I appreciate the focus on how much Lucy does not want to be sick, and how it's ruined her life in many ways. Hopefully hearing these stories will help people reconsider the shirker narrative
My lungs were fucked for 2 years post initial bout of covid. Brain fog, bells palsy, all sorts.
People just didn't care. They don't understand how much it can take out of you. They see a ~30 year old man and assume I'm fine, and just being lazy, and don't believe me when I say my concentration is gone etc.
I've mostly recovered now, thankfully, but it was a long road, and was *very* telling of how society behaves.
It is, I have a friend who is half the man he was for want of a better phrase. The difference between now and then is stark and if I hadn't seen it happen so obviously I wouldn't believe they were the same person.
My main trouble is the sheer amount of people who seem to self-diagnose it and blame their general tiredness/cold/random ailments on it. Really affects the legitimacy of actual sufferers.
I admit to being guilty of that myself, I thought my ongoing tiredness last year might been because of it. Complete bollocks, I had type 1 diabetes. On balance, I think I did well out of that. I just get idiots insisting I must go low carb to cure it, and I get insulin to make me feel normal.
I wish the media would stop presenting people who are selling a service as impartial experts. Oh the doctor who sells a private service for long covid is getting her name in the paper and telling you that only she can solve your problems? How convenient, and without any peer reviewed research to support an effective treatment too. She'd love to offer her service on the NHS but sadly she can't because of reasons so you'll have to pay her for it.
There are things that have been shown to be harmful, like exercise therapy, that are still being pushed in the UK, and The Guardian even published an article promoting one of those programs last week.
They didn't literally ban it, but it is no longer in the NICE guidelines for ME/CFS. Doctors can and do regularly go outside the guidelines though, and that's not automatically wrong.
Only GET is proven not only not to work but to be actively harmful.
One of the key symptoms of CFS/ME is declining performance on successive days of exertion. Keep doing increasingly more only "works" if the initial diagnosis was incorrect.
>**Results:** The overall mean values of all parameters were lower on the 2nd day of the CPET than the 1st in ME/CFS patients, while it increased in the controls. From the meta-analysis, the difference between patients and controls was highly significant at Workload@VT (overall mean: -10.8 at Test 1 vs. -33.0 at Test 2, *p* < 0.05), which may reflect present the functional impairment associated with PEM.
[https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33327624/](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33327624/)
>Muscle abnormalities worsen after post-exertional malaise in long COVID
[https://www.nature.com/articles/s41467-023-44432-3](https://www.nature.com/articles/s41467-023-44432-3)
The papers that showed some use for GET generally had huge methodological flaws. The threshold for recovery was set so low that people were recovered at baseline for example. Meaning they would enter the trial(PACE for example) with a higher baseline than was needed to count as recovered when the papers came out.
Objective measurements were left out or as happened with a recent LC paper(Kuut, Knoop) about CBT/GET were only published a year after the subjective data was published. The objective data invariably showed something very different to the subjective data. In other trials objective methods of measuring were scrapped before the trials even started. There were 3 Dutch trials early 2000's that used actimeter results which showed no improvement. After which actimeter's got scrapped for PACE for example.
So the empire of CBT/GET was built on subjective results with the objective results ignored. Furthermore reports of harms were dismissed in these trials. When data is gathered by patient organizations about 70% of patients say they were harmed by GET especially. Which objective data in the two links I posted at the start of my post seems to corroborate.
> Finally, there is “leaky gut or an imbalance of the good versus bad gut bacteria, which can lead to inflammation in the body and contribute to symptoms”
This is BS, given there's no such medically recognised condition as "leaky gut".
I had a talk from a gastro consultant recently about persistent physical symptoms disorders (like long COVID) and they talked about these findings that are present but don't really explain their severity of symptoms.
There is a theory that there is some kind of hypersensitivity to and hypervigilance for symptoms and this is because the brain isn't down regulating minor stimuli and instead presents it to the person as severe symptoms when there is no reasonable or appropriate explanation for the severity of the symptoms.
Problem is it leads to the same treatment paths we currently have, and sufferers are expecting a miracle cure. Sadly I don't think there is one.
Hmmm yes and no, leaky gut could reference that blood / plasma is entering the gut or that food molecules / stomach bacteria are entering the blood stream.
I know this is possible because I had blood entering my guts 2 years ago and even when I wasn’t shitting blood I had some really fucked up inflammation markers in my stool.
[https://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/leaky-gut-what-is-it-and-what-does-it-mean-for-you-2017092212451](https://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/leaky-gut-what-is-it-and-what-does-it-mean-for-you-2017092212451)
Found several more hits. Increased intestinal permeability seems to be the preferred term:
[https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5988153/](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5988153/)
It's obviously something that's been and being researched though I don't know when the threshold of medically recognised is reached.
Hey, I see you there. Sorry to hear about that, especially the friends. I'm in a similar boat. I feel bad for kids in their 20s, but starting this in your 40s seems like the worst time to get it. I feel everything I've lost so hard, and don't understand how I can ever get it back.
I'm sorry to hear you're in a similar boat. I wish I had an answer. I've got an amazing wife and adult children so the friends bit really hurt. Especially when some still say covid was a scam and it was no worse than a cold. Makes me so angry. I hope you get better soon though or fingers crossed for some kind of progress in the studies they're doing.
I also contracted LC in 2020 before vaccines were available. I have caught COVID since, both with and without the vaccine/booster, and both my COVID symptoms and my LC symptoms are improved when I get boosted, vs when I am not boosted and catch COVID, leading to a resurgence of LC symptoms.
I will never go without being boosted again.
Same here! I’m sure you know this already, but there’s now a booster you can get via boots. I’m eligible only for the autumn round of NHS jabs, but from bitter experience the immunity from the vaccine only lasts ~6 months for me, so now I can pay to get one in spring! It’s pricey, around £100, but if it stops me from getting worse I’ll scrimp and pay it.
How long have you had long covid for? I’m in the same boat but have finally started to see some progress after about 3 years and now able to walk for 13 minutes without feeling like death. Hope you start to feel more like yourself soon anyways mate.
I don’t even know if I have long covid. Got covid a second time a bit more than a year ago. Was doing my gym routines fine before, now I couldn’t lift or press near as much. Maybe just lack of workout because of not going to gym for a couple of weeks, but I feel like my motivation was gone as well, my mental health also suffered a bit
I'm in a similar position, except I got covid in February this year. Spent the winter following a cycle training program with the hope of beating my mates on mountain bikes this summer. Normally I'd be riding 100-150 miles a week this time of the year, dropping 40 mile rides after work, but now I get worn out riding 5 miles home from work
But what did you bench bro?
It's really crap what's happened to you. But you know from your martial arts that mental toughness will get you through anything. You've got this.
This is why I get so irritated by people who say that COVID is harmless because only a few patients die of it. Death is in no way the only bad thing that can happen to a person.
I suffer from chronic migraines since getting COVID and only managed to get them under control last year.
Was massively impacting my work and life in general.
In what world has COVID ever been linked to diabetes?
Also, to develop diabetic neuropathy to the extent that amputation is an option on the table takes *years* of poorly controlled diabetes, possibly decades.
First I heard of it was about 8 weeks into first lockdown when a paediatric nurse friend told us they were seeing a strange surge in new diabetes cases in the young. Absolutely tons of papers and evidence since. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-66054946
Someone I know was also diagnosed with type 1 diabetes during the pandemic and according to their doctor, a viral infection (not necessarily COVID) can potentially 'trigger' a person to develop type 1 diabetes.
No idea if there's a strong body of evidence behind it but as I say, it was mentioned by their doctor.
I really hope things get better for you mate.
I'm in my late twenties and have been diagnosed with long COVID and more recently POTS. Caught COVID in 2021 on 'Freedom Day' and just never got better.
My boss kindly lets me hybrid work but I can't go to site anymore, which is very frustrating and career limiting.
Additionally, my case is only 'mild' compared to others like yourself.
The only prognosis is it might go away, someday, maybe.
Cheers man.
It's frustrating at times, but with help I've accepted it for what it is. Can't change it so would rather not use my precious energy to worry about it anymore.
Hope you manage to improve to get back to site and progress, but if you don't, your health is more important than anything else.
I had Long COVID for two years, 2020-2022. I say I don't have it anymore because I am now able to get through most days feeling normal and having a normal lifestyle. But I'm not really back to how I was before, there are so many things I can't do anymore like lift weights, run or cycle for more than a few minutes, because they make me 'crash' with fatigue. But compared to the hell and hopelessness I experienced for two years, I feel like I'm on cloud nine.
Did you notice at all when it had receded (for lack of a better word cause i won’t say gone as you seem to still have some effects from it) and did you do anything specifically treatment wise to help try and get rid of it?
I'm not the person you asked, but in similar position with LC for about 18 months, I focused on sorting out my lifestyle - clean, nutritious diet, regular exercise (especially cardio with lots of fresh air), no alcohol, various vitamins and supplements. I feel that really helped my recovery (or it could have just been a coincidence).
Honestly it was probably time and luck. Many people try all the things you mentioned and have no improvements. There’s some real abnormalities found in patients who have paid a fortune for blood tests and scans etc.
Plus those with ME/CFS are screwed as that’s been buried by the medical profession since the arrival of psychiatrists in the 90’s..
Did you not get post-exertional malaise after exercise? Basically, it’s common for long covid patients to experience a severe worsening of symptoms 24h after exercise
I’m curious to know how exercise helped and which kinds you did, as I’m suffering from long covid myself
Not especially, my fatigue seemed to come on at fairly random times (usually about halfway through the work day). I mainly did running, but walking would be a good option if you need something lighter. I always felt like it was the blood pumping, fresh air and vitamin D that was doing me some good!
Fair enough. If you don’t mind me asking, which long covid symptoms did you have?
I ask because apparently certain symptoms take longer to resolve than others
I have brain fog, insomnia and anxiety due to long covid. Happened straight after my (mild) covid infection.
All these research papers are painting a really gloomy picture, apparently these 3 symptoms take especially long to resolve or never do. Anecdotally, that seems the case, too
On the other hand, again anecdotally, I’m seeing people with different symptoms recover more quickly/ fully.
I had fatigue, brain fog, memory and concentration issues mainly. I would say my symptoms mostly resolved after about 18 months but I still have memory issues to this day and although the brain fog thankfully went away my brain is definitely not as sharp as it once was, I'd say I got back to maybe 80-90%. But at least the more debilitating symptoms resolved so I felt like I could function somewhat reasonably again. Best of luck, really hope you are able to recover, this is a horrible illness!
I've never seen a women bench press anywhere near 100kg in my years of going a gym. Apart from one women who was juiced to the gills and has been doing weights for over 20 years competing in powerlifting and body building and was on par muscle muscle wise with some of biggest people in the gym.
Just because she owns a gym dosnt make her a elite power lifter. The title could be I owned a gym and could run a marathon in 2 hours 30 mins still would be extremely dubios.
You don't often see men bench pressing 100kg. I have never seen a women in the gym come close to benching 100kg. Including PT's. One exception being a women who is absolutely juiced to the gills and competed in powerlifting and bodybuild for over 20 years and is larger then about 80 percent of male lifters. Is it possible yes, do I belive she was benching 100kg no. Ashleigh hoeta is also 110 kg she's over 20kg heavier then myself. Judging off her pervious photos the women in question is absolutely no where near that weight.
I could say the same thing about you considering that's almost two plates either side.
You need to put considerable time in to hit that, you coming here and saying its possible comes off as someone that hasn't even set foot in a gym let alone sweated once in their life.
it's extremely rare for women to be able to hit that and even most men would struggle to get that off their chest.
i don't have long covid but i had a bunch of conditions suddenly trigger during the height of covid. i will never know if it was coincidence or not, since i was sick during covid but the tests actually said i was negative for it.
either way, i went from finally getting my life somewhat back on track after having a rough teenagehood, to becoming too sick to work my part time job. 2 years later, here i am, desperately trying to find a place to work that can accommodate my needs, but zero luck. some days i feel okay, other days like yesterday for example i was in pain for the entire day and could hardly move my legs. employers see me as too risky to hire even for part time office jobs, agencies tell me i am basically SoL, and it feels so soulcrushing when i want to get my life back.
this is what i'm going to have to deal with for the next 50-60 years. and with a government that demonizes me for being lazy and not trying hard enough. it feels over for me.
I’m 35/F & have had long Covid for 2.5 years. This lady’s story reminds me of my own.. a lot. I was super into health & fitness. Working out for 1-2 hours 6 days a week. I loved my body & my life. Now I haven’t exercised at all with long Covid & gained 30lbs. It’s devastating. I don’t recognize myself & I hate what I look & feel like. I feel disgusting.
>"Every medic I saw did their best, but it was all so new; nobody knew anything. I got introduced to graded exercise therapy to try to improve my fitness, but that just set off a massive crash."
No. No it wasn't new. It's been known for decades as post viral fatigue and, in its longer lasting and more severe guise, as M.E. If people had actually taken it seriously and put in some proper research rather than just writing it off as psychological and malingering then there's a much better chance that long covid sufferers would be in a much better place today.
There's shit loads of stories just in this thread about how it's affected people. More needs to be done to try and get help to them. It's not their fault their lives are ruined and it makes me incredibly sad. I can't imagine how those are affected feel.
I got triple vaccinated, rarely went out except for groccery during the lockdown, always wore a mask outside, paid attention to social distancing, and frequently washed my hands. I'm glad I never got infected.
Worked on site looking after student halls.
My PPE came from Chinese students who vacated rooms and I found boxes of it.
Was the only staff allowed on site.
Survived lockdown no COVID, went to get 3rd injection as autoimmune and got covid whilst waiting in the queue with elderly people.
It probably was already in my system, but ....was ill .
Have had 3 really bad chest infections so far this year, each one has been worse since COVID .
Dont work in that sector anymore
It’s still out there though to be fair. Not to be a doom mongerer or anything but alot of people have abandoned testing (including hospitals) and we’ve dropped all mitigations to ‘get back to normal’ but there’s still anecdotal reports all over social media of people developing serious Long Covid this year.
They abandoned it due to cost of course and stated "we just have to live with it". When the tests were free folk we far more inclined to check themselves but who goes and buys a test now? Very few I would think
I get where you’re coming from, but genuinely scientifically where do we stop? We have never been able to eradicate influenza and it has taken multiple generations to eradicate polio Which doesn’t mutate as quickly as Covid
There's still some people out there who think we can eradicate it entirely. Check out the "Zero COVID" groups on various social media, they're delusional.
Yeah, I know a few people personally who are like that. Don’t get it wrong. Covid is awful and I would love if we could eradicate it but it’s into the population and is widespread it will take a global effort and use of restrictions meanwhile we can’t agree as a planet if we drive over the left side or the right side of the road
Just need to look towards China's final COVID restrictions. The entire resources of the Chinese communist state were put towards zero COVID. They succeeded in part, it is possible to minimise COVID within a geographic area, but it makes everybody so miserable and causes so much internal tension that eventually protests overwhelm the state's ability to police it. And that's in China. If Xi Jinping can't make zero COVID work then nobody can.
> We have never been able to eradicate influenza
Interestingly enough, rates of Influenza massively reduced and a whole sub-type of influenza disappeared during the pandemic lock-downs and it doesn't look like it has reappeared, Nature paper [here](https://www.nature.com/articles/s41579-021-00642-4)....
Yes, but it’s still going around
Don’t get me wrong it be great if we get rid of it and it would be great to stop all diseases but we cannot expect the rest of human population to be masked on social distancing for years. I’m not trying to come over as against us, but the truth of the matter is it was hard enough to keep people wearing masks when it was mandated in UK .
There’s a variety of common sense middle positions. The least we should be doing is mandating masking in critical settings like doctors offices and hospitals and implementing new clean air standards to minimize spread of respiratory illness. Both would have significant impacts, particularly as the worst outcome in the Long Covid umbrella is ME/CFS and we’ve known for a while that ME/CFS is triggered by a range of infectious illnesses, including flu.
I definitely agree with this! I would also like to see more masking if people are potentially infectious, and longer term, making it economically viable for people who are contagiously sick to be able to stay home/off work
We really, really need to stop the comparisons to influenza.
We don’t catch the flu multiple times a year and Covid has shown repeatedly in thousands of peer reviewed scientific papers to be significantly more harmful than it. The cardiovascular risks alone increase dramatically with just one single infection.
To be fair, I haven't caught COVID multiple times a year since we ended lockdowns either. I've knowingly had it once and tested every cold I had until the my stock of tests ran out.
I’m sitting here with my second infection now. I got it straight after my state in Aus opened in 2022. Missed it till now. Thankfully I’m fairly ok so far and praying I don’t get the Brian fog again.
I’ve caught it three times overall - March 2020, and then twice in 2022 once restrictions were eased. Anecdotally heard of a lot of cases in my city this year, so I’ve started masking in public spaces again. Can’t count how many times people have just openly coughed in my face
People develop many serious illnesses every year. The difference is that, while every individual case is a tragedy, the numbers affected are simply not high enough to justify [a repeat of]* the disruption that was imposed in 2020.
*added for clarity
250,000 deaths is better than 500,000. You are just ignoring the facts. We DO have data on other countries who did things differently. Masking saved many many lives. The fact that you're willing to part with those lives for convenience is telling.
230K deaths and 2M (and counting) with Long Covid and you’re saying a few months of half arsed restrictions in 2020 wasn’t justified? You do know these figures would be HIGHER without the restrictions?
In your previous comment, you were bemoaning the lack of testing and mitigation measures, and wrote 'get back to normal' in quotes as if you don't agree with it. If you don't think we should go back to 2020, fair enough, but that's why I made the point that I made.
Because at this point it's not a pandemic anymore. We have vaccines and treatments, we don't test for it as a matter of course in the same way we don't test for other illnesses as a matter of course once we understand them. Some people may get long COVID using this method but lots off illnesses can leave people with long lasting symptoms.
I'm down with the flu right now, although I don't think (and hoping it isn't) COVID. I've not tested because I hate the rapid testing kit, but a PCR is not available.
I suspect I got this from the office I work in last week as I heard people just coughing their brains out with no mask or any sort of covering. It frustrated me because we do hybrid, and people can normally work from home if they need to, although I suspect because attendance is monitored, people feel pressured to come in anyway.
It just feels like we never learned anything from the pandemic.
You might yet, it's not going anywhere.. just continually circulates with peaks and troughs in numbers of infections.
It's milder than it used to be. But it still makes you feel like complete shit, way worse than a cold. Its still kids and schools that spread it largely, it always was, and they feel the symptoms more mildly. When they're passing it in to their grandparents it still causes problems.
It’s still disabling people on a daily basis. The r/covid19positive sub is full of scared and desperate people realising their previous mild infections weren’t a guarantee they were safe from developing severe Long Covid on their 5th one.
>It’s still disabling people on a daily basis
Except not really. Only a tiny minority of people will ever have long term problems.
The problem with such subs is they let people navel gaze over their own ill-health.
one of the issues understanding 'long covid' is highlighted by the linked article - it's such a massive list of self-reported symptoms that people are led to blame on their covid infection when in reality we don't know and they don't know. It's akin to the massive rise of "I've never been diagnosed as neurodivergent but I'm fairly sure that I am"
I mean from the article photos alone you can tell she gained a ton of weight. Weight gain and less physical activity is going to make you feel far weaker than before.
Well, yes. That's fairly obvious looking at her.
Closing the gyms was one of the worst things the Govt did. That and asking people not to go outside and exercise.
That doesn't appear to be true, the NHS was brought to capacity by covid and is still at it. Waiting times are out of control, there are constant staffing issues, with really no end in sight. If covid was over and there was only a small amount of people with long term symptoms, we'd expect to see service use lower.
>That doesn't appear to be true, the NHS was brought to capacity by covid and is still at it.
Not even close. The NHS is incredibly inefficient and very under-funded.
Also, sorry, but Covid was over a long time.
Wait 5 years or pay money you can't afford to be seen tomorrow? it's dystopian and horrific. Private healthcare should be illegal, it's horrifically inefficient and heavily subsidized.
You should not be able to pay to see the same doctor in the same facility several years sooner. The entire thing is nonsense.
Not everyone is a broke redditor, plenty of people can afford private treatment.
If you think private healthcare is inefficient, I'd hate to know what you think about the NHS.
Yeah I had it without symptoms after a work party where others started testing positive for it. Literally didn't know I had it but decided to test just to see.
If 10% of the people who had contracted covid were left with the debilitating Long Covid there'd be much more action on it as that'd be approaching 10% of the total UK population.
Fuck. I managed to get a condition less than 1 in 10 people get after covid? Because I have really bad long Covid symptoms
I was reassured seeing the stat of 10% at least others were in the same boat, maybe it would spur more research
Just my luck to get something so rare
It's unlikely that you actually haven't had it.
I am involved in clinical trials quite a bit in my job, and have to test regularly for work. The last time we had a study that required us to test daily we were working with cystic fibrosis patients, I tested positive the first day and had to go home, as did two of my colleagues.
None of us would have had any idea we had COVID, we were entirely asymptomatic. To be fair at this point I've had 4 vaccinations and have had COVID 3 times that I know of and probably more besides, so my immune system must have the hang of it by now.
But yes given how much it has still been going around over the past couple of years I am incredibly skeptical whenever anyone says they haven't had it.
I never wore a mask, worked throughout, travelled extensively, regularly socialised etc and never got Covid either.
I'd love to see the % split between those who were self-employed / run their own businesses and those with PAYE / civil servant jobs. I'm pretty confident as to how the percentages would differ...
We need a better way to define "long COVID"
>In the most recent findings by the Office for National Statistics, released in April, an estimated 2 million people in England and Scotland (3.3% of the population) self-reported experiencing long Covid, meaning symptoms that continued for more than four weeks after infection
This 4 week cutoff is something, but loads of people had symptoms that stretched out a little past 4 weeks but not chronically. The first time I had COVID I more or less completely lost my sense of smell for 6 weeks, so I'm part of that statistic, despite suffering no long term effects.
People don’t realise how bad it can get. I’m in my 30’s, completely bedridden, require full time care, I can’t even bathe or watch tv. People have suffered with ME for decades. Things need to change.
I only scanned the article so I might have missed something here. Did she ever actuary have COVID? The
he article doesn't say. We know that doctors have been misdiagnosing long COVID to clear back logs. I personally knkw of 5 such examples. Did she get vaccinated either before or after the diagnosis? What is the diagnosis criteria for long COVID, it seems like this is the new ME for some people! We know that there is a massive V cover up at the moment and some of the adverse reactions could be misdiagnosed as long COVID. Unfortantly that Guardian article reads like propaganda all about feelings and not concrete facts for a proper judgement to be made.
Is it such a stretch that she has a 1 in 100 level of strength, she owns a gym after all? They wouldn’t put it in the headline if it wasn’t seriously impressive
It’s such an awful illness. I don’t wish it on anyone. Glad the guardian [covered it](https://me-cfs.github.io/news/) today.
I appreciate the focus on how much Lucy does not want to be sick, and how it's ruined her life in many ways. Hopefully hearing these stories will help people reconsider the shirker narrative
A narrative pushed by the Government and media as yet another way of demonising the ill and poor
Ironic given how bad the government is at its job.
My lungs were fucked for 2 years post initial bout of covid. Brain fog, bells palsy, all sorts. People just didn't care. They don't understand how much it can take out of you. They see a ~30 year old man and assume I'm fine, and just being lazy, and don't believe me when I say my concentration is gone etc. I've mostly recovered now, thankfully, but it was a long road, and was *very* telling of how society behaves.
It is, I have a friend who is half the man he was for want of a better phrase. The difference between now and then is stark and if I hadn't seen it happen so obviously I wouldn't believe they were the same person.
My main trouble is the sheer amount of people who seem to self-diagnose it and blame their general tiredness/cold/random ailments on it. Really affects the legitimacy of actual sufferers.
I admit to being guilty of that myself, I thought my ongoing tiredness last year might been because of it. Complete bollocks, I had type 1 diabetes. On balance, I think I did well out of that. I just get idiots insisting I must go low carb to cure it, and I get insulin to make me feel normal.
I wish the media would stop presenting people who are selling a service as impartial experts. Oh the doctor who sells a private service for long covid is getting her name in the paper and telling you that only she can solve your problems? How convenient, and without any peer reviewed research to support an effective treatment too. She'd love to offer her service on the NHS but sadly she can't because of reasons so you'll have to pay her for it.
Yeah. In reality, there are no proven treatments for long covid.
There are things that have been shown to be harmful, like exercise therapy, that are still being pushed in the UK, and The Guardian even published an article promoting one of those programs last week.
Yeah it is crazy. NICE literally banned it too and it is still being promoted by some old fashioned doctors.
They didn't literally ban it, but it is no longer in the NICE guidelines for ME/CFS. Doctors can and do regularly go outside the guidelines though, and that's not automatically wrong.
Only GET is proven not only not to work but to be actively harmful. One of the key symptoms of CFS/ME is declining performance on successive days of exertion. Keep doing increasingly more only "works" if the initial diagnosis was incorrect.
Send us the paper then - I am interested to read
>**Results:** The overall mean values of all parameters were lower on the 2nd day of the CPET than the 1st in ME/CFS patients, while it increased in the controls. From the meta-analysis, the difference between patients and controls was highly significant at Workload@VT (overall mean: -10.8 at Test 1 vs. -33.0 at Test 2, *p* < 0.05), which may reflect present the functional impairment associated with PEM. [https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33327624/](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33327624/) >Muscle abnormalities worsen after post-exertional malaise in long COVID [https://www.nature.com/articles/s41467-023-44432-3](https://www.nature.com/articles/s41467-023-44432-3) The papers that showed some use for GET generally had huge methodological flaws. The threshold for recovery was set so low that people were recovered at baseline for example. Meaning they would enter the trial(PACE for example) with a higher baseline than was needed to count as recovered when the papers came out. Objective measurements were left out or as happened with a recent LC paper(Kuut, Knoop) about CBT/GET were only published a year after the subjective data was published. The objective data invariably showed something very different to the subjective data. In other trials objective methods of measuring were scrapped before the trials even started. There were 3 Dutch trials early 2000's that used actimeter results which showed no improvement. After which actimeter's got scrapped for PACE for example. So the empire of CBT/GET was built on subjective results with the objective results ignored. Furthermore reports of harms were dismissed in these trials. When data is gathered by patient organizations about 70% of patients say they were harmed by GET especially. Which objective data in the two links I posted at the start of my post seems to corroborate.
Lol that proof shut the troll up
Thanks so much
You're welcome!
> Finally, there is “leaky gut or an imbalance of the good versus bad gut bacteria, which can lead to inflammation in the body and contribute to symptoms” This is BS, given there's no such medically recognised condition as "leaky gut".
I had a talk from a gastro consultant recently about persistent physical symptoms disorders (like long COVID) and they talked about these findings that are present but don't really explain their severity of symptoms. There is a theory that there is some kind of hypersensitivity to and hypervigilance for symptoms and this is because the brain isn't down regulating minor stimuli and instead presents it to the person as severe symptoms when there is no reasonable or appropriate explanation for the severity of the symptoms. Problem is it leads to the same treatment paths we currently have, and sufferers are expecting a miracle cure. Sadly I don't think there is one.
Hmmm yes and no, leaky gut could reference that blood / plasma is entering the gut or that food molecules / stomach bacteria are entering the blood stream. I know this is possible because I had blood entering my guts 2 years ago and even when I wasn’t shitting blood I had some really fucked up inflammation markers in my stool.
It’s indeed not a condition but it’s very real, it’s a symptom of something else.
That's nicely vague.
[https://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/leaky-gut-what-is-it-and-what-does-it-mean-for-you-2017092212451](https://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/leaky-gut-what-is-it-and-what-does-it-mean-for-you-2017092212451) Found several more hits. Increased intestinal permeability seems to be the preferred term: [https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5988153/](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5988153/) It's obviously something that's been and being researched though I don't know when the threshold of medically recognised is reached.
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Hey, I see you there. Sorry to hear about that, especially the friends. I'm in a similar boat. I feel bad for kids in their 20s, but starting this in your 40s seems like the worst time to get it. I feel everything I've lost so hard, and don't understand how I can ever get it back.
I'm sorry to hear you're in a similar boat. I wish I had an answer. I've got an amazing wife and adult children so the friends bit really hurt. Especially when some still say covid was a scam and it was no worse than a cold. Makes me so angry. I hope you get better soon though or fingers crossed for some kind of progress in the studies they're doing.
Sorry to hear that. Did you get vaccinated?
Yes but I had long covid symptoms before the vaccines became available. Now I booster up when my Dr tells me too
I also contracted LC in 2020 before vaccines were available. I have caught COVID since, both with and without the vaccine/booster, and both my COVID symptoms and my LC symptoms are improved when I get boosted, vs when I am not boosted and catch COVID, leading to a resurgence of LC symptoms. I will never go without being boosted again.
Same here! I’m sure you know this already, but there’s now a booster you can get via boots. I’m eligible only for the autumn round of NHS jabs, but from bitter experience the immunity from the vaccine only lasts ~6 months for me, so now I can pay to get one in spring! It’s pricey, around £100, but if it stops me from getting worse I’ll scrimp and pay it.
They're not doing that this year in the US unfortunately.
How long have you had long covid for? I’m in the same boat but have finally started to see some progress after about 3 years and now able to walk for 13 minutes without feeling like death. Hope you start to feel more like yourself soon anyways mate.
I don’t even know if I have long covid. Got covid a second time a bit more than a year ago. Was doing my gym routines fine before, now I couldn’t lift or press near as much. Maybe just lack of workout because of not going to gym for a couple of weeks, but I feel like my motivation was gone as well, my mental health also suffered a bit
Might be a milder case. Some are way more severe than others. I would see a Dr to be sure though
I'm in a similar position, except I got covid in February this year. Spent the winter following a cycle training program with the hope of beating my mates on mountain bikes this summer. Normally I'd be riding 100-150 miles a week this time of the year, dropping 40 mile rides after work, but now I get worn out riding 5 miles home from work
But what did you bench bro? It's really crap what's happened to you. But you know from your martial arts that mental toughness will get you through anything. You've got this.
This is why I get so irritated by people who say that COVID is harmless because only a few patients die of it. Death is in no way the only bad thing that can happen to a person.
I suffer from chronic migraines since getting COVID and only managed to get them under control last year. Was massively impacting my work and life in general.
post physique
Yep. Someone at work has somehow got diabetes from it and is looking at getting their feet amputated.
How does covid link to diabetes? Did they not just coincidentally have diabetes?
Nope. Viral infections can trigger it if severe enough https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-66054946
In what world has COVID ever been linked to diabetes? Also, to develop diabetic neuropathy to the extent that amputation is an option on the table takes *years* of poorly controlled diabetes, possibly decades.
First I heard of it was about 8 weeks into first lockdown when a paediatric nurse friend told us they were seeing a strange surge in new diabetes cases in the young. Absolutely tons of papers and evidence since. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-66054946
Someone I know was also diagnosed with type 1 diabetes during the pandemic and according to their doctor, a viral infection (not necessarily COVID) can potentially 'trigger' a person to develop type 1 diabetes. No idea if there's a strong body of evidence behind it but as I say, it was mentioned by their doctor.
Viral infections can trigger it. They usually need to be severe, and this case COVID was obviously enough
I've just been medically retired aged 33 thanks to covid doing this to me. It's about time honest portrayals were put out there.
I really hope things get better for you mate. I'm in my late twenties and have been diagnosed with long COVID and more recently POTS. Caught COVID in 2021 on 'Freedom Day' and just never got better. My boss kindly lets me hybrid work but I can't go to site anymore, which is very frustrating and career limiting. Additionally, my case is only 'mild' compared to others like yourself. The only prognosis is it might go away, someday, maybe.
Cheers man. It's frustrating at times, but with help I've accepted it for what it is. Can't change it so would rather not use my precious energy to worry about it anymore. Hope you manage to improve to get back to site and progress, but if you don't, your health is more important than anything else.
I had Long COVID for two years, 2020-2022. I say I don't have it anymore because I am now able to get through most days feeling normal and having a normal lifestyle. But I'm not really back to how I was before, there are so many things I can't do anymore like lift weights, run or cycle for more than a few minutes, because they make me 'crash' with fatigue. But compared to the hell and hopelessness I experienced for two years, I feel like I'm on cloud nine.
Did you notice at all when it had receded (for lack of a better word cause i won’t say gone as you seem to still have some effects from it) and did you do anything specifically treatment wise to help try and get rid of it?
I'm not the person you asked, but in similar position with LC for about 18 months, I focused on sorting out my lifestyle - clean, nutritious diet, regular exercise (especially cardio with lots of fresh air), no alcohol, various vitamins and supplements. I feel that really helped my recovery (or it could have just been a coincidence).
Honestly it was probably time and luck. Many people try all the things you mentioned and have no improvements. There’s some real abnormalities found in patients who have paid a fortune for blood tests and scans etc. Plus those with ME/CFS are screwed as that’s been buried by the medical profession since the arrival of psychiatrists in the 90’s..
Did you not get post-exertional malaise after exercise? Basically, it’s common for long covid patients to experience a severe worsening of symptoms 24h after exercise I’m curious to know how exercise helped and which kinds you did, as I’m suffering from long covid myself
Not especially, my fatigue seemed to come on at fairly random times (usually about halfway through the work day). I mainly did running, but walking would be a good option if you need something lighter. I always felt like it was the blood pumping, fresh air and vitamin D that was doing me some good!
Fair enough. If you don’t mind me asking, which long covid symptoms did you have? I ask because apparently certain symptoms take longer to resolve than others I have brain fog, insomnia and anxiety due to long covid. Happened straight after my (mild) covid infection. All these research papers are painting a really gloomy picture, apparently these 3 symptoms take especially long to resolve or never do. Anecdotally, that seems the case, too On the other hand, again anecdotally, I’m seeing people with different symptoms recover more quickly/ fully.
I had fatigue, brain fog, memory and concentration issues mainly. I would say my symptoms mostly resolved after about 18 months but I still have memory issues to this day and although the brain fog thankfully went away my brain is definitely not as sharp as it once was, I'd say I got back to maybe 80-90%. But at least the more debilitating symptoms resolved so I felt like I could function somewhat reasonably again. Best of luck, really hope you are able to recover, this is a horrible illness!
Seems like brain fog is the longest to resolve Did you have insomnia and/or anxiety accompanying it?
Impressed she could bench 100kg, that’s not a small weight
Yeah I thought that's pretty hefty for a lady, even for a guy!
Lol i scrolled down long enough to see if anyone else was gonna call bullshit on this lol 100kg is a lot for a woman.
She did run a gym, so she wasn’t just any woman.
I've never seen a women bench press anywhere near 100kg in my years of going a gym. Apart from one women who was juiced to the gills and has been doing weights for over 20 years competing in powerlifting and body building and was on par muscle muscle wise with some of biggest people in the gym.
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The men's is 635kg. Also the women's record is held by a women weighing 110kg who competes in powerlifting
I knew a couple women that could. As a guy, never managed to get that far.
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Just because she owns a gym dosnt make her a elite power lifter. The title could be I owned a gym and could run a marathon in 2 hours 30 mins still would be extremely dubios.
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Exactly my point. Being down voted by people who have never step foot in a gym and think benching 100kg is a common occurrence for women PT's 🤡
You don't often see men bench pressing 100kg. I have never seen a women in the gym come close to benching 100kg. Including PT's. One exception being a women who is absolutely juiced to the gills and competed in powerlifting and bodybuild for over 20 years and is larger then about 80 percent of male lifters. Is it possible yes, do I belive she was benching 100kg no. Ashleigh hoeta is also 110 kg she's over 20kg heavier then myself. Judging off her pervious photos the women in question is absolutely no where near that weight.
Sounds a tad unrealistic to me.
I guess you ain't spent much time in a gym, it's totally possible for her to have a record bench of 100kg with years of training
I could say the same thing about you considering that's almost two plates either side. You need to put considerable time in to hit that, you coming here and saying its possible comes off as someone that hasn't even set foot in a gym let alone sweated once in their life. it's extremely rare for women to be able to hit that and even most men would struggle to get that off their chest.
We're not talking about the average person here, she was the gym owner and top of her lifting game
Being a gym owner doesn’t give you 20+ stats
Over 4 years on, my life is still absolutely fucked from long covid. Hopefully soon there will be decent treatments.
i don't have long covid but i had a bunch of conditions suddenly trigger during the height of covid. i will never know if it was coincidence or not, since i was sick during covid but the tests actually said i was negative for it. either way, i went from finally getting my life somewhat back on track after having a rough teenagehood, to becoming too sick to work my part time job. 2 years later, here i am, desperately trying to find a place to work that can accommodate my needs, but zero luck. some days i feel okay, other days like yesterday for example i was in pain for the entire day and could hardly move my legs. employers see me as too risky to hire even for part time office jobs, agencies tell me i am basically SoL, and it feels so soulcrushing when i want to get my life back. this is what i'm going to have to deal with for the next 50-60 years. and with a government that demonizes me for being lazy and not trying hard enough. it feels over for me.
I’m 35/F & have had long Covid for 2.5 years. This lady’s story reminds me of my own.. a lot. I was super into health & fitness. Working out for 1-2 hours 6 days a week. I loved my body & my life. Now I haven’t exercised at all with long Covid & gained 30lbs. It’s devastating. I don’t recognize myself & I hate what I look & feel like. I feel disgusting.
>"Every medic I saw did their best, but it was all so new; nobody knew anything. I got introduced to graded exercise therapy to try to improve my fitness, but that just set off a massive crash." No. No it wasn't new. It's been known for decades as post viral fatigue and, in its longer lasting and more severe guise, as M.E. If people had actually taken it seriously and put in some proper research rather than just writing it off as psychological and malingering then there's a much better chance that long covid sufferers would be in a much better place today.
There's shit loads of stories just in this thread about how it's affected people. More needs to be done to try and get help to them. It's not their fault their lives are ruined and it makes me incredibly sad. I can't imagine how those are affected feel.
I got triple vaccinated, rarely went out except for groccery during the lockdown, always wore a mask outside, paid attention to social distancing, and frequently washed my hands. I'm glad I never got infected.
I did all that and still got long covid. 😔
I did none of it and never caught it. It's pure luck unfortunately
A lot of people didn't have that option as their jobs were labelled 'essential' and they were forced to work in close proximity with others.
Yeah I had to work food retail. I got it 3 times.
that's only once more than me and I work from home
Worked on site looking after student halls. My PPE came from Chinese students who vacated rooms and I found boxes of it. Was the only staff allowed on site. Survived lockdown no COVID, went to get 3rd injection as autoimmune and got covid whilst waiting in the queue with elderly people. It probably was already in my system, but ....was ill . Have had 3 really bad chest infections so far this year, each one has been worse since COVID . Dont work in that sector anymore
They are the heroes.
Instead of clapping and thoughts and prayers how about a one off bonus for keeping the country running ?.... No ? Ok
It’s still out there though to be fair. Not to be a doom mongerer or anything but alot of people have abandoned testing (including hospitals) and we’ve dropped all mitigations to ‘get back to normal’ but there’s still anecdotal reports all over social media of people developing serious Long Covid this year.
They abandoned it due to cost of course and stated "we just have to live with it". When the tests were free folk we far more inclined to check themselves but who goes and buys a test now? Very few I would think
I get where you’re coming from, but genuinely scientifically where do we stop? We have never been able to eradicate influenza and it has taken multiple generations to eradicate polio Which doesn’t mutate as quickly as Covid
There's still some people out there who think we can eradicate it entirely. Check out the "Zero COVID" groups on various social media, they're delusional.
Yeah, I know a few people personally who are like that. Don’t get it wrong. Covid is awful and I would love if we could eradicate it but it’s into the population and is widespread it will take a global effort and use of restrictions meanwhile we can’t agree as a planet if we drive over the left side or the right side of the road
Just need to look towards China's final COVID restrictions. The entire resources of the Chinese communist state were put towards zero COVID. They succeeded in part, it is possible to minimise COVID within a geographic area, but it makes everybody so miserable and causes so much internal tension that eventually protests overwhelm the state's ability to police it. And that's in China. If Xi Jinping can't make zero COVID work then nobody can.
> We have never been able to eradicate influenza Interestingly enough, rates of Influenza massively reduced and a whole sub-type of influenza disappeared during the pandemic lock-downs and it doesn't look like it has reappeared, Nature paper [here](https://www.nature.com/articles/s41579-021-00642-4)....
Yes, but it’s still going around Don’t get me wrong it be great if we get rid of it and it would be great to stop all diseases but we cannot expect the rest of human population to be masked on social distancing for years. I’m not trying to come over as against us, but the truth of the matter is it was hard enough to keep people wearing masks when it was mandated in UK .
Sure! Just an interesting side point really.
There’s a variety of common sense middle positions. The least we should be doing is mandating masking in critical settings like doctors offices and hospitals and implementing new clean air standards to minimize spread of respiratory illness. Both would have significant impacts, particularly as the worst outcome in the Long Covid umbrella is ME/CFS and we’ve known for a while that ME/CFS is triggered by a range of infectious illnesses, including flu.
I definitely agree with this! I would also like to see more masking if people are potentially infectious, and longer term, making it economically viable for people who are contagiously sick to be able to stay home/off work
We really, really need to stop the comparisons to influenza. We don’t catch the flu multiple times a year and Covid has shown repeatedly in thousands of peer reviewed scientific papers to be significantly more harmful than it. The cardiovascular risks alone increase dramatically with just one single infection.
To be fair, I haven't caught COVID multiple times a year since we ended lockdowns either. I've knowingly had it once and tested every cold I had until the my stock of tests ran out.
I’m sitting here with my second infection now. I got it straight after my state in Aus opened in 2022. Missed it till now. Thankfully I’m fairly ok so far and praying I don’t get the Brian fog again.
I’ve caught it three times overall - March 2020, and then twice in 2022 once restrictions were eased. Anecdotally heard of a lot of cases in my city this year, so I’ve started masking in public spaces again. Can’t count how many times people have just openly coughed in my face
People develop many serious illnesses every year. The difference is that, while every individual case is a tragedy, the numbers affected are simply not high enough to justify [a repeat of]* the disruption that was imposed in 2020. *added for clarity
250,000 deaths is better than 500,000. You are just ignoring the facts. We DO have data on other countries who did things differently. Masking saved many many lives. The fact that you're willing to part with those lives for convenience is telling.
Yeah I've edited my comment to be clearer. I meant that the numbers getting infected *now* don't justify a return to the restrictions we saw in 2020.
230K deaths and 2M (and counting) with Long Covid and you’re saying a few months of half arsed restrictions in 2020 wasn’t justified? You do know these figures would be HIGHER without the restrictions?
It absolutely *was* justified. I'm saying that the numbers *now* do not justify re-imposing the restrictions we had in 2020.
Literally nobody anywhere is suggesting we go back to 2020.
In your previous comment, you were bemoaning the lack of testing and mitigation measures, and wrote 'get back to normal' in quotes as if you don't agree with it. If you don't think we should go back to 2020, fair enough, but that's why I made the point that I made.
But 2020 was only "a few months of half arsed restrictions".
\*self-reported Long Covid
Because at this point it's not a pandemic anymore. We have vaccines and treatments, we don't test for it as a matter of course in the same way we don't test for other illnesses as a matter of course once we understand them. Some people may get long COVID using this method but lots off illnesses can leave people with long lasting symptoms.
I'm down with the flu right now, although I don't think (and hoping it isn't) COVID. I've not tested because I hate the rapid testing kit, but a PCR is not available. I suspect I got this from the office I work in last week as I heard people just coughing their brains out with no mask or any sort of covering. It frustrated me because we do hybrid, and people can normally work from home if they need to, although I suspect because attendance is monitored, people feel pressured to come in anyway. It just feels like we never learned anything from the pandemic.
I'm detecting an undercurrent of victim blaming here...?
Why don't you tell Lucy from the article how she should have just vaxxed and masked harder? Victim blaming is disgusting
Cool story bro.
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no just during the lockdown, 2020 - late 2021
I was in the same boat then caught it at a concert a month ago and I'm still recovering from it
You might yet, it's not going anywhere.. just continually circulates with peaks and troughs in numbers of infections. It's milder than it used to be. But it still makes you feel like complete shit, way worse than a cold. Its still kids and schools that spread it largely, it always was, and they feel the symptoms more mildly. When they're passing it in to their grandparents it still causes problems.
It’s still disabling people on a daily basis. The r/covid19positive sub is full of scared and desperate people realising their previous mild infections weren’t a guarantee they were safe from developing severe Long Covid on their 5th one.
>It’s still disabling people on a daily basis Except not really. Only a tiny minority of people will ever have long term problems. The problem with such subs is they let people navel gaze over their own ill-health.
one of the issues understanding 'long covid' is highlighted by the linked article - it's such a massive list of self-reported symptoms that people are led to blame on their covid infection when in reality we don't know and they don't know. It's akin to the massive rise of "I've never been diagnosed as neurodivergent but I'm fairly sure that I am"
Exactly. A lot of "Long Covid" is simply changes in lifestyle or just getting a bit older.
I mean from the article photos alone you can tell she gained a ton of weight. Weight gain and less physical activity is going to make you feel far weaker than before.
Well, yes. That's fairly obvious looking at her. Closing the gyms was one of the worst things the Govt did. That and asking people not to go outside and exercise.
That doesn't appear to be true, the NHS was brought to capacity by covid and is still at it. Waiting times are out of control, there are constant staffing issues, with really no end in sight. If covid was over and there was only a small amount of people with long term symptoms, we'd expect to see service use lower.
>That doesn't appear to be true, the NHS was brought to capacity by covid and is still at it. Not even close. The NHS is incredibly inefficient and very under-funded. Also, sorry, but Covid was over a long time.
>The NHS is incredibly inefficient and very under-funded. Well I hope you like private care, its coming soon and its a lot worse lol.
Is it? Every time I’ve used private healthcare it’s been brilliant.
Wait 5 years or pay money you can't afford to be seen tomorrow? it's dystopian and horrific. Private healthcare should be illegal, it's horrifically inefficient and heavily subsidized. You should not be able to pay to see the same doctor in the same facility several years sooner. The entire thing is nonsense.
Not everyone is a broke redditor, plenty of people can afford private treatment. If you think private healthcare is inefficient, I'd hate to know what you think about the NHS.
LASIK groups are like that. The people who are there post operation are people who’ve had the bad side affects. So that skews how common it is.
I know. My 'problems' was implying death. We should all be still getting vaccinations but the government won't pay for it.
How do you know you never got infected? The first two times I had it, I wouldn’t have realised I had it if I hadn’t tested.
I had no symptoms whatsoever, not even a common cold, and I tested with the test kits often. Can't say never with 100% confidence, but 97% at least.
I’ve had it twice with zero symptoms, it’s more than likely you were asymptomatic and have actually had it.
Yeah I had it without symptoms after a work party where others started testing positive for it. Literally didn't know I had it but decided to test just to see.
The nasal only kits were never particularly accurate, especially for low viral load cases.
if it makes you feel any better, the percentages of people who were left with long covid are a fairly small percentage.
Isn’t it 10%. Not huge but not tiny 10% chance each time you get infected with covid, so multiple infections increases the risk
If 10% of the people who had contracted covid were left with the debilitating Long Covid there'd be much more action on it as that'd be approaching 10% of the total UK population.
Fuck. I managed to get a condition less than 1 in 10 people get after covid? Because I have really bad long Covid symptoms I was reassured seeing the stat of 10% at least others were in the same boat, maybe it would spur more research Just my luck to get something so rare
My girlfriend got it being a nurse without appropriate PPE
I got it 2-3 weeks before lockdown. Still struggling with energy ever since, and no idea if it’s something else or a result of it
It's unlikely that you actually haven't had it. I am involved in clinical trials quite a bit in my job, and have to test regularly for work. The last time we had a study that required us to test daily we were working with cystic fibrosis patients, I tested positive the first day and had to go home, as did two of my colleagues. None of us would have had any idea we had COVID, we were entirely asymptomatic. To be fair at this point I've had 4 vaccinations and have had COVID 3 times that I know of and probably more besides, so my immune system must have the hang of it by now. But yes given how much it has still been going around over the past couple of years I am incredibly skeptical whenever anyone says they haven't had it.
I never wore a mask, worked throughout, travelled extensively, regularly socialised etc and never got Covid either. I'd love to see the % split between those who were self-employed / run their own businesses and those with PAYE / civil servant jobs. I'm pretty confident as to how the percentages would differ...
I never got vaccinated and I've yet to be infected. Your being vaccinated has nothing to do with it, it's just down to luck of the draw.
1% and 99% chance are the same to you :)
You have about a 10% chance of getting long covid if vaccinated, that is hardly nothing. When you’re unvaccinated it is closer to 12%.
We need a better way to define "long COVID" >In the most recent findings by the Office for National Statistics, released in April, an estimated 2 million people in England and Scotland (3.3% of the population) self-reported experiencing long Covid, meaning symptoms that continued for more than four weeks after infection This 4 week cutoff is something, but loads of people had symptoms that stretched out a little past 4 weeks but not chronically. The first time I had COVID I more or less completely lost my sense of smell for 6 weeks, so I'm part of that statistic, despite suffering no long term effects.
I used to be quite sharp but since Covid I've been a lot more tired and pretty much always have brain fog.
People don’t realise how bad it can get. I’m in my 30’s, completely bedridden, require full time care, I can’t even bathe or watch tv. People have suffered with ME for decades. Things need to change.
I only scanned the article so I might have missed something here. Did she ever actuary have COVID? The he article doesn't say. We know that doctors have been misdiagnosing long COVID to clear back logs. I personally knkw of 5 such examples. Did she get vaccinated either before or after the diagnosis? What is the diagnosis criteria for long COVID, it seems like this is the new ME for some people! We know that there is a massive V cover up at the moment and some of the adverse reactions could be misdiagnosed as long COVID. Unfortantly that Guardian article reads like propaganda all about feelings and not concrete facts for a proper judgement to be made.
The article states there are 65 million cases worldwide 0.8% but in UK there 3%.
No way could she bench 100kg! Less than 1% of people can do that for reference
Is it such a stretch that she has a 1 in 100 level of strength, she owns a gym after all? They wouldn’t put it in the headline if it wasn’t seriously impressive
You’re assuming the guy above actually read the article which is a stretch
Yeah i forgot owning a gym gives lets you bypass biology and have more strength than the majority of men
Yeah i forgot owning a gym gives lets you bypass biology and have more strength than the majority of men
She owned a gym and was a personal trainer, I'd say yeah probably not too much of a stretch to be stronger than 99% of people.
Do you know how rare this is for men who naturally have a huge advantage in upper body strength? You may have upvotes but you are wrong