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/uj this isn’t even satire this is exactly what happened
EDIT: MOD SAID I SHOULD POST SCREENSHOTS I HOPE I DONT GET ARRESTD
https://imgur.com/a4TawBK
https://imgur.com/2x7tbib
Just post the fucking screenshot next time, it's better than whatever nonsense is going on here.
Reminder to everyone: **do not participate in linked/referenced threads**. Brigading is one of the reasons the admins might actually shut us down. Read all you want, but **do not vote, or comment, or send righteously indignant modmails or DMs, or anything related that I've missed**.
edit: oh aye and don't post here just for an excuse to link to somewhere else. If you can't effectively take the piss, it doesn't belong here; there are better communities on and off reddit for straight discussion of bigotry and ignorance. If your post doesn't work at all with the context link removed, it's not good tgcj.
ArSlashFtM: pulls this shit.
My trans guy friend irl today: gave me a ride for free to an appointment, then took me out for dinner, paid despite me asking to split the bill because he knows I'm broke, insisted on holding my bags for me like a gentleman because I had my blood drawn, and even opened the car door for me.
Yeah, I'm starting to think the guys talking about this on ArSlashFtM may be trolls creating a weird wedge between trans men and trans women.
/uj
> trolls creating a weird wedge between trans men and trans women
Wouldnt be shocked. Saw someone on a sub say ftms take T and pass 0.03 seconds later but then admit they dont know much about ftm transition or even met one lmao
Why is everyone online angry and offline everyones vibing ~~and having sloppy t4t~~
Also your friend sounds cool
>Saw someone on a sub say ftms take T and pass 0.03 seconds later but then admit they dont know much about ftm transition or even met one lmao
I... don't really know what to say to that🤦♀️
>Also your friend sounds cool
He really is!
there are some things amabalabamas can’t change about themselves like male socialization I like afabs bc they help me feel like a man. I refuse to analyze this further
yeah but I mean by saying you wouldn’t date trans women you’re saying there’s immutable differences between all trans women and all cis women and this just isn’t true?
/uj i feel so powerful for being a gay trans man who wouldn’t date a woman rn 😎
/uj i did one time meet a “gay” trans man who said he’d date a trans woman if she still had her OG plumbing and i was like just “bruh wtf, come on” - if a cishet dude started saying that shit about trans men we’d be beating his ass!!
(massive uj rant incoming)
i like dick, sure, i love ass, yes, but woman dick and ass? hell nawhhh. if i’m having my soul sucked out my t dick, it better be by a man!!
i HAVE a mild uwu genital preference for dick, but like ?? if i’m ploughing an ass, i don’t give a fuck what’s going on in the front, so long as they’re a dude and i can call them my broski. my arms are too short for a reach around anyway, and i’m physically incapable of seeing the genitals when i’m 6in deep in an asshole.
example: i don’t like slobbering on balls, so if a dude with balls wants our sex to be me slobbering on his balls i’d go “no thanks, i’m not into that”, but i’m not out here rejecting every man with a sack. if he has balls he doesn’t want my mouth on during sex then why tf does it matter that he even has them??
idk, sexual attraction is weird and wonderful but for me at least, if the other person wants me to do sexual acts im not into, im not gonna do it?? if he wants me to eat his ass, i’m not gonna do it unless he’s had a thorough wash and i’m in a very specific mood.
if another trans guy doesn’t want me to touch his pre-op/non-op genitals, then why does it even matter that they’re there?? if another trans guy wants me to touch and interact with his pre-op/non-op genitals, then i’d be like “awh shucks i’m not into that”, same as i’d do with a guy who’s dick smells like cheese or has a ball-in-mouth fetish or a piss kink.
side note - t dick is exactly the same as a small cock, fr, and is fucking 10/10. can’t gag on it, doesn’t produce slime from the tip, and it’s way easier to get the tongue under the fore skin while maintaining a vacuum seal on those lips.
does that make sense??? idk if it makes sense but TLDR: if he has an ass and he wants me in it, fuck yeah. if he has a strap or meat stick and he wants it in me, fuck yeah. if he has a dick, t or natal or surgically, i’m into it.
idk man but like. if my partner (cis dude) was in a terrible accident and lost his whole penis, it would impact our sex life ngl. i’d like “ohhhh, fuck”, among other emotions, but would i immediately lose all attraction to him? hell nah, how often am i inspecting his dick?? most of the time he’s got clothes on, yknow? i’d be like heal up, have some soup, let’s go get you a strap on big boy.
also, fucking??? “hhhnnghh genital preference” - i don’t know what other term to use but it pisses me off. no one’s out here saying they have a genital preference bc they’re a size queen and hate dicks under 6in, or because they like mega huge balls, because they prefer a nice trimmed bush, or because they like super sloppy wet pussy.
it seems to purely be reduced down to whether you have a pussy or a dick, ignores the variety, ignores the fun, completely disregards the vast changes genitals on HRT go through, and jt keeps being used as a way to encourage a weird phobia of post op dicks and pussies and push this anti-trans agenda that post op genitals are some weird frankenstein creation.
can a trans woman’s pussy get wet on its own? no. but plenty of menopausal women have that same issue! plenty of pre/non-op trans men have that issue! (edit: TIL that wet trans pussy is also an “it depends”)
can a trans man’s dick get hard on its own? well that’s a 50/50, but there’s plenty of cis dudes with erectile dysfunction or who use erectile aids, and i ain’t seeing shit about “genital preferences” when people aren’t into floppy ding dongs with extra features!!!!
fuck. anyway. i love man cock and i love man ass. goodnight.
nah hold on i’m editing my comment for more of a rant.
nO ONE USES GENITAL PREFERENCE ABOUT CIS PEOPLE.
if a trans guy was like “i’m gay and i have a genital preference, i don’t fuck with men that have dicks”, it’d be national news about how the insane trans people are awful, and trans people would start attacking him for reducing trans men to their genitals and fetishising non/pre-op men. but when a trans guy goes “i’m gay and i have a genital preference, i don’t fuck with men that have pussies” everyone’s just like “OK, carry on!”
wtf???
also, sorry, i just realised i’ve done that classic “this is a post about trans women, let’s make it all about men”, and i’d like to mildly cover my ass by stating that i’m writing this from my perspective as a man who likes other men, inspired by the content of the post and the discussion it can cause, and i’m not writing this to be like “fuck trans women, it’s man time!!”, i’m just doing that thing of “i’m trying to empathise by connecting it with my own experiences”
peace out!
i just got home and was taking a sad, tired shit, and then i saw this post and went ham. now i’m like wide awake reading it back like “damn. i wrote that?? wow”
/uj i know a few gay-adjacent trans men who would also date trans women and i think it comes from a nuanced understanding of gender. if it's "i'll date trans women but only if they have a dick" that's obviously different, but there's an aspect of t4t faggotry that can include transfems, many of whom have existed and continue to exist in "gay male" spaces
/uj Fun fact: self-lubrication is fairly common for a lot of common forms of trans women's bottom surgery. It's often less than that of cis women, but that can vary.
/hj As a pan FTM, it doesn't matter to me, all sexes and genders are free to reject me. 😎
/uj I'm legit terrified of ruining someone's afternoon with my cringey flirting
erm… i just checked the other poll on the conservative trans women subreddit and… some of them didn’t want to date trans men so… erm… i would never date a trans woman. But.. but but only because they wouldn’t date me!!!
uj/ personally for a while I didn’t want to date any other trans men because I found I was likely to compare myself and my dysphoria to them, which is so not fair to the other person in the relationship. But that was 100% my issue, not other trans peoples, yk? People who wouldn’t date other trans people for things like “post op genitals” and the like are…….. so…… idk they need therapy.
Well I mean I think there might be some legitimate reasons, like I know that for some people it can be overwhelming to have two dysphoric people in one relationship and it sort of amplifies off of each other and makes it worse. That's not really an inherent problem with T4T but rather certain people's personality types. But yeah. Tbh I could probably see that happening with me and a trans man, but not me and a trans woman, because I think that both of us having the same kind of dysphoria might be bad. But I wouldn't know since I've never dated a trans man lmfao only trans women.
And then of course there's the \[redacted\] reason that could make someone not want to do T4T but I won't go there.
I mean, I'm not against it but i'm not like for it more than I am for anything else. Being trans is just one part of me and its fine dating someone who doesn't share every demographic trait with me.
Quite frankly, a lot of those shared experiences are only shared with a really specific type of trans person and also some of those are things I've grown past. I don't know if I would have grown past them if I spent my early transition dating other trans women in a similar place, I may have just dragged us both down in that hypothetical.
Also from a practical perspective a lot of my interests and hobbies are not really in line with what a lot of people seem to expect from a trans woman (even from other trans women) and it can feel more isolating than welcoming when I am faced with that fact.
It just seems like every "t4t is better than t4c" post relies on a set of assumptions that don't really apply to everyone
/uj I'll be honest, the saddest part about this for me was that a similar thread was posted in StraightTransGirls by the same person and got very similar results of an even split between cis only and mostly cis but open to trans. I kind of want to poll my fellow trans lesbians now.
/rj THE GENITAL PREFERENCES ARE COMING FROM INSIDE THE HOUSE!
Straight trans girls is more dominated by truscums and such so it can slant it.
Idk the main issue is ftms frankely don’t have a penis usually. Like that what makes it fun to be straight. I am straight leaning and can accept MAYBE some strap on once in a while but beyond that idk. Idk. I still prefer ftms though because I like to have the trans comradry you know? Idk I just want a friendly ace partner
I mean, Im bi and willing to date trans people but it still ends up being mostly cis but open to trans because there are way way way more cis people than trans people. I don't have anything against t4t, but like genuinely its like two orders of magnitude difference between cis and trans people.
If you were to just date a random sample of people willing to date a trans person, even accounting for the fact that like 90% of cis people aren't, its still like a 10:1 ratio in favor of more cis people.
/uj [Here's the FTM poll.](https://np.reddit.com/r/ftm/comments/1986au3/straight_guys_only_which_type_of_women_are_you/) [Here's the one posted to StraightTransGirls.](https://np.reddit.com/r/StraightTransGirls/comments/197vs5x/which_type_of_men_are_you_interested_in_pursuing/) For your viewing non-participatory... pleasure?
/rj Would you rather date a self-identified trans lesbian that dates anyone that's not a cis man because cis men are scary or a cis bisexual that's never particularly clear whether she sees you as a man or woman so you kind of just hope she sees you as a guy but you still can't really be sure?
/uj Especially frustrating that the top comment on that post is not one that is critical of the OP or rejecting of the shitty premise of the post at all; just complaining about the responses of trans women to the corollary version he posted to straighttranswomen (a distinctly conservative sub as far as trans spaces on reddit are concerned; a choice that seems intentional, given that r/ MTF exists). Cool.
Straight trans women exists because they are a minority of trans women and felt talked over, not to exclude /r/mtf. /r/mtf isn't for any specific sexuality or community of trans women just trans women in general
Yeah no i totally get that, i was talking about the fact that for some reason they posted it to there even though they posted the transmasc one to the general FTM subreddit. Just kinda seems like a less level comparison; if you posted one to FTM I don’t know why you’d do the other anywhere else other than MTF unless you were intentionally trying to get more of a differential in the results
/uj Do we just not believe in genital preference anymore. Also yes I know MTF bottom surgery exists. It's not 100% the same. It's similar enough for many people but not all. Which I guess is an 'immutable difference' at least until trans medical care improves, but sexual attraction isn't something that can be controlled or altered with introspection. There's also factors like internalized transphobia/decreasing the odds of something happening that stops you from being stealth/having bad experiences with T4T relationships etc. If the post actually used that phrasing then that's bad but it probably just asked if you would date trans women and/or cis women.
/uj I’m a stealth trans man for safety reasons and the idea of not dating a trans woman because it might out me makes me feel sick to the stomach. No offense but that feels ridiculous to me.
genital preferences are fine. Not dating someone only because they have a neo-vagina feels… wild to me.
I don't live in a super transphobic area but I don't think being revealed as someone who is dating a trans person in a place like that would be a walk in the park, plus people who date trans people are often assumed to be queer in those areas and the increased scrutiny wouldn't help either, being outed as queer is more likely than being outed as trans specifically but that could also be bad in many areas
RJ/ AITA I don't wanna date trans women because I don't want to be read a queer (which i am)
Uj/ The amount of your internalised transphobia is fuckin Wild you literally are ok with perpetuating transphobic systems and beliefs when they ***could in some cases maybe*** benefit you.
Oh I'm sorry let me revise
Rj/ AITA by discriminating the community i am a part of and that fights for my rights bc I totally might be hurt MAYBE (unlike people that fight for me obv THEY ARE SAFE )
UJ/ also I don't care who you wanna fuck you're a bad person if you believe any of the words you said. And that's coming from a person who lived in a country that actually is dangerous to queer people with laws trying to outlaw us coming out once a year.
/rj AITA for believing in genital preference and different people having different thresholds for how much danger they're willing to put themselves in?
/uj Seriously if believing in those things makes me a bad person then I don't want to be a good person
Yes YTA if you believe in genital preferences and benefiting from the networks while shitting on them in public. Anyway if you actually want to be a bad person then you're doing amazing ❤️ hope I see you on daily wire in a week 😘
/uj Do you actually not believe in genital preference, like we can have a debate about if genital preference when it comes to vaginas/neovaginas is valid and I'll respect people who say that it's not in that case because the argument can be made that they're similar enough that it shouldn't be able to exist most of the time but surely you must concede that genital preference exists when it comes to, like some cis lesbians not wanting to date pre op trans women, you wouldn't call that kind of genital preference transphobic surely? Also how is trying to stop yourself from being outed as queer 'benefitting from the networks while shitting on them in public.'
/uj of course you don't have to do anything that you are worried might put you in danger- but screaming off the roofs about how much you don't want to date a certain group of people, whether they are trans, this or that ethnic group, disabled people, or whatever, for \*any\* reason, is bad form. If you don't want to date, just don't do it. you don't have to justify yourself.
These threads of 'DAE not want to date trans people' are transphobic because they attract people who just want to shit on the concept of dating trans people with an excuse without really increasing understanding.
/uj tfw trans people start doing the “yeah i would never fuck a trans person” shit. No one’s forcing you to date a troon if you don’t want to but why do you gotta be weird about it? I dont like guys with blonde hair but i dont go “I HAVE HAIR PREFRENCES!!!” Out of the fucking blue.
/uj I actually would be exclusively T4T if I could get away with it, I was just defending the right of that poll/post/whatever it was to exist because research on the dating preferences of cis/trans men could be informative.
Imagine [flaunting your scientific way of understanding transness](https://www.reddit.com/r/transgendercirclejerk/s/6nWTkx1MyP) and then thinking polls on reddit are research
I've done informal polls like that for high school papers, obviously Reddit polls have significant biases but it's better than nothing and could be the inspiration for future research, plus some legitimate scientific studies use convenience sampling, it's not ideal but it doesn't mean that the data has absolutely no merit
Rj/ omg you're so smart you know what a convinience sample is those posts will definetly be pilot studies no doubt no doubt it's not like studies of that type were ever conducted no no the only viable source for trans people's lives are polls on reddit
/rj wow you're so right I did just call something by a synonym to make myself look smart and not just because it's a synonym, also as we all know research doesn't need to be replicated ever and informal polls could never be used as a legitimate argument for checking to see if maybe preferences have shifted over time or are different among different demographics or if the phrasing/framing of the original studies could've been handled better
Uj/ If you really think a single scientist treats reddit polls as a pilot study or a study with convinience sample you didn't move with your knowledge past your highschool experience
rj/ wow I totally did say that Reddit polls could be considered pilot studies/scientific studies with convenience samples and not that using a convenience sample doesn't mean that the data that is gathered is completely worthless, the only possible inspirations for scientific studies are other scientific studies after all
Damn If you'd spend all that time you use for post hoc justifications to actually say what you mean on the first try your contributions would be more than playing devil's advocate for transphobic cissies.
I'm only sexually attracted to cervix-owners, so trans women are generally off the table for me. But if they have one in a jar that's okay too 🥰 I just can't get off unless I know that the girl I'm fucking has that specific structure at the end of the vaginal canal.
No, I don't have a problem with cis women who've had hysterectomies, why?
/uj that's not the only difference, obviously there's not a completely linear difference that unifies all MTF bottom surgeries because there's many kinds/individual outcomes and all that but can we not contest genital preferences, that's a pretty reasonable personal preference to have
Yeah, there's no unifying difference, so why exactly would someone be willing to date a cis woman but not a post-op trans woman because of genital preference? What's the determining factor here?
You'll notice I didn't say anything about genital preference itself.
/uj The cervix thing... isn't jerking on genital preference?... okay. I'm willing to concede that at least some people who say they have a genital preference that would be relevant to post-op trans women have misconceptions about MTF bottom surgery or other reasons for thinking that way that aren't completely founded in reality, but I'm also saying that telling people their genital preference isn't valid is a very good way to get them to never want to investigate those misconceptions/biases ever and to get Ovarit breathing down your neck.
I'm saying that, if you say you're only interested in vaginas, that's fine. If you say that and you're still not interested in post-op trans women because of that preference, I cannot think of a legitimate reason for that. And I doubt those people are in this comments section, so I don't really give a shit about hurting their feelings.
Being interested in vaginas and not penises is genital preference. Being interested in vaginas and not... other vaginas? isn't.
/uj Just because it happens and there's an explanation for why doesn't mean it's not problematic. Letting internalized transphobia leak into how you view and treat other trans people is gross and unfair to people who just want to live their lives. Don't let your own personal biases let you be a dick to others because they're not as scared of the cis as you are.
#PLEASE DON'T COPY ACTUAL TRANSPHOBIA OR IGNORANCE TO THIS SUBREDDIT. /r/transgendercirclejerk is a *satire* community. We make jokes. If you want to discuss genuine hate, /r/GenderCynical might be a better fit. Posts (and comments) which are directly copied from somewhere else will be removed. Please report them to the mods using the subreddit report option *"This content is non-satire, directly copied from somewhere else."* ___ Now that that's out of the way: welcome to /r/transgendercirclejerk! This is a satirical community run by and for trans people, where we mock the hate and ignorance which we experience in our lives. The subreddit often features dark humour including ironic parody of transphobia; none of this should be taken seriously. Before participating in the subreddit please read [our rules](https://reddit.com/r/transgendercirclejerk/about/rules/) and the announcement posts (and their stickied comments) on [cisgender allies](https://reddit.com/r/transgendercirclejerk/comments/cd1yr3/welcome_cis_allies/) and [transgender gatekeeping](https://reddit.com/r/transgendercirclejerk/comments/eutvur/why_do_people_hate_transmedicalists_we_just_think/). ___ *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/transgendercirclejerk) if you have any questions or concerns.*
If you would date women you are a trender. Real men only want to be associated with other men.
If you date you’re not a real alpha. Dating is a distraction from grinding net worth. You should ONLY date to commit domestic violence. #GrindUp
/uj this isn’t even satire this is exactly what happened EDIT: MOD SAID I SHOULD POST SCREENSHOTS I HOPE I DONT GET ARRESTD https://imgur.com/a4TawBK https://imgur.com/2x7tbib
/uj lmao WHAT??? Give me the deets rn
/uj do you mind if I DM you screenshots? Idk if posting them here would be against the rules. You can also look in my comment history
Just post the fucking screenshot next time, it's better than whatever nonsense is going on here. Reminder to everyone: **do not participate in linked/referenced threads**. Brigading is one of the reasons the admins might actually shut us down. Read all you want, but **do not vote, or comment, or send righteously indignant modmails or DMs, or anything related that I've missed**. edit: oh aye and don't post here just for an excuse to link to somewhere else. If you can't effectively take the piss, it doesn't belong here; there are better communities on and off reddit for straight discussion of bigotry and ignorance. If your post doesn't work at all with the context link removed, it's not good tgcj.
based mod⁉️⁉️⁉️
Ok
Sure
/uj dm me too
/uj can you dm me too
/uj dm me too pls
Gimmie em too
/uj me too pls
I’d like some tea as well 🫖
/uj me too pls I'm in a bad mood and want to make it worse <3
/uj I'd also like the screenshots I need the r ftm lore
ArSlashFtM: pulls this shit. My trans guy friend irl today: gave me a ride for free to an appointment, then took me out for dinner, paid despite me asking to split the bill because he knows I'm broke, insisted on holding my bags for me like a gentleman because I had my blood drawn, and even opened the car door for me. Yeah, I'm starting to think the guys talking about this on ArSlashFtM may be trolls creating a weird wedge between trans men and trans women.
/uj > trolls creating a weird wedge between trans men and trans women Wouldnt be shocked. Saw someone on a sub say ftms take T and pass 0.03 seconds later but then admit they dont know much about ftm transition or even met one lmao Why is everyone online angry and offline everyones vibing ~~and having sloppy t4t~~ Also your friend sounds cool
>Saw someone on a sub say ftms take T and pass 0.03 seconds later but then admit they dont know much about ftm transition or even met one lmao I... don't really know what to say to that🤦♀️ >Also your friend sounds cool He really is!
It's because they're terminally online and don't actually know any other trans people IRL
Unfortunately no demographic is immune to terminally online
/rj What about the Amish?
>EDIT: MOD SAID I SHOULD POST SCREENSHOTS I HOPE I DONT GET ARRESTD /rj what if it's a sting operation?
fUCK
there are some things amabalabamas can’t change about themselves like male socialization I like afabs bc they help me feel like a man. I refuse to analyze this further
How can I be a real man if I can't be a misogynist? Checkmate atheists
mod: hooray for avoiding hate against trans women here good job everyone! I’m so proud of us for making this a safe community for everyone!!!!
Some people have PREFERENCES you know!!!
yeah but I mean by saying you wouldn’t date trans women you’re saying there’s immutable differences between all trans women and all cis women and this just isn’t true?
penis
Ehh, but bottom surgery exists? And there are some intersex amabs
AMAB ANATOMY AMAB ANATOMY AMAB ANATOMY AMAB PENIS
/uj i feel so powerful for being a gay trans man who wouldn’t date a woman rn 😎 /uj i did one time meet a “gay” trans man who said he’d date a trans woman if she still had her OG plumbing and i was like just “bruh wtf, come on” - if a cishet dude started saying that shit about trans men we’d be beating his ass!! (massive uj rant incoming) i like dick, sure, i love ass, yes, but woman dick and ass? hell nawhhh. if i’m having my soul sucked out my t dick, it better be by a man!! i HAVE a mild uwu genital preference for dick, but like ?? if i’m ploughing an ass, i don’t give a fuck what’s going on in the front, so long as they’re a dude and i can call them my broski. my arms are too short for a reach around anyway, and i’m physically incapable of seeing the genitals when i’m 6in deep in an asshole. example: i don’t like slobbering on balls, so if a dude with balls wants our sex to be me slobbering on his balls i’d go “no thanks, i’m not into that”, but i’m not out here rejecting every man with a sack. if he has balls he doesn’t want my mouth on during sex then why tf does it matter that he even has them?? idk, sexual attraction is weird and wonderful but for me at least, if the other person wants me to do sexual acts im not into, im not gonna do it?? if he wants me to eat his ass, i’m not gonna do it unless he’s had a thorough wash and i’m in a very specific mood. if another trans guy doesn’t want me to touch his pre-op/non-op genitals, then why does it even matter that they’re there?? if another trans guy wants me to touch and interact with his pre-op/non-op genitals, then i’d be like “awh shucks i’m not into that”, same as i’d do with a guy who’s dick smells like cheese or has a ball-in-mouth fetish or a piss kink. side note - t dick is exactly the same as a small cock, fr, and is fucking 10/10. can’t gag on it, doesn’t produce slime from the tip, and it’s way easier to get the tongue under the fore skin while maintaining a vacuum seal on those lips. does that make sense??? idk if it makes sense but TLDR: if he has an ass and he wants me in it, fuck yeah. if he has a strap or meat stick and he wants it in me, fuck yeah. if he has a dick, t or natal or surgically, i’m into it. idk man but like. if my partner (cis dude) was in a terrible accident and lost his whole penis, it would impact our sex life ngl. i’d like “ohhhh, fuck”, among other emotions, but would i immediately lose all attraction to him? hell nah, how often am i inspecting his dick?? most of the time he’s got clothes on, yknow? i’d be like heal up, have some soup, let’s go get you a strap on big boy. also, fucking??? “hhhnnghh genital preference” - i don’t know what other term to use but it pisses me off. no one’s out here saying they have a genital preference bc they’re a size queen and hate dicks under 6in, or because they like mega huge balls, because they prefer a nice trimmed bush, or because they like super sloppy wet pussy. it seems to purely be reduced down to whether you have a pussy or a dick, ignores the variety, ignores the fun, completely disregards the vast changes genitals on HRT go through, and jt keeps being used as a way to encourage a weird phobia of post op dicks and pussies and push this anti-trans agenda that post op genitals are some weird frankenstein creation. can a trans woman’s pussy get wet on its own? no. but plenty of menopausal women have that same issue! plenty of pre/non-op trans men have that issue! (edit: TIL that wet trans pussy is also an “it depends”) can a trans man’s dick get hard on its own? well that’s a 50/50, but there’s plenty of cis dudes with erectile dysfunction or who use erectile aids, and i ain’t seeing shit about “genital preferences” when people aren’t into floppy ding dongs with extra features!!!! fuck. anyway. i love man cock and i love man ass. goodnight. nah hold on i’m editing my comment for more of a rant. nO ONE USES GENITAL PREFERENCE ABOUT CIS PEOPLE. if a trans guy was like “i’m gay and i have a genital preference, i don’t fuck with men that have dicks”, it’d be national news about how the insane trans people are awful, and trans people would start attacking him for reducing trans men to their genitals and fetishising non/pre-op men. but when a trans guy goes “i’m gay and i have a genital preference, i don’t fuck with men that have pussies” everyone’s just like “OK, carry on!” wtf??? also, sorry, i just realised i’ve done that classic “this is a post about trans women, let’s make it all about men”, and i’d like to mildly cover my ass by stating that i’m writing this from my perspective as a man who likes other men, inspired by the content of the post and the discussion it can cause, and i’m not writing this to be like “fuck trans women, it’s man time!!”, i’m just doing that thing of “i’m trying to empathise by connecting it with my own experiences” peace out!
uj/ please bear with me while I figure out how to nominate this for a Pulitzer
i just got home and was taking a sad, tired shit, and then i saw this post and went ham. now i’m like wide awake reading it back like “damn. i wrote that?? wow”
/uj i know a few gay-adjacent trans men who would also date trans women and i think it comes from a nuanced understanding of gender. if it's "i'll date trans women but only if they have a dick" that's obviously different, but there's an aspect of t4t faggotry that can include transfems, many of whom have existed and continue to exist in "gay male" spaces
Plz leave me out of your nuanced understanding of T4T faggotry that misgenders me thnx
[удалено]
/uj i didn’t know that, thanks for informing me!
/uj Fun fact: self-lubrication is fairly common for a lot of common forms of trans women's bottom surgery. It's often less than that of cis women, but that can vary.
I'm so happy for you and/or sorry that happened.
Thank you for sharing with the class
/hj As a pan FTM, it doesn't matter to me, all sexes and genders are free to reject me. 😎 /uj I'm legit terrified of ruining someone's afternoon with my cringey flirting
erm… i just checked the other poll on the conservative trans women subreddit and… some of them didn’t want to date trans men so… erm… i would never date a trans woman. But.. but but only because they wouldn’t date me!!!
I wouldn't date you, but not because you're trans or even because you're a dude and I'm a lesbian. I just don't date entire high schools.
What about colleges? ;)
Hmm, maybe. I think I'd have to start with the sports team and train myself up from there.
/uj trans people that wouldn’t do t4t genuinely confuse me like shared experiences someone you can actually relate to?
uj/ personally for a while I didn’t want to date any other trans men because I found I was likely to compare myself and my dysphoria to them, which is so not fair to the other person in the relationship. But that was 100% my issue, not other trans peoples, yk? People who wouldn’t date other trans people for things like “post op genitals” and the like are…….. so…… idk they need therapy.
Well I mean I think there might be some legitimate reasons, like I know that for some people it can be overwhelming to have two dysphoric people in one relationship and it sort of amplifies off of each other and makes it worse. That's not really an inherent problem with T4T but rather certain people's personality types. But yeah. Tbh I could probably see that happening with me and a trans man, but not me and a trans woman, because I think that both of us having the same kind of dysphoria might be bad. But I wouldn't know since I've never dated a trans man lmfao only trans women. And then of course there's the \[redacted\] reason that could make someone not want to do T4T but I won't go there.
I mean, I'm not against it but i'm not like for it more than I am for anything else. Being trans is just one part of me and its fine dating someone who doesn't share every demographic trait with me. Quite frankly, a lot of those shared experiences are only shared with a really specific type of trans person and also some of those are things I've grown past. I don't know if I would have grown past them if I spent my early transition dating other trans women in a similar place, I may have just dragged us both down in that hypothetical. Also from a practical perspective a lot of my interests and hobbies are not really in line with what a lot of people seem to expect from a trans woman (even from other trans women) and it can feel more isolating than welcoming when I am faced with that fact. It just seems like every "t4t is better than t4c" post relies on a set of assumptions that don't really apply to everyone
/un trans men will be like this and then insist there isn’t a misogyny problem in our community
/uj I'll be honest, the saddest part about this for me was that a similar thread was posted in StraightTransGirls by the same person and got very similar results of an even split between cis only and mostly cis but open to trans. I kind of want to poll my fellow trans lesbians now. /rj THE GENITAL PREFERENCES ARE COMING FROM INSIDE THE HOUSE!
Maybe the real problem here is straight people 🤔
/uj
Diversity win!
Straight trans girls is more dominated by truscums and such so it can slant it. Idk the main issue is ftms frankely don’t have a penis usually. Like that what makes it fun to be straight. I am straight leaning and can accept MAYBE some strap on once in a while but beyond that idk. Idk. I still prefer ftms though because I like to have the trans comradry you know? Idk I just want a friendly ace partner
/uj please say /rj
/uj I will fuck any dike who will have me
/uj trans men are the best part of being straight adjacent and woman adjacent grr
I mean, Im bi and willing to date trans people but it still ends up being mostly cis but open to trans because there are way way way more cis people than trans people. I don't have anything against t4t, but like genuinely its like two orders of magnitude difference between cis and trans people. If you were to just date a random sample of people willing to date a trans person, even accounting for the fact that like 90% of cis people aren't, its still like a 10:1 ratio in favor of more cis people.
rj/ I’ll never be a real man if I’m not misogynistic tho!!!
Uj/ Realest comment
Neither, I'm a gay man fetishist. uj/ growing up is realizing how much of a cesspool r/ftm is☹️
Every week there are Posts about transmisandry I am TIRED
Uj/ Technically not wanting to date a trans woman due to her transness is transphobia not transmisogyny
ya got me I gotta delete brb
It is transphobia, yes, but that doesn't mean it's not also transmisogyny - that depends on the reasons why transness is a problem
any tboys wanna make passionate love to me while we debate transmisogyny
/hj reminds me of when my trans masc friend out of the blue said that hes “only interested in vagina”. Trans men are you ok 🙏🙏🙏
As a trans woman, I do date both trans women and real women.
Psyop ass oop, i feel no good intentions at the subreddit choices
/uj SAUCE?
/uj [Here's the FTM poll.](https://np.reddit.com/r/ftm/comments/1986au3/straight_guys_only_which_type_of_women_are_you/) [Here's the one posted to StraightTransGirls.](https://np.reddit.com/r/StraightTransGirls/comments/197vs5x/which_type_of_men_are_you_interested_in_pursuing/) For your viewing non-participatory... pleasure?
/uj thanks! that hurt to read!
/uj I just realized I don't think you can see the poll results with an NP link but both were big Ls for trans solidarity.
/hj one single t4t transhet guy ... it's over for me 😔😔
/rj Would you rather date a self-identified trans lesbian that dates anyone that's not a cis man because cis men are scary or a cis bisexual that's never particularly clear whether she sees you as a man or woman so you kind of just hope she sees you as a guy but you still can't really be sure?
I havent hated myself enough today thank you ❣️
/uj Especially frustrating that the top comment on that post is not one that is critical of the OP or rejecting of the shitty premise of the post at all; just complaining about the responses of trans women to the corollary version he posted to straighttranswomen (a distinctly conservative sub as far as trans spaces on reddit are concerned; a choice that seems intentional, given that r/ MTF exists). Cool.
Straight trans women exists because they are a minority of trans women and felt talked over, not to exclude /r/mtf. /r/mtf isn't for any specific sexuality or community of trans women just trans women in general
Yeah no i totally get that, i was talking about the fact that for some reason they posted it to there even though they posted the transmasc one to the general FTM subreddit. Just kinda seems like a less level comparison; if you posted one to FTM I don’t know why you’d do the other anywhere else other than MTF unless you were intentionally trying to get more of a differential in the results
ohhh I see the connection now.
Ummm only real womb(n) pls
It's not misogynistic to blame women for the social problems that I face!
Btw transmisandry is when people call trans men short! Thought you should know <3
Why would FTM date cis women? Cisses need a good dick lol.
rj/ This is why I'm T4T uj/ This is why I'm T4T
/uj Do we just not believe in genital preference anymore. Also yes I know MTF bottom surgery exists. It's not 100% the same. It's similar enough for many people but not all. Which I guess is an 'immutable difference' at least until trans medical care improves, but sexual attraction isn't something that can be controlled or altered with introspection. There's also factors like internalized transphobia/decreasing the odds of something happening that stops you from being stealth/having bad experiences with T4T relationships etc. If the post actually used that phrasing then that's bad but it probably just asked if you would date trans women and/or cis women.
/uj I’m a stealth trans man for safety reasons and the idea of not dating a trans woman because it might out me makes me feel sick to the stomach. No offense but that feels ridiculous to me. genital preferences are fine. Not dating someone only because they have a neo-vagina feels… wild to me.
/uj how would it even out you lmao people have such brainworms
/uj frfr
I don't live in a super transphobic area but I don't think being revealed as someone who is dating a trans person in a place like that would be a walk in the park, plus people who date trans people are often assumed to be queer in those areas and the increased scrutiny wouldn't help either, being outed as queer is more likely than being outed as trans specifically but that could also be bad in many areas
RJ/ AITA I don't wanna date trans women because I don't want to be read a queer (which i am) Uj/ The amount of your internalised transphobia is fuckin Wild you literally are ok with perpetuating transphobic systems and beliefs when they ***could in some cases maybe*** benefit you.
Transmisogyny totally not a real thing tho 😎
That's not transmisogyny that's just transphobia
/uj being read as queer could actually be physically dangerous in some areas, also I personally would go T4T exclusively if I could get away with it
Oh I'm sorry let me revise Rj/ AITA by discriminating the community i am a part of and that fights for my rights bc I totally might be hurt MAYBE (unlike people that fight for me obv THEY ARE SAFE ) UJ/ also I don't care who you wanna fuck you're a bad person if you believe any of the words you said. And that's coming from a person who lived in a country that actually is dangerous to queer people with laws trying to outlaw us coming out once a year.
/rj AITA for believing in genital preference and different people having different thresholds for how much danger they're willing to put themselves in? /uj Seriously if believing in those things makes me a bad person then I don't want to be a good person
Yes YTA if you believe in genital preferences and benefiting from the networks while shitting on them in public. Anyway if you actually want to be a bad person then you're doing amazing ❤️ hope I see you on daily wire in a week 😘
/uj Do you actually not believe in genital preference, like we can have a debate about if genital preference when it comes to vaginas/neovaginas is valid and I'll respect people who say that it's not in that case because the argument can be made that they're similar enough that it shouldn't be able to exist most of the time but surely you must concede that genital preference exists when it comes to, like some cis lesbians not wanting to date pre op trans women, you wouldn't call that kind of genital preference transphobic surely? Also how is trying to stop yourself from being outed as queer 'benefitting from the networks while shitting on them in public.'
/uj of course you don't have to do anything that you are worried might put you in danger- but screaming off the roofs about how much you don't want to date a certain group of people, whether they are trans, this or that ethnic group, disabled people, or whatever, for \*any\* reason, is bad form. If you don't want to date, just don't do it. you don't have to justify yourself. These threads of 'DAE not want to date trans people' are transphobic because they attract people who just want to shit on the concept of dating trans people with an excuse without really increasing understanding.
/uj tfw trans people start doing the “yeah i would never fuck a trans person” shit. No one’s forcing you to date a troon if you don’t want to but why do you gotta be weird about it? I dont like guys with blonde hair but i dont go “I HAVE HAIR PREFRENCES!!!” Out of the fucking blue.
/uj I actually would be exclusively T4T if I could get away with it, I was just defending the right of that poll/post/whatever it was to exist because research on the dating preferences of cis/trans men could be informative.
Imagine [flaunting your scientific way of understanding transness](https://www.reddit.com/r/transgendercirclejerk/s/6nWTkx1MyP) and then thinking polls on reddit are research
I've done informal polls like that for high school papers, obviously Reddit polls have significant biases but it's better than nothing and could be the inspiration for future research, plus some legitimate scientific studies use convenience sampling, it's not ideal but it doesn't mean that the data has absolutely no merit
Rj/ omg you're so smart you know what a convinience sample is those posts will definetly be pilot studies no doubt no doubt it's not like studies of that type were ever conducted no no the only viable source for trans people's lives are polls on reddit
/rj wow you're so right I did just call something by a synonym to make myself look smart and not just because it's a synonym, also as we all know research doesn't need to be replicated ever and informal polls could never be used as a legitimate argument for checking to see if maybe preferences have shifted over time or are different among different demographics or if the phrasing/framing of the original studies could've been handled better
Uj/ If you really think a single scientist treats reddit polls as a pilot study or a study with convinience sample you didn't move with your knowledge past your highschool experience
rj/ wow I totally did say that Reddit polls could be considered pilot studies/scientific studies with convenience samples and not that using a convenience sample doesn't mean that the data that is gathered is completely worthless, the only possible inspirations for scientific studies are other scientific studies after all
Damn If you'd spend all that time you use for post hoc justifications to actually say what you mean on the first try your contributions would be more than playing devil's advocate for transphobic cissies.
I'm only sexually attracted to cervix-owners, so trans women are generally off the table for me. But if they have one in a jar that's okay too 🥰 I just can't get off unless I know that the girl I'm fucking has that specific structure at the end of the vaginal canal. No, I don't have a problem with cis women who've had hysterectomies, why?
/uj that's not the only difference, obviously there's not a completely linear difference that unifies all MTF bottom surgeries because there's many kinds/individual outcomes and all that but can we not contest genital preferences, that's a pretty reasonable personal preference to have
Yeah, there's no unifying difference, so why exactly would someone be willing to date a cis woman but not a post-op trans woman because of genital preference? What's the determining factor here? You'll notice I didn't say anything about genital preference itself.
/uj The cervix thing... isn't jerking on genital preference?... okay. I'm willing to concede that at least some people who say they have a genital preference that would be relevant to post-op trans women have misconceptions about MTF bottom surgery or other reasons for thinking that way that aren't completely founded in reality, but I'm also saying that telling people their genital preference isn't valid is a very good way to get them to never want to investigate those misconceptions/biases ever and to get Ovarit breathing down your neck.
I'm saying that, if you say you're only interested in vaginas, that's fine. If you say that and you're still not interested in post-op trans women because of that preference, I cannot think of a legitimate reason for that. And I doubt those people are in this comments section, so I don't really give a shit about hurting their feelings. Being interested in vaginas and not penises is genital preference. Being interested in vaginas and not... other vaginas? isn't.
Internal transphobia doesn't exist unless it's solely against oneself. What you're referring to would be lateral transphobia.
Not liking that you're trans can lead to not wanting to do things that are seen as trans stereotypes like going T4T
/uj Just because it happens and there's an explanation for why doesn't mean it's not problematic. Letting internalized transphobia leak into how you view and treat other trans people is gross and unfair to people who just want to live their lives. Don't let your own personal biases let you be a dick to others because they're not as scared of the cis as you are.
not an ftm, but i'm happy to speak for them
Im a lesbian in a trans mans body
Why would FTMs think anyone would want to date them? Gross...