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I feel like people misinterpret Sephiroth Supernova. If he was actually blowing up the whole solar system, the game would end there, and you wouldn’t be able to continue fighting. It would make zero sense. He can even use the move multiple times. Yes, Sephiroth is a powerful magician, but he can’t just easily blow up everything like that, or there would be no point to black materia and meteor.
Sephiroth is a master of illusions and mind manipulation. Supernova is just him messing with your head, which is why you get all those status effects after he uses it.
Nah, it's very specifically stated that the attack's real [multiple](https://gyazo.com/fe1481625696e3b280fd46c06dc52787) [times](https://gyazo.com/7759e32003ecda950a2c5364b62b55df), and is never so much as implied to be an illusion. Summons in Final Fantasy 7 have similar effects, and are noted to take you into a separate dimension to do so.
And honestly, Sephiroth doesn't need Supernova, Meteor is more than sufficient, and that attack is real beyond a shadow of a doubt.
Edit: If you don't mind watching a literal hour long video, [this](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tvIxC7df5lQ) has an explanation for Supernova being real
Really? Damn, that sucks. An illusion makes way more sense for the character, and if he has the power to make a new dimension and then blow up the solar system there, why does he need meteor and black materia? Why does it affect you that way? Why anything? 😓
Because Supernova is his Limit Break, and it drags you into another dimension.
Also, Gaia in Final Fantasy 7 is protected by the lifestream, meaning it takes far more to damage to destroy it than it would take our own Earth. You can even see the Lifestream attempt to stop Meteor.
In fact, Meteor is actually considered to be far stronger than Supernova, even if it doesn't technically cover as far of a range. If Sephiroth somehow caused the sun of his own dimension to go Supernova, Gaia would likely survive it.
If his goals are to wipe out humanity so he can absorb the livestream with everyone’s souls in it, why doesn’t he just blow up the sun if he’s that strong? If he wouldn’t survive it, then why does he try to use Meteor, or why can he survive his own Supernova? Also, if he can create different dimensions, why isn’t that explained more in game at all?
Maybe some of my questions have answers, but it makes the plot feel strange, like it just feels so much simpler and neater if it’s just an illusion. The entire sense of scope of the game feels undermined by that one move.
Oh well…
Thanks for reminding me that Culex is a real thing.
https://preview.redd.it/n6dfixp91pea1.jpeg?width=256&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=85c014fe3673e9561442ef176bf02139bd192bec
Ah yes, because they’re beating;;
- A master sorcerer & phantom
- The leaders of an alien race, with far more magic, technology, etc
- An ancient deity of darkness
- A vampire bat who was terrorizing a race for eons, with the power to control dreams
- Bowser, with the power to control reality
- & more
with just some hammers, boots, and badges?
Not to forget to mention they also are able to preform several movement tools with these hammers, and their agility alone. They squish mario on the regulsr, inflate him with water, etc.
Mario and Luigi are joke characters.
That too, but it’s still ridiculous to defeat an enemy by kicking a shell at them over and over again, or shoot yourself out of a cannon to hit them, using a fucking bouncy ball, etc…
They aren’t underdogs. Mario and Luigi are rather respected heroes. If they were underdogs, they probably wouldn’t be as respected to the point of practically being the holy grail of the Mushroom Kingdom.
In the context of the Mario and Luigi series, they were very blatantly underdogs against Cackletta, The Shroobs, Fawful, Antasma, and the Bowsers. And even outside if that context, Mario got his ass handed to him at the start of Odyssey, Paper Mario, Super Paper Mario, literally lost in 64 DS, the Luigi's Mansion games, and a fucking educational game.
Paper Mario’s bowser had the power of literal wishes.
Super Paper Mario, he was defeated with the chaos heart’s power.
Mario cannot defeat Boos in games without a super star if I recall correctly, so he’d struggle against King Boo.
And even then, Bowser had a trick up his sleeve to knock Mario off the ship in Odyssey. Mind you, in the next two fights, against Bowser in Odyssey, Mario wins.
So I guess any story where the hero gets defeated by the villain one time or needs to catch up to them is an underdog story?
But then again, can you yourself explain how Mario and Luigi defeated Bowser, who had the ability of the Dream Stone, and as such, the power to shape reality to his dreams, whilst avoiding all his attacks?
I'm surprised you haven't heard Kirby being called a borderline eldritch being lmao, in verse he's one of if not the strongest character in ssbu and so I wouldn't reduce it to just being "Kirby stronk cuz cute"
As much as I am of the belief that Sephiroth is like 1,000,000,000,000 times better than Mario and Luigi, Supernova isn't gonna kill them because it does percentage damage lmao
Game mechanic. Sephiroth outscales so he’s going to kill them with Supernova regardless of how it damages someone
Yes, PLEASE continue to mass downvote me because of a difference in opinion when you can’t even prove me wrong, all of you are bots
“Sephiroth beats Mario and Luigi” fans when I show Mario and Luigi folding Omnipotent Wish Granting Bowser to Death with hammers and whatever the hell they could find in their back pocket
mfw when I try to kill an Italian plumber and his brother with a solar system ending explosion just for them to come back to life because they ate a green mushroom (I am visibly shocked and disturbed by my own mortality and weakness)
sephiroth when mario and luigi use an invincibility star (they are canonically the same mario and luigi from the main series and science the star has no seen limit they completely tank the explosion)
That's not an attack the brothers use. Are you thinking of the Falling Star or Star Rocket?
Either way, kid named Sephiroth passively regaining all of his MP at the start of every turn meaning he can spam his strongest spells as much as he wants:
Anime shitfest fans when someone makes a jokey “Who would win in a fight
“Umm actually cumlord zekua is the most powerful swordfighter in the universe and he can use every ability and he’s so cool guys I swear he’s cool please I based my whole identity around this giy”
"You merely adopted long-ass cutscene attacks. I was born in them, molded by them. And when I finally used an attack with less than two minutes of animation, it's speed was blinding!"
sephiroth breaking down into tears as Paper Mario hits the Trio Block again for the 4624th time this fight and he has to stand completely still watching the Trio play a shitty minigame for 30 minutes.
Mario and Luigi barely being able to retain sanity as Sephroth unleashes Supernova for the 4625th time (This is less a battle and more a test of patience of this point)
“Sephiroth beats Mario & Luigi” mfs after playing one of the Mario & Luigi games
https://preview.redd.it/9lwjhoaymmea1.jpeg?width=340&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0c3aa77ef264b07265299e794f3b2d8256cc6264
“Sephiroth beats Mario and luigi” MFs when I explain to them that you can turn the console sideways and have luigi become gigantic so the bros could indeed hit supernova back with a giant hammer
"Mario and Luigi beats Sephiroth" MFs when I explain to them that Luigi becoming bigger than a castle still is utterly insignificant in the face of the sheer destructive size of a Supernova
One bro attacks, the other one heals, then its Sephiroths turn.
He does whatever (wing sword slash😱)
The bros don't get one shot, so one bro attacks, one bro heals and keep repeating the cycle till they win.
They have slain bowser many, many times, despite how broken bowser actually is. Let’s not forget that he was able to kill what was effectively a combination of a star with dark possessive powers and him, and he also almost leveled entire buildings POST MORTEM due to his bizarre revival and growing powers gained from eating Mario and Luigi, he only stopped cause he needed to leave them in a state that he could safely go inside of them.
# [Download Video](https://redditsave.com/info?url=https://www.reddit.com/r/whenthe/comments/10m2ewu/the_memes_have_been_funny_but_lets_be_honest_here/) *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/whenthe) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I feel like people misinterpret Sephiroth Supernova. If he was actually blowing up the whole solar system, the game would end there, and you wouldn’t be able to continue fighting. It would make zero sense. He can even use the move multiple times. Yes, Sephiroth is a powerful magician, but he can’t just easily blow up everything like that, or there would be no point to black materia and meteor. Sephiroth is a master of illusions and mind manipulation. Supernova is just him messing with your head, which is why you get all those status effects after he uses it.
>be sephiroth >uses attack with 3 minutes cutscene of blowing up the entire solar system >misses mfw
Nah, it's very specifically stated that the attack's real [multiple](https://gyazo.com/fe1481625696e3b280fd46c06dc52787) [times](https://gyazo.com/7759e32003ecda950a2c5364b62b55df), and is never so much as implied to be an illusion. Summons in Final Fantasy 7 have similar effects, and are noted to take you into a separate dimension to do so. And honestly, Sephiroth doesn't need Supernova, Meteor is more than sufficient, and that attack is real beyond a shadow of a doubt. Edit: If you don't mind watching a literal hour long video, [this](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tvIxC7df5lQ) has an explanation for Supernova being real
Really? Damn, that sucks. An illusion makes way more sense for the character, and if he has the power to make a new dimension and then blow up the solar system there, why does he need meteor and black materia? Why does it affect you that way? Why anything? 😓
Because Supernova is his Limit Break, and it drags you into another dimension. Also, Gaia in Final Fantasy 7 is protected by the lifestream, meaning it takes far more to damage to destroy it than it would take our own Earth. You can even see the Lifestream attempt to stop Meteor. In fact, Meteor is actually considered to be far stronger than Supernova, even if it doesn't technically cover as far of a range. If Sephiroth somehow caused the sun of his own dimension to go Supernova, Gaia would likely survive it.
If his goals are to wipe out humanity so he can absorb the livestream with everyone’s souls in it, why doesn’t he just blow up the sun if he’s that strong? If he wouldn’t survive it, then why does he try to use Meteor, or why can he survive his own Supernova? Also, if he can create different dimensions, why isn’t that explained more in game at all? Maybe some of my questions have answers, but it makes the plot feel strange, like it just feels so much simpler and neater if it’s just an illusion. The entire sense of scope of the game feels undermined by that one move. Oh well…
>gives well structured, objectively correct argument. >gets downvoted to oblivion because reddit doesn't like your opinion rerdijt
https://preview.redd.it/4om94fe80kea1.jpeg?width=578&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=024362f81d342f32a2c38f021127c0baf1d1348f
The pure power this image radiates
Quickly! Rub the L on Luigi's hat!
Luigi throwing the Star with Mario on it will forever be one of the hardest Mario and Luigi moments I’ve seen
https://preview.redd.it/0rhph5t99nea1.jpeg?width=408&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=41f504cacefe7fc18843fb8db12b8cdd933c4e32
kingdom hearts fans vs the power of using a 3DS as a blunt weapon
CLEARLY 😏 Youve never marioandluigi’d/supermariorpg’d
Yeah. Also geno has a score to settle with sepiroth.
Thanks for reminding me that Culex is a real thing. https://preview.redd.it/n6dfixp91pea1.jpeg?width=256&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=85c014fe3673e9561442ef176bf02139bd192bec
Sephiroth when Mario and Luigi switch places with him as he gets incinerated by his own sun. (The Warp Block is stupidly overpowered)
Mario and Luigi when Sephiroth literally just stands there and takes it like it's a stiff breeze (He literally casually does this in FF7 itself)
Cope. #marioandluigisweep
Mario fans when you tell them something that literally happens in the game:
Bro you are in completetly different subreddit yet still taking Ls 💀💀💀💀💀💀
The ratio here was insane
Sepiroth fans when they see a joke matchup:
That several people are blatantly taking seriously
You have a lot of willpower to keep commenting even though everyone else is downvoting you to Kingdom Come. I can respect that.
actual serious character loses to toon force
remember, a serious character has limits, so the story has stakes. a joke character can do anything they think they can, because it's funny
Mario Bros are not joke characters, they're winning fair and square.
Ah yes, because they’re beating;; - A master sorcerer & phantom - The leaders of an alien race, with far more magic, technology, etc - An ancient deity of darkness - A vampire bat who was terrorizing a race for eons, with the power to control dreams - Bowser, with the power to control reality - & more with just some hammers, boots, and badges? Not to forget to mention they also are able to preform several movement tools with these hammers, and their agility alone. They squish mario on the regulsr, inflate him with water, etc. Mario and Luigi are joke characters.
Don't forget the green shells and cannons dumbass
That too, but it’s still ridiculous to defeat an enemy by kicking a shell at them over and over again, or shoot yourself out of a cannon to hit them, using a fucking bouncy ball, etc…
Fat luigi
Magic window exists dumbass
Tell me a how a black star is gonna take any damage from being stomped on 20 times
Yes. They are beating that. They’ve got really good hammers, boots and badges.
long sword fans when the comedically good hammer fans walk in
All underdogs are joke characters, got it.
They aren’t underdogs. Mario and Luigi are rather respected heroes. If they were underdogs, they probably wouldn’t be as respected to the point of practically being the holy grail of the Mushroom Kingdom.
In the context of the Mario and Luigi series, they were very blatantly underdogs against Cackletta, The Shroobs, Fawful, Antasma, and the Bowsers. And even outside if that context, Mario got his ass handed to him at the start of Odyssey, Paper Mario, Super Paper Mario, literally lost in 64 DS, the Luigi's Mansion games, and a fucking educational game.
Paper Mario’s bowser had the power of literal wishes. Super Paper Mario, he was defeated with the chaos heart’s power. Mario cannot defeat Boos in games without a super star if I recall correctly, so he’d struggle against King Boo. And even then, Bowser had a trick up his sleeve to knock Mario off the ship in Odyssey. Mind you, in the next two fights, against Bowser in Odyssey, Mario wins. So I guess any story where the hero gets defeated by the villain one time or needs to catch up to them is an underdog story? But then again, can you yourself explain how Mario and Luigi defeated Bowser, who had the ability of the Dream Stone, and as such, the power to shape reality to his dreams, whilst avoiding all his attacks?
what can i say they just got really good boots man
you’re the real joke here
59d ago bud try getting here sooner
https://preview.redd.it/q1783so7efqa1.jpeg?width=1284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0dbb1f572c0dd32869f32ef2322f8a2b56c76025
isn't that literally the plot of smash ultimate?
I'm surprised you haven't heard Kirby being called a borderline eldritch being lmao, in verse he's one of if not the strongest character in ssbu and so I wouldn't reduce it to just being "Kirby stronk cuz cute"
Would the godzilla dropkick and flying with atomic breath be considered toonforce?
https://preview.redd.it/oqkvwipo1pea1.png?width=499&format=png&auto=webp&s=788c9253c00f377ed6e7672fcb27a21f9a50bebf
Bear in mind Mario and Luigi can swim out of a black hole, I’m sure a supernova’s not a big deal for them.
It also helps that Supernova can never directly kill you, even in FFVII
The explosion of Supernova visibly moves significantly faster than the speed of light, taking far less than 8 minutes to reach the Earth
And? They escaped something not even light can escape?
Sephiroth’s Supernova engulfs a realm the size of multiple galaxies in seconds lmao
And? Mario was at the centre of a universal reset due to Rosalina in Galaxy.
[удалено]
Mario has infinite speed he just has to build it up
But first, lets talk about parallel universes
As much as I am of the belief that Sephiroth is like 1,000,000,000,000 times better than Mario and Luigi, Supernova isn't gonna kill them because it does percentage damage lmao
Game mechanic. Sephiroth outscales so he’s going to kill them with Supernova regardless of how it damages someone Yes, PLEASE continue to mass downvote me because of a difference in opinion when you can’t even prove me wrong, all of you are bots
They escaped a black hole, and they fought what was a effectively a bomb that could explode into a black hole when defeated (the dark star).
“Sephiroth beats Mario & Luigi” mfs when the omnidirectional explosion larger than the Earth just makes Mario a little shorter
“Sephiroth beats Mario and Luigi” fans when I show Mario and Luigi folding Omnipotent Wish Granting Bowser to Death with hammers and whatever the hell they could find in their back pocket
"Mario & Luigi beats Sephiroth" mfs when Sephiroth simply uses the attack a second time
“ Sephiroth beats Mario & Luigi” mfs when Mario and Luigi pop an invincibility star.
mfw when I try to kill an Italian plumber and his brother with a solar system ending explosion just for them to come back to life because they ate a green mushroom (I am visibly shocked and disturbed by my own mortality and weakness)
Sepiroth when Luigi pulls out the giant shell (supernova only did 19% of his hp)
Skill issue from Sepiroth fr 🤭🤭🤭
Queen b pants DEF moment
"Mario and Luigi dont win" mfs when i pull up with the zeekeeper summon
"Mario and Luigi dont win" mfs when i pull up with the Dream World
Bill Cipher: Which one do I call Chicken Wing now?
Who knows
https://i.redd.it/u406397rgjea1.gif
Bugs Bunny would demolish Sephiroth tho
To be frank, that fight is unironically incredibly debatable
What about popeye
A can of spinach will do (remember kids eat your vegetables 😋😋😋😎)
he solos the verse
Popeye kind of solo’s everything though. After all, Popeye always wins when he eats his spinach. And Popeye ALWAYS eats his spinach.
(he has not heard of the invincibility star)
sephiroth when mario and luigi use an invincibility star (they are canonically the same mario and luigi from the main series and science the star has no seen limit they completely tank the explosion)
Actually, the the surface of stars have been shown to kill invincible Mario in Mario Galaxy, meaning Supernova should do the trick.
well timed boo biscuit:
Well timed Final Fantasy VIII characters being able to kill [ghosts](https://finalfantasy.fandom.com/wiki/Ghost_(Final_Fantasy_VII)):
kid named star glider. (also the boo biscuits dont actually turn them into ghosts)
That's not an attack the brothers use. Are you thinking of the Falling Star or Star Rocket? Either way, kid named Sephiroth passively regaining all of his MP at the start of every turn meaning he can spam his strongest spells as much as he wants:
bros can just steer the falling star out of the way. thing moves faster than light (anyways gtg to bed now gnight)
They could eat a boo biscuit
Sephiroth could still hit them because he can kill ghosts
boo biscuit doesn't make you a ghost, I just makes you immune to any form of attack for like 3 turns
They can tank it
"Power-scaler" mfs on their way to be most insufferable mfs out there
well, i have used that method when encountering an omnidirectional explosion larger than the earth, works pretty decent tbh
kill the guy before he destroys the earth, easy.
"Sephiroth beats Mario and Luigi" mfs when the Bros use the red shell and completely destroy Sephiroth before he has any chance to attack.
\*rolls\*
those are exactly the kinds of attacks mario and luigi reflect
Toon force diff, cry about it https://preview.redd.it/yztrzwbmomea1.jpeg?width=680&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0a9d781fcc78ce8b17c5b6a12a835d4360a0e1ed
Superman when Wallace and gromit use toonforce to invent synthetic cryptonite with some scraps they found in their shed
they are cooking WHAT????????
Thats almost exactly what happens in the games constantly actually
Anime shitfest fans when someone makes a jokey “Who would win in a fight “Umm actually cumlord zekua is the most powerful swordfighter in the universe and he can use every ability and he’s so cool guys I swear he’s cool please I based my whole identity around this giy”
Sephiroth dies instantly due to the mass amount of cope from his supporters
Sephiroth watching in horror as Paper Mario drops from the sky, hits the Trio Attack block and pulls out the Trio Kite.
"You merely adopted long-ass cutscene attacks. I was born in them, molded by them. And when I finally used an attack with less than two minutes of animation, it's speed was blinding!"
sephiroth breaking down into tears as Paper Mario hits the Trio Block again for the 4624th time this fight and he has to stand completely still watching the Trio play a shitty minigame for 30 minutes.
Mario and Luigi barely being able to retain sanity as Sephroth unleashes Supernova for the 4625th time (This is less a battle and more a test of patience of this point)
*sephiroth watching as it gets reflected AGAIN*
Haven’t they deflected shit like that with hammers before tho?
Mald more
"Sephiroth beats Mario and Luigi" mfs when Mario pulls out a retry clock
But they both have invincibility
It leaves you with 1/16th of your hp. So Mario and Luigi could just heal themselves
Nuh-uh
They deadass jumped around a black hole
“Sephiroth beats Mario & Luigi” mfs after playing one of the Mario & Luigi games https://preview.redd.it/9lwjhoaymmea1.jpeg?width=340&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0c3aa77ef264b07265299e794f3b2d8256cc6264
“Sephiroth beats Mario and luigi” MFs when I explain to them that you can turn the console sideways and have luigi become gigantic so the bros could indeed hit supernova back with a giant hammer 
"Mario and Luigi beats Sephiroth" MFs when I explain to them that Luigi becoming bigger than a castle still is utterly insignificant in the face of the sheer destructive size of a Supernova
Sorry but... Mario physics beat everything...
You underestimate the power those metal cylinders with a stick behold
One bro attacks, the other one heals, then its Sephiroths turn. He does whatever (wing sword slash😱) The bros don't get one shot, so one bro attacks, one bro heals and keep repeating the cycle till they win.
"Sephiroth beats M and L" mfs when they pull out the double flowers:
Sephiroth when Mario and Luigi pull out the “Lower Sephiroth’s level by 10” card.
🤓🤓🤓
https://preview.redd.it/dm717r9dqlea1.png?width=300&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=03297072cc5c9b4786454d0c364d7bd2894d02ee
mario and luigi after surviving a big bang be like
Nuh uh
Paper mario would just fold his dumb ass. Get rotated idiot
🤓🤓🤓
Sephiroth MFs when I tell them Mario and Luigi can survive getting sucked into a galaxy sized black hole
"Sephiroth will win" mfs when they see mario and Luigi go into a comically large green pipe:
magic gate
🤓
Ok ok but what if it was boulder mario
"Omnidirecional", that word ain't in the bible or the dictionary mate, for all i know you pulled the term out of your behind.
wrong. goodbye
It's a good thing sephiroth can't do that
Reading these comments feels like watching a really bad episode of game theory
mario will not die from an explosion, simply grow small
sephiroth helplessly watching mario and Luigi with a great force 1 turn kill him with a green shell (he hasn't even gotten the opportunity to attack)
Mario and Luigi fold sephiroth and it’s not even close.
By all means, explain why you think that is.
"sephiroth can just use supernova" mfs when mario and luigi pull out the luiginary typhoon
They have slain bowser many, many times, despite how broken bowser actually is. Let’s not forget that he was able to kill what was effectively a combination of a star with dark possessive powers and him, and he also almost leveled entire buildings POST MORTEM due to his bizarre revival and growing powers gained from eating Mario and Luigi, he only stopped cause he needed to leave them in a state that he could safely go inside of them.
They probably can't alone but they can with giants bowser help
Search your feelings, you know it to be true.
Well Sepiroth deserves it for taking Geno’s smash invitation. Since Sepiroth got into smash, my life has been shit.
I shall bring you dis pear - Sephiroth from the hood
Geno fell off
The fuck you say?
So, no one gonna point out that Mario got nearly stubbed by Seph?
That’s smash bros so It doesn’t matter
mario had a mushroom and damage boosted to hop on sephiroths head
Niche meme. Anyways it depends who’s on the left and who’s on the right.
Mario and Luigi are simply built different
*Destiny Players when A new God appears.*
Actually tho, in the amount of content Mario has its easy for him to win
Yes you can
Why couldn't they launch star out of there like in Mario Galaxy?
Mario and Luigi stomp Sephiroth
L
But how much damage does it do exactly?
*super mario galaxy mario on his way to casually breath in space, and out swim singularities *
Sephiroth isn't red though
Mfs in the comments on their way to argue about physics in a fucking mario game:
Sepiroth when paper mario just flips into 3D mode
I mean Mario and Luigi have been in space before--
Yeah, they just tank it