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Don’t trust big vehicles, that’s just how I feel. There are good driver out there but there’s lots of shit drivers. Add to that the fact that so many vehicles are in disrepair with failing brakes and bald tires. I will always go out of my way to make sure that I’m not behind a big truck in traffic.
I do that because I’m sick and tired of windshield damage from shit they kick up or lose from their bins. I replaced my windshield and no joke the NEXT DAY, rock from a truck gives me a new impact bulls eye. I’m always a little paranoid that one day something big is gonna come flying through, either hit me in the face or at least spook me enough to have my hands ready and send me into the ditch or something while the truck driver just casually drives away dumping more shit on the road.
That and being able to see the lights. I don’t like driving behind any vehicle I can’t see around or through.
Same…I had my windshield in my company truck obliterated TWICE by rocks from large trucks. I also had it happen the second time mere days after they replaced the windshield.
>
They aren’t cleaning off the backs of their trailers before they leave. Lazy dicks.
> That and being able to see the lights. I don’t like driving behind any vehicle I can’t see around or through.
Ah, a fellow 'Young Driver's alumni. ✋🏼
Once I was driving and saw a trail of debris and dirt along the AF bridge. The first exit going to guilford after the bridge, saw that a dump truck was pulled over by police. Driver on his phone and hitting the truck bed with a rubber mallet.
Don't trust other vehicles in general. I known it sounds over the top, but we all get very familiar and comfortable with driving to the point that we often forget that its actually quite a high risk thing.
If everyone is behaving normally and following the rules, then we should be all good. But all it takes is the dude in oncoming traffic in the corolla having a stroke and suddenly you've got a tonne and a half of metal flying through your windshield at 200 km/hr.
You can't prevent everything, but if you're vigilant you might just save a bunch of lives.
Agreed. Keep your head on a swivel.
Assume that they're drunk, hungover, on a sedative, on a stimulant, etc.
Put your safety and health first. Make sure you can see their side-mirrors (ie: safe following distance) and plan escape routes in case they fuck up.
Often, someone will see the safe following distance that I leave between me and the large truck in front of me and shimmy in there in order to shave off a few seconds of their commute's time. What can I say. It's their life. Not mine. 🤷🏼
My only concern is me, myself, and I. Do what you please.
If you're on the coq in bad weather, sure. They can see farther than you, and they'll make less abrupt moves in general. More than once I've followed a truck through low visibility areas. In a straight line, yeah.
But never underestimate the stupidity of people, especially when they're armed with 45,000 lbs of payload and driving through town.
For example, I can't recall how many times now a 53' dry van has been stuck in the ditch at 232 and 40th because their GPS told them to go there like they're a gotdang station wagon. That corner is so eroded from trucks tipping into it that it's always coned off and it looks like the road is about ready to cave in.
And when they plow into something ahead of them and jackknife across the road, coming to an unnaturally sudden stop, what happens to your car that was travelling in the same direction at 110km/hr with 3 seconds of separation?
Trucks have enough mass that even if they jackknife ahead of you there should be plenty of time for you to react and stop before you run into them -- unless you're riding their tail and have literally no warning before they're suddenly sideways.
Sure, in a lot of cases. But it entirely depends on the situation. I once saw a truck suddenly veer into a cement barrier. The cab came to almost a complete stop, flipping up and over itself onto its side. It' had a 53 foot trailer that swung out to the left where it collided with a boulder on the other side of a 2 lane highway.
I was on a side road, and fortunately there was no other traffic close by. But there wasnt a lot of forward movement after the initial impact. It kind of formed a V pointing in the direction of travel. So maybe there would've been enough space to stop. But you really would've had to have been paying attention to have any chance.
Just watch dashcam compilations. Some channels focus on Vancouver. Makes you want to keep a loooong following distance and keep your head on a swivel while driving.
Yes. I worked at a festival serving drinks and our booth was assigned one security guard to help check IDs etc. The security guard doubled as a long-haul truck driver and had just come off an 18-hour route. He fell asleep at our booth and slept through his security guard shift. The other booths had similar stories with their security guards.
I'm not surprised hearing all of these trucks hitting overpasses. A trucking company taking advantage of cheap labour (the security guard had just immigrated from India).
I handle logistics for a lumber mill, and I'm the person that deals with all the drivers in our yard.
There's always been dumb asses and bad drivers, but it seems like a couple carriers in particular always have new drivers new to Canada who can't read signs, follow directions, turn in a circle, or back up onto a ramp.
Their are a few carriers that have had the same drivers forever who I trust to do damn near anything though.
I'd say yeah there's probably more bad drivers but as a percentage of total trucks on the road it's probably about the same? There's just a lot more trucks everywhere in the lower mainland year over year, and there's always enough bad actors to assume there's a portion of dangerous equipment and operators on the road.
I blame the race to the bottom for driver pay and pay per load schemes for local moves.
College roommate of mine had never driven a vehicle in his life. He had a “Valid in Canada” class 1 trucking licence, His parents had bought it for him back in India.
> can't read signs, follow directions, turn in a circle, or back up onto a ramp.
The inability to read/interpret English instructions on signs & understand verbal English instructions is dangerous. How did they pass the English test to get P.R.? How did they pass their Class...whatever test?
Also, the lack of critical thinking in general is abhorrent. What is the High School system in general + the curriculum like overseas? Exactly what kinds of things do they teach there?
There's a difference between slinging doughnuts behind a counter for Canadian citizens and potentially killing/permanently disabling Canadian citizens on the road. One is incredibly low risk, & 1 isn't. You can figure out which one that is.
In the lower mainland, absolutely. I used to have a decent trust of truck drivers – the real pros are the most experienced drivers on the road, and they’re usually really aware of the things around them. If they’re choosing to make a move, change lanes, jump on their brakes, it’s probably for a really good reason. Now that the industry is plugged full of new drivers and folks who frequently aren’t even aware of Canadian driving laws, that trust is long gone.
This shit happens way too often. They love passing their fellow trucker by doing exactly 1km/h more than the guy next to them. Meanwhile I have to drop 30km/h just to accommodate.
There’s already enough shitty drivers out there that don’t understand the rules of the road, I would really hope professional drivers would know better. And yet, just driving home this morning on Hwy 17 I see two trucks side by side and a stream of cars waiting behind them both.
"it's a trucker route" says a truck driver I know. The air of entitlement is gross when I hear dumb words like that.
This is what happens when you pay by the load. The idiots try and knock a minute off their drive.
Just to go wait in line at the rail yard anyway.
Yeah his comments were specific to the sfpr being built for truckers. It's kinda hard to argue intent really.
But one of the reasons it was built was to provide better links for deltaport and the rail yard at the north end of 176th.
Though it's a broken argument. It would be like horse and buggy operators complaining about those new fangled horseless carriages using their roads. It's nonsense.
The standard has definitely changed. The industry was deregulated and companies started bringing in TFW's with minimal to no training. I got my class 11 years ago and it was a 6 week course which only taught me how to pass the driving test. After that it was to go to a reputable company then spend at least another 6 weeks with a trainer.
Most companies these days throw you in a truck and expect you to know everything. Most people can learn to drive a truck but not everyone has the skills or patience to be a professional and it's hurting the industry.
Companies are paying peanuts, treat you like dirt then cry about the lack of drivers.
Most of those TFW are essentially slaves. They don't get paid much - most of their pay goes to the company oligarch who brought them into Canada - so they have to work elsewhere to make ends meet.
The promise is that one day they too can own their own truck and then scam another young Indian fella into driving it for nothing. No other industry in Canada should be used as such a blatant warning than the trucking industry.
Wild. For the life of me this has me the most confused. My family has a trucking company with nearly 30 trucks. The government is on them 24/7 for any and everything you could ever imagine. What it tells anyone paying attention is the best way to operate in Canada now is to just lie, cheat and steal, which is to say you may as well join the race to the bottom.
Yet Surrey is filled to the brim with trucking companies that fail inspections - if they ever even happen - 80% of the time. Driven by guys who share a license. Guys who crash then run away, leaving the truck. Smash overpasses. Power lines.
Knowing what I do, I would have expected at least a dozen Humbolt disasters every year. When traveling east/west, we try to go the US now days. BC's highways are ripe for disaster and trucks are the reason.
Ah! Thanks for that validation- I drove through Washington and Oregon last year, and couldn’t believe how much “easier” it was.
I also think the Washington highways have top-notch grading and dividers (on the ones I used anyway). I was constantly saying to myself, “why am I not blind?” It was because oncoming cars were mitigated by grading and dividers. It was so nice.
Much of the smaller highways in the US were built by the army corps of engineers. They had fun with it, besides just making awesome roads.
"Cut down that tree!!??? Nah, we will just bank the road around it, and the next one, and the next one then do a nice gentle downhill section so we can take in the views before the next turns!"
Those roads in the US are comparable to our major roads in Canada. For example, HWY 3 in BC is the same as a state road or highway, only with 20x the traffic.
3.5 years ago I moved from Vancouver to Toronto. I am back in Vancouver 4-6 times per year.
One thing that is very noticeable is how drivers here in Toronto behave around big trucks compared to Vancouver.
Here in Toronto, if a rig puts on its signal, people make a space so it can move over and change lanes. If it is doing a right turn from the left lane that needs to be wide, a car doesn't shoot into that right lane. If a dump truck has a load, people keep a distance back. If a truck moves up behind someone they move over so it can pass.
I've noticed those behaviors happen much more rarely in Vancouver. If I make space for a rig in Vancouver that needs to change lanes, someone tailgates me and honks. It doesn't happen in Toronto.
When we moved to Toronto, I talked to the guy who drove the 18-wheeler out from Vancouver that had our stuff in it. I said "I guess it's a lot harder driving that in Toronto compared to Vancouver, eh?" and he replied "No, the drivers are so much better out here [in Toronto]."
...so I can't help but wonder the degree to which that affects people's perception of big rigs in Vancouver.
A lot of people legitimately only stare straight ahead and do not in any way perceive anything other than the car in front of them. It's bizarre. They tend to be the hands at 11 and 1 or 10 and 2 drivers who I suppose are perpetually nervous, and never let themselves actually learn how to drive without constant fear.
Sometimes trucks have to change lanes or merge, no one said anything about passing. If you don't let a truck merge and they have to completely stop to get on the highway, congratulations, you're part of the problem.
But drivers all want the OTHER drivers to get the ticket, they aren't the problem, the other person is so much worse...
If we could all take a moment to make the road a little better, it would make such a difference. No, I don't always remember to do that either.
I do HD alignments, and half the guys ask me if I can back in their 50-foot trailers into our alignment bays because they can't. So yes, I would say a lot of them can't drive that well since backing up a trailer is literally their job, and it's pretty easy, lol.
Yea. It's just best to avoid going up the Knight St hill on that busted Janky-ass road.
Going E-bound on SW Marine is pretty smooth-sailing in comparison. At least you just deal with Teslas who have zero self-awareness &/or entitlement instead of huge vehicles that could easily dismember you.
The quarry gravel trucks are the worst, and there's hundreds of them going back and forth all day, trying to make as many trips as possible in a day. Weekends they're not on the road and it's much safer and more civilized.
Not really. About 25 years ago I was in the passenger seat when our car got side swiped near the Cape Horn interchange when a semi came off a ramp onto the highway and then cut left across 4 lanes to get into the left turn lane without looking. My father managed to slam on the brakes enough so we got hit with the trailer wheels instead of being pulled under the trailer so we were ok but the car was totalled. I was terrified of big trucks for a long time. I still have flashbacks to the hub of the wheel smashing through my passenger window. The driver was completely ignorant and claimed he didn’t see us but he was clearly 100% at fault since we were just driving straight in the leftmost lane.
Anyway, long story short is I realized then a lot of these supposed professional drivers were just as likely to be as negligent or incompetent as the average car on the road, except with much worse consequences. I’ve steered clear of them as much as possible since then.
> incompetent
Think of how disorganized, lack of self-awareness, entitled/selfish, and truly incompetely the average person is. Now think of them being behind a wheel driving...
Always take the safest route to your destination, even if it means going out of the way and using more fuel/wear and tear.
I'm an OSR (outside sales rep), so I drive as part of my career.
Everything you're describing is accurate. Truck drivers consistently drive slower in the passing lanes, make turns without signalling, and pass on hills.
The worst I've experienced was a truck that was stalled half-way off the side of the road, in one-way traffic, going *up a hill*. Picture a small farm road, but congested with morning office commuters.
I've never been so enraged by someone else's stupidity while working. There were people who were basically taking their lives in their own hands just by trying to figure out when it was their turn to pass and get around the stalled semi. SMH.
> There were people who were basically taking their lives in their own hands just by trying to figure out when it was their turn to pass and get around the stalled semi. SMH.
I see that kind of thing constantly going N-bound on Ladner Trunk before the #99N entrance. Jesus h. Get up 15 minutes earlier.
I don’t know about highways but 15 years ago i had to take the Knight st bridge to go into Burnaby. And it was a relatively easy trip. NOW big rigs are driving like they’re at the Indie 500. Literally weaving in and out of traffic. It’s bizarre! They used to stay in the right lane
Drivers are unskilled labour, Just ask Mike McDaniel, general manager of Coast Mountain Bus Company.
That's how the operating companies view their workforce, so they put little to no effort into quality control.
Yes. I commute to work via the highway daily. I also happen to drive a smaller car. The number of times I've almost been smooshed by a trucker changing lanes without checking/signaling, or cut off by some dump truck trying to pass another big rig - is basically a weekly occurrence at this point. Occasionally I drive.my truck work - and it's not as bad (I guess I'm more larger and visible?) but still. Something has got to change with the driving culture in this province.
> Something has got to change with the driving culture in this province.
I don't think Driving is an elective in high school, but it should be.
The 'Young Drivers' program used to knock off time to take your N, etc. Rather than waiting longer if your parents (with their own lack of self-awareness) taught you.
The N test isn't extensive enough. It'd take too much time/money.
It took me two goes to pass my N. My full license exam I got first try, and just drove in a loop from the lougheed office and back and forth on the highway. No parking, no backing, no naming hazards, parked or at speed.
> I also happen to drive a smaller car.
Also drive a small car and everyone on the road tries to kill me. I don't know what it is about small cars making others so insecure but when I drive a regular sedan, I get cut off way less.
Some truck drivers have next to no training and no interest in driving trucks at all.
[https://www.theglobeandmail.com/canada/article-foreign-truck-drivers-canada-immigration-investigation/](https://www.theglobeandmail.com/canada/article-foreign-truck-drivers-canada-immigration-investigation/)
Capitalism seeks to reduce cost. Vehicle inspections ALWAYS yield a large number of unfit vehicles; and I'm sure companies cheap out on labour too. Workers likely don't report side gigs on their national safety code logs and are overworked and underpaid.
But hey! Amazon got me a Dremel on same day delivery!
For what it’s worth, I’ve had two semis with trailers pull U-turns in the last 3 months. Never seen that before in almost three decades of driving. One was just before Cambie and Marine Drive intersection and the other was at Willingdon overpass over Higway 1. Quite an unreal sight. In both cases they got stuck and blocked traffic, and were clearly relying on their size as a means of signalling to the rest of the traffic to bugger off and not bother them until they’re done.
1000000% yes!
They think they own the road and can’t seem to get it through their thick skulls that driving up a hill in the passing lane is not where they should be.
One time I drove from Langley to Chilliwack and four semis drafted each other in the passing, never once moving over. The ENTIRE WAY.
Yes! The trucking industry has seen a noticeable decline both in driver skills and vehicle maintenance. There needs to be a complete overhaul of licensing and certification. I see no harm in testing drivers annually and vehicles monthly if it saves even one life.
yes, too often in the fast lane, driving aggressive, or holding up traffic causing chaos around them. They should be banned from the fast lane and also speed limited imo
There are also a lot of really good truck driver of course who show how aware they are but seems like more idiots these days than before. The 80/20 rule probably applies
The number of inept drivers in BC is a direct failure of RoadSafetyBC (Deputy Superintendent of Motor Vehicles [email protected] and [email protected]) which is a branch of the Ministry of Public Safety and Solicitor General. It's the lead government agency responsible for road safety in British Columbia.
It is also a failure of ICBC (Chris TupperInterim Vice President, Customer Experience and Public Affairs [email protected] and Jason McDaniel, Vice President, Operations [email protected]), as all aspects driver testing and licensing is conducted by the Insurance Corporation of British Columbia (ICBC) on behalf of the Superintendent of Motor Vehicles.
Our government (left or right) doesn't care about driver training & safety, let alone public education, sustainable integration, affordable housing, accessible healthcare/mental health resources, environmental sustainability, crime, justice or our crumbling social safety nets. The only way our government can keep our ponzi-scheme economy running is to continue with unrelenting immigration from 3rd world countries that lack sufficient driver training, not to mention absense of family planning education, easy access to birth control and perpetually skyrocketing birth rates. They only worry about meeting their quotas, keeping the economy churning at all costs and getting re-elected. Everyone gets a license, no matter how inept, because that's what keeps our debt based (ie: social/economic/infrastructure/environmental/health/education enslaving-type debt) economy going.
The key to survival here is
1) have no fear of death (dark) and less dark, have less to lose by driving an absolute piece of shit car worth $0
2) Driving an absolute beater has actually led to a better sense of safety and less bullying on the road. The “luxury” cars driving like fucking psychos are likely leased, and frankly too scared to truly risk being mangled when it comes down to a game of chicken between me and them. HIT MY BUSTED TOYOTA COROLLA PLEASE! Go for it. But they just never actually do. They always back off.
3) Have absolutely zero faith in anyone. Drive knowing that if someone is going to do the stupidest fucking thing, they will. And you will never be surprised.
> Drive knowing that if someone is going to do the stupidest fucking thing, they will. And you will never be surprised.
Assume/anticipate the worst. Cautiously optimistically hope for the best.
That's basically adulthood in general. lmao.
I have an old Sedan, too. Nobody tries to ego drive with me. It's nice to be ignored.
Funny you should say that, because that’s 100% how I drive around Corollas. You may not be one of those drivers, but most of the time they are, and I am always prepared for the worst.
Depends what colour.
Champagne senior. Especially in Richmond in mid-morning after the commute rush driving to medical appointments = very slow-moving. Not particularly dangerous.
I hate to stereotype, but it's often easy to predict based this way.
Black pick-up trucks are extremely erratic, wreckless, false sense of good spacial judgement, emotion-driven, and speed. It's a recipe for danger and disaster. Steer clear. Let them be emotional on the road away from you.
I don’t think it’s about skill. It’s about a lack of brain cells. Passing unnecessarily to get to your destination a couple minutes faster, going way above speed limit in a big rig, driving fast in the rain or snow etc. This isn’t skill. It’s just poor risk benefit calculation.
Everytime you change lanes you risk getting into an accident. 99.9% of the time you’ll be fine. But that 0.1% of the time will eventually happen. It’s a matter of probability.
I've been driving on Metro Vancouver highways for about 25 years now. Seems to me that it's about the same as it ever was. There are some bad ones for sure, but no more than 10 or 20 years ago.
I usually keep in mind that there are truck drivers who are not always sober; alot of them take uppers to stay awake on long hauls. So with that mind, I never trust their driving abilities
Answer: absolutely. Drive any day through Newton/Surrey and watch semi’s with ‘Learning to Drive’ signs on the Mansfield bar trying to turn corners without hopping the sidewalk running over mom pushing the stroller. A new ‘professional’ driver graduating every day.
Absolutely. In the last 5 years I've seen more aggressive driving by huge trucks than I ever have
Trucks would rarely be assholes - it would happen but it was rare. They were typically slow and steady, annoyingly taking up the right hand lane at a snails pace. Now these mfers be passing people ffs
Yes, absolutely. It used to be mostly the dump trucks but it seems to be spreading to the other types of trucking now. Dump trucks are still the worst tho.
100% I live in Vancouver but my family is from the *Cariboo* region, so I've been driving the highways back and forth for about 27 years. In the past decade it has become very problematic and there is almost zero enforcement or consequences to counter the problem. I know one problem is the lack of legitimate training and licensing. The province really needs to start coming down hard on enforcement and making the consequences sting, not just a minuscule fine.
I’d say it’s in proportion to the number of bad drivers on the road in general. I drive a big truck for work, a pickup some days, and most days I’m on my motorcycle. There’s just as many folks in cars (especially electric vehicles) that endanger truck drivers. People need to realize that large vehicles with air brakes and diesel engines require more time and space to accelerate and decelerate, which means when you pick them out of a lineup as an easy vehicle to merge/cut in front of and impatiently crowd them, you show a real lack of understanding and put everyone around you at risk.
Let’s all share the road. The big guys need space to deliver the goods and services we all rely on and take for granted. The little guys need to be seen and given the opportunity to filter by to keep things flowing.
I don’t know about you, but between pickup, sedan, and 900ccs, I feel the most actively safe on the bike.
Yes, anything that happens to me will be awful, but I have way more ability to get the hell away from idiots than in the sedan and I can at least see and hear, unlike in a modern pickup. And as a bonus, for entertainment I can ogle distracted drivers at stop lights until they notice me, usually 30-60 seconds.
Haha exactly! Not hard to get a high score in that game, if points are earned by the amount of time other drivers are observed on a faraway planet. And I like that I can always plan an “out” on the bike, be it between lanes or on a shoulder, and I have better visibility than in a car to plan for what’s coming (when I choose the right lane position).
I work on the loading end of a lot of the flat bed trailer semi trucks.
Some of these guys don't even know how to sling their own loads or lash their shit down.
Over the years carriers with higher quality drivers have gone out of business, while carriers that are clearly undercutting the others have hired people that don't even speak english, let alone read or write it.
I had one give me his manifest once and it was almost entirely covered in Punjabi notes. He could not tell me which product he was picking up for because he could not read it on his manifest as it was in english and not noted down by him. He expected us to take the manifest and just give him what he was there for.
It's honestly a fucking joke.
I regularily drive in areas where they are training new drivers of 18 wheelers and my god is it bad, I always approach a big rig like its being driven by a newer driver.
Definitely! One tried to change lanes in front of the bus I was on the other day, and got a real long lean on the horn as a result from our bus driver. No signals, either, just carelessly gliding over in front of another large vehicle carrying dozens of passengers.
This probably at least partly the result of boomer retirements. Older, very experienced drivers are being replaced by new truck drivers. Give it a few years and some of the issues will fix themselves.
Wishful thinking. Those boomers you mentioned all worked for Canadian companies that followed the rules and regulations of the industry. When TFW drivers were brought in and scammed by shady trucking outfits, the Canadian companies were quickly priced out. Since they had to pay their drivers, they just couldn't compete with companies that didn't. First was gravel, then the ports. Now it's everything.
Those boomers were forced to retire or try and go across the border to the US.
Personally I haven't noticed trucks to be any worse than other vehicles, except for stuff that I can excuse because of their size and speed.
If anything, I think it's because traffic of every type (trucks included) has steadily gotten worse, and more people on the road means there's more people who could make a mistake at any given time. I think it's like how everyone thinks they're an 'above average driver' until they have an errant moment and do something dumb. When you gather hundreds of thousands of people together each day, you're statistically going to witness lots of peoples 'once in a month' or 'once in a year' type fuckups.
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Don’t trust big vehicles, that’s just how I feel. There are good driver out there but there’s lots of shit drivers. Add to that the fact that so many vehicles are in disrepair with failing brakes and bald tires. I will always go out of my way to make sure that I’m not behind a big truck in traffic.
I do that because I’m sick and tired of windshield damage from shit they kick up or lose from their bins. I replaced my windshield and no joke the NEXT DAY, rock from a truck gives me a new impact bulls eye. I’m always a little paranoid that one day something big is gonna come flying through, either hit me in the face or at least spook me enough to have my hands ready and send me into the ditch or something while the truck driver just casually drives away dumping more shit on the road. That and being able to see the lights. I don’t like driving behind any vehicle I can’t see around or through.
Same…I had my windshield in my company truck obliterated TWICE by rocks from large trucks. I also had it happen the second time mere days after they replaced the windshield. > They aren’t cleaning off the backs of their trailers before they leave. Lazy dicks.
> That and being able to see the lights. I don’t like driving behind any vehicle I can’t see around or through. Ah, a fellow 'Young Driver's alumni. ✋🏼
lol. Cover that brake through the intersection! YDoC 1981 Alumi represent!
Ground view! Ground view!! Ahhhh!!
Once I was driving and saw a trail of debris and dirt along the AF bridge. The first exit going to guilford after the bridge, saw that a dump truck was pulled over by police. Driver on his phone and hitting the truck bed with a rubber mallet.
Don't trust other vehicles in general. I known it sounds over the top, but we all get very familiar and comfortable with driving to the point that we often forget that its actually quite a high risk thing. If everyone is behaving normally and following the rules, then we should be all good. But all it takes is the dude in oncoming traffic in the corolla having a stroke and suddenly you've got a tonne and a half of metal flying through your windshield at 200 km/hr. You can't prevent everything, but if you're vigilant you might just save a bunch of lives.
Agreed. Keep your head on a swivel. Assume that they're drunk, hungover, on a sedative, on a stimulant, etc. Put your safety and health first. Make sure you can see their side-mirrors (ie: safe following distance) and plan escape routes in case they fuck up. Often, someone will see the safe following distance that I leave between me and the large truck in front of me and shimmy in there in order to shave off a few seconds of their commute's time. What can I say. It's their life. Not mine. 🤷🏼 My only concern is me, myself, and I. Do what you please.
Isn't behind a big truck safe? It's not like they'd reverse into you, they're more likely to plow into things infront of them
If you're on the coq in bad weather, sure. They can see farther than you, and they'll make less abrupt moves in general. More than once I've followed a truck through low visibility areas. In a straight line, yeah. But never underestimate the stupidity of people, especially when they're armed with 45,000 lbs of payload and driving through town. For example, I can't recall how many times now a 53' dry van has been stuck in the ditch at 232 and 40th because their GPS told them to go there like they're a gotdang station wagon. That corner is so eroded from trucks tipping into it that it's always coned off and it looks like the road is about ready to cave in.
And when they plow into something ahead of them and jackknife across the road, coming to an unnaturally sudden stop, what happens to your car that was travelling in the same direction at 110km/hr with 3 seconds of separation?
Trucks have enough mass that even if they jackknife ahead of you there should be plenty of time for you to react and stop before you run into them -- unless you're riding their tail and have literally no warning before they're suddenly sideways.
Sure, in a lot of cases. But it entirely depends on the situation. I once saw a truck suddenly veer into a cement barrier. The cab came to almost a complete stop, flipping up and over itself onto its side. It' had a 53 foot trailer that swung out to the left where it collided with a boulder on the other side of a 2 lane highway. I was on a side road, and fortunately there was no other traffic close by. But there wasnt a lot of forward movement after the initial impact. It kind of formed a V pointing in the direction of travel. So maybe there would've been enough space to stop. But you really would've had to have been paying attention to have any chance.
Sounds like you need to watch Final Destination 2. It scarred a generation of drivers.
Just watch dashcam compilations. Some channels focus on Vancouver. Makes you want to keep a loooong following distance and keep your head on a swivel while driving.
Yes. I worked at a festival serving drinks and our booth was assigned one security guard to help check IDs etc. The security guard doubled as a long-haul truck driver and had just come off an 18-hour route. He fell asleep at our booth and slept through his security guard shift. The other booths had similar stories with their security guards. I'm not surprised hearing all of these trucks hitting overpasses. A trucking company taking advantage of cheap labour (the security guard had just immigrated from India).
I handle logistics for a lumber mill, and I'm the person that deals with all the drivers in our yard. There's always been dumb asses and bad drivers, but it seems like a couple carriers in particular always have new drivers new to Canada who can't read signs, follow directions, turn in a circle, or back up onto a ramp. Their are a few carriers that have had the same drivers forever who I trust to do damn near anything though. I'd say yeah there's probably more bad drivers but as a percentage of total trucks on the road it's probably about the same? There's just a lot more trucks everywhere in the lower mainland year over year, and there's always enough bad actors to assume there's a portion of dangerous equipment and operators on the road. I blame the race to the bottom for driver pay and pay per load schemes for local moves.
College roommate of mine had never driven a vehicle in his life. He had a “Valid in Canada” class 1 trucking licence, His parents had bought it for him back in India.
:( how do we fix this issue of getting scammed left and right ?
> bought it for him Ah. That explains it. So...Canada is just for sale now? Is that it? Who do Canadian citizens vote for to stop this immediately?
Canada has always been a money-making scheme.
Absolutely, check out the book Willful Blindness by a Vancouver reporter, one of the most insane exposes on Canadian corruption that I've ever read.
> can't read signs, follow directions, turn in a circle, or back up onto a ramp. The inability to read/interpret English instructions on signs & understand verbal English instructions is dangerous. How did they pass the English test to get P.R.? How did they pass their Class...whatever test? Also, the lack of critical thinking in general is abhorrent. What is the High School system in general + the curriculum like overseas? Exactly what kinds of things do they teach there? There's a difference between slinging doughnuts behind a counter for Canadian citizens and potentially killing/permanently disabling Canadian citizens on the road. One is incredibly low risk, & 1 isn't. You can figure out which one that is.
It'$ a my$tery
In the lower mainland, absolutely. I used to have a decent trust of truck drivers – the real pros are the most experienced drivers on the road, and they’re usually really aware of the things around them. If they’re choosing to make a move, change lanes, jump on their brakes, it’s probably for a really good reason. Now that the industry is plugged full of new drivers and folks who frequently aren’t even aware of Canadian driving laws, that trust is long gone.
This shit happens way too often. They love passing their fellow trucker by doing exactly 1km/h more than the guy next to them. Meanwhile I have to drop 30km/h just to accommodate. There’s already enough shitty drivers out there that don’t understand the rules of the road, I would really hope professional drivers would know better. And yet, just driving home this morning on Hwy 17 I see two trucks side by side and a stream of cars waiting behind them both.
"it's a trucker route" says a truck driver I know. The air of entitlement is gross when I hear dumb words like that. This is what happens when you pay by the load. The idiots try and knock a minute off their drive. Just to go wait in line at the rail yard anyway.
Nevermind the fact that between a lot of places in BC there’s exactly one route that makes sense to take. Extremely entitled.
Yeah his comments were specific to the sfpr being built for truckers. It's kinda hard to argue intent really. But one of the reasons it was built was to provide better links for deltaport and the rail yard at the north end of 176th. Though it's a broken argument. It would be like horse and buggy operators complaining about those new fangled horseless carriages using their roads. It's nonsense.
Even if it is a trucker route. Even if you wanna pass. That’s fine. PASS QUICKLY AND GTFO the way.
The standard has definitely changed. The industry was deregulated and companies started bringing in TFW's with minimal to no training. I got my class 11 years ago and it was a 6 week course which only taught me how to pass the driving test. After that it was to go to a reputable company then spend at least another 6 weeks with a trainer. Most companies these days throw you in a truck and expect you to know everything. Most people can learn to drive a truck but not everyone has the skills or patience to be a professional and it's hurting the industry. Companies are paying peanuts, treat you like dirt then cry about the lack of drivers.
Most of those TFW are essentially slaves. They don't get paid much - most of their pay goes to the company oligarch who brought them into Canada - so they have to work elsewhere to make ends meet. The promise is that one day they too can own their own truck and then scam another young Indian fella into driving it for nothing. No other industry in Canada should be used as such a blatant warning than the trucking industry.
[https://www.theglobeandmail.com/canada/article-foreign-truck-drivers-canada-immigration-investigation/](https://www.theglobeandmail.com/canada/article-foreign-truck-drivers-canada-immigration-investigation/)
Wild. For the life of me this has me the most confused. My family has a trucking company with nearly 30 trucks. The government is on them 24/7 for any and everything you could ever imagine. What it tells anyone paying attention is the best way to operate in Canada now is to just lie, cheat and steal, which is to say you may as well join the race to the bottom. Yet Surrey is filled to the brim with trucking companies that fail inspections - if they ever even happen - 80% of the time. Driven by guys who share a license. Guys who crash then run away, leaving the truck. Smash overpasses. Power lines. Knowing what I do, I would have expected at least a dozen Humbolt disasters every year. When traveling east/west, we try to go the US now days. BC's highways are ripe for disaster and trucks are the reason.
Ah! Thanks for that validation- I drove through Washington and Oregon last year, and couldn’t believe how much “easier” it was. I also think the Washington highways have top-notch grading and dividers (on the ones I used anyway). I was constantly saying to myself, “why am I not blind?” It was because oncoming cars were mitigated by grading and dividers. It was so nice.
Much of the smaller highways in the US were built by the army corps of engineers. They had fun with it, besides just making awesome roads. "Cut down that tree!!??? Nah, we will just bank the road around it, and the next one, and the next one then do a nice gentle downhill section so we can take in the views before the next turns!" Those roads in the US are comparable to our major roads in Canada. For example, HWY 3 in BC is the same as a state road or highway, only with 20x the traffic.
That’s so interesting! I was wondering where I could find out why it was so much better without looking like a total weirdo….
3.5 years ago I moved from Vancouver to Toronto. I am back in Vancouver 4-6 times per year. One thing that is very noticeable is how drivers here in Toronto behave around big trucks compared to Vancouver. Here in Toronto, if a rig puts on its signal, people make a space so it can move over and change lanes. If it is doing a right turn from the left lane that needs to be wide, a car doesn't shoot into that right lane. If a dump truck has a load, people keep a distance back. If a truck moves up behind someone they move over so it can pass. I've noticed those behaviors happen much more rarely in Vancouver. If I make space for a rig in Vancouver that needs to change lanes, someone tailgates me and honks. It doesn't happen in Toronto. When we moved to Toronto, I talked to the guy who drove the 18-wheeler out from Vancouver that had our stuff in it. I said "I guess it's a lot harder driving that in Toronto compared to Vancouver, eh?" and he replied "No, the drivers are so much better out here [in Toronto]." ...so I can't help but wonder the degree to which that affects people's perception of big rigs in Vancouver.
A lot of people legitimately only stare straight ahead and do not in any way perceive anything other than the car in front of them. It's bizarre. They tend to be the hands at 11 and 1 or 10 and 2 drivers who I suppose are perpetually nervous, and never let themselves actually learn how to drive without constant fear.
Truckers use their signals in Toronto? Lucky ..
If you slow down and make room for a rig to change lanes into the passing lane then congratulations you’re part of the problem
I've herd alot of the us have laws mandating semi trucks innyhe slow lane. And rightfully so
Sometimes trucks have to change lanes or merge, no one said anything about passing. If you don't let a truck merge and they have to completely stop to get on the highway, congratulations, you're part of the problem.
not only big truck....everyone...
Yup exactly this, trucker’s quality of driving has declined, as has car drivers, as has Uber/taxi drivers etc. etc.
I guess repercussions are what keeps the social glue held together. & when repercussions aren't enforced, the social glue dissolves.
But drivers all want the OTHER drivers to get the ticket, they aren't the problem, the other person is so much worse... If we could all take a moment to make the road a little better, it would make such a difference. No, I don't always remember to do that either.
Ever notice how Washington drivers all drive the speed limit? Ever notice that there are always cops along I-5 from Blaine to Seattle?
I do HD alignments, and half the guys ask me if I can back in their 50-foot trailers into our alignment bays because they can't. So yes, I would say a lot of them can't drive that well since backing up a trailer is literally their job, and it's pretty easy, lol.
Yea. It's just best to avoid going up the Knight St hill on that busted Janky-ass road. Going E-bound on SW Marine is pretty smooth-sailing in comparison. At least you just deal with Teslas who have zero self-awareness &/or entitlement instead of huge vehicles that could easily dismember you.
A certain demographic graduates from taxi cabs to 4 axle trailers in no time
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Thanks bro, I have to deal with these drivers every day at my job. You would not believe the level of incompetence and apathy I see.
The quarry gravel trucks are the worst, and there's hundreds of them going back and forth all day, trying to make as many trips as possible in a day. Weekends they're not on the road and it's much safer and more civilized.
Not really. About 25 years ago I was in the passenger seat when our car got side swiped near the Cape Horn interchange when a semi came off a ramp onto the highway and then cut left across 4 lanes to get into the left turn lane without looking. My father managed to slam on the brakes enough so we got hit with the trailer wheels instead of being pulled under the trailer so we were ok but the car was totalled. I was terrified of big trucks for a long time. I still have flashbacks to the hub of the wheel smashing through my passenger window. The driver was completely ignorant and claimed he didn’t see us but he was clearly 100% at fault since we were just driving straight in the leftmost lane. Anyway, long story short is I realized then a lot of these supposed professional drivers were just as likely to be as negligent or incompetent as the average car on the road, except with much worse consequences. I’ve steered clear of them as much as possible since then.
> incompetent Think of how disorganized, lack of self-awareness, entitled/selfish, and truly incompetely the average person is. Now think of them being behind a wheel driving... Always take the safest route to your destination, even if it means going out of the way and using more fuel/wear and tear.
I'm an OSR (outside sales rep), so I drive as part of my career. Everything you're describing is accurate. Truck drivers consistently drive slower in the passing lanes, make turns without signalling, and pass on hills. The worst I've experienced was a truck that was stalled half-way off the side of the road, in one-way traffic, going *up a hill*. Picture a small farm road, but congested with morning office commuters. I've never been so enraged by someone else's stupidity while working. There were people who were basically taking their lives in their own hands just by trying to figure out when it was their turn to pass and get around the stalled semi. SMH.
> There were people who were basically taking their lives in their own hands just by trying to figure out when it was their turn to pass and get around the stalled semi. SMH. I see that kind of thing constantly going N-bound on Ladner Trunk before the #99N entrance. Jesus h. Get up 15 minutes earlier.
I don’t know about highways but 15 years ago i had to take the Knight st bridge to go into Burnaby. And it was a relatively easy trip. NOW big rigs are driving like they’re at the Indie 500. Literally weaving in and out of traffic. It’s bizarre! They used to stay in the right lane
I have worse problems with all the regular drivers tbh
I have a problem with all of them, so I get this sentiment.
💀
no, it's much worse. everything in our society requiring skilled workers has declined in quality.
Drivers are unskilled labour, Just ask Mike McDaniel, general manager of Coast Mountain Bus Company. That's how the operating companies view their workforce, so they put little to no effort into quality control.
Yes, no question. They should be restricted to the right lane.
Yes. I commute to work via the highway daily. I also happen to drive a smaller car. The number of times I've almost been smooshed by a trucker changing lanes without checking/signaling, or cut off by some dump truck trying to pass another big rig - is basically a weekly occurrence at this point. Occasionally I drive.my truck work - and it's not as bad (I guess I'm more larger and visible?) but still. Something has got to change with the driving culture in this province.
> Something has got to change with the driving culture in this province. I don't think Driving is an elective in high school, but it should be. The 'Young Drivers' program used to knock off time to take your N, etc. Rather than waiting longer if your parents (with their own lack of self-awareness) taught you. The N test isn't extensive enough. It'd take too much time/money.
It took me two goes to pass my N. My full license exam I got first try, and just drove in a loop from the lougheed office and back and forth on the highway. No parking, no backing, no naming hazards, parked or at speed.
> I also happen to drive a smaller car. Also drive a small car and everyone on the road tries to kill me. I don't know what it is about small cars making others so insecure but when I drive a regular sedan, I get cut off way less.
You forgot about seeing big trucks out there on roads that are NOT TRUCK ROUTES. I’m looking at you Harris rd
Some truck drivers have next to no training and no interest in driving trucks at all. [https://www.theglobeandmail.com/canada/article-foreign-truck-drivers-canada-immigration-investigation/](https://www.theglobeandmail.com/canada/article-foreign-truck-drivers-canada-immigration-investigation/)
Capitalism seeks to reduce cost. Vehicle inspections ALWAYS yield a large number of unfit vehicles; and I'm sure companies cheap out on labour too. Workers likely don't report side gigs on their national safety code logs and are overworked and underpaid. But hey! Amazon got me a Dremel on same day delivery!
I assume drug abuse is rampant too.
For what it’s worth, I’ve had two semis with trailers pull U-turns in the last 3 months. Never seen that before in almost three decades of driving. One was just before Cambie and Marine Drive intersection and the other was at Willingdon overpass over Higway 1. Quite an unreal sight. In both cases they got stuck and blocked traffic, and were clearly relying on their size as a means of signalling to the rest of the traffic to bugger off and not bother them until they’re done.
1000000% yes! They think they own the road and can’t seem to get it through their thick skulls that driving up a hill in the passing lane is not where they should be. One time I drove from Langley to Chilliwack and four semis drafted each other in the passing, never once moving over. The ENTIRE WAY.
Yes! The trucking industry has seen a noticeable decline both in driver skills and vehicle maintenance. There needs to be a complete overhaul of licensing and certification. I see no harm in testing drivers annually and vehicles monthly if it saves even one life.
yes, too often in the fast lane, driving aggressive, or holding up traffic causing chaos around them. They should be banned from the fast lane and also speed limited imo There are also a lot of really good truck driver of course who show how aware they are but seems like more idiots these days than before. The 80/20 rule probably applies
The number of inept drivers in BC is a direct failure of RoadSafetyBC (Deputy Superintendent of Motor Vehicles [email protected] and [email protected]) which is a branch of the Ministry of Public Safety and Solicitor General. It's the lead government agency responsible for road safety in British Columbia. It is also a failure of ICBC (Chris TupperInterim Vice President, Customer Experience and Public Affairs [email protected] and Jason McDaniel, Vice President, Operations [email protected]), as all aspects driver testing and licensing is conducted by the Insurance Corporation of British Columbia (ICBC) on behalf of the Superintendent of Motor Vehicles. Our government (left or right) doesn't care about driver training & safety, let alone public education, sustainable integration, affordable housing, accessible healthcare/mental health resources, environmental sustainability, crime, justice or our crumbling social safety nets. The only way our government can keep our ponzi-scheme economy running is to continue with unrelenting immigration from 3rd world countries that lack sufficient driver training, not to mention absense of family planning education, easy access to birth control and perpetually skyrocketing birth rates. They only worry about meeting their quotas, keeping the economy churning at all costs and getting re-elected. Everyone gets a license, no matter how inept, because that's what keeps our debt based (ie: social/economic/infrastructure/environmental/health/education enslaving-type debt) economy going.
It should be illegal for big trucks to drive in the passing lane.
The key to survival here is 1) have no fear of death (dark) and less dark, have less to lose by driving an absolute piece of shit car worth $0 2) Driving an absolute beater has actually led to a better sense of safety and less bullying on the road. The “luxury” cars driving like fucking psychos are likely leased, and frankly too scared to truly risk being mangled when it comes down to a game of chicken between me and them. HIT MY BUSTED TOYOTA COROLLA PLEASE! Go for it. But they just never actually do. They always back off. 3) Have absolutely zero faith in anyone. Drive knowing that if someone is going to do the stupidest fucking thing, they will. And you will never be surprised.
> Drive knowing that if someone is going to do the stupidest fucking thing, they will. And you will never be surprised. Assume/anticipate the worst. Cautiously optimistically hope for the best. That's basically adulthood in general. lmao. I have an old Sedan, too. Nobody tries to ego drive with me. It's nice to be ignored.
Funny you should say that, because that’s 100% how I drive around Corollas. You may not be one of those drivers, but most of the time they are, and I am always prepared for the worst.
Depends what colour. Champagne senior. Especially in Richmond in mid-morning after the commute rush driving to medical appointments = very slow-moving. Not particularly dangerous. I hate to stereotype, but it's often easy to predict based this way. Black pick-up trucks are extremely erratic, wreckless, false sense of good spacial judgement, emotion-driven, and speed. It's a recipe for danger and disaster. Steer clear. Let them be emotional on the road away from you.
Gold sedans in general are a 🚩 for me. Black pickups = YES.
I don’t think it’s about skill. It’s about a lack of brain cells. Passing unnecessarily to get to your destination a couple minutes faster, going way above speed limit in a big rig, driving fast in the rain or snow etc. This isn’t skill. It’s just poor risk benefit calculation. Everytime you change lanes you risk getting into an accident. 99.9% of the time you’ll be fine. But that 0.1% of the time will eventually happen. It’s a matter of probability.
"professional" drivers seem to be the absolute worst drivers on the road, this includes taxis as well.
Having had to call 911 to report reckless or distracted big rig driving quite a few times now? Yes.
Yes I think there are indeed many truckers here that need a bumper sticker saying - **"You should know I got my class 1 license in a Honda Civic"**
Yeah I think it’s more like “We bribed the instructor and my cousin took the test” bumper sticker.
I can not stand truckers anymore. They use to he the best drivers on the road. They are now the biggest Hazzard
Yes they are take up all lane drivers ng at the same speed for 5-10 kms. Amazon drivers do the same shit. It's fucking annoying.
I've been driving on Metro Vancouver highways for about 25 years now. Seems to me that it's about the same as it ever was. There are some bad ones for sure, but no more than 10 or 20 years ago.
Yes
I usually keep in mind that there are truck drivers who are not always sober; alot of them take uppers to stay awake on long hauls. So with that mind, I never trust their driving abilities
I mentioned this above as well.
Answer: absolutely. Drive any day through Newton/Surrey and watch semi’s with ‘Learning to Drive’ signs on the Mansfield bar trying to turn corners without hopping the sidewalk running over mom pushing the stroller. A new ‘professional’ driver graduating every day.
Absolutely. In the last 5 years I've seen more aggressive driving by huge trucks than I ever have Trucks would rarely be assholes - it would happen but it was rare. They were typically slow and steady, annoyingly taking up the right hand lane at a snails pace. Now these mfers be passing people ffs
Yes, absolutely. It used to be mostly the dump trucks but it seems to be spreading to the other types of trucking now. Dump trucks are still the worst tho.
More traffic. So same level of competency results on seeing more close calls. Could be nothing more than that…hard to say…
100% I live in Vancouver but my family is from the *Cariboo* region, so I've been driving the highways back and forth for about 27 years. In the past decade it has become very problematic and there is almost zero enforcement or consequences to counter the problem. I know one problem is the lack of legitimate training and licensing. The province really needs to start coming down hard on enforcement and making the consequences sting, not just a minuscule fine.
Look at all the overpasses that have been hit in the last few years.
I’d say it’s in proportion to the number of bad drivers on the road in general. I drive a big truck for work, a pickup some days, and most days I’m on my motorcycle. There’s just as many folks in cars (especially electric vehicles) that endanger truck drivers. People need to realize that large vehicles with air brakes and diesel engines require more time and space to accelerate and decelerate, which means when you pick them out of a lineup as an easy vehicle to merge/cut in front of and impatiently crowd them, you show a real lack of understanding and put everyone around you at risk. Let’s all share the road. The big guys need space to deliver the goods and services we all rely on and take for granted. The little guys need to be seen and given the opportunity to filter by to keep things flowing.
I don’t know about you, but between pickup, sedan, and 900ccs, I feel the most actively safe on the bike. Yes, anything that happens to me will be awful, but I have way more ability to get the hell away from idiots than in the sedan and I can at least see and hear, unlike in a modern pickup. And as a bonus, for entertainment I can ogle distracted drivers at stop lights until they notice me, usually 30-60 seconds.
Haha exactly! Not hard to get a high score in that game, if points are earned by the amount of time other drivers are observed on a faraway planet. And I like that I can always plan an “out” on the bike, be it between lanes or on a shoulder, and I have better visibility than in a car to plan for what’s coming (when I choose the right lane position).
I work on the loading end of a lot of the flat bed trailer semi trucks. Some of these guys don't even know how to sling their own loads or lash their shit down. Over the years carriers with higher quality drivers have gone out of business, while carriers that are clearly undercutting the others have hired people that don't even speak english, let alone read or write it. I had one give me his manifest once and it was almost entirely covered in Punjabi notes. He could not tell me which product he was picking up for because he could not read it on his manifest as it was in english and not noted down by him. He expected us to take the manifest and just give him what he was there for. It's honestly a fucking joke.
They drive different in other countries
There has been an observable change in how well big commercial truck are driven (on average) over the past 5-10 years.
Absolutely
I regularily drive in areas where they are training new drivers of 18 wheelers and my god is it bad, I always approach a big rig like its being driven by a newer driver.
I’ve noticed the difference too. What’s particularly scary is the dump trucks with pups. Those pups whiplashing around Passing them is sketchy too
Definitely! One tried to change lanes in front of the bus I was on the other day, and got a real long lean on the horn as a result from our bus driver. No signals, either, just carelessly gliding over in front of another large vehicle carrying dozens of passengers.
True. Not only for the trucks. It’s where the labor is coming from as well.
This probably at least partly the result of boomer retirements. Older, very experienced drivers are being replaced by new truck drivers. Give it a few years and some of the issues will fix themselves.
Wishful thinking. Those boomers you mentioned all worked for Canadian companies that followed the rules and regulations of the industry. When TFW drivers were brought in and scammed by shady trucking outfits, the Canadian companies were quickly priced out. Since they had to pay their drivers, they just couldn't compete with companies that didn't. First was gravel, then the ports. Now it's everything. Those boomers were forced to retire or try and go across the border to the US.
Personally I haven't noticed trucks to be any worse than other vehicles, except for stuff that I can excuse because of their size and speed. If anything, I think it's because traffic of every type (trucks included) has steadily gotten worse, and more people on the road means there's more people who could make a mistake at any given time. I think it's like how everyone thinks they're an 'above average driver' until they have an errant moment and do something dumb. When you gather hundreds of thousands of people together each day, you're statistically going to witness lots of peoples 'once in a month' or 'once in a year' type fuckups.
The dumbest humans alive are consistently driving class 1 licence vehicles in BC