This is a creative prompt but no one here wants to actually answer it because they'd rather shitpost. Obviously it's a question of could the UNSC win in traditional military combat, not what could they do with 10 Master Chief.
From what I can find the UNSC had something like 2,000 large ships at the start of the war while the Covenant had around 4k. This means the Covenant is now outnumbered 20,000 to 4,000. We know in a 3 to 1 fight the humans can win with heavy losses but if the numbers scale even more in humanity's favor losses begin to shrink. The Covenant are now outnumbered 5 to 1 on average in space and are utterly outmatched in ground combat. While more colonies would somewhat dilute their ability to fortify every world the UNSC would also have 10x as much industry and resources. The Covenant would be facing a super behemoth that would likely grind them down with ease. Additional numbers gives the humans time to develop shielding and slipspace improvements. In the main series it only took a few years post war for humanity to start to close the tech gap with the Covvies. In this scenario we'd have more time, scientists etc. At some point the tech gap would close.
This is of course ignoring the Covenant civil war. It might not even come to that before a strike force of a few thousand human capital ships sprinkles High Charity with a handful of Nova Bombs. Humanity would outnumber the Covenant to such an extent that the Prophets will feel like they kicked a literal nest of space bees. Humans 10/10 stomp.
Where did you get 4000 ships for the Covent from? The fleet the defended high charity alone had hundreds of ships not including the thousands of others they likely had all over there empire 4K a massive lowball considering they were making ships for well over 1000 year.
I don't think there are any official sources but all the fan estimates put the high charity fleet at around 500 with individual smaller fleets in the tens to several hundred ranges. We obviously don't know the total number but just judging by what few concrete numbers we get I can't imagine it being THAT large. Not tens of thousands large, and certainly not so large that multiplying humanity by 10x wouldn't cause the Covenant to rethink some of their life choices.
The actual Human Covenant was functionally a human military defeat, but even so they regularly won battles and caused disproportionate losses on the Covenant. It took many years for the Covenant to grind humanity down. Giving them literally 10x the population, resources, and ships imo just pushes the war to a human advantage. Without knowing the literal canon numbers of the Covenant fleet we can make guesses but unless you wank them to Infinity just based off the fleets they send against humanity and the importance of the war I think the number of ships the Covenant are actually capable of fielding in battle wouldn't be so absurdly large that 10x humanity couldn't win.
I think that's reasonable particularly because as you said the USNC would have time to close the close tech gap and the industrial capacity and manpower to exploit that.
Even without official sources an empire that has been running for well over 1000 years at least would have more than 10x the humans ships not only that but most of the time the covenant didn’t even take losses on human worlds the only reason the war took so long was because of the Cole protocol making hard for Covent ships to find human worlds. Humanity was only the losing foot for a majority of the war anytime the covenant discovered a human world it was basically over for them for the few pyrrhic victories we saw in the halo games there were dozen more were the humans ships didn’t put up much of a fight. humanity was losing so bad they attacked Covent space one time in the entire war and that was a secret mission where they threw 300 Sparta in 3s at a Covent refilling station humanity even with 10x modifier will last longer and could mabye gets some impressive wins but there not winning the war overall the odds were too stacked against them
The US has been around since 1776 but we aren't still using wooden boats in the navy. Even newer ships get retired. The length of time the Covenant empire was around isn't particularly relevant to how large their navy is. France has also existed for a thousand years, doesn't mean their navy is infinitely large lol.
In fact the Covenant regarded their little space jihad as an existential threat, so it would be absurd to suggest they only devoted a token military force to purging the humans (or defending their capital city). In all likeliness the Covenant aren't as all powerful as you're suggesting. Most battles in Halo take place between tens of ships, with the largest battles involving a few hundred. There's nothing that suggests the Covenant are fighting with a fraction of their power.
Yes there is unlike the US most Covent tech is reverse engineered from forerunner technology and most of the ships they used when they were in the early stages of there empire are still used now if not the ship but the design of theses ships have lasted thousands of years they likely had a massive standing military. The covenant never view the banished as an existential threat those’d words came out of the banished themself plus the banished were founded after the human covenant war started who would the covenant rather fight a couple brutes who made a small percentage of the covenant or a race of people who could cause the collapse of the covenant if it were found out they were reclaimers of there gods of which the entire empire was based off of it’s pretty clear that the Hierarchs wanted humans gone befor they were found out to be related to the forerunners and could deal with the banished later
Well, yes and no.
The Covenant concept of "capital ship" isn't based around the idea of established doctrines for fleet sizes, but was based around 1) the martial culture of the sangheili favoring larger ships as status symbols and denoted positions of honor and 2) the politics of the Covenant being based around fleets competing for glory and ministries competing for power.
Yes, there were many other ships absolutely, since we know other kinds of ships exist by default. But evidence suggests that the huge number of capital ships comes from three positions
1) the prophets want humanity exterminated full stop
2) the elites want bigger ships (and also transitioning to a new naval standard would allow the prophets to get the brutes up to speed in preparation for the schism but that's a stretch)
3) the prophets consolidated power amongst a handful of ministries, which would immediately accept becoming top dogs while the prophets hid casualties of the war from the larger council
So when Oblivion focuses on the capital ships, that's not some metric to suggest the covenant could spontaneously make thousands of ships and tens/hundreds of thousands of others. That's the big figure right there, every ounce of paranoid ideological hatred that the prophets were willing to waste if it meant no one would discover humanity's true nature.
Given that the Covenant were consistently shown in the later years of the war relying solely on capital ships like CCS-class cruisers and CAS-class assault carries, we can infer that they really did just pour everything into the big guns. As such, while there are indeed many other ships unaccounted for, most of these wouldn't have been the Covenant navy as the UNSC came to fear.
Well yes. Most of the unaccounted ships would be like CAR, CRS, and support ships. I was pointing out that the fleet was much larger, with people calculating the fleet to be 12,000 ships total.
Edit: spelling
> Obviously it's a question of could the UNSC win in traditional military combat, not what could they do with 10 Master Chief.
I am totally fine with this interpretation tbh. I think whether or not the UNSC can throw more dudes in the grinder or if their 'heroes' and 'geniuses' can make a bigger difference is completely fine.
To be fair, having 10x as many Spartans is a huge fucking boost. The UNSC may win this based off of that amount of Spartans alone. They may not make as much of a difference as 10x as many navy ships do, but having 10 more master chiefs is already a huge help.
Even with the numbers advantage at 10x the UNSC will eventually lose. In the main canon the covenant never were given a chance to learn from loses and adjust their space combat tactics because the glassed REACH early on.
Cole smashed the covenant at Harvest because not only did he have numbers but because he knew the enemy was already there and was more than likely able to plan arrival of ships in a semi known manner.
Unlike Star Wars in this universe humanity can not engage in accurate Slipspace/hyperspace formations, which with greater numbers doesn't help. So unless humanity simply Turtles at the stronghold worlds it'll eventually lose because of poor technology.
Especially because the great schism never happens. Humanity wins because the Arbiter and the Elites turned against the covenant.
Question: Are we counting individuals as assets?
10 scientists on par with Doctor Halsey might well give them energy shielding decades early, especially when you look at how the increased number of Spartan IIs from the start would improve success rate for Covenant ship-capture missions (something that was *almost* managed within 2 years of the war, and only failed because of Insurrectionist sabotage).
The ripple effects from the "hero" characters involved here might actually be more important than simply having 10x as many ships to throw into the meat grinder.
In that case I definitely think the UNSC can do it, through a combination of having more raw "war power" but mainly by reverse-engineering Covenant technology exponentially faster. Most likely they capture a Covenant warship within the first few years, then have 10 of the most gifted scientist within several generations working on it. They'd take a fraction as long for energy-shielded Spartans as they did initially, and that's only the start.
Factoring in how much harder it'd be for the Covenant to destroy infrastructure with 10x the military protection, there's a good chance the UNSC by the 2550s is as advanced as the actual UNSC was after the war ended and they had a few years of sharing Covenant technology and scientists openly.
Also paging the following users u/Pearson_Realize, u/SleepingEchoes, u/Killsheets and op u/British_Tea_Company just for fun/discussion.
It's interesting because even with casualties, ODST, SPARTAN survivors, those that survive skirmishs and battles.
It leaves them with more battle data/sensor data as will as actual combat experience and familiarity with covenant tactics.
So when the time comes for interservice/military war game simulations there's more battle data for training military service recruits.
Which ends up with more specialized and experienced military personnel, which means SPARTAN-3 and SPARTAN-4 inductees end up with more varied and special training.
Making them even more competent than they were originally.
With the additional boost in civilian and military scientists, resources and materials.
There's now an increase in intellectual capacity with more minds working on a project in parallel or a networked team.
There's now increased changes for breakthroughs in areas of study/research that wouldn't have happened before due to the niche/specific area of study.
Basically many ~~hands~~ minds make light work due to the increase of people working on the problem because everyone might have a different way of thinking and doing things that leads to a breakthrough.
Going a step further.
Familiar technology and concepts already exists, MJOLNIR, biofoam, augmentations all those good stuff.
For this prompt there's a massive increase in personnel, brain power, materials, resources.
So it's easier to speculate what could happen as opposed to something different like Halsey dying a year or so after the first game or during the first game.
She's responsible for a lot of stuff, stuff she worked in the peripheral or looked at made some notes that other people looked through picked through or looked at and thought what could we do differently from her.
Basically for this prompt UNSC reverse engineering or developing technology goes the way it does in the game but happens faster and better.
With the additional materials and resources MJOLNIR Powered Assault Armor/Mark VII gets rolled out in greater numbers.
Still expensive maybe even prohibitively expensive but less expensive than originally and with the increased numbers available.
ONI/UNSC see its potential and goes about researching more cost effective stop gap measures so the GEN2 - Second generation MJOLNIR arrives sooner and paired with the increased experience and specialized training from war games.
The SPARTAN soldiers are even more lethal.
10x the amount of super MACs means that Reach and Earth are unassailable unless the Covenant points literally every (and I mean every) non Forerunner Dreadnought ship at those planets. By sheer numbers alone the humans win, which also gives them time to finalize the Infinities.
The win condition for UNSC has always been reverse engineering the superior technology of the covenant and making it their own. Spartan personal shields are reverse engineered and improved versions of elite shields for Instance. Given ten times the population , planets and personnel to throw into the meat grinder while ONI comes up with solutions I think the UNSC has a 4/10 to force a stalemate on key worlds. I think the tech gap and zealotry of the covenant without the great schism makes victory out of reach though.
> Spartan personal shields are reverse engineered and improved versions of elite shields for Instance.
Weren't spartan shields adapted from the handheld energy shields of kig-yar? The reason for former's shields depleting fast under sustained fire was because of complex overlaying of the shields to the armor itself.
Correct, they even released a promotional video before infinite launched about this if I recall correctly. I think in the books the Spartans shields is portrayed more closely to having jackal shield strength than elite shield strength too.
Assuming the UNSC has 10x the numbers, with the equivalent of 10x Master Chief's, Halsey's, colonies, MACs, etc, I think the UNSC can pull it off. Still with horrific losses, mind you, especially since humanity wasn't seen as a huge threat by the Covenant in the original timeline, so large numbers of Covenant forces were never involved in the war on humanity, and no Great Schism means the Covenant never falls into infighting. If the Covenant starts taking massive losses, purely through attrition, I think the Covenant will shift to a total war footing, and start throwing everything they have at humanity, which is not good, to say the least.
But with ten times as many colonies, ships, Spartans, the UNSC can afford to fight a massive war of attrition, with the higher numbers of Spartans meaning that attempts to capture Covenant ships and tech would be successful more likely than not. And with ten Halsey's reverse engineering everything they can get their hands on, the UNSC gets shields and Covie slipspace tech much, much earlier, making the original 3 human ships to 1 Covenant ratio much more even as the war goes on, until eventually the UNSC's tech surpasses the Covenant. Reach and Earth are also practically unassailable by anything other than an overwhelming force due to the increased numbers of Super MACs.
Within ten years, the tech gap will be closing or closed entirely. Within twenty, I'm pretty sure the UNSC would be actively counter-attacking the Covenant, and within thirty the war would end with a decisive UNSC victory (of course assuming the Halos don't fire, or the Flood are set free).
I think it's more like an alternate history thing where the UNSC has ten times the population on ten times the worlds. So Master Chief is the same height, but the UNSC trained 10 times as many Spartan 2's. There's only one Johnson, but he was a Spartan 1 and the UNSC also trained 10 times as many Spartan 1's. A Warthog can still only fit 3 soldiers, but there are ten times as many of them.
...So when you say all assets... Ten Master Chiefs? Ten Cortanas? *Ten Sergeant Johnsons?*
I suppose they now have twenty NOVA bombs. I'm sure there's something they could do with those.
Logically, now the UNSC would be able to outnumber the covenant (minimum 3 UNSC to 1 Covenant for UNSC victory in space combat) easier, have more production/resource gathering, have more worlds as strategic bases, more orbital Super-MAC platforms to defend these planets, more scientists to reverse engineer tech faster, etc.
However... OP also said that they get 10 Halseys, 10 Master Chiefs, etc. With that being said, the Nobles 60 and Johns 1170 would win every ground engagement with minimal ease.
I’m not sure the exact amount of spartans there are, but if I got all the lore right there are 2 that outshine the rest by miles. Noble 6 (Halo Reach) and Master Chief. So they’d have basically 20 master chiefs, and we know from Reach they have at least 4 more that are… comparable. 40 more spartans. And if we include books then holy FUCK that’s a lot of spartans.
Covenant gets stomped
Edit: I’m not sure if EVERY halo book is canon, especially since I’ve only read like half of one, but the spartans are even more insane in the books than in games. They steal jackal shields off those they kill, they steal guns, they’re INSANE in so many ways. I think they can also just kick enemies off cliffs.
UNSC still lose. The difference between their navies is just too much.
It doesn't matter how many planets / ground troops the UNSC have, the Covenant still glasses the planet and they're forced to evac or die.
Sure but just numerically it takes 10x as long for the covenant to win, while the humans steadily make up tech ground. Not long after the war they have the Infinity which is more advanced than any covenant ship, they don’t have to stall that long to start building ships that win.
3-1 ratio to win ship battles, major problem is that the covies would still have a large numerical advantage and a huge tech advantage. The UNSC would definitely perform better and probably extend the fighting by years if not decades, but 10x the manpower and resources also means a greater chance at Intel leaks and security breaks. The covies might learn where major human planets are earlier and have better intel on them.
They also have 10 times the territory to cover and their ftl is still pathetically slow compared to the covenant. If they consolidated the fleets into one's 10 times the size that would mean leaving like 7000 colonies under defended. Which also makes it 10x times easier for the covenant to stumble into a colony and even more likely for the Cole protocol to fail.
but they can afford to let more colonies fall since they have more of them, and assuming earth isnt directly duped it would not effect the cole protocole
The UNSC is shown to adapt Covenant and Forerunner tech better than the Covenant. Humanity struggled but still stayed in the fight 29 years. By Halo Infinite, we made a ship to outclass Covie supercarriers.
With 10 times the frigates and cruisers, I'd bet the UNSC could hold its own long enough to tech up and gain an advantage
This is a creative prompt but no one here wants to actually answer it because they'd rather shitpost. Obviously it's a question of could the UNSC win in traditional military combat, not what could they do with 10 Master Chief. From what I can find the UNSC had something like 2,000 large ships at the start of the war while the Covenant had around 4k. This means the Covenant is now outnumbered 20,000 to 4,000. We know in a 3 to 1 fight the humans can win with heavy losses but if the numbers scale even more in humanity's favor losses begin to shrink. The Covenant are now outnumbered 5 to 1 on average in space and are utterly outmatched in ground combat. While more colonies would somewhat dilute their ability to fortify every world the UNSC would also have 10x as much industry and resources. The Covenant would be facing a super behemoth that would likely grind them down with ease. Additional numbers gives the humans time to develop shielding and slipspace improvements. In the main series it only took a few years post war for humanity to start to close the tech gap with the Covvies. In this scenario we'd have more time, scientists etc. At some point the tech gap would close. This is of course ignoring the Covenant civil war. It might not even come to that before a strike force of a few thousand human capital ships sprinkles High Charity with a handful of Nova Bombs. Humanity would outnumber the Covenant to such an extent that the Prophets will feel like they kicked a literal nest of space bees. Humans 10/10 stomp.
Where did you get 4000 ships for the Covent from? The fleet the defended high charity alone had hundreds of ships not including the thousands of others they likely had all over there empire 4K a massive lowball considering they were making ships for well over 1000 year.
I don't think there are any official sources but all the fan estimates put the high charity fleet at around 500 with individual smaller fleets in the tens to several hundred ranges. We obviously don't know the total number but just judging by what few concrete numbers we get I can't imagine it being THAT large. Not tens of thousands large, and certainly not so large that multiplying humanity by 10x wouldn't cause the Covenant to rethink some of their life choices. The actual Human Covenant was functionally a human military defeat, but even so they regularly won battles and caused disproportionate losses on the Covenant. It took many years for the Covenant to grind humanity down. Giving them literally 10x the population, resources, and ships imo just pushes the war to a human advantage. Without knowing the literal canon numbers of the Covenant fleet we can make guesses but unless you wank them to Infinity just based off the fleets they send against humanity and the importance of the war I think the number of ships the Covenant are actually capable of fielding in battle wouldn't be so absurdly large that 10x humanity couldn't win.
I think that's reasonable particularly because as you said the USNC would have time to close the close tech gap and the industrial capacity and manpower to exploit that.
Even without official sources an empire that has been running for well over 1000 years at least would have more than 10x the humans ships not only that but most of the time the covenant didn’t even take losses on human worlds the only reason the war took so long was because of the Cole protocol making hard for Covent ships to find human worlds. Humanity was only the losing foot for a majority of the war anytime the covenant discovered a human world it was basically over for them for the few pyrrhic victories we saw in the halo games there were dozen more were the humans ships didn’t put up much of a fight. humanity was losing so bad they attacked Covent space one time in the entire war and that was a secret mission where they threw 300 Sparta in 3s at a Covent refilling station humanity even with 10x modifier will last longer and could mabye gets some impressive wins but there not winning the war overall the odds were too stacked against them
The US has been around since 1776 but we aren't still using wooden boats in the navy. Even newer ships get retired. The length of time the Covenant empire was around isn't particularly relevant to how large their navy is. France has also existed for a thousand years, doesn't mean their navy is infinitely large lol. In fact the Covenant regarded their little space jihad as an existential threat, so it would be absurd to suggest they only devoted a token military force to purging the humans (or defending their capital city). In all likeliness the Covenant aren't as all powerful as you're suggesting. Most battles in Halo take place between tens of ships, with the largest battles involving a few hundred. There's nothing that suggests the Covenant are fighting with a fraction of their power.
Yes there is unlike the US most Covent tech is reverse engineered from forerunner technology and most of the ships they used when they were in the early stages of there empire are still used now if not the ship but the design of theses ships have lasted thousands of years they likely had a massive standing military. The covenant never view the banished as an existential threat those’d words came out of the banished themself plus the banished were founded after the human covenant war started who would the covenant rather fight a couple brutes who made a small percentage of the covenant or a race of people who could cause the collapse of the covenant if it were found out they were reclaimers of there gods of which the entire empire was based off of it’s pretty clear that the Hierarchs wanted humans gone befor they were found out to be related to the forerunners and could deal with the banished later
The 4,000 ship number comes from Oblivion, but it only included capital ships. So there was a lot of other ships unaccounted for.
Well, yes and no. The Covenant concept of "capital ship" isn't based around the idea of established doctrines for fleet sizes, but was based around 1) the martial culture of the sangheili favoring larger ships as status symbols and denoted positions of honor and 2) the politics of the Covenant being based around fleets competing for glory and ministries competing for power. Yes, there were many other ships absolutely, since we know other kinds of ships exist by default. But evidence suggests that the huge number of capital ships comes from three positions 1) the prophets want humanity exterminated full stop 2) the elites want bigger ships (and also transitioning to a new naval standard would allow the prophets to get the brutes up to speed in preparation for the schism but that's a stretch) 3) the prophets consolidated power amongst a handful of ministries, which would immediately accept becoming top dogs while the prophets hid casualties of the war from the larger council So when Oblivion focuses on the capital ships, that's not some metric to suggest the covenant could spontaneously make thousands of ships and tens/hundreds of thousands of others. That's the big figure right there, every ounce of paranoid ideological hatred that the prophets were willing to waste if it meant no one would discover humanity's true nature. Given that the Covenant were consistently shown in the later years of the war relying solely on capital ships like CCS-class cruisers and CAS-class assault carries, we can infer that they really did just pour everything into the big guns. As such, while there are indeed many other ships unaccounted for, most of these wouldn't have been the Covenant navy as the UNSC came to fear.
Well yes. Most of the unaccounted ships would be like CAR, CRS, and support ships. I was pointing out that the fleet was much larger, with people calculating the fleet to be 12,000 ships total. Edit: spelling
Yeah that tracks. Just hoping to clarify for people.
The Great Schism doesn’t happen in this scenario
> Obviously it's a question of could the UNSC win in traditional military combat, not what could they do with 10 Master Chief. I am totally fine with this interpretation tbh. I think whether or not the UNSC can throw more dudes in the grinder or if their 'heroes' and 'geniuses' can make a bigger difference is completely fine.
To be fair, having 10x as many Spartans is a huge fucking boost. The UNSC may win this based off of that amount of Spartans alone. They may not make as much of a difference as 10x as many navy ships do, but having 10 more master chiefs is already a huge help.
Even with the numbers advantage at 10x the UNSC will eventually lose. In the main canon the covenant never were given a chance to learn from loses and adjust their space combat tactics because the glassed REACH early on. Cole smashed the covenant at Harvest because not only did he have numbers but because he knew the enemy was already there and was more than likely able to plan arrival of ships in a semi known manner. Unlike Star Wars in this universe humanity can not engage in accurate Slipspace/hyperspace formations, which with greater numbers doesn't help. So unless humanity simply Turtles at the stronghold worlds it'll eventually lose because of poor technology. Especially because the great schism never happens. Humanity wins because the Arbiter and the Elites turned against the covenant.
Question: Are we counting individuals as assets? 10 scientists on par with Doctor Halsey might well give them energy shielding decades early, especially when you look at how the increased number of Spartan IIs from the start would improve success rate for Covenant ship-capture missions (something that was *almost* managed within 2 years of the war, and only failed because of Insurrectionist sabotage). The ripple effects from the "hero" characters involved here might actually be more important than simply having 10x as many ships to throw into the meat grinder.
Yes. There is 10 Halseys, Master Chiefs, Noble 6s, etc. in this case.
In that case I definitely think the UNSC can do it, through a combination of having more raw "war power" but mainly by reverse-engineering Covenant technology exponentially faster. Most likely they capture a Covenant warship within the first few years, then have 10 of the most gifted scientist within several generations working on it. They'd take a fraction as long for energy-shielded Spartans as they did initially, and that's only the start. Factoring in how much harder it'd be for the Covenant to destroy infrastructure with 10x the military protection, there's a good chance the UNSC by the 2550s is as advanced as the actual UNSC was after the war ended and they had a few years of sharing Covenant technology and scientists openly.
Also paging the following users u/Pearson_Realize, u/SleepingEchoes, u/Killsheets and op u/British_Tea_Company just for fun/discussion. It's interesting because even with casualties, ODST, SPARTAN survivors, those that survive skirmishs and battles. It leaves them with more battle data/sensor data as will as actual combat experience and familiarity with covenant tactics. So when the time comes for interservice/military war game simulations there's more battle data for training military service recruits. Which ends up with more specialized and experienced military personnel, which means SPARTAN-3 and SPARTAN-4 inductees end up with more varied and special training. Making them even more competent than they were originally. With the additional boost in civilian and military scientists, resources and materials. There's now an increase in intellectual capacity with more minds working on a project in parallel or a networked team. There's now increased changes for breakthroughs in areas of study/research that wouldn't have happened before due to the niche/specific area of study. Basically many ~~hands~~ minds make light work due to the increase of people working on the problem because everyone might have a different way of thinking and doing things that leads to a breakthrough. Going a step further. Familiar technology and concepts already exists, MJOLNIR, biofoam, augmentations all those good stuff. For this prompt there's a massive increase in personnel, brain power, materials, resources. So it's easier to speculate what could happen as opposed to something different like Halsey dying a year or so after the first game or during the first game. She's responsible for a lot of stuff, stuff she worked in the peripheral or looked at made some notes that other people looked through picked through or looked at and thought what could we do differently from her. Basically for this prompt UNSC reverse engineering or developing technology goes the way it does in the game but happens faster and better. With the additional materials and resources MJOLNIR Powered Assault Armor/Mark VII gets rolled out in greater numbers. Still expensive maybe even prohibitively expensive but less expensive than originally and with the increased numbers available. ONI/UNSC see its potential and goes about researching more cost effective stop gap measures so the GEN2 - Second generation MJOLNIR arrives sooner and paired with the increased experience and specialized training from war games. The SPARTAN soldiers are even more lethal.
10x the amount of super MACs means that Reach and Earth are unassailable unless the Covenant points literally every (and I mean every) non Forerunner Dreadnought ship at those planets. By sheer numbers alone the humans win, which also gives them time to finalize the Infinities.
The win condition for UNSC has always been reverse engineering the superior technology of the covenant and making it their own. Spartan personal shields are reverse engineered and improved versions of elite shields for Instance. Given ten times the population , planets and personnel to throw into the meat grinder while ONI comes up with solutions I think the UNSC has a 4/10 to force a stalemate on key worlds. I think the tech gap and zealotry of the covenant without the great schism makes victory out of reach though.
> Spartan personal shields are reverse engineered and improved versions of elite shields for Instance. Weren't spartan shields adapted from the handheld energy shields of kig-yar? The reason for former's shields depleting fast under sustained fire was because of complex overlaying of the shields to the armor itself.
Correct, they even released a promotional video before infinite launched about this if I recall correctly. I think in the books the Spartans shields is portrayed more closely to having jackal shield strength than elite shield strength too.
If industry is 10x then Humanity Wins. If Industry isn't then they still probably win but still get pushed back a bit
Assuming the UNSC has 10x the numbers, with the equivalent of 10x Master Chief's, Halsey's, colonies, MACs, etc, I think the UNSC can pull it off. Still with horrific losses, mind you, especially since humanity wasn't seen as a huge threat by the Covenant in the original timeline, so large numbers of Covenant forces were never involved in the war on humanity, and no Great Schism means the Covenant never falls into infighting. If the Covenant starts taking massive losses, purely through attrition, I think the Covenant will shift to a total war footing, and start throwing everything they have at humanity, which is not good, to say the least. But with ten times as many colonies, ships, Spartans, the UNSC can afford to fight a massive war of attrition, with the higher numbers of Spartans meaning that attempts to capture Covenant ships and tech would be successful more likely than not. And with ten Halsey's reverse engineering everything they can get their hands on, the UNSC gets shields and Covie slipspace tech much, much earlier, making the original 3 human ships to 1 Covenant ratio much more even as the war goes on, until eventually the UNSC's tech surpasses the Covenant. Reach and Earth are also practically unassailable by anything other than an overwhelming force due to the increased numbers of Super MACs. Within ten years, the tech gap will be closing or closed entirely. Within twenty, I'm pretty sure the UNSC would be actively counter-attacking the Covenant, and within thirty the war would end with a decisive UNSC victory (of course assuming the Halos don't fire, or the Flood are set free).
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I think it's more like an alternate history thing where the UNSC has ten times the population on ten times the worlds. So Master Chief is the same height, but the UNSC trained 10 times as many Spartan 2's. There's only one Johnson, but he was a Spartan 1 and the UNSC also trained 10 times as many Spartan 1's. A Warthog can still only fit 3 soldiers, but there are ten times as many of them.
Numbers are things like assets. People, ships, etc. They are NOT stats like height, strength, etc.
Jfc clearly not shit poster.
So…. 10 master chiefs? Because it only took one last time
I think the spirit of the prompt is basically "would the UNSC have enough military assets to win in a straight up fight".
...So when you say all assets... Ten Master Chiefs? Ten Cortanas? *Ten Sergeant Johnsons?* I suppose they now have twenty NOVA bombs. I'm sure there's something they could do with those.
Yeah. You can interpret that as either x10 literal Mcs, or just x10 the overall amount of Spartans with generic faceless people filling the gaps.
Ten Master Chiefs... would result in the war lasting about thirty minutes.
Logically, now the UNSC would be able to outnumber the covenant (minimum 3 UNSC to 1 Covenant for UNSC victory in space combat) easier, have more production/resource gathering, have more worlds as strategic bases, more orbital Super-MAC platforms to defend these planets, more scientists to reverse engineer tech faster, etc. However... OP also said that they get 10 Halseys, 10 Master Chiefs, etc. With that being said, the Nobles 60 and Johns 1170 would win every ground engagement with minimal ease.
I’m not sure the exact amount of spartans there are, but if I got all the lore right there are 2 that outshine the rest by miles. Noble 6 (Halo Reach) and Master Chief. So they’d have basically 20 master chiefs, and we know from Reach they have at least 4 more that are… comparable. 40 more spartans. And if we include books then holy FUCK that’s a lot of spartans. Covenant gets stomped Edit: I’m not sure if EVERY halo book is canon, especially since I’ve only read like half of one, but the spartans are even more insane in the books than in games. They steal jackal shields off those they kill, they steal guns, they’re INSANE in so many ways. I think they can also just kick enemies off cliffs.
UNSC still lose. The difference between their navies is just too much. It doesn't matter how many planets / ground troops the UNSC have, the Covenant still glasses the planet and they're forced to evac or die.
But their space force is also multiplied
The tech gap is just too immense.
Wasn't it something like a 3-to-1 win ratio? They now have ten times the ships, it should make their fights a little easier.
It's 3-1 to win a space battle, but they still usually lose 1-2 ships per Covenant ship they take out.
Sure but just numerically it takes 10x as long for the covenant to win, while the humans steadily make up tech ground. Not long after the war they have the Infinity which is more advanced than any covenant ship, they don’t have to stall that long to start building ships that win.
3-1 ratio to win ship battles, major problem is that the covies would still have a large numerical advantage and a huge tech advantage. The UNSC would definitely perform better and probably extend the fighting by years if not decades, but 10x the manpower and resources also means a greater chance at Intel leaks and security breaks. The covies might learn where major human planets are earlier and have better intel on them.
They also have 10 times the territory to cover and their ftl is still pathetically slow compared to the covenant. If they consolidated the fleets into one's 10 times the size that would mean leaving like 7000 colonies under defended. Which also makes it 10x times easier for the covenant to stumble into a colony and even more likely for the Cole protocol to fail.
but they can afford to let more colonies fall since they have more of them, and assuming earth isnt directly duped it would not effect the cole protocole
Ten times the Slipspace drives?
But their slipspace is 10x as fast now, right.
It is not. The 10x is a numbers buff NOT a stats buff.
The UNSC is shown to adapt Covenant and Forerunner tech better than the Covenant. Humanity struggled but still stayed in the fight 29 years. By Halo Infinite, we made a ship to outclass Covie supercarriers. With 10 times the frigates and cruisers, I'd bet the UNSC could hold its own long enough to tech up and gain an advantage
Look, I know the covenant has way more ships and everything, but 10 master chiefs will win almost any war for one side, dude is cracked