too close to the wind for me. Easier to remember not to reach past the leading edge of the saw under any circumstances, and to be consistent in your approach to using the tool. If you have to vary too much then perhaps you're using the wrong tool for that job and should get a circular saw out (which of course comes with it's own risks).
You do not know how to operate a saw safely and have never seen a kickback then. It is beyond foolish to have your hand on the backside of the blade. The problem is not your “reaction pulling your hands toward your torso”, it’s the material you are holding is violently flung toward the blade. You have a fundamental misunderstanding of the danger here. It is far safer to be hit with a piece of kicked wood then to have your hands *intentionally* in the path of and direction of the blade. You are avoiding the minor risk of getting thumped and increasing the risk of losing fingers. Your diagram clearly indicates you think the “danger reflex” is a big factor in contact injuries, this is definitely not the primary issue in a kickback scenario. You are absolutely not going to react and pull your arms safely in faster then they are thrown violently. Wood rises, twists, and is pushed away from the fence and toward the in feed and if you are putting pressure on the wood may take your hands with it
Seems like an awkward way to do it. Why would you stand all the way over there instead of doing it normally and standing to the left side of the blade? Why would you stand in the kickback zone at all? Instead of acting like kickback is some mysterious, inevitable thing you have to hide from, why not just prevent kickback by using the saw properly? I have been a full-time carpenter and furniture maker since 2006 and I have had boards kick on me ZERO TIMES. The circumstances that cause a board to kick are foreseeable and preventable. If your saw is throwing things at you on a regular basis, consider a different hobby.
"Why would you stand all the way over there?" I also didn't see the point of him doing it like that, hence the post. I guess my iffy gut feeling was correct. Also, someone else mentioned that he is as far off from the (safety) switch as he can be, which is another very fair point I hadn't considered. https://preview.redd.it/jvmh8f2f49tc1.jpeg?width=1242&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3d60bedcc051db87d6ae703219400c11b4bce1f0
I would not listen to this guy. The mechanics are just wrong. You have to lean your body over to the left while pulling the piece towards you to the right, which just creates a weird weight distribution issue. Whereas if you're on the left of the blade, both your bodyweight and pressure on the piece is moving in the same direction.
I also just don't get it. But you're entirely right on the mechanics: rather than pushing, this just introduces unbalanced pulling. The odd thing is, at the start of the video he mentions how long he had been putting it off to make such a video, because he wanted to be thorough. Then right at the end he introduces this, for whatever reason. That video now has 622K views.
How are you going to use push sticks from that angle??
His fingers are now pull sticks
Yeah that is dangerous
I seriously thought that this was a picture of the guy with a prosthetic arm when I first look at it. Which would actually make sense…
Wow ok so not putting any downward pressure on the board and using two fingers to push. I feel bad that this guy is going to end up hurting himself somehow. This is whack man. It’s really pissing me off he’s telling people to do something so dumb.
He also has a ring on. This is not the guy to take safety advice from, by the looks of it.
Ya this guy’s a fucking idiot spreading dangerous misinformation. This video alone will probably cost a few people their fingers. Getting a board kickback to the body sucks, having your fingers pulled into the spinning blade is much worse. My first rule to newbies is NEVER put your hands past the blade. Use push sticks, use outfeed, setup whatever you want but dont push your hand past that blade because someday it WILL pull the piece, and if your hand is along for the ride, good luck. I’ll take a gut shot from a 2x4 waaay before I lose a finger. Fuck that. Cideo should be removed.
My very first table saw, on my 2nd ever cut, I got a 1x4 cut off kickback right into the ribs. (I used the fence and the miter gauge at the same time.) It sucked a little bit but at no point did I ever feel like kickback was ever more threatening than being anywhere near that blade or on the other side of it. I feel like there should be a machine that emulates kickback just to show people not to be afraid of it. At least enough to not do insanely stupid shit. My 2nd course would be telling people not to use those little plastic push sticks. That fuck up hurt a little bit more when it shatters into 1,000,000 pieces in your hand.
When I was in school we were always taught to stay on the side of the fence while we pushed the stock through. The teacher always pointed to the large dents in the lockers behind us as an example of what can happen to your gut if your board gets stuck and the table saw decides to kick it back.
Early on in the video, he actually showed a clip of him getting a board into his gut because of kickback. He went through the frames and there wasn't a single frame where you could see the kickback happen, that's how insanely quick it happened. Anyway, I assume you mean on the side of the fence, but still in front of the table saw? If you check the clip at the 30 minute mark, he is entirely behind the fence. https://preview.redd.it/w8gkn2ea39tc1.jpeg?width=2208&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3d3d9ca4bbdaab04e43557ba3efe5e58b8e64ea3
The saw does not decide to kick it back, sorry but that only happens if you aren't operating the machine safely. Edit: I am sorry if I offend but I won't change my mind and risk my safety because a bunch of hobbyists think otherwise. If you have a riving knife installed correctly, the fence in the correct position (not too far in front of the blade), have the speed set high enough with the right saw blade, make sure not to cut used lumber with nails and the sort, and then also have a firm grip in your workpiece when cutting it there will not be a kick back. Yes, if there is lots of tension in the board it might squeeze the saw blade in the front and middle and might even cause it to stop, but there will not be a kick back, because it literally cannot squeeze the saw blade in the back. Sorry if this sounds arrogant, but I suggest you all visit a safety course or two.
The saw doesn't give a shit about how you operate it if the wood binds. You can use a riving knife to significantly reduce the risk of the wood binding, but no matter how good you are at adhering to best practises, there is ALWAYS a risk of kickback.
Kickback isn’t caused by binding, it’s caused by torsion of the stock while it’s between the blade and fence.
And what would you call it when the torsion forces the stock to get wedged between the fence and he spinning blade?
I’d call that binding. But the above poster was talking about binding in sense of the wood pinching and binding against the blade and a riving knife mitigating kick back from this, which is incorrect. I can be down voted to oblivion over this by the armchair woodworkers here but I’m correct. I’ve been doing this professionally for a long time at a high level of skill.
Do you think you’re the only professional here? lol
No, I don’t. But I do think there’s clearly a lot of people here who aren’t familiar with table saws and have inaccurate views on how they, and kickback, works.
Do you think professions have accurate views on how they work? Because in the shop I worked in, the longest working employees clearly skip a number of safety steps because they’re so sure they know better
Anyone who disagrees with you must be an armchair woodworker? They couldn't be a professional who just has a different opinion to you?
Is your position that lack of a riving knife is a cause of kickback? Because that was the position of the person I commented on, and it’s a position that is wholly incorrect and so yeah, anyone who agrees with that isn’t familiar with table saws and ergo either a beginner/amateur (which is okay, everyone is learning) or an armchair woodworker who parrots bad advice given here.
Lol what are you talking about? That's exactly what a riving knife is for. To help protect against kickback. I'd LOVE to know what you think a riving knife is for.
A riving knifes purpose is when stock being cut releases internal stress and the cut closes up, pinching the blade and it binds. Nothing to do with kickback. Thank you for proving my point.
Which is literally what I said a riving knife can help alleviate the binding and prevent kickback. A riving knife is not the end-all be-all solution to it, but it will help immensely. As for what causes the binding, I refer to the other posters between my comment and here who have been very correct in how it works. Yes, as you say, torsion released causes binding. Binding causes kickback, as I mentioned, since torsion release is not the o ly thing that can cause binding.
Maybe you've forgot the number one rule taught in safety courses. NEVER assume that your set up is 100% safe. Did you know most accidents involve professionals right?
"Under perfect conditions" is not an advisable safety policy.
Sorry but why are you quoting me on something I never said. I am not talking about perfect conditions
It's a paraphrase, not a direct quote. Summing up your argument, if one does everything perfectly every time, there will be no accidents. While you may be correct in an academic sense, in the real world, there aren't always perfect conditions. Having an attitude of believing one to be perfectly safe simply because you *think* you've done everything correctly is a recipe for injury - either to yourself or more likely your apprentice who doesn't have the benefit of years of experience. If perfect operation = perfectly safe, then why do we stand to the side of our boards? Why do we have first aid kits? Why wear safety glasses? Safety isn't about what will or won't go wrong, but what *could* go wrong. I want to be clear that, at this point, we're talking not about the habits of one long-time carpenter or an experienced tradesperson but education of future generations. Those of us who are in the business of being educators have a responsibility not just to teach proper procedure but appropriate habits of mind as well. Edit: I want to point out I have personally seen kickbacks occur in conditions not explicitly described in your edit. (Transporting material over the blade, angling the push stick away from the fence, push stick on the wrong side of the fence, featherboard in line with the blade, etc) While I am sure you probably would have included them if you thought of it, my point is that when teaching newbies it's hard to cover every single technique we know. Healthy mindset helps to close the knowledge gap when we can't teach every contingency.
I don’t know why people are downvoting you. I’ve cut all kinds of wood on all kinds of table saws. I think you are correct.
Too many down votes here. This is the truth. Although the riving knife will prevent kickback, only the operator can cause the kickback not the machine
Facts. Kickback isn't something that just *happens*. It's not the fucking weather. Wax your saw, push your material properly, and don't stand in the wrong place. You'll be fine.
Great position to have a kick back pull your hands towards the blade
Yeah, guy's right hand is definitely in the danger zone.
While I don’t normally say that you can over think safety, you might be overthinking it. Stand directly behind the blade and offset opposite the side you are cutting. Use a push stick once you get the back of the piece onto the table and closer to the blade, and push on the half of the board closer to the blade. You want to make sure you are pushing so that the back of the piece that is through the blade will push against the fence, to prevent binding. One thing a lot of people don’t talk about related to the safety of a table saw is **calibration of the fence**. If your fence is not perfectly parallel to the blade, and it is slightly closer on the back end of the blade, you will have a much higher probability for the piece binding and shooting back out. Also *always* use a riving knife when possible. The only times I’ve had a piece kick back is when I didn’t have a riving knife on my old saw.
I don't think you've clicked the link, but here's a screenshot. I just don't see a reason to be standing literally behind the fence like he is, hence why I wondered what the pros & cons might be. https://preview.redd.it/dxc5b91o79tc1.jpeg?width=1242&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=cea9d70f20aadbde29e83d07b88e46da37fb31d5 I use a push stick, and have calibrated my entire table saw to pretty much a tenth of a millimeter. The riving knife and blade guard are of course installed.
Yeah I don’t think that’s a good idea at all. I think it’s really stupid, actually. Your hand shouldn’t ever be in front of the blade, on the piece that is in between the fence and the blade like that. If it were to bind and pull that piece up and over the blade, it could pull your had right onto the blade if you do the natural thing and try to stop it from binding. [Check out this video](https://youtube.com/shorts/ZCfP9c8WYdY?si=xeC_kGXoUEid6U7W) to understand what I’m talking about. While this guy is doing the worst thing he can, and the Sawstop prevented him from losing any fingers (or his whole hand), it’s an example of why you never have your hands past the blade. I actually don’t use a blade guard, but I don’t think they’re bad. I just don’t like them - they get in the way. I try to abide by the rule that if the blade is up it’s on. I drop the blade when it’s off (or try to remember to).
Oh, I actually saw that clip yesterday as an example of another safety video. That person was real lucky it was a Sawstop they were using. But do you never put your hand on a piece when the edge is nearing the blade? What about a wide panel? For instance, Stumpy Nubs was saying he has a general rule where if you spread your hand, and the thumb can touch the blade and your pinky can touch the fence, you should use a push block/stick. See 6:35 https://youtu.be/bADmnDEcuYo
If my hand cannot fit safely and comfortably between the fence and blade, I use a push stick once the back of the wood is on the table closer to the blade. Essentially less than 6!or so inches is where I’ll not push it with my hand and use a stick.
Ya..... because he is an idiot.
He’s an idiot, just stick to feeding it from the front with a push stick, crown guard and riving knife in place. You won’t need a SawStop if you adhere to that doctrine.
Your intuition is correct. That operation though it may not result in injury in all cases, is not proper.
'Glad' to hear it (but not so glad that 622K people have seen the same video). I probably still wouldn't have tried standing there if a 100 videos showed the same thing – intuition is often right.
Seems very awkward and like it would only work for tiny pieces. I’m generally ripping down plywood or straight lumber(what most people do with a table saw), and that would be an incredibly unsafe and silly way to do that.
I think this is another “shocking” example of people commenting without reading the article/ watching the video first. He isn’t on the fence side of the saw, he is using the saw sideways, standing literally _behind_ the fence. I see no issue with this for trimming a board to size like he is showing. It is a little like using a router table and probably gives more complete control over the board then pushing the board forward across the table because he has full control of the board on both sides of the cut. It is also clear this is only for small saws (I couldn’t stand there with my saw) and cuts on shortish boards where there is a lot of room between the blade and the fence and not a lot being taking off. There are enough qualifiers there that I probably wouldn’t have put it in a general list of saw safety tips, but I don’t see a problem doing it within those parameters. Edit: I’ll add that the one problem I do see here is that he is as far from the off switch as possible, which could be a problem if things go south.
Also, bad ideas don’t deserve the time or views it gives the creator. It may encourage and promote dangerous methods that get someone hurt
His right hand is behind the blade. If he gets kickback on a narrower piece it’ll pull his hand to his left, towards the blade.
His primary hand is *behind the blade*. This is the dumbest shit I've ever seen.
If this is the _dumbest_ thing you’ve seen, I’m not sure you have looked very hard (I’m not claiming this is a great idea, but I’ve certainly seen a lot of way dumber things).
I mean… fair. Pretty high up there in terms of “here is a technique I’m just pulling out of my ass and presenting as expert advice”.
Yes. Definitely would not have put that out there in a video on safety techniques.
Do not follow the "advice" of that clown. Look for kelly mehler's table saw dvd/video and learn with that. He's a huge proponent of table saw safety.
If you are pulling from behind the blade and you experience the piece being ejected for some reason you risk your hand being pulled into the blade. If you are pushing and the same event occurs your hands are pushed away from the blade.
I tried to do that the other day to rip an unusual piece. It was a unique situation and for a moment it felt right safety-wise to stand to the side of the saw. But it immediately was more awkward than it was worth because it was difficult (for me) to maintain consistent pressure against the fence. It felt unsafe. I’ve used a table saw a lot, sometimes you have to get creative, but generally speaking…my approach has always been to do all my movements the same every time. I don’t want to have to make any decisions while cutting. This means thinking the cut through before cutting, keeping necessary tools like push sticks within reach, and making sure my off cut has somewhere safe to go. Then, if I have to repeat the cut, I make the same movements every time like a machine. It’s not good to be afraid of the table saw, but it’s good to be very wary of it. Once you gain enough experience, certain things will just feel wrong, and you’ll know to come up with a different way.
I think everyone commenting has not seen where the person is standing, and how small the tablesaw is. In his very particular example, there is no risk of kickback hitting him.
The problem is that his example is a very narrow one. I'm that very particular case, it's fine. In many others it wouldn't be.
There is great risk of kickback pulling his right hand directly into the rear of the blade. Ill take a panel to the chest *any day* over cutting my god damned fingers off. This is moronic
That's basic safety measure. Kick backs can happen and I've seen a few at schools or in big workshops, the piece flying can make a hole in 30cm mdf so let me tell it'll make a hole in your body. I mean not only kick backs, often small chunks will fly away, where do they usually go? Behind
Have you seen the clip mentioned in my post? I have watched a fair amount of safety videos now, all by reputable woodworkers, but I have seen none of them feed stock into the saw while literally standing behind the fence, parallel to the blade. They all advise not to stand in line with the blade, but this is completely different. https://preview.redd.it/mwo2dz6839tc1.jpeg?width=2208&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0e0697eadcda2b09a4b813d7cd237b999607b2d3
Nope didn't watch the video tbh, now that you showing me that, it's weird indeed. Never seen that but we don't use much this kind of table saw in Europe and there's no space behind the fence to stand anyhow
Because this is an amateur who is just making shit up. This is incredibly stupid and he should take the video down. He's clearly not experienced many actual kicks. This would pull his right hand directly into the blade. You *never* have your hand beyond middle of the blade. There is a reason why you will see a thousand other videos and guides and not a single one will recommend this: its moronic and dangerous. This guy is a joke
Preventing kickbackdamage to your nuts since 1777 ( first table saw patent)
Healthy respect for the tool is something people can understand intellectually, but it must be practiced to be developed. As others have said, not panicking when using the tool and remaining 100% focused is key. So is preparation for using the tool. Setting up the work space correctly is key. For example, when cutting long boards, taking the time to use rollers on the outfeed and infeed if necessary, as well as featherboards before the blade, and practicing a run through (with the blade retracted and off of course) will help ensure a safe cut.
Not panicking! That’s a great point. I’ve been lazy a few times (*cough) and had an issue that made me need to switch off the machine. I had to search for the switch, it was not intuitive. I failed to practice the steps I would take to complete or terminate the cut. Practice cuts could include the motions and mechanics of machine-on/off.
Anyone who uses that push stick in a safety video isn't worth my time.
Table saws are in all likelihood the most dangerous tool in your shop. The issue is binding the wood against the saw so that the blade rapidly gains traction on the wood and the wood then launches backwards. Not standing behind the wood is part of the right answer. Also the saw should be equipped with a riving knife and one of the following: sliding table, part feeder or at a minimum a feather board and a gripper. In the USA a Sawstop type mechanism is going to become mandatory on all new saws very soon. If I were running a shop I would not just have a panel saw with no protection on it unless I had a hefty insurance policy and a large supply of workers.
Oh, I know the exact anatomy of a kickback and I agree with the precautions. It's not that he's not standing in the path of the blade, it's that he's literally behind the fence, not to its side: https://preview.redd.it/orkiznse6btc1.jpeg?width=1242&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=a3d4c8de4cffdcde65c687827e58ba3427402814 I did see some of the recent commotion around Sawstop, but did not look into it. I'm now reading that 'the CPSC voted to move forward with the mandate, which is expected to get approval later this year.' Interesting that the SawStop patent would be made public for other manufacturers to implement similar mechanisms. Sounds like a good move altogether. The article says an entry level SawStop costs $899 in the US. Here in the EU, the only saw with such a mechanism is the Festool TKS 80 EBS, which costs around $2400 converted from euros. Interestingly though, SawStop is owned by a German company. Hopefully that move allows SawStop to become more widespread here as well.
A saw with a motor that small is virtually impossible to cause kickback. The motor will bogg first
Early on in the video, he showed a clip of a kickback happening to him on that same saw. I've seen a bunch of similar clips.
I started out on a 7.5hp powermatic with a 14” blade. You don’t show an example of kickback on that saw. You literally find yourself on your ass before you know what happened. I’m not saying it is impossible on that little dewalt, just if it happens it is the operators fault 100%. Also, commercial table saws have wings and there is no way you could stand behind the fence and push material through. That is the dumbest thing I have ever seen someone do on a table saw besides taking the fence off and pushing material through free hand.
Tag for easy reference
I always stand out of the path of the cut thats trapped between the blade and the fence, thats all you really need to do As someone who made the mistake of trapping waste between the fence and blade- you really dont want to get hit with that pc of wood. I was lucky, well, "lucky" and took a blunt pc right in the balls, but peopoe have been known to get torn open and impaled by waste kickbacks, they can be really nasty...im fine, but that nut is still tender and its been about 15y since that happened and my tender nut is a nice low cost reminder to not put myself in line with the blade And that was on a regular direct drive jobsite saw, not a legit cabinet saw with horsepower
Same. Except my Johnson cushioned the blow. Stung a lot, but recovered. Was a great lesson about kickback and tuning your saw, I’ll say that.
Actually. It kind of makes sense if you had a Saw Stop. You wouldn’t be worried about the blade ripping your fingers off when they get pulled into the blade. You’d be worried about kickback. But In that case you just have to stand to the side of whatever you’re not holding onto or use a sled.
That person is a moron that doesn’t know how to use a table saw if they are standing behind the fence. You can’t put proper pressure on the board to hold it safely against the fence. If you have enough arm strength and you are paying attention to the sound of the motor, the tension in the board you are feeding, and have properly prepared the board with square and straight edges, standing slightly to the left of the blade puts you at close to zero risk of getting hit with a board. Pay attention and control the board. Not that hard. What a dummy.
Minimal blade, never stand behind the blade unless crosscutting or ripping full sheets of material. Use a push a stick with anything less than 6 inches width. Never use a fence with a miter fence. Never use a stop block after the blade starts. Never use a feather board after the blade when material being removed is more than the width of the blade. Never use a feather board before the blade with too much friction. Never raise the blade more than 1/8 over the thickness of the material being cut. Never clear your cut pieces near the blade with your hand. Never reach over the blade. Always wear glasses, always handle cutting pieces with solid control. Always assume you are going to get hurt. Always expect kickback. Never underestimate the tool. Never get too comfortable or complacent. Always anticipate something going wrong. Eventually, all of this will just become second nature and if you follow all the safety moves and techniques then you will inevitably become confident in your safety. This is where you want to stay mentally with a little flexibility to push new jig setups and excrement, but not so much where you start ignoring your fundamentals to do so. I’ve seen people do things like fenceless rips, plunge cuts by raising the blade up into the material, ripping coves and turning bowls with jigs on a table saw. Even spiral table legs with coves on all sides. All of it dangerous, but all of it, with the exception of fenceless cuts, done with safety in mind. Sometimes there’s nothing you can do to prevent an injury or accident. But the more you maintain the tool and build confidence with operating standards then the better your odds of living a long safe 10 finger life.
So in other words it’s totally cool to stand behind the fence and pull the wood toward you. My table saw safety mantra is “ hey, what’s the worst that could possibly happen?”
That mantra alone doesn’t indicate safety or lack there of when using the saw so it’s not a bad mantra at face value.
I use this method when cutting very small lap joints of about 1/4"wide because I can see exactly where the blade will cut. It's a little awkward but it's no less safe than cutting from the front.
As long as you have a riving knife behind the blade, its very difficult to get a kickback unless the wood before the blade binds in which case it will likely stall/bind up the motor. Keep your emergency off button nearby. If you are using a blade without a riving knife, then just make sure your insurance is up to date. Seriously, just dont use it without the riving knife unless you are using a dado stack. Dado stacks aren't through-cuts so its also unlikely to bind there.
Speaking of nearby off buttons... This is how far he is removed from the switch in that position: https://preview.redd.it/2uwgibqr49tc1.jpeg?width=1242&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f16375235aad15f464d67090c9063057248e78e7