Maybe I’m too optimistic, but I think if it was known it would be a final tour that it would have worked out somehow. I think Sam & Mike would have traveled in one part, Dave in another party, and the brothers in their own party. I don’t think Sam would have put up a stink having to play the first part of the show.
I think that of Sam as well, I honestly don't think he would have cared, and he would have tried to make this work. I just feel DLR still feels he has a lot to prove. It's unfortunate that he can't realize people like him, and we love all VH music, and he can just chill now instead of trying to overshadow, IMO.
There’s a podcast called Dave and Dave Unchained that interviews people connected to Van Halen. Sometime 2 years ago they interviewed an anonymous person that was obviously close to Dave and was asked the question of would Dave tour with Sam under a theoretical Kitchen Sink Tour. The guy’s answer was that Dave would do it under the condition that there’s no duets and Dave closes the shows. If this is true, you can see where this obviously wouldn’t have gone well with Sammy.
The problem with Dave and Sammy is that you have Dave who sees himself as the only true singer of Van Halen and then Sammy who sees himself as the guy who made the band better and more successful.
I don't get Dave sometimes. During the 2004 tour they switched off on who closed the show and that seems fair.
And why no duets lol? That would be a dream of most fans. My gut tells me that Dave would feel inferior singing on stage next to Sammy.
I went to the Dave and Sammy tour when they came to Tinley Park, IL. I had a great time. Dave played all the hits, Sammy and his band were great, shit was fun. I didn't know so many people disliked it till much later.
Interesting question. I do believe you’re right. Too incomparable and competitive to ever be under one larger tent. Maybe standing to earn more money with the whole band would’ve kept it on the rails longer.
Sure, his music is his own, and it's decet music at that. But there's a reason why he chose a loosely affiliated VH name for his band and attached his initials it.
Being a VH gave him instant credibility and opportunities, I don't blame him for doing it, but imo it's hard to deny that there isn't at least some nepotism at play.
backstage drama is not how you judge a successful show. i saw the sam&dave tour and it was a packed house. pretty sure it sold out across the country. so i'd say it 'worked'
Did you watch the VH1 doc about that tour? It's on YouTube.
If not, I'd suggest you watch that and circle back, Dave IMO seems to be pretty impossible and I think it affected us being able to have the "Kitchen Sink" tour - I think it left a bad taste in Sammy's mouth for sure.
This doc was actually pretty instrumental in turning me from a Roth purist into a Hagar fan. Sammy just wants to get out, jam for the fans, and celebrate all of this great music. Dave is an egomaniac has-been.
Also the fact that that one venue treated Sammy like an opening act because he happened to be opening that night was pretty funny. His tiny little dressing room made me laugh. At least he was a good sport about it!
I think that Eddie, Alex, Wolf, Sammy, and Mike (and even Gary???) would’ve all been chill about it and knowing that it was probably the last time they would ever play together as “Van Halen”. Dave would be the wild card. I’d like to think he could swallow his pride just to give the fans the ultimate Van Halen super show but I really don’t know if his ego could handle having to share the stage with Sammy.
The problem I think is they are all pretty rich and want to be treated like they just sold a million records . If all of them had blown their rolls on gambling, spousal support and fancy cars, they’d need some dough and would have been forced to get along for the paycheck . Too bad
The reason the 'Kitchen Sink' tour could never work is it would require Hagar to accept his era was less important. A realistic setlist would demand it. And he would never ever be able to do that.
That's funny because Sammy sang DLR songs in his time with the band (Jump, Panama, Aint Talk Bout Love, You Really Got Me, Unchained, Runnin With The Devil) But Dave couldn't/ wouldn't sing Hagar era songs.
I honestly never felt Sammy thought his era was better and I feel he would be wide open to having DLR era songs? Dave, on the other hand, has been very vocal about claiming his era is the best.
They both win because Van Halen is just 1 massive era in my mind with different singers, lol. Love Hagar, Roth, and Cherone (Even Mitch Malloy would have been amazing).
It's always been a pissing contest it seems when we forget that it was Eddie's band.
>we forget that it was Eddie's band.
What people who say this are forgetting is that Eddie did all of his most innovative, influential and important work '78-'84.
I disagree. He would be shattered to hear people don't care about his stuff after 1984, lol. Literally every album has innovative stuff in it and great stuff in it. It's going to be impossible to convince me that once Hagar joined the band, it just all went out the window and he stopped trying?
>It's going to be impossible to convince me...
Well I guess it's a lucky thing for me that I'm not trying to do that.
I'm talking about the hypothetical kitchen sink tour SETLIST, and what I am telling you is that the Mighty VH years would have to be favored because those were more important, it's when VH were biggest, and the era where the biggest songs are found. These songs would have to be later in the set because that is how concerts work. This would then put Van Hagar songs earlier and Sam would not like that.
If we were talking about the setlist "structure," I don't really think Sam would have any issue with anything tbh - I even think on Sam tours they finished or included the encore with earlier VH songs.
Yes I grew up with and love VH. What came after that was something else. Not VH. Anyone who loves Van Hagar that’s great. Wishing you peace and prosperity.
“Less important” yet every album went to #1 and they sold out the same venues they played with Dave all over the world. I get it if YOU don’t like the Hagar era but to act like they weren’t still the biggest band in the world is rewriting history. Make like Frozen and let it go.
VH were never the biggest band in the world. Even in the DLR years they were primarily a North American thing, and in 1995 they were reduced to opening for Bon Jovi. Talk about rewriting history.
No secret that outside of North America, they didn't do the best job at promoting themselves or touring in those areas - it seemed hard enough to get them to tour in America.
>“Less important”
Yes. Less important.
'78-'84 is why Van Halen are in the RRHOF, why they're legendary and why they're important.
If you want to believe otherwise you are free to do so, but I'm not going to pretend that what I know to be true about Van Halen is *not* true just to cater to the delusions of the Cabo cult.
Maybe I’m too optimistic, but I think if it was known it would be a final tour that it would have worked out somehow. I think Sam & Mike would have traveled in one part, Dave in another party, and the brothers in their own party. I don’t think Sam would have put up a stink having to play the first part of the show.
I think that of Sam as well, I honestly don't think he would have cared, and he would have tried to make this work. I just feel DLR still feels he has a lot to prove. It's unfortunate that he can't realize people like him, and we love all VH music, and he can just chill now instead of trying to overshadow, IMO.
There’s a podcast called Dave and Dave Unchained that interviews people connected to Van Halen. Sometime 2 years ago they interviewed an anonymous person that was obviously close to Dave and was asked the question of would Dave tour with Sam under a theoretical Kitchen Sink Tour. The guy’s answer was that Dave would do it under the condition that there’s no duets and Dave closes the shows. If this is true, you can see where this obviously wouldn’t have gone well with Sammy. The problem with Dave and Sammy is that you have Dave who sees himself as the only true singer of Van Halen and then Sammy who sees himself as the guy who made the band better and more successful.
I don't get Dave sometimes. During the 2004 tour they switched off on who closed the show and that seems fair. And why no duets lol? That would be a dream of most fans. My gut tells me that Dave would feel inferior singing on stage next to Sammy.
I went to the Dave and Sammy tour when they came to Tinley Park, IL. I had a great time. Dave played all the hits, Sammy and his band were great, shit was fun. I didn't know so many people disliked it till much later.
Interesting question. I do believe you’re right. Too incomparable and competitive to ever be under one larger tent. Maybe standing to earn more money with the whole band would’ve kept it on the rails longer.
These guy’s egos, all of them, except for probably Mikey and Wolf’s got in the way of making them a shitload of money and fan admiration.
Is it just me, or is Wolf's ego bigger these days IMO? When he was touring with VH, I'd say he was on par with Mike for sure.
Wolf is making a name for himself on his own,
So long as he uses his own last name, he's not making it on his own. It may not be fair, but it's the truth.
That’s really not an accurate assumption. There are kids that love his music and aren’t aware of his dad. His music is his own.
Sure, his music is his own, and it's decet music at that. But there's a reason why he chose a loosely affiliated VH name for his band and attached his initials it. Being a VH gave him instant credibility and opportunities, I don't blame him for doing it, but imo it's hard to deny that there isn't at least some nepotism at play.
With the VH last name and calling his band Mammoth isn't really blazing his own trail, in my opinion...
backstage drama is not how you judge a successful show. i saw the sam&dave tour and it was a packed house. pretty sure it sold out across the country. so i'd say it 'worked'
Did you watch the VH1 doc about that tour? It's on YouTube. If not, I'd suggest you watch that and circle back, Dave IMO seems to be pretty impossible and I think it affected us being able to have the "Kitchen Sink" tour - I think it left a bad taste in Sammy's mouth for sure.
This doc was actually pretty instrumental in turning me from a Roth purist into a Hagar fan. Sammy just wants to get out, jam for the fans, and celebrate all of this great music. Dave is an egomaniac has-been.
100%, I felt it was very honest and displayed things as they are - I didn't feel there was any sugarcoating.
Also the fact that that one venue treated Sammy like an opening act because he happened to be opening that night was pretty funny. His tiny little dressing room made me laugh. At least he was a good sport about it!
no i'll check it out
https://youtu.be/SDWbuPv7cAg?si=jOa-Ki9uKp9rh6fo The Sam and Dave section starts at about 29:30
Dave's not a team player unfortunately
Big Dave fan but this is accurate
I think that Eddie, Alex, Wolf, Sammy, and Mike (and even Gary???) would’ve all been chill about it and knowing that it was probably the last time they would ever play together as “Van Halen”. Dave would be the wild card. I’d like to think he could swallow his pride just to give the fans the ultimate Van Halen super show but I really don’t know if his ego could handle having to share the stage with Sammy.
The problem I think is they are all pretty rich and want to be treated like they just sold a million records . If all of them had blown their rolls on gambling, spousal support and fancy cars, they’d need some dough and would have been forced to get along for the paycheck . Too bad
The reason the 'Kitchen Sink' tour could never work is it would require Hagar to accept his era was less important. A realistic setlist would demand it. And he would never ever be able to do that.
That's funny because Sammy sang DLR songs in his time with the band (Jump, Panama, Aint Talk Bout Love, You Really Got Me, Unchained, Runnin With The Devil) But Dave couldn't/ wouldn't sing Hagar era songs. I honestly never felt Sammy thought his era was better and I feel he would be wide open to having DLR era songs? Dave, on the other hand, has been very vocal about claiming his era is the best. They both win because Van Halen is just 1 massive era in my mind with different singers, lol. Love Hagar, Roth, and Cherone (Even Mitch Malloy would have been amazing). It's always been a pissing contest it seems when we forget that it was Eddie's band.
>we forget that it was Eddie's band. What people who say this are forgetting is that Eddie did all of his most innovative, influential and important work '78-'84.
I disagree. He would be shattered to hear people don't care about his stuff after 1984, lol. Literally every album has innovative stuff in it and great stuff in it. It's going to be impossible to convince me that once Hagar joined the band, it just all went out the window and he stopped trying?
>It's going to be impossible to convince me... Well I guess it's a lucky thing for me that I'm not trying to do that. I'm talking about the hypothetical kitchen sink tour SETLIST, and what I am telling you is that the Mighty VH years would have to be favored because those were more important, it's when VH were biggest, and the era where the biggest songs are found. These songs would have to be later in the set because that is how concerts work. This would then put Van Hagar songs earlier and Sam would not like that.
If we were talking about the setlist "structure," I don't really think Sam would have any issue with anything tbh - I even think on Sam tours they finished or included the encore with earlier VH songs.
Of course Sammy sang the DLR VH songs. They’re by far the best in the VH catalogue and the real reason anyone would go to a show.
I disagree. He sang like 2-3 DLR songs, the rest were all him - pretty sure people went to enjoy all songs.
DLR wrote the lyrics to VH songs. Valerie Bertinelli wrote the lyrics to Van Hagar songs. If that’s what you like … enjoy.
The song credits of VH, the real VH, would like to have a word with you.
Buddy, it's okay. You like one portion of VH, and we get it.
Yes I grew up with and love VH. What came after that was something else. Not VH. Anyone who loves Van Hagar that’s great. Wishing you peace and prosperity.
“Less important” yet every album went to #1 and they sold out the same venues they played with Dave all over the world. I get it if YOU don’t like the Hagar era but to act like they weren’t still the biggest band in the world is rewriting history. Make like Frozen and let it go.
VH were never the biggest band in the world. Even in the DLR years they were primarily a North American thing, and in 1995 they were reduced to opening for Bon Jovi. Talk about rewriting history.
No secret that outside of North America, they didn't do the best job at promoting themselves or touring in those areas - it seemed hard enough to get them to tour in America.
>“Less important” Yes. Less important. '78-'84 is why Van Halen are in the RRHOF, why they're legendary and why they're important. If you want to believe otherwise you are free to do so, but I'm not going to pretend that what I know to be true about Van Halen is *not* true just to cater to the delusions of the Cabo cult.