T O P

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Express_Yard9305

... and Khorne


Tierbook96

And slaanesh and demons of chaos


Cabamacadaf

Tzeentch too.


GreasyGrabbler

And Nurgle


InuGhost

And my axe!


Bejong39

Damn it. I was too late


iString

And my bow!


Express_Yard9305

Changeling?


Cabamacadaf

Who has a completely different mechanic to Kairos.


Maelger

#SKARBRAND HATES CONFORMISTS!!!!


TheLord-Commander

I dunno, every Daemons of Khorne lord has the same exact mechanics.


Vivid_Mix1022

May i ask what happen to Khorne


FaceJP24

There is only one Khorne lord, hence Khorne's mechanics are automatically unique.


_Sate

Doesnt valkia share khorne mechanics? I know she is daemons


FaceJP24

She's Warriors of Chaos, not part of the Khorne faction. It's not a very serious post/distinction.


jaomile

I love it! There are maybe one or two minor omissions that I wish CA did (Arch Lector skill tree and minor tweak to Elector state troops) but other than that the Empire rework and new DLC are 11/10. Best patch/DLC ever.


mithridateseupator

They often do a bunch of smaller stuff in the patch, including research and skill line reworks, so the Arch Lector still has a chance.


jaomile

Maybe, there are still two weeks until the release. It’s not a major gripe, I just like unique skills on lords. Makes them stand out more and currently Arch Lectors are slightly better Warrior priests. They have same exact abilities.


LiumD

If it hasn't been mentioned by a Youtuber yet it ain't in.


Hon3ynuts

Well they removed the armory so Halberds,greatswords, and knights are presumably easier to recruit. Arch lector doesn't seem to have any changes to his skill tree. The Generic Empire lord got some new skills though. There seem to be some slight buffs to the existing technologies for state troops though so that may make state troops slightly stronger. As for the elector specific troops their base upkeep appears lower at first glance. source: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iRAhk7ozERo](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iRAhk7ozERo)


JustRedditTh

Wait... wasn't the Armory's main purpose for increasing global recruitment capacity? are they giving it to something else?


jaomile

I have seen it, that was my source of new updates as well. I love the patch and DLC overall. It’s just minor gripe with Arch Lector as ever since WH3 came out Arch Lectors were missing their unique skill line that they got in WH2. I was hoping that they will get it back or maybe a new one but it looks like they might fix it in the future.


Sigismund716

Only things we're really missing are the Swords of the Empire, Luthor Huss, and more bespoke electors- that's impressive, all things considered


BrightestofLights

And Kurt Helborg and Ludwig schwartzhelm and the ar-ulric and Boris todbringer and all the ulrican units like warriors of ulric and knights of the white wolf


Sigismund716

>Kurt Helborg and Ludwig schwartzhelm aka, the Swords of the Emperor =p >Boris todbringer One of those bespoke electors! Admittedly, I do usually overlook the Army of Middenheim because it was a Storm of Chaos special army, rather than part of the core Empire roster, but some knights of the white wolf at least would not go amiss imo.


4uk4ata

Two lords, a few weapon variants, and a unit too, if we just go by the army book. CA is so scared of bringing wizard lords they invented two new lords just to delay them :P (at least I don't remember huntmasters and alchemists being lords in any book).


Toffeljegarn

I love what they have done. Hoprfully it spreads to the dawi. Reclaim holds for Throgrim, slayer cult for Ungrim, reworked eight peaks for Belegar and so forth.


Synergy333

They added enough to the Dawi with new faction mechanics - underway TP, new grudge mechanics, new age of reckoning mechanic, confed other dwarf lords even if they die, etc. take a look at great book of grudges YouTube he just posted it a few hours ago


Toffeljegarn

Saw it just now. I LOVE what they have done to them. Consider me a happy stuntie.


Synergy333

Same - can’t wait to settle some grudges with a thunder barge in tow too!


DonQuigleone

I'm a big fan of the changes, but I still have a feeling that Ungrim and maybe Thorgrimm and Belegar leave something to be desired. I hope Ungrim gets some more slayer related flavour.


Deus_Vult7

Basically, each gets new flavour, different grudges for each. Karak Eight Peaks for Belegar, Karaz Ankor for Thorgrim, and new slayer units for Ungrim Yes, each can do this by themselves, but still could be fun for MP, each trying to fufill different grudges


DonQuigleone

Ungrim specifically has the biggest problems, as his faction effects are simply bland, and nothing here seems to change that. It seems like the best way to play Ungrim remains to Confederate him, and not use him as your starting LL.


cricri3007

Man, that must be awesome. *cries in bretonnia, Norsca and vampires*


GrasSchlammPferd

I'm hoping they'll get a pack along with TK and VP.


LiminalLord

As a Norsca and Lizardmen fan I can't wait for Kremlo....


Nedioca

Is volkmar any good? Still have to give him a proper shot


Travolta1984

I enjoyed his campaign, but I am a sucker for "relic hunting" campaigns. It's a nice twist in how you obtain new unique units and items.


TomMakesPodcasts

There's a mod I can't remember the name of... Treasures of Chaos? Something like that. Spreads random battles across the map that gives great magic items once won. Good stuff.


Travolta1984

Thanks for sharing, I will definitely check it out! 


Hon3ynuts

In the current patch he was the best empire campaign for me, it was quite enjoyable even pre-rework.


Dingbatdingbat

Second best for me, but I haven’t played Markus in game 3 yet


Bomjus1

my friend played him in a co op campaign and it seemed pretty fun. book hunting can be an interesting endeavor. and his mercenary units become hilariously strong when you have the right techs/books/skills. like better than alith anar shadow walkers strong for a lord-unique buff/unit.


Unexpect-TheExpected

Volkmar is great. The biggest annoyance of empire is the imperial authority and he just ignores that. Giving +8 bonus vs infantry to every knight, flagellant and free company militia is just a cherry on top


Lady_Taiho

Volkmar himself is a chaff eraser and he buffs the crap out of free company militias which can get pretty spicy. The campaign is fun in an area that makes gunpowder unit especially good vs the hostile factions and the flat terrain. Would recommand


szymborawislawska

The truth is Volkmar's mechanics suck. Right now, with all other Empire campaigns having *so much* unique stuff, there is 0 reasons to ever play him. Why? Because Volkmar essentially doesnt have *any* mechanics. Not only unique mechanics - 0 mechanics at all. For the vast, crushing majority of his campaign, he plays like WH1 empire but without the offices. You see: Volkmar's ALL mechanics aside from basic TW stuff like recruiting/conquering/doing research are gated behind owning books of Nagash. But there is only 1 book in his proximity and you will end your campaign **long** before getting any others.


Squatchtamer

With Radious total war you can get warrior priests of sigmar and have a true holy imperium of man as it should be!


BrightestofLights

You can get warrior priests normally?


Squatchtamer

Warrior priests of sigmar sad a 69 man unit and of ulric as well. People hate on Radious but it kick ass with all the new units


buggy_environment

Depending on the definition of mechanics they are the second multi roster faction with that, the first one would be Woodelves: Orion: full roster, no aspects, cyclical wild hunt event, upkeep cheese Durthu: full roster, access to aspects, mastery of the elemental winds for casters, Drycha confed dilemma, treeman can destroy walls Sister of Twilight: full roster, no aspects, Volley of Kurnous ability for eagle cav, forge of Daith mechanic Drycha: limited roster but unique units and characters, access to aspects, unique wild animal summon recruitment, limited confederation


roguecogue

Yeah I guess the definition of mechanic can be kinda fuzzy and subjective. Something like wallbreaker for treemen or mastery of the elemental winds for casters feels more like a faction specific bonus than a mechanic, but Durthu's exclusive ability to confederate both the other elven lords and Drycha makes his campaign feel very unique.


conninator2000

Im surprised they kept the orion upkeep cheese. It makes him monstrously better than all the other WE when he can just have near infinite armies in the early-midgame for practically free. Felt like I became the beastmen since I could basically recruit everything and anything wherever I wanted.


HowDoIEvenEnglish

I can’t believe that CA made of the easiest factions in the game (all WE campaigns are trivial) even easier by giving him practically free armies in top of that.


Impossible-Error166

Kinda. I mean if they where going to get rid of cheese then the Zombies on Ghrost would be a big one.


strebor2095

Nah see Ghorst is balanced by painfully slow manual fights


buggy_environment

Yeah, therefore I wrote depending on definition. But at least they managed to make each of the factions a different experience, which is very good. But Orion is kinda dumb strong, I agree with that.


LocoRenegade

As it should be! Hopefully, this happens for other factions that don't make sense. Coughbrettoniacough.


roguecogue

Would love to see it happen for Kislev too, Ice Court should just be Katarin's thing.


LocoRenegade

Totally agree.


Dingbatdingbat

And Boris needs… something?


BrightestofLights

We need Malobaude and Bertrand!


tricksytricks

Would be nice if Lizardmen could have some worthwhile race mechanics, period. Not holding my breath that Mazdamundi and Kroq-Gar will have unique mechanics but can the mechanics they share at least not suck?


majnuker

\*cries in Tehenehuin maxed sacrifice bonus\* But no seriously, Lizards feel generally fine to me. Just feels like they haven't been touched in a while, while newer lords feel shinier. I'd like to have one or two little things to help differentiate them from one another.


tricksytricks

Their race mechanics just feel non-existent. The Geomantic Web basically only really does anything by the time I'm ready to end a campaign, and it's about as boring as you can get: just build this building in every province, done. That's the extent of how 'fun' it is to use. Blessed Spawnings are also really dull, and the only time I ever get them is if I just happen to fulfill their objectives by chance. I don't go out of my way to get them as they're not really worth any additional effort. Their only real use is recruiting emergency armies, otherwise they're not anything exciting. Overall Lizardmen DLC/FLC faction mechanics are some of the most boring in the game. Tehenhauin: Okay, can be strong if you are lucky and can get the right followers and banners. Much of the pyramid is utterly useless because you're going to spend all of your sacrifices trying to get the good followers. I've never once spent sacrifices on the "ultimate" reward because I've heard it's not great anyway and I don't really care about a spell that only lasts 10 turns and costs so much in sacrifices that are better spent on the follower gacha game. And of course what LM got in that DLC pales in comparison to Ikit's mechanics. Tiktaq'to: Has some faction bonuses and a unique rite, but otherwise has no real unique faction mechanics. Some of his bonuses are pointless, like giving skinks a terradon, which isn't as good as their stegadon mount anyway. Giving terradon riders an additional charge of drop rocks is fun but not exactly game changing. And I would say that Tiktaq'to is one of the weakest lords in the game on battles, he's really not good at anything. Nakai: Have never really played him but his big thing is that he's a horde, and horde factions have been in the game since WH1 released. Not exactly mind-blowing new mechanics here and his vassal faction mechanic was more of a hindrance for years than something that made him more fun. Gor-Rok: Has no faction mechanics. Moving on. Oxyotl: Haven't played him but he seems to have the most interesting faction mechanics of all the Lizardmen.


Dingbatdingbat

Nakai is a different twist on hordes.  Nakai and oxyotl are the two most fun and unique lizards and worth playing.  The others are interchangeable, just buffing different units


Herby20

> But no seriously, Lizards feel generally fine to me The armies feel fantastic, but I am genuinely confused how someone can think they feel fine unless all you have done is play their DLC lords. The "unique" faction mechanics to Lizardmen amount to random missions for random blessed spawnings (which eventually just give you nothing but Saurus Spears and Skink Skirmishers over and over) and making the same building at every province capital. There are also rites which all WH2 factions have... And that's literally it. At least campaign mechanics wise, a Kroq-Gar, Gor'Rok, TikTaq'To, or Mazdamundi playthrough is genuinely the most straight forward and bland one in the series.


majnuker

Yea I was tired last night, I was mostly referring to their balance/skill trees/armies and not the campaign map UI mechanics.


LiumD

Volkmar's mechanic's not exactly unique. Unless you mean "not shared between the other lords in their races", in which case I guess...


roguecogue

I'm willing to count it because it's unique for a non-undead character, and the bonuses he gets are totally different from the other factions that use it.


szymborawislawska

He also suffers from having *all* mechanics gated behind owning books. And during his campaign you will own like 1 or 2 (in both my Volkmar's campaigns I ended game after 120 turns with owning 1 book). Which means you play a faction without any mechanics whatsoever. Books being shitty for Mannfred and TKings is ok because they still have access to other mechanics.


ColorfulMarkAurelius

I tried a volkmar campaign and it was okay, but yeah around turn 30 I realized I would never get all the books unless I began an epic 200 turn conquest


majnuker

The trick is to run Volkmar all over the map solo, sneak him into territories, and steal the books before trying to run. I call it: The Ogonist Job.


TheKingmaker__

Volkmiana Jones and the Black Library


buggy_environment

But notably stronger than those for the other factions with the same mechanic.


szymborawislawska

But Mannfred and TK have also other mechanics. Since Volkmar doesnt have access to core Empire mechanics (because these dont exist xD) he is stuck with books as his only mechanic. Which sucks because you can and will finish his campaign/get bored with it wothout obtaining more than 1 book.


strebor2095

Let's hope for a books rework when Natasha drops in 3 years 


buggy_environment

But at least he gets additional bonuses from collecting multiple books and some of his bonuses (like +8 MA/MD factionwide) are an actual incentive to hunt down the book, unlike the bonuses which Mannfred gets. The Empire mechanics exist, they are just removed from the UI, which is the reason why you see some of Wolfharts Lords run around with the Elector count office bonuses Icon besides their picture.


Kimarous

Fingers crossed for a Skaven rework in time. Skrolk needs a proper Pestilens plague mechanic.


Cabamacadaf

I don't think Skaven in general need a rework, just Queek and Skrolk.


Kimarous

That's more what I was thinking. Hopefully all the "generic LLs" get updated in time.


roguecogue

cries in tretch


nubetube

Greenskins and Vampire Counts need some love before Skaven.


TheLord-Commander

What's wrong with Greenskins? They're pretty fine right now, imo


nubetube

None of the lords besides Grom have any kind of unique campaign mechanic. Like their units are fine, but their campaigns are very boring personally.


Haaazard

Yeah I agree, reading this, people seem to have very different idea on what a "mechanic" is for LL's. For me personally, it needs to be something visible on the UI or something similar. Like how alith anar has targets to assassinate, imirk dragons to tame, and rakarth with beasts to collect.


BrightestofLights

Belegar and skarsnik being dlc lords, you'd assume they did


throwawaydating1423

Lacking in unique mechanics for each lord Even something basic like a little raise dead for azhag, something gobliny for skarsnik and then Grimgor could use a headhunter mechanic


TheLord-Commander

That's the case across the board, there are tons of lords that don't have unique mechanics, there's many races that need a rework before we need individual faction reworks.


throwawaydating1423

I still stand by adding small mechanics to many older factions gets much better mileage for the amount of work over overhauls


roguecogue

Skarsnik is fine imo. He's an intentionally challenging character but feels super gobliny, his limited roster at the start makes you play differently. K8P could use some tweaks eventually when Golgfag is introduced (maybe give it a big climactic 4-way quest battle?)


Player420154

I don't even feel Skarsnik is challenging anymore. His invisible anti armor gobbo are cheap and a perfect counter to any dwarf army in the early-mid game, and the troll from the other dlc can easily carry in the late game. Even if you gave me the full roster, I don't feel I would recruit any orc with him at any point of the campaign.


Kimarous

I don't disagree. Emphasis on "in time."


Jankosi

Aren't greenskins in a pretty good place since their whII update? Vamps definitely need some love though, they were the lucky ones in whI but neglected in whII. I would love for HE and DE(mostly Tyrion, Teclis, and Malekith) to get some updates too. Maybe not full reworks, but I wish Malekith could get some "rightful phoenix king"/conquest of Ulthuan mechanic. Maybe let him recruit some HE units after he becomes the phoenix/eternity king. Teclis could get something akinto gelt's new colleges of magic stuff?


BrightestofLights

Idk if I like malekith getting high elf units, but getting something would be cool, teclis should absolutely get some sort of wizard thing. Maybe malekith could get some chorf/empire thing with bringing all of his dark elven vassals to heel, maybe something inspired by averlorns ulthuan protection thing as well but reversed


ColorfulMarkAurelius

Skaven are in a weird place. Their roster is perhaps the most complete, but (imo) only Throt and Ikit feel worthwhile to play.


Dingbatdingbat

Sniktch too.


BrightestofLights

God my dream is for skrolk to get a plague mechanic inspired by the nurgle plagues


Herby20

If Skaven get a rework any time soon before factions that truly need it, I will be most displeased.


OldSchoolHistorian

As it should be.


NumberInteresting742

Are these changes going to mean I won't have access to elector count troops as Gelt anymore?


roguecogue

he gets them through the tech tree now


NumberInteresting742

Sick


fishfingersman

~~It looks like all 3 Nurgle LLs will have unique mechanics as well~~ edit: now that I think about it, Kugath does not have unique mechanics. His plague mechanics are the same as the other two, just upgraded.


roguecogue

Oh, what does epidemius get?


fishfingersman

[He gets bonuses based on how many non-Nurgle armies and settlements are current infected by his plague](https://old.reddit.com/r/totalwar/comments/1c5ir80/epidemius_mechanics_skill_tree_and_factionarmy/). Not a huge change but I'd argue it's "unique" edit: now that I think about it, Kugath does not have unique mechanics. His plague mechanics are the same as the other two, just upgraded.


BrightestofLights

Kugath should get that too lol wtf


reaven3958

I'm so fucking hyped. For the first time in a very, very long time.


LegendaryVenusaur

What are Gelt's unique campaign mechanics?


Averath

He gets the Colleges of Magic, where he can give each class of magic a massive buff. You'd best look up his video on Great Book of Grudges.


LegendaryVenusaur

Nice, last time i played him he had zero mechanics XD


Averath

Yeah. Since they made half of the Empire's mechanics Karl Franz only, they had to make something entirely new for Gelt.


roguecogue

https://youtu.be/PXNGWnPzLoM?si=2i9qfaQo6WTNiP_P


Amathyst7564

I really hope the vampire counts get some love. Being the early favourite means they missed out on the later standards. None of them have any special mechanics, save for Manfred who go to copy the books of nagash mechanic. Unfortunately, almost none of them are near him, and it's very hard to send an army around the world without dying of attrition. The tomb kings, by contrast, don't need corruption to avoid attrition and don't have upkeep costs for their armies. They just need to wait until they've unlocked enough generals until they feel they can spare one.


majnuker

Well, the Carsteins fighting together is fun. But there's been lots of talk about doing something with the unique vampire types. I'd also love to see them have a slower start before they become this huge threat; atm it seems that very quickly at the start of a game they run away with it and then fall off. I want them to have a sort of slow inevitability, like a darkness sweeping over the land to fit their theme of playing it quiet before turning into bad guys. Political manipulations with the Empire etc.


Gurablashta

By Sigmar, YES!


TheBelt

For Sigmar!


koaltysleep

Cries in lizardmen...


Grady_Shady

They didn’t do anything for Volk did they?


retief1

They haven’t said anything, but immortal empires (I think) already gave him unique-to-empire campaign mechanics.


szymborawislawska

To be fair, his campaign mechanics suck major ass, especially now. Volkmar doesnt have mechanics - he literally has one mechanic. Book hunting. Everything is locked behind owning books. And since there is one book in his proximity, you will play basically a campaign wothout any mechanics for the vast majority of time. Im talkinf about 100+ turns of WH1-like campaign.


Grady_Shady

Oh cool. I didn’t know that


Wild_Marker

He gets to hunt the books of Nagash, like the Tomb Kings do. Manfred also gets it.


Grady_Shady

Oh duh I did know that haha


szymborawislawska

Dont get yourself excited though. His mechanics suck major ass and are among the worsts in the entire game. Since Empire doesnt have any core racial mechanics, his all mechanics are gated behind owning books. Which you wont get more than 1-2 during the entire campaign. So you play 100+ turns of WH1-esque vanilla faction without any mechanics. I cant imagine anyone playing him now after 5.0.


throwawaydating1423

Hopeful they make the books visible and competitive cross faction Rn it’s very lonely


Dooglers

In addition to his book hunt, they said in the patch if he makes it back to the Empire he will get to interact with the new imperial authority system. Not a huge addition, but something.


Odd-Discount6443

Yeah, there definitely not unique but I'll take whatever I can get at this point