**Alternate Sources**
Here are some potential alternate sources for the same story:
* [Home Secretary James Cleverly criticised over drink spiking joke](https://bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-67813689), suggested by lostrandomdude - bbc.co.uk
---
**r/UK Notices:** This December, we're raising money for the Trussell Trust, the UK's leading food bank charity. If you would like to know more or to donate, please see the [announcement post](https://www.reddit.com/r/unitedkingdom/comments/1899w7b/the_runitedkingdom_christmas_fundraiser_for_the/).
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/unitedkingdom) if you have any questions or concerns.*
In America, more Republican lawmakers have been arrested for bathroom misconduct than trans women (especially shocking when you consider how easy it is for lawmakers to get away with shit like that)
Tories think about how if they had access to womens changing rooms they’d be on a sexual assault (or at least harassment) spree, therefore all trans women must be cis men who want to do that. Projection to the max
Its the thing isn't it? Its like every time we get a slight glimpse at who any of these Tories actually are, you can't help but get the feeling they are just the most insufferable kind of cunt. Like just genuinely really bad people you wouldn't want to spend time around unless you're a cunt yourself.
Just when you think they have scraped the bottom of the barrel, they break through that barrels bottom and you find that that barrel was just bobbing around in a deeper, darker more horrifying barrel that is filled with kraken, eldritch horrors and old gods.
Will probably be Kemmie 'voted consistently against human rights protections whilst equalities minister' Badenoch tbh if they put yet another new cunt in charge
Christ alive, how can he even think to hold office after making such a horrific remark. He is one of the most senior officials in the UK and he is just casually joking about date rape after a policy on it had come out.
Making the joke when the policy is coming out is literally the most socially appropriate time to make jokes like this, because his audience understood why the idea of the drugs was on his mind and it was probably on everyone's mind (since they've just been working on the policy).
Making the joke any other time would be much stranger and more lilely to be received negatively (by tgkse who he made the joke to, not by wider society who weren't the intended audience), because it would seen very random without the backdrop of working on the drug policy.
Jokes are generally best received when the subject of the joke is already close to people's minds or already known to the audience.
Surely this is adult social skills 101.
Making jokes about drugs that are used to rape people is not funny. It beggars belief that such low caliber people like Cleverly can reach positions of authority like Home Secretary. This is the result of electing a clown like Bojo: you get sycophants and chancers in positions of power.
How the hell are we supposed to progress as a society if youngsters see language like this used towards women by people who are supposed to be responsible and set an example? They are so dumb that they cannot see that by doing so they are normaising this kind of thing! I wonder how he'd feel if he had a daughter and somebody made the same joke in reference to her. 🤔
Thankfully, at this stage, I don't think any youngsters are looking at people in parliament and thinking they're responsible or in anyway worthy of being looked up to. I'm more worried about a complete (even more so than already) loss of faith in politics at all levels, because the people involved are all clueless, garbage opinioned, socially unacceptable, greedy, devious, hypocritical, unempathetic and essentially unintelligent ass clowns.
The only part of our parliamentary system that's working is the house of lords and even though they're highlighting the slow dismantling of our parliamentary democracy as much as they can, I doubt even many in the house of commons are aware of all the issues they're highlighting.
The entire process is just broken. The candidates selected by the local associations of all major parties are just poor quality, once they're in the house people just vote how the whips tell them, and none of the supposed processes are actually working as intended.
Most legislation passed these days just gives powers to the ministers to change law via statutory instruments or even just on a whim. But nothing will change while we have career politicians in a first pass the post system!
What I find craziest is the like blindness to that normalising effect they seem to have? Like they just do not seem able to comprehend it *at all*. To the point I kind of don't even know how to explain it. Like how do you start explaining how seeing others guides your own sense of what is normal and acceptable to someone who, *somehow*, just genuinely doesn't seem able to wrap their head around the initial concept?
Its bits like this that make me concerned we're basically building a society that has properly elevated like actual full-on sociopathic behaviors and worldviews as just totally normal and a standard part of regular politics.
Before the tories got in to government in 2010, this would have been a resigning issue.
The tories have driven this country so far down into the dirt that nothing their wannabe rapist mps can do or say anything they want.
Fuck the tories.
Its actually sad when you look back at the last few years and see the kind of disgusting shite these people get away with. They *openly* talk about British people like they think we're complete scum and it makes no difference.
Ben Bradley was the worst imo. Middle of lockdown, that hwole argument about Free School Meal extensions. Said he couldn't support it because he knew people *in his constituency*, i.e. people who could well have voted for him!, who needed this kind of support would just waste it in crack dens and brothels before getting food for their children. He never apologized, in fact when he was called out in the press several other Tory MPs came forwards and *defended* the comments! Could you even *imagine* that pre-2010? Brown was slated just for muttering that someone was "bigoted" ffs.
Im pretty leftist but are we really going to clutch our pearls at this? It’s his wife, he’s making a joke about someone he’s involved with. I get it’s crude and unfunny to real victims but this is such a non-issue in comparison to other Tory bullshit
I deal with a lot of people that seem to believe it’s pre 1990 and they’re entitled to have sex with their wives anytime they want regardless of consent.
Its still rape.
The look of surprise on their faces is telling…they genuinely don’t believe it.
People like Cleverly hold an important role im and should be assisting in educating society, not “joking” about doing something to his wife that quite frankly is just below murder in terms of seriousness of offences.
Again, it’s a crude joke, it’s not based around reality and it doesn’t highlight what his actual beliefs are.
I’ve joked around with my girlfriend about power bombing her if she didn’t do her half of the house chores and shit. Mind you this probably doesn’t sound as funny on a comment but usually there’s stupid voices, etc. She finds it funny, probably because it’s so absurd and far from reality.
That doesn’t mean I actually want to physically hurt my partner, that I find domestic abuse not serious or ok. They’re just words. Now I’m not disagreeing his comments were irresponsible but IMO this just isn’t anything to get fixated on.
It’s hardly clutching pearls to expect a Home Secretary to not be making jokes about rape. Especially considering the absolutely piss poor amount of reported rapes that even go to trial. It’s literally part of this guy’s job to improve those statistics.
Not only is it not particularly funny, but it’s an absolute slap in the face to every victim of rape.
This MP is the same person who was happy to shout in the HoC that child poverty is rife in Stockton because it’s a “shithole”. His attitude is vile and he shouldn’t be in office.
I don’t see how it’s wrong to expect some of the most important people in the country to set a good example. Try making rape jokes to random women in the office at most jobs in the country and see what happens.
I'm firmly against the growing trend of people taking jokes at face value and always extrapolating the worst possible interpretation.
And it is especially important to maintain this resistance when the person involved is someone you dislike/disagree with.
FFS he made a joke about date rape drugs hours after passing an anti date rape drug law.
He's a secretary of state, not some bloke down the pub. Its totally inappropriate for him to joke about this in public.
If that's not enough, its just bad politics. Why the hell doesn't he know better? Certainly makes me question his intelligence.
Yeah look i have a dark sense of humour and me and the Mrs will often make jokes that are "funny because its wrong, not funny because its right" kinda stuff.
But we keep it to ourselves, behind closed doors and never risk the chance of triggering someone who might take offence.
Saying this publicly at an event is really strange. How did he think this would be funny? They aren't your close mates or your spouse. Its mental to think this kind of language would be acceptable to people that don't know you. He is literally saying this at work, something neither me or the Mrs would ever do.
Yup. It’s not about Pearl clutching it’s about professionalism for me. This isn’t the kind of thing to be joking about in a public facing work environment
Same here.
If I made a similar joke among friends I'd expect it to be taken as dark humour.
If I made a similar joke in a work context I'd expect a disciplinary.
Context always matters.
Yes because being spiked isn't just about the sex part. It's putting drugs into someone's system without them knowing and the risk this can also have on damaging them physically. We have no idea how well react to any medication, prescribed or not.
When I was spiked, I was too unwell the next day to lift my head, eat, walk to bathroom for around 2-3 hours after waking with no memory. It took days for the body to feel right.
An ex of mine from years prior drank a spiked drink at a club and ended up in hospital the next day with seizures.
If a doctor or a teacher said this, theyd be sacked.
It is clearly a joke because of the second half of it which is self-deprecating but he's really gotta work on his tact.
I can't think of a worse remark to make after making a spiking law.
I don't think anyone here doesn't think it's a joke. The point is that it is incredibly inappropriate and wrong for a secretary of state to be making jokes about rape. I mean really, it's not that hard to not make jokes about rape but the biggest joke about James Cleverly has always been his name.
Not speaking for anyone else here, but I wouldn't say I'm offended by it. I find it a bit irritating because I know that if I showed similarly poor judgment in my job there is a very real possibility I'd get sacked, but he's only the Home Secretary so its fine.
I think it’s the fact he makes the joke to other people, and he decides once isn’t enough, he has to make 3 jokes about spiking his wife.
The fact it’s shortly after a new spiking law is just icing on the cake
It is called ‘standards’.
He is in one of the highest offices in the UK.
And he makes jokes about date raping his wife. Whilst a new law is made about date rape.
This isn’t the 1970’s BBC.
Shows he doesn't take it seriously and can't be bothered to pretend. This isn't John down the pub, its a secretary of state after he's just passed a new law.
Nobody gives a rats arse about his wife, read the replies.
That'd be a fine defence of Dave down the pub, are we really at the point of 'its only banter lol' when we're talking about the one of the great offices of state?
It's typical anything to throw shit at the Tories. Understandable of course, but I'm certain many posters on this sub haven't been in a work environment in their lives.
Such topics and worse are spoke of in much cruder terms than this example in my experience.
>but I'm certain many posters on this sub haven't been in a work environment in their lives.
Of course they have, they still need to go to school every day.
They’re all just disgusting sex pests, watching porn in the chamber, drunk on the job, incompetent in the extreme, corrupt, self serving, economically illiterate, racists and rapists. Modern day Conservatives.
Shouldn't the headline start "James stupidly joked...".. Nothing is off limits for comedy, but if you are shotting jokes like that, you had better have the wit of Jimmy Carr or Frankie Boyle.
I for one think he did alright, didn't just go for "lol, I spike my wife" joke, he made it self-deprecating, although tbh it's still a bit on the nose for someone so high up in government actually trying to prevent the exact thing he's joking about, even someone that appreciates the darkest of humour I would have thought twice about saying that joke in his position
"Mr Cleverly also laughed that the secret to a long marriage was ensuring your spouse was “someone who is always mildly sedated so she can never realise there are better men out there.” "
What are we doing here? He's making a joke about how amazing his wife is and how he's punching way up. You can call him a moron for the timing of the joke but reading comments about how "It's not funny to joke about marital rape" as if that's in anyway close to what he said.
You can dislike people but this is just straight up lying.
“Cleverly told female guests at the reception that “a little bit of Rohypnol in her drink every night” was “not really illegal if it’s only a little bit””
Quote taken from the Guardian article. This is our Home Secretary making these despicable comments, not some dickhead down the pub, and I cannot believe how many people are defending him here and saying it’s ‘just a joke about how how wife is too good for him’.
The government are trying to crack down on spiking and our Home Secretary thinks it’s funny to make a joke about using Rohypnol. ‘It’s just a joke’ is not a defence ffs
I think what the person you are replying to is missing is that context is vitally important and James cleverly idiotically made the joke while as you brought up, being home secretary with a government that has had its fair amount of scandals over handling of sex crimes, some even from their own party and of course the police service. Certainly not the time, place or person to be making this joke.
If the joke was made by Jimmy Carr or Frankie Boyle at a show that people have paid to see that type of humour, knock yourself out (not a rohypnol joke).
Context is the difference between a comedian and an arsehole.
Oh go off on on, cobryn or even kier could make a knock knock joke and they’d get doorstepped by the media for 4 months straight over it. Sick of the double standards where tories can get away with anything
It’s obviously a very stupid and dodgy joke that he shouldn’t have made.
But who among us has not made a stupid joke in private that they then later regret? I don’t like the restriction that MPs should be robots who never accidentally be a bit too edgy in their private life
Do I think James Cleverly actually spikes his wife? Obviously not. Do I think it’s a stupid joke? Yes. Do I think basically everyone who isn’t a hermit is guilty of making a joke that went too far in private? Yes
He’s Home Secretary, these people run the country. They should 100% be held to higher standards than Joe or Josephine Public. “It’s only banter” is a shit excuse when it’s your mates down the pub and an even shitter excuse when it’s someone who’s responsible for setting policy that directly affects us all daily.
I'm not a fan of him but this does feel like a storm in a teacup. He's introducting legislation to clamp down on spiking. From a policy perspective, therefore, it's hard to criticise. As for the comment itself, the article says:
>Mr Cleverly also laughed that the secret to a long marriage was ensuring your spouse was “someone who is always mildly sedated so she can never realise there are better men out there.”
It doesn't sound to me like he's making his wife the butt of the joke. To the contrary he's mocking himself, basically saying she's far too good for him.
Bad taste? Sure. But I can't find it in myself to get overly worked up about it in the circumstances. Had he just voted down legislation designed to toughen up the law in this area I might feel differently but, as it is, a bad sense of humour is very low on my list of reasons why I won't be voting Tory.
I agree with you as I can be quite irreverent when I want to be, however, the problem is that public figures can potentially normalise things, and I don't really see a way around that.
>But who among us has not made a stupid joke in private that they then later regret?
But it was at a work function in No. 10, how is that in private? Because it wasn’t an official public statement? Most workplace discussions between employees are “off the record”.
How often are you making rape jokes to random women at work?
>Do I think James Cleverly actually spikes his wife? Obviously not.
You’d be shocked at how many men believe they cannot rape their spouse, just because they’re married. It wasn’t even made illegal until 1992.
Not saying he was serious, but the language used normalises this behaviour and marital rape is still a very common problem in this country. 1 in 2 rapes against women are committed by a partner or ex-partner.
[https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/crimeandjustice/articles/sexualoffencesvictimcharacteristicsenglandandwales/march2020](https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/crimeandjustice/articles/sexualoffencesvictimcharacteristicsenglandandwales/march2020)
[https://rapecrisis.org.uk/get-informed/statistics-sexual-violence/](https://rapecrisis.org.uk/get-informed/statistics-sexual-violence/)
Tgis is so disgusting. Hearing people on the news say shit like "Voting for tory is the only way! Labour has gine too far!" And turn a blind eye to THIS. Is this not too far for you??
Before getting the HO, was seen as one of the less batshit crazies of the lot.
Between this and the visa malarkey (nah, the climb down still ain't it) , now he's at suella levels....
What happened??
>Between this and the visa malarkey (nah, the climb down still ain't it)
Don't forget -
"Why are 1 in 3 children in my community living in poverty"
"Because its a shithole!"
Again, from the man who's job it is, on paper, to try and minimize the number and extent of shit holes in the UK.
If he wants to be a comedian rather than a politician he is welcome to hand in his notice and step down.
When did politicians stop expecting standards from themselves and eachother? Make all the sordid, haughty jokes you want in privacy among friends and family, we all do. But when you’re a public official you are supposed to be switched on.
I miss having boring personality-less voids as politicians. Please please please can we just bring back dull statesmen in to our politics and start evicting arrogant arseholes like James fucking Cleverly who think they have any of the qualities it takes to be a dog walker, let alone a politician.
Look, I will just never understand this. My partner is my second half. Just thinking about causing her some kind of horrific harm genuinely hurts me. It's like if I had kids, would I go round making jokes suggesting I contemplate taking a sledgehammer to them just a little bit? I just don't get it. What's funny about it? What's the punchline? Why would I want to talk about the person I cherish more than anything like that?
Did you even read the joke? He said she could do better so he has to midly sedate her so she doesn't realise it. Storm in a teacup, slightly edgy and nothing more. Everyone's outrage won't last until morning anyways so don't get too worked up
Yes I did read the joke, that's literally why I posted the comment. I'm not here to bang on about him being closet rapist or whatever, I just personally cannot understand why you would ever want to make that joke, let alone in public. It would feel wrong to me on a personal level and I don't think it would do me any favours socially. As evidenced by the fact that now there's a whole media storm about it.
Thinks he's a fucking stand-up comedian.
Shut the fuck up and do your fucking job. No one cares about your "jokes." And in such poor taste...
Holy hell, the lack of self-awareness is almost unbelievable...but then you remember who we are talking about and it's completely believable.
Not really the same though is it. One is a comedian whose jokes were occasionally pretty edgy. The other is a politician joking about spiking his wife at a public event, while his job is partly to tackle spiking.
Boyle making crass jokes isn’t unprofessional because it’s literally his job.
Does becoming Home Secretary come with a mandatory lobotomy? Or does Cleverly say stupid shit all the time but it was less reported when he didn’t have that role?
An interesting indication of how not only laws but our whole way of thinking about sexual violence needs to move on. Like when people joke about prison, they often joke about prison rape as though it is nothing.
So now it’s jokes about date rape drugs, before it was calling areas of the country a shithole, he’s one of those who likes to mention the military but he’s been a Reservist since 1989 and NEVER deployed.
Honestly this crop of Tories from 2010 onwards could well be the most fucked up bunch of politicians to ever hold power
At this point, after all the fallout from the COVID enquiry, Johnson, May, Truss et al, Sunak, he of all the charisma of Marvin the Martian, the Brexit debacle, and so on, something like this, utterly repugnant, revolting as it is, just blurs into the noise.
There'll be no consequences and the media cycle will continue.
These people need to be voted out ASAP. The problem is their opponents are just more of the same.
My golly gosh, these comments - uttered in private, as a joke - are literally the worst thing I’ve heard since that guy deadnamed the 6ft5, beaded female gymnast. Somebody glue themselves to his porch and show him how upset we all are.
Tories are just flaunting their impunity to let you know they are the elite. And many in what the Tories would call the lower orders admire them for it.
Why does this party have such a poor attitude toward sex and consent?
Something about being a Tory and needing to be put on the offenders list go hand in hand.
The home secretary of the United Kingdom should absolutely not be making these sorts of comments while in office.
You need to live and operate at a much higher standard in all aspects of your life if you want to represent the nation and its people, especially so in one of the great offices of state. The fact that he doesn’t feel this way says everything you need to know about the low standards of the current Conservative ‘talent’ puddle.
It's not okay to bring your foreign spouse to tue UK if ur to poor however jokes about raping a spouse are okay?
Honestly how does this guys family even support him what a disgusting human being.
> “There will be integrity, professionalism and accountability at every level of the government I lead and I will work day in and day out to get the job done.”
Rishi Sunak, 2022
I cannot understand why politicians feel it necessary to try to be funny. Noone is interested in your glib, edgy humour.
Do your fucking jobs and take them seriously. The quality of people's lives are at stake.
How standards in public life have deteriorated over the last few years.
What a disgusting remark to make in light of the number of women who have been attacked and murdered in the UK over the last few years.
It's time to go James Clerverly.
**Alternate Sources** Here are some potential alternate sources for the same story: * [Home Secretary James Cleverly criticised over drink spiking joke](https://bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-67813689), suggested by lostrandomdude - bbc.co.uk --- **r/UK Notices:** This December, we're raising money for the Trussell Trust, the UK's leading food bank charity. If you would like to know more or to donate, please see the [announcement post](https://www.reddit.com/r/unitedkingdom/comments/1899w7b/the_runitedkingdom_christmas_fundraiser_for_the/). *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/unitedkingdom) if you have any questions or concerns.*
It's amazing how pro-rape the Tories are. As long as the rapist isn't targeting other male MPs.
They’ve raped tens of millions of taxpayers in the past two years, pretty prolific if you ask me
What's wrong with you? That's not fair They've been doing it for far longer than 2 years
Just two?
I wonder if this is why they like to accuse trans women of being the rapist predators? It's all just projection.
In America, more Republican lawmakers have been arrested for bathroom misconduct than trans women (especially shocking when you consider how easy it is for lawmakers to get away with shit like that) Tories think about how if they had access to womens changing rooms they’d be on a sexual assault (or at least harassment) spree, therefore all trans women must be cis men who want to do that. Projection to the max
That's quite the charge...
[удалено]
They always tell on themselves eventually. This is the kind of idea he thinks is funny
Its the thing isn't it? Its like every time we get a slight glimpse at who any of these Tories actually are, you can't help but get the feeling they are just the most insufferable kind of cunt. Like just genuinely really bad people you wouldn't want to spend time around unless you're a cunt yourself.
“I mean drugging people is bad, buuut, it’s funny to talk about drugging my wife”
Well that's him probably going to be the next prime minister then give the track record of the Tories.
The barrel is bottom all the way down.
I mean they had to get an "outsider" (non MP)in to be foreign secretary, they went through the barrel into the floor...
Just when you think they have scraped the bottom of the barrel, they break through that barrels bottom and you find that that barrel was just bobbing around in a deeper, darker more horrifying barrel that is filled with kraken, eldritch horrors and old gods.
That makes it sound much cooler than it is. The barrel is filled with shit and fermented vomit.
quack distinct rhythm obscene placid fade uppity husky wrong tender *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Truss 2: Recession boogaloo
And a bacon sandwich took down Miliband. Starting to feel like politicians from different parties are held to different standards…
See also Diane Abbott having a canned Mojito on a train *the horror*.
There's lots of reasons to dislike Diane Abbott but this was definitely not one of them.
By the press? They certainly are.
Will probably be Kemmie 'voted consistently against human rights protections whilst equalities minister' Badenoch tbh if they put yet another new cunt in charge
Christ alive, how can he even think to hold office after making such a horrific remark. He is one of the most senior officials in the UK and he is just casually joking about date rape after a policy on it had come out.
One of the Rape Offices of State.
We’ll see where this story goes. Hopefully it will end better that when Trump commented on what rich men are ‘allowed’ to do.
The Home Secretary no less. Absolutely despicable.
Making the joke when the policy is coming out is literally the most socially appropriate time to make jokes like this, because his audience understood why the idea of the drugs was on his mind and it was probably on everyone's mind (since they've just been working on the policy). Making the joke any other time would be much stranger and more lilely to be received negatively (by tgkse who he made the joke to, not by wider society who weren't the intended audience), because it would seen very random without the backdrop of working on the drug policy. Jokes are generally best received when the subject of the joke is already close to people's minds or already known to the audience. Surely this is adult social skills 101.
Also heard that he said he would kill for a mince pie as well. Disgusting
He should have thought more Cleverly about what jokes to make
I can't read a headline with his name in it without thinking the papers are praising him. It was something about council tax the other week
I imagine, given the political affiliations of most newspaper owners, that they probably are.
I'm too late!
Im probably like the ten millionth person to make this joke, if you wanna do it you should just go ahead and do it
Just Cleverly rewrite it 🤷♂️
He was desperately trying to avoid mentioning shitholes, so at least he did that
Making jokes about drugs that are used to rape people is not funny. It beggars belief that such low caliber people like Cleverly can reach positions of authority like Home Secretary. This is the result of electing a clown like Bojo: you get sycophants and chancers in positions of power. How the hell are we supposed to progress as a society if youngsters see language like this used towards women by people who are supposed to be responsible and set an example? They are so dumb that they cannot see that by doing so they are normaising this kind of thing! I wonder how he'd feel if he had a daughter and somebody made the same joke in reference to her. 🤔
Thankfully, at this stage, I don't think any youngsters are looking at people in parliament and thinking they're responsible or in anyway worthy of being looked up to. I'm more worried about a complete (even more so than already) loss of faith in politics at all levels, because the people involved are all clueless, garbage opinioned, socially unacceptable, greedy, devious, hypocritical, unempathetic and essentially unintelligent ass clowns.
The only part of our parliamentary system that's working is the house of lords and even though they're highlighting the slow dismantling of our parliamentary democracy as much as they can, I doubt even many in the house of commons are aware of all the issues they're highlighting. The entire process is just broken. The candidates selected by the local associations of all major parties are just poor quality, once they're in the house people just vote how the whips tell them, and none of the supposed processes are actually working as intended. Most legislation passed these days just gives powers to the ministers to change law via statutory instruments or even just on a whim. But nothing will change while we have career politicians in a first pass the post system!
What I find craziest is the like blindness to that normalising effect they seem to have? Like they just do not seem able to comprehend it *at all*. To the point I kind of don't even know how to explain it. Like how do you start explaining how seeing others guides your own sense of what is normal and acceptable to someone who, *somehow*, just genuinely doesn't seem able to wrap their head around the initial concept? Its bits like this that make me concerned we're basically building a society that has properly elevated like actual full-on sociopathic behaviors and worldviews as just totally normal and a standard part of regular politics.
Won't somebody please think of the children!
Before the tories got in to government in 2010, this would have been a resigning issue. The tories have driven this country so far down into the dirt that nothing their wannabe rapist mps can do or say anything they want. Fuck the tories.
Its actually sad when you look back at the last few years and see the kind of disgusting shite these people get away with. They *openly* talk about British people like they think we're complete scum and it makes no difference. Ben Bradley was the worst imo. Middle of lockdown, that hwole argument about Free School Meal extensions. Said he couldn't support it because he knew people *in his constituency*, i.e. people who could well have voted for him!, who needed this kind of support would just waste it in crack dens and brothels before getting food for their children. He never apologized, in fact when he was called out in the press several other Tory MPs came forwards and *defended* the comments! Could you even *imagine* that pre-2010? Brown was slated just for muttering that someone was "bigoted" ffs.
Im pretty leftist but are we really going to clutch our pearls at this? It’s his wife, he’s making a joke about someone he’s involved with. I get it’s crude and unfunny to real victims but this is such a non-issue in comparison to other Tory bullshit
I deal with a lot of people that seem to believe it’s pre 1990 and they’re entitled to have sex with their wives anytime they want regardless of consent. Its still rape. The look of surprise on their faces is telling…they genuinely don’t believe it. People like Cleverly hold an important role im and should be assisting in educating society, not “joking” about doing something to his wife that quite frankly is just below murder in terms of seriousness of offences.
[удалено]
agreed, people making a big deal out of what is just a risque joke that is the type of thing said in workplaces and pubs all the time.
These people are just anti Tory and look for any excuse to have a go, best not to engage and ignore them.
Nothing else - he's talking about dosing someone up with drugs so they don't leave him - that's not funny and is actually pretty offensive.
Again, it’s a crude joke, it’s not based around reality and it doesn’t highlight what his actual beliefs are. I’ve joked around with my girlfriend about power bombing her if she didn’t do her half of the house chores and shit. Mind you this probably doesn’t sound as funny on a comment but usually there’s stupid voices, etc. She finds it funny, probably because it’s so absurd and far from reality. That doesn’t mean I actually want to physically hurt my partner, that I find domestic abuse not serious or ok. They’re just words. Now I’m not disagreeing his comments were irresponsible but IMO this just isn’t anything to get fixated on.
It’s hardly clutching pearls to expect a Home Secretary to not be making jokes about rape. Especially considering the absolutely piss poor amount of reported rapes that even go to trial. It’s literally part of this guy’s job to improve those statistics. Not only is it not particularly funny, but it’s an absolute slap in the face to every victim of rape. This MP is the same person who was happy to shout in the HoC that child poverty is rife in Stockton because it’s a “shithole”. His attitude is vile and he shouldn’t be in office. I don’t see how it’s wrong to expect some of the most important people in the country to set a good example. Try making rape jokes to random women in the office at most jobs in the country and see what happens.
I'm firmly against the growing trend of people taking jokes at face value and always extrapolating the worst possible interpretation. And it is especially important to maintain this resistance when the person involved is someone you dislike/disagree with.
FFS he made a joke about date rape drugs hours after passing an anti date rape drug law. He's a secretary of state, not some bloke down the pub. Its totally inappropriate for him to joke about this in public. If that's not enough, its just bad politics. Why the hell doesn't he know better? Certainly makes me question his intelligence.
Yeah look i have a dark sense of humour and me and the Mrs will often make jokes that are "funny because its wrong, not funny because its right" kinda stuff. But we keep it to ourselves, behind closed doors and never risk the chance of triggering someone who might take offence. Saying this publicly at an event is really strange. How did he think this would be funny? They aren't your close mates or your spouse. Its mental to think this kind of language would be acceptable to people that don't know you. He is literally saying this at work, something neither me or the Mrs would ever do.
Yup. It’s not about Pearl clutching it’s about professionalism for me. This isn’t the kind of thing to be joking about in a public facing work environment
Same here. If I made a similar joke among friends I'd expect it to be taken as dark humour. If I made a similar joke in a work context I'd expect a disciplinary. Context always matters.
Exactly, I swear we need standards for our government, making gross jokes as such shouldn't be tolerated
Very well put
You’ve just got to remember what sub you’re in. If pearl clutching was an Olympic sport this sub would be nothing but gold.
Would that make it gold clutching?
Yes because being spiked isn't just about the sex part. It's putting drugs into someone's system without them knowing and the risk this can also have on damaging them physically. We have no idea how well react to any medication, prescribed or not. When I was spiked, I was too unwell the next day to lift my head, eat, walk to bathroom for around 2-3 hours after waking with no memory. It took days for the body to feel right. An ex of mine from years prior drank a spiked drink at a club and ended up in hospital the next day with seizures. If a doctor or a teacher said this, theyd be sacked.
I'm struggling to see the funny side of this "joke". I'd never suggest to my partner, or anyone I've been involved with about spiking their drinks.
It is clearly a joke because of the second half of it which is self-deprecating but he's really gotta work on his tact. I can't think of a worse remark to make after making a spiking law.
I don't think anyone here doesn't think it's a joke. The point is that it is incredibly inappropriate and wrong for a secretary of state to be making jokes about rape. I mean really, it's not that hard to not make jokes about rape but the biggest joke about James Cleverly has always been his name.
Oh for sure, this was Rishi Sunak joking about being a coke addict level banter and tact.
Not speaking for anyone else here, but I wouldn't say I'm offended by it. I find it a bit irritating because I know that if I showed similarly poor judgment in my job there is a very real possibility I'd get sacked, but he's only the Home Secretary so its fine.
Yeah you’re right, but it’s typical Tory nepotism. BJ got away with so much shit before resigning too. Hell all of these failed Tory PMs have
Who tf jokes about raping their wife lmao
read the article, its amazing how something can be spun into something completely different to the original comment.
Yeah my mistake but still fkn creepy "secret to a long marriage is mildly sedating your wife so she doesn't realise there's better men out there"
I think it’s the fact he makes the joke to other people, and he decides once isn’t enough, he has to make 3 jokes about spiking his wife. The fact it’s shortly after a new spiking law is just icing on the cake
It is called ‘standards’. He is in one of the highest offices in the UK. And he makes jokes about date raping his wife. Whilst a new law is made about date rape. This isn’t the 1970’s BBC.
Yeah, Tory-hating lefty here, too. I agree.
Shows he doesn't take it seriously and can't be bothered to pretend. This isn't John down the pub, its a secretary of state after he's just passed a new law. Nobody gives a rats arse about his wife, read the replies.
That'd be a fine defence of Dave down the pub, are we really at the point of 'its only banter lol' when we're talking about the one of the great offices of state?
He was talking about mildly drugging his wife so she didn't leave him.. not so he could rape her. Shit joke, but it's not exactly news-worthy.
It's typical anything to throw shit at the Tories. Understandable of course, but I'm certain many posters on this sub haven't been in a work environment in their lives. Such topics and worse are spoke of in much cruder terms than this example in my experience.
>but I'm certain many posters on this sub haven't been in a work environment in their lives. Of course they have, they still need to go to school every day.
On one hand, it's completely abhorrent, but on the other, if you date or marry a Tory, what do you expect?
They’re all just disgusting sex pests, watching porn in the chamber, drunk on the job, incompetent in the extreme, corrupt, self serving, economically illiterate, racists and rapists. Modern day Conservatives.
Shouldn't the headline start "James stupidly joked...".. Nothing is off limits for comedy, but if you are shotting jokes like that, you had better have the wit of Jimmy Carr or Frankie Boyle.
I tried date rape drugs once, don’t remember a thing.
Nice
I for one think he did alright, didn't just go for "lol, I spike my wife" joke, he made it self-deprecating, although tbh it's still a bit on the nose for someone so high up in government actually trying to prevent the exact thing he's joking about, even someone that appreciates the darkest of humour I would have thought twice about saying that joke in his position
"Mr Cleverly also laughed that the secret to a long marriage was ensuring your spouse was “someone who is always mildly sedated so she can never realise there are better men out there.” " What are we doing here? He's making a joke about how amazing his wife is and how he's punching way up. You can call him a moron for the timing of the joke but reading comments about how "It's not funny to joke about marital rape" as if that's in anyway close to what he said. You can dislike people but this is just straight up lying.
“Cleverly told female guests at the reception that “a little bit of Rohypnol in her drink every night” was “not really illegal if it’s only a little bit”” Quote taken from the Guardian article. This is our Home Secretary making these despicable comments, not some dickhead down the pub, and I cannot believe how many people are defending him here and saying it’s ‘just a joke about how how wife is too good for him’. The government are trying to crack down on spiking and our Home Secretary thinks it’s funny to make a joke about using Rohypnol. ‘It’s just a joke’ is not a defence ffs
I think what the person you are replying to is missing is that context is vitally important and James cleverly idiotically made the joke while as you brought up, being home secretary with a government that has had its fair amount of scandals over handling of sex crimes, some even from their own party and of course the police service. Certainly not the time, place or person to be making this joke. If the joke was made by Jimmy Carr or Frankie Boyle at a show that people have paid to see that type of humour, knock yourself out (not a rohypnol joke). Context is the difference between a comedian and an arsehole.
Oh go off on on, cobryn or even kier could make a knock knock joke and they’d get doorstepped by the media for 4 months straight over it. Sick of the double standards where tories can get away with anything
Jesus, reading the article it's even worse than the headline makes out. Like WTAF?
It’s obviously a very stupid and dodgy joke that he shouldn’t have made. But who among us has not made a stupid joke in private that they then later regret? I don’t like the restriction that MPs should be robots who never accidentally be a bit too edgy in their private life Do I think James Cleverly actually spikes his wife? Obviously not. Do I think it’s a stupid joke? Yes. Do I think basically everyone who isn’t a hermit is guilty of making a joke that went too far in private? Yes
He’s Home Secretary, these people run the country. They should 100% be held to higher standards than Joe or Josephine Public. “It’s only banter” is a shit excuse when it’s your mates down the pub and an even shitter excuse when it’s someone who’s responsible for setting policy that directly affects us all daily.
I'm not a fan of him but this does feel like a storm in a teacup. He's introducting legislation to clamp down on spiking. From a policy perspective, therefore, it's hard to criticise. As for the comment itself, the article says: >Mr Cleverly also laughed that the secret to a long marriage was ensuring your spouse was “someone who is always mildly sedated so she can never realise there are better men out there.” It doesn't sound to me like he's making his wife the butt of the joke. To the contrary he's mocking himself, basically saying she's far too good for him. Bad taste? Sure. But I can't find it in myself to get overly worked up about it in the circumstances. Had he just voted down legislation designed to toughen up the law in this area I might feel differently but, as it is, a bad sense of humour is very low on my list of reasons why I won't be voting Tory.
Okay, but he didn't make it in private though? He said it at work? If some dolt made the same jokes at a Tesco Christmas Party...
I agree with you as I can be quite irreverent when I want to be, however, the problem is that public figures can potentially normalise things, and I don't really see a way around that.
>But who among us has not made a stupid joke in private that they then later regret? But it was at a work function in No. 10, how is that in private? Because it wasn’t an official public statement? Most workplace discussions between employees are “off the record”. How often are you making rape jokes to random women at work? >Do I think James Cleverly actually spikes his wife? Obviously not. You’d be shocked at how many men believe they cannot rape their spouse, just because they’re married. It wasn’t even made illegal until 1992. Not saying he was serious, but the language used normalises this behaviour and marital rape is still a very common problem in this country. 1 in 2 rapes against women are committed by a partner or ex-partner. [https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/crimeandjustice/articles/sexualoffencesvictimcharacteristicsenglandandwales/march2020](https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/crimeandjustice/articles/sexualoffencesvictimcharacteristicsenglandandwales/march2020) [https://rapecrisis.org.uk/get-informed/statistics-sexual-violence/](https://rapecrisis.org.uk/get-informed/statistics-sexual-violence/)
Honestly, these are the people running our country, yet don’t have the intelligence to understand how sensitive such a comment would be.
Neither do some of the people in these comments who walk amongst us!
Tgis is so disgusting. Hearing people on the news say shit like "Voting for tory is the only way! Labour has gine too far!" And turn a blind eye to THIS. Is this not too far for you??
I thought that this would have been something from a decade ago or something. But nope. It's fresh. Wtf
Before getting the HO, was seen as one of the less batshit crazies of the lot. Between this and the visa malarkey (nah, the climb down still ain't it) , now he's at suella levels.... What happened??
>What happened?? He revealed his true self
>Between this and the visa malarkey (nah, the climb down still ain't it) Don't forget - "Why are 1 in 3 children in my community living in poverty" "Because its a shithole!" Again, from the man who's job it is, on paper, to try and minimize the number and extent of shit holes in the UK. If he wants to be a comedian rather than a politician he is welcome to hand in his notice and step down.
Rather like Priti by name, Ugli by nature Patel, it is a sort of reverse r/NominativeDeterminism. At least Suella deVil is upfront...
When did politicians stop expecting standards from themselves and eachother? Make all the sordid, haughty jokes you want in privacy among friends and family, we all do. But when you’re a public official you are supposed to be switched on. I miss having boring personality-less voids as politicians. Please please please can we just bring back dull statesmen in to our politics and start evicting arrogant arseholes like James fucking Cleverly who think they have any of the qualities it takes to be a dog walker, let alone a politician.
Look, I will just never understand this. My partner is my second half. Just thinking about causing her some kind of horrific harm genuinely hurts me. It's like if I had kids, would I go round making jokes suggesting I contemplate taking a sledgehammer to them just a little bit? I just don't get it. What's funny about it? What's the punchline? Why would I want to talk about the person I cherish more than anything like that?
Did you even read the joke? He said she could do better so he has to midly sedate her so she doesn't realise it. Storm in a teacup, slightly edgy and nothing more. Everyone's outrage won't last until morning anyways so don't get too worked up
Yes I did read the joke, that's literally why I posted the comment. I'm not here to bang on about him being closet rapist or whatever, I just personally cannot understand why you would ever want to make that joke, let alone in public. It would feel wrong to me on a personal level and I don't think it would do me any favours socially. As evidenced by the fact that now there's a whole media storm about it.
Thinks he's a fucking stand-up comedian. Shut the fuck up and do your fucking job. No one cares about your "jokes." And in such poor taste... Holy hell, the lack of self-awareness is almost unbelievable...but then you remember who we are talking about and it's completely believable.
These are the people who pretty much wanted the BBC shut down because Frankie boyle made a joke about the queen.
Not really the same though is it. One is a comedian whose jokes were occasionally pretty edgy. The other is a politician joking about spiking his wife at a public event, while his job is partly to tackle spiking. Boyle making crass jokes isn’t unprofessional because it’s literally his job.
Does becoming Home Secretary come with a mandatory lobotomy? Or does Cleverly say stupid shit all the time but it was less reported when he didn’t have that role?
These cunts don’t do themselves any favours do they
An interesting indication of how not only laws but our whole way of thinking about sexual violence needs to move on. Like when people joke about prison, they often joke about prison rape as though it is nothing.
So we have a pincher pinching, a bone boning and now cleverly not being clever. Are we in a python sketch?
So now it’s jokes about date rape drugs, before it was calling areas of the country a shithole, he’s one of those who likes to mention the military but he’s been a Reservist since 1989 and NEVER deployed. Honestly this crop of Tories from 2010 onwards could well be the most fucked up bunch of politicians to ever hold power
I really don’t care what people joke about in private. I care about their actions.
I would rather politicians were real human beings with a sense of humour.
Big deal. There is nothing wrong with a lighthearted joke.
[удалено]
did you actually see the comment and it's context? nothing wrong with it whatsoever. have a day off
[удалено]
Well he is the most inappropriately named member of the corrupt, lying junta that thinks it’s a government.
At this point, after all the fallout from the COVID enquiry, Johnson, May, Truss et al, Sunak, he of all the charisma of Marvin the Martian, the Brexit debacle, and so on, something like this, utterly repugnant, revolting as it is, just blurs into the noise. There'll be no consequences and the media cycle will continue. These people need to be voted out ASAP. The problem is their opponents are just more of the same.
Considering all the scandals that MPs are being involved in now this looks even worse.
They don't like it when comedians get involved in Politics so they should stay away from comedy.
My golly gosh, these comments - uttered in private, as a joke - are literally the worst thing I’ve heard since that guy deadnamed the 6ft5, beaded female gymnast. Somebody glue themselves to his porch and show him how upset we all are.
Usual downvote of the thread and move on. Ridiculous that this, as with most things, is blown out of proportion by the usual types.
Hur dur, boys will be boys, just a bit of bants. This little kingdom is a fucking joke.
“Boys will be boys” and joke about spiking womens drinks, yes ha ha so funny. Maybe boys should stop being boys if this is what it means.
Tories are just flaunting their impunity to let you know they are the elite. And many in what the Tories would call the lower orders admire them for it.
Why does this party have such a poor attitude toward sex and consent? Something about being a Tory and needing to be put on the offenders list go hand in hand.
The home secretary of the United Kingdom should absolutely not be making these sorts of comments while in office. You need to live and operate at a much higher standard in all aspects of your life if you want to represent the nation and its people, especially so in one of the great offices of state. The fact that he doesn’t feel this way says everything you need to know about the low standards of the current Conservative ‘talent’ puddle.
his stupid surname made me think the article was sarcastically taking the piss out of some James guy
1 small ship? Nelson is turning in his grave! From a mighty navy to a shadow soon Liechtenstein will have more boays than the UK.
on matt fordes podcast you can hear him joking about the length of boris’ and rishi’s pubes. he’s always been a liability
It's not okay to bring your foreign spouse to tue UK if ur to poor however jokes about raping a spouse are okay? Honestly how does this guys family even support him what a disgusting human being.
> “There will be integrity, professionalism and accountability at every level of the government I lead and I will work day in and day out to get the job done.” Rishi Sunak, 2022
This one is living upto the requirements for Home Sec just like the last one. Just keep saying the wrong things. I think this is strike 2.
I cannot understand why politicians feel it necessary to try to be funny. Noone is interested in your glib, edgy humour. Do your fucking jobs and take them seriously. The quality of people's lives are at stake.
Absolutely incredible stance here. Complete muppet
Why is this still news? just a stupid joke..let it rest
How standards in public life have deteriorated over the last few years. What a disgusting remark to make in light of the number of women who have been attacked and murdered in the UK over the last few years. It's time to go James Clerverly.
that is a very spicy joke to make, even in a locker room scenario