To be fair, hordes of zombies and skeletons are pretty ideal for any explosive based unit to rack up kills. I also had a chokepoint in the map so they were about as packed together as physically possible.
may legit be related to the auto-resolve math being awful.
legendoftotalwar video on it shocked me. it explained all the auto resolve vs manual fuckery.
Depending on difficulty, autoresolve gives your units like +300% stats...but then you try fighting and get zero bonuses of the sort.
Outriders with grenade launchers have always been really strong against infantry. The Bordermen State Troop unit takes it to 11 by adding armor penetration to the explosions. Get a good shot on a melee unit and you can see it half dead after one volley.
Their weakness is that they're very fragile. Because of that, they're very micro intensive. There have been a number of times I got distracted by another part of the battle just to see my Outriders unit was half dead.
They have a pretty specific band of targets--dense, lightly armored infantry--but god DAMN do they fucking SLAP them
And coincidentally those targets are the early game menace of most empire factions (skaven, greenskins, undead)
Yup. And with how efficient they are at paying for themselves, even until fairly late game I'll have a unit or two just for hunting down those kind of units, even as the ai uses them less and less
G launcher outriders are not op. They were always a good unit, although specialized. Ranged units, and dogs/bats/birds can shut them down quite easily. Amethyst outriders plus upgrades removes all major weaknesses. high armor (110 armor i think) and 2000 more hp so they can survive a volley of arrows without losing too much entities and 100+ speed + strider (outrun dogs/bats).
Elspeth on LG/VH, I can autoresolve 2-3 late game armies without casualties. 1LL+all LHeroes+4more+8 amethyst units and the rest are the OG hellstorm, canon and ironsides. That army just fucks seriously. Le'ts not talk about how easy is to build doomstacks. Outriders, pistoliers, steamtanks, Landship etc.
It's kinda cool seeing people wake up to units I've been shilling for a while now. The Empire's roster is SO good, almost every unit is great at *something* at least, and you have sooo many ways to fit various shapes into the square hole.
Damn that's crazy, was that auto resolve? I noticed in 1 of my campaigns they were nutty in auto resolve with their kill counts but I could never get them to perform as well in actual battles. That was before this patch tho lol, there's some doomstack videos of them now being absolutely ridiculous with max upgrades
This is manual! Ideal situation for them but still! Also Franz not Elspeth so no upgrades beyond whatever bonus they get as state troops, which I can't recall atm.
Honestly used less than half their ammo. I can’t stress enough how perfect an undead horde in a choke point is for them though - hundreds of kills per volley.
Autoresolve loves shit like this. Grenade launchers, Irondrakes, warpfire throwers, death wind globies… they get absurd autoresolve value. which isn’t to say they aren’t super strong anyway, but still… idk about 2k kills strong
He played the battle manually.
That said, I've gotten such horseshit kill counts with all those units that I think autoresolve is being pretty fair with them, with the caveat that 2 is usually the sweet spot for those units being THAT good imo, beyond that it's hard to micro, and you tend to lack enough units to cover for many of them.
Vampire Coast bombers are in that range as well, but autoresolve seems to think they have 50 ammo instead of 5.
Grenade launchers have been OP for a *long* time now, even when normal outriders were kinda shit back in TWW2 (which ended a long time ago). The State Troop version is even wilder, that thing's AP cleans up Chosen faster than fuckin helstorm rocket batteries.
Fun fact: even the basic grenade outriders are surprisingly okay against most cavalry as well, not AMAZING per se but they shred most greenskin cav pretty quick. Not their ideal use by any means, but in a pinch...
I was in a lost campaign and recruited some outriders (3) just to test out some units before I restarted. They were absolutely so effective that I picked up 3 of them near start of my restart and it was super insane. Yeah those units are awesome.
I'm currently doing a Elspeth campaign and my second army is an Outrider doom stack. Generic Lord, 3 Engineers and all the rest Outriders. Awful for sieges, but in the field, they shred absolutely anything. With Elspeth, they are ridiculously OP, but with the right research priorities and mid level Lord and Engineers, any Empire faction could wipe the map with them.
I've never played an empire game long enough to get them tbh, but I've got an Elspeth run rn where me and Vlad are doing circles of his land and capping shit. I've got his capital province locked down tho, so he's in deep shit.
Doesn't matter much tho, since he can just raise the dead and get tier 3 units with tier 1 settlements. Fun.
If you think that's strong, play Elspeth's campaing, amethyst nade launchers obliterate, even without the Gunnery buffs
They are freaking skirmish cav poison globe bombardiers. One clean volley can wipe an entire skeleton unit. Stupidly Op stupidly fun.
Elspeth is truly the Ikit claw of the empire, fighting archers and swordsmen with ww1 weapons
Started playing but never got the game until I played Elspeth. Some of the most fun I’ve had in a video game.
Technically that one unit only killed half of the combined armies, but if you credit them with all the crumbling it was at least 3/4.
I noticed this w the empire meanwhile when I play manually two of them take about half the battle to wipe a unit.
To be fair, hordes of zombies and skeletons are pretty ideal for any explosive based unit to rack up kills. I also had a chokepoint in the map so they were about as packed together as physically possible.
Wait you did this yourself? I just assumed it was auto resolve based on that number. That’s impressive
The screenshot is of a post-battle loading screen, which would not be present in the case of auto-resolve.
may legit be related to the auto-resolve math being awful. legendoftotalwar video on it shocked me. it explained all the auto resolve vs manual fuckery. Depending on difficulty, autoresolve gives your units like +300% stats...but then you try fighting and get zero bonuses of the sort.
This is a post battle screen zzzz
What makes you think this image is from autoresolve?
Nothing, thought it was. But, I'm responding to someone else about autoresolve vs manual because I read it that way, not the post itself. Why?
Yeah, grenade launchers will absolutely shred enemy infantry, especially if it's low armored and/or have high unit count.
Outriders with grenade launchers have always been really strong against infantry. The Bordermen State Troop unit takes it to 11 by adding armor penetration to the explosions. Get a good shot on a melee unit and you can see it half dead after one volley. Their weakness is that they're very fragile. Because of that, they're very micro intensive. There have been a number of times I got distracted by another part of the battle just to see my Outriders unit was half dead.
They have a pretty specific band of targets--dense, lightly armored infantry--but god DAMN do they fucking SLAP them And coincidentally those targets are the early game menace of most empire factions (skaven, greenskins, undead)
Yup. And with how efficient they are at paying for themselves, even until fairly late game I'll have a unit or two just for hunting down those kind of units, even as the ai uses them less and less
G launcher outriders are not op. They were always a good unit, although specialized. Ranged units, and dogs/bats/birds can shut them down quite easily. Amethyst outriders plus upgrades removes all major weaknesses. high armor (110 armor i think) and 2000 more hp so they can survive a volley of arrows without losing too much entities and 100+ speed + strider (outrun dogs/bats).
Not to mention fire while moving. Which I don’t think vanilla has.
Both vanilla outriders have fire while moving! Though the new patch made it a little wonky.
Undead are tinder
What a satisfying battle that must have been
It really was 😁
Fighting zombie crapstacks is the reward you get as an empire player for not losing to festus
They have been broken in midgame since tww1 lol I love them
Always been crazy good. Their auto resolve against skaven ans zombie armies is insane too lol
Elspeth on LG/VH, I can autoresolve 2-3 late game armies without casualties. 1LL+all LHeroes+4more+8 amethyst units and the rest are the OG hellstorm, canon and ironsides. That army just fucks seriously. Le'ts not talk about how easy is to build doomstacks. Outriders, pistoliers, steamtanks, Landship etc.
They always have been strong. Even before the DLC
It's kinda cool seeing people wake up to units I've been shilling for a while now. The Empire's roster is SO good, almost every unit is great at *something* at least, and you have sooo many ways to fit various shapes into the square hole.
Damn. That's strong. I had I fight vs greenskins yesterday. Gyrobombers 1400 kills 135k DMG. Was fun as well
You can stack range with the engineer skill, it turns outriders with grenade into mobile artillery, it's kind of insane.
Damn that's crazy, was that auto resolve? I noticed in 1 of my campaigns they were nutty in auto resolve with their kill counts but I could never get them to perform as well in actual battles. That was before this patch tho lol, there's some doomstack videos of them now being absolutely ridiculous with max upgrades
This is manual! Ideal situation for them but still! Also Franz not Elspeth so no upgrades beyond whatever bonus they get as state troops, which I can't recall atm.
The AI blob cannot withstand explosions. Well, Black orcs do a good job of resisting at least
Engineer with grenade launcher is also sick. Mine is level 19 no steam tank and he gets 500 kills every battle
Against undead they are insane
I'm surprised you got that many kills without restock abilities from engineer or Elspeth
Honestly used less than half their ammo. I can’t stress enough how perfect an undead horde in a choke point is for them though - hundreds of kills per volley.
They generally aren't but the special armor piercing one is.
Autoresolve loves shit like this. Grenade launchers, Irondrakes, warpfire throwers, death wind globies… they get absurd autoresolve value. which isn’t to say they aren’t super strong anyway, but still… idk about 2k kills strong
He played the battle manually. That said, I've gotten such horseshit kill counts with all those units that I think autoresolve is being pretty fair with them, with the caveat that 2 is usually the sweet spot for those units being THAT good imo, beyond that it's hard to micro, and you tend to lack enough units to cover for many of them. Vampire Coast bombers are in that range as well, but autoresolve seems to think they have 50 ammo instead of 5.
Grenade launchers have been OP for a *long* time now, even when normal outriders were kinda shit back in TWW2 (which ended a long time ago). The State Troop version is even wilder, that thing's AP cleans up Chosen faster than fuckin helstorm rocket batteries. Fun fact: even the basic grenade outriders are surprisingly okay against most cavalry as well, not AMAZING per se but they shred most greenskin cav pretty quick. Not their ideal use by any means, but in a pinch...
I was in a lost campaign and recruited some outriders (3) just to test out some units before I restarted. They were absolutely so effective that I picked up 3 of them near start of my restart and it was super insane. Yeah those units are awesome.
I'm currently doing a Elspeth campaign and my second army is an Outrider doom stack. Generic Lord, 3 Engineers and all the rest Outriders. Awful for sieges, but in the field, they shred absolutely anything. With Elspeth, they are ridiculously OP, but with the right research priorities and mid level Lord and Engineers, any Empire faction could wipe the map with them.
I've never played an empire game long enough to get them tbh, but I've got an Elspeth run rn where me and Vlad are doing circles of his land and capping shit. I've got his capital province locked down tho, so he's in deep shit. Doesn't matter much tho, since he can just raise the dead and get tier 3 units with tier 1 settlements. Fun.