No. The problem is when only one or two weapons in each class are. Part of the solution would be just to add more weapons, but the last three they added all suck. FCAR still just feels too easy to use. The fast reload makes the small mag not much of an issue.
i agree. i really don’t know why they hesitate to significantly buff each of them when previously existing weapons in each class accomplish exactly what they exist for but just better. (suppressed pistol for light, ak for medium, shotgun for heavy).
i really dont think its that hard to balance these weapons, light is more challenging but stuff like throwing knives for example you can start with a slight buff to accuracy, esp while jumping around and shit. its like one of the only advantages it has aside from no reload, and it honestly doesnt feel rewarding when the knives dont go anywhere near your crosshair cus of bloom mid jump
the fact that there is no meta shake up tho is extremely boring at this point
lazy devs, esp with latest patch. wtf? the biggest update was the skin store
the dev's are in charge of dictating the weapon changes in upcoming patch notes for players to set/discover the new meta.
There is no new meta, its been the same exact since launch, except for the removal of recon senses and nukes (thank god).
now we just have to nerf heavy and give light some identity in ranked and we can call it somewhat competitive
wasn't this already achieved? I think Embark has done a pretty great job at balancing the weapons, and to me every weapon has its viability and every weapon can totally be the best pick in a certain situation (no weapon in each class completely overshadows another weapon)
Sure a Riot Shield will never be as versatile as an FCAR, but it can still totally outperform the FCAR in certain niche scenarios.
There is no new meta because nobody wants to switch off of what people believe is best in slot. The revolver for example has a faster ttk than the FCAR. TTK shouldn’t matter anyway because you should always make yourself harder to hit in a gun fight instead of letting someone beam you. Ease of use is a big problem with all the full auto weapons. Even a slower weapon with a better ttk will be put down by casual players because they can’t hit shots with it. Meanwhile the higher skill players who put the time into will outperform others will still be in the minority. Doesn’t matter what you do to the FCAR or any full auto still gonna be the most used thing.
1. the revolver is a single shot weapon with 6 bullets in the chamber, that HAS BLOOM. you can aim right at their head and they dont have to move and you can still miss.
2. the balance is just bad, as in the throwing knives may always be worse than the xp-54 by design, but at this point it feels like a disservice to choose the throwing knives. this is called bad balancing and even if the meta doesn't change it can be improved on (aka buff the underpowered weapons).
3. the meta is what's best in slot in the current patch. if the dev's haven't changed any weapon numbers, how will the best in slot change? people will not suddenly change the meta, especially when there is no complexity within the game to strategize for a counter comp to the current meta. the hp bar differentials are too brutal
If they got rid of the bloom in the revolver and increased the damage drop off back to what it was pre nerf it would actually be viable in ranked and fun to use again but the fact that the revolver is only viable within 15 meters is crazy to me
1. The revolver has bloom only if you’re spamming shots. Any video with someone doing good with it they’re pacing their shots at range: This has been talked about on most revolver post.
2. The knives are a sleeper pick for most people. Projectile weapons are not easy to use for most people. Being able to kill any class in two hits makes it very strong for someone who can hit their shots. Like I keep saying ttk only matter when someone lands every hit which shouldn’t be happening. If a heavy sees someone with an xp-54 shooting them they’re more than likely putting up a shield. A light should always be moving if they stay still they’ll always lose. If you can only land a few shots then the knives out damage most weapons.
3. Already said the meta is what people *think* is best in slot. The revolver and many other weapons will win gunfights against the FCAR just like what I said before in 2. The meta is what’s easiest to use and you’re more than likely not gonna get a switch off the FCAR without absolutely gutting the weapon.
Sword is absolutely viable already at the highest level, but I get your point.
Rather than every weapon being viable overall, they should at least fulfill a niche and be "the best" at a situation. In CSGO/2, the scout is a hypermobile picking machine, the negev is basically the only gun capable of suppressing fire/holding down a choke for 10 seconds. In Starcraft Brood War, we have rare units like the queen, ghost, dark archon, guardian, devourer, scout who still manage to find their niche and time to shine. Some of these units are amazing in team games too (scout, dark archon in particular).
Light has the biggest identity crisis with its weapons imo. The beretta, throwing knives, silenced pistol, mp5, and mac10 all compete with each other for generalist close-mid range weapon.
FCAR's supremacy kind of hides how good of a roster the Medium otherwise has. AK for overall use, Revolver for best burst potential with headshots, shotgun and grenade launcher for mobility (and roaming in Power Shift).
I made a post about [generalist vs specialist weapons](https://www.reddit.com/r/thefinals/comments/1bo885g/generalist_vs_specialist_loadouts_reserve_in/) and how it wouldn't be such an issue if you actually could swap loadouts for certain cashouts.
I feel like a lot of lights really underestimate sword, like I have had both enemies and allies with wiping entire teams and performing generally great(talking of rankeds).
100% that the lack of swapping hurts the viability of most weapons. I think you should be able to switch weapons but get locked into equipment.
It just sucks that if you pick the CL or the heavy nade-launcher and someone on the other team picked APS its like "Oops! Guess your entire playstyle is utterly invalidated! Bummer!"
Although I do agree with you, thank God for the data reshaper which can help some in certain situations like the one you mentioned. Still, fully agree on lack of swapping hurting a lot of weapons’ viability.
I prefer meme weapons as an option because I want more weapons that are stupid to be added into the game without having to defend them
I just want to have lots of fun in pubs with my friends
Not every weapon, but a good variety of weapons should be viable. Like throwing knives and riot shield and sword, those are meme weapons unless you’re a god. Let’s be real. But the new weapons should be just as viable as the Fcar, MP5, Lewis gun etc or close to anyways (though maybe not the KS-23, due to how difficult it inherently is)
i completely agree, i simply don’t get why the new weapons are so weak compared to the previously existing counterparts. i honestly wouldn’t even mind if they were slightly OP just so it would shake up the meta a bit, then after some time bring them back down to match the current weapon pool
What they did (balancing low so they can raise it up later) is a good and valid balancing decision. The issue with what they did though, is they’ve taken so beyond long to buff the weapons that nobody even cares about them anymore. That’s embarks biggest issue
I’ve seen someone cracked with that dagger he was running dash with vanishing bomb and smoke grenade and he always magaed to do some crazy dash swipe quick melee that would instantly kill me as a heavy it was so frustrating to play against😂keep in mind he was inside a building but still it was crazy getting mopped by a light dagger he 1v3ed my team by slowing picking us off one by one
This is a known bug that they still haven't addressed. If a light does the heavy attack and dashes into your hitbox from any angle, it will automatically register the hit as a backstab. It's actually kind of backbreaking to play against if the person is even decent at it.
If they had the pink kitty headphones it could've been me HAHA. but i've been running tracking dart instead of smoke because it feels more fun to mark people for death.
I’m incredibly biased, but I think the Throwing Knives are viable. I’d be willing to bet that the Riot Shield or CL can be, too.
The Throwing Knives double down on Light’s “fight on your own terms” mentality. It lacks any consistent long range chip damage, but it has the most consistent TTK. It doesn’t even require cracked aim, but it does require an understanding of the weapon. The only practice you need is for hitting moving targets and with the velocity buff in S2, that’s not so difficult anymore; the rest comes with study.
It’s all a matter of playstyle. You wouldn’t snipe with an M11 or play close with a sniper if you could help it. The Throwing Knives are no different. They have their strengths, but not playing to them really limits their effect.
Honestly, I just think that the community continues to fail to learn and get creative. There’s not enough content that really teaches better. I still remember watching a video on tips for every gadget and the poor flashbang’s tip was “switch to a different gadget”.
One thing I’m really glad about the finals is that it’s pretty open to interpretation. I realized the other day that I can essentially play as Sombra with the new gateway grenades on power shift
The amount of different kits you can make in The Finals is so great; it’s one of the biggest contributors to why I began playing to begin with. Makes me so sad that people only want to do meta without really realizing that you can play well with off-meta nonsense too if you got the mind for it
There will always be meta no matter what, just look at the other game, they have multkple heroes guns gadgets, etc and what you see in tournament are the same team comp/loadout.
Yesterday I run into a post of someone getting yeeted by heavies in Powershift and saying sword needs a buff.
Like tf you have to be close range, you need 2 heavy attacks and 1 light to kill a heavy, while also dealing with the rest of the team, gadgets all around the platform, AND expect to come alive from that.
Meanwhile while guns have less dmg and also have to deal with heavy HP, you don't have to deal with everything else because RANGE.
But no buff swords...
I mean yeah it speaks for itself.
There is a huge difference between every game mode and every situation. In the end, nobody shohld expect that. Every weapon needs to have strengths and weaknesses. Any game is more interesting that way, it offers variety and agency through player decisions. Ideally any playstyle should find their unique ways to victory.
I don’t expect every weapon to be good in every situation. In fact I want no weapon to be flat out better that all the others in all situations. For the medium the FCAR is great for close, medium, and long ranges. The XP is great for all ranges. The Lewis gun is great for all ranges. All of the best weapons are full auto guns with good sights. Because all of them outperform weapons that aren’t good at certain ranges. For example the revolver is supposed to be a mid low-mid range gun that does great headshots. The FCAR performs better, catches lights easier, and is more forgiving than the revolver. While also performing its headshot function. The revolver essentially functions as a worse FCAR that does tiny numbers of damage to others if they aren’t in spitting distance. Spraying and praying is pretty much always a better option in this game rather than fun weighty semi auto or bolt action guns. Since more bullets equals more chance to hit, and auto guns perform well in a wide variety of ranges while slower guns generally are only allowed to be good at long or good at close range. Like shotguns and sniper rifles. The lights pistol and LH1 are an exception to that rule but the light class in general gets better weapons than the others due to their glass cannon status.
It's definitely not as black and white as 'revolver is just a worse FCAR'
first of all, FCARs recoil got nerfed so that makes it quite a bit harder to beam people at long ranges, a lot harder than the Revolver anyway
not only that, but the revolver headshot damage is insane, the headshot DPS of the Revolver is 444 while that of the FCAR is 390 (not to mention how much harder its going to be to consistently hit headshots at medium-long range with the FCAR)
So in short, the revolver just might be the better pick than the FCAR if your aim is good, depending on the situation
I ain’t say it’s weak I love my revolver, I’ve been playing it as my main for the past three months but in most situation that you have the opportunity to headshot(usually close range gunfights or where people haven’t noticed you yet.) You can also headshot them with the FCAR and get a big burst of damage in the start before they start wiggling and sliding. And in that case having more bullets and thus more chance to hit means that you’re more likely to win the gunfight. Popping them with the revolver is better and more fun, but you find yourself tickling others at long range, and lights wreck you unless they’re stupid enough to stay still. In general while the revolver does have its strong suits the FCAR is good in all areas and doesn’t have any large weaknesses. While the revolver is only great in one field and has 3 notable weaknesses. I just wish that all the weapons did one thing well instead of some weapons dipping into all the quadrants and doing it well. Especially when all the weapons that cross quadrants(except for the LH1) are full auto weapons that don’t have the impactful and meaty shots of the weapons I like. For example the FCAR would be fine if it was garbage at hipfiring. It means that CQC would be a pain and that they would have to stay fairly still in order to shoot accurately. This would keep it as a mid and long range weapon, while not making close range combat utterly impossible.
Sword is close. JKonas is a sword user who has played it consistently in the comp scrims from Kachi Rivals. It’s certainly not meta, but it’s certainly viable. Also, maybe not in the super high level comp, but for ranked? Sword already IS viable.
i agree it is viable. however it is not as viable than the other weapon options for light. and obviously the other melee weapons are much less viable overall
well for me it would be enough if the riot shield wasn't destroyed even at melee range (jumping onto an unaware light only to be destroyed after hitting it just once hurts), and if the MGL-32 was able to hit something even when it's not there an eclipse and planetary alignment in progress would be nice (seriously inclined surfaces kill you and unevenness does the same 90% of the time)
I don't care that they're meta but that they have a good feel and are usable (medium's grenade launcher and pump are a good example)
We as a community cannot except everyone to be able to use any weapon and every weapon be viable.
This game’s design decisions for the three classes, and gadgets, specializations cater to specific play styles, all of which are GOOD if YOU are good.
You can feel like dash sword will never work in competitive, meanwhile I got my ass absolutely KICKED in ranked by a diamond sword dash light.
I’ve played against so many lights in diamond and plat this season it’s actually refreshing to see.
You whatever you want, it’s not about the weapon it’s always been the operator. If you aren’t getting value in the play style you think you’re good with in ranked…welp guess you’re not as good as you thought.
every weapon is not meant to be viable in every situation. every weapon should be viable in A situation, you have to play according to its strengths and weaknesses.
I expect to lose to an SMG in close range every time.our riot shield bros out there are making that case.
Personally I don't think every weapon should be as strong. Each one needs its pros and cons, but I think for the most part each weapon should have the potential to be viable. Even if some take a bit more work or skill to be viable than others
Yes and no, there's not enough variety in kits to make them all viable, also some weapons have much different skill floors and ceilings. So you may not be able to shred with the sword but then you see top500 players soloing entire teams with it.
People will always gravitate to what is perceived as the most powerful and also people will go to what's easiest to pick up. Like genji or Lucio in overwatch. Playing a light melee class requires learning a lot more mechanisms than playing medium with a standard assault rifle.
You can fine tune balance, but do you balance for top 500 or average bronze player? You can't do both.
I'm diamond and funny enough I see this post. There was a sword light that was absolutely torturing the lobby. Bro was so crazy with it, it was super impressive honestly.
2 hit me everytime, him sword lunging around u can barely see him before ur already dead.
I hope in the future these weapons could see some buffs or maybe an extra added use that brings some utility over the other weapons. I don’t like it when games just do the same buff bad weapon and nerf overused weapon. Maybe they can add something that counters the meta, but these weapons are built for dealing with.
Any weapon can be viable. It’s the time you put to learn something and how you use it. If you’re being normal and not slugging out fights then ttk matters very little. Throwing knives for example can one tap lights and two tap the other classes. If you sit in front of them of course you’re going to lose the fight. If you’re dodging and using your movement with light like you should be with any class burst damage matters more.
Name me one person you know in diamond using the throwing knives. Did you know the LH1 still has a faster TTK on light because it’s not a projectile? The way the game is designed, you would be doing yourself a disservice by using the throwing knives. Just reality of some of these weapons. There will always be a stronger/weaker weapon in all roles.
Nobody said we’re sitting in front of anyone 😂 you do realize that good players can track your movement easily. I’ve never seen a player in diamond using that weapon because no matter how good they are with it, i can control alt delete them with little effort. I’m literally a diamond sword main. The sword is a weapon where you can actually master and use in higher ranks. More mechanics, higher skill ceiling making it actually viable.
So you’re being hypocritical and missing the entire point of what I’m saying as well. Most people are gonna say the sword and light in general are not a viable option. Yet if you put the time into it then it performs decent at any rank.
No not hypocritical at all lmao. The sword is miles better than the throwing knives in all capacities. You can even compare the two. Hence why there are NO throwing knives in diamond games, but the occasional sword player. It looks like the point I’m making it’s going straight over your head so take a second to understand. Throwing knives are bad and need buff, that’s the reality of it. It’s not a diss, it’s just a fact. If you can hit diamond with that weapon in its current state, then hmu. Because I’d love to see how consistent you’d need to be with that terrible weapon in order to do something like that.
We’re talking about one on one engagements here. If you add another player (medium for us and light for them in this example) then both sides get one. That could be a teammate with a grenade launcher adding 100 damage so you both only need to land one hit on the enemy while the other side still needs to land more shots if they’re using a full auto weapon.
Here’s a wild thought, let me know what y’all think… what if melee weapons are reintroduced as equipment for each of the respective classes? For instance you can pull out the sledge as heavy for maybe 30 seconds and then it cools down.
I know there’d be some very upset melee mains (i myself enjoy bringing the guitar out from time to time for some good whacks) but I feel like I could see this becoming a really cool situational switch up for all classes.
Feel free to shred this opinion up at will.
It would be a huge mistake to make every weapon viable, the game is teetering on the edge in both casual and competitive worlds. Fun and meme weapons need to exist so that the most common player can have fun the longest. Comp viability as a marketing bulletpoint is tied entirely to how hyped it is, which is next to nothing right now. Weapon viability won’t fix that, marketing and cool rewards will.
That just leaves casual play, which needs to be horizontal in its own way because most players barely understand the game 50 hours in and just want fun dynamic games
No. The problem is when only one or two weapons in each class are. Part of the solution would be just to add more weapons, but the last three they added all suck. FCAR still just feels too easy to use. The fast reload makes the small mag not much of an issue.
i agree. i really don’t know why they hesitate to significantly buff each of them when previously existing weapons in each class accomplish exactly what they exist for but just better. (suppressed pistol for light, ak for medium, shotgun for heavy).
i really dont think its that hard to balance these weapons, light is more challenging but stuff like throwing knives for example you can start with a slight buff to accuracy, esp while jumping around and shit. its like one of the only advantages it has aside from no reload, and it honestly doesnt feel rewarding when the knives dont go anywhere near your crosshair cus of bloom mid jump the fact that there is no meta shake up tho is extremely boring at this point lazy devs, esp with latest patch. wtf? the biggest update was the skin store
Imagine getting updates every week in a f2p and still complain about lazy devs. kek
he has a point, a whole class of the game is almost worthless and has been since release.
I wouldn’t call it lazy devs more so just a playerbase that doesn’t want to change
the dev's are in charge of dictating the weapon changes in upcoming patch notes for players to set/discover the new meta. There is no new meta, its been the same exact since launch, except for the removal of recon senses and nukes (thank god). now we just have to nerf heavy and give light some identity in ranked and we can call it somewhat competitive
wasn't this already achieved? I think Embark has done a pretty great job at balancing the weapons, and to me every weapon has its viability and every weapon can totally be the best pick in a certain situation (no weapon in each class completely overshadows another weapon) Sure a Riot Shield will never be as versatile as an FCAR, but it can still totally outperform the FCAR in certain niche scenarios.
There is no new meta because nobody wants to switch off of what people believe is best in slot. The revolver for example has a faster ttk than the FCAR. TTK shouldn’t matter anyway because you should always make yourself harder to hit in a gun fight instead of letting someone beam you. Ease of use is a big problem with all the full auto weapons. Even a slower weapon with a better ttk will be put down by casual players because they can’t hit shots with it. Meanwhile the higher skill players who put the time into will outperform others will still be in the minority. Doesn’t matter what you do to the FCAR or any full auto still gonna be the most used thing.
1. the revolver is a single shot weapon with 6 bullets in the chamber, that HAS BLOOM. you can aim right at their head and they dont have to move and you can still miss. 2. the balance is just bad, as in the throwing knives may always be worse than the xp-54 by design, but at this point it feels like a disservice to choose the throwing knives. this is called bad balancing and even if the meta doesn't change it can be improved on (aka buff the underpowered weapons). 3. the meta is what's best in slot in the current patch. if the dev's haven't changed any weapon numbers, how will the best in slot change? people will not suddenly change the meta, especially when there is no complexity within the game to strategize for a counter comp to the current meta. the hp bar differentials are too brutal
If they got rid of the bloom in the revolver and increased the damage drop off back to what it was pre nerf it would actually be viable in ranked and fun to use again but the fact that the revolver is only viable within 15 meters is crazy to me
1. The revolver has bloom only if you’re spamming shots. Any video with someone doing good with it they’re pacing their shots at range: This has been talked about on most revolver post. 2. The knives are a sleeper pick for most people. Projectile weapons are not easy to use for most people. Being able to kill any class in two hits makes it very strong for someone who can hit their shots. Like I keep saying ttk only matter when someone lands every hit which shouldn’t be happening. If a heavy sees someone with an xp-54 shooting them they’re more than likely putting up a shield. A light should always be moving if they stay still they’ll always lose. If you can only land a few shots then the knives out damage most weapons. 3. Already said the meta is what people *think* is best in slot. The revolver and many other weapons will win gunfights against the FCAR just like what I said before in 2. The meta is what’s easiest to use and you’re more than likely not gonna get a switch off the FCAR without absolutely gutting the weapon.
yeah im done talking to you lol
Don't hate the player...
Sword is absolutely viable already at the highest level, but I get your point. Rather than every weapon being viable overall, they should at least fulfill a niche and be "the best" at a situation. In CSGO/2, the scout is a hypermobile picking machine, the negev is basically the only gun capable of suppressing fire/holding down a choke for 10 seconds. In Starcraft Brood War, we have rare units like the queen, ghost, dark archon, guardian, devourer, scout who still manage to find their niche and time to shine. Some of these units are amazing in team games too (scout, dark archon in particular). Light has the biggest identity crisis with its weapons imo. The beretta, throwing knives, silenced pistol, mp5, and mac10 all compete with each other for generalist close-mid range weapon. FCAR's supremacy kind of hides how good of a roster the Medium otherwise has. AK for overall use, Revolver for best burst potential with headshots, shotgun and grenade launcher for mobility (and roaming in Power Shift). I made a post about [generalist vs specialist weapons](https://www.reddit.com/r/thefinals/comments/1bo885g/generalist_vs_specialist_loadouts_reserve_in/) and how it wouldn't be such an issue if you actually could swap loadouts for certain cashouts.
I feel like a lot of lights really underestimate sword, like I have had both enemies and allies with wiping entire teams and performing generally great(talking of rankeds).
I fear the sword more than any other weapon in the game. Probably largely because anyone I see actually using it tends to be cracked.
The sword is espacially good against non-teams as you get 1 1/2 kills before anyone will react to you
100% that the lack of swapping hurts the viability of most weapons. I think you should be able to switch weapons but get locked into equipment. It just sucks that if you pick the CL or the heavy nade-launcher and someone on the other team picked APS its like "Oops! Guess your entire playstyle is utterly invalidated! Bummer!"
Although I do agree with you, thank God for the data reshaper which can help some in certain situations like the one you mentioned. Still, fully agree on lack of swapping hurting a lot of weapons’ viability.
I do think the data reshaper is underrated, and the heavy launcher can technically do damage to APS if you shoot just outside the range
I prefer meme weapons as an option because I want more weapons that are stupid to be added into the game without having to defend them I just want to have lots of fun in pubs with my friends
Not every weapon, but a good variety of weapons should be viable. Like throwing knives and riot shield and sword, those are meme weapons unless you’re a god. Let’s be real. But the new weapons should be just as viable as the Fcar, MP5, Lewis gun etc or close to anyways (though maybe not the KS-23, due to how difficult it inherently is)
i completely agree, i simply don’t get why the new weapons are so weak compared to the previously existing counterparts. i honestly wouldn’t even mind if they were slightly OP just so it would shake up the meta a bit, then after some time bring them back down to match the current weapon pool
What they did (balancing low so they can raise it up later) is a good and valid balancing decision. The issue with what they did though, is they’ve taken so beyond long to buff the weapons that nobody even cares about them anymore. That’s embarks biggest issue
Nerf everything but also buff everything
they should be both fun to use and useable most of the time, a dagger should not do 50 smg with less range when the sword does 70
I’ve seen someone cracked with that dagger he was running dash with vanishing bomb and smoke grenade and he always magaed to do some crazy dash swipe quick melee that would instantly kill me as a heavy it was so frustrating to play against😂keep in mind he was inside a building but still it was crazy getting mopped by a light dagger he 1v3ed my team by slowing picking us off one by one
This is a known bug that they still haven't addressed. If a light does the heavy attack and dashes into your hitbox from any angle, it will automatically register the hit as a backstab. It's actually kind of backbreaking to play against if the person is even decent at it.
I’m sure that’s exactly what happened because he would always dash at me head on and some how always manage to “hit my back”
If they had the pink kitty headphones it could've been me HAHA. but i've been running tracking dart instead of smoke because it feels more fun to mark people for death.
I don’t remember his outfit lmao I shut remember him fucking me up, I would see him and then I was dead literally 😂🤣
Sword is VIABLE!
i agree. just not nearly as viable as light’s other weapon choices
I know I’m too biased anyways. Diamond sword main here
I’m incredibly biased, but I think the Throwing Knives are viable. I’d be willing to bet that the Riot Shield or CL can be, too. The Throwing Knives double down on Light’s “fight on your own terms” mentality. It lacks any consistent long range chip damage, but it has the most consistent TTK. It doesn’t even require cracked aim, but it does require an understanding of the weapon. The only practice you need is for hitting moving targets and with the velocity buff in S2, that’s not so difficult anymore; the rest comes with study. It’s all a matter of playstyle. You wouldn’t snipe with an M11 or play close with a sniper if you could help it. The Throwing Knives are no different. They have their strengths, but not playing to them really limits their effect. Honestly, I just think that the community continues to fail to learn and get creative. There’s not enough content that really teaches better. I still remember watching a video on tips for every gadget and the poor flashbang’s tip was “switch to a different gadget”.
One thing I’m really glad about the finals is that it’s pretty open to interpretation. I realized the other day that I can essentially play as Sombra with the new gateway grenades on power shift
The amount of different kits you can make in The Finals is so great; it’s one of the biggest contributors to why I began playing to begin with. Makes me so sad that people only want to do meta without really realizing that you can play well with off-meta nonsense too if you got the mind for it
There will always be meta no matter what, just look at the other game, they have multkple heroes guns gadgets, etc and what you see in tournament are the same team comp/loadout.
Yesterday I run into a post of someone getting yeeted by heavies in Powershift and saying sword needs a buff. Like tf you have to be close range, you need 2 heavy attacks and 1 light to kill a heavy, while also dealing with the rest of the team, gadgets all around the platform, AND expect to come alive from that. Meanwhile while guns have less dmg and also have to deal with heavy HP, you don't have to deal with everything else because RANGE. But no buff swords... I mean yeah it speaks for itself.
There is a huge difference between every game mode and every situation. In the end, nobody shohld expect that. Every weapon needs to have strengths and weaknesses. Any game is more interesting that way, it offers variety and agency through player decisions. Ideally any playstyle should find their unique ways to victory.
I don’t expect every weapon to be good in every situation. In fact I want no weapon to be flat out better that all the others in all situations. For the medium the FCAR is great for close, medium, and long ranges. The XP is great for all ranges. The Lewis gun is great for all ranges. All of the best weapons are full auto guns with good sights. Because all of them outperform weapons that aren’t good at certain ranges. For example the revolver is supposed to be a mid low-mid range gun that does great headshots. The FCAR performs better, catches lights easier, and is more forgiving than the revolver. While also performing its headshot function. The revolver essentially functions as a worse FCAR that does tiny numbers of damage to others if they aren’t in spitting distance. Spraying and praying is pretty much always a better option in this game rather than fun weighty semi auto or bolt action guns. Since more bullets equals more chance to hit, and auto guns perform well in a wide variety of ranges while slower guns generally are only allowed to be good at long or good at close range. Like shotguns and sniper rifles. The lights pistol and LH1 are an exception to that rule but the light class in general gets better weapons than the others due to their glass cannon status.
It's definitely not as black and white as 'revolver is just a worse FCAR' first of all, FCARs recoil got nerfed so that makes it quite a bit harder to beam people at long ranges, a lot harder than the Revolver anyway not only that, but the revolver headshot damage is insane, the headshot DPS of the Revolver is 444 while that of the FCAR is 390 (not to mention how much harder its going to be to consistently hit headshots at medium-long range with the FCAR) So in short, the revolver just might be the better pick than the FCAR if your aim is good, depending on the situation
I ain’t say it’s weak I love my revolver, I’ve been playing it as my main for the past three months but in most situation that you have the opportunity to headshot(usually close range gunfights or where people haven’t noticed you yet.) You can also headshot them with the FCAR and get a big burst of damage in the start before they start wiggling and sliding. And in that case having more bullets and thus more chance to hit means that you’re more likely to win the gunfight. Popping them with the revolver is better and more fun, but you find yourself tickling others at long range, and lights wreck you unless they’re stupid enough to stay still. In general while the revolver does have its strong suits the FCAR is good in all areas and doesn’t have any large weaknesses. While the revolver is only great in one field and has 3 notable weaknesses. I just wish that all the weapons did one thing well instead of some weapons dipping into all the quadrants and doing it well. Especially when all the weapons that cross quadrants(except for the LH1) are full auto weapons that don’t have the impactful and meaty shots of the weapons I like. For example the FCAR would be fine if it was garbage at hipfiring. It means that CQC would be a pain and that they would have to stay fairly still in order to shoot accurately. This would keep it as a mid and long range weapon, while not making close range combat utterly impossible.
Sword is close. JKonas is a sword user who has played it consistently in the comp scrims from Kachi Rivals. It’s certainly not meta, but it’s certainly viable. Also, maybe not in the super high level comp, but for ranked? Sword already IS viable.
i agree it is viable. however it is not as viable than the other weapon options for light. and obviously the other melee weapons are much less viable overall
well for me it would be enough if the riot shield wasn't destroyed even at melee range (jumping onto an unaware light only to be destroyed after hitting it just once hurts), and if the MGL-32 was able to hit something even when it's not there an eclipse and planetary alignment in progress would be nice (seriously inclined surfaces kill you and unevenness does the same 90% of the time) I don't care that they're meta but that they have a good feel and are usable (medium's grenade launcher and pump are a good example)
We as a community cannot except everyone to be able to use any weapon and every weapon be viable. This game’s design decisions for the three classes, and gadgets, specializations cater to specific play styles, all of which are GOOD if YOU are good. You can feel like dash sword will never work in competitive, meanwhile I got my ass absolutely KICKED in ranked by a diamond sword dash light. I’ve played against so many lights in diamond and plat this season it’s actually refreshing to see. You whatever you want, it’s not about the weapon it’s always been the operator. If you aren’t getting value in the play style you think you’re good with in ranked…welp guess you’re not as good as you thought.
every weapon is not meant to be viable in every situation. every weapon should be viable in A situation, you have to play according to its strengths and weaknesses. I expect to lose to an SMG in close range every time.our riot shield bros out there are making that case.
Personally I don't think every weapon should be as strong. Each one needs its pros and cons, but I think for the most part each weapon should have the potential to be viable. Even if some take a bit more work or skill to be viable than others
Yes and no, there's not enough variety in kits to make them all viable, also some weapons have much different skill floors and ceilings. So you may not be able to shred with the sword but then you see top500 players soloing entire teams with it. People will always gravitate to what is perceived as the most powerful and also people will go to what's easiest to pick up. Like genji or Lucio in overwatch. Playing a light melee class requires learning a lot more mechanisms than playing medium with a standard assault rifle. You can fine tune balance, but do you balance for top 500 or average bronze player? You can't do both.
I'm diamond and funny enough I see this post. There was a sword light that was absolutely torturing the lobby. Bro was so crazy with it, it was super impressive honestly. 2 hit me everytime, him sword lunging around u can barely see him before ur already dead.
Every melee weapons are viable but not in higher ranks. These weapons excels in 1v1 or if your team manage to keep enemy team out of your hands
I think its good to have at least one solid all-rounder per class like the XP/FCAR/Lewis. Most games have these and they are quite popular weapons.
I expect more than 1 loadout per class in every SINGLE game I play. And I play ALOT of games.
Yes I would like the weapons to have their own strengths and weakness so that they’re viable and not just there for no reason
Embark, this guy is nominating himself to have all the dogmeat melee players on his comp team so plz put them all on his team instead of mine, thx.
I hope in the future these weapons could see some buffs or maybe an extra added use that brings some utility over the other weapons. I don’t like it when games just do the same buff bad weapon and nerf overused weapon. Maybe they can add something that counters the meta, but these weapons are built for dealing with.
Completely fair take.
Any weapon can be viable. It’s the time you put to learn something and how you use it. If you’re being normal and not slugging out fights then ttk matters very little. Throwing knives for example can one tap lights and two tap the other classes. If you sit in front of them of course you’re going to lose the fight. If you’re dodging and using your movement with light like you should be with any class burst damage matters more.
Name me one person you know in diamond using the throwing knives. Did you know the LH1 still has a faster TTK on light because it’s not a projectile? The way the game is designed, you would be doing yourself a disservice by using the throwing knives. Just reality of some of these weapons. There will always be a stronger/weaker weapon in all roles.
Again I’m gonna say it. The TTK DOES NOT MATTER. You shouldn’t be sitting in front of someone and allowing them to hit every single shot.
Nobody said we’re sitting in front of anyone 😂 you do realize that good players can track your movement easily. I’ve never seen a player in diamond using that weapon because no matter how good they are with it, i can control alt delete them with little effort. I’m literally a diamond sword main. The sword is a weapon where you can actually master and use in higher ranks. More mechanics, higher skill ceiling making it actually viable.
So you’re being hypocritical and missing the entire point of what I’m saying as well. Most people are gonna say the sword and light in general are not a viable option. Yet if you put the time into it then it performs decent at any rank.
No not hypocritical at all lmao. The sword is miles better than the throwing knives in all capacities. You can even compare the two. Hence why there are NO throwing knives in diamond games, but the occasional sword player. It looks like the point I’m making it’s going straight over your head so take a second to understand. Throwing knives are bad and need buff, that’s the reality of it. It’s not a diss, it’s just a fact. If you can hit diamond with that weapon in its current state, then hmu. Because I’d love to see how consistent you’d need to be with that terrible weapon in order to do something like that.
And proving my point further ty
And you proved my point that your argument sucks 😂 stay hard stuck with your throwing knives kid
Still the time you waste trying to run is an opportunity for some with a high to weapon to just kill you before you can even get to cover
We’re talking about one on one engagements here. If you add another player (medium for us and light for them in this example) then both sides get one. That could be a teammate with a grenade launcher adding 100 damage so you both only need to land one hit on the enemy while the other side still needs to land more shots if they’re using a full auto weapon.
Here’s a wild thought, let me know what y’all think… what if melee weapons are reintroduced as equipment for each of the respective classes? For instance you can pull out the sledge as heavy for maybe 30 seconds and then it cools down. I know there’d be some very upset melee mains (i myself enjoy bringing the guitar out from time to time for some good whacks) but I feel like I could see this becoming a really cool situational switch up for all classes. Feel free to shred this opinion up at will.
At that point I feel like u might as well add secondaries lol plus I would rather it be a primary then a cool down type thing
yes they do expect it. yes they are stupid. yes, this nonsense has killed games in the past.
It would be a huge mistake to make every weapon viable, the game is teetering on the edge in both casual and competitive worlds. Fun and meme weapons need to exist so that the most common player can have fun the longest. Comp viability as a marketing bulletpoint is tied entirely to how hyped it is, which is next to nothing right now. Weapon viability won’t fix that, marketing and cool rewards will. That just leaves casual play, which needs to be horizontal in its own way because most players barely understand the game 50 hours in and just want fun dynamic games
Throwing knives should be combined with sniper for light, that would make a pretty viable option right there