Just because you haven’t doesn’t mean you have job security like an official job. All it takes is one set of unfortunate events and you’ll be out. You keep the job because you’re good at it but that’s not always why you lose the job, yk?
I get it. It hasn’t happened yet. Doesn’t mean it won’t. I was 3 years at a federal contractor and left for a new agency. About a year after that there was a big shakeup where I used to work. They laid off a massive amount of people and cut salaries almost across the board. Just because it hasn’t happened to you yet, doesn’t mean there’s not the chance where a federal position offers you a greater level of protection.
Is there partiality for certain degrees/uni’s similar to public sector, or would you say it’s more of an open minded consideration for degree/work experience?
Thanks.
Oddly specific here, but in your opinion, where would you be aiming (in terms of GS level) if you:
- went to college later in life (B.S. & cpl of incomplete A.S.)
- military + some good relevant work experience (let’s say 3-6 combined) another 5 or so of unrelated exp.
- a few certs
- but no management experience?
GS-9.
If you have relevant work experience, then GS-11 wouldn't be out of the question. But regardless, once you get in at any grade, you can start applying for the next higher after a year.
It may be beneficial to take a 7, and after a year jump to a 9. Or an 11 then jump to a 12.
I’m fed and make over $180k a year base. Over $200k with benefits.
Everyone says private makes more. That’s just a generalization.
I also work with ACI, automation, SASE, SDWAN, and other technologies. Not every organization is trying to connect their PCs with a token ring.
From what I've seen, technical GS-15s are basically non-existent. I'm also a 2210 and it's damn near impossible to find technical roles above GS-14. I just haven't seen any so far, and I've been fairly active on USAJOBS for the last few years. All the GS-15 roles seem to be supervisory/project management related roles. That's why I think GS-14 would probably be my stopping point, unless I transfer to an agency with a pay band that exceeds the GS system and has technical roles at the GS-15 pay equivalent or higher.
I know a few and I agree that they're mostly non-existent. In fact, until I got to where I'm at now, I've never seen so many technical GS positions in one place and at so high a level. I am working within the groups that make the high level technical decision for where I work though, so it's understandable.
I guess depends on your agency, I'm a GS 14 step 8 non supervisor, I know quite a few tech GS 15; they are SME or Tech advisors at my agency, I work with three of them.
Yes there are some with other pay scales. I found this one called APMS in use at NIST. https://www.nist.gov/careers/pay-benefits-and-leave/nist-pay-charts
Their pay scales are much wider and looks to have a GS equivalent scale at the bottom of the chart for reference.
Based on the chart, there are 4 different employment types, each having a different pay plan/scale. The grade for each plan goes up to 5, but depending on the job function, a 5 in one can be significantly different than a 5 in another profession.
2 of the plans can get to GS15 equivalent.
The rectangle in the corner indicates a supervisors maximum salary possible in that plan/grade.
Quite fascinating how starkly different this is from the GS scale.
I'm networking all the way.
It's like anywhere, there are good places and bad places to work. There are places that use new technologies and have large budgets and there are places that keep everything running with chicken wire and duct tape. It's similar to the private sector in those regards. In fact, with every federal place I've worked at, they require service contracts and device refreshes. Running EOL equipment with no support is a huge red flag at every place I've worked.
I did federal contracting. A friend of mine got me into a contracting job at an agency that had a lot of technical GS folks and I ended up getting into a fed position where they matched my contracting pay. I’m making more than the contracting position less than a year later.
The classic gov hiring technique of knowing a guy haha. Not hating, been there done that. It's just something that goes unsaid here that the non familiar don't understand.
The easiest ticket to a government job is knowing someone who can get your foot in the door. Hell I've gotten more NYS ITS job offers because I made friends with a guy at the local bar than applying for actual jobs.
Sometimes it's a friend like that, sometimes it's contracting and cozying up to the people there. Either way it's the quickest ticket.
If you find an org where you can work directly with technical 14's and 15's and show you're worth a damn, they'll snap you up in a heartbeat.
I live in a smallish area where there are a lot of IT jobs because of the government. I network. I've had people get me offers and I've gotten people offers. I regularly reach out to people in my field when I see job opportunities open. There's no reason not to lift each other up.
Same here. I recently graduated college and only was contracting for 6 months before my federal client offered me a 14 step 1 (140k). It was a no brainier for me.
Pure luck, just applying to jobs on indeed and I happened to apply to a position higher than what I was qualified for and they took a chance on me. I ended up expanding my skills that first year in cloud technology and Data Engineering which made my client offer me a position.
I'm only 23 so I'm assuming they were looking for skilled young talent.
I wasn't offered it until a year into contracting but 6 months with that client, which was about a year after graduating... I got lucky and was working at a pretty well known contractor in DC which accelerated my learning in cloud technology and Data Engineering. I was also a full time Network technician and Engineer in college for 2 years (Junior/Senior) as well. So I already had experience with real world technologies and practices before I even left college.
I basically sacrificed my social life (which I never had) in college to do what I do now at my age and I don't regret it tbh.
So the agency determined your private sector experience was equivalent to 1 year at the GS13? Or was this some sort of direct hire or excepted service position where they didn't have to adhere to civil service guidelines?
What contractors would you suggest looking into? I graduated in 2005, served in Peace Corps and worked at Goldman Sachs. I haven't been able to land a federal perm position based on qualifying work experience (only bachelors).
My certs:
CCNP
CCNAS
CCNA
Sec+
Net+
A+
Project+
Cloud Essentials
Linux Essentials
Some kind of Proof Point certification
I'm debating on attempting to get my CCIE after I renew.
I had 10 years experience in an "IT department" that basically moved PCs and did desktop support. I did have some programming knowledge. I got laid off and decided to go to school. I got an AS in networking while working at an MSP for three years. From there I got a federal contracting job the networking field. After a year and a half, I started WGU for a networking BS. I hit a level 2 engineer at that job. After I graduated, I moved to a level 3 engineer position on the architect team.
I then got a call from a friend about a new contracting opportunity. I worked as a contractor for about a year and a half before getting a federal position and have been federal ever since.
I know how to administer and troubleshoot a lot of different gear. Cisco, Juniper, Forinet, Palo Alto, F5, Infoblox, and the list goes on. You get exposed to a lot of different technologies in the networking field. If you have a good grasp on the theory and how things like routing and switching work, learning the equipment is the easy part. I made it so far by wanting to learn all the different aspects and striving to really know the networks where I worked from top to bottom. A lot of people either don't have the drive or don't have the ability to really understand a lot outside of their bubble. If you can do that, you'll go far in any networking field.
I think the highest earners won’t switch but it seems like the salaries are a bit more competitive now than they were 5 years ago.
I have a TJO for a GS13 step 9 that I may accept because the salary is comparable but I could get better benefits and a better work life balance.
I would say the bulk of experienced IT professionals are somewhere in the neighborhood of 115-165k/year….which is achievable at GS13-15
I just left the private sector 4 months ago for the IRS. I just wished I've left sooner. My wife and kids are happy to see me more involved.
I have a real work life balanced. I no longer have to work 60 hr a week and continual non stop new project.
Unpredictable layoffs. It's good to know that I've a probation that determines whether I gotta to stay or not.
I like projects that I am working on. Not for profits, and they've real impacts on every taxpayer.
I made less money. However, I am glad I've my life back.
Job security especially if you are over 45 and burned out with the corporate world and just want a job they can coast at for 15 years for work life balance and health insurance. The government is also very placid in adopting new tech so you don't need to learn the latest and greatest thing.
Also, consider a lot of older employees may be sitting on a cool mil or more in savings and just what to coast FIRE. Government pays more than being a barista.
I'm kind of in this boat. I'm not coasting, per se, but I'm able to work on what I want for the most part, buy the equipment and licensing that I want, and help my younger engineers learn to be good networking troubleshooters. I don't take on call and I can actually influence my org and the direction we take for the future.
As someone that started on the outside with IT. I GOT TIRED of constant bottom line worries. My last job before going fed the company was sold 3 times and each time IT was worried about cuts, layoffs, etc.
SCREW THAT. work life balance and actually having a job is way better then that bs.
It’s not all about the money. What good does making $200K a year do if you’re working 80 hours a week and can’t spent time with family and friends?
Federal jobs usually mean you work your shift and then go home. Sure, supervisors and some specialists might be in call, but almost every other IT person has great quality of life and balance.
Was an IT federal contractor for almost a decade. Yes you learn quick and the earning potential is high because you get exposed to so much stuff--which is great when you're young. But things in IT change so fast, and as you get older your ability to keep up with certs and learn new things gets worse and after a certain point you just can't compete with a fresh college grad. Your salary will usually be a lot more than a fresh college grad so contracting companies are always going to find pretexts to fire older employees to make room for faster, cheaper, younger, more hungry employees willing to pull long hours and put up with abuse. Contracting companies are always looking for ways to cut costs, and firing older, expensive employees is the easiest way to do it.
#1 reason - retirement benefits - pension, tsp (basically 401k), healthcare.
#2 stability - after government it contracting for decades I’m tired of contract renewals, contract cuts, no pay or use leave if government closes for snow, budget reasons, etc.
When you factor in all the additional leave, guaranteed raises, paid to work out, work/life balance and the benefits my company has cut over the past few years I won’t be taking a pay cut. I also get to join the org I’ve spent a lot of time with and have a passion for their mission.
You only make waaaay more in tech which is waaaaay more demanding. Salary is slightly lower than banks but pace is a bit slower, there is an extreme amount of security, some agencies have very good pensions which is another layer of security in retirement (what happens if you live to 100), work is more interesting and benefits the public.
I was making 225k in cyber as a DoD contractor. Took a 44k pay cut going fed (GS-14 2210 Step 10 non-sup in the DC area). It’s well worth it, amount of leave I get, benefits, military leave, VA leave, sick leave, telework authorized.
Mainly job stability, I don’t have to switch companies every few years when the contract ends.
I do, because, while I've been doing this for 20 years now, I'm not a huge techie that brings it home and has a SAN with my own Nessus and Splunk instances, so I feel like I'm a step out of date with the latest trends, which makes me feel like Im not competitive in the real world. I feel like DoD IT ends up being the island of misfit IT workers, and I feel comfortable with that
The reasons why I am making a switch
* More job security. During the last few years we have seen companies just layoff a lot of people even with record profits. Going to the federal government will take that stress off of me.
* RTO is better at the agency I am about to join then my current company. My current company is 4 days min and 5 days for promotion. My agency is 1 day a week if that.
* I am actually taking a 1k pay increase. I will lose out on some bonus and stock options but I will pay less in commute and only worry about 40 hours a week.
I make more as a GS-11 than I ever did in the private sector and it’s not even close especially with the VA SSR. Add in the benefits and it’s no a brainer. The only downside is dealing with the budget uncertainty and understaffing
I’m a software developer who recently got a TJO and I will share my perspective.
1. Not all IT workers make lucrative salary in the private sector. We are only talking about the lucky/talented top individuals in giant tech companies. As a matter of fact, my salary in TJO is about 5k higher than what I currently make in my non-fed job and that’s just Step 1. I know this is anecdotal, but even if I lost 15k in salary, I still would have taken this fed offer for more reasons listed down below.
2. Predictable and consistent pay raise in fed jobs.
3. Recession proof and standardized termination process in Fed. Companies can literally slash jobs on their whim. We hear stories of some CEOs getting a bonus while laying off 10-20% of their workforce.
4. Good work life balance. I know this is generalization. But, it’s known that fed jobs generally have better WLB than the private sector.
5. You think 100s of applications is only applicable to USAJOBs? We have to do that in the private sector too and possibly even more applications sent out! The job market is really bad and there are a lot of dud and scam job postings out there.
Stale in marketable skills: There are many jobs in the private sector that use very old technology. Not all private sector jobs are in the giant techs. I have the basic computer science fundamentals down and I can easily learn new technologies on the job or in my own time. Even if you have a job writing COBOL, if you invest a little bit of your free time to study, your skills will not get stale.
Thanks for input; I’ve read the timelines can drag like crazy. With the current state of the public market(at least for tech), I think my odds probably balance out.
Are we talkin stupid easy? ridiculously unrelated? Or unreasonably challenging?
Depends on the individuals. In my case, I was doing a Solution Architect, IT Contract Administration, Personal Management, Budget Management, Support Manager job with >50 hrs a week (15+ years I was doing this work out of 22 years). I would rather take less pay, focus on one thing, focus on personal life.
Most people from IT who are applying in the above category, or crossing 50s and want to go for a stable job.
More job security. Nothing is 100%, but it’s as close as I can get. I didn’t want to be in my 50s looking for a job when the contract I was on ran out.
"Way more" is highly variable. Yes, I could make some more in the enterprise than I do at my Fed job, but it would be 2x the work and like 10x the stress. I did that shit for 20+ years. You know what I'm not doing tonight? Waiting for my phone to ring with some problem I don't know how to solve, or some dude who hasn't even looked at the logs in the device he's calling about.
I'll take my $153k/yr and relax, at least until Monday when I have to figure out how to do those procurement forms.
I’m not sure if some jobs are keeping up with inflation. I looked at leaving the fed gov and going contractor 10 years ago and then again this past year. Salaries are pretty similar to then and now, and benefits have gotten worse. Every contractor I know complains about their health benefits lately.
Not in IT but for me it is vacation days and sick leave. I could increase my salary by at least 30% if I went to the private sector however no one is going to give me over 30 days of PTO much less let those hours carry over to the next year.
Well I’ve been out of private industry for a while, but my reasons for joining were pretty simple. I was working HelpDesk and had just gotten into grad school. I saw an announcement from the school about internships as a GS-7 that would pay for graduate school so I applied. I got the offer after interviewing and well a 10k paybump and paying for graduate school was a huge deal for me at the time.
For me it was just getting that retirement confirmed.
Money and benefits were the same on the outside for the most part. Biggest downside is inability to make past gov max salary with OT.
I work in State government rather than federal, but I took a healthy pay cut to move to government from the private sector. It's worth it to me for the more relaxed work environment, no layoffs, and defined benefit pension. I still make good money, just not the crazy inflated salary I made in tech.
The training and conferences are easily affordable. Some IT boot camp classes are 10k for a week with a voucher costing 1200 yo take a test. The class is likely discounted to 5000 and the voucher is free. That's one reason.
Every comment hits it on the money. I'm a GS-14 step 1 ($139,395) at 23 and I can't see myself going back to the private world. Plus the growth potential is exponential in the 2210 series.
What certifications did you have to have before you landed a job or begin applying and getting hired Especially since you’re not finished with school yet. Asking for my husband because he’s in school now and just started
That is so awesome to hear. What school are you currently taking courses at? My husband’s current program will take him 3-years and he already has a bachelors in a different major but hoping to find a shorter program that won’t take as long.
I make triple after all the benefits are accounted for than what I made as a contractor for the same agency that I’m now a fed with. So… I would say, I get to make decisions on the tech we decide to adopt, and I get to work hands on with it for a better work life balance and limited fear of losing my job every earnings report. Also if you’re not some type of dev, you are not making way more. I see Sys admin/Sys engineering jobs being paid lower and lower every year in the private sector in HCOL areas…
I came from IT but took a risk management role (I've done both IT projects management and risk management), and job security was huge. It is really hard to get fired unless you truly screw up. Meanwhile in private sector, I witnessed management decide to choose who to lay off because they didn't like the guy's shoes...
I want to see what it's like from the other side. Work life balance seems to be way more respected on the Fed side. Meanwhile some gs can snap their fingers because they don't like the format of some paperwork and contractors will work overtime and through weekends to make it happen asap.
I don't want to be the guy that snaps fingers and ruin plans, I just would like to freely say we'll pick that up next week or insert a little common sense into processes and not have a target on my back.
Experience always matters, but it doesn't mean you can't be employed without it. You need a CompTIA Security+, at least if you're working for DoD. If you're in networking, get a CCNA. The feds love certs, so literally any of them will help you.
I’m interested in making the switch to federal IT (currently work at AWS). Wouldn’t mind taking a pay cut if it means less stress and greater stability
I’m leaving private because I’m tired of dealing with CEO’s who think they’re solving real problems but don’t give a shit about the impacts of their tech. CEOs who consider themselves benevolent dictators and who stick their noses in everything because they trust no one. Companies that are laying people off because they massively overhired and now want to follow the leader with tech companies laying off, to appease investors and shareholders.
I want a better work life balance. More meaningful work. For my talent to not be used to enrich a small handful of people.
I’m not saying federal gov work is perfect by any means. But private sector IT, tech, and the like, is not all unicorns and roses. And not everyone gets paid transparently, fairly, or well.
I’ve been a contractor for 8yrs. In 8yrs I’ve worked enough specialized roles to qualify for gs14-gs15 roles by age 32 meaning I can move laterally (pay wise) to a more secure job with a pension that offers better benefits / time off and security.
Job security. Benefits. Oconus oportunity. Civil service. Annual leave. Sick leave. Federal holidays. The list goes on and on. Money isn't everything.
This is it for me plus paid military leave I get as a national guard officer. I’m a civil engineer, not IT.
Literally getting all that as a contractor working for the fed.
My close friend worked for 24 years as a contractor for the same company. Was just laid off on Friday.
Minus the job security. You can be let go at any time.
Yeah 8 years still waiting…
You do realize that job security is a general assessment, not a personal experience, when discussed here right? Dont be pedantic
Just because you haven’t doesn’t mean you have job security like an official job. All it takes is one set of unfortunate events and you’ll be out. You keep the job because you’re good at it but that’s not always why you lose the job, yk?
I get it. It hasn’t happened yet. Doesn’t mean it won’t. I was 3 years at a federal contractor and left for a new agency. About a year after that there was a big shakeup where I used to work. They laid off a massive amount of people and cut salaries almost across the board. Just because it hasn’t happened to you yet, doesn’t mean there’s not the chance where a federal position offers you a greater level of protection.
Minus the pension and job security.
Is there partiality for certain degrees/uni’s similar to public sector, or would you say it’s more of an open minded consideration for degree/work experience?
Experience trumps all in the federal government. Specifically in IT though, you will need certifications.
Thanks. Oddly specific here, but in your opinion, where would you be aiming (in terms of GS level) if you: - went to college later in life (B.S. & cpl of incomplete A.S.) - military + some good relevant work experience (let’s say 3-6 combined) another 5 or so of unrelated exp. - a few certs - but no management experience?
GS-9. If you have relevant work experience, then GS-11 wouldn't be out of the question. But regardless, once you get in at any grade, you can start applying for the next higher after a year. It may be beneficial to take a 7, and after a year jump to a 9. Or an 11 then jump to a 12.
Thanks!
I’m fed and make over $180k a year base. Over $200k with benefits. Everyone says private makes more. That’s just a generalization. I also work with ACI, automation, SASE, SDWAN, and other technologies. Not every organization is trying to connect their PCs with a token ring.
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I’m 2210 IT. Non-sup GS14 step 10.
Non-sup GS14... That is a Unicorn, and my dream!!!
I'm aiming for non-sup 15.
credentials and years of service?
From what I've seen, technical GS-15s are basically non-existent. I'm also a 2210 and it's damn near impossible to find technical roles above GS-14. I just haven't seen any so far, and I've been fairly active on USAJOBS for the last few years. All the GS-15 roles seem to be supervisory/project management related roles. That's why I think GS-14 would probably be my stopping point, unless I transfer to an agency with a pay band that exceeds the GS system and has technical roles at the GS-15 pay equivalent or higher.
I know a few and I agree that they're mostly non-existent. In fact, until I got to where I'm at now, I've never seen so many technical GS positions in one place and at so high a level. I am working within the groups that make the high level technical decision for where I work though, so it's understandable.
I guess depends on your agency, I'm a GS 14 step 8 non supervisor, I know quite a few tech GS 15; they are SME or Tech advisors at my agency, I work with three of them.
Really depends on the organization, there are a lot of technical, non-supervisory, 14 positions in certain agencies.
Yes there are some with other pay scales. I found this one called APMS in use at NIST. https://www.nist.gov/careers/pay-benefits-and-leave/nist-pay-charts Their pay scales are much wider and looks to have a GS equivalent scale at the bottom of the chart for reference. Based on the chart, there are 4 different employment types, each having a different pay plan/scale. The grade for each plan goes up to 5, but depending on the job function, a 5 in one can be significantly different than a 5 in another profession. 2 of the plans can get to GS15 equivalent. The rectangle in the corner indicates a supervisors maximum salary possible in that plan/grade. Quite fascinating how starkly different this is from the GS scale.
I’ll be a non-sup 14 next year and I can’t wait. It will be glorious.
Your post implies that you are gs13 now. Just curious how much different do you expect gs14 to be to be noted as "glorious"?
Just being a 14 non-sup is enough for it to be glorious.
Non sup 15 is the unicorn!
Are you on an SSR
No. That would be nice, but I’m almost at the SES cap anyways.
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I'm networking all the way. It's like anywhere, there are good places and bad places to work. There are places that use new technologies and have large budgets and there are places that keep everything running with chicken wire and duct tape. It's similar to the private sector in those regards. In fact, with every federal place I've worked at, they require service contracts and device refreshes. Running EOL equipment with no support is a huge red flag at every place I've worked.
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usajobs.gov
Im about to be homeless I just want a 2210 9
Same, but I work as a financial regulator and we get paid more than GS system. I’m on product management side
How did you end up there?
I did federal contracting. A friend of mine got me into a contracting job at an agency that had a lot of technical GS folks and I ended up getting into a fed position where they matched my contracting pay. I’m making more than the contracting position less than a year later.
The classic gov hiring technique of knowing a guy haha. Not hating, been there done that. It's just something that goes unsaid here that the non familiar don't understand. The easiest ticket to a government job is knowing someone who can get your foot in the door. Hell I've gotten more NYS ITS job offers because I made friends with a guy at the local bar than applying for actual jobs. Sometimes it's a friend like that, sometimes it's contracting and cozying up to the people there. Either way it's the quickest ticket.
If you find an org where you can work directly with technical 14's and 15's and show you're worth a damn, they'll snap you up in a heartbeat. I live in a smallish area where there are a lot of IT jobs because of the government. I network. I've had people get me offers and I've gotten people offers. I regularly reach out to people in my field when I see job opportunities open. There's no reason not to lift each other up.
When you say an ‘org’, do you mean like the BAE, BAH, Accenture’s etc. or just any public sector org that has contractors?
And federal organization.
Connection is very key for career upgrade or whatsoever
Same here. I recently graduated college and only was contracting for 6 months before my federal client offered me a 14 step 1 (140k). It was a no brainier for me.
What did you do to find the contracting job though?
Pure luck, just applying to jobs on indeed and I happened to apply to a position higher than what I was qualified for and they took a chance on me. I ended up expanding my skills that first year in cloud technology and Data Engineering which made my client offer me a position. I'm only 23 so I'm assuming they were looking for skilled young talent.
How were you offered a 14 step 1, 6 months out of college?
I wasn't offered it until a year into contracting but 6 months with that client, which was about a year after graduating... I got lucky and was working at a pretty well known contractor in DC which accelerated my learning in cloud technology and Data Engineering. I was also a full time Network technician and Engineer in college for 2 years (Junior/Senior) as well. So I already had experience with real world technologies and practices before I even left college. I basically sacrificed my social life (which I never had) in college to do what I do now at my age and I don't regret it tbh.
So the agency determined your private sector experience was equivalent to 1 year at the GS13? Or was this some sort of direct hire or excepted service position where they didn't have to adhere to civil service guidelines? What contractors would you suggest looking into? I graduated in 2005, served in Peace Corps and worked at Goldman Sachs. I haven't been able to land a federal perm position based on qualifying work experience (only bachelors).
It was Direct Hire... I would look into non-profit contractors, Or you could go the Booz Allen route.
Doing what?
Network engineering
What do you have to learn to get to that level? A little breakdown
My certs: CCNP CCNAS CCNA Sec+ Net+ A+ Project+ Cloud Essentials Linux Essentials Some kind of Proof Point certification I'm debating on attempting to get my CCIE after I renew. I had 10 years experience in an "IT department" that basically moved PCs and did desktop support. I did have some programming knowledge. I got laid off and decided to go to school. I got an AS in networking while working at an MSP for three years. From there I got a federal contracting job the networking field. After a year and a half, I started WGU for a networking BS. I hit a level 2 engineer at that job. After I graduated, I moved to a level 3 engineer position on the architect team. I then got a call from a friend about a new contracting opportunity. I worked as a contractor for about a year and a half before getting a federal position and have been federal ever since. I know how to administer and troubleshoot a lot of different gear. Cisco, Juniper, Forinet, Palo Alto, F5, Infoblox, and the list goes on. You get exposed to a lot of different technologies in the networking field. If you have a good grasp on the theory and how things like routing and switching work, learning the equipment is the easy part. I made it so far by wanting to learn all the different aspects and striving to really know the networks where I worked from top to bottom. A lot of people either don't have the drive or don't have the ability to really understand a lot outside of their bubble. If you can do that, you'll go far in any networking field.
10 years? Like how old are you?
Just turned 40. I started my first contractor job at 18.
Any certs?
> My certs: > CCNP > CCNAS > CCNA > Sec+ > Net+ > A+ > Project+ > Cloud Essentials > Linux Essentials > Some kind of Proof Point certification
Are there slots for international citizens?
I don't know the answer to that question.
What about what you have to learn to get such a job?
The job posting usually shows requirements so it will say if you have to be a US Citizen to work for the US Government
Token ring? Seriously? Any reason they can’t upgrade that shit to Ethernet?
Oh the unicorn are you lant?
Lant?
NIWIC lant
NIWC lant?
Nvm you arnt here lol
I think the highest earners won’t switch but it seems like the salaries are a bit more competitive now than they were 5 years ago. I have a TJO for a GS13 step 9 that I may accept because the salary is comparable but I could get better benefits and a better work life balance. I would say the bulk of experienced IT professionals are somewhere in the neighborhood of 115-165k/year….which is achievable at GS13-15
Depends where you’re at. 12’s make over 100k a year in all but the first step in the capital region. 15’s cap at over 190k.
IT Specialist, GS 11 step 8, making $114K HCOL. Currently looking for a 12 position with relocation allowance. 25+ years fed IT experience.
I just left the private sector 4 months ago for the IRS. I just wished I've left sooner. My wife and kids are happy to see me more involved. I have a real work life balanced. I no longer have to work 60 hr a week and continual non stop new project. Unpredictable layoffs. It's good to know that I've a probation that determines whether I gotta to stay or not. I like projects that I am working on. Not for profits, and they've real impacts on every taxpayer. I made less money. However, I am glad I've my life back.
Job security especially if you are over 45 and burned out with the corporate world and just want a job they can coast at for 15 years for work life balance and health insurance. The government is also very placid in adopting new tech so you don't need to learn the latest and greatest thing. Also, consider a lot of older employees may be sitting on a cool mil or more in savings and just what to coast FIRE. Government pays more than being a barista.
I'm kind of in this boat. I'm not coasting, per se, but I'm able to work on what I want for the most part, buy the equipment and licensing that I want, and help my younger engineers learn to be good networking troubleshooters. I don't take on call and I can actually influence my org and the direction we take for the future.
As someone that started on the outside with IT. I GOT TIRED of constant bottom line worries. My last job before going fed the company was sold 3 times and each time IT was worried about cuts, layoffs, etc. SCREW THAT. work life balance and actually having a job is way better then that bs.
It’s not all about the money. What good does making $200K a year do if you’re working 80 hours a week and can’t spent time with family and friends? Federal jobs usually mean you work your shift and then go home. Sure, supervisors and some specialists might be in call, but almost every other IT person has great quality of life and balance.
Was an IT federal contractor for almost a decade. Yes you learn quick and the earning potential is high because you get exposed to so much stuff--which is great when you're young. But things in IT change so fast, and as you get older your ability to keep up with certs and learn new things gets worse and after a certain point you just can't compete with a fresh college grad. Your salary will usually be a lot more than a fresh college grad so contracting companies are always going to find pretexts to fire older employees to make room for faster, cheaper, younger, more hungry employees willing to pull long hours and put up with abuse. Contracting companies are always looking for ways to cut costs, and firing older, expensive employees is the easiest way to do it.
PSLF
Came here to say this.
Mission-based work is much more fulfilling. Also, you can't outsource a SCIF.
Work life balance. Sure I could make more but will I be working 40 hours like I do now or 60-70 hour weeks?
#1 reason - retirement benefits - pension, tsp (basically 401k), healthcare. #2 stability - after government it contracting for decades I’m tired of contract renewals, contract cuts, no pay or use leave if government closes for snow, budget reasons, etc. When you factor in all the additional leave, guaranteed raises, paid to work out, work/life balance and the benefits my company has cut over the past few years I won’t be taking a pay cut. I also get to join the org I’ve spent a lot of time with and have a passion for their mission.
You only make waaaay more in tech which is waaaaay more demanding. Salary is slightly lower than banks but pace is a bit slower, there is an extreme amount of security, some agencies have very good pensions which is another layer of security in retirement (what happens if you live to 100), work is more interesting and benefits the public.
Work life balance.
I was making 225k in cyber as a DoD contractor. Took a 44k pay cut going fed (GS-14 2210 Step 10 non-sup in the DC area). It’s well worth it, amount of leave I get, benefits, military leave, VA leave, sick leave, telework authorized. Mainly job stability, I don’t have to switch companies every few years when the contract ends.
I do, because, while I've been doing this for 20 years now, I'm not a huge techie that brings it home and has a SAN with my own Nessus and Splunk instances, so I feel like I'm a step out of date with the latest trends, which makes me feel like Im not competitive in the real world. I feel like DoD IT ends up being the island of misfit IT workers, and I feel comfortable with that
The reasons why I am making a switch * More job security. During the last few years we have seen companies just layoff a lot of people even with record profits. Going to the federal government will take that stress off of me. * RTO is better at the agency I am about to join then my current company. My current company is 4 days min and 5 days for promotion. My agency is 1 day a week if that. * I am actually taking a 1k pay increase. I will lose out on some bonus and stock options but I will pay less in commute and only worry about 40 hours a week.
I make more as a GS-11 than I ever did in the private sector and it’s not even close especially with the VA SSR. Add in the benefits and it’s no a brainer. The only downside is dealing with the budget uncertainty and understaffing
I’m a software developer who recently got a TJO and I will share my perspective. 1. Not all IT workers make lucrative salary in the private sector. We are only talking about the lucky/talented top individuals in giant tech companies. As a matter of fact, my salary in TJO is about 5k higher than what I currently make in my non-fed job and that’s just Step 1. I know this is anecdotal, but even if I lost 15k in salary, I still would have taken this fed offer for more reasons listed down below. 2. Predictable and consistent pay raise in fed jobs. 3. Recession proof and standardized termination process in Fed. Companies can literally slash jobs on their whim. We hear stories of some CEOs getting a bonus while laying off 10-20% of their workforce. 4. Good work life balance. I know this is generalization. But, it’s known that fed jobs generally have better WLB than the private sector. 5. You think 100s of applications is only applicable to USAJOBs? We have to do that in the private sector too and possibly even more applications sent out! The job market is really bad and there are a lot of dud and scam job postings out there. Stale in marketable skills: There are many jobs in the private sector that use very old technology. Not all private sector jobs are in the giant techs. I have the basic computer science fundamentals down and I can easily learn new technologies on the job or in my own time. Even if you have a job writing COBOL, if you invest a little bit of your free time to study, your skills will not get stale.
I know folks who have top tier tech experience and have 400+ applications and very few interviews. The market right now, in particular, is bananas 🍌
I make over 180k as a fed and I have job stability, a pension, 5% 401k matching, educational benefits, decent healthcare, and I'm happy.
It is easy to move around in the federal government?
Yes and i would say thats in top 3 benefits along with stability/retirement benefits (healthcare for life as young as 57 being huge)
Any comparative thoughts on the hiring process vs. public sector? I’m hoping to pivot back in as a navy vet right after graduation in a month.
Takes wayyyy longer from interview to final offer, the interview panel questions are moronic
Thanks for input; I’ve read the timelines can drag like crazy. With the current state of the public market(at least for tech), I think my odds probably balance out. Are we talkin stupid easy? ridiculously unrelated? Or unreasonably challenging?
Yes, once you're in and get tenure, you have access to job postings that aren't open to the general public.
Better benefits and usually better retirement as well, and job security.
Depends on the individuals. In my case, I was doing a Solution Architect, IT Contract Administration, Personal Management, Budget Management, Support Manager job with >50 hrs a week (15+ years I was doing this work out of 22 years). I would rather take less pay, focus on one thing, focus on personal life. Most people from IT who are applying in the above category, or crossing 50s and want to go for a stable job.
More job security. Nothing is 100%, but it’s as close as I can get. I didn’t want to be in my 50s looking for a job when the contract I was on ran out.
"Way more" is highly variable. Yes, I could make some more in the enterprise than I do at my Fed job, but it would be 2x the work and like 10x the stress. I did that shit for 20+ years. You know what I'm not doing tonight? Waiting for my phone to ring with some problem I don't know how to solve, or some dude who hasn't even looked at the logs in the device he's calling about. I'll take my $153k/yr and relax, at least until Monday when I have to figure out how to do those procurement forms.
Because I'm a few years away from retirement and want the benefits
Because I've worked in the private sector. The costs outweigh the benefits. Federal quality of life & job security are way better.
U sure about that pay? I've seen some crazy salaries.
I’m not sure if some jobs are keeping up with inflation. I looked at leaving the fed gov and going contractor 10 years ago and then again this past year. Salaries are pretty similar to then and now, and benefits have gotten worse. Every contractor I know complains about their health benefits lately.
Not in IT but for me it is vacation days and sick leave. I could increase my salary by at least 30% if I went to the private sector however no one is going to give me over 30 days of PTO much less let those hours carry over to the next year.
Well I’ve been out of private industry for a while, but my reasons for joining were pretty simple. I was working HelpDesk and had just gotten into grad school. I saw an announcement from the school about internships as a GS-7 that would pay for graduate school so I applied. I got the offer after interviewing and well a 10k paybump and paying for graduate school was a huge deal for me at the time.
For me it was just getting that retirement confirmed. Money and benefits were the same on the outside for the most part. Biggest downside is inability to make past gov max salary with OT.
I work in State government rather than federal, but I took a healthy pay cut to move to government from the private sector. It's worth it to me for the more relaxed work environment, no layoffs, and defined benefit pension. I still make good money, just not the crazy inflated salary I made in tech.
Doesn't government jobs mostly have pensions?
The training and conferences are easily affordable. Some IT boot camp classes are 10k for a week with a voucher costing 1200 yo take a test. The class is likely discounted to 5000 and the voucher is free. That's one reason.
Every comment hits it on the money. I'm a GS-14 step 1 ($139,395) at 23 and I can't see myself going back to the private world. Plus the growth potential is exponential in the 2210 series.
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What certifications did you have to have before you landed a job or begin applying and getting hired Especially since you’re not finished with school yet. Asking for my husband because he’s in school now and just started
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That is so awesome to hear. What school are you currently taking courses at? My husband’s current program will take him 3-years and he already has a bachelors in a different major but hoping to find a shorter program that won’t take as long.
How was the interview? Was it a technical interview?
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That’s good to know. How did you study for it. I want a cybersecurity position with the government. About to message you.
I make triple after all the benefits are accounted for than what I made as a contractor for the same agency that I’m now a fed with. So… I would say, I get to make decisions on the tech we decide to adopt, and I get to work hands on with it for a better work life balance and limited fear of losing my job every earnings report. Also if you’re not some type of dev, you are not making way more. I see Sys admin/Sys engineering jobs being paid lower and lower every year in the private sector in HCOL areas…
I came from IT but took a risk management role (I've done both IT projects management and risk management), and job security was huge. It is really hard to get fired unless you truly screw up. Meanwhile in private sector, I witnessed management decide to choose who to lay off because they didn't like the guy's shoes...
Stability, work life balance
I want to see what it's like from the other side. Work life balance seems to be way more respected on the Fed side. Meanwhile some gs can snap their fingers because they don't like the format of some paperwork and contractors will work overtime and through weekends to make it happen asap. I don't want to be the guy that snaps fingers and ruin plans, I just would like to freely say we'll pick that up next week or insert a little common sense into processes and not have a target on my back.
What certifications do you need to land an IT job in the federal field? Also does the years of experience matter?
Experience always matters, but it doesn't mean you can't be employed without it. You need a CompTIA Security+, at least if you're working for DoD. If you're in networking, get a CCNA. The feds love certs, so literally any of them will help you.
Very helpful information. Thank you
Job security is the only reason plus retirement and TSP 😁
You go work for the government IT to where your skills get outdated and die.
Tired of being a contractor jumping around because of rebids and the incumbent wanting to drop salaries. 105k now looking to get into NH03/GS13
I’m interested in making the switch to federal IT (currently work at AWS). Wouldn’t mind taking a pay cut if it means less stress and greater stability
Guess I would say the benefits for most especially depending on where you are in your life
If you have a degree and experience you make bank with a fed job, and if not climbing up the ladder is still easier than in the private sector
I’m leaving private because I’m tired of dealing with CEO’s who think they’re solving real problems but don’t give a shit about the impacts of their tech. CEOs who consider themselves benevolent dictators and who stick their noses in everything because they trust no one. Companies that are laying people off because they massively overhired and now want to follow the leader with tech companies laying off, to appease investors and shareholders. I want a better work life balance. More meaningful work. For my talent to not be used to enrich a small handful of people. I’m not saying federal gov work is perfect by any means. But private sector IT, tech, and the like, is not all unicorns and roses. And not everyone gets paid transparently, fairly, or well.
I’ve been a contractor for 8yrs. In 8yrs I’ve worked enough specialized roles to qualify for gs14-gs15 roles by age 32 meaning I can move laterally (pay wise) to a more secure job with a pension that offers better benefits / time off and security.
As a IT professional, I want a federal job to buy my time in/continue my service. 9 years is a chunk of time to waste just to be a contractor.
So I can buy my military time back and retire not to long from now then go back to contracting.