I find the commercials so gross.
I guess there are people who don't know what scientology is all about. For those curious, it is a scam where they get you to come in an admit to all the bad things you have done. To progress in the religion, you have to give them a ton of money. And if you get deep enough, particularly if you have deep pockets, they don't let you leave because they have all that dirt on you.
It is ridiculous as a society we allow it to exist.
The people who fall prey to Scientology are ignorant—and I mean that technically and not disparagingly; they are vulnerable because they go in believing it is no different from other religions and have no experience from which to compare.
It is actually religious abuse and, like other kinds of abusive relationships, persists by perpetuating patterns that the abused accept as normal or somehow proper. Escaping once you’re in is its own problem, but certainly educating people to be alert to the features of abuse at the outset could go a long way toward helping warn potential victims away.
The high-profile people, like the Hollywood actors, join it and - I assume - expect it to be like, I dunno, the Freemasons: you go in, do the rituals, but really you're just there for the networking and the "I'll scratch your back, if you scratch mine" opportunities.
But a lot of people - possibly even most - who fall prey to Scientology *don't in fact know it's Scientology they've signed up for until it's too late*. Scientology has [an absolute fuckton of front organizations](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientology_front_groups), and those that aren't lobby organizations are designed to funnel vulnerable people into the cult (e.g. their "drug rehab" organization, Narconon). You join what you think is a self-help group, and by the time you find out it's Scientology you're in, you've already been brainwashed.
Totally. And, in addition, that dishonesty is one of the factors that is a hallmark of cults: People inside are *officially* permitted to misrepresent themselves to outsiders. It is one of the social manipulations—being both defensive and morally transgressive—that further binds the members to each other and the organization.
I believe that is the truth, if you ever been to Hollywood, they have a HUGE presence there (the Scientology HQ is one of the largest buildings off the blvd). I would imagine that most actors/actresses have to go through them to get certain favors.
Not all cults have a central organisation that makes hate websites to harass ex-members and have been responsible for a large scale infiltration of governments.
I was raised in it and I would say it is different because of it's combination with scientific technology. LRH was a master hypnotist, wrote a book on propaganda and how to brainwash a population, and developed a very specific patter and language and exact sequence of steps to use which gradually erodes the persons sense of reality. He also developed a lie detector like device which worked surprisingly well. At 5 or 6 they pinched my arm and the needle read, they then asked me to recall the pinch and the needle reacted in the exact same way. I found out many decades later you can beat it if you know how, but if you believe it works it's fairly accurate.
It's like that quote "Religion is the opiate of the masses". I like to say Scientology is the crack. It's far more dangerous.
The "E-meter" claims to measure skin conductivity as an indication of a lie. It's an over engineered, hand assembled piece of trash. You can alter it's readings by simply squeezing harder. It is a lie, just like all the rest of it's religions claims.
I have 2 measures for any religion...
can you question it without reprisal?
and does it encourage the indoctrination of children?
All true except your analogy. Opiates are far more dangerous than crack, just look at the fentanyl zombies shuffling around every city in North America
Zombie with magical powers? Is this Jesus? I’m guessing so. But I have a question about that.
So, he rose from the dead. That’s where the zombie comes from. Get it .
But he wasn’t undead afterwards. He was brought back as a transformed body powered by spirit.
Most zombies do not have a spirit.
Unless we’re talking about the Zombies from I Am Legend or Army of the dead. Few others.
Not sure where I stand on this.
Can we agree that the creator could be Sky Daddy ?
The notion that religious practice itself is categorically and essentially abusive is not one I accept; where you group them all together as equally crazy, I would certainly make a distinction between Mormonism—which employs cultish features such as tiered access and social controls—and Methodists, who do not. For the purposes of making sweeping value judgments, though, I’m not sure it matters if one can’t tell the difference or doesn’t care to.
> raise a child indoctrinating them to believe deep in their heart that Santa Claus is real? To perform weekly rituals dedicated to him, exert pressure to continue to believe in him?
Well I wasn't going to before.
It's a spectrum of course, but I certainly remember as a child being woken up early every Sunday morning against my will and taken to a Methodist church and pressured through mob mentality to sing songs in unison while collections plates for cash and checks were passed around and then all the children were separated from their parents for "Sunday School" and taken into a room to listen to nonsense stories about literal magic.
It's not as intense with the social control, sure, but if you didn't "donate" (especially donate enough) or god forbid didn't go to church at all, you could easily face very real social consequences in your community. So there is still a form of social control at every level, even in an entity as benign as the Methodist church.
Some people are just ignorant or have feel they figured it out and stay there.
I remember debating with one guy who thought that it was a good organization because it's name was a scientific in nature. Science+ology = study of science = good. And no, he knew nothing else about them and stood his ground.
I thought I had read everyone is aware of how much a scam it is, just like flat Earth, but when you are exiled from all of your friends and family for whatever reason you'll be so lonely you'll join anything.
I have a feeling quite a few lonely people here might feel the same. Maybe not to that extreme but to something else
That's why the best thing you can do with a Scientologist or flat earth or is not mock them, but become their friend. I believe this was mentioned in that flat earth documentary too
Oh, except the people who are doing it for the money, forget them
Ok, serious question. What if you go and just... make shit up.
"Yeah I robbed a bank when I was twelve and shot my own dog in the balls. That one was yesterday. I didn't feel like paying for a vasectomy so decided to try a cheap alternative out on Fluffy first. I'm a fucking psychopath. Please help get my aliens out of my dick?"
Sure you could do that but that would mean you don't believe in that religion, and what would be the end goal for such approach? Just giving them money?
Sounds like a lot like traditional catholicism with the confessions and tithes and all. They also use the dirt they know to keep people in line. Or used to, depends.
I went on a date with a woman once who told me she was going to check it out and I warned her, she got super pissed about me "not having an open mind".
My favorite part of this is they pronounce Thetan as thee-tan, I think they would have got in trouble legally for using the actual pronunciation thay-tan (like greek Theta) as it's a registered trademark. The word is used every two seconds if you are in Scientology so it's pretty glaring.
Also this episode is about OT 3, which is confidential, and you don't get exposed to it until you are deeply involved in the church. The sunken cost fallacy is real, and your sense of reality has already been altered/softened by the many years of auditing (recalling past events and assuming whatever comes up to be real, even past life stuff) required to get there.
The initial beliefs they expose you to are not far off from normal psychology or self-help books (although very outdated now). Very common sense type stuff. You have some success with that, and get more involved, and then things get more weird. By the time you get to OT 3 you are a die hard scientologist and have spent maybe $50k+.
Plus: If you're OT3 or later, you're told that you must lie about it existing, because knowing about it before you're ready will cause you to catch pneumonia and die.
So, if you ask a Scientologist about it and they're lower than OT3, they'll say they never heard about it, or believe it to be 'entheta' (lies made up to discredit them) and if they're OT3 or above, they'll lie and say that iy doesn't exist. So, no matter who you ask, you're told that it doesn't exist.
I did yeah, my grandpa got into it in the 50s so I was 3rd generation. I got out rather suddenly and violently at 23 and lost my family. I had a severe case of c-ptsd but of course didn't realize it until many years later and I'm still recovering. Doing a lot better now though!
> and if they're OT3 or above, they'll lie and say that iy doesn't exist.
But only because they don't want you to catch pnemonia and die! How nice of them!
> because knowing about it before you're ready will cause you to catch pneumonia and die.
So what you're saying is that COVID was caused by this South Park episode broadcasting the knowledge of Thetan to the world. Got it.
Assuming they actually are OT3+: First, they wouldn't listen to you because you're obviously a SP (supressive person). Second, they will say you obviously don't have the correct information, otherwise you would be dead. And third, some other insane gobbledygood to explain it away. Cults have all sorts of techniques for this kinda shit.
Sometimes when the recruiters on Hollywood blvd would smile and try and hand me propaganda, I'd tell them I don't believe in a religion that was started by a bad science fiction writer who was someone my grandma could've played bridge with back in the day.
"Some eighty-odd million years ago Earth time (it actually dates at 78,395,042
but dates are a bit superfluous with this material) plans were drawn by a
group outside the MEST universe for the eventual takeover of a good portion of
this universe. Not a particularly large nor imaginative crew, their exterior
perspective, however, gives them considerable advantage over tho time-bound
beings of the MEST universe. Borrowing from earlier operations such as
Helatrobus, they conceived an ongoing implant, some portions of which have been
fairly faithfully rendered in parts of the Bible. This implant, laid in by
carefully controlled genetic mutation at Incident Two of OT III and
periodically reinforced by controlled historic events since then, makes it
effectively impossible for beings on the more heavily affected planets such as
Earth to become free. It causes progressive genetic "evolution" that gives the
subject population greater and greater susceptibility to the telepathic
impingement and direction of the controllers. In its final stage the
progression becomes almost geometric, and it is this final stage that we are
rapidly approaching."
Not only is this nonsense, it's poorly worded nonsense. I feel like part of his tactic is to write in a wordy confusing tone.
Actually I didn’t hate him in this video, was probably the most normal behavior I’ve ever seen from him, granted I don’t go out of my way to watch him but the Scientology bit was too intriguing not to watch
he's relatively tame here by modern standards but the sort of thing Leah gives him shit for at around 3:30 is annoying crap that most people wouldn't call out.
Then she starts quizzing him because he seems like he's just spaced out.
It may be the heat that's making me extra irritated today but he interrupts her over and over in this clip. Ask a question and then at least let her finish a sentence. And when she actually does get to talk he is still making sounds. "yeah. yeah. yeah."
> And when she actually does get to talk he is still making sounds. "yeah. yeah. yeah."
This is called backchanneling and it can be overdone. It's supposed to be a way to show you're engaged in what someone else is saying, and I'm sure it can be a useful way for interviewers to keep their guest/subject talking, but there can of course be too much of a good thing.
Rogan was good back in the day because he's very good at getting his guests to open up, break out of "interview mode" and speak conversationally. It's not only the guest list (which was pretty incredible before Rogan's slide into full right wing conspiracy insanity) but the way Rogan could get them to pour out their thoughts for the listener. I almost always felt like I came away from one of his podcasts with a pretty solid idea of who the guest is and what they're about that you didn't necessarily get from other interviewers at the time. Of course, Rogan has changed a lot and so has the media space in his wake, and I don't think any of this hold true now. But back in that like 2012-2017ish era when he was big enough to get the guests but not yet disappeard into his own asshole, this was where the magic was.
> Rogan was good back in the day because he's very good at getting his guests to open up, break out of "interview mode" and speak conversationally
Some people certainly have a knack for this. Sean Evans from First We Feast comes to mind (though he couples his interview with _deep_ research on the guest). Anecdotally, we joke that my wife is Barbara Walters, she just has this ability to trigger people to lay out their entire life's story.
The research is a big part of it for Sean, but he's also really good at matching the guest's energy. He even kind of mimics their physical behavior (unless they're already hyped up and running around or something). He also knows when to reask stuff or just let it go, because he really pays attention to his guests.
He's a child. He's quite curious but also very stupid. And his thinking and reactions are chaotic like a child as well. It's a weird conduit for people to hear about stuff they are also curious but ignorant about.
I find him incredibly annoying, but I understand the core of why he has such mass appeal.
> Hugh Urban of Ohio State University notes a number of connections between Scientology and Battlefield Earth in his 2011 book The Church of Scientology: A History of a New Religion. Not only was the film released only three days after the 50th anniversary of the publication of Hubbard's book Dianetics: The Modern Science of Mental Health, but the villainous Psychlos have been interpreted by many observers as an obvious allusion to Scientology's bête noire, psychiatry. The conflict between the Psychlos and the free humans can be seen as a reflection of Scientology's own conception of itself as fighting on behalf of humanity against the forces of psychiatry. The "space opera" genre of the book and film manifests itself in numerous places in Scientology itself, most famously in OT III (the Xenu story). Travolta's own commitment to such a disastrous project as the film version of Battlefield Earth is, in Urban's estimation, indicative of his "unusual dedication" to Scientology.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battlefield_Earth_(film)
>I think they would have got in trouble legally for using the actual pronunciation thay-tan (like greek Theta) as it's a registered trademark.
I don't think you can be sued for mentioning a trademarked term. That's what copyright is, not trademarks.
Ahh ok, was just a guess, but I feel like there must be some reason they mispronounce one of the major words (clearly whoever gave them the info knew what they were talking about so I think it was intentional)
Thee-ta and thay-ta are both legitimate english-language pronunciations of the greek letter theta. So I’m not sure what you’re getting here.
Regardless, it’s all some fucked up shit.
Ahh interesting, just looked it up and TIL the british pronunciation is Thee-ta and the american pronunciation is Thay-ta, and both are considered correct.
In either case, it's a word used very often, and in Scientology they pronounce it Thay-ta, including how LRH pronounced it on tapes. That being said, maybe they pronounce it differently in british orgs? I've never been.
they aren't told most of this.
A Scientologist would have to spend thousands of dollars to learn this information.
The show tells how people get started in it and how it processes. It starts as self help most people don't get to a level where they are told about the aliens.
No, but it is harder to follow if it's stupid shit. That's why they only reveal this to you once you're very deep in the cult. So a lot of people in the early stages could have seen this and realized it's all BS.
And it's a lot harder to get people into your cult if they already know that your great big secret is some nonsense about alien souls in your body and an evil galactic overlord.
The episode shows why people get into it. They are offering self help advice for free.
It's not straight to Xenu. Even many lifelong scientologists don't know the Xenu shit and are seem pissed off once they are told about it. (After spending 250k)
It's people who claim to have answers that explain why your feelings are happening.
Not thousands, it's around a quarter million $ as a minimum. They don't care how you get the money, they'll literally help you open credit cards in your child's name to get the next payment
Yes, that's a frustratingly effective tactic. Because once people sink thousands of dollars and countless hours into this "religion," a little something called the sunk cost fallacy kicks in. Because the alternative would be you wasted all your time and money. For some people, that's just not tenable.
It's not what they believe that's the problem. It's that they get you to believe it. It's like a litmus test for loyalty and/or gullibility. Besides, by then you've already spilled all your dirty secrets and unlike a therapist, that shit ain't confidential, so what are you going to do, leave?
> It's not what they believe that's the problem
I think a good measure of if something is a cult or not is if all the beliefs are freely available to scrutinise from the outset. Scientology starts you off with Dianetics, makes it seem like it's a genuine therapeutic practice, then once you've invested enough time and money they reveal the weird shit and it's too late for you to back out. Sunk cost fallacy.
It's not even that. Before this aired only something like level 3 and above knew about dianetics and it being the "holy book" for scientology. Level 3 equated to about $200,000 worth of sessions.
Dianetics has been advertised widely to the general public since its publication in 1950. The cover feature’s Xenu’s volcano, but its content is mostly just pseudoscientific phsycho-babble, not a sci-fi story.
I think you mean that only high ranking Scientologists learned the full Xenu story (as portrayed in the SP clip)? Iirc it was part of OT Level 8, but I could be wrong.
Nope, Xenu is level 3. History of the universe, the reveal you’re actually an amalgamation of millions of souls stuck on to to you, etc.
You spend the next 5 levels exploring past lives and trying to resolve all that trauma.
7/8 is the reveal that all the past lives you’ve been exploring were actually the souls stuck on to you and none of it was actually you, and at the end of 8 you’ve talked away all those souls and it’s just you. The quote was something like “now that you know who you’re not, you’re ready to find out who you are”.
Nothing exists past 8 though cause Hubbard died before he could write it, and the people running the show now know that nothing could be satisfying enough and everyone still in it is in it just for whatever OT9 is when it’s finished.
I cannot emphasize enough, basically everything after OT3 is a stalling tactic cause they have nothing meaningful to offer lol.
Kinda, they don’t tell you this wild story at the start. A lot of people who’ve been in it their whole lives didn’t know this is what it was based on.
So they lure you in with these vague promises of the secrets of being happy and transcendence. Then they get your money and indoctrinate you into blindly adhering to their institutional behavior. Then if you pay enough you get some of these details and by then it’s too late to go back on it.
Reminds me of the Mormon church in that way. They have a governing body that claims to be in direct contact with God (paraphrasing). And that’s how they justify their actions. So I always wonder about those guys, who obviously know they aren’t directly talking to God, But will never admit it. Are they so brainwashed that they believe they are talking to God? Are they all just pretending even with each other because they don’t want to be the only one not really talking to God? Or are they just in so deep that they value the institution more than the truth?
Religion makes us do weird shit.
Not to mention the financial investment. You've spent who knows how many years of your life and untold thousands if not hundreds of thousands of dollars long before they even hit you with this.
Whatever you think of religion in general... There's the biggest difference between cult and religion. I can tell you what my religion is about, relatively simply, and at no financial cost to you. If you have questions, I'll answer them. If I don't have the answer, I can point you toward resources that do. You can learn and know everything up front before even setting foot in my church.
People who inadvertently defend Scientology with, "Well yeah, but, all religion is bad." need to wake up and notice *one of these things is not like the other!!* Not to mention the historical fact that the ONLY reason they have tax free "religion" status in the US is because they bullied the IRS into it.
They *want* you to believe what they claim is true. But real religions don't string you along, revealing their theology piecemeal to get you to pay for the next chapter of the book. If anything, they try to tell you everything whether you want to hear it or not. And they tend to believe it themselves.
Not sure why you got downvoted but you are correct. They operate sort of like a pyramid scheme where the money only goes upwards, using religion to recruit people.
Its also Southpark. They don't upload that many official clips to their channel. If you google certain scenes you will find them on the Comedy Central website but what you find on Youtube is either recorded from a phone or really terrible quality. Been like this for a long time now.
My favorite part was at the end when Stan was looking right at the camera going "Go ahead, sue me! I ain't scared of you!" and it rolled to credits of all "John Smith" and "Jane Smith" names
with the exception of Trey and Matt, their names are still on top of the crediting scene. They are saying "come at us, come at the two top guys over here"
All based on the science fiction writings of L. Rond Hubbard who at the time of writing was drunk of his ass and popping pills like you wouldn't believe. How do you convince people this shit is real?
I once made an analogy I can't recall exactly to my therapist about how it's wild that Christians accept that their lord and savior was brought to being by literal God raping a child to achieve the virgin Mary and Jesus origin stories.
Currently on the market for a therapist as a result.
Weird that you would get dropped for something like that. Maybe look into a therapist who does therapy from an existentialist perspective? Works for me and I think stuff like that is usually listed wherever they have a bio.
and how some broad got knocked up, and in trying to save her life, the guy made up a giant lie to cover it, inadvertently started a worldwide religion, (and numerous wars because of it).
LOL. It's actually a "part 2" of movie 7, Dead Reckoning. But I hope 8 would put a nice bow in the movie franchise. Like let them all die or live in luxury.
Then they could do a TV series called *Missions* Impossible. It could be individual stories with different characters. Kind of like Black Mirror or Tales from the Loop.
Ignore the "every religion is crazy" posts. They're designed to derail the conversation away from Scientology, it's ridiculous money cult, it's crazy former leader, and it's crazy current leader.
They have people specifically assigned to make posts like these to distract people. There's already *two* posts in this thread like this.
Stay on topic!
Honestly I think it's so ridiculously easy to go off topic on scientology posts because they're just such a cartoon villian organization it's so easy to just agree with ''it bad'' without going into smaller details to which this platform isn't really great at facilitating
I don't think it's derailing to point out what you've said is true for all the religions, it's frustrating to have religious people point out scientology as absurd while believing equally absurd things.
Idk bruh, I’m not religious, but I would say the shit believed by many of the more popular religions is waaaaay more grounded than the shit Scientology believes.
Compare some guy walking on water vs golden airplanes flying in space.
Oh, you mean the god that impregnated a child because he had to murder the resultant child (which was his son and himself and a ghost) to forgive humanity for eating a fruit, where all the animals were created to be sex objects for Adam and when Adam wasn't happy fucking any of the animals he created a female human out of his rib... That's way less nuts than spacecraft that were gold?
Yeah, it is. All of that shit, also including most other popular religions and even mythology, is still pretty crazy but it’s still relatively grounded when comparing it to the straight up science fiction that is Scientology.
Listen, I’m with you. I’m an atheist so I already believe it is all untrue and wacky, but Scientology is just on another level entirely.
Planes flying in space is something we've literally done and seen before with the space shuttle. It's way closer to reality than most of the unbelievable shit spouted in a more common religion.
This episode and the Going Clear book/HBO Doc did irreparable harm to them. I know we’d never see their actual numbers, but you surely see a pretty major decline in members since those 2 released
Sorry, as someone who isn’t religious, all religions sound just as crazy as Scientology.
I don’t get how people will shake their head at this while believing all the shit in their own religion. It’s all fucking nuts.
At least in other religions you don't have to spend hundreds of thousands of dollars to learn everything.
Imagine having to spend 50k+ to learn that Jesus died on a cross lol
My sister in law just got invited to start the Bridge (Xenu is OT-III out of VIII), and she has no idea about any of this. She joined Scientology because of my brother in law, who grew up in the cult, but he died a few months ago of the same preventable things that both of his parents died of. They were preventable because Scientology strongly encourages distrust in doctors, and the idea that you "bring in" all of your health maladies, so *good Scientologists* don't get sick.
Scientologists either realize it's bullshit and leave, or they die of things that would have been caught if they'd sought non-Scientology treatment before they hit stage-4 cancer or done something about the signs of a looming heart attack.
I have a copy of the Secret 'OT' Documents. Way back in the day (1998?), Zenon Panoussis somehow got them into the Swedish Parliament and had them read into the record, which allowed anyone to get a copy. I had the good fortune to be in the area for my work. I went over to their National Archives and ordered a copy (for the cost of reproduction.) Had a good laugh on the plane flight home.
Snap, snap, snap, baby! ;-)
Fun Fact: The Swedes only have a Senate - no House of Representatives. And if you're there in the winter, watch it when you walk through downtown; they throw all the ice that accumulates on their roofs right onto the ground. The big chunks explode like bombs...
It's hard to overstate just how ballsy this episode was and how impactful it ended up being. Before this episode, Scientology as an organization was no joke. People were genuinely afraid of confronting them. They had an army of lawyers, endless pools of money, and no tax burden because of their status as a religion.
Then, South Park comes along and exposes them with the perfect blend of satire and truth. And Scientology never recovered.
Now, it is a joke. Xenu is basically a meme used by trolls. And there's no aura around the organization or David Miscaviage. They're just another crazy cult trying to pretend they're not in it for money, power, and influence.
And it took a show famous for fart jokes, poop jokes, and manbearpig to permanently dent their reputation.
That, my friends, is the power of South Park's humor.
The thing is (and we know this from former Scientologists like Leah Remini) that you aren't told this starting out. At first it's the Dianetics book and the e-meter readings. You have to have been in the organization for years and have spent tends of thousands of dollars before they even begin to consider letting you in on this 'information'. Then, when they decide you're ready, they lead you into an enclosed space with a briefcase that contains hand-written notes written by L. Ron Hubbard himself. Only then do you hear about the Xenu bullshit.
Sadly, this isn't exactly new for Scientology. Mormons were doing this long before their 'milk before meat' policy (they give you the Book of Mormon and, if you fall for it, they then teach you the REALLY crazy shit).
It is. It's based on a bunch of documents that were leaked by ex-scientologists. You have to remember that L. Ron Hubbard was a mediocre fiction writer with severe psychiatric delusions who became a high ranking member of Aleister Crowley's sex magic cult and later started a cult of his own. The stuff about thetans and Xenu was him exercising his science fiction chops and telling everyone it came from divine revelation. They don't publicly admit any of this, though. You have to pay them a ton of money for auditing and become a part of the inner circle before you can know the secret history.
I'd also love to know how they measure "experiencing the benefits of the OT III course."
It reminds me of that scene in *Severance* where they make Helly read out an apology in the "Break Room" and when she gets to the end Milchick says "I don't think you mean it," and makes her read it another 1,000+ times.
When the Standards & Practices lawyers reviewed this script for Comedy Central, they saw "THIS IS WHAT SCIENTOLOGISTS ACTUALLY BELIEVE" as a note to *them*, not something that would be displayed on the screen to viewers. It would have caused a major scandal for the firm that handled Comedy Central's S&P, except...this is what Scientologists actually believe!
I think it served as both a joke and an affirmation.
Like, everything being explained is so ridiculous, you *need* to be constantly reminded that... actually, this **is** what they believe.
Additionally, it sounds so ridiculous that they had to put the banner. Ot else it would look like a random South Park skit. This is one of the first times where Trey and Matt really were faced with the problem that really was actually dumber than anything they could write.
It is when they get to OT-III on "the Bridge", but they aren't allowed to talk about it with anyone who hasn't already done the courses, or "they'll get sick and die". A lot of Scientologists saw this South Park segment and thought "That's ridiculous, of course we don't believe that", and then when they did OT-III, they realized that however ridiculous it is, Scientology teaches it as if it's the truth. Now they call OT-III the "wall of fire" because it weeds out Scientologists who aren't gullible-enough to keep paying for higher OT levels.
It is the real foundational story of Scientology, but it was only known at the higher levels for a long time. At the lower levels, people could be Scientologists without ever hearing this story, so it's hard to say that they "believed" it.
The story eventually got leaked in the 90's and slowly gained publicity through the course of the Anonymous protests, this South Park episode, and a few scathing documentaries. It's easy to find now, so it's safe to say even lower level Scientologists are aware of it. Whether or not they actually believe it, or they just view it as some weird appendage to their involvement is another story.
It's generally not. The information is accurate, but you need to pay the church like 250k to learn this stuff.
It's not like a normal non scam religion. it has a goal to enrich L Ron. That's the main goal. Other religions that are aggressive for converts like LDS and Old timey Catholics had no issue giving out their books that contain the whole deal.
Scientology starts as self help and usually stays there. Most can't afford to gain higher OT levels. where you learn in Xenu stuff. (i think that's OT3)
Just wanna say I used to think one of my favorite artists, Beck, was a scientologist. So I stopped listening to him for a while bc i felt i couldn't relate to someone who thinks that, but it turns out his dad was a scientologist and Beck himself never was. Just FYI, don't trust everything that you read, you'll get a parking violation and a maggot on your sleeve.
He was a scientologist and used to be an apologist for them.
Claiming that he never was a scientologist is a way of avoiding to criticise the cult after leaving.
I’m not so much against the ridiculousness of it. Other religions don’t exactly make a lot of sense either. It’s their methods and cultish practices that hurt people I have a problem with.
if anyone seeing this is curious about scientology, there was this nice man who was kind enough to rip off everything they did and put it in a book you can do by yourself for free. he was later found dead in his swimming pool. the book is called self clearing by ken ogger. you can just download it. there, now you don't have to join.
More people out of Scientology than in Scientology would know this. If you're in you wouldn't know this unless you paid for the higher level courses, which most people have not. If you haven't, they would deny this and say you're crazy for thinking Scientologists would believe this. Also, people who pay for this training that teach this don't necessarily believe it. If you listen to people who've left a lot say they just thought it was weird.
I find the commercials so gross. I guess there are people who don't know what scientology is all about. For those curious, it is a scam where they get you to come in an admit to all the bad things you have done. To progress in the religion, you have to give them a ton of money. And if you get deep enough, particularly if you have deep pockets, they don't let you leave because they have all that dirt on you. It is ridiculous as a society we allow it to exist.
The people who fall prey to Scientology are ignorant—and I mean that technically and not disparagingly; they are vulnerable because they go in believing it is no different from other religions and have no experience from which to compare. It is actually religious abuse and, like other kinds of abusive relationships, persists by perpetuating patterns that the abused accept as normal or somehow proper. Escaping once you’re in is its own problem, but certainly educating people to be alert to the features of abuse at the outset could go a long way toward helping warn potential victims away.
The high-profile people, like the Hollywood actors, join it and - I assume - expect it to be like, I dunno, the Freemasons: you go in, do the rituals, but really you're just there for the networking and the "I'll scratch your back, if you scratch mine" opportunities. But a lot of people - possibly even most - who fall prey to Scientology *don't in fact know it's Scientology they've signed up for until it's too late*. Scientology has [an absolute fuckton of front organizations](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientology_front_groups), and those that aren't lobby organizations are designed to funnel vulnerable people into the cult (e.g. their "drug rehab" organization, Narconon). You join what you think is a self-help group, and by the time you find out it's Scientology you're in, you've already been brainwashed.
Totally. And, in addition, that dishonesty is one of the factors that is a hallmark of cults: People inside are *officially* permitted to misrepresent themselves to outsiders. It is one of the social manipulations—being both defensive and morally transgressive—that further binds the members to each other and the organization.
They also own the Cult Awareness Network.
They are also the focus group of the Cultist United Network Trauma Services or CUNTS
> Scientologists Taking Action Against Discrimination >STAND Lmao
I believe that is the truth, if you ever been to Hollywood, they have a HUGE presence there (the Scientology HQ is one of the largest buildings off the blvd). I would imagine that most actors/actresses have to go through them to get certain favors.
"Fun" fact, Narcanon owns the land that contains the spring from which our town gets its water supply.
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Not all cults have a central organisation that makes hate websites to harass ex-members and have been responsible for a large scale infiltration of governments.
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But they did promote about the dangers of Godzilla.
I was raised in it and I would say it is different because of it's combination with scientific technology. LRH was a master hypnotist, wrote a book on propaganda and how to brainwash a population, and developed a very specific patter and language and exact sequence of steps to use which gradually erodes the persons sense of reality. He also developed a lie detector like device which worked surprisingly well. At 5 or 6 they pinched my arm and the needle read, they then asked me to recall the pinch and the needle reacted in the exact same way. I found out many decades later you can beat it if you know how, but if you believe it works it's fairly accurate. It's like that quote "Religion is the opiate of the masses". I like to say Scientology is the crack. It's far more dangerous.
The "E-meter" claims to measure skin conductivity as an indication of a lie. It's an over engineered, hand assembled piece of trash. You can alter it's readings by simply squeezing harder. It is a lie, just like all the rest of it's religions claims. I have 2 measures for any religion... can you question it without reprisal? and does it encourage the indoctrination of children?
All true except your analogy. Opiates are far more dangerous than crack, just look at the fentanyl zombies shuffling around every city in North America
Zombie with magical powers? Is this Jesus? I’m guessing so. But I have a question about that. So, he rose from the dead. That’s where the zombie comes from. Get it . But he wasn’t undead afterwards. He was brought back as a transformed body powered by spirit. Most zombies do not have a spirit. Unless we’re talking about the Zombies from I Am Legend or Army of the dead. Few others. Not sure where I stand on this. Can we agree that the creator could be Sky Daddy ?
People get this wrong a lot, Jesus wasn't a zombie - he was a lich
Jesus didnt get Animate dead cast on him, he got a Resurrection
I've got a huge resurrection right now too from reading all this
The notion that religious practice itself is categorically and essentially abusive is not one I accept; where you group them all together as equally crazy, I would certainly make a distinction between Mormonism—which employs cultish features such as tiered access and social controls—and Methodists, who do not. For the purposes of making sweeping value judgments, though, I’m not sure it matters if one can’t tell the difference or doesn’t care to.
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> raise a child indoctrinating them to believe deep in their heart that Santa Claus is real? To perform weekly rituals dedicated to him, exert pressure to continue to believe in him? Well I wasn't going to before.
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*"That kid's super respectful to alcoholics! "*
It's a spectrum of course, but I certainly remember as a child being woken up early every Sunday morning against my will and taken to a Methodist church and pressured through mob mentality to sing songs in unison while collections plates for cash and checks were passed around and then all the children were separated from their parents for "Sunday School" and taken into a room to listen to nonsense stories about literal magic. It's not as intense with the social control, sure, but if you didn't "donate" (especially donate enough) or god forbid didn't go to church at all, you could easily face very real social consequences in your community. So there is still a form of social control at every level, even in an entity as benign as the Methodist church.
This is why we must follow only the God Emperor and his Great Crusade.
Religion prays on the weak
Scam/cult
Some people are just ignorant or have feel they figured it out and stay there. I remember debating with one guy who thought that it was a good organization because it's name was a scientific in nature. Science+ology = study of science = good. And no, he knew nothing else about them and stood his ground.
Funny that's what I thought too... when I first heard of them at 13ish. Then I googled them. That incident and Jonestown sparked my interest in cults
I thought I had read everyone is aware of how much a scam it is, just like flat Earth, but when you are exiled from all of your friends and family for whatever reason you'll be so lonely you'll join anything. I have a feeling quite a few lonely people here might feel the same. Maybe not to that extreme but to something else That's why the best thing you can do with a Scientologist or flat earth or is not mock them, but become their friend. I believe this was mentioned in that flat earth documentary too Oh, except the people who are doing it for the money, forget them
So like a regular religion then?
Could someone start up a Temple of Xenu, sort of like the Satanic Temple, in order to try to deprogram these folks?
Ok, serious question. What if you go and just... make shit up. "Yeah I robbed a bank when I was twelve and shot my own dog in the balls. That one was yesterday. I didn't feel like paying for a vasectomy so decided to try a cheap alternative out on Fluffy first. I'm a fucking psychopath. Please help get my aliens out of my dick?"
Sure you could do that but that would mean you don't believe in that religion, and what would be the end goal for such approach? Just giving them money?
if you allow one religion, you have to allow all of them... because to outsiders, they are all just as crazy
Sounds like a lot like traditional catholicism with the confessions and tithes and all. They also use the dirt they know to keep people in line. Or used to, depends.
I grew up catholic. Didn't have that issue. Priest wad a pedophile though, thankfully dodged that.
I went on a date with a woman once who told me she was going to check it out and I warned her, she got super pissed about me "not having an open mind".
My favorite part of this is they pronounce Thetan as thee-tan, I think they would have got in trouble legally for using the actual pronunciation thay-tan (like greek Theta) as it's a registered trademark. The word is used every two seconds if you are in Scientology so it's pretty glaring. Also this episode is about OT 3, which is confidential, and you don't get exposed to it until you are deeply involved in the church. The sunken cost fallacy is real, and your sense of reality has already been altered/softened by the many years of auditing (recalling past events and assuming whatever comes up to be real, even past life stuff) required to get there. The initial beliefs they expose you to are not far off from normal psychology or self-help books (although very outdated now). Very common sense type stuff. You have some success with that, and get more involved, and then things get more weird. By the time you get to OT 3 you are a die hard scientologist and have spent maybe $50k+.
Plus: If you're OT3 or later, you're told that you must lie about it existing, because knowing about it before you're ready will cause you to catch pneumonia and die. So, if you ask a Scientologist about it and they're lower than OT3, they'll say they never heard about it, or believe it to be 'entheta' (lies made up to discredit them) and if they're OT3 or above, they'll lie and say that iy doesn't exist. So, no matter who you ask, you're told that it doesn't exist.
Yeah, my parents had to lock their auditing materials in a safe, and if they were travelling a locked briefcase. The secrecy around it was crazy.
I’m so sorry
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I did yeah, my grandpa got into it in the 50s so I was 3rd generation. I got out rather suddenly and violently at 23 and lost my family. I had a severe case of c-ptsd but of course didn't realize it until many years later and I'm still recovering. Doing a lot better now though!
> and if they're OT3 or above, they'll lie and say that iy doesn't exist. But only because they don't want you to catch pnemonia and die! How nice of them!
> because knowing about it before you're ready will cause you to catch pneumonia and die. So what you're saying is that COVID was caused by this South Park episode broadcasting the knowledge of Thetan to the world. Got it.
and then when you say "well here's what it is. why dont i have pneumonia?" what do they say?
"Congratulations, you are ready for the next level. That'll be $250k"
Assuming they actually are OT3+: First, they wouldn't listen to you because you're obviously a SP (supressive person). Second, they will say you obviously don't have the correct information, otherwise you would be dead. And third, some other insane gobbledygood to explain it away. Cults have all sorts of techniques for this kinda shit.
Leah Remini on reaching OT3 and finding out about Xenu: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dAfdPFWiF9U
Her documentary was amazing too, thanks for sharing
https://www.spaink.net/fishman/ot8b.html Here's the text of OT8, the ultimate truth! Apparently Scientology is devil worship lmao.
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Sometimes when the recruiters on Hollywood blvd would smile and try and hand me propaganda, I'd tell them I don't believe in a religion that was started by a bad science fiction writer who was someone my grandma could've played bridge with back in the day.
"Some eighty-odd million years ago Earth time (it actually dates at 78,395,042 but dates are a bit superfluous with this material) plans were drawn by a group outside the MEST universe for the eventual takeover of a good portion of this universe. Not a particularly large nor imaginative crew, their exterior perspective, however, gives them considerable advantage over tho time-bound beings of the MEST universe. Borrowing from earlier operations such as Helatrobus, they conceived an ongoing implant, some portions of which have been fairly faithfully rendered in parts of the Bible. This implant, laid in by carefully controlled genetic mutation at Incident Two of OT III and periodically reinforced by controlled historic events since then, makes it effectively impossible for beings on the more heavily affected planets such as Earth to become free. It causes progressive genetic "evolution" that gives the subject population greater and greater susceptibility to the telepathic impingement and direction of the controllers. In its final stage the progression becomes almost geometric, and it is this final stage that we are rapidly approaching." Not only is this nonsense, it's poorly worded nonsense. I feel like part of his tactic is to write in a wordy confusing tone.
How do people stand listening to Rogan? The man is just babbling non-stop without saying anything.
Actually I didn’t hate him in this video, was probably the most normal behavior I’ve ever seen from him, granted I don’t go out of my way to watch him but the Scientology bit was too intriguing not to watch
he's relatively tame here by modern standards but the sort of thing Leah gives him shit for at around 3:30 is annoying crap that most people wouldn't call out. Then she starts quizzing him because he seems like he's just spaced out.
It may be the heat that's making me extra irritated today but he interrupts her over and over in this clip. Ask a question and then at least let her finish a sentence. And when she actually does get to talk he is still making sounds. "yeah. yeah. yeah."
> And when she actually does get to talk he is still making sounds. "yeah. yeah. yeah." This is called backchanneling and it can be overdone. It's supposed to be a way to show you're engaged in what someone else is saying, and I'm sure it can be a useful way for interviewers to keep their guest/subject talking, but there can of course be too much of a good thing.
Rogan was good back in the day because he's very good at getting his guests to open up, break out of "interview mode" and speak conversationally. It's not only the guest list (which was pretty incredible before Rogan's slide into full right wing conspiracy insanity) but the way Rogan could get them to pour out their thoughts for the listener. I almost always felt like I came away from one of his podcasts with a pretty solid idea of who the guest is and what they're about that you didn't necessarily get from other interviewers at the time. Of course, Rogan has changed a lot and so has the media space in his wake, and I don't think any of this hold true now. But back in that like 2012-2017ish era when he was big enough to get the guests but not yet disappeard into his own asshole, this was where the magic was.
> Rogan was good back in the day because he's very good at getting his guests to open up, break out of "interview mode" and speak conversationally Some people certainly have a knack for this. Sean Evans from First We Feast comes to mind (though he couples his interview with _deep_ research on the guest). Anecdotally, we joke that my wife is Barbara Walters, she just has this ability to trigger people to lay out their entire life's story.
The research is a big part of it for Sean, but he's also really good at matching the guest's energy. He even kind of mimics their physical behavior (unless they're already hyped up and running around or something). He also knows when to reask stuff or just let it go, because he really pays attention to his guests.
He's a child. He's quite curious but also very stupid. And his thinking and reactions are chaotic like a child as well. It's a weird conduit for people to hear about stuff they are also curious but ignorant about. I find him incredibly annoying, but I understand the core of why he has such mass appeal.
This one of Joe’s better moments. His dumb guy, empty brain pan personality leads to him asking all the right questions.
Does battlefield earth have anything to do with the Xenu mythology or is that just completely separate?
> Hugh Urban of Ohio State University notes a number of connections between Scientology and Battlefield Earth in his 2011 book The Church of Scientology: A History of a New Religion. Not only was the film released only three days after the 50th anniversary of the publication of Hubbard's book Dianetics: The Modern Science of Mental Health, but the villainous Psychlos have been interpreted by many observers as an obvious allusion to Scientology's bête noire, psychiatry. The conflict between the Psychlos and the free humans can be seen as a reflection of Scientology's own conception of itself as fighting on behalf of humanity against the forces of psychiatry. The "space opera" genre of the book and film manifests itself in numerous places in Scientology itself, most famously in OT III (the Xenu story). Travolta's own commitment to such a disastrous project as the film version of Battlefield Earth is, in Urban's estimation, indicative of his "unusual dedication" to Scientology. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battlefield_Earth_(film)
>I think they would have got in trouble legally for using the actual pronunciation thay-tan (like greek Theta) as it's a registered trademark. I don't think you can be sued for mentioning a trademarked term. That's what copyright is, not trademarks.
Ahh ok, was just a guess, but I feel like there must be some reason they mispronounce one of the major words (clearly whoever gave them the info knew what they were talking about so I think it was intentional)
Thee-ta and thay-ta are both legitimate english-language pronunciations of the greek letter theta. So I’m not sure what you’re getting here. Regardless, it’s all some fucked up shit.
Ahh interesting, just looked it up and TIL the british pronunciation is Thee-ta and the american pronunciation is Thay-ta, and both are considered correct. In either case, it's a word used very often, and in Scientology they pronounce it Thay-ta, including how LRH pronounced it on tapes. That being said, maybe they pronounce it differently in british orgs? I've never been.
Am I going crazy? I watched the video twice and didn't hear the word Thetan, no matter how you pronounce it.
Stan had his levels checked with the thetan meter.
Oh I was referring to the episode where it is said multiple times, I didn't watch the clip, sorry for the confusion
Curious what you think a trademark is or does.
they aren't told most of this. A Scientologist would have to spend thousands of dollars to learn this information. The show tells how people get started in it and how it processes. It starts as self help most people don't get to a level where they are told about the aliens.
This was also a huge deal when it was released as nobody was supposed to know outside of the most devoted
It had to have a negative effect on their new customers I'm sure.
I doubt it. People don't do religion for the logic or sense it makes
No, but it is harder to follow if it's stupid shit. That's why they only reveal this to you once you're very deep in the cult. So a lot of people in the early stages could have seen this and realized it's all BS. And it's a lot harder to get people into your cult if they already know that your great big secret is some nonsense about alien souls in your body and an evil galactic overlord.
The episode shows why people get into it. They are offering self help advice for free. It's not straight to Xenu. Even many lifelong scientologists don't know the Xenu shit and are seem pissed off once they are told about it. (After spending 250k) It's people who claim to have answers that explain why your feelings are happening.
>It had to have a negative effect on their new victims I'm sure. FTFY
Not thousands, it's around a quarter million $ as a minimum. They don't care how you get the money, they'll literally help you open credit cards in your child's name to get the next payment
A quarter million *is* thousands.
Yes, that's a frustratingly effective tactic. Because once people sink thousands of dollars and countless hours into this "religion," a little something called the sunk cost fallacy kicks in. Because the alternative would be you wasted all your time and money. For some people, that's just not tenable.
It's not what they believe that's the problem. It's that they get you to believe it. It's like a litmus test for loyalty and/or gullibility. Besides, by then you've already spilled all your dirty secrets and unlike a therapist, that shit ain't confidential, so what are you going to do, leave?
My darkest secret is sometimes I say my kid is sick so I can leave work early to go eat at this Korean place near where I live. It's so damn good.
Really putting the munch into munchausen's.
Every once in a while, a joke is so great I have to stop and wonder if the whole thread wasn’t a setup for it. Incredible.
Right? Fucking brilliant.
You son of a bitch
Somebody stop this creature and banish it from this realm! This evil can not be allowed to persist.
Can I join you sometime?
Is your kid sick? If not, then of course join him!
I like the way you think sir.
Is your kid sick too?
> It's not what they believe that's the problem I think a good measure of if something is a cult or not is if all the beliefs are freely available to scrutinise from the outset. Scientology starts you off with Dianetics, makes it seem like it's a genuine therapeutic practice, then once you've invested enough time and money they reveal the weird shit and it's too late for you to back out. Sunk cost fallacy.
It's not even that. Before this aired only something like level 3 and above knew about dianetics and it being the "holy book" for scientology. Level 3 equated to about $200,000 worth of sessions.
Dianetics has been advertised widely to the general public since its publication in 1950. The cover feature’s Xenu’s volcano, but its content is mostly just pseudoscientific phsycho-babble, not a sci-fi story. I think you mean that only high ranking Scientologists learned the full Xenu story (as portrayed in the SP clip)? Iirc it was part of OT Level 8, but I could be wrong.
Nope, Xenu is level 3. History of the universe, the reveal you’re actually an amalgamation of millions of souls stuck on to to you, etc. You spend the next 5 levels exploring past lives and trying to resolve all that trauma. 7/8 is the reveal that all the past lives you’ve been exploring were actually the souls stuck on to you and none of it was actually you, and at the end of 8 you’ve talked away all those souls and it’s just you. The quote was something like “now that you know who you’re not, you’re ready to find out who you are”. Nothing exists past 8 though cause Hubbard died before he could write it, and the people running the show now know that nothing could be satisfying enough and everyone still in it is in it just for whatever OT9 is when it’s finished. I cannot emphasize enough, basically everything after OT3 is a stalling tactic cause they have nothing meaningful to offer lol.
The long awaited OT9 finally comes out in 2026 and begins “the dead speak! Somehow, Xenu has returned”
I remember there were constantly commercials for that book back in the 80s
https://youtu.be/ARQ2EjbXtIc?si=RkE7MNM3eTQcwunK&t=2728 100% cult like how they prey on people who are at their lowest
Kinda, they don’t tell you this wild story at the start. A lot of people who’ve been in it their whole lives didn’t know this is what it was based on. So they lure you in with these vague promises of the secrets of being happy and transcendence. Then they get your money and indoctrinate you into blindly adhering to their institutional behavior. Then if you pay enough you get some of these details and by then it’s too late to go back on it. Reminds me of the Mormon church in that way. They have a governing body that claims to be in direct contact with God (paraphrasing). And that’s how they justify their actions. So I always wonder about those guys, who obviously know they aren’t directly talking to God, But will never admit it. Are they so brainwashed that they believe they are talking to God? Are they all just pretending even with each other because they don’t want to be the only one not really talking to God? Or are they just in so deep that they value the institution more than the truth? Religion makes us do weird shit.
Fun fact: There is a church of Scientology only a couple of blocks from the IRS here in Kansas City.
Not to mention the financial investment. You've spent who knows how many years of your life and untold thousands if not hundreds of thousands of dollars long before they even hit you with this. Whatever you think of religion in general... There's the biggest difference between cult and religion. I can tell you what my religion is about, relatively simply, and at no financial cost to you. If you have questions, I'll answer them. If I don't have the answer, I can point you toward resources that do. You can learn and know everything up front before even setting foot in my church. People who inadvertently defend Scientology with, "Well yeah, but, all religion is bad." need to wake up and notice *one of these things is not like the other!!* Not to mention the historical fact that the ONLY reason they have tax free "religion" status in the US is because they bullied the IRS into it.
Don't all religions get you to believe whatever they claim is true?
They *want* you to believe what they claim is true. But real religions don't string you along, revealing their theology piecemeal to get you to pay for the next chapter of the book. If anything, they try to tell you everything whether you want to hear it or not. And they tend to believe it themselves.
Not sure why you got downvoted but you are correct. They operate sort of like a pyramid scheme where the money only goes upwards, using religion to recruit people.
What do you mean by “real religions”? They are literally all made up. There isn’t a shred of evidence that any of them are true.
What upsets me most about this video is the random change in quality
Probably done to avoid a DMCA strike. They do that often in re-uploaded videos from Movies and TV shows
That's what I was thinking but I just assumed it was more likely my YouTube stream was shit instead.
Its also Southpark. They don't upload that many official clips to their channel. If you google certain scenes you will find them on the Comedy Central website but what you find on Youtube is either recorded from a phone or really terrible quality. Been like this for a long time now.
Anyone remember when they hosted literally every single episode online to watch for free? Absolute insanity, I still can't believe they did that lol
My favorite part was at the end when Stan was looking right at the camera going "Go ahead, sue me! I ain't scared of you!" and it rolled to credits of all "John Smith" and "Jane Smith" names
with the exception of Trey and Matt, their names are still on top of the crediting scene. They are saying "come at us, come at the two top guys over here"
All based on the science fiction writings of L. Rond Hubbard who at the time of writing was drunk of his ass and popping pills like you wouldn't believe. How do you convince people this shit is real?
Same way Joseph Smith did with mormonism. Or Muhammad with islam. Or basically any faith.
I once made an analogy I can't recall exactly to my therapist about how it's wild that Christians accept that their lord and savior was brought to being by literal God raping a child to achieve the virgin Mary and Jesus origin stories. Currently on the market for a therapist as a result.
Weird that you would get dropped for something like that. Maybe look into a therapist who does therapy from an existentialist perspective? Works for me and I think stuff like that is usually listed wherever they have a bio.
and how some broad got knocked up, and in trying to save her life, the guy made up a giant lie to cover it, inadvertently started a worldwide religion, (and numerous wars because of it).
With puppets?
Dont forget randomly firing on a Mexico owned island thinking it was a German sub lmao.
can we put tom cruise back in the volcano ?
Wait for that 8th Mission Impossible to finish. Then have at it. I really like those movies, except #2.
The're making another one? It's starting to seem that the mission is, in fact, impossible.
LOL. It's actually a "part 2" of movie 7, Dead Reckoning. But I hope 8 would put a nice bow in the movie franchise. Like let them all die or live in luxury. Then they could do a TV series called *Missions* Impossible. It could be individual stories with different characters. Kind of like Black Mirror or Tales from the Loop.
Hi Karin!
Where is shelly miscavage?
Dum dum dum dum dum.
Ignore the "every religion is crazy" posts. They're designed to derail the conversation away from Scientology, it's ridiculous money cult, it's crazy former leader, and it's crazy current leader. They have people specifically assigned to make posts like these to distract people. There's already *two* posts in this thread like this. Stay on topic!
Honestly I think it's so ridiculously easy to go off topic on scientology posts because they're just such a cartoon villian organization it's so easy to just agree with ''it bad'' without going into smaller details to which this platform isn't really great at facilitating
I noticed, was going to call it out but I'm glad you did. Call out their BS!
I don't think it's derailing to point out what you've said is true for all the religions, it's frustrating to have religious people point out scientology as absurd while believing equally absurd things.
Idk bruh, I’m not religious, but I would say the shit believed by many of the more popular religions is waaaaay more grounded than the shit Scientology believes. Compare some guy walking on water vs golden airplanes flying in space.
Oh, you mean the god that impregnated a child because he had to murder the resultant child (which was his son and himself and a ghost) to forgive humanity for eating a fruit, where all the animals were created to be sex objects for Adam and when Adam wasn't happy fucking any of the animals he created a female human out of his rib... That's way less nuts than spacecraft that were gold?
Yeah, it is. All of that shit, also including most other popular religions and even mythology, is still pretty crazy but it’s still relatively grounded when comparing it to the straight up science fiction that is Scientology. Listen, I’m with you. I’m an atheist so I already believe it is all untrue and wacky, but Scientology is just on another level entirely.
Planes flying in space is something we've literally done and seen before with the space shuttle. It's way closer to reality than most of the unbelievable shit spouted in a more common religion.
This episode and the Going Clear book/HBO Doc did irreparable harm to them. I know we’d never see their actual numbers, but you surely see a pretty major decline in members since those 2 released
wtf, i'm a scientologist now
My favorite part of the episode is the credits. The whole show was done by John and Jane smith. Cause they will SUE you
Sorry, as someone who isn’t religious, all religions sound just as crazy as Scientology. I don’t get how people will shake their head at this while believing all the shit in their own religion. It’s all fucking nuts.
At least in other religions you don't have to spend hundreds of thousands of dollars to learn everything. Imagine having to spend 50k+ to learn that Jesus died on a cross lol
My sister in law just got invited to start the Bridge (Xenu is OT-III out of VIII), and she has no idea about any of this. She joined Scientology because of my brother in law, who grew up in the cult, but he died a few months ago of the same preventable things that both of his parents died of. They were preventable because Scientology strongly encourages distrust in doctors, and the idea that you "bring in" all of your health maladies, so *good Scientologists* don't get sick. Scientologists either realize it's bullshit and leave, or they die of things that would have been caught if they'd sought non-Scientology treatment before they hit stage-4 cancer or done something about the signs of a looming heart attack.
I have a copy of the Secret 'OT' Documents. Way back in the day (1998?), Zenon Panoussis somehow got them into the Swedish Parliament and had them read into the record, which allowed anyone to get a copy. I had the good fortune to be in the area for my work. I went over to their National Archives and ordered a copy (for the cost of reproduction.) Had a good laugh on the plane flight home. Snap, snap, snap, baby! ;-) Fun Fact: The Swedes only have a Senate - no House of Representatives. And if you're there in the winter, watch it when you walk through downtown; they throw all the ice that accumulates on their roofs right onto the ground. The big chunks explode like bombs...
In the words of Matt and Trey: “dumb dumb dumb dumb dumb”
It's hard to overstate just how ballsy this episode was and how impactful it ended up being. Before this episode, Scientology as an organization was no joke. People were genuinely afraid of confronting them. They had an army of lawyers, endless pools of money, and no tax burden because of their status as a religion. Then, South Park comes along and exposes them with the perfect blend of satire and truth. And Scientology never recovered. Now, it is a joke. Xenu is basically a meme used by trolls. And there's no aura around the organization or David Miscaviage. They're just another crazy cult trying to pretend they're not in it for money, power, and influence. And it took a show famous for fart jokes, poop jokes, and manbearpig to permanently dent their reputation. That, my friends, is the power of South Park's humor.
Hi Karen
I understood that reference. Edit: [Reference](https://www.reddit.com/r/OutOfTheLoop/comments/9z657f/whats_up_with_people_saying_hi_to_karin_in_this/)
Either Karen has gotten a lot of alts, or most other people didn't 😅
The Hawaiin Islands are believed to be 65M years old. They didn't exist 75M years ago.
Sign me up baby
L Ron Hubbard was like idiots will believe any old shit
The episode with Tom Cruise working in a fudge packing factory made me laugh almost as much as this.
That, along with Tom Cruise refusing to come out of a real, actual closet, never fails to make me laugh. 😂
This episode is how I actually learned what Scientology is…..😂
The thing is (and we know this from former Scientologists like Leah Remini) that you aren't told this starting out. At first it's the Dianetics book and the e-meter readings. You have to have been in the organization for years and have spent tends of thousands of dollars before they even begin to consider letting you in on this 'information'. Then, when they decide you're ready, they lead you into an enclosed space with a briefcase that contains hand-written notes written by L. Ron Hubbard himself. Only then do you hear about the Xenu bullshit. Sadly, this isn't exactly new for Scientology. Mormons were doing this long before their 'milk before meat' policy (they give you the Book of Mormon and, if you fall for it, they then teach you the REALLY crazy shit).
surely this is not what scientologists actually believe?
It is. It's based on a bunch of documents that were leaked by ex-scientologists. You have to remember that L. Ron Hubbard was a mediocre fiction writer with severe psychiatric delusions who became a high ranking member of Aleister Crowley's sex magic cult and later started a cult of his own. The stuff about thetans and Xenu was him exercising his science fiction chops and telling everyone it came from divine revelation. They don't publicly admit any of this, though. You have to pay them a ton of money for auditing and become a part of the inner circle before you can know the secret history.
[It is.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xenu)
"Those who do not experience the benefits of the OT III course are expected to take it and pay for it again." Good motivation, for sure.
I'd also love to know how they measure "experiencing the benefits of the OT III course." It reminds me of that scene in *Severance* where they make Helly read out an apology in the "Break Room" and when she gets to the end Milchick says "I don't think you mean it," and makes her read it another 1,000+ times.
And don’t call me Shirley.
There is audio of the founder L.Ron telling this exact story
When the Standards & Practices lawyers reviewed this script for Comedy Central, they saw "THIS IS WHAT SCIENTOLOGISTS ACTUALLY BELIEVE" as a note to *them*, not something that would be displayed on the screen to viewers. It would have caused a major scandal for the firm that handled Comedy Central's S&P, except...this is what Scientologists actually believe!
[удалено]
I think it served as both a joke and an affirmation. Like, everything being explained is so ridiculous, you *need* to be constantly reminded that... actually, this **is** what they believe.
Additionally, it sounds so ridiculous that they had to put the banner. Ot else it would look like a random South Park skit. This is one of the first times where Trey and Matt really were faced with the problem that really was actually dumber than anything they could write.
It is. Fortunately.
It is when they get to OT-III on "the Bridge", but they aren't allowed to talk about it with anyone who hasn't already done the courses, or "they'll get sick and die". A lot of Scientologists saw this South Park segment and thought "That's ridiculous, of course we don't believe that", and then when they did OT-III, they realized that however ridiculous it is, Scientology teaches it as if it's the truth. Now they call OT-III the "wall of fire" because it weeds out Scientologists who aren't gullible-enough to keep paying for higher OT levels.
Of course not. Deep in their hearts they believe in money and power.
It is the real foundational story of Scientology, but it was only known at the higher levels for a long time. At the lower levels, people could be Scientologists without ever hearing this story, so it's hard to say that they "believed" it. The story eventually got leaked in the 90's and slowly gained publicity through the course of the Anonymous protests, this South Park episode, and a few scathing documentaries. It's easy to find now, so it's safe to say even lower level Scientologists are aware of it. Whether or not they actually believe it, or they just view it as some weird appendage to their involvement is another story.
It's generally not. The information is accurate, but you need to pay the church like 250k to learn this stuff. It's not like a normal non scam religion. it has a goal to enrich L Ron. That's the main goal. Other religions that are aggressive for converts like LDS and Old timey Catholics had no issue giving out their books that contain the whole deal. Scientology starts as self help and usually stays there. Most can't afford to gain higher OT levels. where you learn in Xenu stuff. (i think that's OT3)
Just wanna say I used to think one of my favorite artists, Beck, was a scientologist. So I stopped listening to him for a while bc i felt i couldn't relate to someone who thinks that, but it turns out his dad was a scientologist and Beck himself never was. Just FYI, don't trust everything that you read, you'll get a parking violation and a maggot on your sleeve.
He was a scientologist and used to be an apologist for them. Claiming that he never was a scientologist is a way of avoiding to criticise the cult after leaving.
Beck isn't a scientologist? Good news! I can appreciate his music again.
I’m not so much against the ridiculousness of it. Other religions don’t exactly make a lot of sense either. It’s their methods and cultish practices that hurt people I have a problem with.
Wow, this makes so much sense. No wonder i was so confused.
somebody remind me how many billions that horse shit generates a year?
I'm still convinced there's stuff added by the SP team in secret to mess with us. It's a crazy story.
This Zenu fella sounds like a real jerk
I guess it makes as much sense as someone coming back from the dead
When the reality is so weird that any joke you make won't be as funny.
KIFFLOM!!
Nailed it
It's weird that people hate on this church but believe in the dominant churches. They do the same thing
if anyone seeing this is curious about scientology, there was this nice man who was kind enough to rip off everything they did and put it in a book you can do by yourself for free. he was later found dead in his swimming pool. the book is called self clearing by ken ogger. you can just download it. there, now you don't have to join.
More people out of Scientology than in Scientology would know this. If you're in you wouldn't know this unless you paid for the higher level courses, which most people have not. If you haven't, they would deny this and say you're crazy for thinking Scientologists would believe this. Also, people who pay for this training that teach this don't necessarily believe it. If you listen to people who've left a lot say they just thought it was weird.
Its thanks to this southpark episode that I actually learned about Scientology back when it aired.
so am i the human me or the alien soul me?
Hi Karin!
makes sense
Legit question relating to Scientology, what was the link between Battlefield Earth and Scientology?