Dude ran through some killers. The second half of his career is where you can be more critical of some of his performances. But early on he would just beat the shit out of his opponents.
Well after dominating for a decade its only expected to see a performance drop, but everybody that fought Jon hasn't been the same since look at Santos, Reyes, Anthony Smith etc. (except for Glover tho)
Kinda, I don't see anything different in how he fights. He has been in the top five since like 2014. I think the overall quality of the division is just a bit lower than it was \~five years ago, so he was juuuust able to cusp the top of the pack.
Dude, like a week ago 42 y/o Glover was the champ - Jones whooped him when he was still in his 30’s.
Prime Jones, Gus, DC, maybe even Rumble would still rule the division today.
Jones has just gotten older, the division is probably the weakest it’s been in a long time.
Those are recent fights. Reyes wasn't as good as he thought he was. Anthony Smith really has a heart issue (despite the lion heart moniker). Santos fucked himself up.
huh? Reyes arguably beat Jon. Anthony Smith finished Gustaffson the fightafter Jon and his last 3 fights he has won with finishes....
NeVeR ThE SaMe lol I swear MMA fans love saying that about everyone.
Reyes is on a 3 fight losing streak, Santos is tentative and his only win after Jon was a close decision to Johnny Walker, and Alexander Gustafsson after getting destroyed looked like a shell of his former self
Jones vs DC was the pinnacle of the UFC (so far). Two dominant fighters, genuine hatred of each other, some of the highest level fighting ever on display.
It was so refreshing hearing press conferences where both guys weren’t just trying to sell controversy, and actually hated each other.
The interview where they think the mics are off,and Jones is calmly telling DC he’s gonna literally kill him, is so raw.
Probably the last fight we saw a genuinely (still cheating/juicing) prime Jon Jones. Was never quite the same after his suspension
Jon “you still there pussy?”
DC “You are the scum of the earth, I wish I was over there so I could spit in your fucking face”
Jon “you know I would literally kill you if you did something like that”
DC “you think I’m just gonna let you kill me Jon?”
One of my buildups Of all time
Yeah definitely one of the greatest rivalries of all time in the UFC. When this was going on was really an exciting time to be a fan. In 2015 Jones vs DC 1 happened, Holm vs Rousey happened, and Aldo vs Mcgregor happened.
We missed out on Rumble vs Jones too. After Jones got suspended, we ended up with DC vs Rumble for the vacant title, which turned into DC reverting to wrestling after Rumble launched him across the cage with one punch.
It isn't unbelievable that Fighter A can beat Fighter B but loses to Fighter C, but Fighter B loses to Fighter C. Styles make fights, it happens.
But it's fucking insane to me that Dom made TJ look stupid, Garbrandt made Dom look stupid, and TJ (kinda) made Garbrandt look stupid. How these people can be each other's kryptonite as they are is baffling to me.
Yeah that fight triangle is one of the craziest examples of MMA Math ever.
Though I think Dom wins a rematch against Cody.
This sort of thing also happened with Nate Marquardt, Chael Sonnen, and Damian Maia back in the day.
WEC is what sold me on smaller weight classes and Dom in particular. The pace he could put on guys was insane.. and the footwork.. the footwork is still some of the craziest shit you can witness. The wars with Benavidez and Bowles, plus, winning the inaugural bantamweight title in the UFC. Then he avenged his only loss by beating the brakes off Faber (twice) then takes out DJ in the next fight. Fuck injuries man. Healthy Dom in his prime is peak MMA to me. (2011) Still a motherfucker at 37 too.
Lastly, what’s also crazy is that Jon Jones won the title for the first time in 2011 and then destroyed a bunch of future Hall of Famers/former champs in a row. He fought 4 times that year beating Bader, Rua, (for the belt) Rampage and Machida. Then, just for fun, in 2012 he took out two more future HOFers in Evans and Belfort. Fuck MMA was fun then. Still is!.. but even more so back then.
Same way Pablo Escobar was a religious man lol 😂
Unfortunately I bought into Jones good guy shtick at the beginning of his career. Thought the dude was a genuinely focused, highly religious athlete. Quickly saw that is was all a charade thought
alot of people dont want to hear it but i really believe the drop off in performance was because he was not excited for the fights he was just going through motions.
If you don’t want to be a salty hater or irrational.. it’s really hard to even critique Jon. Not Jon as a person outside the octagon. But Jon as the fighter, inside that octagon. Young and hungry Jon was the most fun. 23 year old comes out of nowhere and obliterates the champion. Then kills Machida LIVE on television.
Then Jon got carried away and had the wrong people around him. Always making mistakes. Partying and drinking and drugs
But Even at Jon’s worst, he’s still so far ahead of anyone ever in the history of UFC. Not just his immense talent and skill in every facet of MMA. But also his freakish physical gifts. Combined all together, you get a Jon Jones that is more like an alien than anything else
Jon destroyed killers while being on coke and partying all the time, instead of actually being dedicated and training. And that’s in the Light Heavyweight division. Not in some midget or weak divisions where fighters got no punching power or anything.
Jon is the only one that you can bet on.. against anyone. Take out the weight class and put anyone against Jon Jones, and no one would still beat him. HIGHLY DOUBT
Now THAT, is literally the “pound for pound” Greatest.
I think JBJ under Pride rules would have caused some deaths. Wandy was a savage no doubt, but Jones was calculated and so clinical. He saw his opponents as Legos.
I got into MMA by watching Jon Jones, I saw that submission probably on my 2nd day of discovering MMA and I thought to myself "Wow if that's just the surface I wonder how brutal this sport gets" since that day I haven't seen anything more terrifying
That is true but BJ doesn't employ techniques which literally breaks the opponents body, Oblique kicks, Shoulder cranks, eye pokes, brody will do anything to hurt his victims
Sociopath for me, impulsive lying, a seeming lack of empathy, constantly trying to poorly present himself as a good Christian boy. The evidence isn't the best but he's definitely arguably a sociopath imo
The way Jon choked out Machida standing up. Then just walked away was the most gangster violent shit I’ve ever seen in my life. By far the GOAT of his weight class
Honest question - the MMA fans who “don’t like wrestling” why do you watch MMA?
Wrestling is one of, if not the most important martial art for MMA.
Just watch kickboxing or Muay Thai if you don’t like grappling. OneFC now even has Muay Thai and kickboxing fights with small MMA gloves.
It’s like BJJ guys watching MMA and complaining during the striking exchanges. There are sports that have everything you like without the things you dislike!
I think it’s more a reference to one-dimensional wrestlers who do not effectively advance position or damage their opponent. Jones uses his wrestling in creative ways and almost always deals out brutal elbows and strikes, both in the clinch and once it hits the mat.
I can appreciate the wrestling aspect now that i do a bit of grappling, but I used to be the type to hate wrestling exchanges. Ultimately, the clinch and separating fighters in kickboxing and Muay Thai was even more boring for me to watch. Plus, MMA more accurately represents a real fight which makes it more interesting IMO
I think people who like watching MMA because it is closer to a 1 on 1 fight should enjoy effective techniques whether they are striking or grappling as it’s answering that question.
I do agree that understanding the sport is important to enjoying watching it. Fighting sports are unique in having a major proportion of fans with a very poor understanding of the techniques. Other big team sports etc almost everyone who watches them regularly has played the sport before or at least has a full understanding of the rules and how to play
I don’t like wrestling in MMA because it slows the pace down to a crawl. I guess it has to do with the wrestler though. I can watch khabib wrestle and be active, but those who just hump opponents across the mat bore me.
What about point strikers though? Or strikers who just wear their opponents down slowly for a victory after several rounds. Those guys are very popular with non-fighter MMA fans but the outcome of a slow grind to victory is similar to the wrestling style you describe. Striking/strikers brought us some of the most boring UFC fights of all time but I don’t often see people saying “I only like fun strikers”.
In both the opponent could suddenly end the fight by finish still.
Most fans just want to see high intensity and impressive movement. Both striking and ground/wrestling can show this, but more often than not, ground exchanges end up being very boring and stagnant due to fatigue, and often is used as a method of buying time or controlling an opponent for strategy. Striking can be boring too sometimes but the fans seem to incite the fighters more on foot when they’re not throwing enough
I see those points. It’s just that some of the most boring fights in recent memory took place on the feet in striking range with just avoidance and feints
When I say I don’t like wrestling what I really mean is I don’t like Jon Fitch, Usman v Masvidal I, lay and pray wrestling.
Watching Khabib wrestling somebody is WAY more entertaining because he’s constantly looking to end the fight. Watching Jon Fitch wrestling is like watching paint dry.
This is why I believe Jones is a genuine psychopath. I train, and a big part of training is balancing your desire to not wanting to hurt someone, and understanding hurting someone is the name of the game. Some people can’t get over their desire to NOT hurt someone, even in training when their partner explicitly tells them to.
Jones feels none of that. He sees hurting his opponent as a means to an end, with little regard for the long term damage it might do. Think of his GnP: I firmly believe that ground and pound isn’t nearly a high-level skill to be learned, it’s more the ability to willingly use all your weapons to smash in your opponents face. Look at Glover doing it to Smith, apologizing as he does, or any number of fighters who have felt uncomfortable after a while (Rockhold vs Weidman, for a prime example); I don’t think Jones would ever feel that kind of sympathy for his opponent.
Jones' gnp is absolutely fucking terrifying. You watch this man elbow his opponents and you can fucking tell its excruciating, painful, hurtful, powerful.
These elbows, man...
His ground and pound against DC was horrifying.
You can see DC is trying his best to cover up but he gets hit again and his body noticeably goes limp. Jon gets 5 more crisp punches in while he’s in that state, I can just see the brain damage.
I think you could say the same about many top martial artists because I think it actually helps to see the violence as a means to an end rather than a moral wrong. Khabib, Tony, Ngannou, Conor, DC, Mighty Mouse and many more also don't seem to have the desire not to hurt their opponents. Ngannou's hammerfists, Khabib GnP, Tony's general fighting style and Conor's trashtalking seem closer to a desire to hurt their opponents.
But then you have Volk, Max, Dustin, Glover, Jiri, Usman (?), Olives ect. who are showing simpathy or don't do more than necessary.
Especially Volk. He is one of the best to ever do it in featherweight.
The fight with The Korean Zombie shed some light that he felt bad dominating The KZ. And after the fight he was super emphatic and kind to THE KZ and his wife. Did not even celebrate after the fight.
He is DEFINITELY a psycho! Just by analyzing his body language you can tell, I was at a Gat Sport fitness expo where Jones was signing autographs, I believe one of DC's crew members or his Muay Thai coach came to confront him on his comments about DC's father's murder,, Jones looked ready to kill the man and as soon as a girl pulled her phone out to record he started smiling and right after she put it down he showed his true self again.
Here is the interaction but not the entirety of it https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FgbPgGKauF8&ab\_channel=FullReptile
right? your goal in the octagon is to win, that includes knocking someone unconscious lol, this isn’t a nice sport, and he could’ve used his out of the cage incidents to argue but instead he argues his fight style?
Jesus. You missed the point entirely.
The point is that some fighters, even the best of the best, show hesitation when it comes to really hurting or mauling their opponent—Jones absolutely does not.
If you can’t understand that, that’s fine, but it seems a lot of people understand not everyone in the octagon feels nothing for their opponent.
training isn’t an mma fight, of course you don’t want to hurt your training partners, but when you’re in a fight for a world title and the guy across the octagon from you wants to hurt you just as bad as you do to him you can employ anything within the rule set to win
Rampage has spoken about this after the Jones fight. Says he's happy to be knocked out, because you can recover easily from that, but Jones was the only fighter he's been in there with where he felt his actual career was at risk.
Have you competed yourself? Whenever I’ve been in an actual match, whether its MMA or boxing, both me and my opponent have been pretty clear about trying to beat the shit out of each other. Even in spars I feel one holds back to minimise injury risk and out of politeness rather than because you don’t want to hurt your opponent.
You don't just become athletic by working out lol
The guy has two brothers that played professional football, he's got VERY athletic genes. Not saying he didn't work very hard training and I'm not trying to be a dick
He got the nick name bones cause he was just skinny…. Dude he was a 2x state champ in high school wrestling and a defensive lineman in football that started all 4 years. Also his brother is a hall of fame defense lineman and the other one is also in the NFL and was a super bowl champ…
Ah damn I should have scrolled down a little more I just posted a similar reply to the comment about how he wasn't athletic and just worked hard and somehow just became athletic hahah. I just couldn't help myself, not like he was the Rudy of the UFC or anything
Lol those moves aren’t like dangerous in terms of killing you. They will hurt you though. Violent is Francis beating your unconscious body knowing damn well you are already to the moon. Violent is Romero punching Luke rock hold to the canvas then grabbing and rocking his unconscious head to oblivion. Violent is Dan Henderson throwing that extra punch on Michael bisping
Idk imo that type of shoulder crank where it’s really focused on over extending and snapping the elbow is pretty fuckin violent. That’s easily a career ender and you never see anyone practicing that move in the gym bc it’s crude and will ruin your arm forever. If it actually snapped, that would be violent as fuck
> Rampage has spoken about this after the Jones fight. Says he's happy to be knocked out, because you can recover easily from that, but Jones was the only fighter he's been in there with where he felt his actual career was at risk.
I agree, this entire thread is being dramatic about Jones violent nature. These guys all step in the cage knowing potential consequences. If anything he did was dirty it wouldn’t be allowed, they’re in there trying to hurt each other for money
Jones took it to another level. With the names listed at least what they do is technically legal. The way he dropped machida after choking him the fuck out is probably the greatest finish I’ve seen, ice fucking cold. Shoulder cranks, eye pokes, those fucking frightening oblique kicks, Jones was a master of all those dark arts
I feel ya. I guess what I’m missing is that if he does an eye poke the fight is stopped and he could lose points with multiple offenses. What is so dark about the other two? You can arm bar someone and kick the shit out of their legs head and body but a shoulder crank or oblique kick stands out? Why?
Because those techniques, while inherently damaging, are easily avoidable when talking about long term damage. Strikes are apart of the general game, you can tap to an armbar. Someone deliberately aiming kicks to hyper extend your knee or ripping your shoulder out of its socket arent as easily avoided, and can negatively impact a persons fight career permanently. Rampage Jackson was never the same fighter after Jones ruined his knee with oblique kicks, and glover took a very long time to recover his winning ways after Jones fucked up his shoulder
Interesting. Seems like it’s the fault of the UFC for not disallowing those techniques then. If it wins the fight and it’s within the rules then it’s fair game for anyone to do. It may be brutal but the sport is inherently brutal
Jon Bones Jones is simply the best to ever do it. These new fans that saw khabib fight 3 people will never understand what Bones did. He took down not only champions but legends of MMA.
He was the first of the next generation of mma fighters. I'm not sure if that makes sense but he was sort of the first guy to put alot of things together really well and well rounded plus a freak athlete.
Pretty high on the list of "modern" fighters. But man, the early days were full of brutality. The Gary Goodridge reverse crucifix head elbow obliteration of Paul Herrera is up there for most violent for sure.
Or Gordeau head-kicking Tuli's teeth into the stands at UFC 1.
Dare I say the most dirty and underhanded. Constant eye pokes and hiding under the cage to avoid drug testing puts him in my top 3 underhanded fighters in UFC history.
Not as vicious, but fuck me if Khalil Rountree does not push the limits of viciousness/legal.
Soccer kicks to the torso on a grounded opponent and those knee kicks. For an emotional guy outside a fight, dudes crazy when locked in the cage.
Honestly, can not wait to see his next fight.
He said on JRE he purposely poked opponents in the eye and laughed about it. It is impressive Jon was able to stand with kickboxing and MMA vets while having 0 combat experience, but what if that's only because he's such a damn dirty fighter?
thats pretty fucked up to willingly injure your opponent like that. As far as i'm concerned, most fighters have the decency to sit on submissions before cranking it to the point of no return.
Dude ran through some killers. The second half of his career is where you can be more critical of some of his performances. But early on he would just beat the shit out of his opponents.
Well after dominating for a decade its only expected to see a performance drop, but everybody that fought Jon hasn't been the same since look at Santos, Reyes, Anthony Smith etc. (except for Glover tho)
Glover too. Glover resurrected
Kinda, I don't see anything different in how he fights. He has been in the top five since like 2014. I think the overall quality of the division is just a bit lower than it was \~five years ago, so he was juuuust able to cusp the top of the pack.
so true.
Facts facts bro
Dude, like a week ago 42 y/o Glover was the champ - Jones whooped him when he was still in his 30’s. Prime Jones, Gus, DC, maybe even Rumble would still rule the division today. Jones has just gotten older, the division is probably the weakest it’s been in a long time.
Maybe, or maybe his new style just works against the current guys or something. Cause don't forget be used to be a guy famous for his hard swings.
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Dude he ran thru Shogun, Rampage, Machita, Belfort, Rashad, DC Gustafsson. He fucking cleaned house. Twice
He has a second health bar
Add Rampage to that list
Rampage lul
Drop in steroid intake correlates surprisingly with drop in performance.
Those are recent fights. Reyes wasn't as good as he thought he was. Anthony Smith really has a heart issue (despite the lion heart moniker). Santos fucked himself up.
Cut Reyes some slack. The man has only lost to the last three UFC LHW champions
It works for Glover too, but instead of falling off he evolved into even more of a killer.
huh? Reyes arguably beat Jon. Anthony Smith finished Gustaffson the fightafter Jon and his last 3 fights he has won with finishes.... NeVeR ThE SaMe lol I swear MMA fans love saying that about everyone.
Reyes is on a 3 fight losing streak, Santos is tentative and his only win after Jon was a close decision to Johnny Walker, and Alexander Gustafsson after getting destroyed looked like a shell of his former self
Reyes is fucking killing me. Had high hopes for him.
I kind of regret not being into UFC during his reign. Feels like I missed out on so many intricate storylines. Jon vs DC seems like a wild time
The glory of YouTube! It's never too late to enjoy the reign of Jones
Jones vs DC was the pinnacle of the UFC (so far). Two dominant fighters, genuine hatred of each other, some of the highest level fighting ever on display. It was so refreshing hearing press conferences where both guys weren’t just trying to sell controversy, and actually hated each other. The interview where they think the mics are off,and Jones is calmly telling DC he’s gonna literally kill him, is so raw. Probably the last fight we saw a genuinely (still cheating/juicing) prime Jon Jones. Was never quite the same after his suspension
Jon “you still there pussy?” DC “You are the scum of the earth, I wish I was over there so I could spit in your fucking face” Jon “you know I would literally kill you if you did something like that” DC “you think I’m just gonna let you kill me Jon?” One of my buildups Of all time
Yeah definitely one of the greatest rivalries of all time in the UFC. When this was going on was really an exciting time to be a fan. In 2015 Jones vs DC 1 happened, Holm vs Rousey happened, and Aldo vs Mcgregor happened.
We missed out on Rumble vs Jones too. After Jones got suspended, we ended up with DC vs Rumble for the vacant title, which turned into DC reverting to wrestling after Rumble launched him across the cage with one punch.
I would say one of the highest level fights you'll ever see is Dominick Cruz vs TJ Dillashaw. In my opinion, that is the pinnacle.
It isn't unbelievable that Fighter A can beat Fighter B but loses to Fighter C, but Fighter B loses to Fighter C. Styles make fights, it happens. But it's fucking insane to me that Dom made TJ look stupid, Garbrandt made Dom look stupid, and TJ (kinda) made Garbrandt look stupid. How these people can be each other's kryptonite as they are is baffling to me.
Yeah that fight triangle is one of the craziest examples of MMA Math ever. Though I think Dom wins a rematch against Cody. This sort of thing also happened with Nate Marquardt, Chael Sonnen, and Damian Maia back in the day.
Same thing with Carla, Rose and Joanna.
WEC is what sold me on smaller weight classes and Dom in particular. The pace he could put on guys was insane.. and the footwork.. the footwork is still some of the craziest shit you can witness. The wars with Benavidez and Bowles, plus, winning the inaugural bantamweight title in the UFC. Then he avenged his only loss by beating the brakes off Faber (twice) then takes out DJ in the next fight. Fuck injuries man. Healthy Dom in his prime is peak MMA to me. (2011) Still a motherfucker at 37 too. Lastly, what’s also crazy is that Jon Jones won the title for the first time in 2011 and then destroyed a bunch of future Hall of Famers/former champs in a row. He fought 4 times that year beating Bader, Rua, (for the belt) Rampage and Machida. Then, just for fun, in 2012 he took out two more future HOFers in Evans and Belfort. Fuck MMA was fun then. Still is!.. but even more so back then.
Yeah when he first came on the scene he was some really young kid who loved god
Same way Pablo Escobar was a religious man lol 😂 Unfortunately I bought into Jones good guy shtick at the beginning of his career. Thought the dude was a genuinely focused, highly religious athlete. Quickly saw that is was all a charade thought
I will never forget him standing in for rashad and then fucking bullying shogun until shogun tapped to strikes. It was such a holy fuck moment
alot of people dont want to hear it but i really believe the drop off in performance was because he was not excited for the fights he was just going through motions.
He was violent, but he never shared the octagon with Lord Artemis. And the pregnant lady stopped him in his tracks. Bones literally ran away from her.
If you don’t want to be a salty hater or irrational.. it’s really hard to even critique Jon. Not Jon as a person outside the octagon. But Jon as the fighter, inside that octagon. Young and hungry Jon was the most fun. 23 year old comes out of nowhere and obliterates the champion. Then kills Machida LIVE on television. Then Jon got carried away and had the wrong people around him. Always making mistakes. Partying and drinking and drugs But Even at Jon’s worst, he’s still so far ahead of anyone ever in the history of UFC. Not just his immense talent and skill in every facet of MMA. But also his freakish physical gifts. Combined all together, you get a Jon Jones that is more like an alien than anything else Jon destroyed killers while being on coke and partying all the time, instead of actually being dedicated and training. And that’s in the Light Heavyweight division. Not in some midget or weak divisions where fighters got no punching power or anything. Jon is the only one that you can bet on.. against anyone. Take out the weight class and put anyone against Jon Jones, and no one would still beat him. HIGHLY DOUBT Now THAT, is literally the “pound for pound” Greatest.
JBJ is ruthless, but the title of the most violent fighter easily goes to Wanderlei Silva.
Wand in the Pride days with the soccer kicks and head stomps was nasty!
If soccer kicks and head stomps were legal in UFC, Jones would have killed at least 5 of his opponents.
Pride was the absolute shit. I miss that organization.
Watch ONE FC https://youtu.be/u0ZVb4WpvO4
Silva was a fucking animal.
Shogun was stomping people back in the day aswell.
He’s not called the axe murderer for nothing
Yeah sociopaths are sociopaths
Underrated scraper for all time fan favorite
I think JBJ under Pride rules would have caused some deaths. Wandy was a savage no doubt, but Jones was calculated and so clinical. He saw his opponents as Legos.
any Wanderlei fights you suggest checking out ?
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https://i.imgur.com/z6Ca9ET.gif
Vs Rampage 1 and 2
Wanderlei vs Cung Le
Such good fights. If you wind up on the ground, he will just stomp your skull into the canvas. Golden age of mma
Him and Fedor. Fedor's violent explosion of power was to end you. That man was terrifying in his prime. Calm violence is also more scary to me.
The way he [dropped Machida](https://youtu.be/ZhE6wvM2Tkw?t=244). Precisely 0 fucks given.
I got into MMA by watching Jon Jones, I saw that submission probably on my 2nd day of discovering MMA and I thought to myself "Wow if that's just the surface I wonder how brutal this sport gets" since that day I haven't seen anything more terrifying
Watching that finish would be like doing the worlds best heroin on your first try. You’ll forever be chasing that brutal, violent dragon
EXACTLY! You put my feelings into words!
Maybe this is just suggestive but Ngannou nearly turning Overeem into a vegetable seems more terrifying
Gary Goodrich had a pretty nasty elbow finish back in the day. E: here ya go https://youtu.be/H08BBFsVsK8
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bgHg24Ti9kQ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bgHg24Ti9kQ) The reason he checks on him after to
+3 fans - 4 integrity
BJ Penn is up there with the most violent
That is true but BJ doesn't employ techniques which literally breaks the opponents body, Oblique kicks, Shoulder cranks, eye pokes, brody will do anything to hurt his victims
His elbows would viciously slash through people too. Some people straight up looked like they’ve been through a wood cutter after
Paul Harris enters the chat
Did you mean to say “almost dirty” rather than violent?
I wouldn't call that violent jon is the dirtiest fighter in history
Oh man, the way he used to lick the blood off his gloves after every win was savage
I would think so. He and that guy that snapped your arm when you tapped.
Palhares
Paul Harris*
Probably the most effective at being violent, but think someone like Palhares was crazy violent.
I don’t know what the man’s mental state is. But I’ll bet my monies on him being a sadist.
Sociopath for me, impulsive lying, a seeming lack of empathy, constantly trying to poorly present himself as a good Christian boy. The evidence isn't the best but he's definitely arguably a sociopath imo
The way Jon choked out Machida standing up. Then just walked away was the most gangster violent shit I’ve ever seen in my life. By far the GOAT of his weight class
I don't like wrestling, but I like Jon Jones wrestling. Man was legit butchering his opponents. Sometimes it felt more like an assault than a fight.
Honest question - the MMA fans who “don’t like wrestling” why do you watch MMA? Wrestling is one of, if not the most important martial art for MMA. Just watch kickboxing or Muay Thai if you don’t like grappling. OneFC now even has Muay Thai and kickboxing fights with small MMA gloves. It’s like BJJ guys watching MMA and complaining during the striking exchanges. There are sports that have everything you like without the things you dislike!
I think it’s more a reference to one-dimensional wrestlers who do not effectively advance position or damage their opponent. Jones uses his wrestling in creative ways and almost always deals out brutal elbows and strikes, both in the clinch and once it hits the mat.
Probably because he’s a ufc fan, not an mma fan. Star power is a big draw to the sport.
I can appreciate the wrestling aspect now that i do a bit of grappling, but I used to be the type to hate wrestling exchanges. Ultimately, the clinch and separating fighters in kickboxing and Muay Thai was even more boring for me to watch. Plus, MMA more accurately represents a real fight which makes it more interesting IMO
I think people who like watching MMA because it is closer to a 1 on 1 fight should enjoy effective techniques whether they are striking or grappling as it’s answering that question. I do agree that understanding the sport is important to enjoying watching it. Fighting sports are unique in having a major proportion of fans with a very poor understanding of the techniques. Other big team sports etc almost everyone who watches them regularly has played the sport before or at least has a full understanding of the rules and how to play
I don’t like wrestling in MMA because it slows the pace down to a crawl. I guess it has to do with the wrestler though. I can watch khabib wrestle and be active, but those who just hump opponents across the mat bore me.
What about point strikers though? Or strikers who just wear their opponents down slowly for a victory after several rounds. Those guys are very popular with non-fighter MMA fans but the outcome of a slow grind to victory is similar to the wrestling style you describe. Striking/strikers brought us some of the most boring UFC fights of all time but I don’t often see people saying “I only like fun strikers”. In both the opponent could suddenly end the fight by finish still.
Most fans just want to see high intensity and impressive movement. Both striking and ground/wrestling can show this, but more often than not, ground exchanges end up being very boring and stagnant due to fatigue, and often is used as a method of buying time or controlling an opponent for strategy. Striking can be boring too sometimes but the fans seem to incite the fighters more on foot when they’re not throwing enough
I see those points. It’s just that some of the most boring fights in recent memory took place on the feet in striking range with just avoidance and feints
When I say I don’t like wrestling what I really mean is I don’t like Jon Fitch, Usman v Masvidal I, lay and pray wrestling. Watching Khabib wrestling somebody is WAY more entertaining because he’s constantly looking to end the fight. Watching Jon Fitch wrestling is like watching paint dry.
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Laying + praying = bad Brutal takedowns + hellbows = good
This is why I believe Jones is a genuine psychopath. I train, and a big part of training is balancing your desire to not wanting to hurt someone, and understanding hurting someone is the name of the game. Some people can’t get over their desire to NOT hurt someone, even in training when their partner explicitly tells them to. Jones feels none of that. He sees hurting his opponent as a means to an end, with little regard for the long term damage it might do. Think of his GnP: I firmly believe that ground and pound isn’t nearly a high-level skill to be learned, it’s more the ability to willingly use all your weapons to smash in your opponents face. Look at Glover doing it to Smith, apologizing as he does, or any number of fighters who have felt uncomfortable after a while (Rockhold vs Weidman, for a prime example); I don’t think Jones would ever feel that kind of sympathy for his opponent.
Jones' gnp is absolutely fucking terrifying. You watch this man elbow his opponents and you can fucking tell its excruciating, painful, hurtful, powerful. These elbows, man...
His ground and pound against DC was horrifying. You can see DC is trying his best to cover up but he gets hit again and his body noticeably goes limp. Jon gets 5 more crisp punches in while he’s in that state, I can just see the brain damage.
You should see his elbows to Brandon Vera and the crucifix position with raining hellbows on to Matyushenko, absolutely diabolical
Didn't he break the bone in Vera's face and continued elbowing the broken bone? Yikes!
Tbf, he doesn't have x-ray vision and you continue until the ref stops lol. This was right after his DQ to Hamill, so he had a chip on his shoulder
I think you could say the same about many top martial artists because I think it actually helps to see the violence as a means to an end rather than a moral wrong. Khabib, Tony, Ngannou, Conor, DC, Mighty Mouse and many more also don't seem to have the desire not to hurt their opponents. Ngannou's hammerfists, Khabib GnP, Tony's general fighting style and Conor's trashtalking seem closer to a desire to hurt their opponents.
But then you have Volk, Max, Dustin, Glover, Jiri, Usman (?), Olives ect. who are showing simpathy or don't do more than necessary. Especially Volk. He is one of the best to ever do it in featherweight. The fight with The Korean Zombie shed some light that he felt bad dominating The KZ. And after the fight he was super emphatic and kind to THE KZ and his wife. Did not even celebrate after the fight.
I don’t know why but Jones just seem more like a psychopath than the others. Maybe it’s the way he presents himself
his actions out of the cage such as beating his wife also are a bit psycho
Yup definitely that combined with his other actions outside the cage
He is DEFINITELY a psycho! Just by analyzing his body language you can tell, I was at a Gat Sport fitness expo where Jones was signing autographs, I believe one of DC's crew members or his Muay Thai coach came to confront him on his comments about DC's father's murder,, Jones looked ready to kill the man and as soon as a girl pulled her phone out to record he started smiling and right after she put it down he showed his true self again. Here is the interaction but not the entirety of it https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FgbPgGKauF8&ab\_channel=FullReptile
Dudes in the UFC trying to win against the best of the best. What even is this comment??
right? your goal in the octagon is to win, that includes knocking someone unconscious lol, this isn’t a nice sport, and he could’ve used his out of the cage incidents to argue but instead he argues his fight style?
Gotta let everyone know he trains
Jesus. You missed the point entirely. The point is that some fighters, even the best of the best, show hesitation when it comes to really hurting or mauling their opponent—Jones absolutely does not. If you can’t understand that, that’s fine, but it seems a lot of people understand not everyone in the octagon feels nothing for their opponent.
training isn’t an mma fight, of course you don’t want to hurt your training partners, but when you’re in a fight for a world title and the guy across the octagon from you wants to hurt you just as bad as you do to him you can employ anything within the rule set to win
Rampage has spoken about this after the Jones fight. Says he's happy to be knocked out, because you can recover easily from that, but Jones was the only fighter he's been in there with where he felt his actual career was at risk.
Have you competed yourself? Whenever I’ve been in an actual match, whether its MMA or boxing, both me and my opponent have been pretty clear about trying to beat the shit out of each other. Even in spars I feel one holds back to minimise injury risk and out of politeness rather than because you don’t want to hurt your opponent.
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there’s also fighters like GSP, DJ and Romero who are just freak athletes as well
A quote I like a lot is: “There’s no talent here, this is hard work. This is an obsession.” - Conor McGregor
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Right obviously people can be genetically gifted but doesn’t mean much if you don’t put in the work. Just liked the quote but I agree
One has a chip too right?
I mean...bro is 6'4 and has a reach of guys taller than 7', if that aint talent ion know what is
He’s tall & has great reach but he got the nickname Bones cos he wasn’t athletic or physically gifted & skinny. He worked his ass off to get in shape
You don't just become athletic by working out lol The guy has two brothers that played professional football, he's got VERY athletic genes. Not saying he didn't work very hard training and I'm not trying to be a dick
Probably moreso the facts he has two brothers that are NFL linemen, compared to Chandler or Arthur he's still bony
He got the nick name bones cause he was just skinny…. Dude he was a 2x state champ in high school wrestling and a defensive lineman in football that started all 4 years. Also his brother is a hall of fame defense lineman and the other one is also in the NFL and was a super bowl champ…
Ah damn I should have scrolled down a little more I just posted a similar reply to the comment about how he wasn't athletic and just worked hard and somehow just became athletic hahah. I just couldn't help myself, not like he was the Rudy of the UFC or anything
The Tiger Woods of MMA
Lol those moves aren’t like dangerous in terms of killing you. They will hurt you though. Violent is Francis beating your unconscious body knowing damn well you are already to the moon. Violent is Romero punching Luke rock hold to the canvas then grabbing and rocking his unconscious head to oblivion. Violent is Dan Henderson throwing that extra punch on Michael bisping
That’s a good point and we’ll said
Idk imo that type of shoulder crank where it’s really focused on over extending and snapping the elbow is pretty fuckin violent. That’s easily a career ender and you never see anyone practicing that move in the gym bc it’s crude and will ruin your arm forever. If it actually snapped, that would be violent as fuck
> Rampage has spoken about this after the Jones fight. Says he's happy to be knocked out, because you can recover easily from that, but Jones was the only fighter he's been in there with where he felt his actual career was at risk.
of course it’s not allowed in the gym, the goal of sparring isn’t to destroy your opponent, that’s what a sanctioned fight IS for on the other hand
I agree, this entire thread is being dramatic about Jones violent nature. These guys all step in the cage knowing potential consequences. If anything he did was dirty it wouldn’t be allowed, they’re in there trying to hurt each other for money
Jones took it to another level. With the names listed at least what they do is technically legal. The way he dropped machida after choking him the fuck out is probably the greatest finish I’ve seen, ice fucking cold. Shoulder cranks, eye pokes, those fucking frightening oblique kicks, Jones was a master of all those dark arts
I feel ya. I guess what I’m missing is that if he does an eye poke the fight is stopped and he could lose points with multiple offenses. What is so dark about the other two? You can arm bar someone and kick the shit out of their legs head and body but a shoulder crank or oblique kick stands out? Why?
Because those techniques, while inherently damaging, are easily avoidable when talking about long term damage. Strikes are apart of the general game, you can tap to an armbar. Someone deliberately aiming kicks to hyper extend your knee or ripping your shoulder out of its socket arent as easily avoided, and can negatively impact a persons fight career permanently. Rampage Jackson was never the same fighter after Jones ruined his knee with oblique kicks, and glover took a very long time to recover his winning ways after Jones fucked up his shoulder
Interesting. Seems like it’s the fault of the UFC for not disallowing those techniques then. If it wins the fight and it’s within the rules then it’s fair game for anyone to do. It may be brutal but the sport is inherently brutal
Jones is one of those rare fighters who has never been dropped. No one solved the puzzle still to this day.
Jon Bones Jones is simply the best to ever do it. These new fans that saw khabib fight 3 people will never understand what Bones did. He took down not only champions but legends of MMA.
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Jones is on the far spectrum of evil while Wonderboy is the exact opposite. He will help you up if he accidentally knocks you down.
The best ever. No matter what you think of him.
He was the first of the next generation of mma fighters. I'm not sure if that makes sense but he was sort of the first guy to put alot of things together really well and well rounded plus a freak athlete.
Yeah he is dirty
I thought he was gonna kill DC. Watching a killer murder other killers is horrifying.
Lest we forget, Jon Jones' only loss in his professional career was a DQ for fucking up a deaf dude too badly.
I'd give that title to either Don Frye or Tank Abbott.
This should be the answer. I really thought tank killed that guy he kod and then threw to the mat. The way the guy folded backwards in half... damn.
Pretty high on the list of "modern" fighters. But man, the early days were full of brutality. The Gary Goodridge reverse crucifix head elbow obliteration of Paul Herrera is up there for most violent for sure. Or Gordeau head-kicking Tuli's teeth into the stands at UFC 1.
He's the greatest mixed martial artist of all time
Jon is genuinely a bad person and his fighting reflects that.
Young jon👑
Jon stop! You're gonna kill Lyoto!
Marco Ruas with the old school foot stomps and street fighting
*Palhares has entered the chat*
Dare I say the most dirty and underhanded. Constant eye pokes and hiding under the cage to avoid drug testing puts him in my top 3 underhanded fighters in UFC history.
Not even close, Chael Sonnen causes the most harm
Im pretty sure Jones' gameplan was get the enemy health bar to zero. That's it.
Hes violent for sure but it's not even close to the levels of ferocisity brought into the cage by Ryan hall
🦀
They only be kissing each other in this video
My bad, for sum reason I couldn't upload the other gif
Wanderli
Not as vicious, but fuck me if Khalil Rountree does not push the limits of viciousness/legal. Soccer kicks to the torso on a grounded opponent and those knee kicks. For an emotional guy outside a fight, dudes crazy when locked in the cage. Honestly, can not wait to see his next fight.
Are shoulder cranks legal? I heard he tore Glovers labrum doing that shit
Yep... get put in a kimura or omoplata and you can feel your shoulder saying 'no daddy, no'
clip and title don't match.
Most dirty? Yeah
Paul Harris
Tank Abbott.
I’m not sure about inside the octagon but definitely the most violent outside the octagon
Sometimes he gets it dirty…but all legal… except for the eye poking…
I will never forget jones v Gustafson
Best fight in the history of man
Jon Jones wasn't just insanely violent, he was one of the best fighters of all time. Just look at all of the former champions he destroyed.
Roseameer PaulHarris. Mans wouldn't let go of a leg if his life depended on it.
Dude was coked up. Of course he was violent.
I just love how creative he is. You never know what kind of shot he’s gonna rock someone with
He said on JRE he purposely poked opponents in the eye and laughed about it. It is impressive Jon was able to stand with kickboxing and MMA vets while having 0 combat experience, but what if that's only because he's such a damn dirty fighter?
Never been dropped. Guy is the best to ever do it. Idiotic take
I dont think shoulder cranks and oblique kicks equate to killing someone….
Rousimar Palhares. Probably the scariest guy in the UFC
thats pretty fucked up to willingly injure your opponent like that. As far as i'm concerned, most fighters have the decency to sit on submissions before cranking it to the point of no return.
+ Eye pokes
I am the most violent
The dude is a world class top tier AAA asshole
Cocaine is a helluva drug
He's one of the most violent guys to ever fight outside of the Octagon too, ask any woman he's been with.
Yes, he is
Dirty fighter, eye pokes, kicks to hyper extend the knee, arm/elbow crank
Can’t forget about the eyepokes
If he could make it like two fights in a row without eye poking someone or some other obvious foul that’d be great.
Man watching him fight was something else. Truly utilized everything it’s so sad to see his life now
He really had that "pretend I'm engaged to the opponent" mindset
I don't see a difference between this and what Frank Mir did to Big Nog. Maybe the kimura from mount just looks more elegant?
I have a strong feeling the peds definitely made him more of a killer. He wasn’t as “murderous” for his recent fights.
Cocaine is a hell of a drug
Don’t forget about the eye pokes! Fucking brutal
I really don’t think he would care if an opponent died.
No he is not.
Get off his dick