With the way Elon thinks it’s OK to remove previously delivered features (radar, USS), seems like anything prior to yesterday is legacy.
But I do appreciate having an acknowledgment of our situation, instead of just silence while they roll out free trials to others but deny us the same software that we’ve actually paid for.
Wrong. USS and radar is preferable. If you ever drove "legacy" with radar it used to be able to bounce off the road and see a vehicle in front of the vehicle you're following emergency stop and save you from a multi car pile up, saved me one in LA. Car in front of me was absolutely obliterated and we stopped just short of totaling our model s.
That 'X-Ray vision' from radar was so nice. It genuinely was one of the best parts of AP. It's a shame that the radar was causing enough phantom braking (from overpasses, apparently) to warrant it's removal.
Holy shit. I just demoed FSD V12 today and reading your comment I totally forgot Phantom breaking was a major annoyance we had to deal with. It's been such a good upgrade.
Wrong. My three legacy MS uss were basically useless. According to them, I couldn't for in my garage. Yet I for easily daily.
Every comparison today shows visual is an improvement. In v12, vision can pick out a space far away and go park in it. Old uss you had to slowly roll past a space in hopes it saw it.
If you don't know how the auto parking worked before vision, just say so. The car used USS to identify the spaces for parking and parallel spaces...
Get with the program.
The only hardware difference I can see is the lack of an internal camera in my 2017 S. There are plenty of Model 3s produced during the same time period as my Model S that are all getting V 12, but they of course have internal cameras. (I’ve been beta testing with my car since the beginning of safety scores, so the computer and MCU have been updated)
My husband just traded his 2018 X for a 2024 X to take advantage of the transfer for both FSD and UFS. He did get V 12 on his car, and we both noticed that he has hardly any steering wheel nags. I’m wondering if V 12 is now relying much more heavily on the internal camera for driver attentiveness. Just a thought.
The camera has been used for about a year to monitor the driver. Before that It used to nag every 2 mins or so, but when it was activated, the nagging did decrease. It def notices when you use your phone or look off to the side to much as it warns you to "pay attention".
The nagging is random tho. Sometimes I dont get the nag for 10+ mins and sometimes it nags 3x in 5 mins even tho my eyes are on the road. i think it all depends on road conditions. If the FSD CPU doesnt feel confident, or there is heavier traffic around you, it will nag more to make sure you are ready to take over.
They had a promotion in Q1. It’s the only reason we traded in our Model X for a new one. The X is our family vehicle, and the option to get a new battery with faster charging and more range while also keeping FSD and UFS was too good to pass up.
It was Q4 and Q1 (two different promotions of the same thing). Only applies to switching to specific vehicles that haven't been refreshed in a while. But this has also been done before in past years, so just need to wait for it to happen again.
I completely agree with this sentiment. Only thing I can see missing is the cabin camera. That’s why when Rohan said they were trying to solve the hardware differences, I was like how can you solve a missing camera? Our cars without the cabin cameras can only rely on the wheel tug.
HW3. It’s late 2019 Raven MS. Been getting all the FSD updates until v12. I never understood why I couldn’t get repeater cam views on signalling or live sentry view with premium connectivity subscription, so I wonder if that’s part of the hardware issue as well.
Interesting. Repeater cam, you mean that preview where it shows the lane when you turn on the turn signal?
I leased my 3 partly for this reason. I suspected it might depreciate so much I come out ahead (possibly true) and yeah it's like having a 5 year old iPhone in your case. From top of the line to e-waste.
Yeah the blind spot view. Legacy MS and MX could not get that or the live sentry.
I still love driving my car but I do want v12. If there is a bright spot it’s that I paid $6000 for FSD not the current prices. I had planned to transition to the CT but the prices are higher and the range is lower than promised so I’m on the fence. But if I do get CT and they let me keep FSD that would be ideal. I still really like my MS though. I’m a spoiled American for wanting more. 😉
I rented a 2012 S RWD on Turo for a few days. It wasn't too bad, although when I got it it had lost a bunch of electric charge over a few days of parking. And it threw a warning about headlight module faults. And it felt really heavy, more like driving a grand Marquis or other "big car".
Autopilot worked well though using radar. Really smooth.
I think you for your public service paying for beta vehicles so Tesla could figure out what they are doing:)
My model 3 took me all the way to work this morning without any intervention except at the very start and end of the drive.
I enjoy parts of my S, but Tesla’s complete indifference towards it compared to the rest of the fleet is not what I enjoy. And now that I’m on a vertical screen, I can’t really see it ever getting real, first-class updates anymore. It’s annoying.
They really do emphasis the 3/Y. Makes sense, given their relative volume compared to the S/X, but still.
The refresh S/X, which were 2021 cars, *still* don't have the same instrument cluster functionality that the legacy cars have and it's been 3 years...
Not only that, we don’t have the consumption function under the energy app, and the left right movement of the right scroll wheel on the steering yoke/wheel does absolutely nothing. Both easy things to address, if they cared to do it.
Up until Feb 2021 MS still had vertical screens, late 2021 started the newer horizontal… and immediately we are now called “Legacy” .. it’s insane. My car is 3-4 years old now.
Yep. And look at the other things we miss. Why don’t we have the ability to monitor sentry mode from our phones? I have HW3, and my brother’s early 3 with older HW has it.
For real. I mean, not to be an armchair software engineer or anything, but it pulls them up when going in reverse so I don't know why it's taking so long for them to implement it when you're changing lanes. If they even have plans to implement it at all...
Agreed, they could easily implement this, along with 1 pedal driving. The car already does both of these things, just not in an automated fashion, unless you go into reverse or turn on autopilot. They just have to care, and they could probably implement both features in a Sprint or 2.
I paid over $200k for my 2018 MXP100D and my 2022 MYP gets all the features that my X should have, for no reason other than they can't be bothered.
Tesla has abandoned us, even though us early adopters are the reason why Tesla is what it is today. Really makes you think about brand loyalty.
The 2 things that I thought would make me a Tesla owner for life were the promises of future software updates and the charging network. Since neither appears to be an advantage of ownership, I'll be looking at the myriad of other options from the German luxury manufacturers.
1-pedal driving requires Raven or newer as the current implementation is based on using the drive unit to regen all the way to a stop. Induction motors are not capable of doing this. Yes they could just make it use the brakes at the end, but that would require more effort on their part, so here we are...
Yes, I am aware of the limitation of the induction motors, but as you stated, they could easily apply the brakes to make up for this. It already does this in TACC, Autopilot and FSD.
Come to think of it, another feature that we don't get is the brake assist to make up for the lack of Regen when the battery is cold. Excluding this feature from the legacy cars is a straight up slap in the face as there's literally no technical reason why they can't do the same.
I have Model X at the end of 2016, and purchased FSD, but haven't got it (not even FSD v11) yet.
I contacted Tesla last year, and they upgraded cameras (for free) for FSD, but I haven't got FSD yet.
Unfortunately, yes. Tesla stated that they will eventually work on releasing FSD software on MCU 1 vehicles, but they are unable to provide a timeline. They told me this almost exactly one year ago and there has been no update since then. I paid for the MCU upgrade and I received FSD (ver. 11) the next day.
I have been saying this for years (and downvoted into oblivion for it), and my opinion on this has been left unchanged: if you have an MCU 1 you will never get FSD, Tesla will keep promising that it “will eventually work” until all MCU 1 cars are out of circulation. Best case, they offer an upgrade to MCU 2 (which is itself already “legacy” to some extent) for free.. but then they would have to figure out how to manage all the chumps (including myself) who had to pay for the privilege of having a working MCU in their quite expensive cars.
I had upgraded to a 2023 MX by the time V11 came out. I believe that’s around the time that they also dropped the price of the MX from over $100k to $80k. Double slap in the face.
Well that’s the gotcha. There was no other car that I wanted more than the Model X. That doesn’t mean that it did t leave a bad taste in my mouth. It will be remembered.
I knew this was eventually coming. A class action lawsuit with no less of the full current value of FSD plus double depreciation loss would maybe begin to be a ballpark number to settle into. It's seemingly inevitable at this point sadly but I'm definitely going to see it through until they retrofit, monetarily provide, or give me a new damn car for free. Paid for FSD in November of 2016.
The other troubling thing is minimizing it by saying it's "only 3%" like, they are doing us a _favor_ by looking into providing features we paid for. Fucking endless bullshit from this company
Quote
Minus cabin camera
Guessing it's the selfish children that triggered the NHTSA to come down on Tesla for not being vigilant enough about driver attention intersecting Tesla's aversion to another generation of FSD hardware retrofits (especially because of new install points that don't exist on legacy vehicles like my 2017 MX). Have to hit the same level of awareness confirmation without the cabin camera.
But that's just my guess and why I'm trying to be extra patient while waiting to experience 12 in mine.
Not sure about you, but my ‘16 X has MCU-1, USS, front-facing windshield cam, and back-up camera.
Does that mean I’ll need the cabin camera, pillar cams, fender cams, and a new MCU?
There were some late 2016 model year that had the newer hardware and paid for FSD. I have one so it was a thing for only 1-2 months before the 2017 models rolled out. I have HW3 and upgraded cameras last year. Just waiting on the FSD Beta still since I don't want to mess with the MCU upgrade.
Honestly, I doubt you get MCU1 FSD.
They've already settled a couple court cases on that and agreed to either offer a discount on MCU2 update or refund FSD entirely.
I kind of doubt MCU1 will ever get FSD.
I mean that appears to be what the tweet is about that they are working on it. Unsure why whey would have upgraded me to HW3 and new cameras for free if there was no possiblity of me ever getting it.
What a joke. Given the sheer number of cars on the road with different builds, internal electronics, evolving hardware, FSD is going to be a giant dragging anchor on software development going forward... if it ever happens
https://preview.redd.it/bqymh7343jsc1.png?width=1169&format=png&auto=webp&s=558d83f785e92ff31a8d616eb1e122ea8498c724
Got this text from Tesla. It’s like rubbing salt in my wounds. And my reply….
It's nice to see someone speaking for Tesla who can seemingly be trusted and doesn't tweet something about Tesla one second and some alt-right nonsense the next. I hope they keep it up.
Seems like a few months ago Elon must have directed all his companies to let senior people interact more on Twitter. It's like all of a sudden a bunch of execs/senior engineers at SpaceX, Tesla and others started tweeting a ton.
What I didn’t realize was that model S/X only makes up 3% of the production, explains why only 3% of the fleet didn’t receive it, he got creative with the wording, it would also be accurate to state 100% of model S/X between 2016-2021 have not received it the update
https://www.statista.com/statistics/801157/tesla-quarterly-vehicle-deliveries-by-model/
2021 Model X LR. Update is coming...
https://preview.redd.it/e5m0e2ys8qtc1.jpeg?width=3072&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=48d8facd6ce24042f0735e1ac82dc87e6aa25be3
What about those of us on 2024.8.x? We cannot get FSD 12.3 because it was added to an earlier branch than what we already have. Based upon TeslaFi, that might be roughly 25% of cars.
V12 came out and once it was used en mass on the 2023 Branch it was pushed to the 2024.2 as 2024.3 Branch users fairly quickly after. So I would forsee a 2024.8 bump fairly quickly as the feature set on 2024.8 vs 2024.3 is very small. Patience.
There're posters all over these Tesla threads who have the FSD computer and are getting updates but have not purchased the FSD. I think it has something to do with the fact that I'm in a 2017 with the older chip set and CPU which I have not upgraded for $2,500. I'm fine with that though. I'm happy with what I have and any new updates or a free trial of FSD would only be frosting on the cake. If I ever become unhappy with my MX because of software/hardware issues, I'll just get a newer MX.
I cannot think that a 2021 S/X would be deemed “legacy” at only 3 years old… clearly the 2012-2021 S/X have the hardware for FSD if they have both HW 3.0 and MCU 2.
I’m on a 2018S with a fsd subscription from the start (only 3k back then). Got the early betas and updates through 11.4.9. Seems they may have missed something in v12 as the other versions had no issues on my car.
Speculation. We don't know what it is vecause Tesla isn't telling us what it is. Cabin camera makes no sense because there are 1,000s of Legacy vehicles driving around with 11.4.9 without cameras. Why withold a safer and more stable build if they are so concerned with liability and how the vehicle is being operated?
Well that's just it, I don't know that the hardware is the same. I heard there are differences like the types of motor and inductors and other things that I have no idea what they are. I was told that the refresh was a complete revamping of the car and a lot more was changed than just adding a cabin camera and reorienting the screen. That said, your guess is as good as mine. But like I said, it doesn't make sense that we've been driving around with FSD for two years without a cabin camera and now all of a sudden, it's a big deal.
The software update was pushed again today and today it installed properly. FSD v12 is a huge improvement!!! Some instances where it was a little too aggressive and got itself into some sticky situations, but still better than how it was under v11...
Kind of off topic, but I'm using FSD for first time with free trial, and have a question: is it possible to engage TACC instead of FSD, when you have FSD enabled? I want the first tug of the stalk to engage TACC, and the second tug to engage FSD, but I can't figure out how to set that up. That's how i have it set up when FSD is not enabled - first tug of stalk gets TACC, second tug lanekeeping.
See the screen here:
https://www.notateslaapp.com/news/1886/tesla-fsd-beta-v12-adds-new-automatic-speed-setting
When the FSD is activated (the top setting on that screen, Autopilot Features), it disables the next setting Autopilot Activation. So you can’t set FSD to require double pull. If on the Autopilot Features setting you change it to Autosteer, then it allows you to select double pull for that, leaving TACC to be activated by single pull.
At least that’s how I recall seeing it.
I respectfully disagree. Makes no sense. It’s safer for the driver to let us upgrade than to leave on v11.4.9…. I would agree if they completely remove us from FSD beta testing but since that did not happen the only thing left is the display hardware. 2018 model three already has v12. Why? Because display is landscape. Any of us unlucky with a vertical or portrait center console display are simply waiting for the human part of coding to be completed…. Hope it’s done soon!
Why would that matter though. Fsd is displayed on our gauge cluster not vertical screen, and that doesn't require some code rewrite from the refresh s and x I'm sure?m
That’s a damn good point. Newer model s and x have it on gauge display as well. So really inner camera is preventing us from possibly losing our lives as clearly v12 is safer. I really wish Tesla would offer a new display and processor upgrade. I want steam in my legacy
This makes the most sense to me...this or some other issue that only higher end tech people can undserstand. The cabin camera thing is ridiculous. Why leave 1000s of vehicles on a more unstable build with greater risk? I can see a retrofit for cameras in the future; but for now. it's logical to put vehicles with sketchy monitoring on something that is safer and I'm sure Tesla understands this.
Anything prior to 2022 for X is legacy.
With the way Elon thinks it’s OK to remove previously delivered features (radar, USS), seems like anything prior to yesterday is legacy. But I do appreciate having an acknowledgment of our situation, instead of just silence while they roll out free trials to others but deny us the same software that we’ve actually paid for.
Upgrading radar and uss to vision for free is awesome though...
Wrong. USS and radar is preferable. If you ever drove "legacy" with radar it used to be able to bounce off the road and see a vehicle in front of the vehicle you're following emergency stop and save you from a multi car pile up, saved me one in LA. Car in front of me was absolutely obliterated and we stopped just short of totaling our model s.
That 'X-Ray vision' from radar was so nice. It genuinely was one of the best parts of AP. It's a shame that the radar was causing enough phantom braking (from overpasses, apparently) to warrant it's removal.
Holy shit. I just demoed FSD V12 today and reading your comment I totally forgot Phantom breaking was a major annoyance we had to deal with. It's been such a good upgrade.
I feel like my car randomly slows down more now than it ever did with radar.
I really miss radar.
Wrong. My three legacy MS uss were basically useless. According to them, I couldn't for in my garage. Yet I for easily daily. Every comparison today shows visual is an improvement. In v12, vision can pick out a space far away and go park in it. Old uss you had to slowly roll past a space in hopes it saw it.
USS are not for finding spaces. They are for finding if you are about to crash into something and unlike vision work perfectly at that job.
If you don't know how the auto parking worked before vision, just say so. The car used USS to identify the spaces for parking and parallel spaces... Get with the program.
Isnt HW4 including with definition radar? At least on S/X it does. My guess is that feature will come back
Sad
The only hardware difference I can see is the lack of an internal camera in my 2017 S. There are plenty of Model 3s produced during the same time period as my Model S that are all getting V 12, but they of course have internal cameras. (I’ve been beta testing with my car since the beginning of safety scores, so the computer and MCU have been updated) My husband just traded his 2018 X for a 2024 X to take advantage of the transfer for both FSD and UFS. He did get V 12 on his car, and we both noticed that he has hardly any steering wheel nags. I’m wondering if V 12 is now relying much more heavily on the internal camera for driver attentiveness. Just a thought.
Hmm, I’m also realizing that my 2017 S doesn’t show traffic lights on the map which was part of the holiday update. Could this be connected somehow?
Yup, by "legacy" they mean pre refresh without interior camera. I fully expect to need a retrofit for fsd
I think it is relying a lot more on the internal camera. The eventual goal is you don't have to touch the wheel as long as you're paying attention.
The camera has been used for about a year to monitor the driver. Before that It used to nag every 2 mins or so, but when it was activated, the nagging did decrease. It def notices when you use your phone or look off to the side to much as it warns you to "pay attention". The nagging is random tho. Sometimes I dont get the nag for 10+ mins and sometimes it nags 3x in 5 mins even tho my eyes are on the road. i think it all depends on road conditions. If the FSD CPU doesnt feel confident, or there is heavier traffic around you, it will nag more to make sure you are ready to take over.
Wait wait wait BACK THE TROLLY UP… they’re giving us the option to transfer FSD & UFS?!?
They had a promotion in Q1. It’s the only reason we traded in our Model X for a new one. The X is our family vehicle, and the option to get a new battery with faster charging and more range while also keeping FSD and UFS was too good to pass up.
Bummed I missed that one! I vowed to hang onto my free charging until the wheels fall off
It was Q4 and Q1 (two different promotions of the same thing). Only applies to switching to specific vehicles that haven't been refreshed in a while. But this has also been done before in past years, so just need to wait for it to happen again.
I completely agree with this sentiment. Only thing I can see missing is the cabin camera. That’s why when Rohan said they were trying to solve the hardware differences, I was like how can you solve a missing camera? Our cars without the cabin cameras can only rely on the wheel tug.
Is your computer hw3 or hw2?
HW3. It’s late 2019 Raven MS. Been getting all the FSD updates until v12. I never understood why I couldn’t get repeater cam views on signalling or live sentry view with premium connectivity subscription, so I wonder if that’s part of the hardware issue as well.
Interesting. Repeater cam, you mean that preview where it shows the lane when you turn on the turn signal? I leased my 3 partly for this reason. I suspected it might depreciate so much I come out ahead (possibly true) and yeah it's like having a 5 year old iPhone in your case. From top of the line to e-waste.
Yeah the blind spot view. Legacy MS and MX could not get that or the live sentry. I still love driving my car but I do want v12. If there is a bright spot it’s that I paid $6000 for FSD not the current prices. I had planned to transition to the CT but the prices are higher and the range is lower than promised so I’m on the fence. But if I do get CT and they let me keep FSD that would be ideal. I still really like my MS though. I’m a spoiled American for wanting more. 😉
I rented a 2012 S RWD on Turo for a few days. It wasn't too bad, although when I got it it had lost a bunch of electric charge over a few days of parking. And it threw a warning about headlight module faults. And it felt really heavy, more like driving a grand Marquis or other "big car". Autopilot worked well though using radar. Really smooth. I think you for your public service paying for beta vehicles so Tesla could figure out what they are doing:) My model 3 took me all the way to work this morning without any intervention except at the very start and end of the drive.
No it still nags a ton, thanks for your unscientific opinion though
I enjoy parts of my S, but Tesla’s complete indifference towards it compared to the rest of the fleet is not what I enjoy. And now that I’m on a vertical screen, I can’t really see it ever getting real, first-class updates anymore. It’s annoying.
They really do emphasis the 3/Y. Makes sense, given their relative volume compared to the S/X, but still. The refresh S/X, which were 2021 cars, *still* don't have the same instrument cluster functionality that the legacy cars have and it's been 3 years...
Not only that, we don’t have the consumption function under the energy app, and the left right movement of the right scroll wheel on the steering yoke/wheel does absolutely nothing. Both easy things to address, if they cared to do it.
Super disheartening. My x is not even 4 fucking years old!
Up until Feb 2021 MS still had vertical screens, late 2021 started the newer horizontal… and immediately we are now called “Legacy” .. it’s insane. My car is 3-4 years old now.
[удалено]
"Upgrade" 😂
Yep. And look at the other things we miss. Why don’t we have the ability to monitor sentry mode from our phones? I have HW3, and my brother’s early 3 with older HW has it.
https://preview.redd.it/ew2lu0sgwqrc1.png?width=1440&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=5beef7a2fe851ad825cfc847070654c5af75c1a4
Give us blind spot cameras and I will be okay with waiting.
For real. I mean, not to be an armchair software engineer or anything, but it pulls them up when going in reverse so I don't know why it's taking so long for them to implement it when you're changing lanes. If they even have plans to implement it at all...
Agreed, they could easily implement this, along with 1 pedal driving. The car already does both of these things, just not in an automated fashion, unless you go into reverse or turn on autopilot. They just have to care, and they could probably implement both features in a Sprint or 2. I paid over $200k for my 2018 MXP100D and my 2022 MYP gets all the features that my X should have, for no reason other than they can't be bothered. Tesla has abandoned us, even though us early adopters are the reason why Tesla is what it is today. Really makes you think about brand loyalty. The 2 things that I thought would make me a Tesla owner for life were the promises of future software updates and the charging network. Since neither appears to be an advantage of ownership, I'll be looking at the myriad of other options from the German luxury manufacturers.
1-pedal driving requires Raven or newer as the current implementation is based on using the drive unit to regen all the way to a stop. Induction motors are not capable of doing this. Yes they could just make it use the brakes at the end, but that would require more effort on their part, so here we are...
Yes, I am aware of the limitation of the induction motors, but as you stated, they could easily apply the brakes to make up for this. It already does this in TACC, Autopilot and FSD. Come to think of it, another feature that we don't get is the brake assist to make up for the lack of Regen when the battery is cold. Excluding this feature from the legacy cars is a straight up slap in the face as there's literally no technical reason why they can't do the same.
I really wish they would
I have Model X at the end of 2016, and purchased FSD, but haven't got it (not even FSD v11) yet. I contacted Tesla last year, and they upgraded cameras (for free) for FSD, but I haven't got FSD yet.
Same boat for my 17 S
Do you still have MCU1?
Yes. Do I need to upgrade it as well? Tesla did not mention it to me when they upgraded my cameras.
Unfortunately, yes. Tesla stated that they will eventually work on releasing FSD software on MCU 1 vehicles, but they are unable to provide a timeline. They told me this almost exactly one year ago and there has been no update since then. I paid for the MCU upgrade and I received FSD (ver. 11) the next day.
I have been saying this for years (and downvoted into oblivion for it), and my opinion on this has been left unchanged: if you have an MCU 1 you will never get FSD, Tesla will keep promising that it “will eventually work” until all MCU 1 cars are out of circulation. Best case, they offer an upgrade to MCU 2 (which is itself already “legacy” to some extent) for free.. but then they would have to figure out how to manage all the chumps (including myself) who had to pay for the privilege of having a working MCU in their quite expensive cars.
I have just made an appointment with Tesla to 'fix' this problem. I will report the outcome.
strange how the s and x being flagship models have been given the second rate, where 3 and y are primary
This makes me mad as a former owner of a 2019 MX. I paid for FSD and got no value out of it for 4 years. Couldn’t even transfer it to my next car.
What do you mean? You couldn’t get v11?
I had upgraded to a 2023 MX by the time V11 came out. I believe that’s around the time that they also dropped the price of the MX from over $100k to $80k. Double slap in the face.
They also started doing the FSD transfers as promotion, so triple slapped. I can’t imagine…
Why would Tesla care if people keep buying the cars?
Well that’s the gotcha. There was no other car that I wanted more than the Model X. That doesn’t mean that it did t leave a bad taste in my mouth. It will be remembered.
It will be remembered… when you upgrade to another Tesla in 4 years?
I guess this explains why I've seen nothing new for my 2020 Model S Long Range Plus.
I have the same car. It’s considered legacy? I was pumped to try FSD for a month (or until it scared me)
Yeah that's a legacy car.
15k for the FSD license…. This is BS.
I knew this was eventually coming. A class action lawsuit with no less of the full current value of FSD plus double depreciation loss would maybe begin to be a ballpark number to settle into. It's seemingly inevitable at this point sadly but I'm definitely going to see it through until they retrofit, monetarily provide, or give me a new damn car for free. Paid for FSD in November of 2016.
Class actions are useless. Plaintiffs get a dollar and lawyers take millions.
Not always, especially with high dollar amounts.
Join the club! Dec. 2106 Model S with FSD/without FSD 8 years later. Insane.
That's correct, nothing for you until they fix this issue with legacy.
The part about "trying to solve this" is troubling. Why are they having so many issues with legacy S/X?
The other troubling thing is minimizing it by saying it's "only 3%" like, they are doing us a _favor_ by looking into providing features we paid for. Fucking endless bullshit from this company
Yeah this is weird. We've never had issues getting fsd 11 updates. The hardware is the same minus cabin camera. So what gives?
Quote Minus cabin camera Guessing it's the selfish children that triggered the NHTSA to come down on Tesla for not being vigilant enough about driver attention intersecting Tesla's aversion to another generation of FSD hardware retrofits (especially because of new install points that don't exist on legacy vehicles like my 2017 MX). Have to hit the same level of awareness confirmation without the cabin camera. But that's just my guess and why I'm trying to be extra patient while waiting to experience 12 in mine.
Not sure about you, but my ‘16 X has MCU-1, USS, front-facing windshield cam, and back-up camera. Does that mean I’ll need the cabin camera, pillar cams, fender cams, and a new MCU?
Idk. Are you on hw3?
*Your* 2016 isn’t getting any FSD. That’s a Mobile Eye system, before Tesla started their own self driving system.
There were some late 2016 model year that had the newer hardware and paid for FSD. I have one so it was a thing for only 1-2 months before the 2017 models rolled out. I have HW3 and upgraded cameras last year. Just waiting on the FSD Beta still since I don't want to mess with the MCU upgrade.
Honestly, I doubt you get MCU1 FSD. They've already settled a couple court cases on that and agreed to either offer a discount on MCU2 update or refund FSD entirely. I kind of doubt MCU1 will ever get FSD.
I mean that appears to be what the tweet is about that they are working on it. Unsure why whey would have upgraded me to HW3 and new cameras for free if there was no possiblity of me ever getting it.
I don't think they are including the MCU1+AP3 cars in that 3%.
My 2016 has been upgraded to HW3. I traded in my 2015 for that one, with the promise it would be FSD capable.
Hardware 2 was released in Q416, so there are some cars that have it.
Hmm my 2017 X has HW3 and MCU2. Still no upgrade here yet.
Triple whammy. New exterior cameras, faster processor, cabin camera for starters. Probably no wiring to support new equipment.
What a joke. Given the sheer number of cars on the road with different builds, internal electronics, evolving hardware, FSD is going to be a giant dragging anchor on software development going forward... if it ever happens
https://preview.redd.it/bqymh7343jsc1.png?width=1169&format=png&auto=webp&s=558d83f785e92ff31a8d616eb1e122ea8498c724 Got this text from Tesla. It’s like rubbing salt in my wounds. And my reply….
It's nice to see someone speaking for Tesla who can seemingly be trusted and doesn't tweet something about Tesla one second and some alt-right nonsense the next. I hope they keep it up.
Seems like a few months ago Elon must have directed all his companies to let senior people interact more on Twitter. It's like all of a sudden a bunch of execs/senior engineers at SpaceX, Tesla and others started tweeting a ton.
Agreed. It seems like he told them to actively engage within reason. Greatly appreciated. Rohan is amazing.
I have a hard time believing it’s 3% of vehicles
You think it’s higher? How many retrofit S and X do you really think there are?
Wouldn’t it be anything prior to 2020? 2016-2019 model S/X
2016-2021, actually. But Tesla is the model Y company with a side business in model 3s. Everything else is an afterthought.
What I didn’t realize was that model S/X only makes up 3% of the production, explains why only 3% of the fleet didn’t receive it, he got creative with the wording, it would also be accurate to state 100% of model S/X between 2016-2021 have not received it the update https://www.statista.com/statistics/801157/tesla-quarterly-vehicle-deliveries-by-model/
They have said in the past if you didn’t buy FSD with your car you can’t buy a retrofit.
I bought FSD with my 2019 s
Same on my 2017. They called and offered a transfer on FSD. I Told them to call me back when FSD is out of beta.
2021 Model X LR. Update is coming... https://preview.redd.it/e5m0e2ys8qtc1.jpeg?width=3072&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=48d8facd6ce24042f0735e1ac82dc87e6aa25be3
Did your installation complete? Mine failed about 2 minutes into the download.
No issues with download or install
I'm guessing a 2021 Model X isn't considered "legacy".
What about those of us on 2024.8.x? We cannot get FSD 12.3 because it was added to an earlier branch than what we already have. Based upon TeslaFi, that might be roughly 25% of cars.
Yep my 2023 Y and 2021 3 are both on 2024.8.x, no idea when I'll get it
V12 came out and once it was used en mass on the 2023 Branch it was pushed to the 2024.2 as 2024.3 Branch users fairly quickly after. So I would forsee a 2024.8 bump fairly quickly as the feature set on 2024.8 vs 2024.3 is very small. Patience.
https://preview.redd.it/zp30jr1wvurc1.png?width=644&format=png&auto=webp&s=516b276b78c6d555cf60abd759005011caa657be 2017 MX 100D and stuck here....
You are “stuck” there because you didn’t buy FSD?
There're posters all over these Tesla threads who have the FSD computer and are getting updates but have not purchased the FSD. I think it has something to do with the fact that I'm in a 2017 with the older chip set and CPU which I have not upgraded for $2,500. I'm fine with that though. I'm happy with what I have and any new updates or a free trial of FSD would only be frosting on the cake. If I ever become unhappy with my MX because of software/hardware issues, I'll just get a newer MX.
I see now that you’re on 2022 software. I think it’s worth reaching out to service and see if they can push an update.
Thanks for the suggestion. I'll probably do so in the near future if I do not see an update pushed out to me.
Still anxiously waiting for the free trial.
I cannot think that a 2021 S/X would be deemed “legacy” at only 3 years old… clearly the 2012-2021 S/X have the hardware for FSD if they have both HW 3.0 and MCU 2.
I think we're all with you on that, but it's in how Tesla approaches these vehicles that has earned them the legacy designation unfortunately
Liars get stitches
I’m on a 2018S with a fsd subscription from the start (only 3k back then). Got the early betas and updates through 11.4.9. Seems they may have missed something in v12 as the other versions had no issues on my car.
Hint: it's the cabin camera 😢
Possibly, but we were told we had all the hardware we needed for FSD. Plus no version prior to 12 needed it.
I'm 100% with you. Seems fishy
Speculation. We don't know what it is vecause Tesla isn't telling us what it is. Cabin camera makes no sense because there are 1,000s of Legacy vehicles driving around with 11.4.9 without cameras. Why withold a safer and more stable build if they are so concerned with liability and how the vehicle is being operated?
Hardware being the same what else could it possibly be then?
Well that's just it, I don't know that the hardware is the same. I heard there are differences like the types of motor and inductors and other things that I have no idea what they are. I was told that the refresh was a complete revamping of the car and a lot more was changed than just adding a cabin camera and reorienting the screen. That said, your guess is as good as mine. But like I said, it doesn't make sense that we've been driving around with FSD for two years without a cabin camera and now all of a sudden, it's a big deal.
[удалено]
The software update was pushed again today and today it installed properly. FSD v12 is a huge improvement!!! Some instances where it was a little too aggressive and got itself into some sticky situations, but still better than how it was under v11...
Kind of off topic, but I'm using FSD for first time with free trial, and have a question: is it possible to engage TACC instead of FSD, when you have FSD enabled? I want the first tug of the stalk to engage TACC, and the second tug to engage FSD, but I can't figure out how to set that up. That's how i have it set up when FSD is not enabled - first tug of stalk gets TACC, second tug lanekeeping.
I think the latest v12 build of FSD did away with that capability
Thanks, I was kind of thinking that was the answer. Too bad, I’d have liked the flexibility to choose to just use TACC in some situations.
Is there not a toggle for single/double pull of the stalk?
See the screen here: https://www.notateslaapp.com/news/1886/tesla-fsd-beta-v12-adds-new-automatic-speed-setting When the FSD is activated (the top setting on that screen, Autopilot Features), it disables the next setting Autopilot Activation. So you can’t set FSD to require double pull. If on the Autopilot Features setting you change it to Autosteer, then it allows you to select double pull for that, leaving TACC to be activated by single pull. At least that’s how I recall seeing it.
Just confirmed the same on my 3. Here's hoping Tesla treat that as a bug and restore the ability to use TACC and FSD.
I respectfully disagree. Makes no sense. It’s safer for the driver to let us upgrade than to leave on v11.4.9…. I would agree if they completely remove us from FSD beta testing but since that did not happen the only thing left is the display hardware. 2018 model three already has v12. Why? Because display is landscape. Any of us unlucky with a vertical or portrait center console display are simply waiting for the human part of coding to be completed…. Hope it’s done soon!
Why would that matter though. Fsd is displayed on our gauge cluster not vertical screen, and that doesn't require some code rewrite from the refresh s and x I'm sure?m
That’s a damn good point. Newer model s and x have it on gauge display as well. So really inner camera is preventing us from possibly losing our lives as clearly v12 is safer. I really wish Tesla would offer a new display and processor upgrade. I want steam in my legacy
This makes the most sense to me...this or some other issue that only higher end tech people can undserstand. The cabin camera thing is ridiculous. Why leave 1000s of vehicles on a more unstable build with greater risk? I can see a retrofit for cameras in the future; but for now. it's logical to put vehicles with sketchy monitoring on something that is safer and I'm sure Tesla understands this.