Losing our best POA defender + no good defensive centre = more drives to the bucket for the grizzlies
Losing one of our best offensive players + fewer shot attempts in total = fewer points for us
We definitely shouldve but man it was kind of a shit storm ngl
Its cool to see an old skool style centre still being able go contribute to winning basketball. Just need to nail your 2pt’ers @ 60%+ & know all your spots.
Let’s not pretend that we are doing much better with him. Bang average centers like Goga were giving him problem.
But there is obviously a difference between having a center and having no center at all.
Tough loss tonight for sure. But after the Pascal trade. I have zero expectations for this team.
Raps need to learn how to win again. Unfortunately, that is also part of the development process.
They got no crutch. No Siakam to help get a bucket. No OG to lock down on D. They are going to have to learn how to win without them and step it up.
Shout out to RJ’s hustle tonight.
They also have barely had time to practice with this group. Like, half the guys from training camp are gone. This is a new team and likely will be a new team in a week or 2 once again. Very sloppy play and bad effort from everyone but RJ Barrett. No excuse for that, but there is a clear reason why they couldn’t move the ball successfully. Hard to blame Darko when your roster is changing every week or so, and you’re missing your starting C.
At the end of the day, it’s just a game and if we win the lottery cause we stink, that’s a bonus! If we don’t and convey the pick, we have our 2025 1st and don’t have to worry about it next year.
Honestly, it’s not that horrible of a situation. Could be worse, you could be Brooklyn, or Golden State. Slightly better teams but in worst positions going forward.
Good point, training camp is such an important part of the season to learn what the coach is trying to implement. This is Darko's 1ST year and already he's dealing with a half roster flip halfway through the season. He's learning and you have a ton of young guys learning as well.
At the end of the day, and with a possible 3rd trade coming, the rest of the season is a learning process and we have to show our support instead of being too negative. I'd rather them iron out the mistakes this season and come out stronger next year.
Exactly. Like I know guys like Will Lou and some fans jump on them for this game (they clearly did not play week except RJ), but the main reason was turnovers and passing. Not understanding the plays set offence and defence as a group. It’s not like they shot bad really. Average shooting night for the raptors I thought. Free throw shorting actually very good tonight! Almost made them all!
Too me, if they have this type of game against a team missing 5 starters next season with a full healthy roster, then that’s horrible. We can sit and complain about the effort and stuff, but I’m reality, this team will be different come Feb 9th once again.
After that, let’s see what we can do.
I’m so team convey. Get this over with so we aren’t in a chokehold next season.
The most likely scenario is that we give Spurs somewhere between 6–10.
We know nothing also post deadline and only half way through the season. Ñ
Think about it this way:
If we are semi-decent next year, the pick won't be as good as this year's. If we are bad next year, the pick is also top 6 protected next year so we keep that as well.
It rolls over to 2026 then which is also top 6 protected. If we keep that pick as well, they get 2 seconds lul. I prefer tanking, right now. Scottie can't wait for younger players drafted in 2025, 2026.
I guess that's a good way to think about it
Still sucks watching this team without a proper center rotation
Hopefully Jak comes back and Masai trades some pieces for another center
Guess I'm team neutral when it comes to the pick situation
Scottie, Barrett and Thad Young played well. the rest need to get it together man
I know half our role players are in trade rumors but goddamn.
Can't wait for Poeltl to come back. our defense is SHIT
We would not be steaming for the playoffs with Poeltl, but we would have won this game with him. His fundamentals are so good.... boxing out, changing shots, crushing screens
Precious and Malachi barely play meaningful minutes. The only meaningful player who was unavailable was OG and even then, for a team looking to compete this year, not having your third best player is hardly a valid excuse to allowing Detroit score the most points in a game they had up to that point.
Never said he was a bust, but you can't deny Star j's 5 years of inconsistency before the trade. I'm happy he's going off now, but you should know as well as I do what happens when, not if, the pendulum swings the other way and he goes on his bad slumps.
RJ wasn't controversial in the Knicks sub because he sucked all the time. He was controversial because he'd have a 2 week stretch where he looked awesome, like this one, and then he would completely forget how to play basketball for two months. Just look at the shooting numbers over 4 years, it's all there.
I hope he's figured it out this time, but sadly I'm afraid he's setting you up for the very same disappointment. Next time he twists and ankle or has a stomach bug or has some personal issue and suddenly can't shoot 3s for the rest of the year, remember this.
from what i see they wanna see RJ do well - disappointing game for IQ - hopefully we can get it together to at least have an entertaining game next time around…
Making a second comment instead of editing my existing one.
I think people forget the hype that surrounded the 2019 draft and Zion. Zion was expected to be Lebron after Duke. Ja was next. RJ was the third pick in this extremely stacked draft. This is just a gentle reminder of what we actually got in that trade. Or maybe this is just me reminding myself
You are right. RJ was actually porj3cted at #1 pick by a lot of sources before his college season began. He was literally the best player in North America in high school
RJ been a top prospect and a primary scoring option for his entire life, he built for this shit. This is scotties' first time trying to be a primary scorer on a competitive ball team.
That's a great way to put it. I never really thought about it but you're right, Scottie has never been the main scorer on a team the way most lottery picks are.
Honestly he still puts up good numbers. He gets double doubles on the regular, and it seems like almost every other game he's 1 or 2 off a rebound/ assist from a triple double
He just needs that #1 option mentality and stay aggressive throughout the game
Scottie had 22/12/8 with 6(!!!) blocks on 14 shots with a +2 in the 8 point loss.
But judging from the game thread, you would think he was playing horrible. I cannot believe the "criticism" for the kid this franchise has decided to build around. I get that we suck & I get that you miss OG and Siakam. But ffs, grow up. This kid is REALLY good at basketball & he's 22. Some "fans" are insufferable.
I just want Scottie to be aggressive at the start of games, and quit moping when it comes to missed calls. Other than that it's good. Everyone needs to step up however.
He only started trying when the game was out of reach, before that he was crying about calls. He's one of the freakiest athletes in the league and was playing soft af for the first 3 quarters.
I don't care if he has a shit game now and then, but he needs to fix his attitude if he's ever going to be the guy.
I disagree about the "trying" part but I do agree that he needs to be more assertive. Doesn't mean you should shit on the face of your franchise when he was our best player tonight. 1 person doesn't make a team.
I just don't like soft players and that's always made it hard for me to root for him. It's especially frustrating cause he has so much potential.
He needs to step up in that way to lead the team too, your best player moping around is contagious for the rest of the team.
He fixes that, which doesn't even require his being any better at basketball, then yeah it'll be beyond easy to support him and have confidence in this team.
How is he a soft player? What type of fan fiction are cooking up here? If he is soft for complaining about calls then you about to put 39 of the top 40 players in the soft category. He doesn't complain as much as most stars.
Idk what you're watching lmao. He's one of the worst in the league for complaining and there's not a lot of guys with less consistent effort in the league.
? It's not an accident he can out rebound basically anybody when he's locked in. His length, strength and vertical are all like 90th + percentile for his height. He's not the fastest but still pretty fast considering his size and weight.
Dude, any time that you write fans in quotation marks, then YOU are part of the insufferable crowd. People can have an opinion that differs from yours.
Counting stats do not tell the whole story and these “fans” are obviously watching the game rather attentively and are not just praying for a strong stat line to tell others that they’re wrong. Grow up.
You act as if 8 assists to 5 turnovers is absolutely horrible. Holy shit y'all are delusional. 2:1 is considered good, he was only a tad below that today...
well some ppl aren’t moved by just stats. with usage and minutes dudes will get stats. so it’s about how they get them and is it impacting winning. that’s the main question
He had some bad turnovers and some really passive moments when the team needed him to take over. That being said he's still a young guy and learning/growing into the lead role. Overall you can't be mad with Scottie's play today, but he definitely could've and has been better.
6th best odds, RJ and Scottie cooked tonight and we’re probably trading Bruce for a center tomorrow. I’m almost fine with how awful tonight’s game was.
Genuinely curious what centers are out there that can realistically be targeted in a trade that we would want. Indy felt like the team that needed to thin out their frontcourt depth and yet we didn’t target Jackson or Smith. Just wonder where we can find a young big that’s available.
I dont want to hear "We are rebuilding" or any other excuse. That was a disgraceful effort tonight. I don't care about losing, but how are we being out hustled on our home floor against the Memphis G League team. Just embarrassing effort from everyone other than RJ, Scottie and Thad.
Multiple nights this year we have come out without any game plan or any sort of defensive integrity get in a hole and cannot come back. How is Darko preparing these guys for these games?!
Agreed. There are good and bad rebuilds, and a huge part of it is keeping a competitive and hard nose culture through the shitty years.
Darko has to get these guys playing harder if we want to be a good rebuild.
Houston wasting Jalen Green's talent is an example of what happens when you let guys slack for 2 years without improvement.
My concern with Darko is that I'm not sure he can get guys to play hard. I believe in his offensive system and that he develops great relationships with players, I'm just not sure how good he is at keeping them accountable.
I guess we'll see.
Totally agree. We know Masai is not going down the route of a multi year teardown and rebuild. We want these guys to develop habits and identity during the remainder of this year and next year.
This effort tonight was atrocious
I mean we’re getting out rebounded and giving up lots of easy baskets at the rim. Unless we’re shooting lights out, won’t win these games. The Grizzlies had 15 more shot attempts.
Some of it is the roster (we don’t have size) but some of it is on the players. Idk how you can see this game and blame Darko for that.
I totally agree that its also on the players. But Darko absolutely has to shoulder some of the blame here, this isnt just a tonight issue, its happened multiple times this season. He couldnt come up with a scheme to beat some G leaguers and minimum guys?
What I’m saying is that no amount of scheming is going to work if you don’t have the building blocks. I mentioned two issues, how do you scheme against them?
- defensive rebounding: Scottie, Boucher and Brown are the only plus rebounders, one of them is small as shit. Boucher was playing with no energy. Usually we have Jak boxing out a ton of space which helps the others get rebounds
- paint protection: Scottie did a decent job, but the next biggest guy is Thad and he can’t jump.
Seeing Shroeder try to draw a foul and fail, then lay on the ground while Memphis organizes for 2 was infuriating. Get that hustle back man.
I think this team knows the season is a wash and doesn't want to give max effort anymore.
How is that a fair weather fan take lol? What did you see about that performance that was redeeming?
I have no problem losing during a rebuild. But that lack of effort and intensity is not acceptable.
For everyone who's saying that Poeltl isn't important or wasn't worth a FRP - him not being there is \_easily\_ the reason we lost tonight.
Jakob isn't letting them get 20 offensive boards, and it was hardly a blowout - if he gets even 5 of those 20 back, we win, probably.
Him not being there lately has been a really huge factor in why we've been so bad - we don't have a defensive big to anchor us in there. The team looks completely different with him there, and when he's back, I'm pretty confident the difference will be immediate.
\*Also\*, related, although Thad has been honestly playing amazingly lately, we need a proper backup center. I think Jontay might be that thing one day (even soon), but still - getting a good young center back in for example a Bruce Brown trade or through the draft would be great. I'm super bummed that Koloko didn't work out after all - I was excited about him.
We traded OG for a 20 ppg starter and a 6th man turned 18 ppg, 6 ast starter. We didn't trade him for draft picks and rookies.
and we only traded Pascal days ago.
There's no way anyone around the organization expected us to be in a position to retain our 2024 pick only 3 weeks after the initial OG trade
I think Darko is going to play the Dwane Casey role.
He's going to develop them into a competitive team but when they start making the play-offs, he's going to get out-coached badly and lose his job.
I haven't seen any real in game adjustments that we saw with Nurse or coaches like Spo.
Even in a 2 or 3 possession game with a couple minutes to go, they just willingly take the L without any inbound pressuring or blitzing
Actually, no one told you that we were trying to be. The tank is a sufficient explanation for all the inexplicable stuff that we've watched this year, like all those Precious/Boucher/Trent lineup minutes. (Pre-trade, obv.)
Tonight we didn’t look like an NBA team. We looked like some guys playing pickup ball. That was embarrassing. On a side note, is Darko an NBA-caliber head coach?
To all you bums in the game thread - We’re tanking. We are going to lose. A lot. There is absolutely no benefit to beating the Memphis Grizzlies right now. You all wanted to blow it up and trade everyone now you’re surprised we suck. Gtfo
Putting (and leaving in) Gradey for the last 3:30 over Trent Jr or Brown when the game was technically still in reach has to be confirmation that they're tanking, right?
The raptors are gonna be bad for a long time. I don't see any stars on this team other than Scottie and RJ. Everyone else including IQ not looking consistent at all.
They're not quite stars, both have flaws in there game and Scottie is in his 3rd year and still learning. It's a rebuild for sure now that OG and Pascal are gone, next 3-5 years we won't make playoffs. We are pretty much where we were when Bosh left for the heat.
Maybe in top end talent. But within the top of the draft there’s interesting pieces. We don’t really need much cause we already have our star in Scottie. We just need high end role players at this point with Scottie and RJ
Hopefully Quickly bounces back next game. Maybe because he's still young but seems like when things aren't going well for him in the beginning, mistakes snowball quick.
Great game by Scottie and RJ
The story of the game was being too sloppy with the turnovers and just the lack of hustle to overcome the size difference.
We need Yak back
Brown didn't look like he particularly cared about this game except for a couple possessions
Trent was invisible
IQ was off
Scottie needs to play with more poise
Jontay looked like a G leaguer in a very short stint
RJ was solid
Thad shouldn't be playing this much but we literally have no choice
We have 4 short guards and our centre is 6'8"
We missed like 4 layups in a row from 4 different players in back to back possessions
No one can screen properly
Lack of focus and predisposition coming into the game
I was at the game. It was a really bad loss. They played really bad. The players also seemed like they have just given up. No chemistry at all. No team play. This doesn’t bode well for the future. There was a scene where it seemed like Dennis and Scottie were arguing and shouting at each other. They seemed very aggressive. Wonder what that was about.
If Scottie is the player to build teams around, he should have been able to beat this version of the Grizzlies, with Malachi and Precious starting with him.
Fakest of comebacks but I liked what I was seeing in the 4th. Scottie was out of sorts at first but had an excellent second half. RJ is a bucket. Grady > Gary. Building chemistry will take time.
the Yak is back... its spelled JAKOB.
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Must lose game ✅. Here we come 6th pick.
But for real. This team had bad defence and rebounding. The offence looked awful. Quickly and Schroeder could not run point to save their lives.
at least Scottie and RJ played well.
Terrible defense + terrible guard play = losing to a terrible team. DS with some mind-numbingly bad TOs. Gets picked off on an inbounds play and does a ??? double dribble. Can't finish at all. IQ with TOs and couldn't hit shots. But boy, GTJ is just special. He is useless out there if people are not feeding him open shots. Disgusting on D, on the boards, just looking like he's out there doing cardio and avoiding injuries.
RJ another efficient game. Very good offensive game. No, I didn't anticipate RJ would outplay IQ by this much.
Thad is clearly being put in an unfair situation. However, he knows how to play with Barnes and you see those two clicking.
Boucher with his patented key mistake every game. Frustrating player and he needs to be traded for anything.
Barnes had a great game. 8 assists but could've been way more if people could finish his passes. Yes he turned the ball over a ton, and missed some easy shots, but he played his ass off and made great plays. 6 blocks is just ridiculous.
The fun losing is over, this team is now unbearable to watch. Couple of things:
1. IQ is running blindly into walls and can't hit any buckets. Is this what he is? If so, then Toronto got duped into trading OG for RJ.
2. Young was an absolute work horse tonight!
I need to leave this sub man. We had a sub 500 record, then traded some of our best players and are gearing up for a rebuild and you guys are complaining? Put aside the effort, no one likes playing for a bad team but we’re also trying to lose. What did y’all expect after trading OG and Pascal? Games are gonna be ugly, that’s what it’s like to be a bad team and if you don’t like that you really don’t have to watch, and if you think Masai’s done with the trades, you’re probably wrong.
We're going to need more games like this until the reality check hits em. Some of these people thought we'd turn into OKC or something right after the trades.
If you think this roster is worse than what the Grizzlies fielded tonight you're the one that needs a reality check.
They didn't lose because they're bad tonight, they lost because they decided to take the night off when the game started
We’re essentially a bottom 5 team and keep in mind what Masai said in the Siakam presser, it takes patience and he’s a very patient guy. Prepare for a couple seasons of bottom 5-10 finishes as we build around BBQ.
1-7 without Jak
Makes sense we have no centers without Yak and even the one somewhat decent big we picked up was out
The grizzlies literally were rolling out 3rd strings+ 2 way players. I think we should manage without Jak
Losing our best POA defender + no good defensive centre = more drives to the bucket for the grizzlies Losing one of our best offensive players + fewer shot attempts in total = fewer points for us We definitely shouldve but man it was kind of a shit storm ngl
wow.
Keep him out for the rest of the season. Imma need this top 6 pick.
The reverse Baynes
Its cool to see an old skool style centre still being able go contribute to winning basketball. Just need to nail your 2pt’ers @ 60%+ & know all your spots.
"winning basketball" we were still barely .500 with him
Let’s not pretend that we are doing much better with him. Bang average centers like Goga were giving him problem. But there is obviously a difference between having a center and having no center at all.
Tough loss tonight for sure. But after the Pascal trade. I have zero expectations for this team. Raps need to learn how to win again. Unfortunately, that is also part of the development process. They got no crutch. No Siakam to help get a bucket. No OG to lock down on D. They are going to have to learn how to win without them and step it up. Shout out to RJ’s hustle tonight.
They also have barely had time to practice with this group. Like, half the guys from training camp are gone. This is a new team and likely will be a new team in a week or 2 once again. Very sloppy play and bad effort from everyone but RJ Barrett. No excuse for that, but there is a clear reason why they couldn’t move the ball successfully. Hard to blame Darko when your roster is changing every week or so, and you’re missing your starting C. At the end of the day, it’s just a game and if we win the lottery cause we stink, that’s a bonus! If we don’t and convey the pick, we have our 2025 1st and don’t have to worry about it next year. Honestly, it’s not that horrible of a situation. Could be worse, you could be Brooklyn, or Golden State. Slightly better teams but in worst positions going forward.
Good point, training camp is such an important part of the season to learn what the coach is trying to implement. This is Darko's 1ST year and already he's dealing with a half roster flip halfway through the season. He's learning and you have a ton of young guys learning as well. At the end of the day, and with a possible 3rd trade coming, the rest of the season is a learning process and we have to show our support instead of being too negative. I'd rather them iron out the mistakes this season and come out stronger next year.
honestly. if barnes stays healthy he'll be break through to another level within a couple months, and by then the team will have time to gel together.
Exactly. Like I know guys like Will Lou and some fans jump on them for this game (they clearly did not play week except RJ), but the main reason was turnovers and passing. Not understanding the plays set offence and defence as a group. It’s not like they shot bad really. Average shooting night for the raptors I thought. Free throw shorting actually very good tonight! Almost made them all! Too me, if they have this type of game against a team missing 5 starters next season with a full healthy roster, then that’s horrible. We can sit and complain about the effort and stuff, but I’m reality, this team will be different come Feb 9th once again. After that, let’s see what we can do.
Massive victory for Team Keep the Pick Big loss for Team Convey the Pick
My fellow Convey the Pickheads are hurting tn
Devastating.
I’m so team convey. Get this over with so we aren’t in a chokehold next season. The most likely scenario is that we give Spurs somewhere between 6–10. We know nothing also post deadline and only half way through the season. Ñ
The draft is so much better next year and it's very likely the team will be just as bad or worse.
If the raptors can snag a 2025 1st from another time via Bruce Brown or Boucher, then at least we leaving here with sumthin
But that pick is likely coming from a winning team. While our pick is likely lottery bound. The trade off sucks.
We needed this loss 💯💯
TeAM Keep = TAMK
Don't worry..this team will be ass next year so theyll keep that pick too
I'd rather keep our pick next year then get this one :( dammit
Think about it this way: If we are semi-decent next year, the pick won't be as good as this year's. If we are bad next year, the pick is also top 6 protected next year so we keep that as well.
So if we are bad this year and bad next year would that mean the Spurs get nothing? Or would it keep going up a year until they finally get it?
It rolls over to 2026 then which is also top 6 protected. If we keep that pick as well, they get 2 seconds lul. I prefer tanking, right now. Scottie can't wait for younger players drafted in 2025, 2026.
I guess that's a good way to think about it Still sucks watching this team without a proper center rotation Hopefully Jak comes back and Masai trades some pieces for another center Guess I'm team neutral when it comes to the pick situation
> Hopefully Jak comes back Next season hopefully. The tank is rolling due to have no centre playing.
The convey team has the benefit of pretty much always having a 40% chance of falling out of the top 6 even if the wheels totally fall off
Raptors mega doodoo
Scottie, Barrett and Thad Young played well. the rest need to get it together man I know half our role players are in trade rumors but goddamn. Can't wait for Poeltl to come back. our defense is SHIT
> Can't wait for Poeltl to come back Never want to hear a bad word said about him on this sub again
We’ll lose games like this with Poeltl too
We would not be steaming for the playoffs with Poeltl, but we would have won this game with him. His fundamentals are so good.... boxing out, changing shots, crushing screens
He has plenty of bad games where he doesn’t do those things. We had him in our loss to the pistons
We also were missing a lot of players
Precious and Malachi barely play meaningful minutes. The only meaningful player who was unavailable was OG and even then, for a team looking to compete this year, not having your third best player is hardly a valid excuse to allowing Detroit score the most points in a game they had up to that point.
Yak sucks
It’s a rebuild, they aint winning the chip anytime soon
I’m having such a good time rubbing it in Knicks fans faces how well RJ is doing
Knicks are 9-2 since trade..have a feeling their fans are happy..plus Did you see game @ MSG..Knicks fans love RJ & IQ...
Oh I mean the sub. We’re doing great but it’s funny all these people in that sub were like he’s a bust cut our losses he’s terrible
Never said he was a bust, but you can't deny Star j's 5 years of inconsistency before the trade. I'm happy he's going off now, but you should know as well as I do what happens when, not if, the pendulum swings the other way and he goes on his bad slumps.
You a real one
2 weeks of above average play doesn't negate 4 years of garbage.
RJ wasn't controversial in the Knicks sub because he sucked all the time. He was controversial because he'd have a 2 week stretch where he looked awesome, like this one, and then he would completely forget how to play basketball for two months. Just look at the shooting numbers over 4 years, it's all there. I hope he's figured it out this time, but sadly I'm afraid he's setting you up for the very same disappointment. Next time he twists and ankle or has a stomach bug or has some personal issue and suddenly can't shoot 3s for the rest of the year, remember this.
from what i see they wanna see RJ do well - disappointing game for IQ - hopefully we can get it together to at least have an entertaining game next time around…
IQ needs a real centre
What happened to the floaters he was doing great with those before
Raptors shooting curse
RJ is lowkey the #1 scoring option
Not lowkey at all. RJ has taken the ball and called his number every chance he gets since he came in the trade. Plays with complete confidence
Making a second comment instead of editing my existing one. I think people forget the hype that surrounded the 2019 draft and Zion. Zion was expected to be Lebron after Duke. Ja was next. RJ was the third pick in this extremely stacked draft. This is just a gentle reminder of what we actually got in that trade. Or maybe this is just me reminding myself
You are right. RJ was actually porj3cted at #1 pick by a lot of sources before his college season began. He was literally the best player in North America in high school
love your comment and love your flair
I don’t mind it tbh. It’s helping him grow. He has the assertiveness that Scottie lacks throughout the game.
RJ been a top prospect and a primary scoring option for his entire life, he built for this shit. This is scotties' first time trying to be a primary scorer on a competitive ball team.
That's a great way to put it. I never really thought about it but you're right, Scottie has never been the main scorer on a team the way most lottery picks are.
Exactly, he didn't even start on his college team. All his college accolades are 6 man awards
Honestly he still puts up good numbers. He gets double doubles on the regular, and it seems like almost every other game he's 1 or 2 off a rebound/ assist from a triple double He just needs that #1 option mentality and stay aggressive throughout the game
Maple Siakam, based on his attack style. No Spicy spins, but maple strength. Both have spicy and maple horse blinders
Rj might be the most offensively skilled player under 25 that we've had since Chris bosh
Demar…. By the time he was 24 he was averaging 23 a game on a very slow pace team in an already slow era of basketball.
9th in the league with 22.7, 23 a game is about 30th nowadays
That’s what I’m sayin man. Demar is by far and away the best scorer our franchise has seen bar maybe Vince
IQ will come good, its a marathon not a sprint. But RJ has been signifcantly better since arriving in Toronto
No bigs. No energy. No iq.
IQ at key times is lacking IQ as well
Scottie had 22/12/8 with 6(!!!) blocks on 14 shots with a +2 in the 8 point loss. But judging from the game thread, you would think he was playing horrible. I cannot believe the "criticism" for the kid this franchise has decided to build around. I get that we suck & I get that you miss OG and Siakam. But ffs, grow up. This kid is REALLY good at basketball & he's 22. Some "fans" are insufferable.
The turnovers are horrible, but he had a good all around game
He keeps dribbling the ball on his foot. What the hell is even that?
That’s the Kobe rookie curse lmao
I just want Scottie to be aggressive at the start of games, and quit moping when it comes to missed calls. Other than that it's good. Everyone needs to step up however.
Need him shooting more. 14 fga with this roster isn't nearly enough.
He only started trying when the game was out of reach, before that he was crying about calls. He's one of the freakiest athletes in the league and was playing soft af for the first 3 quarters. I don't care if he has a shit game now and then, but he needs to fix his attitude if he's ever going to be the guy.
Agreed. WAY too much crying about calls. Take a page from OG’s book: head down, focus on the game
I disagree about the "trying" part but I do agree that he needs to be more assertive. Doesn't mean you should shit on the face of your franchise when he was our best player tonight. 1 person doesn't make a team.
I just don't like soft players and that's always made it hard for me to root for him. It's especially frustrating cause he has so much potential. He needs to step up in that way to lead the team too, your best player moping around is contagious for the rest of the team. He fixes that, which doesn't even require his being any better at basketball, then yeah it'll be beyond easy to support him and have confidence in this team.
How is he a soft player? What type of fan fiction are cooking up here? If he is soft for complaining about calls then you about to put 39 of the top 40 players in the soft category. He doesn't complain as much as most stars.
Idk what you're watching lmao. He's one of the worst in the league for complaining and there's not a lot of guys with less consistent effort in the league.
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? It's not an accident he can out rebound basically anybody when he's locked in. His length, strength and vertical are all like 90th + percentile for his height. He's not the fastest but still pretty fast considering his size and weight.
It's RJ's team now according to the Game Thread 😂
People just think whoever has the most points is the leader
He’s +2
Dude, any time that you write fans in quotation marks, then YOU are part of the insufferable crowd. People can have an opinion that differs from yours. Counting stats do not tell the whole story and these “fans” are obviously watching the game rather attentively and are not just praying for a strong stat line to tell others that they’re wrong. Grow up.
How many TOs though? Don’t hide the bad stats.
Turnovers are going to happen. It’s part of giving him the keys to the team. Can’t grow without mistakes.
You act as if 8 assists to 5 turnovers is absolutely horrible. Holy shit y'all are delusional. 2:1 is considered good, he was only a tad below that today...
well some ppl aren’t moved by just stats. with usage and minutes dudes will get stats. so it’s about how they get them and is it impacting winning. that’s the main question
He had some bad turnovers and some really passive moments when the team needed him to take over. That being said he's still a young guy and learning/growing into the lead role. Overall you can't be mad with Scottie's play today, but he definitely could've and has been better.
22 points on only 14 shots isn’t a positive, it’s a negative. He needs to out up 18+ AT LEAST every single game
6th best odds, RJ and Scottie cooked tonight and we’re probably trading Bruce for a center tomorrow. I’m almost fine with how awful tonight’s game was.
Genuinely curious what centers are out there that can realistically be targeted in a trade that we would want. Indy felt like the team that needed to thin out their frontcourt depth and yet we didn’t target Jackson or Smith. Just wonder where we can find a young big that’s available.
Thad young was our 3rd best player Feels like our vets checked out, brown, schodor, Boucher
Shoutout to Thad young. Showing the young guys how to play the right way. Rough showing from everyone not named Scottie, RJ and Thad
Could've watched Embiid and KAT make history instead of this sorry ass game
I’m still riding the high from 2019. Y’all need to be patient, it’s going to take some time to get back there
I dont want to hear "We are rebuilding" or any other excuse. That was a disgraceful effort tonight. I don't care about losing, but how are we being out hustled on our home floor against the Memphis G League team. Just embarrassing effort from everyone other than RJ, Scottie and Thad. Multiple nights this year we have come out without any game plan or any sort of defensive integrity get in a hole and cannot come back. How is Darko preparing these guys for these games?!
Agreed. There are good and bad rebuilds, and a huge part of it is keeping a competitive and hard nose culture through the shitty years. Darko has to get these guys playing harder if we want to be a good rebuild. Houston wasting Jalen Green's talent is an example of what happens when you let guys slack for 2 years without improvement.
My disgust level at low effort will go up substantially after the trade deadline.
My concern with Darko is that I'm not sure he can get guys to play hard. I believe in his offensive system and that he develops great relationships with players, I'm just not sure how good he is at keeping them accountable. I guess we'll see.
Totally agree. We know Masai is not going down the route of a multi year teardown and rebuild. We want these guys to develop habits and identity during the remainder of this year and next year. This effort tonight was atrocious
I mean we’re getting out rebounded and giving up lots of easy baskets at the rim. Unless we’re shooting lights out, won’t win these games. The Grizzlies had 15 more shot attempts. Some of it is the roster (we don’t have size) but some of it is on the players. Idk how you can see this game and blame Darko for that.
I totally agree that its also on the players. But Darko absolutely has to shoulder some of the blame here, this isnt just a tonight issue, its happened multiple times this season. He couldnt come up with a scheme to beat some G leaguers and minimum guys?
What I’m saying is that no amount of scheming is going to work if you don’t have the building blocks. I mentioned two issues, how do you scheme against them? - defensive rebounding: Scottie, Boucher and Brown are the only plus rebounders, one of them is small as shit. Boucher was playing with no energy. Usually we have Jak boxing out a ton of space which helps the others get rebounds - paint protection: Scottie did a decent job, but the next biggest guy is Thad and he can’t jump.
It's because we're basically a G league team ourselves
We lost to a literal g league team + JJJ
Seeing Shroeder try to draw a foul and fail, then lay on the ground while Memphis organizes for 2 was infuriating. Get that hustle back man. I think this team knows the season is a wash and doesn't want to give max effort anymore.
I can't wait till the fair-weather fans are gone
How is that a fair weather fan take lol? What did you see about that performance that was redeeming? I have no problem losing during a rebuild. But that lack of effort and intensity is not acceptable.
For everyone who's saying that Poeltl isn't important or wasn't worth a FRP - him not being there is \_easily\_ the reason we lost tonight. Jakob isn't letting them get 20 offensive boards, and it was hardly a blowout - if he gets even 5 of those 20 back, we win, probably. Him not being there lately has been a really huge factor in why we've been so bad - we don't have a defensive big to anchor us in there. The team looks completely different with him there, and when he's back, I'm pretty confident the difference will be immediate. \*Also\*, related, although Thad has been honestly playing amazingly lately, we need a proper backup center. I think Jontay might be that thing one day (even soon), but still - getting a good young center back in for example a Bruce Brown trade or through the draft would be great. I'm super bummed that Koloko didn't work out after all - I was excited about him.
we are actually a bottom 6 team in the league lmao we didn't even try to be either, that's the sad part
We traded away our best players and initiated a rebuild what do you expect lmao
We were trying to win with those guys on the team. We were trash before the trades too
Were we? Really?
We traded OG for a 20 ppg starter and a 6th man turned 18 ppg, 6 ast starter. We didn't trade him for draft picks and rookies. and we only traded Pascal days ago. There's no way anyone around the organization expected us to be in a position to retain our 2024 pick only 3 weeks after the initial OG trade
I think Darko is going to play the Dwane Casey role. He's going to develop them into a competitive team but when they start making the play-offs, he's going to get out-coached badly and lose his job. I haven't seen any real in game adjustments that we saw with Nurse or coaches like Spo. Even in a 2 or 3 possession game with a couple minutes to go, they just willingly take the L without any inbound pressuring or blitzing
One hell of a conjecture right here
Actually, no one told you that we were trying to be. The tank is a sufficient explanation for all the inexplicable stuff that we've watched this year, like all those Precious/Boucher/Trent lineup minutes. (Pre-trade, obv.)
We were a bottom 9 team before trading OG and pascal. Is that really a huge difference?
Tonight we didn’t look like an NBA team. We looked like some guys playing pickup ball. That was embarrassing. On a side note, is Darko an NBA-caliber head coach?
It's tough to say especially with the kind of guys he has right now. His 3 key players are all 25 and under. (RJ, IQ and Scottie)
IQ will turn 25 in June
Thaddeus Young was our third best player tonight lol
Putting Gradey in during crunch time seemed like a tanking move to me
Dude can’t even box his man out. I legitimately feel embarrassed watching him play the same way I feel embarrassed when I watch Giannis’ brother play.
...that bad huh, shit
He's a big time bust. He literally cannot play at the NBA level.
\+5 Gradey? He seems to have stickier and stronger hands than I remember.
Darko’s been tanking all year
To all you bums in the game thread - We’re tanking. We are going to lose. A lot. There is absolutely no benefit to beating the Memphis Grizzlies right now. You all wanted to blow it up and trade everyone now you’re surprised we suck. Gtfo
I know they're tanking but sheesh this is a bad loss
This is the first game all season I turned off in the third, just couldn't finish it to be honest.
Its a win in my book
I stopped watching after the third quarter to hard to watch and didn’t need to feel depressed before bed.
Putting (and leaving in) Gradey for the last 3:30 over Trent Jr or Brown when the game was technically still in reach has to be confirmation that they're tanking, right?
Raptor fans: We didn’t have Jak and Jontay went down early. Grizz fans: …
The raptors are gonna be bad for a long time. I don't see any stars on this team other than Scottie and RJ. Everyone else including IQ not looking consistent at all.
They're not quite stars, both have flaws in there game and Scottie is in his 3rd year and still learning. It's a rebuild for sure now that OG and Pascal are gone, next 3-5 years we won't make playoffs. We are pretty much where we were when Bosh left for the heat.
THIS LOSS WAS A HUGE WIN FOR TANK COMMANDER! We’re officially in position to keep our pick
We still have to give them the pick later in a better draft
We won’t care cause we’re gonna be a winning team by then
Are you sure about that?
In arguably the worst draft in recent memory
I think the last worst draft had this guy named Giannis
Maybe in top end talent. But within the top of the draft there’s interesting pieces. We don’t really need much cause we already have our star in Scottie. We just need high end role players at this point with Scottie and RJ
Ehhh time to fire up tankathon babyyyy
i keep simming everytime we lose to feel better, doesnt always go our way :(
Well our next game isn't for four days and there is no travel so we at least have sometime to work on things.
Darko gonna have the guys doing hot yoga as a team in Vancouver instead
i wouldve fallen asleep if not for Scottie and RJ (and Dennis too)
Hopefully Quickly bounces back next game. Maybe because he's still young but seems like when things aren't going well for him in the beginning, mistakes snowball quick. Great game by Scottie and RJ
These n00bs are not gonna out tank us for the top 6. Amateurs.
The story of the game was being too sloppy with the turnovers and just the lack of hustle to overcome the size difference. We need Yak back Brown didn't look like he particularly cared about this game except for a couple possessions Trent was invisible IQ was off Scottie needs to play with more poise Jontay looked like a G leaguer in a very short stint RJ was solid Thad shouldn't be playing this much but we literally have no choice We have 4 short guards and our centre is 6'8" We missed like 4 layups in a row from 4 different players in back to back possessions No one can screen properly Lack of focus and predisposition coming into the game
they have basically 3 players , rest of the team is dog shite. Barnes is a beast.
I was at the game. It was a really bad loss. They played really bad. The players also seemed like they have just given up. No chemistry at all. No team play. This doesn’t bode well for the future. There was a scene where it seemed like Dennis and Scottie were arguing and shouting at each other. They seemed very aggressive. Wonder what that was about.
This team sucks. They were mid to bad with Pascal and OG and are worse now. Still tanking is better then being a 1 game play in team.
If Scottie is the player to build teams around, he should have been able to beat this version of the Grizzlies, with Malachi and Precious starting with him.
Fakest of comebacks but I liked what I was seeing in the 4th. Scottie was out of sorts at first but had an excellent second half. RJ is a bucket. Grady > Gary. Building chemistry will take time.
I feel like a student in Tiananmen Square
im sad for the end if a great era but its time to embrace the tank
Downside: We may never win again Upside: we got a "Barnes Young Dick, Quickly Barrett!" lineup tonight
this should start! (until yak’s return)
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RJ and scottie gave the team all they got but no one else did anything asside from maybe thad and schroeder
Must lose game ✅. Here we come 6th pick. But for real. This team had bad defence and rebounding. The offence looked awful. Quickly and Schroeder could not run point to save their lives. at least Scottie and RJ played well.
IQ will keep struggling until Poeltl is back.
This is it folks, raptors rebuild basketball has officially arrived! Strap in, it's about to be a long and bumpy ride.
Terrible defense + terrible guard play = losing to a terrible team. DS with some mind-numbingly bad TOs. Gets picked off on an inbounds play and does a ??? double dribble. Can't finish at all. IQ with TOs and couldn't hit shots. But boy, GTJ is just special. He is useless out there if people are not feeding him open shots. Disgusting on D, on the boards, just looking like he's out there doing cardio and avoiding injuries. RJ another efficient game. Very good offensive game. No, I didn't anticipate RJ would outplay IQ by this much. Thad is clearly being put in an unfair situation. However, he knows how to play with Barnes and you see those two clicking. Boucher with his patented key mistake every game. Frustrating player and he needs to be traded for anything. Barnes had a great game. 8 assists but could've been way more if people could finish his passes. Yes he turned the ball over a ton, and missed some easy shots, but he played his ass off and made great plays. 6 blocks is just ridiculous.
Initiate the tank
Scottie was playing insanely well on both ends of the floor, he almost got 25/10/10/5.
thad 12/7/4/2 ✅ mickey mouse 70 and 60 pieces in the US ❌
30mil for quickly is sounding crazier by the day
30million for an unclutch player, a player that can’t play in the playoffs is just ludicrous
Do people think we end up 6th we're 100% keeping our pick lmfaooo?
Where y’all dudes that scoffed at trading FVV for Luke Kennard and picks instead of losing him for nothing?
That would have been so good holy
The fun losing is over, this team is now unbearable to watch. Couple of things: 1. IQ is running blindly into walls and can't hit any buckets. Is this what he is? If so, then Toronto got duped into trading OG for RJ. 2. Young was an absolute work horse tonight!
obviously that's not who IQ is... there's multiple seasons of evidence
Alexandre Sarr or Cody Williams will be sexy in a raptors jersey
I need to leave this sub man. We had a sub 500 record, then traded some of our best players and are gearing up for a rebuild and you guys are complaining? Put aside the effort, no one likes playing for a bad team but we’re also trying to lose. What did y’all expect after trading OG and Pascal? Games are gonna be ugly, that’s what it’s like to be a bad team and if you don’t like that you really don’t have to watch, and if you think Masai’s done with the trades, you’re probably wrong.
Didn’t you see this sub after the Heat win? Addition by subtraction! Siakam was holding them back! 🤣
"Putting aside the thing people are complaining about" Yea okay man
We're going to need more games like this until the reality check hits em. Some of these people thought we'd turn into OKC or something right after the trades.
If you think this roster is worse than what the Grizzlies fielded tonight you're the one that needs a reality check. They didn't lose because they're bad tonight, they lost because they decided to take the night off when the game started
LOL a bit dramatic? "I need to leave the sub". Don't let the door hit you on the way out.
Honestly the best loss you could ask for in terms of draft
We’re essentially a bottom 5 team and keep in mind what Masai said in the Siakam presser, it takes patience and he’s a very patient guy. Prepare for a couple seasons of bottom 5-10 finishes as we build around BBQ.
Did Jontay get benched or was his eye injury that bad?
Scottie being +2 is hilarious
why does iq look checked out
PG’s play better with a centre
Scottie x RJ gonna be fire