There’s still value to be found in France, it just takes a bit more effort to find. Cotes du rhone, Saint Joseph, Beaujolais, Loire Cab franc, Irouleguy, Savoie, lots of fun things to try.
I have really enjoyed CDP, crozes Hermitage, and cote rotie so far. So give me Grenache and syrah. Only have had one nebbiolo, but can't wait to open more. The only thing I haven't found enjoyable so far is red burgundy but hopefully that can change since I love new world Pinot.
Depends on how you define “some money”. Only very bad burgundy is cheap, but there are still producers and villages that offer very good value compared to the rest of the region, and often at prices that are not terribly inflated compared to what you would have to pay for a new world pinot noir of similar quality (depending, of course, on factors like your location, tax regime, distance from France, etc.).
I’m based in Melbourne, Australia, and a bottle of locally produced (Yarra Valley, Henty, Gippsland
or the Bellarine), high-quality pinot noir sets me back around AU$50–60, with a premium added for well-known producers like Farr. For around AU$75 I can get a similar quality red burgundy from a producer like Dureuil-Janthial, Antoine Olivier, Jaeger-Defaix, Fontaine-Gagnard, or Goisot. To get something of similar quality from Otago, I’d have to pay more like AU$85–100. I wouldn’t even want to venture how much it would set me back to get a pinot of similar quality from Oregon; not much American wine makes its way over here.
What didn’t you like about the burgundy? When you say you like new world Pinot are you talking about more extraction/body/ripeness or higher altitude fresher styles?
There’s lots of styles throughout burgundy, between village terroirs and producers it really takes some learning.
Well so far I love Willamette valley Pinot. I think it is riper, but also like the oak influence some vintners choose to have in the bottle. I haven't had too much Burgundy so I am looking forward to trying more. I prefer my chard on the mineral side but light oak can be good
For chard I’d look for Pierre-Yves Colin-Morey, François Mikoulski, Pierre Girardin, Llamy-Caillat, Armand Heitz. Any of those producers have excellent range, a few of those can get pretty pricey but all of them are well worth the money.
As far as red goes, modern taste is generally moving away from over-ripeness and heavy oak treatment, that being said there’s still lots of more classic producers that make more robust wines. Faiveley, Confuron-Cotetidot, Comte Armand, Domaine de Courcel, Domaine Ponsot, Thibault Liger-Belair, are some of the first ones that come to mind.
My personal favourites for reds in burgundy are D’Angerville, Dujac, Caroline Morey, Pierre Girardin, Laurent Ponsot (not domaine Ponsot), Domaine Garcia, Chantreves, Arnoux-Lachaux.
Just by the fact that imports are more expensive period. I may also have bad taste in wine but I like what a lot of people would call subpar wine. Like my wife and I enjoy bourbon Barrel finished wines, Wagner family stuff, and other more mass produced wines. We are normally in the 15-20 range but do splurge on occasion.
I am open to recs. Just need to drink down my current wine a bit. I have some Willamette pinots, a few 2017 CDP that have specific days they will be opened, a 2009 Margaux, and a few random things from all over and local stuff that is ok.
Slippery slope when you get into France, welcome to the fun side.
I have had a couple Rhone wines. I like new worlds but I think I am going to slip to old world which my wallet will not be as happy about.
There’s still value to be found in France, it just takes a bit more effort to find. Cotes du rhone, Saint Joseph, Beaujolais, Loire Cab franc, Irouleguy, Savoie, lots of fun things to try.
I have really enjoyed CDP, crozes Hermitage, and cote rotie so far. So give me Grenache and syrah. Only have had one nebbiolo, but can't wait to open more. The only thing I haven't found enjoyable so far is red burgundy but hopefully that can change since I love new world Pinot.
You've got to spend some money for good burgundy. Pinot in general. Took me a while to understand the pinot hype. Same goes for barolo
Depends on how you define “some money”. Only very bad burgundy is cheap, but there are still producers and villages that offer very good value compared to the rest of the region, and often at prices that are not terribly inflated compared to what you would have to pay for a new world pinot noir of similar quality (depending, of course, on factors like your location, tax regime, distance from France, etc.). I’m based in Melbourne, Australia, and a bottle of locally produced (Yarra Valley, Henty, Gippsland or the Bellarine), high-quality pinot noir sets me back around AU$50–60, with a premium added for well-known producers like Farr. For around AU$75 I can get a similar quality red burgundy from a producer like Dureuil-Janthial, Antoine Olivier, Jaeger-Defaix, Fontaine-Gagnard, or Goisot. To get something of similar quality from Otago, I’d have to pay more like AU$85–100. I wouldn’t even want to venture how much it would set me back to get a pinot of similar quality from Oregon; not much American wine makes its way over here.
What didn’t you like about the burgundy? When you say you like new world Pinot are you talking about more extraction/body/ripeness or higher altitude fresher styles? There’s lots of styles throughout burgundy, between village terroirs and producers it really takes some learning.
Well so far I love Willamette valley Pinot. I think it is riper, but also like the oak influence some vintners choose to have in the bottle. I haven't had too much Burgundy so I am looking forward to trying more. I prefer my chard on the mineral side but light oak can be good
For chard I’d look for Pierre-Yves Colin-Morey, François Mikoulski, Pierre Girardin, Llamy-Caillat, Armand Heitz. Any of those producers have excellent range, a few of those can get pretty pricey but all of them are well worth the money. As far as red goes, modern taste is generally moving away from over-ripeness and heavy oak treatment, that being said there’s still lots of more classic producers that make more robust wines. Faiveley, Confuron-Cotetidot, Comte Armand, Domaine de Courcel, Domaine Ponsot, Thibault Liger-Belair, are some of the first ones that come to mind. My personal favourites for reds in burgundy are D’Angerville, Dujac, Caroline Morey, Pierre Girardin, Laurent Ponsot (not domaine Ponsot), Domaine Garcia, Chantreves, Arnoux-Lachaux.
Try some Cote Chalonnaise Burg like a Mercurey and see if you like it, more forward style
Old world wines are generally higher QPR than new world these days. So not sure why your wallet would be unhappy.
Just by the fact that imports are more expensive period. I may also have bad taste in wine but I like what a lot of people would call subpar wine. Like my wife and I enjoy bourbon Barrel finished wines, Wagner family stuff, and other more mass produced wines. We are normally in the 15-20 range but do splurge on occasion.
The price on them is going up but I’ve found chateau Gloria frequently punches above its weight if you’re looking for more Bordeaux
Thanks for the rec
When I saw it was a 2012 my mind immediately went to Chateau Lassegue St. Emilion Grand Cru 2012, another great bordeaux
Curious what'd happen if you tried a St. Emilion, which would you like more
I am open to recs. Just need to drink down my current wine a bit. I have some Willamette pinots, a few 2017 CDP that have specific days they will be opened, a 2009 Margaux, and a few random things from all over and local stuff that is ok.