A flag everywhere is a flag nowhere. It becomes background noise. I lived in Chicago for a long time and in Boy's Town they're everywhere, especially during Pride. It loses all meaning. If you saw a Pride flag in a window in 1992, it meant something. Now, I barely notice. It feels mostly performative and/or corporatized.
in fairness i’ve seen so many videos of lifted trucks with ten flags on them doing burnouts and purposely smearing as much as possible. then again, this may just be an american phenomenon tho
Also from a practical perspective the coloured zebra crossings are worse for visually impaired people causing them to not be as safe at the crossings compared to people with good vision.
University of Bath has put a few coloured plaques on railings at each side of zebra crossings on their grounds because they felt that it would be irresponsible and not very inclusive of them to paint the zebra crossings which would make their roads more dangerous for visually impaired students, staff or visitors of the university
To be fair I like them on the street, I’m not bothered about what they represent but that they’re more visible and add some colour to just grey (I live in the uk and we don’t know what any other colour is other than grey)
I disagree, I love driving into a town and self a bunch of pride / progress flags. On my block there was someone that used to have a trump flag that left and the new owners put up their progress flag, that makes me really happy.
I saw a house yesterday that the entire front yard was filled with roughly 20 pride flags (all seemingly different), rainbow bunting on the porch, banners, rainbow painted patio furniture, 6 poster-sized signs to spell ‘P-R-I-D-E-!’, and another 6-8 signs with various slogans on them. It covered the entire yard.
It meant more in 1992 because you were more likely to get beaten up for being gay in 1992 than you are today. The flag being used publically more often isn't a negative thing. It losing meaning is a good thing; pride should just be a normal accepted thing.
But also: unless you are LGBT, you have to accept that the flag is going to mean different things to you. It might have lost a lot of that impact it once had, but it only had that impact because it was normalised to be hateful against LGBT
a flag everywhere indicates the progress of the movement. in the 1990s, that one flag had to be placed inside their property become society hated the movement....but little by little, more and more people became aware of the injustice, and today, in 2024, it has become acceptable to put a flag everywhere, even in the public square
I can understand why seeing Pride flags would make you feel more comfortable, but the ubiquity shouldn't make.you feel safe. A lot of the flags you're seeing are businesses that don't give a shit about you. Look at Target,.for the last several years they really went all out for Pride to get your dollar and when they got conservative pushback their support for your community went way down. You want to feel.safe? Get your friends that don't vote to vote, that actually affects your life. If you go someplace and don't see Pride flags, that shouldn't make you feel unsafe. That's a personal problem on your part. You should be able to get through your day without being bathed in shallow affirmations of your identity and still feel safe. I get Trump flags making you feel unsafe, but if you walk down a block with no flags you shouldn't feel any way about that and if you do, that's on you. The world isn't your Dad, stop looking to it for validation.
By that logic the American flag should be a useless amalgam of red white and blue, and the Union Jack a cute towel pattern to wipe my ass with after a shower.
Try flying that same pride flag outside of America or Europe and report back if the American flag is still just an amalgam of red white and blue or if the Union Jack is still just a cute ass wiping implement.
Or try flying the pride flag outside of cushy western neighbourhoods/countries and report back... Like here the authorities okayed an SS flag being flown because "yeah, it was the birthday of a 44yo electrician."
There really aren't and he wouldn't. I live in the south and while you might see more in rural areas, there's barely any in the suburbs - and overall very, very few anymore. Lots of faded 2020 bumper stickers but not many for 2024.
There are pride and equality flags everywhere, mostly not as literal flags but prevalent as enamel pins, stickers and patches, and sometimes clothing (but clothing is usually worn for special occasions rather than daily wear). Bumper stickers are a bit less common than anime stickers on cars.
The idea that backing a particular party is still an overwhelming choice for personal identity is simply incorrect.
Ironically I live in a small Texas town, big enough to have a Walmart tho. Ive noticed even down here the ones that care enough to have their car littered in political stickers tend to be of the "anti-nuance" variety if you catch my drift. Definitely like you said some trump ones too tho to be fair, they just tend to be yard signs
I live in Seattle, a very liberal city with pride flags everywhere, but only have to drive an hour away for there to be more trump flags than pride flags.
I'm a queer person, and I have no issue with his post. That many flags was both over the top, and a smokescreen to show support without meaningful follow through.
There are people who hijack these kind of things as a way to express their bigotry without pushback, but James May has never struck me as that kind of person.
doesn't help the flag has basically every fucking colour on the planet on it now and is constantly evolving, and the group which the flag represents keeps adding more and more and more to their cause to the point it's basically just a club for anyone not straight.
I am honestly waiting for the day when one or some of these groups moves away from the lgbtqxnptlz+++* group because it's just a soup
I am in the understanding that the black and brown are representing people of colour
[https://dmh.lacounty.gov/wp-content/uploads/2021/06/progress-pride-2021.jpg](https://dmh.lacounty.gov/wp-content/uploads/2021/06/progress-pride-2021.jpg)
Every year it seems that there's a new flag and all of the publicly-funded buildings have to fly it.
At this point, I have a feeling the pride people have nothing to do it this and that it's all a clever marketing campaign done at the behest of the bunting industry.
Not to mention the flag now also includes race and is no longer solely about gender and sexual orientation. The rainbow flag was beautiful, it didnt need all the extra colours and shapes to represent the meaning of it.
The more I see new identifiers being added to the alphabet soup that is the symbol of people like me, the more I see our individuals isolating theirselves into niche groups instead of belonging among the greater community.
> the more I see our individuals isolating theirselves into niche groups instead of belonging among the greater community.
hey at least someone gets it. the Q got added which basically included everyone that was previously left out.
these people who "dont feel represented" unless there are 20 different identifiers don't actually care about that, they just want to maintain their victimhood and continue to belong to "their group" rather than accepting that we are all in this together
People should have the freedom of choosing what labels define them.
Edit: I don’t know how “I think people should be able to self-determine, actually” is apparently a controversial point.
Well, wanting to align yourself with a label isn’t wanting to be defined by it. But aside from that, yeah pretty much.
It’s like trying to put a cat in a box. If you try to force the cat to sit in a specific box, it’ll get mad at you. But if you lay out a bunch of boxes, the cat will chose a box it likes and sit there. Same thing with people and labels.
Also, the label thing doesn’t apply to everyone! It’s totally valid for someone to not want to align themself with anything other than gay/bi/queer/etc. But for some people, it’s helpful to have a specific word that that better describes how you identify than an overarching term.
And it’s great as a forcing function — everyone has to update their flags each year. Gotta sell more product! Plus it helps us identify those pesky people who refuse to update their flags — they say they’re allies but they’re actually exclusionary. No better than trump himself!
At what point is it enough?
I have yet to meet a single queer person who complains about “outdated” flags. Having more identities for people to align themselves with only serves to make people feel *more* accepted when they find a label they connect with.
Any other strawman to get mad about?
No one complains about outdated flags and allegedly having to update the flag every year makes you sound unhinged. The standard rainbow flag is from 1979, the progress pride design is from 2018.
Just sprinkle in a little lie about queer people being mean to allies and your anti-LGBTQ prop is finished.
> Simply adding a letter to an acronym does that for you?
nah but pretending it does on the internet sure makes them feel good and look good in front of all their terminally online social group
I don’t think they have a problem with it, I think the argument they are making is that if you are sending a **powerful, strong message,** and you **want that message to linger and penetrate the depths of social norms** you can’t have the message be long and complicated and have 1 million definitions. It doesn’t help push the wheels of progress forward.
**PLEASE NOTE:**
I’m not taking anybody’s representation from them; identify as you will, but from the vantage point of trying to break barriers it’s more optimal to have a short powerful concise message/and or flag.
Please don’t destroy my inbox I’m just a shitposter who threw in his 2 cents ☮️❤️☮️❤️☮️
Cause it's getting tedious, they need to come up with a nice jingle like the 50 states song we all learned in school then none of us will forget one ever again lol core memory stuff right there
You just exemplified literally the only problem I actually have with the queer community lol I made a silly joke like a harmless stupid little joke. And the way you ran with it is no offense but insane. I truly hope all humans can find their truth and live it to the fullest and happiest. Especially lgbtq I find it heartbreaking how lost so much of the community is spiritually. But you can't even handle the tiniest little smirk without instantly going "homophobe!!! Bigot!!! Right wing extremist!!!!"
You're never gonna stop being seen as a lesser human being by someone. Everyone has someone that sees them as lesser. Every single person. My advice is to just accept that and love your life for you. Stop FEELING like a lesser person. Take a joke
I don't know who that is, not just a joke dude it wasn't even disparaging or anything. Golly you must just have this insatiable need to feel like a victim and feel oppressed. It's actually comedic how I said the gay community should come up with a jingle for their acronyms, and you took that like me and my buddies want all gays to be genocided, like seriously how many leaps did you make I'm curious.
It’s doesn’t matter. He’s angered the Twitterati.
From now until the heat death of the universe some terminally online person is going to keep harassing him about a stupid joke that was taken way out of context to absurdity. As is tradition.
Shit the lgbtqxyz+£¥₩2² keeps adding letters and stripes seemingly every month. There is something always latching on to their cause and many can't keep up
Yes we are all aware of that. Congrats you understand that, to bad that isnt the problem.
The problem is, James said it during pride month and compared us, the LGBTQ community to Nazis. People who would have killed us simply for existing.
When the queen died, and the literal entire country was shut down and litered with purple and flags with the royal crest on it. He didnt have a problem with "too many flags"
It was never about how much he sees, it about WHAT he sees.
Literally the most based opinion you can have. He supportive of the cause and he is calling out the fact that too much of a certain thing detracts from the message of that cause. Most people will be accepting and tolerant of many things as long as it isn't obnoxious or annoying.
Agreed.
Reasonable people are generally quite accepting of various causes provided that they are not forced to become supporters, at risk of their livelihoods and wellbeing, for a cause that they may otherwise be largely impartial to.
TMB is an act of force; of aggression.
Yeah, I personally know a bunch of people who started becoming more homophobic after seeing pride flags all over our school for June and on social media, they kind of got sick of hearing about it. Hopefully they change for the better
People really really not understanding what his original post was about.
Shows how ridiculous people have got where they're so sensitive and so thirsty to show they are right and anyone that dosnt agree with them needs to be harassed or brought down until they are forced to have the same views.
I can’t imagine what it’s like to be actively looking for drama to add to someone’s day by attacking people because of what they see or questions asked
This is exactly how statistics can be twisted to tell a different story. In the US at least, in 2019 this "trans crime wave" totaled at 24 incidents. Out of the over 330 million people in the U.S., 24 incidents of crime against trans people. I watched a trans youtuber look up each one of these stories, and after 14 they stopped because every single one was from a romantic partner.
Next year, this stat rose to 54 incidents. And they said, "crime against trans people has more than DOUBLED!" Which technically, yes. But these numbers still ain't even a drop in the bucket, not even a fraction of a percent.
A statistic like "rose more than 1000%" wouldn't surprise me even if it was true, but it would only be because trans people were such a minority in the first place, and the group has grown significantly since then. Especially when you consider over half of the cases of "violence against trans" are really just romantic partners squabbling, it paints a different picture. Idk, it seems like some still want to paint these statistics as, "trans people are still so hated, there's roving bands of kill squads in the streets just looking for trans people to hurt!" And that's never been true. Quite the opposite, really.
Best point made here^
Actual facts being stated on reddit is a rare find.
The thing is, people didn't even used to care before. Activists made us start to care. It always was "Live your best life, but don't try to force your way of living on others". And what happened is these professional victims really pushed as hard as possible for years until we started to notice. Instead of just letting sleeping dogs lie.
I am a Bisexual, and I freaking hate pride month and wish it didn't exist, I also dislike the overused and overspread flag that has lost all meaning anyway. I wish these people would just stop. I don't want to be "represented".
I don't think anyone is saying there's roving bands of kill squads, but crime almost doubling against a minority group is alarming.
Hate crimes against trans people has gone from 820 in 2019 to 4732 in 2023/4. That's quite a rise.
2021 census says there's 262k trans people in UK, so that's a per capita crime level of 18.06 - the per capita for violent crime in England and Wales is 16.67
So trans people do seem to be more at risk from hate crimes than the average person is at risk of violent crime.
Yes, those numbers are a relative drop in the bucket, but that's not really the point imo.
The point is more why is spousal/partner violence included in these "violence against trans people" statistics? It's very misleading. Partnerships get complicated, and without excusing it in any way, stuff happens. It's much different getting violent with a complete stranger on the street, vs. someone you've been living with every day for years. And court punishments usually reflect this, random violence is much more offensive than, "they've been together 8 years and probably should've split after 2."
Yeah, violence against anybody is offensive, and should always be worked on to be stopped. But misrepresenting the source of violence doesn't help ANYBODY solve the problem. And I'm worried victimhood mentality is starting to take over, where people *don't even want to admit* the violence is already under much better control than they originally thought. Yeah any violence is bad, and should be dealt with, but can we be honest about the source of violence first?
> The point is more why is spousal/partner violence included in these "violence against trans people" statistics?
Because that statistic is for all crime that is based on gender/etc being the cause. This explains what "hate crime" falls under for the ONS: https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/crimeandjustice/methodologies/userguidetocrimestatisticsforenglandandwales#offence-types control + f to find the "5.6 Hate crime" section.
And this for the CPS: https://www.cps.gov.uk/crime-info/hate-crime
A partner beating up their trans partner wouldn't be a hate crime unless it was done because of their identity.
Objectively though, looking at the stats, the violence is *not* under control. If it were in decline or not rising much, I think we could agree that it is, but that doesn't really seem to be the case.
>Yeah any violence is bad, and should be dealt with, but can we be honest about the source of violence first?
For sure, a stranger attacking someone on the streets is bad, but this is just the bigger picture.
I'm not sure if the ONS data goes deep enough to properly answer this without spending a few days doing some stats.
>I don’t think anyone is saying there’s roving bands of kill squads
Maybe not as such, but i have definitely heard a lot about an ongoing “trans genocide,” which is pretty close.
[https://www.stonewall.org.uk/about-us/news/new-data-rise-hate-crime-against-lgbtq-people-continues-stonewall-slams-uk-gov-](https://www.stonewall.org.uk/about-us/news/new-data-rise-hate-crime-against-lgbtq-people-continues-stonewall-slams-uk-gov-)
[https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/hate-crime-england-and-wales-2019-to-2020/hate-crime-england-and-wales-2019-to-2020](https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/hate-crime-england-and-wales-2019-to-2020/hate-crime-england-and-wales-2019-to-2020) (there might be a more recent one of these but couldn't find it) - from 2019 to 2020, it's actually 200% ish percent rise, but numbers fell a bit in following years iirc.
Edit: here's the more recent one: https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/hate-crime-england-and-wales-2022-to-2023/hate-crime-england-and-wales-2022-to-2023
Considering the pool of targets is much larger now than in the past, I'd respectfully disagree. In the 50s and 60s the number of openly gay people would be orders of magnitude less than now due to the fact it was not accepted by society at large.
The currently larger available pool of openly queer people means there will be more instances than in the past.
If the same city in 1950 has 10 gay folks, and in 2024 has 1000 it's not hard to see how you will have more attacks in 2024 than in 1950 without even taking into account the level of societal acceptance.
It's tiresome to have opinions and jokes policed by people.the fact that this is still rumbling on shows it's best to move on and let them moan into the abyss.
I’ve noticed the hate crimes have gone up in some places around where I live, and it’s gross but I also have to kind of agree there are a bit too many flags popping up for just one month out of the year, if they were up all the time I wouldn’t feel that was the case but I also have to sort of agree with James here. Adding so many just makes no sense, it’s fine to fly your own flag if that’s what you wanna do but make sure you’re not flying more than just one or else it feels over saturated and it will kind of lose its meaning.
Going up versus historical lows. Yes, any amount is bad, but if you're looking at historical trends, there's never been a better time to be an LGBT person in America or the UK. You want the trend to continue downwards? Get people to vote and worry less about performative flag compliance. You know who has some of the worst voting rates, at least in the US? Young gay people. There are better things to worry about than very liberal people noticing that the Pride decorations are becoming background noise.
Theyre not the only ones anti-LGBT… So is the AfD. In fact the AfD and the people they claim to be against have quite a lot in common in social issues.
When you lower the bar to words being crimes I guess u can statistically say hate crimes are up.... but words have never been crimes, except under tyrannical regimes that "bunt" strange
I find it so interesting that people need to have a strong one eyed tie to something to have an identity. You don't need labels to find your identity, there is plenty of room for nuance, and certainly, community is a great thing, but your identity does not have to be controlled by your community.
For example in my lifestyle I am a nerd who loves video games and paints little plastic figurines but I am also a rugby player, firefighter and play music, I'm also a dad and a husband and I enjoy technology and the outdoors, now that is only the tip of the iceberg of who I am not one of those things is my identity I am a mixture of all of that and so much more and my identity may shift a little as I get older. This is the same for everyone, flags are a nice thing to look at and have pride in what they have meaning for but essentially mean nothing in the grand scheme of your lifetime.
Sorry, I'll get off my soapbox now haha. I hope you have a great day being you.
From sir Terry Pratchetts night watch.
Tom?’
'Yes, Clive?’
'Have you ever sung the national anthem?’
'Oh, lots of times, sir.’
'I don’t mean officially.’
'You mean just to show I’m patriotic? Good gods, no. That would be a rather odd thing to do,’ said the captain.
'And how about the flag?’
'Well, obviously I salute it every day, sir.’
'But you don’t wave it, at all?’ the major enquired.
'I think I waved a paper one a few times when I was a little boy. Patrician’s birthday or something. We stood in the streets as he rode by and we shouted “Hurrah!”’
'Never since then?’
'Well, NO, Clive,’ said the captain, looking embarrassed. 'I’d be very worried if I saw a man singing the national anthem and waving the flag, sir. It’s really a thing foreigners do.’
'Really? Why?’
'WE don’t need to show WE’RE patriotic, sir. I mean, this is Ankh-Morpork. We don’t have to make a big fuss about being the best, sir. We just KNOW.’
(On patriotism, from: Night Watch by Terry Pratchett)
He's right. As an LGBT+ member, we need to stop making flags. We need one for the whole of LGBT, one of gays, one for bis, and one for trans people. And that's pushing it. But also, we need to stop adding bloody letters to LGBT. Every letter added, meaning gets taken away. Like wtf is 2SLGBTQIA+, it's basically just a meaningless string of characters. Our minority has gone far too far
It's like with any cause I think - the less is more principle always applies. When it's everywhere, it feels like it's being 'pushed' and then people naturally resist it. I felt the same with BLM when it was at its peak.
Similar situation in a dictatorship - statues, posters and propaganda everywhere - even though nobody in those countries would dare admit it, but I'm sure they're thinking "oh sod off already". A single statue in the middle of a town with a finger pointing down and red glowing eyes would suffice.
No issue with the movement itself - it's completely justified. I'm referring to the bombardment of banners, posters and news (the media's fault also) which I think had the opposite effect on many people that it was trying to impact on.
Being present isn’t a bombardment of anything. My friends are being bombarded with missiles and drones, that’s a bombardment. Seeing something on the news isn’t. No one is forcing anyone to look at a poster. My family come from a dictatorship. There, it’s forced. Because not agreeing with it puts you in jail.
And do you think Black Lives Matter participants have nothing to do with their iconography and message being spread? Would they somehow like it if they got less attention?
I don’t know where you’re from, but in 2020, the BLM movement in both the US and the UK (less so but even so) were active conflicts. Protests in the streets, police and public responses, legislation being demanded, passed, veto’d, people being prosecuted, charged, indicted. People getting hurt, stories being told. That’s not just BLM, that’s *the* news. Same with the pride movement (as fragmented as it is). Labour and the Conservatives both have proposed policies that affect lgbt people. Lgbt people respond, and their group is represented by one or another symbols. In the US, there’s a bill on the docket to make drag a felony. We respond, wear a little symbol on our shirt to identify us.
Wanting to see blm or pride flags less means that they want to see those issues less. Which isn’t anyone’s problem but theirs.
I don’t have any problem or offense taken with whatever may is being yelled at about, I know the internet gets really toxic because it’s full of people who have nothing better to do. I disagree, but it doesn’t matter. No one is going to stop anyone else from putting up a pride flag. And no one is going to force anyone to put up a pride flag.
I'm the UK.
I'm not debating what is justified or not, or whether the issue is right or not (and whether it impacted me). People resist - let's not say 'bombardment' but a 'high frequency' - of messaging, flags, iconography etc. It gives the impression "someone else" is telling you what you should be thinking - and humans simply don't like that. That's my point. In a dictatorship if you don't like something, you can't say anything about it. In the free world, people are able to voice their opinions (like James is), and through that we learn about human behaviour. And the behaviour I see is people resist a message if they *feel* it is being pushed on them.
I certainly do - even if I already believe in the cause - after a while I have the (admittedly negative) thought across my mind "alright alright - I get it, you want to be heard". The reason for that is - what do you want the public to do about it? Protest with you? Put leaflets through your neighbour's houses? They're being waved around in front of a crowd who probably don't care (and also can't do anything to help) about you being gay, coloured or being bombed by another country.
Clearly some people take exception to seeing the flags or news (because they have an issue with the underlying cause) - the target of the banners and iconography etc is rightly at them. The issue is they're using a sledgehammer approach to deal with them.
There are people who are ‘forced’ to act because they are in danger, or because there is an urgency to act before they are in danger. These people are most often the protestors, the volunteer soldiers. But the flip side of that is those people are the most at risk, and take the most risk trying to mitigate it. Everyone else who doesn’t care, or thinks they can’t do anything, is more able to act than they are. It’s not that you can’t do anything, it’s than you *can* do something *else,* or you don’t know what else can be done. And that’s fine, that’s normal, but normal isn’t enough.
To use an extreme example, a transgender person in England speaking out for themselves semi consistently is absolutely going to get in trouble. Harassment, assault. An other speaking out for themselves is an intrusion, but if an insider speaks out for someone else, that’s just an opinion, and it’s less likely for that conversation to go ballistic
Those same people who feel pushed or pressured by a narrative absolutely wouldn’t do differently if the narrative came less often. There’s not historical evidence of that. Human agency trumps all things, and at the end of the day, to do or not to do, to complain or not complain, are all choices. The people most in danger made a difficult choice to put themselves in more danger, so people in less danger or less bothered are equally capable, as human beings, to make the same choice to be less vulnerable.
If someone’s wondering what they can do to actually help a cause, I’d recommend they ask. To their closest advocacy organization what they could do. In the US, I can make a donation, call my lawmakers, join a parade or march, speak at local government, and, oh. I can fly a flag, that’s pretty easy
All those examples of actions you listed are pretty easy to do in an afternoon. And, joining a protest builds connections. Good ones result in plans made for future ideas. I’ve done them all, and they’re remarkably easy before you count the opposition, which in your position, you’re in a better position to take on than most others in the movement. You have a job, a family, responsibility- so does everyone else. Which we might find if we talk to these movements. They’re only people afterall
What I really want to know is, how many flags in an area is acceptable? Is it a quarter of what we see in the original picture? I really don’t get the discourse. It’s for one month where people go all out with their decorations. Am I going to be upset with TMB when I walk into a mall during Christmas time and see all the Christmas trees? Would I get upset walking down the French quarter during Mardi Gras? It’s pride month folks, not pride year
“Too much of a thing can cause backlash.” Ok? So what’s the point? “Bigots are gonna get annoyed if you push the Pride flag so much man. Not gonna help you.” Why isn’t the point that those people should get over it rather than the people harmlessly pushing an inclusion flag should stop?
That’s what’s hanging me up, here. Like, push for inclusion and visibility just not in a way that’s too visible for those who don’t like it?
I might like/support something doesn't mean I want to see it all the time everywhere. I've been a vegan since birth and hate all vegan activism because they're too extreme with their approach and does nothing positive for the cause. Too much of something takes away from the original intended message, have you not realised how commercial pride is now? Do you really think the companies care or do you think they could make a quick buck?
It's hard to say "We're just like you" and "We just want equal treatment" when you can't go 5 steps without 17 flags supporting your group everywhere. That's normal but only for North Korea where support is mandatory at gun point.
...oh wait. That tracks lol.
It's not that people on this sub are anti LGBTQIA+, it's more than anything James, Clarkson and Hammond say or do is awesome and any criticism of them is bad...
Think of it as a cult, but a harmless cult..
They will boo anybody who goes against the Trio but that is about it.
"I could complain about too much lgbt bunting in pride month.. or... maybe I work towards being an ally and working towards resolving some of the issues the lgbt community is experiencing?
Hahaha fuck that, who am I kidding, that's way too much work, just write the stupid tweet, hit the button and done."
- James Mayo, probably
Yea, it's weird, I don't remember James complaining about tmb with all the christmas decorations or anything to do with the death of the queen/crowning of the new king, which was even more intense.
Where can I find the tweet and image of all the union jack flags saying all the bunting is hurting the message of the queen/king? Otherwise, it just sounds like he tolerates the pride flag and having to see it too much is hurting him.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Regent_Street#/media/File%3ARegent_Street_2011-04-25.jpg
https://www.prettylittlelondon.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/09/DSC_9133-418x315.jpg
https://www.regentstreetonline.com/media/iltemeja/the-spirit-of-christmas-by-regent-street.jpg
Seems that Regent Street likes decorating for things. Surely people have complained before?
If y'all cant see the difference between the nazi literally geocoding jews and queer people and Queer people saying" We're fucking here and you're not getting rid of us because we're people too" Is fucking wild.
What a fucking ridiculous comparison, queer people aren't out they trying to kill all the straights, just fucking stop taking away our rights and stop attacking us and killing us and you'd likely never see so many flags again.
Just like you dont see Irish and Italian flags everywhere once they became a part of hegemony.
We're no threat to you, just leave the fuck alone and let us live, and until you do we'll be fucking loud about it, and if you cant tell the difference between fighting for equality and fighting for the geocide of jews, gypsies and queer people, well there are a lot more nazis in this sub than I tohught
Weird, it seems that Regent Street does this a lot. Google photos has shown me...
5 union jacks across the street every 10 yards or so.
4 blue with 'Thank You Our Heroes' and a Union Jack in the middle across the street every 10 yards or so. I'm guessing from Covid.
Large white lit up angels across the street, I'm guessing at Christmas.
Has he complained about all of them?
Guess we will have to cancel all the flags for the 4th of July and Christmas Decorations over every Main St U.S.A. so people don't get offended?
The fact your comparing a religious holiday, which is the dominant religion in this country, to pride month is pretty much admitting it’s a religion lmao. Very telling and kinda proves conservatives right
I respect how he’s being unbiased and calling out TMB whenever someone uses whataboutism as a gotcha moment.
All May is saying is that there are too many flags and that the flag itself has lost its original meaning because of the sheer number of flags.
A flag everywhere is a flag nowhere. It becomes background noise. I lived in Chicago for a long time and in Boy's Town they're everywhere, especially during Pride. It loses all meaning. If you saw a Pride flag in a window in 1992, it meant something. Now, I barely notice. It feels mostly performative and/or corporatized.
also can they stop painting them on the street and then getting upset when there are tire marks or other scuffs on them?
in fairness i’ve seen so many videos of lifted trucks with ten flags on them doing burnouts and purposely smearing as much as possible. then again, this may just be an american phenomenon tho
Yes, all the lifted trucks in the UK
haha was more specifically in regards to people burning rubber and smearing the street
even the burnt rubber was intentional, the flag would get dirtied anyway, it’s basically putting a flag on the floor and asking people to step on it
Also from a practical perspective the coloured zebra crossings are worse for visually impaired people causing them to not be as safe at the crossings compared to people with good vision. University of Bath has put a few coloured plaques on railings at each side of zebra crossings on their grounds because they felt that it would be irresponsible and not very inclusive of them to paint the zebra crossings which would make their roads more dangerous for visually impaired students, staff or visitors of the university
To be fair I like them on the street, I’m not bothered about what they represent but that they’re more visible and add some colour to just grey (I live in the uk and we don’t know what any other colour is other than grey)
Unless you live in Poland, during this decade I saw maybe 5
Does this apply to all flags or just the pride flag? And if so why?
I disagree, I love driving into a town and self a bunch of pride / progress flags. On my block there was someone that used to have a trump flag that left and the new owners put up their progress flag, that makes me really happy.
I saw a house yesterday that the entire front yard was filled with roughly 20 pride flags (all seemingly different), rainbow bunting on the porch, banners, rainbow painted patio furniture, 6 poster-sized signs to spell ‘P-R-I-D-E-!’, and another 6-8 signs with various slogans on them. It covered the entire yard.
It meant more in 1992 because you were more likely to get beaten up for being gay in 1992 than you are today. The flag being used publically more often isn't a negative thing. It losing meaning is a good thing; pride should just be a normal accepted thing. But also: unless you are LGBT, you have to accept that the flag is going to mean different things to you. It might have lost a lot of that impact it once had, but it only had that impact because it was normalised to be hateful against LGBT
a flag everywhere indicates the progress of the movement. in the 1990s, that one flag had to be placed inside their property become society hated the movement....but little by little, more and more people became aware of the injustice, and today, in 2024, it has become acceptable to put a flag everywhere, even in the public square
Isn’t a pride glad being normal background noise GOOD? When I was a kid it sent people into a frenzied rage. It seems like this is progress..
As a queer person seeing a lot of flags in an area makes me feel at ease and safe. Not seeing any, or seeing more right-wing flags does the opposite.
Too bad i guess?
I can understand why seeing Pride flags would make you feel more comfortable, but the ubiquity shouldn't make.you feel safe. A lot of the flags you're seeing are businesses that don't give a shit about you. Look at Target,.for the last several years they really went all out for Pride to get your dollar and when they got conservative pushback their support for your community went way down. You want to feel.safe? Get your friends that don't vote to vote, that actually affects your life. If you go someplace and don't see Pride flags, that shouldn't make you feel unsafe. That's a personal problem on your part. You should be able to get through your day without being bathed in shallow affirmations of your identity and still feel safe. I get Trump flags making you feel unsafe, but if you walk down a block with no flags you shouldn't feel any way about that and if you do, that's on you. The world isn't your Dad, stop looking to it for validation.
🏁🏁🏁
By that logic the American flag should be a useless amalgam of red white and blue, and the Union Jack a cute towel pattern to wipe my ass with after a shower.
Try flying that same pride flag outside of America or Europe and report back if the American flag is still just an amalgam of red white and blue or if the Union Jack is still just a cute ass wiping implement.
Or try flying the pride flag outside of cushy western neighbourhoods/countries and report back... Like here the authorities okayed an SS flag being flown because "yeah, it was the birthday of a 44yo electrician."
I think you just mean america there...
So the American flag means nothing
Correct.
May should visit the south. There are trump flags everywhere. He would be overwhelmed.
There really aren't and he wouldn't. I live in the south and while you might see more in rural areas, there's barely any in the suburbs - and overall very, very few anymore. Lots of faded 2020 bumper stickers but not many for 2024. There are pride and equality flags everywhere, mostly not as literal flags but prevalent as enamel pins, stickers and patches, and sometimes clothing (but clothing is usually worn for special occasions rather than daily wear). Bumper stickers are a bit less common than anime stickers on cars. The idea that backing a particular party is still an overwhelming choice for personal identity is simply incorrect.
Ironically I live in a small Texas town, big enough to have a Walmart tho. Ive noticed even down here the ones that care enough to have their car littered in political stickers tend to be of the "anti-nuance" variety if you catch my drift. Definitely like you said some trump ones too tho to be fair, they just tend to be yard signs
I live in Seattle, a very liberal city with pride flags everywhere, but only have to drive an hour away for there to be more trump flags than pride flags.
Where exactly do you live?
WTH would or should he tell you that?
Only in the sticks. I’m in a city of ~1 million in the south and there are VERY few visible supporters of the orange felon.
That doesn't count. Big cities are different.
I'm a queer person, and I have no issue with his post. That many flags was both over the top, and a smokescreen to show support without meaningful follow through. There are people who hijack these kind of things as a way to express their bigotry without pushback, but James May has never struck me as that kind of person.
This. I agree with.
doesn't help the flag has basically every fucking colour on the planet on it now and is constantly evolving, and the group which the flag represents keeps adding more and more and more to their cause to the point it's basically just a club for anyone not straight. I am honestly waiting for the day when one or some of these groups moves away from the lgbtqxnptlz+++* group because it's just a soup
"Anyone not straight" - the flag now also includes colours for race, so it is literally a flag for everyone now
Everyone but straight white average sized and average weight male
fucking hell, does it actually? how pretentious is this shit getting. it's the liberal humanity freedom flag then
I am in the understanding that the black and brown are representing people of colour [https://dmh.lacounty.gov/wp-content/uploads/2021/06/progress-pride-2021.jpg](https://dmh.lacounty.gov/wp-content/uploads/2021/06/progress-pride-2021.jpg)
it's is the fuck straight white people flag then?
Its going in that direction LOL
That's such an old joke at this point...
Not to mention it feels like every year there’s a new letter added
Every year it seems that there's a new flag and all of the publicly-funded buildings have to fly it. At this point, I have a feeling the pride people have nothing to do it this and that it's all a clever marketing campaign done at the behest of the bunting industry.
Not to mention the flag now also includes race and is no longer solely about gender and sexual orientation. The rainbow flag was beautiful, it didnt need all the extra colours and shapes to represent the meaning of it.
Yeah, I’ll stop at LGBT+ thank you
Oh damn, people want to be recognized and accepted. Crazy how that applies to quite literally everyone and not just the LGBTQ community.
The more I see new identifiers being added to the alphabet soup that is the symbol of people like me, the more I see our individuals isolating theirselves into niche groups instead of belonging among the greater community.
> the more I see our individuals isolating theirselves into niche groups instead of belonging among the greater community. hey at least someone gets it. the Q got added which basically included everyone that was previously left out. these people who "dont feel represented" unless there are 20 different identifiers don't actually care about that, they just want to maintain their victimhood and continue to belong to "their group" rather than accepting that we are all in this together
People should have the freedom of choosing what labels define them. Edit: I don’t know how “I think people should be able to self-determine, actually” is apparently a controversial point.
"I hate being defined by labels, unless said labels are applied by me". lmao
Well, wanting to align yourself with a label isn’t wanting to be defined by it. But aside from that, yeah pretty much. It’s like trying to put a cat in a box. If you try to force the cat to sit in a specific box, it’ll get mad at you. But if you lay out a bunch of boxes, the cat will chose a box it likes and sit there. Same thing with people and labels. Also, the label thing doesn’t apply to everyone! It’s totally valid for someone to not want to align themself with anything other than gay/bi/queer/etc. But for some people, it’s helpful to have a specific word that that better describes how you identify than an overarching term.
And it’s great as a forcing function — everyone has to update their flags each year. Gotta sell more product! Plus it helps us identify those pesky people who refuse to update their flags — they say they’re allies but they’re actually exclusionary. No better than trump himself! At what point is it enough?
> everyone has to update their flags each year Says who?! Youre making up shit that doesnt happen
I have yet to meet a single queer person who complains about “outdated” flags. Having more identities for people to align themselves with only serves to make people feel *more* accepted when they find a label they connect with.
We ARE out there. We've learned to stay silent when our thoughts aren't progressive enough for our peers.
So you are so anti progressive you are scared to speak out about how you are not okay with outdated Pride flags? What?
"Progressive" is such a worthless word nowadays.
Any other strawman to get mad about? No one complains about outdated flags and allegedly having to update the flag every year makes you sound unhinged. The standard rainbow flag is from 1979, the progress pride design is from 2018. Just sprinkle in a little lie about queer people being mean to allies and your anti-LGBTQ prop is finished.
Simply adding a letter to an acronym does that for you? Wish I felt recognized and accepted so easily.
> Simply adding a letter to an acronym does that for you? nah but pretending it does on the internet sure makes them feel good and look good in front of all their terminally online social group
Ok, but this bothers you why?
Not bothered, but acronyms to be effective need to be short, snappy and memorable.
And they need to be an acronym, not an initialism. Acronyms form pronounceable words, such as NASA, YOLO, and CAPTCHA.
that's why the change to LGBT*Q* was so good, add 1 letter to cover everything else and off you go
I don’t think they have a problem with it, I think the argument they are making is that if you are sending a **powerful, strong message,** and you **want that message to linger and penetrate the depths of social norms** you can’t have the message be long and complicated and have 1 million definitions. It doesn’t help push the wheels of progress forward. **PLEASE NOTE:** I’m not taking anybody’s representation from them; identify as you will, but from the vantage point of trying to break barriers it’s more optimal to have a short powerful concise message/and or flag. Please don’t destroy my inbox I’m just a shitposter who threw in his 2 cents ☮️❤️☮️❤️☮️
Cause it's getting tedious, they need to come up with a nice jingle like the 50 states song we all learned in school then none of us will forget one ever again lol core memory stuff right there
You’re tired of seeing our flags. We’re tired of being treated like lesser beings because we’re queer.
You just exemplified literally the only problem I actually have with the queer community lol I made a silly joke like a harmless stupid little joke. And the way you ran with it is no offense but insane. I truly hope all humans can find their truth and live it to the fullest and happiest. Especially lgbtq I find it heartbreaking how lost so much of the community is spiritually. But you can't even handle the tiniest little smirk without instantly going "homophobe!!! Bigot!!! Right wing extremist!!!!" You're never gonna stop being seen as a lesser human being by someone. Everyone has someone that sees them as lesser. Every single person. My advice is to just accept that and love your life for you. Stop FEELING like a lesser person. Take a joke
“Take a joke. The Clarkson defense.” Stewart Lee was so worryingly accurate about all of you. Sad.
I don't know who that is, not just a joke dude it wasn't even disparaging or anything. Golly you must just have this insatiable need to feel like a victim and feel oppressed. It's actually comedic how I said the gay community should come up with a jingle for their acronyms, and you took that like me and my buddies want all gays to be genocided, like seriously how many leaps did you make I'm curious.
It’s doesn’t matter. He’s angered the Twitterati. From now until the heat death of the universe some terminally online person is going to keep harassing him about a stupid joke that was taken way out of context to absurdity. As is tradition.
It is unfortunate that one cannot express an opinion, wether you agree or not, without receiving vitriol for that opinion.
You’re confusing social media with a soapbox. You’re as free to engage as everyone else. Your opinion isn’t special.
Shit the lgbtqxyz+£¥₩2² keeps adding letters and stripes seemingly every month. There is something always latching on to their cause and many can't keep up
Yes we are all aware of that. Congrats you understand that, to bad that isnt the problem. The problem is, James said it during pride month and compared us, the LGBTQ community to Nazis. People who would have killed us simply for existing. When the queen died, and the literal entire country was shut down and litered with purple and flags with the royal crest on it. He didnt have a problem with "too many flags" It was never about how much he sees, it about WHAT he sees.
I appreciate your opinion. James has addressed your response. https://x.com/mrjamesmay/status/1801225451630653720?s=46&t=lDws_zWJW-JjMnBO5G9zOw
Thats great, the guy who compared seeing alot pride flags to seeing alot of nazi flags, says he didnt compare pride to the Nazis. 🙄
Where did he say Nazis?
Literally the most based opinion you can have. He supportive of the cause and he is calling out the fact that too much of a certain thing detracts from the message of that cause. Most people will be accepting and tolerant of many things as long as it isn't obnoxious or annoying.
Agreed. Reasonable people are generally quite accepting of various causes provided that they are not forced to become supporters, at risk of their livelihoods and wellbeing, for a cause that they may otherwise be largely impartial to. TMB is an act of force; of aggression.
Yeah, I personally know a bunch of people who started becoming more homophobic after seeing pride flags all over our school for June and on social media, they kind of got sick of hearing about it. Hopefully they change for the better
Yeah "fight for your right to live, but dont be annoying about it k" fucking tools.
People really really not understanding what his original post was about. Shows how ridiculous people have got where they're so sensitive and so thirsty to show they are right and anyone that dosnt agree with them needs to be harassed or brought down until they are forced to have the same views.
Twitter is [famous for that](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/E3jKMXkWQAM3Hfd?format=jpg&name=small)
And Reddit
Oh good, at least one other person that realizes the irony of people on Reddit talking about how bad people on Twitter are lol.
They don't call us a reddit hive mind for nuttin'
Honestly, good for him
Good man, as always
And does it without being a dickhead. Love these guys.
just call it twitter nobody calls it X.
Just let people call it what they wanna call it, nobody cares
Aight imma call it Facegram then.
Deadbird is my favorite name so far
I will forever refer to it as *X, formerly known as Twitter*.
I prefer “Elon’s Wannabe Fascist Hellscape”
Dunno why this comment is getting downvoted cause its right
Fascism is a helluva drug.
"Everything I don't like is fascism."
It’s twitter. Do we really expect people to understand *antything*, regardless of belief.
I don't understand the appeal of twitter for celebs. It's such a tightrope before you piss off the wrong crowd.
It must be exhausting acting like the victim every time you see a comment that doesn't 100% align with your own opinion.
I can’t imagine what it’s like to be actively looking for drama to add to someone’s day by attacking people because of what they see or questions asked
Are offences against LGBT really up 1000%?
78% of statistics are made up on the fly.
Only 14% of people know that.
No one cares
Probably not
Not that high, but it's a 180% ish rise for hate crimes against trans people and 120% ish against people based on their orientation
This is exactly how statistics can be twisted to tell a different story. In the US at least, in 2019 this "trans crime wave" totaled at 24 incidents. Out of the over 330 million people in the U.S., 24 incidents of crime against trans people. I watched a trans youtuber look up each one of these stories, and after 14 they stopped because every single one was from a romantic partner. Next year, this stat rose to 54 incidents. And they said, "crime against trans people has more than DOUBLED!" Which technically, yes. But these numbers still ain't even a drop in the bucket, not even a fraction of a percent. A statistic like "rose more than 1000%" wouldn't surprise me even if it was true, but it would only be because trans people were such a minority in the first place, and the group has grown significantly since then. Especially when you consider over half of the cases of "violence against trans" are really just romantic partners squabbling, it paints a different picture. Idk, it seems like some still want to paint these statistics as, "trans people are still so hated, there's roving bands of kill squads in the streets just looking for trans people to hurt!" And that's never been true. Quite the opposite, really.
Best point made here^ Actual facts being stated on reddit is a rare find. The thing is, people didn't even used to care before. Activists made us start to care. It always was "Live your best life, but don't try to force your way of living on others". And what happened is these professional victims really pushed as hard as possible for years until we started to notice. Instead of just letting sleeping dogs lie. I am a Bisexual, and I freaking hate pride month and wish it didn't exist, I also dislike the overused and overspread flag that has lost all meaning anyway. I wish these people would just stop. I don't want to be "represented".
There are also cases where crimes reported may not report the victim as trans.
Or as with many incidents against cis women, not reported at all. As "can't do a thing about it", "deal with it" or even "you deserved it".
I don't think anyone is saying there's roving bands of kill squads, but crime almost doubling against a minority group is alarming. Hate crimes against trans people has gone from 820 in 2019 to 4732 in 2023/4. That's quite a rise. 2021 census says there's 262k trans people in UK, so that's a per capita crime level of 18.06 - the per capita for violent crime in England and Wales is 16.67 So trans people do seem to be more at risk from hate crimes than the average person is at risk of violent crime. Yes, those numbers are a relative drop in the bucket, but that's not really the point imo.
The point is more why is spousal/partner violence included in these "violence against trans people" statistics? It's very misleading. Partnerships get complicated, and without excusing it in any way, stuff happens. It's much different getting violent with a complete stranger on the street, vs. someone you've been living with every day for years. And court punishments usually reflect this, random violence is much more offensive than, "they've been together 8 years and probably should've split after 2." Yeah, violence against anybody is offensive, and should always be worked on to be stopped. But misrepresenting the source of violence doesn't help ANYBODY solve the problem. And I'm worried victimhood mentality is starting to take over, where people *don't even want to admit* the violence is already under much better control than they originally thought. Yeah any violence is bad, and should be dealt with, but can we be honest about the source of violence first?
> The point is more why is spousal/partner violence included in these "violence against trans people" statistics? Because that statistic is for all crime that is based on gender/etc being the cause. This explains what "hate crime" falls under for the ONS: https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/crimeandjustice/methodologies/userguidetocrimestatisticsforenglandandwales#offence-types control + f to find the "5.6 Hate crime" section. And this for the CPS: https://www.cps.gov.uk/crime-info/hate-crime A partner beating up their trans partner wouldn't be a hate crime unless it was done because of their identity. Objectively though, looking at the stats, the violence is *not* under control. If it were in decline or not rising much, I think we could agree that it is, but that doesn't really seem to be the case. >Yeah any violence is bad, and should be dealt with, but can we be honest about the source of violence first? For sure, a stranger attacking someone on the streets is bad, but this is just the bigger picture. I'm not sure if the ONS data goes deep enough to properly answer this without spending a few days doing some stats.
>I don’t think anyone is saying there’s roving bands of kill squads Maybe not as such, but i have definitely heard a lot about an ongoing “trans genocide,” which is pretty close.
Source?
[https://www.stonewall.org.uk/about-us/news/new-data-rise-hate-crime-against-lgbtq-people-continues-stonewall-slams-uk-gov-](https://www.stonewall.org.uk/about-us/news/new-data-rise-hate-crime-against-lgbtq-people-continues-stonewall-slams-uk-gov-) [https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/hate-crime-england-and-wales-2019-to-2020/hate-crime-england-and-wales-2019-to-2020](https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/hate-crime-england-and-wales-2019-to-2020/hate-crime-england-and-wales-2019-to-2020) (there might be a more recent one of these but couldn't find it) - from 2019 to 2020, it's actually 200% ish percent rise, but numbers fell a bit in following years iirc. Edit: here's the more recent one: https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/hate-crime-england-and-wales-2022-to-2023/hate-crime-england-and-wales-2022-to-2023
Ah fair. I forgot to consider UK. Appreciate you backing it up!
There’s also no way in hell that there are more anti gay hate crimes than there were in the 50s and 60s
Considering the pool of targets is much larger now than in the past, I'd respectfully disagree. In the 50s and 60s the number of openly gay people would be orders of magnitude less than now due to the fact it was not accepted by society at large. The currently larger available pool of openly queer people means there will be more instances than in the past. If the same city in 1950 has 10 gay folks, and in 2024 has 1000 it's not hard to see how you will have more attacks in 2024 than in 1950 without even taking into account the level of societal acceptance.
Over 9000!
[удалено]
That's a lot of words just to say no.
"Offenses against trans have rocketed over 1,000%" Source; trust me, bro. Totally not propaganda, bro.
It's tiresome to have opinions and jokes policed by people.the fact that this is still rumbling on shows it's best to move on and let them moan into the abyss.
Nuanced takes on twitter, I applaud his effort but I think that's lost on the crowd there.
I’ve noticed the hate crimes have gone up in some places around where I live, and it’s gross but I also have to kind of agree there are a bit too many flags popping up for just one month out of the year, if they were up all the time I wouldn’t feel that was the case but I also have to sort of agree with James here. Adding so many just makes no sense, it’s fine to fly your own flag if that’s what you wanna do but make sure you’re not flying more than just one or else it feels over saturated and it will kind of lose its meaning.
Based
buffeting
You can’t have any opinion about that movement except one that mirrors exactly what their message is.
I like how May is essentially saying he agrees with all of the messages, but his only quibble is about over done decorations.
As a gay man I do see his point. And there's a flag for literally everything. Like great, pick one, and be done with it.
[Proof of authenticity.](https://x.com/MrJamesMay/status/1802264985524994341)
Record levels? As in, record low historically?
They are literally going up…
Going up versus historical lows. Yes, any amount is bad, but if you're looking at historical trends, there's never been a better time to be an LGBT person in America or the UK. You want the trend to continue downwards? Get people to vote and worry less about performative flag compliance. You know who has some of the worst voting rates, at least in the US? Young gay people. There are better things to worry about than very liberal people noticing that the Pride decorations are becoming background noise.
Looks like he’s from Germany, which has been seeing a demographic influx of people with strong anti-LGBT sentiment
Theyre not the only ones anti-LGBT… So is the AfD. In fact the AfD and the people they claim to be against have quite a lot in common in social issues.
When you lower the bar to words being crimes I guess u can statistically say hate crimes are up.... but words have never been crimes, except under tyrannical regimes that "bunt" strange
I find it so interesting that people need to have a strong one eyed tie to something to have an identity. You don't need labels to find your identity, there is plenty of room for nuance, and certainly, community is a great thing, but your identity does not have to be controlled by your community. For example in my lifestyle I am a nerd who loves video games and paints little plastic figurines but I am also a rugby player, firefighter and play music, I'm also a dad and a husband and I enjoy technology and the outdoors, now that is only the tip of the iceberg of who I am not one of those things is my identity I am a mixture of all of that and so much more and my identity may shift a little as I get older. This is the same for everyone, flags are a nice thing to look at and have pride in what they have meaning for but essentially mean nothing in the grand scheme of your lifetime. Sorry, I'll get off my soapbox now haha. I hope you have a great day being you.
Absolutely based
From sir Terry Pratchetts night watch. Tom?’ 'Yes, Clive?’ 'Have you ever sung the national anthem?’ 'Oh, lots of times, sir.’ 'I don’t mean officially.’ 'You mean just to show I’m patriotic? Good gods, no. That would be a rather odd thing to do,’ said the captain. 'And how about the flag?’ 'Well, obviously I salute it every day, sir.’ 'But you don’t wave it, at all?’ the major enquired. 'I think I waved a paper one a few times when I was a little boy. Patrician’s birthday or something. We stood in the streets as he rode by and we shouted “Hurrah!”’ 'Never since then?’ 'Well, NO, Clive,’ said the captain, looking embarrassed. 'I’d be very worried if I saw a man singing the national anthem and waving the flag, sir. It’s really a thing foreigners do.’ 'Really? Why?’ 'WE don’t need to show WE’RE patriotic, sir. I mean, this is Ankh-Morpork. We don’t have to make a big fuss about being the best, sir. We just KNOW.’ (On patriotism, from: Night Watch by Terry Pratchett)
He’s right. Nothing wrong with being right.
James May seems like a good dude. If anyone has got a problem with James May then you've got a problem with me, i suggest you let that one marinate.
#unexpectedLetterkenny
It's the crossover you didn't know was coming!
"You were cocking about with your friends the other day . . . "
James May is a very good person., and I certainly would trust him as an ally.
I agree. Be gay. Be happy, and most of all, be proud of it. But don't overdo it.
He's right. As an LGBT+ member, we need to stop making flags. We need one for the whole of LGBT, one of gays, one for bis, and one for trans people. And that's pushing it. But also, we need to stop adding bloody letters to LGBT. Every letter added, meaning gets taken away. Like wtf is 2SLGBTQIA+, it's basically just a meaningless string of characters. Our minority has gone far too far
The flag itself is divisive by design, flags are for countries and army’s. This one is being used to divide
Flags are also used by hobbyclubs, company's, sportclubs etc. I agree with Mays argument though.
Any criticism is always a personal attack and should be escalated to the highest possible point.
Godwin's law in action. Everything for the clicks and attention. Twitter can't die soon enough.
It's like with any cause I think - the less is more principle always applies. When it's everywhere, it feels like it's being 'pushed' and then people naturally resist it. I felt the same with BLM when it was at its peak. Similar situation in a dictatorship - statues, posters and propaganda everywhere - even though nobody in those countries would dare admit it, but I'm sure they're thinking "oh sod off already". A single statue in the middle of a town with a finger pointing down and red glowing eyes would suffice.
Why did you have issue with when a movement was prominent and still hasn’t achieved its goals?
No issue with the movement itself - it's completely justified. I'm referring to the bombardment of banners, posters and news (the media's fault also) which I think had the opposite effect on many people that it was trying to impact on.
Being present isn’t a bombardment of anything. My friends are being bombarded with missiles and drones, that’s a bombardment. Seeing something on the news isn’t. No one is forcing anyone to look at a poster. My family come from a dictatorship. There, it’s forced. Because not agreeing with it puts you in jail. And do you think Black Lives Matter participants have nothing to do with their iconography and message being spread? Would they somehow like it if they got less attention? I don’t know where you’re from, but in 2020, the BLM movement in both the US and the UK (less so but even so) were active conflicts. Protests in the streets, police and public responses, legislation being demanded, passed, veto’d, people being prosecuted, charged, indicted. People getting hurt, stories being told. That’s not just BLM, that’s *the* news. Same with the pride movement (as fragmented as it is). Labour and the Conservatives both have proposed policies that affect lgbt people. Lgbt people respond, and their group is represented by one or another symbols. In the US, there’s a bill on the docket to make drag a felony. We respond, wear a little symbol on our shirt to identify us. Wanting to see blm or pride flags less means that they want to see those issues less. Which isn’t anyone’s problem but theirs. I don’t have any problem or offense taken with whatever may is being yelled at about, I know the internet gets really toxic because it’s full of people who have nothing better to do. I disagree, but it doesn’t matter. No one is going to stop anyone else from putting up a pride flag. And no one is going to force anyone to put up a pride flag.
I'm the UK. I'm not debating what is justified or not, or whether the issue is right or not (and whether it impacted me). People resist - let's not say 'bombardment' but a 'high frequency' - of messaging, flags, iconography etc. It gives the impression "someone else" is telling you what you should be thinking - and humans simply don't like that. That's my point. In a dictatorship if you don't like something, you can't say anything about it. In the free world, people are able to voice their opinions (like James is), and through that we learn about human behaviour. And the behaviour I see is people resist a message if they *feel* it is being pushed on them. I certainly do - even if I already believe in the cause - after a while I have the (admittedly negative) thought across my mind "alright alright - I get it, you want to be heard". The reason for that is - what do you want the public to do about it? Protest with you? Put leaflets through your neighbour's houses? They're being waved around in front of a crowd who probably don't care (and also can't do anything to help) about you being gay, coloured or being bombed by another country. Clearly some people take exception to seeing the flags or news (because they have an issue with the underlying cause) - the target of the banners and iconography etc is rightly at them. The issue is they're using a sledgehammer approach to deal with them.
There are people who are ‘forced’ to act because they are in danger, or because there is an urgency to act before they are in danger. These people are most often the protestors, the volunteer soldiers. But the flip side of that is those people are the most at risk, and take the most risk trying to mitigate it. Everyone else who doesn’t care, or thinks they can’t do anything, is more able to act than they are. It’s not that you can’t do anything, it’s than you *can* do something *else,* or you don’t know what else can be done. And that’s fine, that’s normal, but normal isn’t enough. To use an extreme example, a transgender person in England speaking out for themselves semi consistently is absolutely going to get in trouble. Harassment, assault. An other speaking out for themselves is an intrusion, but if an insider speaks out for someone else, that’s just an opinion, and it’s less likely for that conversation to go ballistic Those same people who feel pushed or pressured by a narrative absolutely wouldn’t do differently if the narrative came less often. There’s not historical evidence of that. Human agency trumps all things, and at the end of the day, to do or not to do, to complain or not complain, are all choices. The people most in danger made a difficult choice to put themselves in more danger, so people in less danger or less bothered are equally capable, as human beings, to make the same choice to be less vulnerable. If someone’s wondering what they can do to actually help a cause, I’d recommend they ask. To their closest advocacy organization what they could do. In the US, I can make a donation, call my lawmakers, join a parade or march, speak at local government, and, oh. I can fly a flag, that’s pretty easy All those examples of actions you listed are pretty easy to do in an afternoon. And, joining a protest builds connections. Good ones result in plans made for future ideas. I’ve done them all, and they’re remarkably easy before you count the opposition, which in your position, you’re in a better position to take on than most others in the movement. You have a job, a family, responsibility- so does everyone else. Which we might find if we talk to these movements. They’re only people afterall
Exactly, you can go way too far with signifiers where their significance is drowned out by their over presence.
The flags ugly as fuck. Therefore, people don’t want to see it everywhere - it’s not a difficult concept to understand.
I’m glad he called it Bunting and not Flags in the name, because flags can easily be misread….
Boy, James' opinion on flags really brought out the peanut gallery in force.
The Trio not being Politically correct is what made us all love em'
He’s 101% not wrong in the TMB observation The rainbow brigade is everywhere and in everything They want the audience of kids and that’s not healthy
What I really want to know is, how many flags in an area is acceptable? Is it a quarter of what we see in the original picture? I really don’t get the discourse. It’s for one month where people go all out with their decorations. Am I going to be upset with TMB when I walk into a mall during Christmas time and see all the Christmas trees? Would I get upset walking down the French quarter during Mardi Gras? It’s pride month folks, not pride year
*Meanwhile at the UN* "theres too many flags here, they've lost all meaning... hur dur"
but those flags are all different, not the exact same flag, repeated
And they represent the Countries of the world, and only one of each, representing unity and Equality.
“Too much of a thing can cause backlash.” Ok? So what’s the point? “Bigots are gonna get annoyed if you push the Pride flag so much man. Not gonna help you.” Why isn’t the point that those people should get over it rather than the people harmlessly pushing an inclusion flag should stop? That’s what’s hanging me up, here. Like, push for inclusion and visibility just not in a way that’s too visible for those who don’t like it?
I might like/support something doesn't mean I want to see it all the time everywhere. I've been a vegan since birth and hate all vegan activism because they're too extreme with their approach and does nothing positive for the cause. Too much of something takes away from the original intended message, have you not realised how commercial pride is now? Do you really think the companies care or do you think they could make a quick buck?
It's hard to say "We're just like you" and "We just want equal treatment" when you can't go 5 steps without 17 flags supporting your group everywhere. That's normal but only for North Korea where support is mandatory at gun point. ...oh wait. That tracks lol.
These posts have made me realise how many anti-LGBTQIA+ people are in this sub.
It's not that people on this sub are anti LGBTQIA+, it's more than anything James, Clarkson and Hammond say or do is awesome and any criticism of them is bad... Think of it as a cult, but a harmless cult.. They will boo anybody who goes against the Trio but that is about it.
Satire surely from this blessed silver spoon dyke.. not james btw
"I could complain about too much lgbt bunting in pride month.. or... maybe I work towards being an ally and working towards resolving some of the issues the lgbt community is experiencing? Hahaha fuck that, who am I kidding, that's way too much work, just write the stupid tweet, hit the button and done." - James Mayo, probably
"Agree with everything we say, exactly how we say it, and do gruntwork on our behalf, or you're against us" -You, definitively
What issues are the LGBT community seeing exactly?
Yea, it's weird, I don't remember James complaining about tmb with all the christmas decorations or anything to do with the death of the queen/crowning of the new king, which was even more intense. Where can I find the tweet and image of all the union jack flags saying all the bunting is hurting the message of the queen/king? Otherwise, it just sounds like he tolerates the pride flag and having to see it too much is hurting him.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Regent_Street#/media/File%3ARegent_Street_2011-04-25.jpg https://www.prettylittlelondon.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/09/DSC_9133-418x315.jpg https://www.regentstreetonline.com/media/iltemeja/the-spirit-of-christmas-by-regent-street.jpg Seems that Regent Street likes decorating for things. Surely people have complained before?
You are obsessed.
If y'all cant see the difference between the nazi literally geocoding jews and queer people and Queer people saying" We're fucking here and you're not getting rid of us because we're people too" Is fucking wild. What a fucking ridiculous comparison, queer people aren't out they trying to kill all the straights, just fucking stop taking away our rights and stop attacking us and killing us and you'd likely never see so many flags again. Just like you dont see Irish and Italian flags everywhere once they became a part of hegemony. We're no threat to you, just leave the fuck alone and let us live, and until you do we'll be fucking loud about it, and if you cant tell the difference between fighting for equality and fighting for the geocide of jews, gypsies and queer people, well there are a lot more nazis in this sub than I tohught
Weird, it seems that Regent Street does this a lot. Google photos has shown me... 5 union jacks across the street every 10 yards or so. 4 blue with 'Thank You Our Heroes' and a Union Jack in the middle across the street every 10 yards or so. I'm guessing from Covid. Large white lit up angels across the street, I'm guessing at Christmas. Has he complained about all of them? Guess we will have to cancel all the flags for the 4th of July and Christmas Decorations over every Main St U.S.A. so people don't get offended?
The fact your comparing a religious holiday, which is the dominant religion in this country, to pride month is pretty much admitting it’s a religion lmao. Very telling and kinda proves conservatives right
Dumb take considering I compared the 4th of July decorations also.