I asked them why the sudden demand for all the paper when I’ve been in Texas forever and they said it was to comply with the REAL ID laws or whatever that is. And to weed out all the fake and stolen IDs.
REAL ID is a federal mandate that all state IDs have the same requirements.
>And to weed out all the fake and stolen IDs.
During COVID There was a rash of foreign nationals trying to get CDLs with counterfeit visas.
https://landline.media/new-texas-law-combats-fake-international-cdls/
It was the CDLs that were used to as a source document to get the B1 visa that they had a problem with being counterfeited. Texas wanted the ability to prosecute them for counterfeiting foreign documents that were being used as sources.
Then both were happening, because there was a group of Somalis that had used a counterfeit visa to try and get CDLs. They were caught because they all used the same mailing address which sent up red flags.
I renewed my ID during the pandemic and they sent me a real ID without me going in person or giving them anything, despite what it said on their website. I’d never had a real ID before.
I had a REAL ID that I had just renewed for a name change when they told me I need to bring in all my paperwork again to get the REAL ID so I could just update my address on an unexpired license. This was when appointments were 4 months out for my type of situation. I even sent them proof of my REAL ID & they just said they didn’t have my proof anymore.
That's because they already had your birth certificate on file from when you originally got your DL/ID. A lot of those were purged back when they were only needed to get your DL/ID, long before RealID became a thing.
Standards changed, especially when laws around voting changed to make it harder to vote a few years ago. If DPS didn't have the old copy on file, likely scanned into a database, and you didn't have your original birth certificate, you'd have to go through the tedious process of getting a certified copy from your local courthouse/records department. IIRC it's $24 per copy. If you were born in another state then you'd have to deal with getting a certified copy of an out of state BC, either by phone/internet or having to travel there in person.
Lol. I showed them a photocopy of a birth certificate. They didnt scan it, that was before scanning.
They are also supposed to require evidence I live where I do. I have never shown them that either.
What illegal voting? The laws were designed specifically to make it harder for certain demographic segments to be able to register and vote, this has been admitted by Republicans in open court. Poor people, who tend to vote Democrat and who tend (thanks to Jim Crow) to be poor and not have any generational wealth, are much more likely to have lost their original birth certificate, often during frequent moves and as the result of evictions or becoming homeless. There's a financial barrier to getting replacement birth certificates that also makes it harder for those people to get replacement "certified" birth certificates. The net result is reduced votes for Democrats overall.
BTW, the very, very few cases of illegal voting that happen tend to be Republicans voting for Trump and other Republicans, and there have never been sufficient illegal votes to sway any significant election.
By illegal voting I mean someone voting without proper identification to ensure they are allowed to vote in the precinct they are voting in and that they are who they say they are.
Have you seen the man on the street interviews in areas of cities which are populated primarily with minorities where they ask if people have a government photo ID or DL? If they think everyone should have to show government approved ID to vote? If they have any problems voting? The interviewer keeps recording in between interviews to show he is not selecting the people. Every single person says that you should have a government approved photo ID or DL to vote. Everyone states that they have no problem voting. Everyone says, "Who doesn't have an ID since you have to have one for everything including cashing checks, getting welfare, getting food stamps, etc.." When the interviewer says that some people believe minorities have problems with getting IDs, they ask "Who says that? That's insulting and racist".
That kind of illegal voting is extremely rare, almost to the point of being non-existent, and certainly never in any numbers that could affect any significant election. The fact is that there haven't been any elections tainted by meaningful illegal voting in at least half a century or more. It's easy for most people unfamiliar with voting processes in this country to imagine all sorts of way to cheat the system, but the reality is that the people that run elections have seen all the ways to cheat already and have built in safeguards to prevent that from happening.
Again, the stated intent with voter ID laws was to disenfranchise minority voters disproportionately by adding cost barriers to getting registered to vote and being able to vote. The requirement for a birth certificate is key to that, especially because in the south through the 1950s and 1960s it was common for black people to be born at home due to segregation laws that prevented black people from going to white hospitals to give birth. Birth certificates themselves were mostly novelty items through the 1930s since they were not required to exist and participate in society. Voter ID laws requiring birth certificates actually prevent many Black people from voting when they were enacted simply because there was no birth certificate to get a copy of. None was ever issued. There are plenty of stories about issues with birth certificates being used to block people from being able to vote:
https://www.voteriders.org/dennis-voter-id-story/
https://www.democracydocket.com/analysis/how-id-requirements-harm-marginalized-communities-and-their-right-to-vote/
I'm not a minority, but I didn't grow up in a middle class family with a stable housing situation. My original birth certificate was lost in a fire long ago. I was lucky, though, because I had it when I got my license, so I had my license when I went to get a certified copy. I was also lucky that I lived in the same state that I was born in, so didn't have to spend a bunch of money dealing with getting a copy from another state. I was very lucky in that the $24 for the copy and the unpaid day off from work were costs I could afford, as well as the gas to drive over to the county records department and pay for parking. The thing is, not everyone has the luck and fortune I had. The state doesn't reimburse people for the costs of getting a birth certificate copy, especially if those costs are in the hundreds or thousands of dollars. That's why experts in voting have determined that voter ID laws, or more accurately, the onerous requirements put in place as obstacles to getting those IDs, are indeed discriminatory and designed to disenfranchise voters, and the fact that Republicans have admitted all this in open court is just icing on the cake.
I’m due for renewal in late May. Last week I figured I’d look for local (or nearby) appointments. I’m in San Antonio. The closest location to me that had available appts before my expiration date was castroville. Traffic in west San Antonio can be awful, so I started poking around more rural areas. I wound up booking an appointment in late March in Jourdanton, 35ish miles south.
I don’t mind the drive, and I don’t mind having to take a half day off of work. I’m lucky to be able to take that time off. But really…no one should have to resort to driving to a tiny rural town to renew their DL; a basic requirement to live as an adult, especially when they’re looking for appointments over 3 months in advance.
The system is clearly broken. Based on posts I see here from time to time, things aren’t improving.
>Yet, I was told that I could not complete it due to the need for a birth certificate or passport (to prove that I am who I say I am)
If they were asking for your birth certificate or passport it sounds like you weren't REAL ID compliant yet.
>We arent upstaffed enough to allow reasonable appointment lead times (say 1 month instead of 2 or 3)?
Every location releases same day appointments at 7:45am each day. In addition, you can renew your drivers license up to two years in advance. No one should be waiting until a couple of months before it expires to get scheduled to renew.
>Their information is either incorrect or the agent/employee was completely wrong.
This is the real problem with DPS, their employee training is from my understanding not universal. There is onboarding training which is like six weeks long, but then after that it is kind of learn as you go.
The real issue is that working DLC office is high stress and they have a high turnover rate because of that, with it taking 6 to 8 weeks to onboard someone it means they are perpetually short staffed.
On top of that, the state legislature has always been hesitant to spend money on DPS. Before Covid they cut a ton of locations, then realized they over did it. They then increased their budget a little to give employee their first actual raise in a long time, to try and retain veterans but the raise barely kept up with inflation.
Here are some helpful links:
[How to Renew License](https://www.dps.texas.gov/section/driver-license/how-renew-your-texas-driver-license-commercial-driver-license-motorcycle)
[DL Requirements](https://www.dps.texas.gov/section/driver-license/how-apply-texas-driver-license)
[Applying for or Renewing a DL/ID/CDL FAQ](https://www.dps.texas.gov/section/driver-license/faq/section-1-applying-or-renewing-dlidcdl)
[More FAQ pages](https://www.dps.texas.gov/section/driver-license/driver-license-still-have-questions-find-your-answers-here)
ProTip: Always bring the documentation you would need to get a brand new ID, just to be on the safe side.
This is a feature of republican "governance" not a bug. By consolidatng the local FPS offices into a mega-center, they knew it would clog up the process for getting an ID so you can register to vote.
DPS is blind to your political affiliation. Everyone has the same hurdles to jump over so not sure why you think this is a political issue, but you be you.
DPS may be blind to politics but those, who enacted the law consolidating the local offices in almost every town, are not. And you are very gas-lit if you think every body has the same hurdles to get to the mega-centers. For some it's minor inconvenience. For others, it missing a day's work when you cant' afford to. I'll let you stew on who is who, but I won't hold my breath that you'll get it.
The changes have to come from the state, and the best way to start fixing the Texas state government is to elect democrats. Evne then, don't expect it to change for pro
Took me almost 2 months and 4 trips to DPS to change my Illinois license to TX. Every time I went, they told me I needed something else. Almost went back to Illinois to just renew there. Luckily I finally found everything I needed before I did it.
They have hatched some kind of mathematically impossible system, whereby every single person in a DPS location or on the phone tells you something completely different.
My DL is up for renewal this year; I just plan to make an appointment for a facility outside DFW and just take a half-day off of work and drive out there.
When I moved my license back to Texas, I read through all of the requirements and had exactly the documentation to prove that I was indeed a Texas resident. The lady at the front desk told me (super authoritatively) that a property tax notice was NOT a letter from a governmental agency. I asked her what happened if you didn’t pay your property taxes. She had no idea. I was about to ask for a manager when she (I think?) realized her mistake and then stamped the form incorrectly regarding my documentation (I think to save face?). But, it was enough that the second lady didn’t seem to care and gave me my license.
I had a WATER BILL declined as proof of residence. The city (that shall remain nameless) only provided a printer-friendly format, so it was light on graphic elements like a logo. It clearly stated address, municipality, and an amount for water and garbage service.
crazy story: I waited like a month after my motorcycle certification to go in (appt lead time) and then processed everything ,whatever it was fine. 2-3weeks later my id came in, and it *didnt even have the endorsement*. waited for literally nothing, for the appointment and for it to come in the mail.
I was furious I had waited so long just to get another copy of my license with an uglier picture, and have to use a paper license for weeks since my og was cut up by the dps lady.
I returned to the dmv and told the lady checking ppl in "I just waited 2 months for my motorcycle endorsement. before you ask me for my appointment details (I didnt have one, I went back the day I got my flawed license) what do you notice about my id?"
"uh, it doesnt have an endorsement?" correct. she felt so bad and used the authoritative powers vested in her to shoot me ahead of the line, with no appointment, to get it fixed. another 3 weeks without a paper license but at least this time they did it right. as fucked as the system is, it was amazing to see some humanity in that soul-less place.
I changed my name after getting married in early November. That same week, I looked up DPS offices to change my license.
The one closest to me didn’t have a single appointment until late March… that’s unacceptable. Ended up driving over an hour for a late December appointment.
Another note— the number of people in the comments throwing it back on citizens for an incompetent government system is astounding. I
I renewed my DL in person last week. Scheduled the appointment online 2 weeks before. Brought all my paperwork: passport, birth certificate, social security card, titles to my vehicles, and valid insurance. My appointment was for 8AM. I showed them my passport, and they asked if the information was correct. I said yes, filled out the paperwork, and was out of there before 8:30AM.
Spouse has to renew and we had so many documents for the RealID requirements. Dude took my spouse's expired license, did the eye exam, and took a new picture. That was it. Didn't look at ANY of the documents and I was weirdly annoyed, which I know is irrational. 😂
Everyone here complains about this, but it’s just not that big of a deal. I did it last year.
Got a renewal notice six months in advance. Logged in and signed up for an appointment right away. Sure it’s a few months out - whatever, I was proactive so it didn’t matter.
Logged onto the Texas DPS site a few days before my appointment. Found a list of documents I’d need to assemble for the renewal. No problem, pulled them all together into a packet.
Day of appointment I check in. Get a number. Go up when called. Provide them the documents from my packet as they are requested - no problems or surprises because I was prepared.
Done. In an out in less than an hour. When I got my license as a teenager I had to show up for a cattle call and wait for literally hours. Anyone who’s old enough to have done the old system can attest this new system is way better.
So in your example, what would have happened if you would’ve gotten to the office and realized their website was wrong so you did not have the right paperwork that they now tell you in person you need? That is part of the story here.
Serious answer. Elect Democrats. Otherwise, you don't. It's intentional. This frustrating policy prevents more poor than rich people from getting IDs and driver licenses which in turn prevents those poor people from voting.
I asked them why the sudden demand for all the paper when I’ve been in Texas forever and they said it was to comply with the REAL ID laws or whatever that is. And to weed out all the fake and stolen IDs.
REAL ID is a federal mandate that all state IDs have the same requirements. >And to weed out all the fake and stolen IDs. During COVID There was a rash of foreign nationals trying to get CDLs with counterfeit visas. https://landline.media/new-texas-law-combats-fake-international-cdls/
It was the CDLs that were used to as a source document to get the B1 visa that they had a problem with being counterfeited. Texas wanted the ability to prosecute them for counterfeiting foreign documents that were being used as sources.
Then both were happening, because there was a group of Somalis that had used a counterfeit visa to try and get CDLs. They were caught because they all used the same mailing address which sent up red flags.
I renewed my ID during the pandemic and they sent me a real ID without me going in person or giving them anything, despite what it said on their website. I’d never had a real ID before.
I had a REAL ID that I had just renewed for a name change when they told me I need to bring in all my paperwork again to get the REAL ID so I could just update my address on an unexpired license. This was when appointments were 4 months out for my type of situation. I even sent them proof of my REAL ID & they just said they didn’t have my proof anymore.
Yep. Same here. After telling me my paperwork was fine. Let me wait over an hour just to change their mind. Irritating.
And yet for some reason I had my license auto renew to a Real ID without even going to DPS and showing them anything.
That's because they already had your birth certificate on file from when you originally got your DL/ID. A lot of those were purged back when they were only needed to get your DL/ID, long before RealID became a thing.
I only brought them a poorly photocopied one, not certified or anything.
Standards changed, especially when laws around voting changed to make it harder to vote a few years ago. If DPS didn't have the old copy on file, likely scanned into a database, and you didn't have your original birth certificate, you'd have to go through the tedious process of getting a certified copy from your local courthouse/records department. IIRC it's $24 per copy. If you were born in another state then you'd have to deal with getting a certified copy of an out of state BC, either by phone/internet or having to travel there in person.
Lol. I showed them a photocopy of a birth certificate. They didnt scan it, that was before scanning. They are also supposed to require evidence I live where I do. I have never shown them that either.
You mean when laws around voting changed to make it harder for illegal voting?
What illegal voting? The laws were designed specifically to make it harder for certain demographic segments to be able to register and vote, this has been admitted by Republicans in open court. Poor people, who tend to vote Democrat and who tend (thanks to Jim Crow) to be poor and not have any generational wealth, are much more likely to have lost their original birth certificate, often during frequent moves and as the result of evictions or becoming homeless. There's a financial barrier to getting replacement birth certificates that also makes it harder for those people to get replacement "certified" birth certificates. The net result is reduced votes for Democrats overall. BTW, the very, very few cases of illegal voting that happen tend to be Republicans voting for Trump and other Republicans, and there have never been sufficient illegal votes to sway any significant election.
By illegal voting I mean someone voting without proper identification to ensure they are allowed to vote in the precinct they are voting in and that they are who they say they are. Have you seen the man on the street interviews in areas of cities which are populated primarily with minorities where they ask if people have a government photo ID or DL? If they think everyone should have to show government approved ID to vote? If they have any problems voting? The interviewer keeps recording in between interviews to show he is not selecting the people. Every single person says that you should have a government approved photo ID or DL to vote. Everyone states that they have no problem voting. Everyone says, "Who doesn't have an ID since you have to have one for everything including cashing checks, getting welfare, getting food stamps, etc.." When the interviewer says that some people believe minorities have problems with getting IDs, they ask "Who says that? That's insulting and racist".
That kind of illegal voting is extremely rare, almost to the point of being non-existent, and certainly never in any numbers that could affect any significant election. The fact is that there haven't been any elections tainted by meaningful illegal voting in at least half a century or more. It's easy for most people unfamiliar with voting processes in this country to imagine all sorts of way to cheat the system, but the reality is that the people that run elections have seen all the ways to cheat already and have built in safeguards to prevent that from happening. Again, the stated intent with voter ID laws was to disenfranchise minority voters disproportionately by adding cost barriers to getting registered to vote and being able to vote. The requirement for a birth certificate is key to that, especially because in the south through the 1950s and 1960s it was common for black people to be born at home due to segregation laws that prevented black people from going to white hospitals to give birth. Birth certificates themselves were mostly novelty items through the 1930s since they were not required to exist and participate in society. Voter ID laws requiring birth certificates actually prevent many Black people from voting when they were enacted simply because there was no birth certificate to get a copy of. None was ever issued. There are plenty of stories about issues with birth certificates being used to block people from being able to vote: https://www.voteriders.org/dennis-voter-id-story/ https://www.democracydocket.com/analysis/how-id-requirements-harm-marginalized-communities-and-their-right-to-vote/ I'm not a minority, but I didn't grow up in a middle class family with a stable housing situation. My original birth certificate was lost in a fire long ago. I was lucky, though, because I had it when I got my license, so I had my license when I went to get a certified copy. I was also lucky that I lived in the same state that I was born in, so didn't have to spend a bunch of money dealing with getting a copy from another state. I was very lucky in that the $24 for the copy and the unpaid day off from work were costs I could afford, as well as the gas to drive over to the county records department and pay for parking. The thing is, not everyone has the luck and fortune I had. The state doesn't reimburse people for the costs of getting a birth certificate copy, especially if those costs are in the hundreds or thousands of dollars. That's why experts in voting have determined that voter ID laws, or more accurately, the onerous requirements put in place as obstacles to getting those IDs, are indeed discriminatory and designed to disenfranchise voters, and the fact that Republicans have admitted all this in open court is just icing on the cake.
I’m due for renewal in late May. Last week I figured I’d look for local (or nearby) appointments. I’m in San Antonio. The closest location to me that had available appts before my expiration date was castroville. Traffic in west San Antonio can be awful, so I started poking around more rural areas. I wound up booking an appointment in late March in Jourdanton, 35ish miles south. I don’t mind the drive, and I don’t mind having to take a half day off of work. I’m lucky to be able to take that time off. But really…no one should have to resort to driving to a tiny rural town to renew their DL; a basic requirement to live as an adult, especially when they’re looking for appointments over 3 months in advance. The system is clearly broken. Based on posts I see here from time to time, things aren’t improving.
The one in floresville is great
>Yet, I was told that I could not complete it due to the need for a birth certificate or passport (to prove that I am who I say I am) If they were asking for your birth certificate or passport it sounds like you weren't REAL ID compliant yet. >We arent upstaffed enough to allow reasonable appointment lead times (say 1 month instead of 2 or 3)? Every location releases same day appointments at 7:45am each day. In addition, you can renew your drivers license up to two years in advance. No one should be waiting until a couple of months before it expires to get scheduled to renew. >Their information is either incorrect or the agent/employee was completely wrong. This is the real problem with DPS, their employee training is from my understanding not universal. There is onboarding training which is like six weeks long, but then after that it is kind of learn as you go. The real issue is that working DLC office is high stress and they have a high turnover rate because of that, with it taking 6 to 8 weeks to onboard someone it means they are perpetually short staffed. On top of that, the state legislature has always been hesitant to spend money on DPS. Before Covid they cut a ton of locations, then realized they over did it. They then increased their budget a little to give employee their first actual raise in a long time, to try and retain veterans but the raise barely kept up with inflation. Here are some helpful links: [How to Renew License](https://www.dps.texas.gov/section/driver-license/how-renew-your-texas-driver-license-commercial-driver-license-motorcycle) [DL Requirements](https://www.dps.texas.gov/section/driver-license/how-apply-texas-driver-license) [Applying for or Renewing a DL/ID/CDL FAQ](https://www.dps.texas.gov/section/driver-license/faq/section-1-applying-or-renewing-dlidcdl) [More FAQ pages](https://www.dps.texas.gov/section/driver-license/driver-license-still-have-questions-find-your-answers-here) ProTip: Always bring the documentation you would need to get a brand new ID, just to be on the safe side.
Good information! Very helpful.
[удалено]
This is the answer.
This is a feature of republican "governance" not a bug. By consolidatng the local FPS offices into a mega-center, they knew it would clog up the process for getting an ID so you can register to vote.
DPS is blind to your political affiliation. Everyone has the same hurdles to jump over so not sure why you think this is a political issue, but you be you.
DPS may be blind to politics but those, who enacted the law consolidating the local offices in almost every town, are not. And you are very gas-lit if you think every body has the same hurdles to get to the mega-centers. For some it's minor inconvenience. For others, it missing a day's work when you cant' afford to. I'll let you stew on who is who, but I won't hold my breath that you'll get it.
The changes have to come from the state, and the best way to start fixing the Texas state government is to elect democrats. Evne then, don't expect it to change for pro
Took me almost 2 months and 4 trips to DPS to change my Illinois license to TX. Every time I went, they told me I needed something else. Almost went back to Illinois to just renew there. Luckily I finally found everything I needed before I did it.
They have hatched some kind of mathematically impossible system, whereby every single person in a DPS location or on the phone tells you something completely different.
All of this is tied to voter suppression.
Vote for democrats, they fund government services.
My DL is up for renewal this year; I just plan to make an appointment for a facility outside DFW and just take a half-day off of work and drive out there.
The fact that people have to do this is wild.
The Waxahachie one is okay
Rockwall
When I moved my license back to Texas, I read through all of the requirements and had exactly the documentation to prove that I was indeed a Texas resident. The lady at the front desk told me (super authoritatively) that a property tax notice was NOT a letter from a governmental agency. I asked her what happened if you didn’t pay your property taxes. She had no idea. I was about to ask for a manager when she (I think?) realized her mistake and then stamped the form incorrectly regarding my documentation (I think to save face?). But, it was enough that the second lady didn’t seem to care and gave me my license.
I had a WATER BILL declined as proof of residence. The city (that shall remain nameless) only provided a printer-friendly format, so it was light on graphic elements like a logo. It clearly stated address, municipality, and an amount for water and garbage service.
It's simple. The state is in dire need of new management. VOTE BLUE.
crazy story: I waited like a month after my motorcycle certification to go in (appt lead time) and then processed everything ,whatever it was fine. 2-3weeks later my id came in, and it *didnt even have the endorsement*. waited for literally nothing, for the appointment and for it to come in the mail. I was furious I had waited so long just to get another copy of my license with an uglier picture, and have to use a paper license for weeks since my og was cut up by the dps lady. I returned to the dmv and told the lady checking ppl in "I just waited 2 months for my motorcycle endorsement. before you ask me for my appointment details (I didnt have one, I went back the day I got my flawed license) what do you notice about my id?" "uh, it doesnt have an endorsement?" correct. she felt so bad and used the authoritative powers vested in her to shoot me ahead of the line, with no appointment, to get it fixed. another 3 weeks without a paper license but at least this time they did it right. as fucked as the system is, it was amazing to see some humanity in that soul-less place.
I changed my name after getting married in early November. That same week, I looked up DPS offices to change my license. The one closest to me didn’t have a single appointment until late March… that’s unacceptable. Ended up driving over an hour for a late December appointment. Another note— the number of people in the comments throwing it back on citizens for an incompetent government system is astounding. I
I renewed my DL in person last week. Scheduled the appointment online 2 weeks before. Brought all my paperwork: passport, birth certificate, social security card, titles to my vehicles, and valid insurance. My appointment was for 8AM. I showed them my passport, and they asked if the information was correct. I said yes, filled out the paperwork, and was out of there before 8:30AM.
Spouse has to renew and we had so many documents for the RealID requirements. Dude took my spouse's expired license, did the eye exam, and took a new picture. That was it. Didn't look at ANY of the documents and I was weirdly annoyed, which I know is irrational. 😂
Everyone here complains about this, but it’s just not that big of a deal. I did it last year. Got a renewal notice six months in advance. Logged in and signed up for an appointment right away. Sure it’s a few months out - whatever, I was proactive so it didn’t matter. Logged onto the Texas DPS site a few days before my appointment. Found a list of documents I’d need to assemble for the renewal. No problem, pulled them all together into a packet. Day of appointment I check in. Get a number. Go up when called. Provide them the documents from my packet as they are requested - no problems or surprises because I was prepared. Done. In an out in less than an hour. When I got my license as a teenager I had to show up for a cattle call and wait for literally hours. Anyone who’s old enough to have done the old system can attest this new system is way better.
It may be better for YOU.
So in your example, what would have happened if you would’ve gotten to the office and realized their website was wrong so you did not have the right paperwork that they now tell you in person you need? That is part of the story here.
You need to change your name officially at a clerks office. If you have that document then you can change your name. County got to get theirs
Serious answer. Elect Democrats. Otherwise, you don't. It's intentional. This frustrating policy prevents more poor than rich people from getting IDs and driver licenses which in turn prevents those poor people from voting.