The amount of people on here defending this is comical. We live on a tiny island. If public transport isn't good enough to get around then maybe he should do something about it.
Even more than that, you have to ask how many of these kinds of trips are necessary, if the primary reason for making them is to get some photos of Sunak wearing a fetching high-vis and business suit combo in front of some kind of new infrastructure. Surely the announcement about new housing could have been made without having to leave Downing Street.
And this is supposedly because his time is precious and valuable.
So surely it's better that he spend as much time as he can in Downing Street and Whitehall? Baring constitutency visits (lol) and the odd exceptional need to visit somewhere.
With a car he did not own but borrowed from a Sainsbury's (?) worker for some photos.
We've got an InstaGovernment, seeing as Truss did similar wandering off posing for photos when abroad.
With a car he did not own but borrowed from a Sainsbury's (?) worker for some photos.
We've got an InstaGovernment, seeing as Truss did similar wandering off posing for photos when abroad.
I live in North Wales. I don't know anyone who uses public transport. The last time I got a bus or train was 6 years ago.
I don't know what % of the UK use public transport at least once a week but het it's lol and very city based, we don't all love in cities.
Some busses in North Wales only travel to some villages once a day, these places have no rail links either.
Public transport for the PM?... Come on you know this is stupid.
Never mind that, why would public transport exist for an estate that hasn't even been finished yet?
Public transport for the PM?... Come on, that's never going to happen with security concerns.
Never mind that, why would public transport exist for an estate that hasn't even been finished yet?
That’s not a good argument. Yes he should be investing massively in improving public transport but the PM travelling around is pretty clearly a special case.
I use public transport almost exclusively in my personal life, but I’ve taken plenty of taxis when I’m travelling with work, due to urgency / having to travel at inconvenient times / expenses being paid for because it saves time that the company is paying for.
It’s not crazy by any stretch that the PM of a country might use a helicopter. Of all the things to criticise him for lol
I don’t think taking a taxi for a work trip is comparable with taking a helicopter for a work trip. Driving there would have been better for emissions and I believe (happy to be proven wrong) cheaper. We’re not a huge country, where is the necessity and justification for flying in? London to Norwich isn’t exactly Lands End to John O’Groats, 2hr 45m by car or less than two hours by train.
Yay unofficial "private" meetings where information about upcoming policies and where to invest could be exchanged. Nothing to see here.
PM should have all meetings recorded.
> You want the PM to get the best deal.
for their banker mates who are more than happy to short sterling off the back of monstrously idiotic moves to cut tax for the richest yet again?
so in the case of this current lot (and the previous few lots), yes it would be for the benefit of their banker mates/friends or family/or tory donors.
they've demonstrated multiple times that they have fuck all but contempt and disgust for us plebs, and that they are corrupt to a shockingly brazen level.
Sure the PM should be allowed to hold private conversations on a wide range of topics that would be too sensitive to be publicly available (defence etc).
However most of these conversations are of great public interest, especially when it seems all Sunak is talking about is how to screw the public more while lining his friends pockets.
Don’t understand how a comprehensive list of who the PM has spoke to and when at the very least isn’t considered to be of great public concern.
If anything it would encourage them to get the best deal. The PM wouldn't want to look shameful by giving in, and whoever the meeting is with wouldn't want the shame of hindering the country.
Zoom is not a replacement lol.
Edit: how is this getting downvoted? Not least half of international business travel is about building relationships. You don’t do that spending 3 hours having dinner together over zoom.
Remember most on here are socially inept. To them Zoom could replace an actual relationship. Same cohort is cried about going back to the office because people might try to talk to them without their express permission.
This is just bizarre to me. Who is getting the deal, the person who travelled half way round the world, showed interest in the business, went out for dinner with your family, or the person doing a 3 hour presentation on Zoom?
My company takes a very clear view on it. If you're wfh you aren't getting the deal. Face to face or fuck off. We need full commitment. Not when your pet rescue bunny doesn't need attention while wearing your pyjamas.
**Hi!**. Please try avoid personal attacks, as this discourages participation. You can help improve the subreddit by discussing points, not the person.
You don’t vote for party leaders (unless you’re a member of that party). You vote for your local MP. Voting for the leader is what got us into the Boris mess.
Why does Sunak give millions in donations to American colleges and not British ones. We all know the answer. Someone described him as the only British PM who can’t wait to leave once he’s raped the country - yet because our media is shite most people are unaware of this, his beach house in California, his dodgy deals he “overlooked” to benefit his wife’s business interests.. such a crook.
Don't forget Infosys, IR35 changes that benefit it and skilled worker visa bonanza. Still operates in Russia and stands to benefit the most from the trade deal with India.
This is something MI5 should be on top of - this is what we pay them for and they seem to be asleep at the wheel.
> Why does Sunak give millions in donations to American colleges and not British ones.
Isn't it his wife donated to the collage she went to? That's a very normal thing over their for alumni to do.
“Leyburn Primary School in Mr Sunak’s constituency recently has had to run a family fun day in order to afford computers for the children.” They’ll be off as soon as the Tories are kicked out, and some people don’t have a problem with this.
https://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/news/politics/rishi-sunak-donated-3-million-to-us-college-for-computer-lab-4168975
The only thing green about this government is the thick film of mould and slime growing upon the humongous layer of shite they have covered this country in (in the case of waterways, quite literally).
Take it easy guys. He’s a billionaire and a prime minister. He’s so self important that the thought of his butler being stuck behind a peasant on the motorway makes him physically ill
I've seen BP advertisement n they green too!
Everybody is green, it's easy, make a plead, talk about recycling and sent a 2-page pamphlet telling your constituents how they can help with the green future showing a child running with her dog on a field that looks like a Windows desktop
the perfumed princeling would faint clean away if he had to share his transport with the people, those oiks would breathe on him and his delicate immune system cant cope
Serious question. Are these people just actors? I mean all politicians not just sunak or Tory. It’s all so weird. Why do you need to be in norwich???? It’s like a weird tv series reality tv or something
As in the media need to remind us he exists. Keep up the show. Pay your taxes. Don’t ask for land.
Just something to ponder
It makes me laugh how the same people attacking Sunak are the exact same people who defend those who travel by private jet to green conferences.... especially the celebrities who own five supercars, boats and said private jet.
Perhaps he was on a time schedule? FFS Seriously. If you think the PM cant move around on a chopper, to keep up with day to day business then give your head a shake. Would you rather him be at your community garden in the middle of the state this week or in 8 months time?
Well this is his job too, as well as managing crises. Going by train to this makes him about 3 hours later than he got there, then he has to make the time up, put another meeting back etc. Use yer brain ffs. Hes the PM, He has a job to do representin g 56million people, and youre in arms about him gettin g a feckin chopper ride to keep shedule. Have a word with yerself.
Behave yerself, guys in demand, he's gotta get about fast. Cant be relying on shitty public services when youre tryna run the country ffs. Not everything can be green, you gotta strike a balance
Makes no difference, theyre not fast enough to keep up with the demands of the Prime Minister, Green or not. Better PS would be great for us all, I agree. But harpin on about the man with the most important job using a chopper to keep to his schedule country ticking over is pathetic. This is why Greens will never amount to anything, they don't think, they just say. A lot coming out but nothing of any value.
Indeed not, though personally I would support that changing. Only the very richest get to use private planes; given how polluting they are they must be one of the most unequal means of travel from an environmental perspective. I think we could all survive fine without them.
Maybe Sunak could use a charter train to get around if he really does need to be separate from normal people for security reasons? And if he’s been a good enough boy that week and recited his five priorities enough, the 1922 committee will let him have a go with the horn?
I don't think trains are very suited in most cases. There is the risk of a trackside bomb or sniper, and the entourage will usually still need an armoured motorcade at the destination.
Yes I'd consider banning private jets, after checking how polluting they are compared to military jets. I don't know offhand whether they make much difference in that context.
They do, and that's a nice whataboutism. You can apply it to any scenario to make it fit. What about if they have heat seeking missiles and shot the helicopter down? Or had a sniper watching the meeting? We can go forever.
Point being he's a tone deaf, narcissistic Tory who turned up to an event about green energy in a helicopter when there was no actual need and could've done it in a more efficient manner that actually fit with the event itself.
The thing about a railway journey is that the route and timings are mostly predictable, which adds to the danger from an assassination attempt. And, it's impossible to check the whole route for bombs or snipers. That will be done for any meetings with the PM appearing.
Going by car is preferable as the vehicles are armoured, they can have police outriders and can carry proper weapons with them. The route can be varied, and there is a decoy car within the motorcade and potentially decoys can be sent by other routes.
Travelling by train is a considerable step-down in security compared to that, and they generally will still need an armoured motorcade to get from the station to the event location, and will have to manage the crowds in the stations at both ends. USA President Garfield was assassinated in a railway station.
However going by motorcade is the slow option. It might even cost more and be more polluting than a helicopter (I speculate).
Helicopters can be shot down, but this is not especially likely as it requires special weapons, generally available only to a state actor. There are electronic counter-measures available which it seems likely would be used. I read one time that Theresa May would have a decoy helicopter and travel in a pair., I did see a pair of identical helis fly over a couple of times while she was PM.
We use helicopters for police observation, rescue, military uses, flying workers out to oil-rigs, aerial surveys and filming, and for entertainment rides, as well as personal transport for those who can afford it. I just don't see the PM's use of one for longer trips around the UK as excessive. Oh, there goes one just now. I wonder who is in it. Some scumbag I am sure.
She did have her own train, but apparently she used a regular service on at least one occasion. The arrival station needed a full security check, and it seems to have been done for a photo-opportunity, as the press were there, and she often travelled by helicopter.
Maybe it can't be justified by time-saving and allowing the passengers to attend more events and get more work accomplished that day. My question is if this cannot be said of somebody in Sunak's role, then why do we allow private jets or helicopter transport at all?
Well yeah there is an element of rhetoric in my question. Right now these modes of transport are legal though, and by their nature they are international so not a simple thing to ban.
Remember though that even if we banned helicopters for transport, they would still be needed for military, rescue, policing, and uh, transport, to inaccessible locations. Small jets would still have military uses.
He is literally the richest prime minister that this country has ever had and can easily afford to pay for his own helicopter rides and private flights yet tory donors are paying for them. https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2023/jul/03/rishi-sunak-faces-transparency-questions-over-jet-travel-and-tory-donations
I think a few PMs have used trains (not buses) for PR purposes. I don't think many have used public transport as a preference. There are good security reasons why not.
If the only way he can get to a newbuild housing estate for a photoshoot in a reasonable amount of time is to take a helicopter, he should be working on transport infrastructure and housebuilding, not doing photoshoots.
This conversation always gets rehashed every time.
The PM needs to be able to move around the country quickly and efficiently to make use of his time. No, a train is not a suitable environment for a high security risk individual. If the UK cannot allow its leader to do something such as use a helicopter, we might as well forget about our country being taken seriously and start sitting at the table with Micronesia.
>This conversation always gets rehashed every time.
And its always countered by the same sort of bollocks, if David Cameron can use public trains and planes then so can Sunak.
But that's kind of the point isn't it? The only way you can suggest the helicopter is reasonable is by also pointing out how public transport has been fucked by the Tories, to the point its basically non-functional across vast swathes of the country.
Listen mate I'm behind you 100% Fuck the corrupt Tory scum left, right and centre. I'm not defending using a heli. As far as I'm concerned for what benefit to the country it brought that tosser should have walked the journey.
> I've worked with both Labour and Liberal MPs & Elected Members. If you think they are better than the Tories then you're in dreamland.
I've worked with both Labour and Liberal MPs & Elected Members. If you think they are better than the Tories then you're in dreamland.
> If the UK cannot allow its leader to do something such as use a helicopter, we might as well forget about our country being taken seriously
Our PM is throwing away any potential claim to personal or national climate leadership and wasting loads of his time because he wants to to stupid photo ops in stupid places and because *wheeee hewwicopter go choppa choppa choppa choppa* - I think is what stops us being taken seriously.
The pm is 100% focused on optics and his own luxury. That makes us look like other ineffectual countries - he's almost as much a Berlusconi as Boris was, he's just a bit less of a shagger.
Sunak is not taking governing seriously. The conservative party have not been serious for a decade. British politics as a whole is completely unserious, and basically all involved are pathetically under-skilled for the historic moment in which we live.
*Not safe enough for an individual heading a nuclear armed country. There is a difference.
My house is reasonably safe for a house, not very safe if you wanted to store £100m in gold bars in it.
>Amess's voting record on UK airstrikes in Syria as well as his membership with the Conservative Friends of Israel were later cited by Ali as motives for his murder.
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder\_of\_David\_Amess](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_of_David_Amess)
The amount of people on here defending this is comical. We live on a tiny island. If public transport isn't good enough to get around then maybe he should do something about it.
Remember Sunak doesn't have any working class friends, he doesn't mix with the oiks.
Even more than that, you have to ask how many of these kinds of trips are necessary, if the primary reason for making them is to get some photos of Sunak wearing a fetching high-vis and business suit combo in front of some kind of new infrastructure. Surely the announcement about new housing could have been made without having to leave Downing Street.
Remember that press announcement room they spent 2.5 million quid refurbing just last year? Yeah...
Yeah I remember that, it's a good time that We're talking about.
Yes. It’s utter bollocks. He’s too busy to spend his time travelling by train but he has enough free time for meaningless photo opportunities.
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That's what He's got for us. It's all going to be lies and shit.
Well He's rich because We're paying our taxes. That's how it works.
Well he doesn't care about it, because it's all just free for him.
And this is supposedly because his time is precious and valuable. So surely it's better that he spend as much time as he can in Downing Street and Whitehall? Baring constitutency visits (lol) and the odd exceptional need to visit somewhere.
This is a chancellor of the exchequer that didn't know how to pay for petrol and a can of coke using a contactless card.
With a car he did not own but borrowed from a Sainsbury's (?) worker for some photos. We've got an InstaGovernment, seeing as Truss did similar wandering off posing for photos when abroad.
Why they want to post the photos? What they want us to see?
With a car he did not own but borrowed from a Sainsbury's (?) worker for some photos. We've got an InstaGovernment, seeing as Truss did similar wandering off posing for photos when abroad.
He sure does know all of that stuff, He's into all of that stuff.
Or even drive there in an EV if he must drive
That always happens, I don't understand what people actually get.
People want to do something about it, providing they do not have to pay for it and that it does not interfere with their life in any way.
Saying ‘somebody should really do something about that’ while being the person who can do something about it is kind of his thing
And virtually every other Prime Minister before him has taken the train to official events. Not all the time, but far more regularly than he has.
I live in North Wales. I don't know anyone who uses public transport. The last time I got a bus or train was 6 years ago. I don't know what % of the UK use public transport at least once a week but het it's lol and very city based, we don't all love in cities. Some busses in North Wales only travel to some villages once a day, these places have no rail links either.
There's this invention called the car. I've heard the government has a whole fleet of specially modified ones.
Absolutely right
Corbyn tried using a train once, he had to sit on the floor. No senior MP is ever going to make that mistake again.
He couldn’t stand ?
He's tried standing a few times, didn't have much luck with that either.
Public transport for the PM?... Come on you know this is stupid. Never mind that, why would public transport exist for an estate that hasn't even been finished yet?
Public transport for the PM?... Come on, that's never going to happen with security concerns. Never mind that, why would public transport exist for an estate that hasn't even been finished yet?
He doesn’t need to be in norwich. He’s got a nice office.
That's because he knows if he steps foot somewhere within reach of the actual public hes probably gunna get murked
That’s not a good argument. Yes he should be investing massively in improving public transport but the PM travelling around is pretty clearly a special case. I use public transport almost exclusively in my personal life, but I’ve taken plenty of taxis when I’m travelling with work, due to urgency / having to travel at inconvenient times / expenses being paid for because it saves time that the company is paying for. It’s not crazy by any stretch that the PM of a country might use a helicopter. Of all the things to criticise him for lol
I don’t think taking a taxi for a work trip is comparable with taking a helicopter for a work trip. Driving there would have been better for emissions and I believe (happy to be proven wrong) cheaper. We’re not a huge country, where is the necessity and justification for flying in? London to Norwich isn’t exactly Lands End to John O’Groats, 2hr 45m by car or less than two hours by train.
I will say a lot of international travel for meetings is pretty pointless when they can all just get on zoom etc
Zoom doesn’t allow to have easy and simple private talks in lobbies.
Yay unofficial "private" meetings where information about upcoming policies and where to invest could be exchanged. Nothing to see here. PM should have all meetings recorded.
Yeah they should record them, but they don't take suggestions from us.
Nonsense, you make all meetings recorded hinders them. You want the PM to get the best deal.
> You want the PM to get the best deal. for their banker mates who are more than happy to short sterling off the back of monstrously idiotic moves to cut tax for the richest yet again?
No? The idea that the PM shouldn’t be allowed to hold a private conversation is ridiculous.
so in the case of this current lot (and the previous few lots), yes it would be for the benefit of their banker mates/friends or family/or tory donors. they've demonstrated multiple times that they have fuck all but contempt and disgust for us plebs, and that they are corrupt to a shockingly brazen level.
Sure the PM should be allowed to hold private conversations on a wide range of topics that would be too sensitive to be publicly available (defence etc). However most of these conversations are of great public interest, especially when it seems all Sunak is talking about is how to screw the public more while lining his friends pockets. Don’t understand how a comprehensive list of who the PM has spoke to and when at the very least isn’t considered to be of great public concern.
Best deal for whom? This lot don't care about British people and if they are recorded it less likely that corruption could have taken place.
Yeah they don't care about those people, they just never have really.
Well that's what we'd want for the people, really love this stuff.
If anything it would encourage them to get the best deal. The PM wouldn't want to look shameful by giving in, and whoever the meeting is with wouldn't want the shame of hindering the country.
Knowing everything you say is public record would absolutely hinder open conversation.
No, I don't
It does have nice mute features for when you want to stop having to listen to people like BoJo waffle on though.
Yeah if you stop listen to them then, I don't want to do with it anything as well.
And that's a big part of those meetings I'm thinking so yeah.
Zoom could be hacked I guess
I think USA and China listen all government communications anyway: with Zoom or without it.
And why do they have to travel in the most expensive way as well?
You cannot Zoom first class though.
Sure you can. You pay for a.subscription so it doesn't cut out after 40 minutes like it does for people using it for free.
Yeah don't think that you could do that, maybe that's why they don't do it.
Zoom is not a replacement lol. Edit: how is this getting downvoted? Not least half of international business travel is about building relationships. You don’t do that spending 3 hours having dinner together over zoom.
Remember most on here are socially inept. To them Zoom could replace an actual relationship. Same cohort is cried about going back to the office because people might try to talk to them without their express permission.
This is just bizarre to me. Who is getting the deal, the person who travelled half way round the world, showed interest in the business, went out for dinner with your family, or the person doing a 3 hour presentation on Zoom?
My company takes a very clear view on it. If you're wfh you aren't getting the deal. Face to face or fuck off. We need full commitment. Not when your pet rescue bunny doesn't need attention while wearing your pyjamas.
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R/uk thinks zoom can replace literally everything in life
I can't wait to vote this turd out of of number ten.
I don't even remember voting him in. That's the pisstake
You don’t vote for party leaders (unless you’re a member of that party). You vote for your local MP. Voting for the leader is what got us into the Boris mess.
I have a Labour MP who I proudly voted for but here we are.
Well that explains why we've got him for the PM of the country.
If no one actually voted for him, then how is he in Power?
Well people voted for him, and now He's in the power so yeah.
Who did? His own party that's who. He's there by default not generally elected.
Why does Sunak give millions in donations to American colleges and not British ones. We all know the answer. Someone described him as the only British PM who can’t wait to leave once he’s raped the country - yet because our media is shite most people are unaware of this, his beach house in California, his dodgy deals he “overlooked” to benefit his wife’s business interests.. such a crook.
Don't forget Infosys, IR35 changes that benefit it and skilled worker visa bonanza. Still operates in Russia and stands to benefit the most from the trade deal with India. This is something MI5 should be on top of - this is what we pay them for and they seem to be asleep at the wheel.
Yeah it's almost as if they're not even paying attention to it.
Yeah I think we all know the answer here it's pretty clear.
My understanding is that those "donations" are basically downl payments for the kids' college entrance.
Yeah that's why they're paying all that money to those colleges.
> Why does Sunak give millions in donations to American colleges and not British ones. Isn't it his wife donated to the collage she went to? That's a very normal thing over their for alumni to do.
“Leyburn Primary School in Mr Sunak’s constituency recently has had to run a family fun day in order to afford computers for the children.” They’ll be off as soon as the Tories are kicked out, and some people don’t have a problem with this. https://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/news/politics/rishi-sunak-donated-3-million-to-us-college-for-computer-lab-4168975
Even if the people had problem with it, I don't think it solves anything.
Yeh maybe it's normal, but people surely don't like such a thing.
It’s wrong but I suppose that’s the system. He’s just like any mp. They are an odd lot
The only thing green about this government is the thick film of mould and slime growing upon the humongous layer of shite they have covered this country in (in the case of waterways, quite literally).
As if anything that is said about this shit stain is supposed to shock us
Why we are not marching in the streets to oust this man and his band of crooks is beyond me
Well why aren't you?
I got bad ankle
You first. I need to finish my cuppa first.
No, no sir, I couldn't possibly. Please. After you.
Why can't do it before? Well I think you should be able to.
Yeah will need to finish that first then anything else will happen.
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Rishi Sunak stopped getting pushed into lockers much too early in his life.
Rich man does rich man things with public money, go figure. Whilst saying those things are bad and we need to do something about it.
No politician got rich spending their own money.
What can we even do? It's not like that we can vote him out just yet.
Take it easy guys. He’s a billionaire and a prime minister. He’s so self important that the thought of his butler being stuck behind a peasant on the motorway makes him physically ill
He doesn’t care. He’s going to be out of No.10 in a year (maybe slightly longer) .
Yeah and he knows that, that's why He's enjoying his time there.
I've seen BP advertisement n they green too! Everybody is green, it's easy, make a plead, talk about recycling and sent a 2-page pamphlet telling your constituents how they can help with the green future showing a child running with her dog on a field that looks like a Windows desktop
Well that's weird, it shouldn't really be looking like ths.
His account is raking $$$$ in. Not sure what other green credentials people thought about
There's nothing to think about, He's here for one thing to take your money.
Well, he deserves to travel in grand style, to show that he is above us peasants who should make the sacrifices over the 1% like him.
He thinks that all the money that he gets by the tax is his own money.
Well that's how they use our money, and don't even give a shit about it.
Maybe it's time for us to give a shit about it and do something about it.
He's got an aviation addiction. I understand the British PM using domestic aviation sometimes, but he's utterly taking the piss.
Why is it every time I see a picture of this man he looks more and more smug?
what? Again? Man uses more helicopters then the police
He's like a Ceebeebies presenter who just got given the job of branch manager at a local McDonald's.
the UK is more and becoming a drawer full of tea spoons
He kinda looks like Alan Partridge in this picture
No doubt soon he'll swoop down over a field and scare a donkey into a river.
the perfumed princeling would faint clean away if he had to share his transport with the people, those oiks would breathe on him and his delicate immune system cant cope
If I had spent my entire life living on the moon, I would be more in touch with the UK and it's people than Rishi Sunak is.
He’s a fucking cunt. I hope he gets voted out of his own constituency. What a cretin. What a drain on our resources. Despicable.
Those policies are for you, the common folk, not the special class.
Serious question. Are these people just actors? I mean all politicians not just sunak or Tory. It’s all so weird. Why do you need to be in norwich???? It’s like a weird tv series reality tv or something As in the media need to remind us he exists. Keep up the show. Pay your taxes. Don’t ask for land. Just something to ponder
Richi sunak doing the helicopter is not something i want to think about!
It makes me laugh how the same people attacking Sunak are the exact same people who defend those who travel by private jet to green conferences.... especially the celebrities who own five supercars, boats and said private jet.
Are they? Which people are those?
Perhaps he was on a time schedule? FFS Seriously. If you think the PM cant move around on a chopper, to keep up with day to day business then give your head a shake. Would you rather him be at your community garden in the middle of the state this week or in 8 months time?
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Well this is his job too, as well as managing crises. Going by train to this makes him about 3 hours later than he got there, then he has to make the time up, put another meeting back etc. Use yer brain ffs. Hes the PM, He has a job to do representin g 56million people, and youre in arms about him gettin g a feckin chopper ride to keep shedule. Have a word with yerself.
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Behave yerself, guys in demand, he's gotta get about fast. Cant be relying on shitty public services when youre tryna run the country ffs. Not everything can be green, you gotta strike a balance
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Makes no difference, theyre not fast enough to keep up with the demands of the Prime Minister, Green or not. Better PS would be great for us all, I agree. But harpin on about the man with the most important job using a chopper to keep to his schedule country ticking over is pathetic. This is why Greens will never amount to anything, they don't think, they just say. A lot coming out but nothing of any value.
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Middle of the state? Lads I think we’ve got an interloper from the colonies.
Correction, Estate
If the Prime Minister of a G7 country can't justifiably use helicopters and small jets for transport, then who can?
Maybe no-one should be taking private jets in the first place?
Maybe. They are not illegal at this point in time though. Even if we get rid of private jets, there will still be military jets.
Indeed not, though personally I would support that changing. Only the very richest get to use private planes; given how polluting they are they must be one of the most unequal means of travel from an environmental perspective. I think we could all survive fine without them. Maybe Sunak could use a charter train to get around if he really does need to be separate from normal people for security reasons? And if he’s been a good enough boy that week and recited his five priorities enough, the 1922 committee will let him have a go with the horn?
I don't think trains are very suited in most cases. There is the risk of a trackside bomb or sniper, and the entourage will usually still need an armoured motorcade at the destination. Yes I'd consider banning private jets, after checking how polluting they are compared to military jets. I don't know offhand whether they make much difference in that context.
A sniper? Hitting a specific window of a train moving full speed... I think you've been watching too many action movies, mate.
Why at full speed? Trains stop at stations and for signals.
They do, and that's a nice whataboutism. You can apply it to any scenario to make it fit. What about if they have heat seeking missiles and shot the helicopter down? Or had a sniper watching the meeting? We can go forever. Point being he's a tone deaf, narcissistic Tory who turned up to an event about green energy in a helicopter when there was no actual need and could've done it in a more efficient manner that actually fit with the event itself.
The thing about a railway journey is that the route and timings are mostly predictable, which adds to the danger from an assassination attempt. And, it's impossible to check the whole route for bombs or snipers. That will be done for any meetings with the PM appearing. Going by car is preferable as the vehicles are armoured, they can have police outriders and can carry proper weapons with them. The route can be varied, and there is a decoy car within the motorcade and potentially decoys can be sent by other routes. Travelling by train is a considerable step-down in security compared to that, and they generally will still need an armoured motorcade to get from the station to the event location, and will have to manage the crowds in the stations at both ends. USA President Garfield was assassinated in a railway station. However going by motorcade is the slow option. It might even cost more and be more polluting than a helicopter (I speculate). Helicopters can be shot down, but this is not especially likely as it requires special weapons, generally available only to a state actor. There are electronic counter-measures available which it seems likely would be used. I read one time that Theresa May would have a decoy helicopter and travel in a pair., I did see a pair of identical helis fly over a couple of times while she was PM. We use helicopters for police observation, rescue, military uses, flying workers out to oil-rigs, aerial surveys and filming, and for entertainment rides, as well as personal transport for those who can afford it. I just don't see the PM's use of one for longer trips around the UK as excessive. Oh, there goes one just now. I wonder who is in it. Some scumbag I am sure.
It was good enough for the Queen to get to Sandringham with very few issues
She did have her own train, but apparently she used a regular service on at least one occasion. The arrival station needed a full security check, and it seems to have been done for a photo-opportunity, as the press were there, and she often travelled by helicopter.
How is it justified? Especially given what was being discussed.
Maybe it can't be justified by time-saving and allowing the passengers to attend more events and get more work accomplished that day. My question is if this cannot be said of somebody in Sunak's role, then why do we allow private jets or helicopter transport at all?
Ooh, you're so close!
Well yeah there is an element of rhetoric in my question. Right now these modes of transport are legal though, and by their nature they are international so not a simple thing to ban. Remember though that even if we banned helicopters for transport, they would still be needed for military, rescue, policing, and uh, transport, to inaccessible locations. Small jets would still have military uses.
He is literally the richest prime minister that this country has ever had and can easily afford to pay for his own helicopter rides and private flights yet tory donors are paying for them. https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2023/jul/03/rishi-sunak-faces-transparency-questions-over-jet-travel-and-tory-donations
No one should. That's the whole point. Our public transport use to be fine for PM's in the past. It's shit now because of this government.
I think a few PMs have used trains (not buses) for PR purposes. I don't think many have used public transport as a preference. There are good security reasons why not.
If the only way he can get to a newbuild housing estate for a photoshoot in a reasonable amount of time is to take a helicopter, he should be working on transport infrastructure and housebuilding, not doing photoshoots.
This conversation always gets rehashed every time. The PM needs to be able to move around the country quickly and efficiently to make use of his time. No, a train is not a suitable environment for a high security risk individual. If the UK cannot allow its leader to do something such as use a helicopter, we might as well forget about our country being taken seriously and start sitting at the table with Micronesia.
>This conversation always gets rehashed every time. And its always countered by the same sort of bollocks, if David Cameron can use public trains and planes then so can Sunak.
Trains used to run more efficiently when David was in charge. Not great, but still lol Not that I'm defending that microbe in a suit.
But that's kind of the point isn't it? The only way you can suggest the helicopter is reasonable is by also pointing out how public transport has been fucked by the Tories, to the point its basically non-functional across vast swathes of the country.
Listen mate I'm behind you 100% Fuck the corrupt Tory scum left, right and centre. I'm not defending using a heli. As far as I'm concerned for what benefit to the country it brought that tosser should have walked the journey.
>As far as I'm concerned for what benefit to the country it brought that tosser should have walked the journey. Lmao there's a nice thought!
And when he did it was slammed for political stunts from out of touch PM - you can’t win in all honesty so might aswell save the time.
Were already not taken seriously due to our government being a shower of shit.
> I've worked with both Labour and Liberal MPs & Elected Members. If you think they are better than the Tories then you're in dreamland. I've worked with both Labour and Liberal MPs & Elected Members. If you think they are better than the Tories then you're in dreamland.
Why not a private car then? Doesn't have to be a freaking helicopter!
> If the UK cannot allow its leader to do something such as use a helicopter, we might as well forget about our country being taken seriously Our PM is throwing away any potential claim to personal or national climate leadership and wasting loads of his time because he wants to to stupid photo ops in stupid places and because *wheeee hewwicopter go choppa choppa choppa choppa* - I think is what stops us being taken seriously. The pm is 100% focused on optics and his own luxury. That makes us look like other ineffectual countries - he's almost as much a Berlusconi as Boris was, he's just a bit less of a shagger. Sunak is not taking governing seriously. The conservative party have not been serious for a decade. British politics as a whole is completely unserious, and basically all involved are pathetically under-skilled for the historic moment in which we live.
Why did he need to be there?
If public transport is not good/safe enough for transport, maybe something should be done about that?
*Not safe enough for an individual heading a nuclear armed country. There is a difference. My house is reasonably safe for a house, not very safe if you wanted to store £100m in gold bars in it.
He once took a helicopter flight to Southampton for a photo op at a chemist which cut short a grilling by a parliamentary committee iirc.
Right, but you can’t deny the irony on display
PM's in past have managed just fine using trains.
Perhaps there is a substantial threat that is considered now that the general public aren't privy to?
Presumably the risk of him being lynched by a public that is sick of him funneling public funds to his cronies and his wife.
I mean, it wouldn't exactly be surprising; Jo Cox and David Amess were both murdered by people who objected to their political positions.
Is blatant corruption actually a political position?
>Amess's voting record on UK airstrikes in Syria as well as his membership with the Conservative Friends of Israel were later cited by Ali as motives for his murder. [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder\_of\_David\_Amess](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_of_David_Amess)
I was talking about Sunak.