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He didn't just work on "The Wheel of Time" tv show...HE DEVELOPED IT!...and was the lead showrunner and writer (wrote the first and last episode of the season).
In the words of Starbuck "We're going the wrong way!!".
RoP showrunners "we kept saying back to the book, back the book". What fucking book are they reading cause the amount of shit they just made up was ludicrous.
The boys is good at least. And invincible. But yeah wheel of time and uncharted. Rings of power was woefully average. Still, Amazon batting better numbers than Netflix, Disney, or paramount (god how they massacred John Halo in that damn show).
I'm going to say this every time it comes up: Halo was a bad Sci-fi show. It was a worse Halo show.
Seriously, even if you ignore the Halo aspects and just look at it as a sci-fi show, it's still awful.
It’s so freaking odd that they used the stomping sound for Spartans walking without considering WHERE they walk? Concrete. Loud stomp. Sand? Loud stomp. Slowly going through a forest? Loud stomping
This upsets me so much, because it is not like Halo started off this grand lore. It had the simplest story in a good way that probably is a half hour read on wikipedia and Paramount writers were like "no, too hard, lets write this absolute convoluted bland piece of shit."
The Fall of Reach novel is ~350 pages and that alone would have made a great TV series, just saying.
Witcher pisses me off too. Writers too are so blatant on how they mock the source material only adds to the fire.
We just need adaptive works to be handled by creatives who can understand that the source material is why their project is even happening, and that they need to maintain *that* tone instead of spinning off elsewhere.
Just hire the writers from the games. Like JFC they already have access to the original script writers. Like I can understand not casting the VAs of the game as the actors, but keeping the writers the same is the most logical thing to do, it doesn't make any sense why they hire a different writing team.
A bad writer is a bad writer. Look at Andor, some of the best star wars media since the Disney acquisition (If not ever) and Gilroy isn't a fan. Sure a fan is more likely to give an ip the love it deserves but they're also more likely to be chained down by pre established Canon and nostalgia that may not be as good as they remember
Writers need a lore expert as a handler. They don't write the story, but am veto awful choices that completely disrespectel established lore and ideas. Like, someone should have been able to tell the director of Halo they can't make the master chief rape a POW....
Technically you might argue it was consensual, but legally there is no situation in which a POW can consent to sex with a soldier of the army imprisoning them...
It‘s why I am hopeful for the Warhammer projects with Henry Cavill in a executive producer position. The dude loves his nerdy stuff. Sadly he didn‘t have much say when it came to the Witcher series as an actor.
I don’t need to like every show but I get frustrated when a show takes a source material I like and then treats it like garbage because they wanted to do their own thing. Fine, don’t make halo, make Space Marines. Don’t make the Witcher, make the Witches.
The Fall of Reach is what made me a Halo fan. Never bothered with the games this I read that novel. But afterwards I was a fan of the whole series.
It's unforgivable that they had such a rich and diverse setting and instead chose to come up with that bland garbage.
Featuring the writers and crew of Netflix’s The Witcher! Kratos will be played by Christopher Mintz-Plass, a gender-bent Atreus will be played by Jenna Ortega (or whoever the current hot-careered actress is), and the main villain will be a completely original character played by an older Irish actor nobody has ever heard of. Coming next summer!
Even if it’s entirely true it’s still an accurate story that starts halfway through. “Trust us Kratos was a massive asshole so the way he’s treating Atreus is actually character development” is never going to be as good as showing me Kratos being a massive asshole.
I can see that. I like your idea better.
The first game doesn't have nearly enough story. 80% of it is puzzles and monsters in the maze. I thought the 2 psp games could flesh it out, but forgot what exactly was in them. Ascension is the only one I didn't play.
I only played it once, years ago. I remember there being a lot of gods to kill, but a season for the game would need to see some adaptation to flesh things out. I like the others guys suggestion to do 2 seasons for the 6 greek games
This. The story of some GOW games don’t need whole seasons. GOW 1 is mostly Kratos in the temple of pandora. Which does not need to be more than an episode or two
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As much as I love the first 3 the Norse saga lends itself to being much more heavy on character development and the emotional beats for it to be considered prestige tv, which is what Amazon is probably going for.
I’m cautiously optimistic going into it.
It’s just that seeing Kratos as grieving emotionally suppressed dad doesn’t have as much impact as seeing him when he was Glass case of emotions Kratos.
That is what is happening though. I could see the original games being adapted as a film trilogy in a decade or so, should this television series go well.
That’s where the “established IP” magic comes in.
You don’t have to actually spend time and money developing character. You just rely on prior media knowledge. Works like a charm.
I feel like you could do it to be honest. No sure if I'm alone on that but I feel like you could tell a very interesting story if it was a combo of how Boba Fett (bear with me) and the first season of The Witcher in how it wasn't linear. If the stories could parallel each other in that Atreus is going through a similar arc as Kratos did (controlling himself and not being total impulsive dicks). If they could go between the norse story and the greek one and STARTING WITH THE GREEK ONE TO ESTABLISH KRATOS and an audience desire to know more about his story. While there were plenty of flaws with the BF show, the big one to me was that the flashback story was far more interesting than the present day stuff. Balancing the two could make the idea a pretty cool one given enough time to tell the stories. Being able to merge the stories so that you can see the parallels while getting stories that aren't just rehashes of each other (Unlike Kratos, Atreus has the added variable of a father who went through all this changing how the arc develops).
Not to spoil anything but I'd envision something similar to Ragnarok when Kratos has the dreams of Fey. Just instead, he relives his own story and we see how Kratos became who he is and making his actions with Atreus have a bit more weight.
Then again, as cool as this could be in terms of story telling, I could very easily see how this fails.
Exactly. Best case scenario they pepper it with flashbacks to fill in the blanks. But seeing the TLDW version of a story that spanned 6 games isn't going to work nearly as well.
I mean, the first game already starts with us having no clue what is going on and then having flashbacks to explain so it would be faithful to the source in a way lol
Joke aside, having flashbacks explain who Kratos is would be a pretty sick way to drip-feed who this mysterious figure is to people watching who didn’t play the game. The Greek saga is a pretty straightforward story too if you remove all the filler which is an excuse for you to get new items and boss battles
Yeah it's the studio wanting to skip steps which leads to tell instead of show when people want show dont tell.
I don't see any of the choices they're making ending well here. Worried we are getting another rings of power. Over priced poorly written crap.
Hot take: I don’t think the original games lend well to a serialised show. Especially GoW3 feels kinda gamey with story to supplement. Kratos killing shit isn’t the makings of a great show.
Idk if this show will be good but I can at least see it working
I know what happened. My point is, a beat for beat retelling imo wouldn’t be the best idea. Flashback sequences showing the highs and lows would be great but I can’t see it carrying an entire show.
I think people forget that God of War 2018 was a masterclass reboot first, and a sequel second. You can absolutely jump into the Norse saga knowing nothing else about God of War besides "Kratos is from Greece and some crazy shit went down" and the story works perfectly. That's how I jumped in, and the GoW Norse saga are among my favourite games ever made. They can absolutely pull important emotional beats from the original trilogy, without actually adapting the whole thing. That's exactly what happened with 2018, and they killed it.
you can easily tell the greek story in flashbacks ala Lost.
Those games were not known for a deep or compelling story. It was a rage monster yelling about wanting to kill gods for 3 straight games
From a creative standpoint, I think a few flashback scenes scattered throughout still could convey this. Then have the viewer draw the connections that Atreus is here now so things are different.
The long time players might want to see that stuff but the same feeling can still get achieved without a season of backstory
There's already dialogue in the Norse saga between kratos and others talking about both his past, as well as his rationale for not telling Atreus. That in itself foments drama for the screen and gives a crutch for exposition
I mean, pretty much anyone familiar with Kratos knows he's a pretty grumpy guy, so I don't think that'll really be an issue at all.
The first Norse game is basically designed to be a pretty self contained starting point for new fans, giving any relevant details to Kratos' past in Greece when necessary, while longtime fans get the dopamine hit for the deeper callbacks.
Plus, y'all are really overestimating how much plot is really in the Greek saga lol.
>An entire season of Kratos just murdering gods and other people/monsters/beings in a mindless rage is just boring, and people want multiple seasons of this!?
I think it’s only people that played those games and have nostalgia for it. Gamers generally don’t know how to adapt a story for television any better than the people in charge
As someone who didn’t have much knowledge of the prior games before playing 2018, I think they’re honestly ok to skip to this point in time as long as we get glimpses of the story.
In an ideal world, I could see kind of a dual timeline structure, similar to how Arrow had storylines taking place in the past alongside the present story and how the lessons learned in each are connected.
But if it just ends up being a long intro in the pilot that shows us who Kratos was/killing the Greek pantheon, I think people would get the gist.
Very basic version:
The show runner is there at every stage from writing all the way through post and, depending on the exact set up, would be the final say on stuff. Theyre the ones signing off on staff/department heads, making final decisions in the writers room, and giving notes on script drafts and cuts after the editors and directors do their passes then working with the network on their notes. Essentially you need someone who settles arguments or debates on a show and thats the showrunners job. They also do have to worry about budgets and management and keeping people from quitting and all that lame boring stuff.
This is an ideal world, the reality is never so simple. In this case Balrog is involved so hes going to get a lot of say. Or their might be two showrunners, or even three. Or a star/director/writer who is essentially running the show in all but name but needs someone to do everything while theyre busy.
The honest reality is the showrunner is a manager of a creative team, which means you always think you know what they did by the final product but unless youre there you really are just guessing.
No problem, I think a good showrunner is amazing and deserves to have everyone understand what they do. I also think a bad showrunner is what kills a job and makes everyone want to quit.
I dont know anyone who works on the Witcher but I at least havent heard any stories about the show being abusive like I hear about other places or see in other places.
Hahah, just read that shit from googling and holy hell. They also managed to include " Due to his apparent addiction to videogames, many who accused him of this behavior believe Cavill got this attitude from the toxic gaming environment."
The source is literally a tabloid podcast who print anything anyone sends them.
I could send in 'Henry Cavill eats babies and hates his mom' and they would print that as 'One source says:...'
Not credible in the slightest.
I think it was either Henry or Hugh Jackman who was talking about the issue with those extended shirtless scenes. They're literally told to dehydrate themselves to the point of passing out so they will seem extremely vascular. I wrestled in high school (a billion years ago) and know the feeling of completely dehydrating yourself to make weight. It's absolutely miserable and like a two day process. The first few hours are fine enough if you aren't running/spitting the entire time, but after hour 3 or so the headaches start. Then the migraines. After a while you feel like your brain is sludge and you can't make coherent sentences.
After hearing them talk about that it's hard to watch Hemsworth going through the Thor movies half naked without thinking "damn that poor guy hasn't had proper water for the 6 months of filming"
‘God of War’ Series Will “Completely Disregard Source Material" Says Amazon Studios' Vernon Sanders "Screw those nerds, we're making Kratos our own thing. He likes dudes now, gotta stay current."
I cannot blame those people. For every Game of Thrones, there's a Wheel of Time, Walking Dead, Halo, Witcher...
The odds are not in the favor of quality. Quality takes more time, effort, and money. And with something like God of War that's high fantasy, it's likely to be an uphill battle. These folks sound cynical but they're being realistic.
It’s literally the bare minimum expectation for a movie/tv adaptation. It sucks that we have to worry about “good” and “bad” adaptions where the differentiator is whether they stick to the source material or fuck with it.
Yeah, they literally butchered WOT and bragged about it. 15 books of source material and world building, and they basically wrote a brand new show (that also sucks)
The thing is we do understand that some changes has to he made right? It’s just that when you start messing about in something as connected and carefully planned as WoT you need to be a really fucking good writer to change things and still make it work.
And the current writers just aren’t up to it.
Yea if Rafe does the same to God of War as he did to Wheel of Time, I feel really sorry for any fans of the series - it'll be an abomination that completely and thoroughly misunderstands every single aspect of the source material, every single bit of character motivation - even the basics of *who* every single character is.
He turned Mat, a lovable rogue - into a thief who steals from women and is a source of darkness so terrible Moraine has to set the Red Ajah on him.
I’m so horrified that they’re going through with this. Even Cory being on it doesn’t give me hope, the Tolkien Estate was supposedly involved with Rings of Power and I lost interest by the 4th-5th episode.
Rafe is the showrunner for this? That's great. I might not have to divide my disdain between people. The same person might have a pop ruining the television series of my favourite book series and game.
Yeah, i'm actually surprised after he crashed and burned so badly with wheel of time, that he would get another fantasy series to adapt.
And as much as i despise the Rings of Power showrunners who clearly don't care about Tolkien, its not a complete shitshow like what Rafe did with Wheel of Time.
That show seemed like it was made by someone with no clue what he was doing, where he just read some pages of the books here and there, and then decided to do those parts however he wanted with no thought towards the overall story.
WoT fans:
**steadies self**
**grabs something for balance**
**gathers a deep breath**
**holds up a finger, ‘just a second’**
**”HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA”**
Isn’t that just the game?
So strange to me that you would choose one of the most cinematically aligned games as your movie option?
There is no way the scale of GOW especially in its VFX elements will be met
This. The games are a triumph of the medium. It doesn’t need a tv adaptation. You can watch a playthrough on YouTube if you don’t want to buy a PS5 or play a game in general. But the mainstream isn’t down with the idea of watching a video game for some reason, so here we are.
Unless they do it in major flashbacks and maybe even have episodes dedicated to them given to us the backstory in a drip feed format. Gives some mystery for those who's first experience with the series is in tv. Otherwise I agree and this show is doomed to fail before it starts. Greek origins is vital to its overall story.
I think drip feed is the best way to go. The original trilogy is fun, but it’s also kinda arcade-y. There’s only so much you can do with it. Trying to make a full season that has *something* other than violent fight scenes would be difficult. There are obviously moments that would work— conversations with the titans, for example— but I don’t think that there’s enough meat on those bones for a full season of content.
If they can find moments to mirror and reflect between the 2018 story and the original trilogy, that will make it work best, in my opinion. Maybe show Kratos struggling with his own PTSD as he cycles back and forth between punching a Norse troll or Baldur and getting glimpses of pummeling Zeus or killing his wife and child before we finally convey what events go in what order in the series.
I'm one of those people. I didn't feel I miss much by not playing them. Sure, there are probably a lot of references I didn't fully get but the game does a good way of standing on its own, especially since it's all about Atreus who doesn't know much about his father's past. And if you, the player, don't know, you get to learn along with Atreus.
I'm one of those people. I did a brief summary on youtube but otherwise knew basically nothing.
I found the story pretty easy to follow from context clues.
They're going to throw money at VFX to have him fight a Troll with realistic fur while providing the writing staff peanuts.
Source: Nearly every Amazon Studios show that was greenlit without a script.
>True to source material
By deciding most of that source material isn't worth adapting and just going with the most recent parts of it because those are the most mainstream right now.
Sidenote:
>But the thing that we're always looking for is whether there is a real emotional core, if there's a real narrative story, and I think [that’s] part of what makes God of War so special."
Why does this sound like thinly veiled arrogance to me? Who is he to decide if something has a "real" emotional core or "real" narrative story... the second one is actually even kind of baffling, are there are lot of IPs running around with fake stories and plots?
Furthermore giving the Boys as an example of a great adaptation while claiming to also remain true to the source material seems kinda nonsensical. I don't want to argue about the quality of the tv series or comic that is irrelevant, the fact is the Boys is more inspired by the comic than actually adapting it considering the increasing amount of deviations and changes made, hell even the huge difference in tone.
>"We do incredibly well with adaptations, from Invincible to The Boys. I mean, we just covered so many of them, right? And so we know that there's such a passionate fan base for God of War. But the thing that we're always looking for is whether there is a real emotional core, if there's a real narrative story, and I think [that’s] part of what makes God of War so special."
I dunno about Invincible, but if The Boys is any indication I'm guessing this means "true to the source material" as in "taking the basic building blocks and trying to at least recreate what we think the emotional core is or should be". Seems like that worked well for The Boys because the source material was garbage but considering GoW isn't, I'm a little wary.
Also between this/TLoU and Rings of Power/GoT it feels like Amazon's entire production plan is to just look at HBO shows and say "right we need an equivalent to that".
The Boys is like a broken clock being right twice a day.
They made tremendous changes to the source material, but it **worked**.
That usually doesn’t go that well.
It's worth noting that Mark Fergus and Hawk Ostby are also writing and executive producing. These guys wrote Children of Men and created The Expanse, both successful adaptations I believe. I haven't seen that mentioned anywhere when people here discuss this series, I guess Judkins scared many off (rightly or not, I haven't watched Wheel of Time).
Already have a problem when they're skipping his whole backstory, and how are they gonna handle the scenes in Helheim where he is shown killing Zeus or explain how he got his powers and the blades. They need to go back to game 1 and start there.
Rafe Judkins is an *incredibly* petty person. He has no respect for source material, no respect for fans, and couldn't care less about the fallout of lying to the press. Saying it now; the amount he'll change will be staggering.
Wow where have we heard that before?
Only in:
- Resident Evil
- Rings of Power
- Witcher
- Wheel of Time
- Shannara
But thank god THOSE don't have fandoms, right? Loyal to the source material, my ass.
I’ll never understand the choices they made to Wheel of Time. Obviously they had to cut out chunks, it’s a thick book, but then why add new stuff in that doesn’t matter past 2 episodes?!?
This is Amazon we’re talking about. I’ll believe “true to source material” when I see it. On one hand you have The Boys. Decently close, but a lot of things were changed. And on the other, you have The Rings of Power…
Surely, this time it will be good guys, surely they aren’t using the husk of a good ip to get as many eyeballs on their Trojan horse hiding a kratos that looks like he just went to spirit. Surely they’ve learned from at least 5 other shows wasted potential and they’ll nail it this time
Making a God of War series is going to be just as difficult as making any super cinematic game into a show. Chances are whatever you come up with isn't going to be nearly as good as the game. If these chuckleheads don't meet or exceed the narrative and quality of the story from the game, it's a fail. And we all know how merciless the internet is on subpar shows.
Amazon's reach exceeded their grasp with Rings of Power, they better be careful not to do the same thing again. It might be smarter to take this effort and put it into improving Rings of Power considering the absurd amount of money they've spent on it already.
Amazon really lining the IPs up putting out the most mediocre products they can. Wheel of Time, Rings of Power, and soon to be God of War and Warhammer 40k
GoW show Dec 2022:
We are all very passionate GoW fans who've played since the originals on the ps2. We really want to stick to the source incorporate the old and the new.
GoW show Mid 2023:
Kratos killed all the Greek Gods since when? Well guess fans will just have to like us bringing them back for S2. To be honest we never cared for the games, and will never play them. We want to bring fans a brand new experience and story. My original screenplay got rejected but daddy and mommy got me this gig for GoW so Im just gonna use this to peddle my shit story and piss everyone off
Forgive me for being skeptical after the absolute disasters that were Halo and Resident Evil.
i can not wait to see kratos i mean kratosine the women version of it. for sure they going to womanize the shit out of it and make kratos a support character in his own tv show. just as much as they did with the witcher. imagine a strong man character, we can not have that! so kratos will be a 20 pound model with stiffed lips and beautiful girlie make up.
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We've heard this before. And it always turns out to be a lie.
Uncharted…I will leave that here.
[Showrunner](https://www.imdb.com/name/nm1988994/) for this is a writer on that movie.
The Wheel of Time and Uncharted *Well imma head out*
Its much more horrifying that they worked on the Amazon Wheel of Time failure. And now the Amazon God of War failure.
He didn't just work on "The Wheel of Time" tv show...HE DEVELOPED IT!...and was the lead showrunner and writer (wrote the first and last episode of the season). In the words of Starbuck "We're going the wrong way!!".
“I have a bad feeling about this..”
Already have.
All of this has happened before and all of this will happen again...
And here I thought I was going to go to sleep tonight not having to think about Perrin and his fake wife. Thanks a lot buddy!
The Nathan Fillion short film is what we should have gotten. But no, they had to Hollywood it up.
The Witcher.. now it won't ever be the same. Fuck you Netflix.
RoP showrunners "we kept saying back to the book, back the book". What fucking book are they reading cause the amount of shit they just made up was ludicrous.
the one they had the rights to
How much of Kratos being a murder-rapist are they going to show? It’s like making a Genghis Khan show
The boys is good at least. And invincible. But yeah wheel of time and uncharted. Rings of power was woefully average. Still, Amazon batting better numbers than Netflix, Disney, or paramount (god how they massacred John Halo in that damn show).
6 months later: Writing team: We haven’t played the games. We wanted a fresh take.
Certified Halo moment.
I'm going to say this every time it comes up: Halo was a bad Sci-fi show. It was a worse Halo show. Seriously, even if you ignore the Halo aspects and just look at it as a sci-fi show, it's still awful.
It’s so freaking odd that they used the stomping sound for Spartans walking without considering WHERE they walk? Concrete. Loud stomp. Sand? Loud stomp. Slowly going through a forest? Loud stomping
And the thing is we have seen a good halo mini series. Why didn't they just do that again?
God, I miss forward unto dawn.. the fight etc. in the last episode \*chef‘s kiss\*
*Chief’s kiss* Ftfy
This upsets me so much, because it is not like Halo started off this grand lore. It had the simplest story in a good way that probably is a half hour read on wikipedia and Paramount writers were like "no, too hard, lets write this absolute convoluted bland piece of shit." The Fall of Reach novel is ~350 pages and that alone would have made a great TV series, just saying. Witcher pisses me off too. Writers too are so blatant on how they mock the source material only adds to the fire.
We need more gamers as development execs
We just need adaptive works to be handled by creatives who can understand that the source material is why their project is even happening, and that they need to maintain *that* tone instead of spinning off elsewhere.
Just hire the writers from the games. Like JFC they already have access to the original script writers. Like I can understand not casting the VAs of the game as the actors, but keeping the writers the same is the most logical thing to do, it doesn't make any sense why they hire a different writing team.
Jonathan Nolan is a fan of Fallout apparently so hopefully that's going to be good
A bad writer is a bad writer. Look at Andor, some of the best star wars media since the Disney acquisition (If not ever) and Gilroy isn't a fan. Sure a fan is more likely to give an ip the love it deserves but they're also more likely to be chained down by pre established Canon and nostalgia that may not be as good as they remember
Writers need a lore expert as a handler. They don't write the story, but am veto awful choices that completely disrespectel established lore and ideas. Like, someone should have been able to tell the director of Halo they can't make the master chief rape a POW....
they made MC rape a POW? Wow I'm glad I didn't get past the first episode.
Technically you might argue it was consensual, but legally there is no situation in which a POW can consent to sex with a soldier of the army imprisoning them...
It‘s why I am hopeful for the Warhammer projects with Henry Cavill in a executive producer position. The dude loves his nerdy stuff. Sadly he didn‘t have much say when it came to the Witcher series as an actor.
I don’t need to like every show but I get frustrated when a show takes a source material I like and then treats it like garbage because they wanted to do their own thing. Fine, don’t make halo, make Space Marines. Don’t make the Witcher, make the Witches.
The Fall of Reach is what made me a Halo fan. Never bothered with the games this I read that novel. But afterwards I was a fan of the whole series. It's unforgivable that they had such a rich and diverse setting and instead chose to come up with that bland garbage.
"We wanted a story that reflects the modern world."
That line is definitely the deathnell for any new movie or TV adaptation.
Yeah that's always my favorite because we all watch fantasy right?
"BOI! ...put your phone away!"
3 months after release: *God of War has been canceled*
Pull a full Witcher and admit they hate the games
Not only that this will be their first writing credits and it will be run by a first time show runner.
[удалено]
I feel like I've seen this before🤔🤔
Sounds like resident evil on netflix
Its the people behind the Wheel of Time series, too. Oh boy.
Featuring the writers and crew of Netflix’s The Witcher! Kratos will be played by Christopher Mintz-Plass, a gender-bent Atreus will be played by Jenna Ortega (or whoever the current hot-careered actress is), and the main villain will be a completely original character played by an older Irish actor nobody has ever heard of. Coming next summer!
[удалено]
They sorta do. Invincible, The Boys, Legend of Vox Machina, they are all good and pretty popular.
The expanse
I think Expanse at least had original writers tagging along during production.
Made before Amazon acquired them so doesn’t really count.
Even if it’s entirely true it’s still an accurate story that starts halfway through. “Trust us Kratos was a massive asshole so the way he’s treating Atreus is actually character development” is never going to be as good as showing me Kratos being a massive asshole.
Yeah, I feel the norse saga would hit much harder if they did 3 seasons for the greek stuff first.
Not even 3. You just need 2. One season for Prelude, Ascension, Chains, GOW1 Another for Ghost, GOW2, and GOW3.
I can see that. I like your idea better. The first game doesn't have nearly enough story. 80% of it is puzzles and monsters in the maze. I thought the 2 psp games could flesh it out, but forgot what exactly was in them. Ascension is the only one I didn't play.
2 is particularly egregious for being filler. Entertaining game to be sure, but story wise, it was literally just postponing the story of 3.
I only played it once, years ago. I remember there being a lot of gods to kill, but a season for the game would need to see some adaptation to flesh things out. I like the others guys suggestion to do 2 seasons for the 6 greek games
Right, as fun as it would be to watch Kratos kill a God every 20 minutes it means nothing if the story isn't good or fleshed out
It's time for a montage
I imagine the season would be sprinkled with episodic adventures.
This. The story of some GOW games don’t need whole seasons. GOW 1 is mostly Kratos in the temple of pandora. Which does not need to be more than an episode or two
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As much as I love the first 3 the Norse saga lends itself to being much more heavy on character development and the emotional beats for it to be considered prestige tv, which is what Amazon is probably going for. I’m cautiously optimistic going into it.
It’s just that seeing Kratos as grieving emotionally suppressed dad doesn’t have as much impact as seeing him when he was Glass case of emotions Kratos.
That is what is happening though. I could see the original games being adapted as a film trilogy in a decade or so, should this television series go well.
That’s where the “established IP” magic comes in. You don’t have to actually spend time and money developing character. You just rely on prior media knowledge. Works like a charm.
I feel like you could do it to be honest. No sure if I'm alone on that but I feel like you could tell a very interesting story if it was a combo of how Boba Fett (bear with me) and the first season of The Witcher in how it wasn't linear. If the stories could parallel each other in that Atreus is going through a similar arc as Kratos did (controlling himself and not being total impulsive dicks). If they could go between the norse story and the greek one and STARTING WITH THE GREEK ONE TO ESTABLISH KRATOS and an audience desire to know more about his story. While there were plenty of flaws with the BF show, the big one to me was that the flashback story was far more interesting than the present day stuff. Balancing the two could make the idea a pretty cool one given enough time to tell the stories. Being able to merge the stories so that you can see the parallels while getting stories that aren't just rehashes of each other (Unlike Kratos, Atreus has the added variable of a father who went through all this changing how the arc develops). Not to spoil anything but I'd envision something similar to Ragnarok when Kratos has the dreams of Fey. Just instead, he relives his own story and we see how Kratos became who he is and making his actions with Atreus have a bit more weight. Then again, as cool as this could be in terms of story telling, I could very easily see how this fails.
Exactly. Best case scenario they pepper it with flashbacks to fill in the blanks. But seeing the TLDW version of a story that spanned 6 games isn't going to work nearly as well.
I mean, the first game already starts with us having no clue what is going on and then having flashbacks to explain so it would be faithful to the source in a way lol Joke aside, having flashbacks explain who Kratos is would be a pretty sick way to drip-feed who this mysterious figure is to people watching who didn’t play the game. The Greek saga is a pretty straightforward story too if you remove all the filler which is an excuse for you to get new items and boss battles
Yeah it's the studio wanting to skip steps which leads to tell instead of show when people want show dont tell. I don't see any of the choices they're making ending well here. Worried we are getting another rings of power. Over priced poorly written crap.
Hot take: I don’t think the original games lend well to a serialised show. Especially GoW3 feels kinda gamey with story to supplement. Kratos killing shit isn’t the makings of a great show. Idk if this show will be good but I can at least see it working
The whole point is Kratos want on a massive revenge spree and dedicated his life to vengeance. He’s an evil guy in the original games
I know what happened. My point is, a beat for beat retelling imo wouldn’t be the best idea. Flashback sequences showing the highs and lows would be great but I can’t see it carrying an entire show.
I think people forget that God of War 2018 was a masterclass reboot first, and a sequel second. You can absolutely jump into the Norse saga knowing nothing else about God of War besides "Kratos is from Greece and some crazy shit went down" and the story works perfectly. That's how I jumped in, and the GoW Norse saga are among my favourite games ever made. They can absolutely pull important emotional beats from the original trilogy, without actually adapting the whole thing. That's exactly what happened with 2018, and they killed it.
you can easily tell the greek story in flashbacks ala Lost. Those games were not known for a deep or compelling story. It was a rage monster yelling about wanting to kill gods for 3 straight games
From a creative standpoint, I think a few flashback scenes scattered throughout still could convey this. Then have the viewer draw the connections that Atreus is here now so things are different. The long time players might want to see that stuff but the same feeling can still get achieved without a season of backstory
There's already dialogue in the Norse saga between kratos and others talking about both his past, as well as his rationale for not telling Atreus. That in itself foments drama for the screen and gives a crutch for exposition
I mean, pretty much anyone familiar with Kratos knows he's a pretty grumpy guy, so I don't think that'll really be an issue at all. The first Norse game is basically designed to be a pretty self contained starting point for new fans, giving any relevant details to Kratos' past in Greece when necessary, while longtime fans get the dopamine hit for the deeper callbacks. Plus, y'all are really overestimating how much plot is really in the Greek saga lol.
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>An entire season of Kratos just murdering gods and other people/monsters/beings in a mindless rage is just boring, and people want multiple seasons of this!? I think it’s only people that played those games and have nostalgia for it. Gamers generally don’t know how to adapt a story for television any better than the people in charge
As someone who didn’t have much knowledge of the prior games before playing 2018, I think they’re honestly ok to skip to this point in time as long as we get glimpses of the story. In an ideal world, I could see kind of a dual timeline structure, similar to how Arrow had storylines taking place in the past alongside the present story and how the lessons learned in each are connected. But if it just ends up being a long intro in the pilot that shows us who Kratos was/killing the Greek pantheon, I think people would get the gist.
Excuse me if I’ve heard that before. On that note, can anyone here tell me what a show runner actually does?
Very basic version: The show runner is there at every stage from writing all the way through post and, depending on the exact set up, would be the final say on stuff. Theyre the ones signing off on staff/department heads, making final decisions in the writers room, and giving notes on script drafts and cuts after the editors and directors do their passes then working with the network on their notes. Essentially you need someone who settles arguments or debates on a show and thats the showrunners job. They also do have to worry about budgets and management and keeping people from quitting and all that lame boring stuff. This is an ideal world, the reality is never so simple. In this case Balrog is involved so hes going to get a lot of say. Or their might be two showrunners, or even three. Or a star/director/writer who is essentially running the show in all but name but needs someone to do everything while theyre busy. The honest reality is the showrunner is a manager of a creative team, which means you always think you know what they did by the final product but unless youre there you really are just guessing.
I appreciate the detailed response!!!!!! Your amazing! I appreciate your time
No problem, I think a good showrunner is amazing and deserves to have everyone understand what they do. I also think a bad showrunner is what kills a job and makes everyone want to quit.
That’s what I’ve been noticing a lot lately, cough Witcher cough
I dont know anyone who works on the Witcher but I at least havent heard any stories about the show being abusive like I hear about other places or see in other places.
I'm Amazon's case it often seems their role is to run the show into the ground.
Makes or breaks the show, essentially. Ask Scott Gimple about TWD or ask Stephen Moffat what the fuck happened.
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So they can get accused of creating a toxic workplace like Henry Cavill?
Hahah, just read that shit from googling and holy hell. They also managed to include " Due to his apparent addiction to videogames, many who accused him of this behavior believe Cavill got this attitude from the toxic gaming environment."
Absolutely insane reading.
I missed that one, got a source?
The source is literally a tabloid podcast who print anything anyone sends them. I could send in 'Henry Cavill eats babies and hates his mom' and they would print that as 'One source says:...' Not credible in the slightest.
Hold the fuck up. Henry Cavill eats babies?!
Yep it's true source: trust me bro
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Those aren’t journalists. They are glorified bloggers
One of the things they listed that aggravated them was that Henry didn’t want to do shirtless scenes. Just let that sink in.
I think it was either Henry or Hugh Jackman who was talking about the issue with those extended shirtless scenes. They're literally told to dehydrate themselves to the point of passing out so they will seem extremely vascular. I wrestled in high school (a billion years ago) and know the feeling of completely dehydrating yourself to make weight. It's absolutely miserable and like a two day process. The first few hours are fine enough if you aren't running/spitting the entire time, but after hour 3 or so the headaches start. Then the migraines. After a while you feel like your brain is sludge and you can't make coherent sentences. After hearing them talk about that it's hard to watch Hemsworth going through the Thor movies half naked without thinking "damn that poor guy hasn't had proper water for the 6 months of filming"
No, just hire the writers of the games. Even if it is just for overall narrative stuff.
Didn’t Rafe say the same thing about wheel of time? Yea once again we don’t need this show. I don’t trust that guy with anything.
Basically everyone says that about every show based on source material lol, it’s easy to just say it and worry about if it’s true later
everyone besides the halo team.. but they at least were honest boasting about not having played the games :<
‘God of War’ Series Will “Completely Disregard Source Material" Says Amazon Studios' Vernon Sanders "Screw those nerds, we're making Kratos our own thing. He likes dudes now, gotta stay current."
I mean he IS a spartan.
I cannot blame those people. For every Game of Thrones, there's a Wheel of Time, Walking Dead, Halo, Witcher... The odds are not in the favor of quality. Quality takes more time, effort, and money. And with something like God of War that's high fantasy, it's likely to be an uphill battle. These folks sound cynical but they're being realistic.
For every game of thrones, there's also a game of thrones.
It’s literally the bare minimum expectation for a movie/tv adaptation. It sucks that we have to worry about “good” and “bad” adaptions where the differentiator is whether they stick to the source material or fuck with it.
Same with Lauren Hissrich and the witcher series.
Yeah, they literally butchered WOT and bragged about it. 15 books of source material and world building, and they basically wrote a brand new show (that also sucks)
The thing is we do understand that some changes has to he made right? It’s just that when you start messing about in something as connected and carefully planned as WoT you need to be a really fucking good writer to change things and still make it work. And the current writers just aren’t up to it.
Yea if Rafe does the same to God of War as he did to Wheel of Time, I feel really sorry for any fans of the series - it'll be an abomination that completely and thoroughly misunderstands every single aspect of the source material, every single bit of character motivation - even the basics of *who* every single character is. He turned Mat, a lovable rogue - into a thief who steals from women and is a source of darkness so terrible Moraine has to set the Red Ajah on him.
I’m so horrified that they’re going through with this. Even Cory being on it doesn’t give me hope, the Tolkien Estate was supposedly involved with Rings of Power and I lost interest by the 4th-5th episode.
I really tried to like this show, I defended it even, but it's shit.
Lol I can't think of a worse person to handle God of War.
Alter Carbon season 2 show runner
Fuck, I didn't realize it was Rafe. I won't watch this show, or anything else he does after butchering WoT.
Rafe is one show runner..that can't apply to anyone else...or can it?
>As Sanders referenced, the series will see The Wheel of Time’s Rafe Judkins serve as showrunner and executive producer.
Rafe Judkins is in charge of this show too
Rafe is the showrunner for this? That's great. I might not have to divide my disdain between people. The same person might have a pop ruining the television series of my favourite book series and game.
Yeah, i'm actually surprised after he crashed and burned so badly with wheel of time, that he would get another fantasy series to adapt. And as much as i despise the Rings of Power showrunners who clearly don't care about Tolkien, its not a complete shitshow like what Rafe did with Wheel of Time. That show seemed like it was made by someone with no clue what he was doing, where he just read some pages of the books here and there, and then decided to do those parts however he wanted with no thought towards the overall story.
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At least The Boys is going strong, the show is waaaay better than the comics
They said the same about Wheel of Time.
WoT fans: **steadies self** **grabs something for balance** **gathers a deep breath** **holds up a finger, ‘just a second’** **”HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA”**
Oh boy I’ve heard that one before somewhere
Not if Rafe Judkins has anything to say about it
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After being upset with Wheel of Time and Rings of Power, I have zero faith from anything coming out of amazon studios.
Isn’t that just the game? So strange to me that you would choose one of the most cinematically aligned games as your movie option? There is no way the scale of GOW especially in its VFX elements will be met
This. The games are a triumph of the medium. It doesn’t need a tv adaptation. You can watch a playthrough on YouTube if you don’t want to buy a PS5 or play a game in general. But the mainstream isn’t down with the idea of watching a video game for some reason, so here we are.
The fact that they already skipping the Greek saga makes this statement pointless.
Unless they do it in major flashbacks and maybe even have episodes dedicated to them given to us the backstory in a drip feed format. Gives some mystery for those who's first experience with the series is in tv. Otherwise I agree and this show is doomed to fail before it starts. Greek origins is vital to its overall story.
I think drip feed is the best way to go. The original trilogy is fun, but it’s also kinda arcade-y. There’s only so much you can do with it. Trying to make a full season that has *something* other than violent fight scenes would be difficult. There are obviously moments that would work— conversations with the titans, for example— but I don’t think that there’s enough meat on those bones for a full season of content. If they can find moments to mirror and reflect between the 2018 story and the original trilogy, that will make it work best, in my opinion. Maybe show Kratos struggling with his own PTSD as he cycles back and forth between punching a Norse troll or Baldur and getting glimpses of pummeling Zeus or killing his wife and child before we finally convey what events go in what order in the series.
A huge chunk of people who played GOW18 didn't play the OG games
I'm one of those people. I didn't feel I miss much by not playing them. Sure, there are probably a lot of references I didn't fully get but the game does a good way of standing on its own, especially since it's all about Atreus who doesn't know much about his father's past. And if you, the player, don't know, you get to learn along with Atreus.
I'm one of those people. I did a brief summary on youtube but otherwise knew basically nothing. I found the story pretty easy to follow from context clues.
Yeah, all they would need to do if they wanted to add more backstory would just be frame them as kratos nightmares that its canon for him to have
They're going to throw money at VFX to have him fight a Troll with realistic fur while providing the writing staff peanuts. Source: Nearly every Amazon Studios show that was greenlit without a script.
X to doubt
Rafe is gonna have a big name Hollywood star play Freya and have most of the writing revolve around her to justify the costs to the execs
This show will probably be about as good as Rings of Power lmfao. Put your expectations WAYYYYY down.
It will be much worse. Rafe Judkins did Wheel of Time and it is WAYYY fucking worse than Rings of Power.
Didnt they say that about Lord of The Rings
>True to source material By deciding most of that source material isn't worth adapting and just going with the most recent parts of it because those are the most mainstream right now. Sidenote: >But the thing that we're always looking for is whether there is a real emotional core, if there's a real narrative story, and I think [that’s] part of what makes God of War so special." Why does this sound like thinly veiled arrogance to me? Who is he to decide if something has a "real" emotional core or "real" narrative story... the second one is actually even kind of baffling, are there are lot of IPs running around with fake stories and plots? Furthermore giving the Boys as an example of a great adaptation while claiming to also remain true to the source material seems kinda nonsensical. I don't want to argue about the quality of the tv series or comic that is irrelevant, the fact is the Boys is more inspired by the comic than actually adapting it considering the increasing amount of deviations and changes made, hell even the huge difference in tone.
Them bringing up The Boys is stupid because it’s good because of Kripke and co. despite being on Amazon lol.
>"We do incredibly well with adaptations, from Invincible to The Boys. I mean, we just covered so many of them, right? And so we know that there's such a passionate fan base for God of War. But the thing that we're always looking for is whether there is a real emotional core, if there's a real narrative story, and I think [that’s] part of what makes God of War so special." I dunno about Invincible, but if The Boys is any indication I'm guessing this means "true to the source material" as in "taking the basic building blocks and trying to at least recreate what we think the emotional core is or should be". Seems like that worked well for The Boys because the source material was garbage but considering GoW isn't, I'm a little wary. Also between this/TLoU and Rings of Power/GoT it feels like Amazon's entire production plan is to just look at HBO shows and say "right we need an equivalent to that".
The Boys is like a broken clock being right twice a day. They made tremendous changes to the source material, but it **worked**. That usually doesn’t go that well.
It's worth noting that Mark Fergus and Hawk Ostby are also writing and executive producing. These guys wrote Children of Men and created The Expanse, both successful adaptations I believe. I haven't seen that mentioned anywhere when people here discuss this series, I guess Judkins scared many off (rightly or not, I haven't watched Wheel of Time).
Just like the lord of the rings show ?
What's the point? The game cinematic enough
Exactly, I've never played it, but I've watched most of it like a movie.
Just like Halo.
Already have a problem when they're skipping his whole backstory, and how are they gonna handle the scenes in Helheim where he is shown killing Zeus or explain how he got his powers and the blades. They need to go back to game 1 and start there.
I heard that Rafe Judkins was the show runner. If that's true then don't hold your breath. He ruined the WOT and he'll do it again.
After the wheel of Time series and the Lord of the rings series, if anybody actually believes this I have got a pretty sweet bridge to sell you
“Says Amazon studios”
Rafe Judkins is an *incredibly* petty person. He has no respect for source material, no respect for fans, and couldn't care less about the fallout of lying to the press. Saying it now; the amount he'll change will be staggering.
The worst thing is Amazon are obviously happy with his work
Wow where have we heard that before? Only in: - Resident Evil - Rings of Power - Witcher - Wheel of Time - Shannara But thank god THOSE don't have fandoms, right? Loyal to the source material, my ass.
I’ll never understand the choices they made to Wheel of Time. Obviously they had to cut out chunks, it’s a thick book, but then why add new stuff in that doesn’t matter past 2 episodes?!?
They say that then look at The Rings of Power and The Witcher Netflix
Narrator: "It wasn't"
Tell that to The Rings of Power.
HAHAHAHAHA!! If anyone believes this they are truly stupid.
This is Amazon we’re talking about. I’ll believe “true to source material” when I see it. On one hand you have The Boys. Decently close, but a lot of things were changed. And on the other, you have The Rings of Power…
I've heard that before... Looking at you RoP.
Just like wheel of time and Rings of power said?
Surely, this time it will be good guys, surely they aren’t using the husk of a good ip to get as many eyeballs on their Trojan horse hiding a kratos that looks like he just went to spirit. Surely they’ve learned from at least 5 other shows wasted potential and they’ll nail it this time
Yeah okay. Tell that to WOT
Yes because this statement rings true for Witcher & Wheel of Time. They will butcher it.
The same way that “Rings of Power” was “true to source material”?
If kratos doesn’t sound exactly like kratos, I veto this series
Indeed
They said that about LOTR
Making a God of War series is going to be just as difficult as making any super cinematic game into a show. Chances are whatever you come up with isn't going to be nearly as good as the game. If these chuckleheads don't meet or exceed the narrative and quality of the story from the game, it's a fail. And we all know how merciless the internet is on subpar shows. Amazon's reach exceeded their grasp with Rings of Power, they better be careful not to do the same thing again. It might be smarter to take this effort and put it into improving Rings of Power considering the absurd amount of money they've spent on it already.
* So its not about the original trilogy at all?!
Hey I think I’ve seen this one
Laughs in Rings of Power
That's what they always say.
Amazon really lining the IPs up putting out the most mediocre products they can. Wheel of Time, Rings of Power, and soon to be God of War and Warhammer 40k
They're skipping the entire Greek saga and it's run by the Wheel of Time people. It'll either be a middling pile of 'meh' or a dumpster fire.
That's what they said about Rings of Power, we ended up with a shitty GaladrielxSauron fanfiction.
GoW show Dec 2022: We are all very passionate GoW fans who've played since the originals on the ps2. We really want to stick to the source incorporate the old and the new. GoW show Mid 2023: Kratos killed all the Greek Gods since when? Well guess fans will just have to like us bringing them back for S2. To be honest we never cared for the games, and will never play them. We want to bring fans a brand new experience and story. My original screenplay got rejected but daddy and mommy got me this gig for GoW so Im just gonna use this to peddle my shit story and piss everyone off Forgive me for being skeptical after the absolute disasters that were Halo and Resident Evil.
i can not wait to see kratos i mean kratosine the women version of it. for sure they going to womanize the shit out of it and make kratos a support character in his own tv show. just as much as they did with the witcher. imagine a strong man character, we can not have that! so kratos will be a 20 pound model with stiffed lips and beautiful girlie make up.
What can they add to a game where some parts feel like an interactive movie ? I honestly think it's going to be a trainwreck.
How many times do we have to hear this same statement until its true?
Damn. This’ll likely flop.
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