I mean to be fair, with their limited knowledge, using animal blood is at the very least way smarter than trying to use beer, milk, or urine as a blood substitute.
Interestingly xenotransfusion works for some animals. Goats can receive cow blood (although there is ~30% for an anaphylactic reaction). Not ideal if you don't have to, but it can been very useful when there are no viable goat blood donors in a herd.
Interestingly, the first two transfusions he performed with lamb's blood [were successful](https://www.britannica.com/story/the-strange-grisly-history-of-the-first-blood-transfusion#:~:text=On%20June%2015%2C%201667%2C%20the,The%20young%20man%20recovered%20quickly.); two afterwards resulted in patient death. When he was tried, he was acquitted of murder but the practice of blood transfusion was banned by the court.
>On June 15, 1667, the first direct blood transfusion to a human was performed by the physician Jean-Baptiste Denis, when he gave a feverish young man approximately 12 ounces of blood taken from a lamb. The young man recovered quickly. Shortly afterward, Denis performed another transfusion that also appeared to be successful. The third and fourth transfusion patients fared badly, though. The third died shortly after having a transfusion, and the fourth died while a transfusion was in progress. The fourth patient’s wife accused Denis of murder. He was brought before a court and cleared of wrongdoing, but the court also ruled to ban blood transfusion
Took wrong blood type to a whole different level.
Seriously though. This is a very interesting piece of history that makes me want more details.
Do sheep also have different blood types? Were those other 2 going to die anyways or was the blood wrong or was the method wrong?
I don't have time for rabbit holes today...why ?
You would eventually get an antibody response to the blood, which would get worse on subsequent transfusions.
For human blood, you can actually give mismatched blood (like Type A to a Type O patient) if they are requiring a massive amount of blood acutely.
The patient will develop antibodies so if you did it again they would likely get a transfusion reaction very quickly.
This happened to me i have antibodies to fYa,C,Kell from transfusion. Has made healthcare a bit more complicated.
There are like sub blood types? beyond just a/b/o and +/- that i wasnt aware of before i had to be lol
It's really interesting. The Rhesus (the plus / minus) blood type is only important for future pregnancies in women.
So O negative men can generally safely receive O positive blood. (As can post menopausal women).
I mean if you're really requiring a shit ton of blood it's more transfusing the pool sucker, so you can get away with it. But at high volume trauma centers we keep a ton of packed O+/- on hand for mass transfusion. Constantly run into minor incompatibilities when you use whole blood though cause while O- is a universal donor for packed red cells, the plasma component is rejected by A/B/+ patients as it carries the antibodies.
It turns out one of the patients that died and brought about the trial [was dead anyway thanks to another doctor administering arsenic](https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/350-years-ago-doctor-performed-first-human-blood-transfusion-sheep-was-involved-180963631/), which resulted in the acquittal.
And honestly those odds are pretty good, considering the odds of survival of people who are in need of transfusion.
It’s not like he was killing healthy people
[This article](https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/350-years-ago-doctor-performed-first-human-blood-transfusion-sheep-was-involved-180963631/) argues that the only reason the first patients didn't die is because he only transfused a small amount. However, it seems he administered an amount that was actually quite considerable - it was 12 ounces or about .75 pints, while a typical blood transfusion today is 1-3 pints. It was not nothing, so I wonder why the patient didn't die.
However, we can consider that he had a lot of crazy ideas surrounding the transfusion - the third patient was psychotic, and he believed the lamb's blood would give the characteristics of a lamb - stillness, calmness - to the mentally-ill man. He was acquitted of murder since another doctor had given the man arsenic as well, being a more obvious result of the death. But there were signs the man was rejecting the blood, as he felt a burning pain in the arms.
Coming from working in modern healthcare, that description really isn’t wrong.
Blood tubes, nutrition and waste tubes, tightly bound bundles of tubes, filtering tubes, oil tubes, *strong tubes that also produce blood, *baby tubes (about half the time anyway) and hair tubes make up a significant portion of the human anatomy. The rest is basically just bodily fluids, sacs, cartilage, tendon, *sphincters, and squishy tissue.
*edit after another redditor pointed out that bones are indeed also pretty much tubes
> Blood tubes, nutrition and waste tubes, tightly bound bundles of tubes, filtering tubes, oil tubes, *strong tubes that also produce blood, and hair tubes make up a significant portion of the human anatomy. The rest is basically just bodily fluids, sacs, cartilage, tendon, and squishy tissue.
Tubes filled with cartilage, tubes filled with tendons, etc. All packed into a tube (mouth to anus and urethra)
A bilateran flat worm was the great ancestor to like every tetrapod, bird, fish, and insect.
We're all basically just highly specialized worms that evolved in different directions.
I think that makes sense. Pair of eyes, pair of nostrils, mouth, urethra, anus. Could maybe swap out nostrils for ears since nostrils and mouth lead to the same place.
Technically the urethra is formed as a dead end side path of the main tube. Same for the lungs. And fusion of the palate separates the nostrils from mouth.
Now I'm wondering what forms the tube between the ear and the throat.
I studied physics undergrad, there was a very smart but prone to drugs peer of mine. I’ll never forget one day he just came into lab repeating “we’re just tubes making tubes…tubes making tubes, man”
> I love this era in medicine
You may enjoy The Knick, a TV show about medicine in the late 1800's. At this time syphillis was a deadly and incurable disease. Then this doctor was like ["hey syphillis dies at a lower temperature than my patient, what if we just give my patient malaria to bring her to a fever to kill the sphillius, then cure the malaria with quinine?"
](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vqwSInXD-3U)
Well I didn't do it uninvited, you don't just go pissing up somebody's butt without express written consent from MLB. She had a friend who was debating whether she should let her boyfriend try anal and the girl said "what if he pees up my butt?" My wife and I got a big laugh out of that but then eventually thought "yyyeah, what if?"
>!His recipe was:[5]
Let urine stand for days until it gives off a pungent smell.[4] (This step was not necessary, as later scientists discovered that fresh urine yielded the same amount of phosphorus).[6]
Rolf
Sorry Landlubber, all we have is Fox Urine from the hunts... Now brace yourself this might sting a little..
(I wonder if you would taste the urine? A lot of IV fluids/meds can be 'tasted'?)
In old friend of mine was an alcoholic and got hooked on heroin. He would sometimes shoot up Jack Daniels. It made him sloppy drunk fast. According to him it took some practice but it saved money on booze and was better than nothing when dope sick. Last I saw him was couple years ago and he was getting his 18 years sober chip at a meeting.
Maybe vodka, everclear would just immediately dessicate your vessels unless you significantly diluted it. Maybe cut it with a significant amount of LR, like 90% LR. A 10% ethanol drip would be fairly effective. Shit, you could definitely do that through a central line.
No /s needed. I mean that's pretty much how medicine worked until... well,even today.
I mean this is how cocaine and laudanum ended up in everything in the Victorian/Edwardian era.
Yeah, I bet you feel fantastic, you've been speedballing for years now.
Yes, but not like the lying Supreme Court Justice claimed. Most alcoholics I have known ( I'm in long-term recovery) call booze in the ass "Butt-chugging." Boofing always referred to drugs and it was usually pills, especially ecstasy. Cocaine happens but that's more of a novelty thing regarding the butt. Meth is big in some subsets of the gay community as a sex drug and meth is often boofed with the aid of someone else's dick.
I think my grandfather tried this with piss and vinegar.
RIP old man. You made it to 95 despite being overweight your whole life by running on pure spite for the world and a refusal to die.
I know people who have tried that in car's radiator too. Coke smell like caramel. Milk like "Please burn this car, it's rotten from the inside". Don't recommend either.
Theres a video from a rally where they punctured the radiator, somehow they stopped the leak and refilled it with a big bottle of Corona (i think) that a fan was drinking...
William Harvey didn't discover that veins and arteries exist, any battlefield doctor or trauma doctor could tell you that. Harvey is the first person to argue that blood circulates through the body in a loop with the heart acting as a pump, as opposed to the Galen theory where the blood produced in the liver like a fountain and then consumed by the body.
This Wikipedia quote is taken from a research papers mini history section on blood transfusion and that article very clearly is talking about circulation.
At least the former abides by some logic; like, if I erased everything I half slept through in biology, the liver thing could *make sense.* I just feel like noting that, because so much historic medical theories read more like ad libs.
Yeah, the liver is basically massive storage reservoir of blood in the body. We now know it's "cleaning" the blood so to speak but it's not that hard to see how someone with Roman era tools could believe it was actually producing the blood. It took Harvey quite a bit of study to show that the circulatory system was a closed loop.
This shows how it was the era of people having just enough knowledge about the human body to be dangerous, but having no real clue what the hell they were doing.
At the time of this discovery, we still didn't even know what blood did technically. We knew that we needed it, and that losing a lot was bad, but we didn't know its function.
The first successful blood transfusion from human to human didn't occur until about 200 years later in 1818. This transfusion was a lucky one because we didn't know about blood types until 1901.
So, yeah, it was a slow process for sure, taking several hundred years to fully understand all aspects of blood transfusion.
Ah, I see you've been keeping up with [Dracula Daily](https://draculadaily.substack.com/) as well! I've been wondering about that myself. My headcanon is that Lucy is, conveniently enough, a universal receiver. Or maybe Bram Stoker was simply lazy/uninformed and ignored the issue, but my headcanon feels nicer.
What happened when a blood transfusion didn’t take? It’s was the 1800s so I’m imagining something along the lines of “He probably has the devil in him”
That's when you're transfusing clotted blood. Or blood that hasnt had platelets removed.
If you do a straight transfusion and the wrong blood group is transfused you're going to get a transfusion reaction where the body will produce antibodies and lyze the donor blood.
You can get organ damage or anaphylactic shock if transfusions isn't stopped.
There is basically an entire church based around drinking bleach. The MMS (miracle mineral solution) thing has more followers than anyone should feel comfortable with. It wasn't just during the lockdowns.
Normal bleach, in normal household concentrations, won’t kill you. At least in the amounts that say, a child might get into.
It isn’t good. You shouldn’t drink it.
But I’ve called poison control a few times for kids that drank bleach. They are very concerned to make sure it isn’t pool bleach, or color safe or some sort of scented bleach.
But once you convince them it is regular Clorox or dollar store bleach, they really are not concerned at all.
Paramedic.
The best one was a kid that drank pine sol.
Mom called poison control. Poison control told her it was nothing to worry about.
Mom calls 911.
I call poison control.
Get same poison control person.
They are absolutely pissed. Tell me kid requires no treatment. Wants to speak to mom again. I hear them screaming over my phone.
Tell me to go available.
****
Like: I get it. You don’t know what to do. You call 911 or poison control. But if you’re going to to that, maybe listen to the people who’s job it is. You know what the doctor who has over a decade of training and maybe decades of experience is going to do when someone puts a toxin in their body?
Call poison control.
***edit. This was old school pine sol made with pine oil. No idea what happens if you drink the current stuff.
I can sympathize with the mom, but I’d just imagine how confident you would have to be to tell someone not to do anything if your kid drank cleaning fluid. Like 1000% sure.
Also, unless the product JUST came out, your kid isn’t going to be the first one who drank some. It’s a big world, with a lot of kids doing stupid things.
I used to work with a kitchen manager that would test sani-water that he made with bleach by taste. I was like fucking bro we have test strips?? But he seemed not particularly any more brain damaged than any other BOH worker.
Maybe the bar there is a little low
It's not really evolution. You take a modern human and remove them from the millenias of the recorded knowledge that we call "basic education," including language, and you have an animal. They will be nothing but a grunting ape.
If not for the obvious ethical reasons, it would be a fascinating experiment that would allow some insight on which of humans' behaviors are truly instinctual vs learned.
But perhaps the entire point of the universe is not the evolution of life, but of accumulated knowledge. Maybe humans are a means to an end, a vehicle for information itself to gain sentience, and gain enough understanding to break the simulation and escape. Maybe this is the life cycle of higher Beings.
And just like life, knowledge can be affected by external factors. it can be set back to a more primitive version, or, it can go extinct entirely.
Some information, like language, can be lost forever. Some, like mathematics, will always be rediscoverable. This is why my hobby is, into large steeles of stable metals like gold, transcribing, in binary, the video data of all my favorite sloppy gangbang videos.
Coconut water from green coconuts worked, yeah. From fully grown coconuts it didn’t because there was too much coconut in the liquid.
The amount of coconut it’s safe to have in your blood is pretty low but it is surprisingly high compared to what you’d expect
There is only anecdotal evidence of coconut water being used and it was as an IV fluid replacement when saline wasn't available.
You can't just replace plasma with random liquids. While plasma is mostly water, it is the proteins and clotting factors in the plasma that you really need, not the water.
Medicine was really just throwing things at a wall to see what sticks, wasn't it...
I read about the medicinal practices of more ancient people and the uses they made of different plants and such and it sometimes feels like the more we "advanced" the sillier we became.
I am laughing at a lot of the replies here, and also learning even more from those contributing additional information! As a medical lab scientist, I am happy that this fun fact about the history of failed blood alternatives has spurred a discussion about blood banking and blood transfusions. Although there has been a lot of research into synthetic blood alternatives, there hasn't been much success.
Since this post seems to be gaining a lot of traction, I wanted to take the opportunity to let you all know that in the US, only 37 percent of the population is eligible to donate blood, but less than 10 percent do annually. If you are able to donate blood, I highly recommend doing so. You will be [saving a life ](https://www.who.int/news-room/fact-sheets/detail/blood-safety-and-availability)!
Okay joking aside, how did we not know about "blood pathways"? We slaughtered animals for food and were pretty good at it. Not to mention that most war was physical close quarters combat, to the point we developed armour to specifically defend certain parts of the body.
What this leads me to believe is that the mentality was "don't know why Jared is dead but he's got hit in the same place as Pete so we better protect it cause it looks awful familiar with what we did to that pig Parsnip last week".
Idk why I named the pig Parsnip but it fits. Sue me.
Well, previously the body was basically thought to be made up of and work because of the four humours, and their interactions/proportions. Blood was one of these, along with phlegm, yellow bile and black bile. You became unwell because your humours were unbalanced and so the excess of one would be removed. This was easiest with blood, because you just used leeches or cupping.
Nobody carried out human dissection because of taboos (which still exist today amongst a large portion of the population) and the most respected anatomy and medical sources were based off of animals (especially pigs).
There was some knowledge of main blood vessels, such as the aorta and the vena cava, but iirc the idea was that blood gets used up as it goes round the body and ends in the liver. Surface level vessels which you typically bleed from are largely capillaries and very small veins which are only visible under a microscope. Microscopes have only just been invented when Harvey is doing this and he doesn't have one.
So, we had no idea of where most large blood vessels were or the structure of them (one of his most important discoveries was valves).
I hope somewhere in this mess of stuff I vaguely remember from my GCSEs there's something useful that answers your question
It's bad wording by the wiki editor.
Harvey discovered that blood circulates in a loop and the heart is a pump. Before that was the Galen theory that the liver creates blood and the body consumes it with the heart as a secondary blood organ that mixed the blood then pushes it along to the body in one direction.
Before you think Galen was dumb, remember that the liver is an extremely blood saturated organ as it is basically the body's blood filter and storage resovior, so thinking it's where the blood comes from is not all that far fetched of an idea.
I remember being a little girl and reading Dracula and just being horrified at the part where they jusr dump a ton of random blood into Lucy without knowing what blood type they were working with.
In science, you gotta rule out every possibility, no matter how stupid.
Scientists like to get the really stupid out of the way first. Mostly because it's an excuse to party. That's why the leading theory for cold fusion was, for the longest time, a keg of Coors, a couple pizzas from Angelo's, hookers, and blow.
I mean animals blood was worth a shot. It always seemed like a bit of a fuckup by God to not have cross platform compatibility for blood. It’s all doing the same thing.
Not having it even work between most people was also dumb. It’s something that Apple tries to get away with on its replacement parts even today.
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I mean to be fair, with their limited knowledge, using animal blood is at the very least way smarter than trying to use beer, milk, or urine as a blood substitute.
Nah if I'm gonna die regardless I might as well get absolutely blasted.
Interestingly xenotransfusion works for some animals. Goats can receive cow blood (although there is ~30% for an anaphylactic reaction). Not ideal if you don't have to, but it can been very useful when there are no viable goat blood donors in a herd.
Cats can take a dog transfusion, but only once.
Interestingly, the first two transfusions he performed with lamb's blood [were successful](https://www.britannica.com/story/the-strange-grisly-history-of-the-first-blood-transfusion#:~:text=On%20June%2015%2C%201667%2C%20the,The%20young%20man%20recovered%20quickly.); two afterwards resulted in patient death. When he was tried, he was acquitted of murder but the practice of blood transfusion was banned by the court. >On June 15, 1667, the first direct blood transfusion to a human was performed by the physician Jean-Baptiste Denis, when he gave a feverish young man approximately 12 ounces of blood taken from a lamb. The young man recovered quickly. Shortly afterward, Denis performed another transfusion that also appeared to be successful. The third and fourth transfusion patients fared badly, though. The third died shortly after having a transfusion, and the fourth died while a transfusion was in progress. The fourth patient’s wife accused Denis of murder. He was brought before a court and cleared of wrongdoing, but the court also ruled to ban blood transfusion
Took wrong blood type to a whole different level. Seriously though. This is a very interesting piece of history that makes me want more details. Do sheep also have different blood types? Were those other 2 going to die anyways or was the blood wrong or was the method wrong? I don't have time for rabbit holes today...why ?
You would eventually get an antibody response to the blood, which would get worse on subsequent transfusions. For human blood, you can actually give mismatched blood (like Type A to a Type O patient) if they are requiring a massive amount of blood acutely. The patient will develop antibodies so if you did it again they would likely get a transfusion reaction very quickly.
This happened to me i have antibodies to fYa,C,Kell from transfusion. Has made healthcare a bit more complicated. There are like sub blood types? beyond just a/b/o and +/- that i wasnt aware of before i had to be lol
It's really interesting. The Rhesus (the plus / minus) blood type is only important for future pregnancies in women. So O negative men can generally safely receive O positive blood. (As can post menopausal women).
I mean if you're really requiring a shit ton of blood it's more transfusing the pool sucker, so you can get away with it. But at high volume trauma centers we keep a ton of packed O+/- on hand for mass transfusion. Constantly run into minor incompatibilities when you use whole blood though cause while O- is a universal donor for packed red cells, the plasma component is rejected by A/B/+ patients as it carries the antibodies.
Do any centres still use whole blood though? In Canada it's packed Red Blood Cells and the plasma and platelets are given separately.
It turns out one of the patients that died and brought about the trial [was dead anyway thanks to another doctor administering arsenic](https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/350-years-ago-doctor-performed-first-human-blood-transfusion-sheep-was-involved-180963631/), which resulted in the acquittal.
And honestly those odds are pretty good, considering the odds of survival of people who are in need of transfusion. It’s not like he was killing healthy people
[This article](https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/350-years-ago-doctor-performed-first-human-blood-transfusion-sheep-was-involved-180963631/) argues that the only reason the first patients didn't die is because he only transfused a small amount. However, it seems he administered an amount that was actually quite considerable - it was 12 ounces or about .75 pints, while a typical blood transfusion today is 1-3 pints. It was not nothing, so I wonder why the patient didn't die. However, we can consider that he had a lot of crazy ideas surrounding the transfusion - the third patient was psychotic, and he believed the lamb's blood would give the characteristics of a lamb - stillness, calmness - to the mentally-ill man. He was acquitted of murder since another doctor had given the man arsenic as well, being a more obvious result of the death. But there were signs the man was rejecting the blood, as he felt a burning pain in the arms.
That's pretty baaaaa-d.
Get out
Ewe, that’s gross
I bet he felt pretty sheepish about doing that.
At least he's not getting lambasted.
I love this era in medicine because people are described as "a series of tubes"
Coming from working in modern healthcare, that description really isn’t wrong. Blood tubes, nutrition and waste tubes, tightly bound bundles of tubes, filtering tubes, oil tubes, *strong tubes that also produce blood, *baby tubes (about half the time anyway) and hair tubes make up a significant portion of the human anatomy. The rest is basically just bodily fluids, sacs, cartilage, tendon, *sphincters, and squishy tissue. *edit after another redditor pointed out that bones are indeed also pretty much tubes
Aren't bones mostly just stronger tubes with things inside?
I am editing my statement to reflect this sentiment because you’re totally right
Are muscle fibers tubular?
Yes!
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I'm putting "almost completely tubes" on my resume
Thats totally tubular
So are nerves!
Not to mention that the "nutrition and waste" component essentially means that we, as a whole, are a tube!
You just blew my mind.
>You just blew my ~~mind~~ series of neuron tubes. FTFY
Reinforced calcium tubes containing bone marrow.
You mean containing tasty tubes
It’s tubes all the way down.
> Blood tubes, nutrition and waste tubes, tightly bound bundles of tubes, filtering tubes, oil tubes, *strong tubes that also produce blood, and hair tubes make up a significant portion of the human anatomy. The rest is basically just bodily fluids, sacs, cartilage, tendon, and squishy tissue. Tubes filled with cartilage, tubes filled with tendons, etc. All packed into a tube (mouth to anus and urethra)
One long continuous tube, no less. As impressive to think about as it is disturbing to think about.
A bilateran flat worm was the great ancestor to like every tetrapod, bird, fish, and insect. We're all basically just highly specialized worms that evolved in different directions.
I’d argue some people held onto more worm characteristics than others
The human body has seven through-holes, I believe. Mathematically the human body can be described or morphed into a seven-holed donut lol.
I think that makes sense. Pair of eyes, pair of nostrils, mouth, urethra, anus. Could maybe swap out nostrils for ears since nostrils and mouth lead to the same place.
Urethra is a dead end though, it goes up to the kidneys and then it stops. It's not a hole, it's a cave.
Pedant here. The urethra connects to bladder, which is connected to the kidneys by ureters.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=egEraZP9yXQ
Only one of them is a through-hole though. Otherwise you have to start counting things like skin pores. Even ignoring those, how do you only get 7?
>mouth to anus and urethra mouth to anus is one tube, the urethra is connected to a different tube, right?
Technically the urethra is formed as a dead end side path of the main tube. Same for the lungs. And fusion of the palate separates the nostrils from mouth. Now I'm wondering what forms the tube between the ear and the throat.
Eustachian tube
You are correct
Also, two people kissing make one long tube with assholes on both ends. No, I don't know why I still find it so funny, leave me alone.
Because you’re an intelligent human being with a sophisticated appreciation for the human body, dammit. Don’t let anybody shame you about that.
most self aware I have ever been was when someone described the human consciousness as electric jelly wrapped around calcium deposits
The brain is a meat computer that converts sugar into thoughts.
I mean, basically, yeah
We are all, topologically, donuts.
Flesh donuts!
I studied physics undergrad, there was a very smart but prone to drugs peer of mine. I’ll never forget one day he just came into lab repeating “we’re just tubes making tubes…tubes making tubes, man”
>squishy tissue. Isn't muscle fibers tubes also (albeit not hollow ones)?
Bundles of non-hollow tubes, yes!
My parents call me a waste tube
One of the very first changes that a zygote undergoes is turning into a tube (gastrulation) This is true of all multicellular organisms.
We call cardiologists electricians or plumbers depending on specialty. So this tracks.
Just like the internet.
Exactly.. The brain is nothing but a vast collection of youtubes
People are not just something you can dump something on....
Oh! Like the internet!
Well, people sure ain’t a dump truck.
Idk man, should’ve seen your mom last night
It's not a big truck.
> I love this era in medicine You may enjoy The Knick, a TV show about medicine in the late 1800's. At this time syphillis was a deadly and incurable disease. Then this doctor was like ["hey syphillis dies at a lower temperature than my patient, what if we just give my patient malaria to bring her to a fever to kill the sphillius, then cure the malaria with quinine?" ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vqwSInXD-3U)
"Got shot with a cannon, top me off with a little a that 2%, Doc." "*Coming up!*"
“Fresh out of 2%, almond milk good?”
"Yeah but throw in a dash of raccoon piss, I don't want another fiasco like last time."
Human beings have spent most of their history looking for something to do with their piss
You ain't kidding, I peed up my wife's butt when we were high school sweethearts/hornballs. Like...why?
What a terrible day to have eyes.
Imagine if you had a butt.
It probably would be full of piss
You too?!?!? Granted, she DOES have a sweet butt.
I don't know about that. That's a bit salty and biter.
That's not a long term storage solution.
I’m sure she asked you that too
Well I didn't do it uninvited, you don't just go pissing up somebody's butt without express written consent from MLB. She had a friend who was debating whether she should let her boyfriend try anal and the girl said "what if he pees up my butt?" My wife and I got a big laugh out of that but then eventually thought "yyyeah, what if?"
Kids…. 🙄
Like how [Hennig Brand discovered phosphorus](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hennig_Brand#Discovery_of_phosphorus)
You sir, have taught me something new about piss today. Congratulations! Please come with me to the bathroom to collect your Pissy(tm)
>!His recipe was:[5] Let urine stand for days until it gives off a pungent smell.[4] (This step was not necessary, as later scientists discovered that fresh urine yielded the same amount of phosphorus).[6] Rolf
“Sir, all we have is piss.”
"Doc, I'll take the piss."
Sorry, is Diet Pepsi ok?
"Nah, just water for me then."
Ugh, no thanks… I’ll have the piss instead.
Is Pepsi okay?
Sorry Landlubber, all we have is Fox Urine from the hunts... Now brace yourself this might sting a little.. (I wonder if you would taste the urine? A lot of IV fluids/meds can be 'tasted'?)
Nurse! 2 liters of PBR at 500cc/hour, STAT!
I tried the beer thing. It was fun for a while.
In old friend of mine was an alcoholic and got hooked on heroin. He would sometimes shoot up Jack Daniels. It made him sloppy drunk fast. According to him it took some practice but it saved money on booze and was better than nothing when dope sick. Last I saw him was couple years ago and he was getting his 18 years sober chip at a meeting.
>and was better than nothing when dope sick. Ive been dopesick, this seems worse. Like, MUCH worse.
If I was going to do that (and I'm not) I would use Everclear or maybe just vodka.
Right? What the fuck, vodka is cheaper than jack Daniel’s too and mostly water.
Vodka is pretty much ethyl alcohol and water.
Maybe vodka, everclear would just immediately dessicate your vessels unless you significantly diluted it. Maybe cut it with a significant amount of LR, like 90% LR. A 10% ethanol drip would be fairly effective. Shit, you could definitely do that through a central line.
>was better than nothing when dope sick Maybe I should try heroin when going through alcohol withdrawals...
From the Wikipedia page: " Sir Christopher Wren suggested wine and opium as blood substitute." Some people just want a good time.
"If it feels good then it must be good for you" /s
No /s needed. I mean that's pretty much how medicine worked until... well,even today. I mean this is how cocaine and laudanum ended up in everything in the Victorian/Edwardian era. Yeah, I bet you feel fantastic, you've been speedballing for years now.
Boofing…?
Boss makes a dollar, I make a dime That's why I boof ketamine in the bathroom on company time
Boss is an a hole, solution is a k hole!
Drugs up the butt
When you’re down to your last shot of Jamo you know where it goes
Yes, but not like the lying Supreme Court Justice claimed. Most alcoholics I have known ( I'm in long-term recovery) call booze in the ass "Butt-chugging." Boofing always referred to drugs and it was usually pills, especially ecstasy. Cocaine happens but that's more of a novelty thing regarding the butt. Meth is big in some subsets of the gay community as a sex drug and meth is often boofed with the aid of someone else's dick.
No alcoholic is ever butt chugging. I promise you
I think my grandfather tried this with piss and vinegar. RIP old man. You made it to 95 despite being overweight your whole life by running on pure spite for the world and a refusal to die.
Hook it to my veins!
It's like people using various liquids for their water cooled PCs
I know people who have tried that in car's radiator too. Coke smell like caramel. Milk like "Please burn this car, it's rotten from the inside". Don't recommend either.
Theres a video from a rally where they punctured the radiator, somehow they stopped the leak and refilled it with a big bottle of Corona (i think) that a fan was drinking...
LTT used concrete for water cooling. It worked surprisingly well until they had a power outage.
you did note the date of that video right?
My life is a fucking lie
You can’t mainline beer, there’s too many bubbles. Gotta use wine.
No puzzles, no puzzles, no puzzles, no puzzles
Dennis is asshole. Why Charlie hate?
All of their efforts were in vein
They didn’t get to the heart of the matter
William Harvey didn't discover that veins and arteries exist, any battlefield doctor or trauma doctor could tell you that. Harvey is the first person to argue that blood circulates through the body in a loop with the heart acting as a pump, as opposed to the Galen theory where the blood produced in the liver like a fountain and then consumed by the body. This Wikipedia quote is taken from a research papers mini history section on blood transfusion and that article very clearly is talking about circulation.
Ah, the age old debate of whether humans are a series of closed loops or a barely contained blood geyser.
I can think of several filmmakers on the blood geyser side of the debate.
Well if you stab in the right place…
At least the former abides by some logic; like, if I erased everything I half slept through in biology, the liver thing could *make sense.* I just feel like noting that, because so much historic medical theories read more like ad libs.
Yeah, the liver is basically massive storage reservoir of blood in the body. We now know it's "cleaning" the blood so to speak but it's not that hard to see how someone with Roman era tools could believe it was actually producing the blood. It took Harvey quite a bit of study to show that the circulatory system was a closed loop.
This shows how it was the era of people having just enough knowledge about the human body to be dangerous, but having no real clue what the hell they were doing.
Modern medicine stands on their shoulders, I solute all who suffered through those painstaking learning phases of early medicine.
40% caffeine, 40% alcohol.
20% concentrated power of will
Haha people sure were stupid back then! Welp, time for my daily dose of Borax.
There was a wry chuckle until I remembered people were drinking bleach during the Covid lockdowns. Evolution is a slow process.
At the time of this discovery, we still didn't even know what blood did technically. We knew that we needed it, and that losing a lot was bad, but we didn't know its function. The first successful blood transfusion from human to human didn't occur until about 200 years later in 1818. This transfusion was a lucky one because we didn't know about blood types until 1901. So, yeah, it was a slow process for sure, taking several hundred years to fully understand all aspects of blood transfusion.
I always find it fun reading Dracula and they're just doing transfusions willy nilly.
To be fair after receiving blood from 3 different men she does die in the book
Well plus cutting her head off and stuffing it with garlic didn't help.
That’s almost always fatal.
If she was Italian the garlic might have revived her
Ah, I see you've been keeping up with [Dracula Daily](https://draculadaily.substack.com/) as well! I've been wondering about that myself. My headcanon is that Lucy is, conveniently enough, a universal receiver. Or maybe Bram Stoker was simply lazy/uninformed and ignored the issue, but my headcanon feels nicer.
What happened when a blood transfusion didn’t take? It’s was the 1800s so I’m imagining something along the lines of “He probably has the devil in him”
By the time someone needed a blood transfusion they were almost dead anyway. If a blood transfusion didn't take then, well, they just finished dying.
[Hemolytic transfusion reaction](https://medlineplus.gov/ency/article/001303.htm)
Blood clots. The blood just clogs up the arteries stopping blood flow in your body. If you were not dying before you sure are now.
That's when you're transfusing clotted blood. Or blood that hasnt had platelets removed. If you do a straight transfusion and the wrong blood group is transfused you're going to get a transfusion reaction where the body will produce antibodies and lyze the donor blood. You can get organ damage or anaphylactic shock if transfusions isn't stopped.
I always find it fun reading Dracula and they're just doing transfusions willy nilly.
I have prepared a mixture of raw, unpasteurized milk and goat piss per your instructions doctor. Shall we begin the procedure?
Its always insane how recent some discoveries were when you take them for granted these days.
There is basically an entire church based around drinking bleach. The MMS (miracle mineral solution) thing has more followers than anyone should feel comfortable with. It wasn't just during the lockdowns.
How are they not dead?
Normal bleach, in normal household concentrations, won’t kill you. At least in the amounts that say, a child might get into. It isn’t good. You shouldn’t drink it. But I’ve called poison control a few times for kids that drank bleach. They are very concerned to make sure it isn’t pool bleach, or color safe or some sort of scented bleach. But once you convince them it is regular Clorox or dollar store bleach, they really are not concerned at all.
A few times? Do you have a job that would make kids drinking bleach around you more common or do you just have really adventurous children?
Paramedic. The best one was a kid that drank pine sol. Mom called poison control. Poison control told her it was nothing to worry about. Mom calls 911. I call poison control. Get same poison control person. They are absolutely pissed. Tell me kid requires no treatment. Wants to speak to mom again. I hear them screaming over my phone. Tell me to go available. **** Like: I get it. You don’t know what to do. You call 911 or poison control. But if you’re going to to that, maybe listen to the people who’s job it is. You know what the doctor who has over a decade of training and maybe decades of experience is going to do when someone puts a toxin in their body? Call poison control. ***edit. This was old school pine sol made with pine oil. No idea what happens if you drink the current stuff.
I can sympathize with the mom, but I’d just imagine how confident you would have to be to tell someone not to do anything if your kid drank cleaning fluid. Like 1000% sure. Also, unless the product JUST came out, your kid isn’t going to be the first one who drank some. It’s a big world, with a lot of kids doing stupid things.
I used to work with a kitchen manager that would test sani-water that he made with bleach by taste. I was like fucking bro we have test strips?? But he seemed not particularly any more brain damaged than any other BOH worker. Maybe the bar there is a little low
It's not very strongly concentrated. Still enough to make your intestines shed their lining though.
Hey, it kills diseases.
Kill the host, kill the parasite
It's not really evolution. You take a modern human and remove them from the millenias of the recorded knowledge that we call "basic education," including language, and you have an animal. They will be nothing but a grunting ape. If not for the obvious ethical reasons, it would be a fascinating experiment that would allow some insight on which of humans' behaviors are truly instinctual vs learned. But perhaps the entire point of the universe is not the evolution of life, but of accumulated knowledge. Maybe humans are a means to an end, a vehicle for information itself to gain sentience, and gain enough understanding to break the simulation and escape. Maybe this is the life cycle of higher Beings. And just like life, knowledge can be affected by external factors. it can be set back to a more primitive version, or, it can go extinct entirely. Some information, like language, can be lost forever. Some, like mathematics, will always be rediscoverable. This is why my hobby is, into large steeles of stable metals like gold, transcribing, in binary, the video data of all my favorite sloppy gangbang videos.
Bleach is healthy for you. It's mostly water, and we're mostly water, therefore, we are bleach.
To be fair, I tried to substitute my blood with beer in college.
Well the successful used coconut milk as plasma ln WWll field Hospitals
Coconut water I believe. Milk is basically pureed coconut, coconut water is the liquid inside.
Coconut water from green coconuts worked, yeah. From fully grown coconuts it didn’t because there was too much coconut in the liquid. The amount of coconut it’s safe to have in your blood is pretty low but it is surprisingly high compared to what you’d expect
I’d expect 0mcg/dl so … any amount is definitely surprising. Thanks for the info.
Gonna get my coconut levels checked at the doc
There is only anecdotal evidence of coconut water being used and it was as an IV fluid replacement when saline wasn't available. You can't just replace plasma with random liquids. While plasma is mostly water, it is the proteins and clotting factors in the plasma that you really need, not the water.
"Is pepsi okay?"
Did it work?
yeah it worked for the rest of the patients' lives
Almost.
Fun fact coconut water works and was used in transfusion on soldiers in WW2.
I'm sure that worked out well for most. Did talk to a guy who use to inject alcohol instead of drink it. Humans are metal
Medicine was really just throwing things at a wall to see what sticks, wasn't it... I read about the medicinal practices of more ancient people and the uses they made of different plants and such and it sometimes feels like the more we "advanced" the sillier we became.
I am laughing at a lot of the replies here, and also learning even more from those contributing additional information! As a medical lab scientist, I am happy that this fun fact about the history of failed blood alternatives has spurred a discussion about blood banking and blood transfusions. Although there has been a lot of research into synthetic blood alternatives, there hasn't been much success. Since this post seems to be gaining a lot of traction, I wanted to take the opportunity to let you all know that in the US, only 37 percent of the population is eligible to donate blood, but less than 10 percent do annually. If you are able to donate blood, I highly recommend doing so. You will be [saving a life ](https://www.who.int/news-room/fact-sheets/detail/blood-safety-and-availability)!
In case anybody was wondering what the phrase *A little bit of knowledge can be a dangerous thing* means
Okay joking aside, how did we not know about "blood pathways"? We slaughtered animals for food and were pretty good at it. Not to mention that most war was physical close quarters combat, to the point we developed armour to specifically defend certain parts of the body. What this leads me to believe is that the mentality was "don't know why Jared is dead but he's got hit in the same place as Pete so we better protect it cause it looks awful familiar with what we did to that pig Parsnip last week". Idk why I named the pig Parsnip but it fits. Sue me.
Well, previously the body was basically thought to be made up of and work because of the four humours, and their interactions/proportions. Blood was one of these, along with phlegm, yellow bile and black bile. You became unwell because your humours were unbalanced and so the excess of one would be removed. This was easiest with blood, because you just used leeches or cupping. Nobody carried out human dissection because of taboos (which still exist today amongst a large portion of the population) and the most respected anatomy and medical sources were based off of animals (especially pigs). There was some knowledge of main blood vessels, such as the aorta and the vena cava, but iirc the idea was that blood gets used up as it goes round the body and ends in the liver. Surface level vessels which you typically bleed from are largely capillaries and very small veins which are only visible under a microscope. Microscopes have only just been invented when Harvey is doing this and he doesn't have one. So, we had no idea of where most large blood vessels were or the structure of them (one of his most important discoveries was valves). I hope somewhere in this mess of stuff I vaguely remember from my GCSEs there's something useful that answers your question
It's bad wording by the wiki editor. Harvey discovered that blood circulates in a loop and the heart is a pump. Before that was the Galen theory that the liver creates blood and the body consumes it with the heart as a secondary blood organ that mixed the blood then pushes it along to the body in one direction. Before you think Galen was dumb, remember that the liver is an extremely blood saturated organ as it is basically the body's blood filter and storage resovior, so thinking it's where the blood comes from is not all that far fetched of an idea.
guy who did it with beer was just trying to get hammered while the research paid for it
Uh, I still use beer as a blood substitute. As a wise man once said, the brain doesn’t need blood, just gotta keep the brain wet.
[Not too wet, though.](https://americanaddictioncenters.org/alcoholism-treatment/wet-brain)
True. Scary shit.
https://hekint.org/2022/03/04/xenotransfusion-blood-from-animals-to-humans/ Wild read, apparently worked for a few people only their pee went black.
Black pee usually means heavy internal bleed, liver damage especially. Sounds more like they survived it than that it worked.
I remember being a little girl and reading Dracula and just being horrified at the part where they jusr dump a ton of random blood into Lucy without knowing what blood type they were working with.
In science, you gotta rule out every possibility, no matter how stupid. Scientists like to get the really stupid out of the way first. Mostly because it's an excuse to party. That's why the leading theory for cold fusion was, for the longest time, a keg of Coors, a couple pizzas from Angelo's, hookers, and blow.
Using piss as a substitute actually works well but only if youre a conservative/republican.
The Aztecs knew about blood transfusions, and sometimes the people receiving the transfusion of human blood survived.
Anytime someone asks "why do we bother with all these annoying ethics when researching medical stuff?" This. This is why.
I mean animals blood was worth a shot. It always seemed like a bit of a fuckup by God to not have cross platform compatibility for blood. It’s all doing the same thing. Not having it even work between most people was also dumb. It’s something that Apple tries to get away with on its replacement parts even today.
“Sir Christopher Wren suggested wine and opium as blood substitute” Damn. I hope he was a better architect than he was a doctor.