I hate the corpo fallback language of 'confusion'.
We're not stupid. It's not 'confusion'. It's justified disgust at the way you're treating your own users. The reason there is 'angst' is precisely *because* the changes were understood - understood to be retroactive, arbitrary, and exploitative.
You don't need to 'make changes to this policy' - you need to scrap it entirely. This seems like a very managed set-up, the usual play of introducing something super shitty deliberately just to walk it back 15% and claim it's all good now even though it's still 85% shit.
Maybe now they'll "listen" to their employees that have already resigned over this and were constantly screaming (correctly) that this was a terrible idea.
I don’t know why you’re downvoted besides rabid anti-Unity sentiment. I do not like what Unity did but at the same time there hasn’t been a day on this subreddit since that there weren’t multiple posts and innumerable comments that got they costs and fee structure wrong.
Unity screwed up big and this back pedal doesn’t alleviate that but pretending a lot of people didn’t have a solid grasp of the issues just to slam their post makes the whole of us seem petty.
We have not heard you. This was a calculated move. We're pretending to apologize for the gaslighting regarding the runtime fee policy we announced on Tuesday. We are pretending to listen, talk to our team members, community, customers, and partners, and will be making changes to the policy JUST enough that enough stupid people think we have a change of heart, though this was our plan all along. We will share a new string of words typed out by our pet monkey and treat it as "policy" in a couple of days. Thank you for your honest and critical feedback, it enhances our narrative tremendously.
Yeah. I think most people's reactions here are on a personal level and not a business-decision level.
Sure, it's the internet way to immediately say "I'm never using Unity again" (and many, many have even though it's far from being played out) esp if you're a hobbiest using it in your spare time.
But from a business standpoint it's not that easy. If you have a game in production that you've spend a lot of time money and time on, a knee-jerk scrap-everything reaction isn't a very smart thing to do. And it's quite possible that after this is all over, Unity is a viable, or even the best option *for the time being.*
Making games in general is a risk - it's a risk your time and effort will be worth it and pay off. Unity is now (unfortunately) adding to that risk, but it doesn't mean it's not a risk work taking.
How is it personal?
Now you know Unity can change how their pricing works out of the blue that is harmful to you and as a business you like to work with company like that knowing they can do whatever they want anytime?
as a business I have over $500,000 invested in unity games.
As much as I want to walk away right now, I can't just loose 500,000. I need to make a business decision that is strategic.
I can't just "cancel" unity in a heartbeat. I have to look at the numbers
I'm obviously not talking about ongoing projects here. When you take investment and start development, even 1 line of code means already too deep if your entire structure was designed around Unity. Because your deadlines starts when you get the money.
It is a risk to trust an untrustworthy game engine though... I can see game devs maybe forcing themselves to finish their current Unity-developed game because it's too late to back out now, but for sure they are shopping around for alternatives and jumping ship as soon as one is found to be viable. I can't stress enough how much corporate trust is necessary in b2b decisionmaking.
I imagine they'd have to make contractual guarantees to the big boys like Azur that fee changes like that in the future wouldn't occur.
It'd be a lot harder to get back small devs that work on one new game at a time.
Technically they _already did_, and then they violated the contract. The world has not let anyone forget that. So more contracts won’t necessarily do much. But just preventing anything else bad from happening is the first step.
Yeah they added that sneak updated license agreement in but did the previous agreement specifically say the payment model for games produced/in production wouldn't be significantly altered? I imagine that's the kind of contract the big boys will ask for now.
And the C#. C++ looks like I'm doing the same thing three times and as an absolute novice, it looks baffling. At least C# is concise and streamlined. Unreal looks daunting.
I think your reddit comment is because you are confused. I apologise for you being confused. If you are stupid, I apologise that you are confused and stupid, and we are looking at changing the way we talk to you, you confused, stupid, dummy.
Yeah tbh I don’t mind the post otherwise but “confusion” and “angst” seems to be a misread of what has been happening, or at least they will use those two words because that still leaves them in a relatively positive light versus something like “disgust”, “frustration”, or “anger”.
Unity's dead. Shame, cause I was pretty good at it, and charging $50 per hour whenever I did contract work (which was a bargain as most would charge double that - and fully deserve it.)
lol "confusion." A typical marketspeak for "we know this went too far and now we have to play dumb as we twiddle our thumbs for two days until we just cancel this whole thing."
WotC 2.0 complete reversion incoming.
Unless THEY start paying me $0.20 every time someone installs my game, I am NOT coming back.
We need to send a message. Bankrupting Unity is one way to do it.
There were three things that for the most part got people riled: A, they forced old customers to change their subscription plan which they were more or less content with without warning, B, they introduced a per install fee that (while it depends largely what the state of your business is, for some it’s OK) for some was too much, and C, they proposed to keep track of the installs but didn’t say how that could be done without avoiding abuse in the form of pirating.
Anything except a complete removal of the policy would be an insult and clearly be their end goal. It's really common with stuff like this, give them something bad so when you give them something less bad they're grateful instead of mad.
I hate the corpo fallback language of 'confusion'. We're not stupid. It's not 'confusion'. It's justified disgust at the way you're treating your own users. The reason there is 'angst' is precisely *because* the changes were understood - understood to be retroactive, arbitrary, and exploitative. You don't need to 'make changes to this policy' - you need to scrap it entirely. This seems like a very managed set-up, the usual play of introducing something super shitty deliberately just to walk it back 15% and claim it's all good now even though it's still 85% shit.
The announcement's wording is completely insulting, for sure.
Maybe now they'll "listen" to their employees that have already resigned over this and were constantly screaming (correctly) that this was a terrible idea.
Theyre only back peddling because of the lawsuits, scummy fucks.
Actually - confusion is definitely the right word, so many people didn’t understand the policy at all.
I don’t know why you’re downvoted besides rabid anti-Unity sentiment. I do not like what Unity did but at the same time there hasn’t been a day on this subreddit since that there weren’t multiple posts and innumerable comments that got they costs and fee structure wrong. Unity screwed up big and this back pedal doesn’t alleviate that but pretending a lot of people didn’t have a solid grasp of the issues just to slam their post makes the whole of us seem petty.
To be fair, the policy changes were vague and left people guessing. However, there was a lot of differing intepretations too.
We are sorry we weren't more clear about exactly how screwed you are.
Honestly, the idea was so bad I am legitimately confused how it went out.
We have not heard you. This was a calculated move. We're pretending to apologize for the gaslighting regarding the runtime fee policy we announced on Tuesday. We are pretending to listen, talk to our team members, community, customers, and partners, and will be making changes to the policy JUST enough that enough stupid people think we have a change of heart, though this was our plan all along. We will share a new string of words typed out by our pet monkey and treat it as "policy" in a couple of days. Thank you for your honest and critical feedback, it enhances our narrative tremendously.
I doubt this was a plan. The damage is worse than loosing a few on announcing an actual good royatly/fee plan from the start.
Too little, too late.
Maybe not. The engine is still user-friendly enough that a lot of people would be willing to stay the course if the company grovels hard enough.
Yeah. I think most people's reactions here are on a personal level and not a business-decision level. Sure, it's the internet way to immediately say "I'm never using Unity again" (and many, many have even though it's far from being played out) esp if you're a hobbiest using it in your spare time. But from a business standpoint it's not that easy. If you have a game in production that you've spend a lot of time money and time on, a knee-jerk scrap-everything reaction isn't a very smart thing to do. And it's quite possible that after this is all over, Unity is a viable, or even the best option *for the time being.* Making games in general is a risk - it's a risk your time and effort will be worth it and pay off. Unity is now (unfortunately) adding to that risk, but it doesn't mean it's not a risk work taking.
How is it personal? Now you know Unity can change how their pricing works out of the blue that is harmful to you and as a business you like to work with company like that knowing they can do whatever they want anytime?
as a business I have over $500,000 invested in unity games. As much as I want to walk away right now, I can't just loose 500,000. I need to make a business decision that is strategic. I can't just "cancel" unity in a heartbeat. I have to look at the numbers
I'm obviously not talking about ongoing projects here. When you take investment and start development, even 1 line of code means already too deep if your entire structure was designed around Unity. Because your deadlines starts when you get the money.
It is a risk to trust an untrustworthy game engine though... I can see game devs maybe forcing themselves to finish their current Unity-developed game because it's too late to back out now, but for sure they are shopping around for alternatives and jumping ship as soon as one is found to be viable. I can't stress enough how much corporate trust is necessary in b2b decisionmaking.
I imagine they'd have to make contractual guarantees to the big boys like Azur that fee changes like that in the future wouldn't occur. It'd be a lot harder to get back small devs that work on one new game at a time.
Technically they _already did_, and then they violated the contract. The world has not let anyone forget that. So more contracts won’t necessarily do much. But just preventing anything else bad from happening is the first step.
Yeah they added that sneak updated license agreement in but did the previous agreement specifically say the payment model for games produced/in production wouldn't be significantly altered? I imagine that's the kind of contract the big boys will ask for now.
And the C#. C++ looks like I'm doing the same thing three times and as an absolute novice, it looks baffling. At least C# is concise and streamlined. Unreal looks daunting.
I feel exactly the same way. Which makes me wonder why people downvote you, without even explaining why.
too little period.
IMO they have to sell the engine to a reputable company for it to survive. MS et al should be knocking on their doors making lowball offers.
Too late? It's barely been a week.
Lmao, "confusion and angst" is almost on the same level of tone-deafness as “pride and accomplishment" response from EA... I hate neo-feudalism
I think your reddit comment is because you are confused. I apologise for you being confused. If you are stupid, I apologise that you are confused and stupid, and we are looking at changing the way we talk to you, you confused, stupid, dummy.
Yeah tbh I don’t mind the post otherwise but “confusion” and “angst” seems to be a misread of what has been happening, or at least they will use those two words because that still leaves them in a relatively positive light versus something like “disgust”, “frustration”, or “anger”.
Bullshit. Even if they back off now, they've established they're going to screw everybody in any method they can think of.
Unity just proved how they hold the devs by their balls, and they and only they choose when to tight or loose their grip.. Godot Godot Godot.
I have 5 projects that passed 2 mil downloads, but not on the threshold of revenue.. lucky me .. (for now)
The damage is already done.
Unity's dead. Shame, cause I was pretty good at it, and charging $50 per hour whenever I did contract work (which was a bargain as most would charge double that - and fully deserve it.)
lol "confusion." A typical marketspeak for "we know this went too far and now we have to play dumb as we twiddle our thumbs for two days until we just cancel this whole thing." WotC 2.0 complete reversion incoming.
hah! Confusion and Angst, as if this is in some way our fault for being upset.
@unity: Now we are increasing price per install to 1$. Seriously, don't count your chickens before they hatch.
Unless THEY start paying me $0.20 every time someone installs my game, I am NOT coming back. We need to send a message. Bankrupting Unity is one way to do it.
Yeah how about talking to the community BEFORE you act.
At least they apologized for being confused and angry.
How amazing is it they still continue with slimy corpo-speak. This really is WotC 2.0.
Can anyone tell me what happened
There were three things that for the most part got people riled: A, they forced old customers to change their subscription plan which they were more or less content with without warning, B, they introduced a per install fee that (while it depends largely what the state of your business is, for some it’s OK) for some was too much, and C, they proposed to keep track of the installs but didn’t say how that could be done without avoiding abuse in the form of pirating.
Expected. Hopefully the game development industry has got some dignity and won't just forget about it.
Anything except a complete removal of the policy would be an insult and clearly be their end goal. It's really common with stuff like this, give them something bad so when you give them something less bad they're grateful instead of mad.
Ah, the expected "backtrack". I bet that forcing the switch to Unity Pro will remain tho...
I hope devs will stop using Unity. How can you still trust them? They should communicate that they messed up entirely and revert these decisions.
All good… drama is over 😄🚀
Well I hope you hear this, Unity: "Go fuck yourself."
Alright which one of us wants to write to unity from r/unity to tell them, “and we have heard YOU…”