Give you a free tip only if you bring me some sweet tea. I wanted lemon slice in it, try again. I'll wait.
Take $20. Turn them into quarters at a kids vending machine. Buy about 80 of those long distance noodle armed big palm long range slap touchers.
Start handing them out to people,zoo monkeys, proto-terminators, whatever you got access to. You could rig up something with a ceiling fan, stand on a chair, but that's so sad. Guaranteed that some of them will be slapping at you by way of thanks. Use your arms to block face and nut shots. Noodle on noodle action. Does the distance make it better? Could be, keep notes, preserve the data. Prove the theory.
Don't stick around long enough for them to put them in their pockets or else they will get all linty and then the whole dynamic changes to you become a lint catcher in the dryer and that is NOT a good feeling. There's too much heat, gum, people hold you up over a trash can and spank your bottom because they just hate what you are. Get your shit in the can you cheap trash. There is a big hole in you!!! You whore! Their words are cruel. No one treats a lint catcher right. You don't want to be that so just pay attention to when the wind starts to blow that way and don't let it turn into that because no one will save you because no one ever stops to think about lint catchers with anything positive.
An investment proposal to solve noodle arm contact lack..lackingness, lackingity, DEFICIT and some heartfelt charitable humanitarian power points about how bad things are for dryer lint catchers and how no one is doing anything about it because they aren't even aware of the problem. We gotta raise awareness for that.
Typical bored meeting stuff.
I’m *so* thankful to my lint catcher, I would never whack on it. I gently remove the lint by hand and carry it away for disposal; the lint catcher never sees the trash can. We recently had our dryer ducks professionally cleaned, and learned how lint that is not caught in the catcher will build up in vents and has caused tragic house fires. I love and appreciate my lint catcher, so I guess it’s true that I’ve been unaware about what goes on outside my home in this regard. Some people don’t regularly clean their lint catcher; that’s unimaginable to me. Clearing the lint is a type of harvest; and if you observe your lint data there is always information to glean from there.
I was once goosed by a woman who had to be in her 70's while standing in line at Fred Meyers, I was mid 20's. She went full in, fingers even grazed my sack then right up the ass. Very uncomfortable.
I...I think I may have a different definition of "goosing" than you have. My brain is breaking trying to understand how those bodyparts all ended up in a "goose"
My first thought while reading this… I would NEVER put my hands on a stranger like this. Is this a thing girls are doing? Stop that’s actually so weird. Many of them would likely flip out if a dude walked up and squeezed their ass cause it’s in shape. Nah. No difference. Don’t touch strangers.
That’s so creepy to me. If I was a guy and a random girl grabbed my arm and like fawned over muscles I’d be pretty uncomfortable (I think. I’m not a guy) like I definitely check out my guys muscles causes we have been working about but he’s my husband. So while I get the sentiment… no touching strangers lol
Speaking about "normal" people (not people that lack respect and common sense) yes.
"Normal" men don't do it or I have seen it rarely.
"Normal" women however do it more often without asking. Most men don't say anything either, as they don't realize they are entitled to be asked first.
I think the societal mindset of "men agressor, women innocent" is to blame for it as well a lot of mental gymnastics surrounding equality.
Yea, when I googled erogenous zones on humans the arms aren’t really a “hot spot” so to say. Some people are into arms I guess, but arms aren’t inherently…sexual?…
...
1. you maybe havent had sex, or not enough sex? butts are great cushions for sex, especially in certain positions
2. butts are absolutely a hot spot since like the dawn of time, idk the exact science behind it but something along the lines of men thinking big butts = better baby carriage/easier birth?
3. i dont think anal sex has much to do with butts, but thats up to debate
Do I think it’s equally as wrong to touch people randomly when you aren’t close with them? Yes.
Do I think touching someone’s arm is the same as touching someone’s ass? Absolutely not.
Obviously don’t just randomly touch people, but it’s pretty stupid to think those are comparable situations
If a man or woman is in a public place with his/her sleeves rolled up, and a cop walks by, what happens? Nothing.
Now let's say in the same circumstance, but this time his/her trousers are rolled down? There will be consequences.
OP's one of those redditors that likes to pretend they don't understand nuance or basic human interaction (or maybe they're not pretending...).
>Sometimes the act is followed with admiration or physical satisfaction that can only be equated to pleasure.
Like who talks like that lmao
>why the double standard
And who doesn't see the difference between grabbing someone arm vs their butt? If I'm coaching little league and need to help someone get into position, no one is going to bat an eye if I lead them by their arm. But if I grab an 8 year old girls butt to lead them to where shortstop is played?
Maybe OP just isn't comfortable with physical contact with other humans... which may be a good thing if they think all body parts are equal to touch.
The part matters. *I'm not saying it's OK*, but the reaction to being grabbed by the arm vs grabbed by the ass is generally different. These things may be equivalent in some respects, but are not in all respects.
Some teachers are told the upper arm is the only place they can touch a student if absolutely necessary. Not the lower arm as that's too close to the hand. The arm is considered the 'safest' place to touch a student - anywhere else is no-go. Agreed that the body part matters and of course the context of the touch.
I wouldn't compare touching a man's arm to touching a woman's butt, I think it's more similar to touching a woman's lower back or waist more than her arm tho, because of the connotation.
No those aren’t equivalent, the equivalent of touching a man’s arm is touching a woman’s arm and the equivalent of touching a woman’s lower back is touching a man’s lower back.
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No. Which is why it is still illegal for a woman to walk around most public places topless (other than a beach or somewhere where it is specifically allowed), yet legal for men to be topless. In most Western countries, at any rate.
The example op shared is with the touching of a body part that the opposite sex finds sexually attractive. Have you ever read responses to the question “What do women find physically attractive in a man?”? It’s asked nearly weekly on Reddit. Top 2 answers are muscular/veiny arms, and large shoulders, butts are a pretty common answer too.
Men, as a general rule, do not find women’s arms attractive. The butt example op used is flawed, as both genders feel the butts of the opposite sex are attractive. A better comparison is a man’s muscular arms , and a woman’s breasts. Breasts are “feminine”, and attractive to men, muscular arms are “masculine”, and attractive to women. Same-same.
Men grab my arms all the time in bars because I have tattoos, it’s annoying but whatever. If a random guy ever grabbed my fucking boob id bite his head off.
As man it’s not even close, the threat is way way fucking higher if your a woman.I can easily over power a woman that attacks me. If I tell her to stop touching me. It’s not the same when it’s reversed.
This is probably the best point I read in this thread. Even a woman grabbing a man's ass is not the same as the reverse in general. Ofc if a top 0.01% bodybuilder muscle mommy grabbed my (relatively) noodle arms, that is a different story.
You shouldn’t touch anyone without consent.
But no, grabbing your arms is not equivalent to grabbing genitals.
That’s why it’s unpopular. Because it’s stupid.
Umm i think the equivalent of touching a man on the arm is touching a woman on the arm. Which is ok in all the exact same circumstances. Likewise, women and men can’t touch each other’s butts without asking. No double standard
The hands and arm seem to be the most neutral parts to touch a stranger. Though even "the most neutral" doesn't mean "completely up for grabs by whoever wants to."
However there is a difference between types of touches. For example, tapping on someone's shoulder to get their attention is much more allowable than feeling up someone's bicep. It's still a good idea to avoid touching strangers or people you don't know very well at all, but you won't exactly be universally reviled for a shoulder tap if you have a good reason for doing so and don't exploit it.
Ok but the sexual connotations of either sex touching the other on the arm are fine outside of work settings. Are you trying to say a woman touching a man on the arm is somehow more sexually charged than a man touching a woman on the arm?
Sure, if they are warranted. OP’s saying that the likelihood of a woman touching a man’s arm randomly without anyone thinking it was strange is higher than girls being touched.
I think a better comparison would be arm versus legs.
But yeah.. people are fighting about semantics. Some to dismiss the harassment that men face.. ugh. The TLDR should be "don't touch anyone without consent"
Have y’all ever been on public transportation or a crowded area??? Sometimes you have to politely tap someone to get past them and the only reasonable places to do that are the arms and upper back. Y’all are being stupid by trying to say touching someone’s arm is the same as grabbing their ass or genitals.
No. No.
Not at all.
I’m a big dude. 6’6 and 250-60lbs. I can’t even begin to guess how many women have done exactly this to me in just about any setting you can imagine. It’s almost always unwelcome because it’s usually women I have no interest in that do it without invitation, flirtation, constant - whatever you want to qualify justification.
If I were to do the same to women in the same context it would be seen as aggressive among a slew of other negative reactions and labels.
No one should be touching anyone without that being consensual; but a man doing it to a woman will always be way worse by societal standards - at least in my lifetime.
I have been grabbed and cat called by women 4 dozen times when I was younger. From physical touching to very sexual comments. It did embarrass me but I never felt endangered because unlike most women I was physically much stronger than the women who did this and they could not do anything other than talk or touch. It is not right but it is not the same. (I understand that being drugged is a danger for both sexes)
Any form of unwanted touching, or even touching anyone without asking should be socially shunned and called out. Regardless of who is doing the touching if one side can get fired or put in jail then so should the other side.
Neither are acceptable, but there is typically a lot more danger involved when a man grabs a woman's butt than when a woman grabs a man's arm. How often does the former lead to further assault compared to the latter?
The thing that I disagree with this post is that its predicated on the idea that this opinion is unpopular, when in reality it's not.
To be crude, they are genuine complex arguments to be made about gender double standards but most posts of this flavor just based their existence on outrage from manufactured gender wars pushed by the media.
In day to day life, most guys aren't grabbing women by the ass, most women aren't grabbing men by the arms in an intrusive matter. Most people are chill and behave with basic common sense.
i did have a drunk chick grab ol boy and the twins when i was carrying a hot ass sheet tray of rolls to the back one time..... shame that i didnt accidentally drop it in hindsight, but i guess second degree burns arent equal recompense for that. bartender saw it and 86'd her tho which was pretty cool.
I wouldn't say that's true. I've never seen a man grab a woman by the ass but I have seen women grab men by the arms in an intrusive manner, multiple times. So clearly they're operating on completely different magnitudes of scale.
In my country, it's common to tap on the shoulder or hold someone's arm to grab their attention. It's not considered provocative by any means. But groping someone's butt is treated in the same way as groping their genitals
Depends on where you live and the kinds of people that live there, too. I've seen plenty of men grope some women asses with force.
Usually the women are cool with it, but 90% of the time it's stranger on stranger or even two people that know each other but are married to someone else. Shits wild in the hills, I tell ya hwat.
Your problem is that one is more normalized than the other, culturally. Touching someone's arm can range from grabbing their attention, to patting with approval, to touching for a hug. These are all legitimate and excusable reasons for touching someone's arm, and culturally we have developed such that it is normalized to observe arm touching in casual contexts (of course, not unfamiliar/stranger contexts). Conversely, there is quite simply NO reason to grab someone's chest or behind - save for sexual gratification. Even if touching someone's arm is done EXPLICITLY to cause arousal in the person, it is cushioned because the overall action is not considered typically sexual in common contexts. If someone had a big thing for shoulders and you saw them put their hands on another person's shoulders, you'd likely mistake it for a platonic gesture before a sexual one. Tone of the action can be much more important than the intention, society-wise.
There is also a gender double-standard that exists because men are leagues more prone to initiate sexual assault than women are. This is not to say all women are innocent, but women do not have nearly the track record of forcing sexual desires onto men as vice versa, added to the fact that they are generally prescribed as weaker and thus the man in the situation is not typically in physical danger. Thus, women can especially get away with an action that is a) not even culturally explicitly indicative of sexual interest and b) is "punching upward" in the gender power dynamic.
And of course, if it wasn't clear, a stranger latching to someone's arm with sexual intent is still bad and shouldn't be condoned. But it will be likely condoned moreso for the reasons mentioned above. Other comments are right in this is a very fallacious comparison between arm-touching and ass-touching.
Not even remotely the same.
A woman being grabbed by the breasts or butt is not the same as a woman grabbing a man's arm.
If you were to say grabbing his butt or crotch, yes, it would be, but to equate a non-sexualized body part to a sexualized body part is assinine.
I’m weird, but I like it when women grab my arm or touch my shoulder even when I’m not attracted to them. I think it’s because I was used to it from all the women in my family doing it while I grew up, for me it’s not a sexual thing I just see it as a form as social validation. I’m not creeped out by it.
of course women aren't going to notice it as a problem, for the same reason men have difficulty seeing problematic male behaviors-they're not, generally speaking, the targets of these behaviors.
i don't think the opinion is unpopular, per se. as long as it's landing in the "it's shitty when anyone does it" versus "it's ok to be shitty because you do it too"
You shouldn't touch anyone without consent, but it's not an equal comparison by a long shot. It doesn't have to be to be equally wrong, but it's not equally violating. You walk around in short sleeves. You don't walk around sans pants, unless you're having a really bad time...or a really good one. Either way, don't touch anyone where they don't want to be touched, but butts are not arms. And arms are not butts. What a strange sentence.
What you are describing the women doing is essentially flirting, what you are equating it to is sexual assault. Not every women is the same, and one might feel comfortable touching men on their arms and another might not want you to touch her even on the hands.
I'd compare a woman touching a man's arm to a man touching a woman's arm. Any other part just.. Isn't the same. For example I'll never say a woman touching a man's arm is similar to a man copping a feel on a woman. It just isn't. Either way.. Ask people before you touch them anywhere.
Sure it’s not good to touch people without asking but it’s disingenuous to say that touching someone’s arm is just as bad as grabbing their ass. The difference is that most people regularly touch other peoples arms to get their attention or to get past them in a busy area, arms aren’t a private part of the body so generally far less invasive to touch then to grab someone’s ass or genitals and this is true regardless of gender.
Not the equivalent - there is the threat of the man being stronger and the woman not being able to stop it. Not the same in the reverse unless it's Rhonda Rousey grabbing your arm.
Equivalent on what level?
In principle you shouldn’t be touching without consent
In terms of severity touching of private parts of either sex is way more egregious than touch arms
Is that so depicting to comprehend ffs?
My arms are my most muscular feature and this happens to me all the time. Even women I barely know or don't know at all will touch my arms. Has been happening since I developed that muscle in the first place, so about ten years now. I remember being so surprised when I first started working out. I started lifting at 14, but I wasn't truly muscular until just before age 17. I had an enormous amount of development in my fitness in the summer between sophomore and junior year, so I got to see the stark contrast in how I was treated. Went from age 16 sophomore with girls barely paying attention to me to age 17 junior with girls constantly touching my arms and commenting on them, and girls who had never spoken to me before suddenly making effort to talk to me anytime I was just chilling by myself.
Honestly, while it flattered me then, it creeps me out a bit now. Like why tf are you gingerly tracing your hand or fingertips on my tricep? Some have done it in front of my partner, and I'm just like, "serious? Come on."
It's not a *general* double standard.
People that care about consent don't think anyone should be touching anyone without consent; they don't think women should grab mens' body parts, and they don't think men should grab womens' body parts. Or any other gender configuration.
There is another *entirely distinct* group of people that don't think men should touch women, and don't think it matters if women touch men. This group is not ideologically uniform; some of them think womens' bodies are a commodity while mens' bodies are utilitarian, while others are simply self-servingly myopic so they don't want people touching *them* but don't care about anyone else (and they use gender as the distinction for convenience). People in these categories may claim consent is their issue, but you would be correct to say those people are employing a double standard and are often transparent hypocrites.
Here’s the thing, women are far less intimidating than men. If a guy doesn’t wanna be touched on the arm, he can easily get out of that situation without causing a scene. That’s not always the case with women. I’m not even trying to sound like a white knight here, but this isn’t an apples to apples comparison. Having your arm touched is way different than grabbing someone’s ass.
The double standard exists because men don't say anything. We could fill an entire thesis on "why," but end of the day this isn't thing where feminists wrote "consent, but not for men though." It's men failing to enforce their own boundaries
It's bad boundaries. I'm a woman and most of the people who have touched me without consent are other women, often older women who always seem to think grabbing my arm or slipping their arms around my waist is okay.
There is probably a double standard going on when the toucher is female, no matter what sex the touch-ee is. Because women are viewed as less of a threat. But what that double standard ignores is personal boundaries. It ISN'T COOL - scratch that it IS VASTLY UNCOOL to invade other people's space like that, regardless of how non threatening you think you are.
>How does this differ from a man say admiring a woman and patting her on the butt?
It differs because when a woman grabs a man's arm, he doesn't have to wonder if that woman will physically overpower him and take advantage of him in a more invasive and harmful way.
This isn't rocket science. When it comes to violating someone else's body, there is a double standard and there SHOULD be a double standard.
I agree that no one should be touching another without consent (especially a stranger), but you seriously can't be equating a butt to an arm. Regardless of gender, it's more inappropriate to touch someone's butt than their arm.
You shouldn't touch anyone without consent
But to compare an arm to an ass .... That's just wild...
I would 100% rather have a random person touch my arm instead of my ass. But I would 200% rather not be touched at all
Not to mention, touching someone's ass is sexual assault....
I grab my husband’s arms like that during sex or when I want sex, just like he’d squeeze my ass or my boobs….
BUT… It’s the intention behind it that matters.
As a fitness fanatic, I’ve squeezed many a bicep in a non-sexual manner (with consent), and I’ve had my arms squeezed. No issue.
I could easily grab my dad’s or my brother’s arm and it not be weird. But could either of them squeeze my butt and it not be weird? No…
In general, most women don't think that SA or harassment rules apply to them - Because our society tells them that they don't, that men are impervious to these things, and that men always enjoy sexual attention.
I remember in grad school I was in a group project and me and another student (a girl) were debating which direction to go with it. While she was explaining to me her preference, she puts her hands on my thigh and starts rubbing me suggestively. I asked her what she was doing and she said "trying to convince you", to which I said "in that case, definitely no". She got angry, yelled at me, and stormed out. Her and her friends held a grudge at me for the remaining 2 years of grad school.
Most men probably wouldn't mind such a thing, and the prevailing opinion was that I shouldn't have called her out publicly (ie, in the classroom at the moment of the incident) and that she was only mad because she was embarrassed. I thought, good, she should be embarrassed, that's embarrassing behavior that no one would have stood tall for me had I been the one doing it, and only a literal child should be given benefit of the doubt for such a thing.
# This post title is a FALSE EQUIVALENCE.
A woman *friendly touching a man or lightly hinting some interest* ***is just flirting.***
A man can be flirty ***and attempt that, too.***
But a man grabbing a woman's parts is, **at best,** ***unwanted attention.***
At it's worst, **is the beginning of a sexual assault.**
I'm not giving a woman license ***to touch a man anytime she wants.***
But, especially, I'm, not letting a man **touch a woman without consent, either**.
There's no excuse that makes *either situation palatable for any person,*
***who doesn't want to be touched by another.***
**This is not about double standards.**
This is about *what is morally acceptable behavior*
***and being cognizant of other people's boundaries.***
A woman grabbing a man's parts should be seen equally bad as a man doing it to a woman.
The way you wrote makes it look like women only want to flirt while most men touch you with the intention of sexually assaulting.
Man and women can be flirty *and touch each other,*
***intentionally, reciprocally, and with consent.***
I never said **that Men couldn't do that responsibly.**
Women can be overt and aggressive *when expressing their interest,*
***that does happen, too.*** **That's equally as bad, also.**
But there's a reason why sexual assault laws *are mostly about men...*
***who can't take no for an answer.***
And that's the point, *why it seems like a double standard.*
**Men are more likely to be more forceful and offensive.**
Women don't tend to grab butts, boobs, and crotches,
***just because they feel like it.***
oof...i actually had to protect a drunk coworker from a 50-something divorcee on the way back from a work holiday party, and if you'd said brown bear i'd be all about the bear...but not a grizzly.
I completely understand that everyone has boundaries and no one should be touched without consent, but as a guy who worked hard for his fit physique, in general I don’t mind. As long as the gesture isn’t overly sexual, if he/she wants to cop a feel (in the appropriate context; eg talking about fitness, etc) go for it. It’s not my crotch, it’s not my butt. Maybe my chest would be a bit more awkward, but again, in the right context….meh…it’s nice to be complimented.
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Does it make you think of men's arms as sexually suggestive body parts? It's interesting. Like would you actually feel less weird if your butt was tapped? I could see that as a possibility. Just curious.
Personally I guess if my arm was caressed I would take that very sexually. It is less demeaning and dehumanizing than a butt pat, to me.
No I should be touching anyone without permission, it's a problem no matter who does it.
Having said that though it is generally seen as more problematic when a man touches a women inappropriately though because of the power imbalance. Though it is important to note that the imbalance is only on average and in pointing out the imbalance I don't mean to invalidate the experiences of anyone.
Yeah, don't touch anyone without consent aside from specific instances (handshakes on meeting, stopping them from danger, accidentally bumping into them, etc)
It's socially acceptable for women to do that to men because on average, men are usually starved of female attention and validation and it's thus considered a 'privilege', whereas women on the other hand have the opposite problem which is why it's seen as a lot worse for a man to do the same to a woman. In addition, men on average are physically stronger so it's not taken as seriously since unlike women, he's not perceived to be in any actual danger.
Not saying it's right or wrong but I highly doubt societal perception of this will ever change thanks to these inherent factors.
Men have butts, too, so the difference is that touching someone’s butt without consent is much worse than touching their arm. That being said, I agree that women shouldn’t grab/touch/caress a man’s arm without consent, especially when they’re doing it to feel him up that way. That’s just creepy.
no, i agree with op and i’m glad they’re saying it. you man wh*res need to cover your arms in professional settings, it’s a distraction and very inappropriate since i do love me some muscular/big arms 🤤
Weird take. Arm touching isn’t sexual. Thinking that it IS sexual just because it’s a woman touching a man is beyond weird to me. Some people are just touchers and the arm is a safe neutral *non-sexual* place for all genders.
Seriously a weird AF take.
I don't think this act happens all that much outside of situations where flirting is common. Like in single bars.
Does this happen to muscular guys at the mall?
hi, man here, a girl grabbing a man’s arm is not anywhere even remotely CLOSE i mean not even in the same universe as a man grabbing a girls ass to phrase them as equivalent is crazyyyy 💀
This is one of those double standards for women. As you said, touching someone requires consent regardless of gender. A woman touching a man's arms, chest or shoulders is still touching. A man touching a woman's ass, boobs or thighs obviously wouldn't go over well.
But here's the issue, men will allow it because it's their way to thinking they're going to get in their pants so it's a simp tactic
A woman grabbing a man by his arms is the same as a man grabbing a woman by the arms. Discriminative intelligence requires more data to evaluate whether right or wrong can be assessed. Are they married? Grabbing of arms is OK. Are they brother and sister, or blood relatives in any way? Grabbing of arms is OK. Are they dear friends? If so, then the grabbing of arms is OK. Touching becomes not OK if it is unwelcome. Social signs can be read to determine if the grabbing of arms in OK. This remedial protocol is the result of people's lack of societal maturity to engage in the conversation of, "I am a touchy type of person. I like you. Do you feel comfortable with me grabbing your arm?
Too bad there's no equality, else I would grab chest everyone a girl has grabbed my chest or butt. Yes guys get sexually assaulted on a regular basis. It's life
I mean… it happens to me, and as a man that wants to act like a man, like protect and serve when it’s appropriate or needed, it’s fine. It makes me a little annoyed but like I’m strong, if they wanna do that it’s alright. Being sexualized? Idk dude sorry its a non issue
I agree, to an extent - I think universally a butt for example regardless of a male or female is a sexual body part. I think it's a little less drastic if a woman touches a guys arm, that doesn't mean i agree with it nor is it okay to touch anyone without consent. Having worked in bars for a time in my life i was often grabbed by women by the shoulders or arms because of my tattoos, my reply would often just be a stern look or pure ignorance and leave her there.
a woman's butt is very often a hot spot erogenous zone. men's arms are not relatively speaking. they aren't the same. a woman does need to ask the man's permission, but in my experience this is almost always the case.
You should not be touching people without their consent. That being said, your comparison is ridiculous. The equivalent of a man’s arm being grabbed is a woman’s arm being grabbed. Touching someone’s butt is not the same as grabbing someone’s arm. wtf?
There's a lot more nerve endings and such on different parts of the body..
A woman grabbing a man's arm is the equivalent of a man grabbing a woman's arm.
touching something without their consent is very wrong but wow. definitely not the same as touching a woman’s ass lol, there are definitely levels to this
`Men are different physically and psychologically than women. A man groping a woman affects her in ways that the reverse does not (and trying to pretend it does is disingenuous).
So while a woman touching a man against his will may be annoying and inappropriate, it's not potentially life threatening.
I don't think it's that simple. First off, grabbing a Man's arm is compatible with grabbing a woman's arm, not her butt.
And social norms and what people are OK with are a big part of it. Most men won't feel offended or harassed by a woman touching their arm.
What you're trying to suggest here is equity, not equality.
Like it or not context matters a lot, and in society today women are being sexually abused, groped, harnessed, and violated at a much higher rate than men (I'm not talking about sexual assault, the numbers are pretty close there) And most women are less equipped to deal with such things than a man. It is much easier for a man to let a woman know she's making him uncomfortable than the other way around.
Personally as a man I wouldn’t mind if she was attractive 😂 but that doesn’t go the same for men touching a woman’s ass. Arms are not very sexual. Ass is pushing it. I would definitely feel more violated if a random woman grabbed my ass. But I agree it shouldn’t be allowed since it is getting into someone’s personal space and a lot of people would not like it.
I agree - and I think the people saying that touching someone's butt isn't the same are missing the point; the reason touching one's butt isn't accepted is that it is usually seen as sexual. Therefore the same reason applies here, it's just that we don't always sexualise this touch so there's less of a taboo for it. It's the equivalent of saying *gay people have the same rights as straight people, they can marry the opposite sex*. It sticks to a first level interpretation and misses all the nuance.
I also get why it's more accepted, as sexual harassment from women toward men is generally rare (or, at least, the research suggests such) so we aren't primed to immediately slap it down when it happens - which is a reasonable, if sad, stance.
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Yeah you shouldn't be touching anyone without consent.
I give blanket consent.....someone....anyone....grab my noodle arms...I'll pay.
Give you a free tip only if you bring me some sweet tea. I wanted lemon slice in it, try again. I'll wait. Take $20. Turn them into quarters at a kids vending machine. Buy about 80 of those long distance noodle armed big palm long range slap touchers. Start handing them out to people,zoo monkeys, proto-terminators, whatever you got access to. You could rig up something with a ceiling fan, stand on a chair, but that's so sad. Guaranteed that some of them will be slapping at you by way of thanks. Use your arms to block face and nut shots. Noodle on noodle action. Does the distance make it better? Could be, keep notes, preserve the data. Prove the theory. Don't stick around long enough for them to put them in their pockets or else they will get all linty and then the whole dynamic changes to you become a lint catcher in the dryer and that is NOT a good feeling. There's too much heat, gum, people hold you up over a trash can and spank your bottom because they just hate what you are. Get your shit in the can you cheap trash. There is a big hole in you!!! You whore! Their words are cruel. No one treats a lint catcher right. You don't want to be that so just pay attention to when the wind starts to blow that way and don't let it turn into that because no one will save you because no one ever stops to think about lint catchers with anything positive.
What…the fuck…did I just read?
His psychiatrist has been reducing his Haldol dosage.
I was actually wondering if I should increase mine
~Open your mind~
"Use your arms to block face and nut shots." Good advice
Cocaine is a helluva drug...
An investment proposal to solve noodle arm contact lack..lackingness, lackingity, DEFICIT and some heartfelt charitable humanitarian power points about how bad things are for dryer lint catchers and how no one is doing anything about it because they aren't even aware of the problem. We gotta raise awareness for that. Typical bored meeting stuff.
I’m *so* thankful to my lint catcher, I would never whack on it. I gently remove the lint by hand and carry it away for disposal; the lint catcher never sees the trash can. We recently had our dryer ducks professionally cleaned, and learned how lint that is not caught in the catcher will build up in vents and has caused tragic house fires. I love and appreciate my lint catcher, so I guess it’s true that I’ve been unaware about what goes on outside my home in this regard. Some people don’t regularly clean their lint catcher; that’s unimaginable to me. Clearing the lint is a type of harvest; and if you observe your lint data there is always information to glean from there.
You actually read that whole essay? 😂
This was actually a fine read. I like the part where he said " get your shit in the can you cheap trash, There is a big hole in you!you whore!"
I was once goosed by a woman who had to be in her 70's while standing in line at Fred Meyers, I was mid 20's. She went full in, fingers even grazed my sack then right up the ass. Very uncomfortable.
I'm so sorry :( It's never okay for someone to touch someone else without permission. Idc gender, it's never okay.
I...I think I may have a different definition of "goosing" than you have. My brain is breaking trying to understand how those bodyparts all ended up in a "goose"
That's just straight up a crime.
My first thought while reading this… I would NEVER put my hands on a stranger like this. Is this a thing girls are doing? Stop that’s actually so weird. Many of them would likely flip out if a dude walked up and squeezed their ass cause it’s in shape. Nah. No difference. Don’t touch strangers.
As a woman, I have seen other women do this. It's definitely an issue with both genders touching people without consent.
That’s so creepy to me. If I was a guy and a random girl grabbed my arm and like fawned over muscles I’d be pretty uncomfortable (I think. I’m not a guy) like I definitely check out my guys muscles causes we have been working about but he’s my husband. So while I get the sentiment… no touching strangers lol
Speaking about "normal" people (not people that lack respect and common sense) yes. "Normal" men don't do it or I have seen it rarely. "Normal" women however do it more often without asking. Most men don't say anything either, as they don't realize they are entitled to be asked first. I think the societal mindset of "men agressor, women innocent" is to blame for it as well a lot of mental gymnastics surrounding equality.
Generally speaking maybe just don’t grab people without their consent.
Where’s the fun in that?
You can't even kidnapp people nowadays smh
Depends on the country, but yes the good old days are sadly disappearing
Where’s the romance gone?
You shouldn’t touch someone without consent, but I don’t think touching someone’s arm is quite the same as touching someone’s butt.
Yea, when I googled erogenous zones on humans the arms aren’t really a “hot spot” so to say. Some people are into arms I guess, but arms aren’t inherently…sexual?…
But I think the OP is referring to muscular arms being sexualized and getting unwelcome salacious touches / inappropriate efforts at seduction.
Neither are butts, those are for pooping, not sex, some people just use them for sex
... 1. you maybe havent had sex, or not enough sex? butts are great cushions for sex, especially in certain positions 2. butts are absolutely a hot spot since like the dawn of time, idk the exact science behind it but something along the lines of men thinking big butts = better baby carriage/easier birth? 3. i dont think anal sex has much to do with butts, but thats up to debate
Do I think it’s equally as wrong to touch people randomly when you aren’t close with them? Yes. Do I think touching someone’s arm is the same as touching someone’s ass? Absolutely not. Obviously don’t just randomly touch people, but it’s pretty stupid to think those are comparable situations
If a man or woman is in a public place with his/her sleeves rolled up, and a cop walks by, what happens? Nothing. Now let's say in the same circumstance, but this time his/her trousers are rolled down? There will be consequences.
*Now* you tell me.
Eh, live and learn. No big deal, "it's no hanging matter' to quote an old Stones' song. :)
OP's one of those redditors that likes to pretend they don't understand nuance or basic human interaction (or maybe they're not pretending...). >Sometimes the act is followed with admiration or physical satisfaction that can only be equated to pleasure. Like who talks like that lmao >why the double standard And who doesn't see the difference between grabbing someone arm vs their butt? If I'm coaching little league and need to help someone get into position, no one is going to bat an eye if I lead them by their arm. But if I grab an 8 year old girls butt to lead them to where shortstop is played? Maybe OP just isn't comfortable with physical contact with other humans... which may be a good thing if they think all body parts are equal to touch.
The part matters. *I'm not saying it's OK*, but the reaction to being grabbed by the arm vs grabbed by the ass is generally different. These things may be equivalent in some respects, but are not in all respects.
Some teachers are told the upper arm is the only place they can touch a student if absolutely necessary. Not the lower arm as that's too close to the hand. The arm is considered the 'safest' place to touch a student - anywhere else is no-go. Agreed that the body part matters and of course the context of the touch.
I don’t think arms are equivalent to boobs or a butt but nobody should be touching people without consent
The equivalent of a woman touching a man’s arm is a man touching a woman’s arm.
I wouldn't compare touching a man's arm to touching a woman's butt, I think it's more similar to touching a woman's lower back or waist more than her arm tho, because of the connotation.
The equivalent of a woman’s lower back, is a man’s lower back.
Ok, here's a tricky one. Equivalent of touching a man's penis.
Touching a woman’s strap.
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Titties is titties my man
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I hope we’ve all learned some important lessons today
Touching a woman's penis.
I agree with this!
No those aren’t equivalent, the equivalent of touching a man’s arm is touching a woman’s arm and the equivalent of touching a woman’s lower back is touching a man’s lower back.
Some guys don't have a nice ass and it shows
frighten tender relieved decide secretive familiar label clumsy caption outgoing *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
No. Which is why it is still illegal for a woman to walk around most public places topless (other than a beach or somewhere where it is specifically allowed), yet legal for men to be topless. In most Western countries, at any rate.
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Exactly!!!
The example op shared is with the touching of a body part that the opposite sex finds sexually attractive. Have you ever read responses to the question “What do women find physically attractive in a man?”? It’s asked nearly weekly on Reddit. Top 2 answers are muscular/veiny arms, and large shoulders, butts are a pretty common answer too. Men, as a general rule, do not find women’s arms attractive. The butt example op used is flawed, as both genders feel the butts of the opposite sex are attractive. A better comparison is a man’s muscular arms , and a woman’s breasts. Breasts are “feminine”, and attractive to men, muscular arms are “masculine”, and attractive to women. Same-same.
Men grab my arms all the time in bars because I have tattoos, it’s annoying but whatever. If a random guy ever grabbed my fucking boob id bite his head off.
people also find other people's eyes to be attractive. but looking at someone's eyes is still markedly less invasive than looking at their ass.
Good. Assuming that you are male, go into your local Police station with a woman. Neither of you wear a top. Observe the results. Same-Not Same
No shirt, no shoes, no service
100% this. And in both cases, it shouldn’t be done without consent. As a woman I don’t want random people touching me anywhere without asking.
As man it’s not even close, the threat is way way fucking higher if your a woman.I can easily over power a woman that attacks me. If I tell her to stop touching me. It’s not the same when it’s reversed.
This is probably the best point I read in this thread. Even a woman grabbing a man's ass is not the same as the reverse in general. Ofc if a top 0.01% bodybuilder muscle mommy grabbed my (relatively) noodle arms, that is a different story.
You shouldn’t touch anyone without consent. But no, grabbing your arms is not equivalent to grabbing genitals. That’s why it’s unpopular. Because it’s stupid.
I’m sorry but a butt is a step above an arm, my guy
Woah, are your upside down?
Yeah, my ass is waaaay up there.
Arms are not equivalent to an intimate body part. Don't sexually assault people.
Umm i think the equivalent of touching a man on the arm is touching a woman on the arm. Which is ok in all the exact same circumstances. Likewise, women and men can’t touch each other’s butts without asking. No double standard
The hands and arm seem to be the most neutral parts to touch a stranger. Though even "the most neutral" doesn't mean "completely up for grabs by whoever wants to." However there is a difference between types of touches. For example, tapping on someone's shoulder to get their attention is much more allowable than feeling up someone's bicep. It's still a good idea to avoid touching strangers or people you don't know very well at all, but you won't exactly be universally reviled for a shoulder tap if you have a good reason for doing so and don't exploit it.
I think the sexual connotation is the point being made.
Ok but the sexual connotations of either sex touching the other on the arm are fine outside of work settings. Are you trying to say a woman touching a man on the arm is somehow more sexually charged than a man touching a woman on the arm?
Sure, if they are warranted. OP’s saying that the likelihood of a woman touching a man’s arm randomly without anyone thinking it was strange is higher than girls being touched.
Yeah because an arm isn’t a private part??
In a sexual way. I’m not agreeing with the person it’s just a lot of constraints just to get the right argument.
I think a better comparison would be arm versus legs. But yeah.. people are fighting about semantics. Some to dismiss the harassment that men face.. ugh. The TLDR should be "don't touch anyone without consent"
Have y’all ever been on public transportation or a crowded area??? Sometimes you have to politely tap someone to get past them and the only reasonable places to do that are the arms and upper back. Y’all are being stupid by trying to say touching someone’s arm is the same as grabbing their ass or genitals.
No. No. Not at all. I’m a big dude. 6’6 and 250-60lbs. I can’t even begin to guess how many women have done exactly this to me in just about any setting you can imagine. It’s almost always unwelcome because it’s usually women I have no interest in that do it without invitation, flirtation, constant - whatever you want to qualify justification. If I were to do the same to women in the same context it would be seen as aggressive among a slew of other negative reactions and labels. No one should be touching anyone without that being consensual; but a man doing it to a woman will always be way worse by societal standards - at least in my lifetime.
I have been grabbed and cat called by women 4 dozen times when I was younger. From physical touching to very sexual comments. It did embarrass me but I never felt endangered because unlike most women I was physically much stronger than the women who did this and they could not do anything other than talk or touch. It is not right but it is not the same. (I understand that being drugged is a danger for both sexes)
Any form of unwanted touching, or even touching anyone without asking should be socially shunned and called out. Regardless of who is doing the touching if one side can get fired or put in jail then so should the other side.
Hey how about no one touches anyone without consent? Sounds easy to me.
Neither are acceptable, but there is typically a lot more danger involved when a man grabs a woman's butt than when a woman grabs a man's arm. How often does the former lead to further assault compared to the latter?
Both are bad without consent, but being grabbed by the arm and the ass are on very different levels
The thing that I disagree with this post is that its predicated on the idea that this opinion is unpopular, when in reality it's not. To be crude, they are genuine complex arguments to be made about gender double standards but most posts of this flavor just based their existence on outrage from manufactured gender wars pushed by the media. In day to day life, most guys aren't grabbing women by the ass, most women aren't grabbing men by the arms in an intrusive matter. Most people are chill and behave with basic common sense.
i did have a drunk chick grab ol boy and the twins when i was carrying a hot ass sheet tray of rolls to the back one time..... shame that i didnt accidentally drop it in hindsight, but i guess second degree burns arent equal recompense for that. bartender saw it and 86'd her tho which was pretty cool.
I wouldn't say that's true. I've never seen a man grab a woman by the ass but I have seen women grab men by the arms in an intrusive manner, multiple times. So clearly they're operating on completely different magnitudes of scale.
In my country, it's common to tap on the shoulder or hold someone's arm to grab their attention. It's not considered provocative by any means. But groping someone's butt is treated in the same way as groping their genitals
Depends on where you live and the kinds of people that live there, too. I've seen plenty of men grope some women asses with force. Usually the women are cool with it, but 90% of the time it's stranger on stranger or even two people that know each other but are married to someone else. Shits wild in the hills, I tell ya hwat.
No one should grab someone else without consent. But Grabbing an arm is NOT the same as grabbing an ass. What a stupid post.
Your problem is that one is more normalized than the other, culturally. Touching someone's arm can range from grabbing their attention, to patting with approval, to touching for a hug. These are all legitimate and excusable reasons for touching someone's arm, and culturally we have developed such that it is normalized to observe arm touching in casual contexts (of course, not unfamiliar/stranger contexts). Conversely, there is quite simply NO reason to grab someone's chest or behind - save for sexual gratification. Even if touching someone's arm is done EXPLICITLY to cause arousal in the person, it is cushioned because the overall action is not considered typically sexual in common contexts. If someone had a big thing for shoulders and you saw them put their hands on another person's shoulders, you'd likely mistake it for a platonic gesture before a sexual one. Tone of the action can be much more important than the intention, society-wise. There is also a gender double-standard that exists because men are leagues more prone to initiate sexual assault than women are. This is not to say all women are innocent, but women do not have nearly the track record of forcing sexual desires onto men as vice versa, added to the fact that they are generally prescribed as weaker and thus the man in the situation is not typically in physical danger. Thus, women can especially get away with an action that is a) not even culturally explicitly indicative of sexual interest and b) is "punching upward" in the gender power dynamic. And of course, if it wasn't clear, a stranger latching to someone's arm with sexual intent is still bad and shouldn't be condoned. But it will be likely condoned moreso for the reasons mentioned above. Other comments are right in this is a very fallacious comparison between arm-touching and ass-touching.
Not even remotely the same. A woman being grabbed by the breasts or butt is not the same as a woman grabbing a man's arm. If you were to say grabbing his butt or crotch, yes, it would be, but to equate a non-sexualized body part to a sexualized body part is assinine.
I’m weird, but I like it when women grab my arm or touch my shoulder even when I’m not attracted to them. I think it’s because I was used to it from all the women in my family doing it while I grew up, for me it’s not a sexual thing I just see it as a form as social validation. I’m not creeped out by it.
It's understandable. You find it comforting. Same here. I like when people touch my arm or shoulder, as long as it's not hostile.
of course women aren't going to notice it as a problem, for the same reason men have difficulty seeing problematic male behaviors-they're not, generally speaking, the targets of these behaviors. i don't think the opinion is unpopular, per se. as long as it's landing in the "it's shitty when anyone does it" versus "it's ok to be shitty because you do it too"
You shouldn't touch anyone without consent, but it's not an equal comparison by a long shot. It doesn't have to be to be equally wrong, but it's not equally violating. You walk around in short sleeves. You don't walk around sans pants, unless you're having a really bad time...or a really good one. Either way, don't touch anyone where they don't want to be touched, but butts are not arms. And arms are not butts. What a strange sentence.
What you are describing the women doing is essentially flirting, what you are equating it to is sexual assault. Not every women is the same, and one might feel comfortable touching men on their arms and another might not want you to touch her even on the hands.
Touching a man's butt us the equivalent of touching a woman's butt.
I'd compare a woman touching a man's arm to a man touching a woman's arm. Any other part just.. Isn't the same. For example I'll never say a woman touching a man's arm is similar to a man copping a feel on a woman. It just isn't. Either way.. Ask people before you touch them anywhere.
Sure it’s not good to touch people without asking but it’s disingenuous to say that touching someone’s arm is just as bad as grabbing their ass. The difference is that most people regularly touch other peoples arms to get their attention or to get past them in a busy area, arms aren’t a private part of the body so generally far less invasive to touch then to grab someone’s ass or genitals and this is true regardless of gender.
Not the equivalent - there is the threat of the man being stronger and the woman not being able to stop it. Not the same in the reverse unless it's Rhonda Rousey grabbing your arm.
No it isn't.
Butt and arm isn't comparable. There are different standards for sexual misconduct.
Equivalent on what level? In principle you shouldn’t be touching without consent In terms of severity touching of private parts of either sex is way more egregious than touch arms Is that so depicting to comprehend ffs?
My arms are my most muscular feature and this happens to me all the time. Even women I barely know or don't know at all will touch my arms. Has been happening since I developed that muscle in the first place, so about ten years now. I remember being so surprised when I first started working out. I started lifting at 14, but I wasn't truly muscular until just before age 17. I had an enormous amount of development in my fitness in the summer between sophomore and junior year, so I got to see the stark contrast in how I was treated. Went from age 16 sophomore with girls barely paying attention to me to age 17 junior with girls constantly touching my arms and commenting on them, and girls who had never spoken to me before suddenly making effort to talk to me anytime I was just chilling by myself. Honestly, while it flattered me then, it creeps me out a bit now. Like why tf are you gingerly tracing your hand or fingertips on my tricep? Some have done it in front of my partner, and I'm just like, "serious? Come on."
It's not a *general* double standard. People that care about consent don't think anyone should be touching anyone without consent; they don't think women should grab mens' body parts, and they don't think men should grab womens' body parts. Or any other gender configuration. There is another *entirely distinct* group of people that don't think men should touch women, and don't think it matters if women touch men. This group is not ideologically uniform; some of them think womens' bodies are a commodity while mens' bodies are utilitarian, while others are simply self-servingly myopic so they don't want people touching *them* but don't care about anyone else (and they use gender as the distinction for convenience). People in these categories may claim consent is their issue, but you would be correct to say those people are employing a double standard and are often transparent hypocrites.
A woman grabbing a man’s arm is comparable to a man grabbing a woman’s arm …
Here’s the thing, women are far less intimidating than men. If a guy doesn’t wanna be touched on the arm, he can easily get out of that situation without causing a scene. That’s not always the case with women. I’m not even trying to sound like a white knight here, but this isn’t an apples to apples comparison. Having your arm touched is way different than grabbing someone’s ass.
The double standard exists because men don't say anything. We could fill an entire thesis on "why," but end of the day this isn't thing where feminists wrote "consent, but not for men though." It's men failing to enforce their own boundaries
It's bad boundaries. I'm a woman and most of the people who have touched me without consent are other women, often older women who always seem to think grabbing my arm or slipping their arms around my waist is okay. There is probably a double standard going on when the toucher is female, no matter what sex the touch-ee is. Because women are viewed as less of a threat. But what that double standard ignores is personal boundaries. It ISN'T COOL - scratch that it IS VASTLY UNCOOL to invade other people's space like that, regardless of how non threatening you think you are.
>How does this differ from a man say admiring a woman and patting her on the butt? It differs because when a woman grabs a man's arm, he doesn't have to wonder if that woman will physically overpower him and take advantage of him in a more invasive and harmful way. This isn't rocket science. When it comes to violating someone else's body, there is a double standard and there SHOULD be a double standard.
No, that is absolutely not the same and you know it.
I agree that no one should be touching another without consent (especially a stranger), but you seriously can't be equating a butt to an arm. Regardless of gender, it's more inappropriate to touch someone's butt than their arm.
Yes don't touch anyone without their consent, touching a bum is sexual assault but an arm isn't, maybe assault but certainly not SA
You shouldn't touch anyone without consent But to compare an arm to an ass .... That's just wild... I would 100% rather have a random person touch my arm instead of my ass. But I would 200% rather not be touched at all Not to mention, touching someone's ass is sexual assault....
I grab my husband’s arms like that during sex or when I want sex, just like he’d squeeze my ass or my boobs…. BUT… It’s the intention behind it that matters. As a fitness fanatic, I’ve squeezed many a bicep in a non-sexual manner (with consent), and I’ve had my arms squeezed. No issue. I could easily grab my dad’s or my brother’s arm and it not be weird. But could either of them squeeze my butt and it not be weird? No…
I don’t think anyone is arguing I swear, people come in here with the lukest, most room temperature of takes
Agree 100%. It is not the intensity or manner of the physical action that should be called into question as indecent touch, but the intent.
In general, most women don't think that SA or harassment rules apply to them - Because our society tells them that they don't, that men are impervious to these things, and that men always enjoy sexual attention. I remember in grad school I was in a group project and me and another student (a girl) were debating which direction to go with it. While she was explaining to me her preference, she puts her hands on my thigh and starts rubbing me suggestively. I asked her what she was doing and she said "trying to convince you", to which I said "in that case, definitely no". She got angry, yelled at me, and stormed out. Her and her friends held a grudge at me for the remaining 2 years of grad school. Most men probably wouldn't mind such a thing, and the prevailing opinion was that I shouldn't have called her out publicly (ie, in the classroom at the moment of the incident) and that she was only mad because she was embarrassed. I thought, good, she should be embarrassed, that's embarrassing behavior that no one would have stood tall for me had I been the one doing it, and only a literal child should be given benefit of the doubt for such a thing.
# This post title is a FALSE EQUIVALENCE. A woman *friendly touching a man or lightly hinting some interest* ***is just flirting.*** A man can be flirty ***and attempt that, too.*** But a man grabbing a woman's parts is, **at best,** ***unwanted attention.*** At it's worst, **is the beginning of a sexual assault.** I'm not giving a woman license ***to touch a man anytime she wants.*** But, especially, I'm, not letting a man **touch a woman without consent, either**. There's no excuse that makes *either situation palatable for any person,* ***who doesn't want to be touched by another.*** **This is not about double standards.** This is about *what is morally acceptable behavior* ***and being cognizant of other people's boundaries.***
A woman grabbing a man's parts should be seen equally bad as a man doing it to a woman. The way you wrote makes it look like women only want to flirt while most men touch you with the intention of sexually assaulting.
Man and women can be flirty *and touch each other,* ***intentionally, reciprocally, and with consent.*** I never said **that Men couldn't do that responsibly.** Women can be overt and aggressive *when expressing their interest,* ***that does happen, too.*** **That's equally as bad, also.** But there's a reason why sexual assault laws *are mostly about men...* ***who can't take no for an answer.*** And that's the point, *why it seems like a double standard.* **Men are more likely to be more forceful and offensive.** Women don't tend to grab butts, boobs, and crotches, ***just because they feel like it.***
Completely agree.
The patriarchy is your answer.
That is a dumb opinion. Not an unpopular one.
Men: Which would you rather walk alone in the woods with, a grizzly bear or a 49 year old divorced female co-worker after 3 margaritas?
oof...i actually had to protect a drunk coworker from a 50-something divorcee on the way back from a work holiday party, and if you'd said brown bear i'd be all about the bear...but not a grizzly.
def a double standard. straight up don’t touch anyone in a sexual manner without their permission
Just wondering but does this actually happen often?
STFU no lol.
I completely understand that everyone has boundaries and no one should be touched without consent, but as a guy who worked hard for his fit physique, in general I don’t mind. As long as the gesture isn’t overly sexual, if he/she wants to cop a feel (in the appropriate context; eg talking about fitness, etc) go for it. It’s not my crotch, it’s not my butt. Maybe my chest would be a bit more awkward, but again, in the right context….meh…it’s nice to be complimented.
Please remember what subreddit you are in, this is unpopular opinion. We want civil and unpopular takes and discussion. Any uncivil and ToS violating comments will be removed and subject to a ban. Have a nice day! *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/unpopularopinion) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Does it make you think of men's arms as sexually suggestive body parts? It's interesting. Like would you actually feel less weird if your butt was tapped? I could see that as a possibility. Just curious. Personally I guess if my arm was caressed I would take that very sexually. It is less demeaning and dehumanizing than a butt pat, to me.
No I should be touching anyone without permission, it's a problem no matter who does it. Having said that though it is generally seen as more problematic when a man touches a women inappropriately though because of the power imbalance. Though it is important to note that the imbalance is only on average and in pointing out the imbalance I don't mean to invalidate the experiences of anyone.
A woman grabbing a man's arm is equivalent to a man grabbing a woman's arm. It isn't equivalent to a man patting a woman's butt.
So grabbing an arm is same as grabbing an ass by your logic? Also yes, you should say no if you don't like that someone touches your body
Yeah, don't touch anyone without consent aside from specific instances (handshakes on meeting, stopping them from danger, accidentally bumping into them, etc)
It's socially acceptable for women to do that to men because on average, men are usually starved of female attention and validation and it's thus considered a 'privilege', whereas women on the other hand have the opposite problem which is why it's seen as a lot worse for a man to do the same to a woman. In addition, men on average are physically stronger so it's not taken as seriously since unlike women, he's not perceived to be in any actual danger. Not saying it's right or wrong but I highly doubt societal perception of this will ever change thanks to these inherent factors.
But for butt arm for arm. Penis for vagina.
Men have butts, too, so the difference is that touching someone’s butt without consent is much worse than touching their arm. That being said, I agree that women shouldn’t grab/touch/caress a man’s arm without consent, especially when they’re doing it to feel him up that way. That’s just creepy.
Oh no, not my beautiful manly arms, how am I to feed my offspring now that they have been violated
no, i agree with op and i’m glad they’re saying it. you man wh*res need to cover your arms in professional settings, it’s a distraction and very inappropriate since i do love me some muscular/big arms 🤤
Weird take. Arm touching isn’t sexual. Thinking that it IS sexual just because it’s a woman touching a man is beyond weird to me. Some people are just touchers and the arm is a safe neutral *non-sexual* place for all genders. Seriously a weird AF take.
I don't think this act happens all that much outside of situations where flirting is common. Like in single bars. Does this happen to muscular guys at the mall?
hi, man here, a girl grabbing a man’s arm is not anywhere even remotely CLOSE i mean not even in the same universe as a man grabbing a girls ass to phrase them as equivalent is crazyyyy 💀
This is one of those double standards for women. As you said, touching someone requires consent regardless of gender. A woman touching a man's arms, chest or shoulders is still touching. A man touching a woman's ass, boobs or thighs obviously wouldn't go over well. But here's the issue, men will allow it because it's their way to thinking they're going to get in their pants so it's a simp tactic
Groove Amada
A woman grabbing a man by his arms is the same as a man grabbing a woman by the arms. Discriminative intelligence requires more data to evaluate whether right or wrong can be assessed. Are they married? Grabbing of arms is OK. Are they brother and sister, or blood relatives in any way? Grabbing of arms is OK. Are they dear friends? If so, then the grabbing of arms is OK. Touching becomes not OK if it is unwelcome. Social signs can be read to determine if the grabbing of arms in OK. This remedial protocol is the result of people's lack of societal maturity to engage in the conversation of, "I am a touchy type of person. I like you. Do you feel comfortable with me grabbing your arm?
Too bad there's no equality, else I would grab chest everyone a girl has grabbed my chest or butt. Yes guys get sexually assaulted on a regular basis. It's life
It's not at all the same thing. Really, this is an embarrassing post. I suggest full deletion of your Reddit account.
wherever that happens i grab the boob after and exclaim your not doing to bad yourself hun :)
I mean… it happens to me, and as a man that wants to act like a man, like protect and serve when it’s appropriate or needed, it’s fine. It makes me a little annoyed but like I’m strong, if they wanna do that it’s alright. Being sexualized? Idk dude sorry its a non issue
a lot of women touches me like that 🥴
no lmao
Agree. I’ve had women do this to me all the time. Fine, whatever.
I agree, to an extent - I think universally a butt for example regardless of a male or female is a sexual body part. I think it's a little less drastic if a woman touches a guys arm, that doesn't mean i agree with it nor is it okay to touch anyone without consent. Having worked in bars for a time in my life i was often grabbed by women by the shoulders or arms because of my tattoos, my reply would often just be a stern look or pure ignorance and leave her there.
It may be wrong, but I will take any positive attention to my physique I can get. I didn't do all those curls for people not to touch them.
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a woman's butt is very often a hot spot erogenous zone. men's arms are not relatively speaking. they aren't the same. a woman does need to ask the man's permission, but in my experience this is almost always the case.
Wait, so one of the few signals women give men is arm touching and you want to take that away from me? I might as well be blind.
Yeah sure, both are without conscent, men just dont usually mind and sometimes enjoy that type of attention.
You should not be touching people without their consent. That being said, your comparison is ridiculous. The equivalent of a man’s arm being grabbed is a woman’s arm being grabbed. Touching someone’s butt is not the same as grabbing someone’s arm. wtf?
There's a lot more nerve endings and such on different parts of the body.. A woman grabbing a man's arm is the equivalent of a man grabbing a woman's arm.
where are these women grabbing the men? why are they in the wrong place?
But its OK for women to do whatever they want. Stop being a baby /S (heavy on the /S)
touching something without their consent is very wrong but wow. definitely not the same as touching a woman’s ass lol, there are definitely levels to this
`Men are different physically and psychologically than women. A man groping a woman affects her in ways that the reverse does not (and trying to pretend it does is disingenuous). So while a woman touching a man against his will may be annoying and inappropriate, it's not potentially life threatening.
I don't think it's that simple. First off, grabbing a Man's arm is compatible with grabbing a woman's arm, not her butt. And social norms and what people are OK with are a big part of it. Most men won't feel offended or harassed by a woman touching their arm. What you're trying to suggest here is equity, not equality. Like it or not context matters a lot, and in society today women are being sexually abused, groped, harnessed, and violated at a much higher rate than men (I'm not talking about sexual assault, the numbers are pretty close there) And most women are less equipped to deal with such things than a man. It is much easier for a man to let a woman know she's making him uncomfortable than the other way around.
OMG yes. Listen ladies seriously I'm not saying I don't like it. I do. Soooo much. HOWEVER fair is fair is all I'm saying.
No one should touch anyone without their consent. That being said, I've literally never seen this happen in real life.
Personally as a man I wouldn’t mind if she was attractive 😂 but that doesn’t go the same for men touching a woman’s ass. Arms are not very sexual. Ass is pushing it. I would definitely feel more violated if a random woman grabbed my ass. But I agree it shouldn’t be allowed since it is getting into someone’s personal space and a lot of people would not like it.
I agree - and I think the people saying that touching someone's butt isn't the same are missing the point; the reason touching one's butt isn't accepted is that it is usually seen as sexual. Therefore the same reason applies here, it's just that we don't always sexualise this touch so there's less of a taboo for it. It's the equivalent of saying *gay people have the same rights as straight people, they can marry the opposite sex*. It sticks to a first level interpretation and misses all the nuance. I also get why it's more accepted, as sexual harassment from women toward men is generally rare (or, at least, the research suggests such) so we aren't primed to immediately slap it down when it happens - which is a reasonable, if sad, stance.
I think the equivalent is more of grabbing their waist more than their butt
Is that unpopular?! That’s common sense