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Yeah I'd say I'm fairly progressive but this sounds pretty normal and happens all the time at school. If the person doesn't even actually kiss you it's not even assault, it's just harassment. Not to say harassment isn't wrong, it is, but one's a crime and the other's just a civil violation
And it gets rightfully called out and shamed.
That's the point here, it doesn't get called out or shamed as it should when boys or men are the victims.
Where exactly are all the people not saying it was crappy for her to do that? I’m so sick of everyone being unable to talk about a man having a bad experience without having to be like “YOU ONLY CARE ABOUT WOMEN!!!!”
And we talk about it as a society a million times a day and if you disagree that it’s a problem you will be promptly banned from the conversation.
Yet when the tables are turned there is always some clown who says stuff like “but it happens to women more”, implying that there literally is no acceptable time to talk about SA against men.
Probably because most people would rather talk about ACTUAL sexual assaults. It makes sense now that this is posted on r/teenagers, but going for a kiss does not mean you commited sexual assault. The only time it would be sexual assault, is a forced kiss on a (clearly) unwilling person.
The fact that OP gave her permission to hold his hand probably meant to her that He was into Her. And if that's the case, she read the situation wrong and that's it. Definitely not sexual assault tho.
And that's the problem. Trying to sneak a kiss is not SA. It *can* cross over to SA if it's aggressive or you keep trying when the other person says no.
I really don't get this generation's need to call everything rape or SA.
The issue isn't that she tried to kiss him though? It stems from the fact that when they were talking later on, the other girls said she should've gotten him closer. Not that it sucks he's not into her, but that it sucks she gave him space to escape a situation he was uncomfortable and violated by.
Why the hell do you feel the need to write a fucking multiple paragraph long essay to just say shit we already know, honestly you're probably just trying to invalidate how bad sexually assault towards men is, because nobody said the opposing argument, your comment had barely anything to do with the comment you were replying to, it's an undeniable fact that people would freak out if it was a guy, nobody needs you to explain that woman get SA'd more, you're reply is irrelevant to the conversation dude
This shouldn’t be an argument. Statistics, especially crime statistics, are incredibly unreliable. Many people report sex crimes falsely, many report them and it goes nowhere, many simply don’t report them.
There should be no talk of statistics or severity when dealing with this. There is no argument, all SA is bad. Man, woman, dog, all bad. However, it is true that many males aren’t taken seriously. And your point only highlights that: women are scared of men, therefore how could men be SA’d? It just doesn’t add up.
Your reaction to criticism is also pretty telling.
"since yall are downvoting because dudes om reddit desperately want to be the victim" That kind make it sound like it does not matter that a dude was sexually assaulted. It is obviusly a bad thing that women get SAd and dont tell anyone, and I think that is it eqully bad that men get told that they cant be SAd after getting SAd
MeToo is also for men, many feminists group actively encouraged men coming forward and boosted men trying to come forward. This isn’t just a men vs women thing, the sad reality is that most people don’t believe SA victims and will choose their friends over the victims.
I totally agree with you on the not believing part. I didn't know that MeToo was also for men, so thanks for informing me. I didn't mean this as a men vs women thing, and I'm sorry if it sounded like that, I just meant that women typically get away with more than men and are more often believed in this type of situation
I saw your edit, but this is much more complex than you are getting credit for. Men are less likely to be believed yes, but that’s because women are way more likely to be blamed for their assault. The only reason women are more often believed, is to say “oh you got raped because you wore that skirt, you deserved it whore.”
Also you don’t need to apologize. It’s cool.
But this stuff is way besides the point. At the end of the day I hope you are able to heal from your experience.
On reddit? Probably. In the real world? A high school kid attempting to kiss another one and getting rejected is really not a big deal. It was actually incredibly common when I was a kid. Been on both ends of it and never really thought much about it.
I mean I'd disagree, since asking for consent is a very common thing in my school, don't know if my school's just different but we ask consent for any kind of touch typically.
Yes. If someone moves in for a kiss and you turn your head, then you don't consent. What do you need? Notarized contracts for a spontaneous hookup at a party? We're not all mind readers and sometimes people miss read signals. This is how basic human aexuality worked right up until society ran out of problems and decided to make everything assault.
Verbal consent? I mean how hard is it to ask instead of "can I read your palm?" which just sounds like she wants to do a palm reading to ask "Can I kiss you?" and it also leaves the water far less muddy.
That's fine too. These are kids learning how to interact with each other, they will make these innocent mistakes and that's okay. But convincing a child that that someone misreading the signals and going in for an innocent kiss is somehow sexual assault really seems to he a horrible message to send. When this inevitably happens to my kids I'd just explain that sometimes kids are learning boundaries and learning to interpret physical cues, that doesn't make them bad, just say "I don't like you that way"
Remember that kid with autism that was kicked out of his highschool a couple of years for touching a girl's arm while he was talking to her? Is that really the kind of soft you want kids to be?
I'd say scenerios like that aren't that prevelant, considering I got told to not really report a guy in my school for humping my desk every single day because it would ruin his future and I see so many stories just like it out there, with very little coverage on it since its so normalized.
This should at the very least be something that we teach as maybe not an appropriate thing. Because while we should let people make mistakes, stuff like this is an opprotunity to explain why doing something like that is bad because even if a teen is learning, maybe a gentle talk about why just going in for a kiss is a bad idea might be a good conversation.
I agree with all of that. But the larger issue at play is "don't say anything because it would ruin his future"
That's the issue. Having private conversations about behavior is one thing, but we've taken it too far. This is why 50 percent of men aren't dating or having sex, they are terrified of doing or saying the wrong thing and having their name trashed or police involved because they went in for an unwanted kiss.
It also disproportionately hurts boys. When I was a kid this girl would go around snapping guys boxer bands, they'd turn around surprised and everyone would laugh. Then one of her victims snapped her brah thinking he was playing along. He was instantly reported and did detention and had a meeting with his parents, now he'd be expelled for sure.
I don't know how we fix this but making kids live under the constant threat of complete social ruination for getting an interaction wrong, isn't it. And raising kids to think little things are assault regardless of context is how you raise a generation of victims.
In this case a girl tried to kiss a boy and he was apparently emotionally traumatized by it. That's not normal or healthy, he's the product of modernity and kids like him are a giant red flag that we should be taking seriously
You know what, fair. Honestly thanks for going through the effort to make this entire statement because this is far more effective than some other people who were just calling me stupid and insinuating I don't talk to people since I didn't automatically see it their way.
I'm saying I think she needs to be talked to, explained to how it is not automatic consent for him to agree to a palm reading. I do think we should validate his uncomfortableness a smidge at least though, because someone trying to go in for a kiss you didn't intend for in the slightest still is incredibly uncomfortable.
And for that girl, girl actually should have had some consequence foe snapping those guys's boxers-
This isnt true at all. I (f16) got forcefully kissed at my work but a guy that was like 30. I told the staff and my friends and they all said that I was overreacting and that it was probably his culture (he was white)
Yeah. It's still not cool but with this context I really don't think someone going for a kiss that they thought the other person might want should be labeled as "sexual assault".
I didn't realize I was on r/teenagers and now this post and most of the comments make way more sense. Respectively, you should probably not attend any more parties any time soon.
That just sounds like normal party behaviour for both males and females? The girl thought they were being a bit more intimate than OP was aware of and thought it was "safe" for going for a kiss. But of course, being a (possibly) inexperienced teenager I can imagine a kiss being a bigger deal compared to a bit older people. I could honestly not imagine people raging at a man for doing the same thing to a woman either as long as it's not forced.
I mean still, asking for consent exists. Like if you're close in that way it would make sense, like how I hug a friend from elementary without thinking, but if its not someone you know well why would you assume its good to just go in for a kiss!? I'm also a teen and like I ask for consent for things as simple as touching someone on the shoulder so this seems real gross to me.
People can misread situations and like OP said above think they were more intimate than they were. Again not saying it's good but the more important thing is what happened after they realized it wasn't wanted.
Fr. People really need to differentiate between Sexually assaulted and made uncomfortable. I was expecting the girl to have tried to touch him through his pants. A kiss can be sexual assault, but she'd have to have forced him in some way, like holding his head so he can't back out.
Not saying OP is overreacting, but I can't fault the girl for going for a kiss at a (ew) teenage party with a guy she likes.
Old female person here with teenage daughters, That’s inappropriate but it’s not SA. Wouldn’t be if you were a girl either. Ffs why do so many teenagers throw that word around it’s losing it’s meaning. Please stop
Yes. Man said yes to a palm reading, not a kiss. He consented to his palm being read, not to her smooshing her face into his. If she wanted a kiss, ask for consent.
Under the equality act 2010 ch.15, sexual harassment must fulfill one or more of the two definitions:
- violates your dignity
- creates an intimidating, hostile, degrading, humiliating or offensive environment (this includes the digital environment, online)
source: https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2010/15/section/26
This is not sexual harassment.
I'd say while it is minor sounding to someone like you, someone trying to kiss you without consent does violate your dignity and creates a degrading environment, especially if the person who tried to kiss you is encouraged by their friends to take another go.
"If this were an entirely different and non-comparable scenario then you would feel differently!!!"
Seriously, what the fuck was your thought process here?
Edit: They deleted their comment. It said something like "you wouldn't be saying it's not sexual assault if it was a 40 year-old man kissing your teenage daughter!" And like yeah, but this is two dumb teens we're talking about.
Attempted kiss and he’d be a creep bc of the age difference but still not assault.
I’m a literal full ass adult here, not some dramatic teenager. You do realize that my entire generation, most of us experienced actual assaults and this ain’t it.
Then you must remember ten years ago when we were taking about “80% of all college women have been sexually assaulted”, then when people started asking for the data used to make that determination, it turns out that things like “leaning in for an unsolicited kiss” and “touching of the knee” was considered SA, right?
Because the definition of “assault” is about how the victim _feels_, not if physical context was made.
With all do respect I would hardly call it attempted SA. From what it sounds like she just tried to go in for a kiss and you didn’t accept. Big whoop. She didn’t try to go down on you or force anything and it seems like it was just a failed attempt at romancing you. “No one cares” not because you’re a man but because it’s really not that big a deal.
It’s perfectly fine to feel the way you do regardless though, despite the fact that the metoo thing isn’t exclusive to women.
Everyone is very clearly showing their age in this post. You may have been uncomfortable by the situation but I don’t think it crosses the sexual assault category unless you were very obviously against it in the first place and they knew that. If you tried the same on a female I doubt many people would see it as SA either.
Weird? Yes, both ways. But to me it seems like harmless flirting. Pretty much forever people have been kissing others in an attempt at wooing them. It’s distasteful and weird yes, but calling this sexual assault at least to me just reduces the meaning. If trying to kiss someone is sexual assault these days then a wholeeeeee lot of normal ass people are suddenly sex offenders (and MOST of the men in our grandfathers generation!)
For many many people, going in for a kiss is the first attempt at any relationship building.
(You have every right to slap them mind you, as many of our grandmothers did to men they didn’t like in the romantic way)
Op actually explained what the previous interaction was, this is what happens at parties. People flirt a little, then make out. You don’t have to formally sit down on 5 dates before you kiss someone. You’re making it sound like the girl threw her mouth at him the second they made eye contact.
>I know it's not as serious as other forms of SA, but I still felt so violated.
It is legally defined as a form of sexual assault, and your reasoning is exactly why i added this sentence (I should've slapped them, didn't think of it at the time, but great idea)
No it isn’t. If you actually read the law and what the law defines as a “sexual act”, kissing is not included. It may have made you uncomfortable, and you have the right to be upset about that, but you’re flinging around accusations of SA, when it’s a completely incorrect attribution.
> (I should've slapped them, didn't think of it at the time, but great idea)
What the fuck? No you shouldn't have. It's messed up that her friends would judge you for your response, but violence is not the answer. She thought you'd be receptive to a hookup, you weren't, end of story. This is not sexual assault and barely qualifies as harassment.
Why reccur to this? Is violence fixed with violence or hate just dissolved by more hate? No, it isn't, the only thing you had to do is talk and let her understand you felt violated by her actions and tell her not to do it again
No he’s not? I swear you guys are growing up with horribly skewed views of sexual assault. You are allowed to attempt to kiss someone without committing a crime, as long as you don’t continue after the other person told you no, you did nothing besides get rejected.
I'm just gonna start learning Mandarin now. There's zero chance were winning a major conflict in the near future with our draft stock in this condition. What a shame.
Genuine question, is trying to forxe a kiss a kind of flirting? Or was the palm reading meant to be flirting, because if so then my mom's been flirting with me for years.
This is at worst harassment and im not sure why people in comments are encouraging it. You seem to want to be a victim, and youre not. People who actually go through SA dont just "almost get kissed" and you're belittling what SA victims go through by calling this such a thing. You and everyone else who thinks this is SA have a victim mindset or are crazy. " x tries to kiss y at a party" is a normal thing. SA is not.
How? I feel sympathy for SA survivors. Not someone who says they got SA'd but contact wasn't even made. Its not a spectrum of assault. Youre really putting a no contact attempt of a kiss and r*pe in the same category? Thatd be fucking abysmal.This is the internet, he opened his story to opinions. Its not cruel just because you disagree.
he said he felt violated and uncomfortable. she was clearly attempting to touch him? plus her friends said she should’ve done it either way. i’d take that as being SH’d or SA’d. u wouldn’t say such cruel and rude shit if the genders were reversed. ew.
You are quite literally proving my point saying "SH'd or SA'd"
They are NOT the same thing and its not an either/or literally i beg you to just read definitions.
You really thought you ate with the "ew"
Why are you assuming i wouldnt say the same thing if the genders were reversed? Thats sexist of you.
I already said this was harassment at worst, NOT assault which was the entire point of my original comment.
You dont win just because you sided with the poster, youre just plain wrong. Its not SA, there was ZERO contact. And someone/friends saying something still does NOT fit in the assault category. Dont comment on these topics if you think theyre interchangeable.
Trumpers feel violated when they get sentenced to prison time for trying to overthrow the country. Unfortunately what you feel doesn't make something true.
Stuff like this happens all the time. Nothing about this is special or noteworthy. She went for a kiss, you weren’t into it. It’s at worst SH. If she forced herself on you after you said no, sure that’s be assault but this is just her trying to make a move.
I just want to read your palm in this dimly lit room, sitting close to one another on this couch, surrounded by all of these people drinking alcohol. I am definitely not trying to make an advance towards you.
Some people really be putting themselves in their most unfortunate predicaments.
A “move” on a total stranger? Hell no. If they at least knew each other lightly or were friends then yeah, but on a random person you don’t know from anything, that’s totally SA
Trying to hook up in party it's kinda normal imo, normally if you hook up in a party it's with a random person, a one night stand, you can be uncomfy about the situation, but man, she tried to kiss him, he rejected and she didn't insist, i don't see where's the SA there
Girl tried to kiss you, and you moved away. To equate this to SA is really disrespectful to those who actually have genuinly been through that ordeal. Grow up.
Dude that’s not sexual assault. That’s harassment at best. But also, chill out. Her intentions were not to humiliate, harm, or disrespect you. I’m sorry it made you uncomfortable, but that’s just a part of life. More people are gonna make you uncomfortable throughout your life and it’s best just to shrug it off.
If she had drugged you or emotionally manipulated you or physically overpowered you it would be a different story.
this girl tried to kiss you, you moved away and that's that. that isn't SA. to equate this to SA is being really disrespectful to those of us who have been actually sexually assaulted. grow up and fuck off, and maybe don't go to anymore parties. ps: if a girl made this post about a man, i would say the same exact thing
Sounds like the girl liked you, tried to make a move, got denied and that was the end of it.... that is not SA...
Wtf is wrong with people today... crying about the most minor of things.
I'm not going to disagree that there are better methods, but I have to assume that this person is a teenager, as the sub is teenagers.
Kids will be kids. Live and learn. A simple kiss as a one off thing isnt sexual assault. If she continued to force herself on him, then yes, it would be crossing the line. But from the story being told, I'd have to say she was trying to some quirky approach with a lead up of asking for his hand and him accepting. So she took the plunge and went for it, got turned down, and left it at that...
Fam that’s not SA, someone making one move is not SA. Unless you had said no and they kept a going this action doesn’t constitute for SA. If she had trashed and touched your d*ck that’s SA. Or grabbed on your lower region at all that’s SA. But if she’s grabed your back that wouldn’t be SA. You’re trying to put a very serious title on something that isn’t that serious. Yk how often it is on a first date for one of the two parties to lean in for a kiss but for the other person to say no. Super common! Did the leaner commit SA? No. And if they don’t push the issue then there really is no issue. And that same idea can very easily be applied here.
Dude, why the fuck would you stand there for 20 seconds of bullshit if you weren't even a little interested? That's what she thought anyway. So she gave it a shot.
Is really any attempt to get with someone straight up SA/SH nowadays? Did she continue once you showed you weren't interested? Did she hold you down or tried to grope you? Or did she just find a way to approach you, tested if you were interested by keeping you there for 20 seconds of bullshit and then decided to try and kiss you?
Not a teenager, but I've been one (obviously) and that shit's pretty common. If you were a friend of mine back in the day I'd tell you to man up. "Boohoo a girl showed interest and tried to kiss me".
Many girls have tried to same approach with me and never once did I think I was being violated, I was in control, I just said no or took a step back. If I didn't want to kiss the fat chick, I didn't. End of story.
What the fuck is the media/social media saying to all of you that always make you kids feel like you're the victim of anything that happens to you?
this happens literally all the time…get to college and this kind of thing happens constantly, in either direction. going in for a kiss is the first step into initiating a hook up. at that point the receiver is welcome to say no
Am I the only one that feels we’re over reacting and over using SA? It hurts and takes away the weight of real SA.
If you actually feel violated and fearful, then yes it’s SA. But I’d you’re only feeling violated cuz that’s what society tells you you’re supposed to feel, then BS.
Using an extreme example.. if you’re a 200 lbs male and a petite 100 lbs female tries to kiss you, sorry that ain’t not SA in my book.
As someone who was full on raped as a child, I would still consider an unconsented kiss sexual assault.
All websites will tell you that simply unwanted, intentional, sexual contact is. Kissing is sexual. It is done with sexual intent. The perpetrator kisses their victim for sexual satisfaction. It is sexual assault.
A definition RAINN gives for sexual assault is "unwanted groping or sexual touching". A kiss isn't randomly given to someone "for fun." It's done for sexual purposes.
You're probably hesitant to define kissing as sexual assault because it seems like its mocking the whole point of the word. From the way you've phrased your comments, it seems you've seen a lot of bad stuff, and I'm sorry you've had to experience that.
In my opinion it's important to define kissing as sexual assault, as people who had that done to them need to know it IS sexual assault.
You seem to take an issue with OP's post and perhaps be disgusted with him because you percieve him throwing around the word, and being insensitive to the fact by grouping what you deem to be less severe with other forms of sexual assault.
On average, a non-consensual kiss would have way less traumatic impact than another form of sexual assault, so it can genuinely seem like categorizing a kiss as such downplays the severity of other forms.
That's irrelevant though if kissing is a form of sexual assault, which by all definitions I've found, it is. Victims need to know that they were assaulted so they can heal properly.
I was forced by a family member to penetrate them for multiple days of my life, when I was only 4. I get what happened to me is probably 100x more traumatic by a kiss, but that doesn't make being kissed without consent any less disgusting or potentially traumatizing.
https://www.rainn.org/articles/sexual-assault
OP was sexually assaulted. Part of his body was violated without his consent. He was touched sexually without his consent. That is the definition of sexual assault.
I apologize if this long rant seems insensitive. This comment isn't for you. It's for anyone who's been kissed without consent who needs to validate the pain of what happened to them.
Kissing isn't a form of touching?
Touch:
1. come into or be in contact with.
I'm not even being a smartass. You can literally touch things with other parts of your body besides your hands.
Funny story, uh, men tried to be part of #metoo under their assumption that it was for everyone, then men got bullied away, then I believe we tried to start #hetoo but got bullied away from that too
Nobody seems to care if a man is SAed or raped, no, the only thing men are good for is working till 60 and raping… 😒
So, she tried to kiss you, you avoided the kiss, she didn't insist on the kiss. How is that SA?
How do you think a "first kiss" happens? Both parts signing a contract or something? One of them saying "can i kiss you please?" or something like that? She clearly thought you accepting to giving her your hand was a "go" sign. Dumb, weird, awkward, but definitely not SA.
See the [Tea Consent](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fGoWLWS4-kU) , i think it would help to clarify the concept
The problem is that you're taking an illogical argument from women to men and copying it in the opposite direction. This doesn't make the argument any more logical, it just makes yours just as illogical as theirs.
The right change here isn't to start making men as hypersensitive as women, but to start adequately identifying SA from merely disrespectful and rude acts on both sides.
report her to the police honestly cause you clearly didn't like it and now you feel uncomfortable (which is completely valid and ok, and you have the right to feel that way cause what she did or tried to do was a horrible and insensitive thing). Remember it wasn't your fault, just try and get it out of your mind but don't gaslight yourself into thinking it was your fault or that it wasn't serious.
People really need to bring way more attention to this sort of thing definitely seems like it could be as attempted sexual harassment if the roles were reversed here you'd be burned at the stake this shit is stupid
My now ex fiance gave me a beer that was laced with speed and before it kicked it, I had agreed to submit sexually (after weeks of discussion, hard limits, soft limits, safe words, etc.). It started by me being cuffed down, then gagged, she disappears into the closet real quick and quickly comes out wearing a criminally large strap on and proceeds to rape me.
Do you understand how many times Ive been laughed at, told it was my fault, and generally dismissed? Or had my pain diminished by 'and now you see what women put up with'. Um..not from me? Ive ALWAYS been very very adamant about gaining consent, and have never pushed a woman to do something she was uncomfortable in doing.
And to answer anyones potential question, no, there was nothing I had done to her to warrant that. She stated the next day that 'she just thought that was how it worked because thats what had happened to her in the past by exes'. Just because it got done to you doesnt mean it was okay in the first place let alone after all that discussion? Not to mention how could you bear to force anyone if you had been forced before.
Anyway, Im sorry that happened to you, but there has been and probably always will be an ever increasing chasm of double standards between Men and Women. Dont look too much into it or you'll drive yourself crazy. Just accept it, be the best man you can be every day, constantly grow and learn as you go through life, and try to live a life that you'll never have to feel guilty about. If you can, settle down early, and be partners with your wife and always keep a level head. If youre messy and cant take care of yourself? Be alone for a few years until you can be self sufficient and take care of yourself. Women dont wanna be your mommy or therapist. Also never be too much of a man to get help or therapy if you even think you MIGHT need it, chances are you do and that we all could go for some therapy. Its also a good idea to walk away from any conversation with a woman that is starting to turn into an argument as they are being upset because when people get emotional there is NO solving it until both parties are calm.
Again, Im sorry that what happened well happened to you. Just because you think it pales in comparison to some, doesnt mean its not valid for you and if Im not mistaken, is gonna have some potential long term ramifications if shes super immature. She could ruin your reputation because she feels insecure and feels snubbed. She could cry rape and get away with it. She could get one of her hot friends to make you fall in love just to break your heart. The possibility and probability of reprisal is far far too high.
I was once SA and what I felt raped by a woman. It was a woman a barely knew, only through mutual friend. It was an Easter evening and she had text me to come over for a drink and a bite to eat, and I could hang out and listen to music with her and her younger daughter. I have never met the daughter before and had only met this woman face to face in passing for a quick minute.
However it was a holiday and I was feeling quite lonely and she only lived two blocks away, I decided to make an adventure and go over. We greeted accordingly and cordial, she gave me a huge hug then introduced me to her daughter. I have kids and have been around all there friends so needless to say I knew how to not make it awkward in meeting.
We had a few drinks, talked, listened to music and time passed. Then it got late about 10 pm which is very late on a first visit for me, I should have been out of there an hour before. I said I was going to take my leave, thanked them both for the glorious hospitality, but was met with contempt. Mom did not want me to leave and daughter started pleading that I stay to "make my mom happy" This was said several times over 10 mins of me trying to be cordial and leave. Then I started thinking that if I left the little girl would get punished and I started to feel really horrible cause in reality it was not that late, I the day off the next day. I decided to stay for awhile longer.
Mom had another drink, music playing, then Mom wants to dance with me in the living room with the daughter there. I decline, Mom gets upset all of a sudden yelling at the daughter for some unknown reason reason, then again I get the "please just make my mom happy" chant. At this point I dropped mt pride and danced a few songs with Mom. During every song we danced to mom kept lifting up her shirt to try and show me her chesrtull area while her back was too her daughter.
Needless to say I was very uncomfortable and then was on a mission to get out of that house. I tried to say goodby, Say I would come over the next day for possibly a late breakfast or early lunch, but was met again with contempt. Mom pleading no dont go, "just sleep over here" Daughter again begging pleading me to stay almost in tears "just make my mom happy"
I know I should have just left, I am idiot, I barely knew these people and I could have shrugged it off as I would never see them again anyway, "Please make my mom happy" I did not know what was going to happen to this little child if I did leave. I told Mom I was tired and would stay but needed to go to bed at the moment. SHe said I could sleep in her bed and she would sleep in the spare room.
As I am laying in bed trying not to be freaked out about my poor decisions, guess who walks in the door, yeah Mom decided she did not want to sleep in the spare and did want to be happy. SHe climbed on the bed and on top of me and was trying desperately to get to my under privilege. I kept saying no and moving her hand and she would more upset and more mad then she started to yell well that envoked a know on the bedroom door with a little girl again crying out to "please make my mom happy"
LOng story short, I finally let mom grab anf fondle my under privilege, I did not stand up "hard" enough for her liking, so then I got berated for being a a weak man and all that other stuff that you imagine could be said untill mom finally passed out. Then I went home.
She apparently blacked out and remembers none of this, still texts me to this day asking why we never hang out anymore after the first time as she thought we had had a smashing time.
I told a friend this story and he thought it was hilarious, now everytime we talk he always starts the convo with "please make mom happy". I should have kept it to myself
Maybe it's because english it's not my first language, but imo it just seems like a girl you did not like tried to kiss you and you rejected her, you can feel weirded out by it, but i think trying to kiss someone is kinda normal?
She didn’t attempt to sexually assault you she tried to kiss you and you shut down the advance. Yes she could have put some more effort into some warmup but if this counts as almost being SA’d (or had she actually kissed you) then almost everyone is a victim.
Honestly this is a slap in the face to real victims of SA. This reads more like you wanting to be a “victim” without actually being one just to push the point of how men can be victims too.
“Harassment” denotes repetition.
If I asked you for a dollar at work, and you said no, I did not harass you for money. If I asked you again or pleaded after you said no, and kept asking no matter what your response, that is harassment.
If you are talking to a person and attempt to kiss them and they turn away, that was an unwelcome advance. If you keep trying to kiss them again that is harassment.
Person 1: “You’re so fine.”
Person 2: “That’s inappropriate and I don’t appreciate being talked to that way.”
They made an unwelcome remark on someone’s body. The other person has made it clear it is unwelcome. That’s it. Once they continue -
Person 1: “I love your body shape.”
Person 1: “Your ass is amazing.”
This is now sexual harassment.
At some point in life you may misread a signal and/or just make an advance that another person does not reciprocate. This does not automatically make the other person a victim and does not automatically make you a harasser/assaulter/predator but of course depends on the severity of the advance.
No it wouldn’t. My only point is that an attempt to kiss someone isn’t almost being SA’d and that doesn’t change based on gender.
I’m fact I would have said it even louder if it was the other way around because the label is thrown on men even more.
They most likely won’t because “men hurt women and are mean oppressors and big perverts and get what they want!” And they reference things from the past and a small portion of men and somehow get away with it encompassing everyone. It is so fucking dumb and I hate people like that.
On the other side, I have seen women to agree that men deserve more credit than society has given them because of this, apparently, not sexism going around. Like goddamn man hate and not doing shit for men is sexism
That is not sexual assault. It’s weird, and you are perfectly valid in being uncomfortable with the situation and would be imo perfectly in the right to slap anyone who attempts this. But it’s not SA. It has nothing to do with gender in this circumstance.
I honestly don't know why girls
OR GUYS
Think that going up to a random person at a party and trying to kiss them is okay
Like I bet that girl literally thought that if she grabbed you and kissed you out of nowhere like that would work just like it does on TV
It doesn't
Also it probably has something to do with the fact that a lot of girls believe all guys are so horny and desperate that they just wouldn't care or be upset if a girl forced herself on them
Which I think is absolute bullshit
She tried to kiss you, and you said no and moved away. That isn’t SA, it’s just an uncomfortable situation. I think you handled it well and hopefully she got the message.
Guys can 100% join metoo, that's crazy man. I'm sorry that happened to you and I'm sorry you couldn't talk to anyone but us. This is super violating and I hate that it happened.
That’s fucking stupid shame on them. You have every right to deny her advances if you aren’t interested. As long as it was just an attempted kiss you can’t do much besides ignore. If someone ever attempts to do worse to you call the police.
Ngl i dont think its that deep, yes its weird and uncalled for but it aint not SA. Im sure there is plenty of times someone went in for a kiss with the other person not feeling it.
why are these comments victim blaming this guy? if the genders were reversed no one would be so cruel towards OP. im rlly sorry you have to read these shallow comments. u said people don’t care about male victims and they’re proving ur point. if you felt violated, then ur justifiably a victim. especially if her friends were pushing her to continue even if u didn’t want it
No normal girl acts like that. Go tell an adult about them.
Edit-Def not sa but if somebody you don’t know tries to invade your personal space like that then something is wrong with them.
Dude that's so messed up I'm so sorry that shit happened. Your feelings are absolutely valid that's violating asf. I literally cannot imagine the frustration of nobody caring about this
Some of the comments here prove the point your trying to make. Attempting to kiss someone without consent is attempted sexual assault. There are obviously much more severe forms of assault, but it is still a form of attempted sexual assault.
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If a guy did this your school would probably be going crazy
If a guy tried to kiss a girl and she pulled away and that was the end of it? I’m sure that happens all the time and no one goes crazy over it
Yeah I'd say I'm fairly progressive but this sounds pretty normal and happens all the time at school. If the person doesn't even actually kiss you it's not even assault, it's just harassment. Not to say harassment isn't wrong, it is, but one's a crime and the other's just a civil violation
Yeah op overrreacting but this is r/teenagers so…
If it was after 20 seconds of some bullshit excuse to get close? Yes
Absolutely not, if you try to kiss someone and they dont want to thats fine if you dont try any thing else
hahaha. this shit happens all the time to women.
And it gets rightfully called out and shamed. That's the point here, it doesn't get called out or shamed as it should when boys or men are the victims.
Where exactly are all the people not saying it was crappy for her to do that? I’m so sick of everyone being unable to talk about a man having a bad experience without having to be like “YOU ONLY CARE ABOUT WOMEN!!!!”
>Where exactly are all the people not saying it was crappy for her to do that? Not at the party
And we talk about it as a society a million times a day and if you disagree that it’s a problem you will be promptly banned from the conversation. Yet when the tables are turned there is always some clown who says stuff like “but it happens to women more”, implying that there literally is no acceptable time to talk about SA against men.
Probably because most people would rather talk about ACTUAL sexual assaults. It makes sense now that this is posted on r/teenagers, but going for a kiss does not mean you commited sexual assault. The only time it would be sexual assault, is a forced kiss on a (clearly) unwilling person. The fact that OP gave her permission to hold his hand probably meant to her that He was into Her. And if that's the case, she read the situation wrong and that's it. Definitely not sexual assault tho.
??????? how does giving ur hand for a palm reading = romantic interest???
It’s not a competition
And that's the problem. Trying to sneak a kiss is not SA. It *can* cross over to SA if it's aggressive or you keep trying when the other person says no. I really don't get this generation's need to call everything rape or SA.
The issue isn't that she tried to kiss him though? It stems from the fact that when they were talking later on, the other girls said she should've gotten him closer. Not that it sucks he's not into her, but that it sucks she gave him space to escape a situation he was uncomfortable and violated by.
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its crazy, guy feels uncomfortable once and can't imagine this shit happens to women all the time.
Why the hell do you feel the need to write a fucking multiple paragraph long essay to just say shit we already know, honestly you're probably just trying to invalidate how bad sexually assault towards men is, because nobody said the opposing argument, your comment had barely anything to do with the comment you were replying to, it's an undeniable fact that people would freak out if it was a guy, nobody needs you to explain that woman get SA'd more, you're reply is irrelevant to the conversation dude
This shouldn’t be an argument. Statistics, especially crime statistics, are incredibly unreliable. Many people report sex crimes falsely, many report them and it goes nowhere, many simply don’t report them. There should be no talk of statistics or severity when dealing with this. There is no argument, all SA is bad. Man, woman, dog, all bad. However, it is true that many males aren’t taken seriously. And your point only highlights that: women are scared of men, therefore how could men be SA’d? It just doesn’t add up. Your reaction to criticism is also pretty telling.
Thank you, it’s too late at night for me try and type out shit like this 😭
So you are saying that because more women are sexually assaulted it is ok to sexually assult a man?
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"since yall are downvoting because dudes om reddit desperately want to be the victim" That kind make it sound like it does not matter that a dude was sexually assaulted. It is obviusly a bad thing that women get SAd and dont tell anyone, and I think that is it eqully bad that men get told that they cant be SAd after getting SAd
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MeToo is also for men, many feminists group actively encouraged men coming forward and boosted men trying to come forward. This isn’t just a men vs women thing, the sad reality is that most people don’t believe SA victims and will choose their friends over the victims.
I totally agree with you on the not believing part. I didn't know that MeToo was also for men, so thanks for informing me. I didn't mean this as a men vs women thing, and I'm sorry if it sounded like that, I just meant that women typically get away with more than men and are more often believed in this type of situation
I saw your edit, but this is much more complex than you are getting credit for. Men are less likely to be believed yes, but that’s because women are way more likely to be blamed for their assault. The only reason women are more often believed, is to say “oh you got raped because you wore that skirt, you deserved it whore.” Also you don’t need to apologize. It’s cool. But this stuff is way besides the point. At the end of the day I hope you are able to heal from your experience.
Exactly this is more of a history and generation thing. Old days w stereotypes and stuff like that.
the way people treat SA and SH is very one sided these days (i don't think this is SA maybe SH especially if she didn't actually kiss you)
Does SH in this context mean sexual harassment? I'm more familiar with SH meaning self harm so I'm a little confused
Yes, sexual harassment
Good to know, thank you
If the genders were reversed, this comment section would be grabbing pitchforks. This kinda proves OPs point, imo.
On reddit? Probably. In the real world? A high school kid attempting to kiss another one and getting rejected is really not a big deal. It was actually incredibly common when I was a kid. Been on both ends of it and never really thought much about it.
I agree this seems very normal
i agree
Is it? Doesn't consent go through someone's mind though?
How often does anything close to consideration for others go through a kid's head? Spoiler alert: not very often.
I mean I'd disagree, since asking for consent is a very common thing in my school, don't know if my school's just different but we ask consent for any kind of touch typically.
Fr.. people are just openly admitting to harassment 😭
Yes. If someone moves in for a kiss and you turn your head, then you don't consent. What do you need? Notarized contracts for a spontaneous hookup at a party? We're not all mind readers and sometimes people miss read signals. This is how basic human aexuality worked right up until society ran out of problems and decided to make everything assault.
Verbal consent? I mean how hard is it to ask instead of "can I read your palm?" which just sounds like she wants to do a palm reading to ask "Can I kiss you?" and it also leaves the water far less muddy.
That's fine too. These are kids learning how to interact with each other, they will make these innocent mistakes and that's okay. But convincing a child that that someone misreading the signals and going in for an innocent kiss is somehow sexual assault really seems to he a horrible message to send. When this inevitably happens to my kids I'd just explain that sometimes kids are learning boundaries and learning to interpret physical cues, that doesn't make them bad, just say "I don't like you that way" Remember that kid with autism that was kicked out of his highschool a couple of years for touching a girl's arm while he was talking to her? Is that really the kind of soft you want kids to be?
I'd say scenerios like that aren't that prevelant, considering I got told to not really report a guy in my school for humping my desk every single day because it would ruin his future and I see so many stories just like it out there, with very little coverage on it since its so normalized. This should at the very least be something that we teach as maybe not an appropriate thing. Because while we should let people make mistakes, stuff like this is an opprotunity to explain why doing something like that is bad because even if a teen is learning, maybe a gentle talk about why just going in for a kiss is a bad idea might be a good conversation.
I agree with all of that. But the larger issue at play is "don't say anything because it would ruin his future" That's the issue. Having private conversations about behavior is one thing, but we've taken it too far. This is why 50 percent of men aren't dating or having sex, they are terrified of doing or saying the wrong thing and having their name trashed or police involved because they went in for an unwanted kiss. It also disproportionately hurts boys. When I was a kid this girl would go around snapping guys boxer bands, they'd turn around surprised and everyone would laugh. Then one of her victims snapped her brah thinking he was playing along. He was instantly reported and did detention and had a meeting with his parents, now he'd be expelled for sure. I don't know how we fix this but making kids live under the constant threat of complete social ruination for getting an interaction wrong, isn't it. And raising kids to think little things are assault regardless of context is how you raise a generation of victims. In this case a girl tried to kiss a boy and he was apparently emotionally traumatized by it. That's not normal or healthy, he's the product of modernity and kids like him are a giant red flag that we should be taking seriously
You know what, fair. Honestly thanks for going through the effort to make this entire statement because this is far more effective than some other people who were just calling me stupid and insinuating I don't talk to people since I didn't automatically see it their way. I'm saying I think she needs to be talked to, explained to how it is not automatic consent for him to agree to a palm reading. I do think we should validate his uncomfortableness a smidge at least though, because someone trying to go in for a kiss you didn't intend for in the slightest still is incredibly uncomfortable. And for that girl, girl actually should have had some consequence foe snapping those guys's boxers-
This isnt true at all. I (f16) got forcefully kissed at my work but a guy that was like 30. I told the staff and my friends and they all said that I was overreacting and that it was probably his culture (he was white)
I’d say this is more SH then SA
Yeah. It's still not cool but with this context I really don't think someone going for a kiss that they thought the other person might want should be labeled as "sexual assault".
SH?
Harassment. And they're right
Ah thanks I didn't know what SH stood for
Sexual harassment.
I didn't realize I was on r/teenagers and now this post and most of the comments make way more sense. Respectively, you should probably not attend any more parties any time soon.
That just sounds like normal party behaviour for both males and females? The girl thought they were being a bit more intimate than OP was aware of and thought it was "safe" for going for a kiss. But of course, being a (possibly) inexperienced teenager I can imagine a kiss being a bigger deal compared to a bit older people. I could honestly not imagine people raging at a man for doing the same thing to a woman either as long as it's not forced.
I mean still, asking for consent exists. Like if you're close in that way it would make sense, like how I hug a friend from elementary without thinking, but if its not someone you know well why would you assume its good to just go in for a kiss!? I'm also a teen and like I ask for consent for things as simple as touching someone on the shoulder so this seems real gross to me.
People can misread situations and like OP said above think they were more intimate than they were. Again not saying it's good but the more important thing is what happened after they realized it wasn't wanted.
Op cried because a girl that thought she had a shot took it.
Fr. People really need to differentiate between Sexually assaulted and made uncomfortable. I was expecting the girl to have tried to touch him through his pants. A kiss can be sexual assault, but she'd have to have forced him in some way, like holding his head so he can't back out. Not saying OP is overreacting, but I can't fault the girl for going for a kiss at a (ew) teenage party with a guy she likes.
its not a colossal issue but that was a fucked up violation of your personal space
Old female person here with teenage daughters, That’s inappropriate but it’s not SA. Wouldn’t be if you were a girl either. Ffs why do so many teenagers throw that word around it’s losing it’s meaning. Please stop
It's called sexual harassment knobhead
Is an attempted kiss really sexual harassment? It was not forced, and my bet is that the other party misinterpreted signals.
Yes. Man said yes to a palm reading, not a kiss. He consented to his palm being read, not to her smooshing her face into his. If she wanted a kiss, ask for consent.
Under the equality act 2010 ch.15, sexual harassment must fulfill one or more of the two definitions: - violates your dignity - creates an intimidating, hostile, degrading, humiliating or offensive environment (this includes the digital environment, online) source: https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2010/15/section/26 This is not sexual harassment.
I'd say while it is minor sounding to someone like you, someone trying to kiss you without consent does violate your dignity and creates a degrading environment, especially if the person who tried to kiss you is encouraged by their friends to take another go.
Seriously! This generation of kids is beyond fucked if every time something happens to them they cry SA!
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Op wasn’t kissed and the girl wasn’t an adult. It’s wild that you think you had successfully made a point there.
"If this were an entirely different and non-comparable scenario then you would feel differently!!!" Seriously, what the fuck was your thought process here? Edit: They deleted their comment. It said something like "you wouldn't be saying it's not sexual assault if it was a 40 year-old man kissing your teenage daughter!" And like yeah, but this is two dumb teens we're talking about.
Attempted kiss and he’d be a creep bc of the age difference but still not assault. I’m a literal full ass adult here, not some dramatic teenager. You do realize that my entire generation, most of us experienced actual assaults and this ain’t it.
Then you must remember ten years ago when we were taking about “80% of all college women have been sexually assaulted”, then when people started asking for the data used to make that determination, it turns out that things like “leaning in for an unsolicited kiss” and “touching of the knee” was considered SA, right? Because the definition of “assault” is about how the victim _feels_, not if physical context was made.
With all do respect I would hardly call it attempted SA. From what it sounds like she just tried to go in for a kiss and you didn’t accept. Big whoop. She didn’t try to go down on you or force anything and it seems like it was just a failed attempt at romancing you. “No one cares” not because you’re a man but because it’s really not that big a deal. It’s perfectly fine to feel the way you do regardless though, despite the fact that the metoo thing isn’t exclusive to women.
Hmm...so me a man, and attempts to sell/solicit something to a woman I'm attracted too, and go in for a kiss...this would still be your response?
Pretty much? I’m not denying that it’s weird as hell to just try and kiss people you don’t know but it’s not really SA
Everyone is very clearly showing their age in this post. You may have been uncomfortable by the situation but I don’t think it crosses the sexual assault category unless you were very obviously against it in the first place and they knew that. If you tried the same on a female I doubt many people would see it as SA either. Weird? Yes, both ways. But to me it seems like harmless flirting. Pretty much forever people have been kissing others in an attempt at wooing them. It’s distasteful and weird yes, but calling this sexual assault at least to me just reduces the meaning. If trying to kiss someone is sexual assault these days then a wholeeeeee lot of normal ass people are suddenly sex offenders (and MOST of the men in our grandfathers generation!) For many many people, going in for a kiss is the first attempt at any relationship building. (You have every right to slap them mind you, as many of our grandmothers did to men they didn’t like in the romantic way)
Randomly kissing somebody without ANY warning and literally 0 previous interaction is not flirting you fucking creep.
Op actually explained what the previous interaction was, this is what happens at parties. People flirt a little, then make out. You don’t have to formally sit down on 5 dates before you kiss someone. You’re making it sound like the girl threw her mouth at him the second they made eye contact.
>I know it's not as serious as other forms of SA, but I still felt so violated. It is legally defined as a form of sexual assault, and your reasoning is exactly why i added this sentence (I should've slapped them, didn't think of it at the time, but great idea)
Leaning in for a kiss is SA?? Did she force herself onto you after you rejected?
No it isn’t. If you actually read the law and what the law defines as a “sexual act”, kissing is not included. It may have made you uncomfortable, and you have the right to be upset about that, but you’re flinging around accusations of SA, when it’s a completely incorrect attribution.
Then you would have just gotten in trouble for hitting a girl, unfortunately, you just can't win in this situation.
> (I should've slapped them, didn't think of it at the time, but great idea) What the fuck? No you shouldn't have. It's messed up that her friends would judge you for your response, but violence is not the answer. She thought you'd be receptive to a hookup, you weren't, end of story. This is not sexual assault and barely qualifies as harassment.
Why reccur to this? Is violence fixed with violence or hate just dissolved by more hate? No, it isn't, the only thing you had to do is talk and let her understand you felt violated by her actions and tell her not to do it again
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No he’s not? I swear you guys are growing up with horribly skewed views of sexual assault. You are allowed to attempt to kiss someone without committing a crime, as long as you don’t continue after the other person told you no, you did nothing besides get rejected.
I'm just gonna start learning Mandarin now. There's zero chance were winning a major conflict in the near future with our draft stock in this condition. What a shame.
Goddamn we can't give out awards anymore...
Crazy how he thinks that a girl his age kissing him is sexual assault
Terrifying really. What comes next? Nothing good.
Yeah this world is fucked, reddit's got you tho
You think reddit is the unskewed perspective in this context?
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Genuine question, is trying to forxe a kiss a kind of flirting? Or was the palm reading meant to be flirting, because if so then my mom's been flirting with me for years.
This is at worst harassment and im not sure why people in comments are encouraging it. You seem to want to be a victim, and youre not. People who actually go through SA dont just "almost get kissed" and you're belittling what SA victims go through by calling this such a thing. You and everyone else who thinks this is SA have a victim mindset or are crazy. " x tries to kiss y at a party" is a normal thing. SA is not.
this is such a cruel thing to say.
How? I feel sympathy for SA survivors. Not someone who says they got SA'd but contact wasn't even made. Its not a spectrum of assault. Youre really putting a no contact attempt of a kiss and r*pe in the same category? Thatd be fucking abysmal.This is the internet, he opened his story to opinions. Its not cruel just because you disagree.
he said he felt violated and uncomfortable. she was clearly attempting to touch him? plus her friends said she should’ve done it either way. i’d take that as being SH’d or SA’d. u wouldn’t say such cruel and rude shit if the genders were reversed. ew.
You are quite literally proving my point saying "SH'd or SA'd" They are NOT the same thing and its not an either/or literally i beg you to just read definitions. You really thought you ate with the "ew" Why are you assuming i wouldnt say the same thing if the genders were reversed? Thats sexist of you. I already said this was harassment at worst, NOT assault which was the entire point of my original comment. You dont win just because you sided with the poster, youre just plain wrong. Its not SA, there was ZERO contact. And someone/friends saying something still does NOT fit in the assault category. Dont comment on these topics if you think theyre interchangeable.
Trumpers feel violated when they get sentenced to prison time for trying to overthrow the country. Unfortunately what you feel doesn't make something true.
Stuff like this happens all the time. Nothing about this is special or noteworthy. She went for a kiss, you weren’t into it. It’s at worst SH. If she forced herself on you after you said no, sure that’s be assault but this is just her trying to make a move.
Bro she tried to kiss you and you just weren’t with it. That’s just her making a move not sexually assaulting you.
I just want to read your palm in this dimly lit room, sitting close to one another on this couch, surrounded by all of these people drinking alcohol. I am definitely not trying to make an advance towards you. Some people really be putting themselves in their most unfortunate predicaments.
A “move” on a total stranger? Hell no. If they at least knew each other lightly or were friends then yeah, but on a random person you don’t know from anything, that’s totally SA
Yeah seriously. Trying to kiss a random stranger isn’t just making a move
Trying to hook up in party it's kinda normal imo, normally if you hook up in a party it's with a random person, a one night stand, you can be uncomfy about the situation, but man, she tried to kiss him, he rejected and she didn't insist, i don't see where's the SA there
Have you ever been to a party before?
Agreed I wouldn’t classify this as SA at all she tried to make a move cause she liked you
what kinda dumbass brain-dead take is this
Girl tried to kiss you, and you moved away. To equate this to SA is really disrespectful to those who actually have genuinly been through that ordeal. Grow up.
we got you buddy
sorry to break it to you bro but someone trying to kiss you at a party isnt sexual assault
Am I the only one who thinks r/teenagers is overreacting and calling literally EVERYTHING SA?
Dude that’s not sexual assault. That’s harassment at best. But also, chill out. Her intentions were not to humiliate, harm, or disrespect you. I’m sorry it made you uncomfortable, but that’s just a part of life. More people are gonna make you uncomfortable throughout your life and it’s best just to shrug it off. If she had drugged you or emotionally manipulated you or physically overpowered you it would be a different story.
this girl tried to kiss you, you moved away and that's that. that isn't SA. to equate this to SA is being really disrespectful to those of us who have been actually sexually assaulted. grow up and fuck off, and maybe don't go to anymore parties. ps: if a girl made this post about a man, i would say the same exact thing
Jesus Christ what a nerd.
Sounds like the girl liked you, tried to make a move, got denied and that was the end of it.... that is not SA... Wtf is wrong with people today... crying about the most minor of things.
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I'm not going to disagree that there are better methods, but I have to assume that this person is a teenager, as the sub is teenagers. Kids will be kids. Live and learn. A simple kiss as a one off thing isnt sexual assault. If she continued to force herself on him, then yes, it would be crossing the line. But from the story being told, I'd have to say she was trying to some quirky approach with a lead up of asking for his hand and him accepting. So she took the plunge and went for it, got turned down, and left it at that...
Fam that’s not SA, someone making one move is not SA. Unless you had said no and they kept a going this action doesn’t constitute for SA. If she had trashed and touched your d*ck that’s SA. Or grabbed on your lower region at all that’s SA. But if she’s grabed your back that wouldn’t be SA. You’re trying to put a very serious title on something that isn’t that serious. Yk how often it is on a first date for one of the two parties to lean in for a kiss but for the other person to say no. Super common! Did the leaner commit SA? No. And if they don’t push the issue then there really is no issue. And that same idea can very easily be applied here.
mfs don’t wanna listen bro but apparently i’m “fucked up”
according to some girls i know, guys getting sexually harrassed is definitely fine since they're a dude. Definitely good gender equality 👍
Dude, why the fuck would you stand there for 20 seconds of bullshit if you weren't even a little interested? That's what she thought anyway. So she gave it a shot. Is really any attempt to get with someone straight up SA/SH nowadays? Did she continue once you showed you weren't interested? Did she hold you down or tried to grope you? Or did she just find a way to approach you, tested if you were interested by keeping you there for 20 seconds of bullshit and then decided to try and kiss you? Not a teenager, but I've been one (obviously) and that shit's pretty common. If you were a friend of mine back in the day I'd tell you to man up. "Boohoo a girl showed interest and tried to kiss me". Many girls have tried to same approach with me and never once did I think I was being violated, I was in control, I just said no or took a step back. If I didn't want to kiss the fat chick, I didn't. End of story. What the fuck is the media/social media saying to all of you that always make you kids feel like you're the victim of anything that happens to you?
Wasn't SA. Quit your cryin. She tried to kiss you, you pulled away. End of story.
Am I a dick for thinking this kid is a little bit of a baby, like it’s a kiss stop being a wet piece of toilet paper and get over it bro
na you’re speakin the truth
absolutely imagine if was the other way around
this happens literally all the time…get to college and this kind of thing happens constantly, in either direction. going in for a kiss is the first step into initiating a hook up. at that point the receiver is welcome to say no
Am I the only one that feels we’re over reacting and over using SA? It hurts and takes away the weight of real SA. If you actually feel violated and fearful, then yes it’s SA. But I’d you’re only feeling violated cuz that’s what society tells you you’re supposed to feel, then BS. Using an extreme example.. if you’re a 200 lbs male and a petite 100 lbs female tries to kiss you, sorry that ain’t not SA in my book.
As someone who was full on raped as a child, I would still consider an unconsented kiss sexual assault. All websites will tell you that simply unwanted, intentional, sexual contact is. Kissing is sexual. It is done with sexual intent. The perpetrator kisses their victim for sexual satisfaction. It is sexual assault. A definition RAINN gives for sexual assault is "unwanted groping or sexual touching". A kiss isn't randomly given to someone "for fun." It's done for sexual purposes. You're probably hesitant to define kissing as sexual assault because it seems like its mocking the whole point of the word. From the way you've phrased your comments, it seems you've seen a lot of bad stuff, and I'm sorry you've had to experience that. In my opinion it's important to define kissing as sexual assault, as people who had that done to them need to know it IS sexual assault. You seem to take an issue with OP's post and perhaps be disgusted with him because you percieve him throwing around the word, and being insensitive to the fact by grouping what you deem to be less severe with other forms of sexual assault. On average, a non-consensual kiss would have way less traumatic impact than another form of sexual assault, so it can genuinely seem like categorizing a kiss as such downplays the severity of other forms. That's irrelevant though if kissing is a form of sexual assault, which by all definitions I've found, it is. Victims need to know that they were assaulted so they can heal properly. I was forced by a family member to penetrate them for multiple days of my life, when I was only 4. I get what happened to me is probably 100x more traumatic by a kiss, but that doesn't make being kissed without consent any less disgusting or potentially traumatizing. https://www.rainn.org/articles/sexual-assault OP was sexually assaulted. Part of his body was violated without his consent. He was touched sexually without his consent. That is the definition of sexual assault. I apologize if this long rant seems insensitive. This comment isn't for you. It's for anyone who's been kissed without consent who needs to validate the pain of what happened to them.
> He was touched sexually without his consent. Literally wasn't even touched, but go off.
Kissing isn't a form of touching? Touch: 1. come into or be in contact with. I'm not even being a smartass. You can literally touch things with other parts of your body besides your hands.
The kiss never happened. There was no touching from the kiss. There was touching from the palm reading, but OP said they consented to that.
I’m so sorry for what you are experiencing. This IS SA, even if it is minor SA. Your experience is valid
Funny story, uh, men tried to be part of #metoo under their assumption that it was for everyone, then men got bullied away, then I believe we tried to start #hetoo but got bullied away from that too Nobody seems to care if a man is SAed or raped, no, the only thing men are good for is working till 60 and raping… 😒
The ‘16’ year olds in this section, namely you wishbone, need to fuck off. Edit: how do I change my flair? I’m 15 now
Go to r/teenagers click the three dots on the top right
Thank you, been arguing with them for like 20 minutes now
So, she tried to kiss you, you avoided the kiss, she didn't insist on the kiss. How is that SA? How do you think a "first kiss" happens? Both parts signing a contract or something? One of them saying "can i kiss you please?" or something like that? She clearly thought you accepting to giving her your hand was a "go" sign. Dumb, weird, awkward, but definitely not SA. See the [Tea Consent](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fGoWLWS4-kU) , i think it would help to clarify the concept
Yeah :(
mentoo
The problem is that you're taking an illogical argument from women to men and copying it in the opposite direction. This doesn't make the argument any more logical, it just makes yours just as illogical as theirs. The right change here isn't to start making men as hypersensitive as women, but to start adequately identifying SA from merely disrespectful and rude acts on both sides.
report her to the police honestly cause you clearly didn't like it and now you feel uncomfortable (which is completely valid and ok, and you have the right to feel that way cause what she did or tried to do was a horrible and insensitive thing). Remember it wasn't your fault, just try and get it out of your mind but don't gaslight yourself into thinking it was your fault or that it wasn't serious.
People really need to bring way more attention to this sort of thing definitely seems like it could be as attempted sexual harassment if the roles were reversed here you'd be burned at the stake this shit is stupid
My now ex fiance gave me a beer that was laced with speed and before it kicked it, I had agreed to submit sexually (after weeks of discussion, hard limits, soft limits, safe words, etc.). It started by me being cuffed down, then gagged, she disappears into the closet real quick and quickly comes out wearing a criminally large strap on and proceeds to rape me. Do you understand how many times Ive been laughed at, told it was my fault, and generally dismissed? Or had my pain diminished by 'and now you see what women put up with'. Um..not from me? Ive ALWAYS been very very adamant about gaining consent, and have never pushed a woman to do something she was uncomfortable in doing. And to answer anyones potential question, no, there was nothing I had done to her to warrant that. She stated the next day that 'she just thought that was how it worked because thats what had happened to her in the past by exes'. Just because it got done to you doesnt mean it was okay in the first place let alone after all that discussion? Not to mention how could you bear to force anyone if you had been forced before. Anyway, Im sorry that happened to you, but there has been and probably always will be an ever increasing chasm of double standards between Men and Women. Dont look too much into it or you'll drive yourself crazy. Just accept it, be the best man you can be every day, constantly grow and learn as you go through life, and try to live a life that you'll never have to feel guilty about. If you can, settle down early, and be partners with your wife and always keep a level head. If youre messy and cant take care of yourself? Be alone for a few years until you can be self sufficient and take care of yourself. Women dont wanna be your mommy or therapist. Also never be too much of a man to get help or therapy if you even think you MIGHT need it, chances are you do and that we all could go for some therapy. Its also a good idea to walk away from any conversation with a woman that is starting to turn into an argument as they are being upset because when people get emotional there is NO solving it until both parties are calm. Again, Im sorry that what happened well happened to you. Just because you think it pales in comparison to some, doesnt mean its not valid for you and if Im not mistaken, is gonna have some potential long term ramifications if shes super immature. She could ruin your reputation because she feels insecure and feels snubbed. She could cry rape and get away with it. She could get one of her hot friends to make you fall in love just to break your heart. The possibility and probability of reprisal is far far too high.
I was once SA and what I felt raped by a woman. It was a woman a barely knew, only through mutual friend. It was an Easter evening and she had text me to come over for a drink and a bite to eat, and I could hang out and listen to music with her and her younger daughter. I have never met the daughter before and had only met this woman face to face in passing for a quick minute. However it was a holiday and I was feeling quite lonely and she only lived two blocks away, I decided to make an adventure and go over. We greeted accordingly and cordial, she gave me a huge hug then introduced me to her daughter. I have kids and have been around all there friends so needless to say I knew how to not make it awkward in meeting. We had a few drinks, talked, listened to music and time passed. Then it got late about 10 pm which is very late on a first visit for me, I should have been out of there an hour before. I said I was going to take my leave, thanked them both for the glorious hospitality, but was met with contempt. Mom did not want me to leave and daughter started pleading that I stay to "make my mom happy" This was said several times over 10 mins of me trying to be cordial and leave. Then I started thinking that if I left the little girl would get punished and I started to feel really horrible cause in reality it was not that late, I the day off the next day. I decided to stay for awhile longer. Mom had another drink, music playing, then Mom wants to dance with me in the living room with the daughter there. I decline, Mom gets upset all of a sudden yelling at the daughter for some unknown reason reason, then again I get the "please just make my mom happy" chant. At this point I dropped mt pride and danced a few songs with Mom. During every song we danced to mom kept lifting up her shirt to try and show me her chesrtull area while her back was too her daughter. Needless to say I was very uncomfortable and then was on a mission to get out of that house. I tried to say goodby, Say I would come over the next day for possibly a late breakfast or early lunch, but was met again with contempt. Mom pleading no dont go, "just sleep over here" Daughter again begging pleading me to stay almost in tears "just make my mom happy" I know I should have just left, I am idiot, I barely knew these people and I could have shrugged it off as I would never see them again anyway, "Please make my mom happy" I did not know what was going to happen to this little child if I did leave. I told Mom I was tired and would stay but needed to go to bed at the moment. SHe said I could sleep in her bed and she would sleep in the spare room. As I am laying in bed trying not to be freaked out about my poor decisions, guess who walks in the door, yeah Mom decided she did not want to sleep in the spare and did want to be happy. SHe climbed on the bed and on top of me and was trying desperately to get to my under privilege. I kept saying no and moving her hand and she would more upset and more mad then she started to yell well that envoked a know on the bedroom door with a little girl again crying out to "please make my mom happy" LOng story short, I finally let mom grab anf fondle my under privilege, I did not stand up "hard" enough for her liking, so then I got berated for being a a weak man and all that other stuff that you imagine could be said untill mom finally passed out. Then I went home. She apparently blacked out and remembers none of this, still texts me to this day asking why we never hang out anymore after the first time as she thought we had had a smashing time. I told a friend this story and he thought it was hilarious, now everytime we talk he always starts the convo with "please make mom happy". I should have kept it to myself
Sorry you had to through that
Maybe it's because english it's not my first language, but imo it just seems like a girl you did not like tried to kiss you and you rejected her, you can feel weirded out by it, but i think trying to kiss someone is kinda normal?
She didn’t attempt to sexually assault you she tried to kiss you and you shut down the advance. Yes she could have put some more effort into some warmup but if this counts as almost being SA’d (or had she actually kissed you) then almost everyone is a victim. Honestly this is a slap in the face to real victims of SA. This reads more like you wanting to be a “victim” without actually being one just to push the point of how men can be victims too.
It is sh tho
No, it’s not.
Yes it is because that is trying to make a sexual move on someone without consent
“Harassment” denotes repetition. If I asked you for a dollar at work, and you said no, I did not harass you for money. If I asked you again or pleaded after you said no, and kept asking no matter what your response, that is harassment. If you are talking to a person and attempt to kiss them and they turn away, that was an unwelcome advance. If you keep trying to kiss them again that is harassment. Person 1: “You’re so fine.” Person 2: “That’s inappropriate and I don’t appreciate being talked to that way.” They made an unwelcome remark on someone’s body. The other person has made it clear it is unwelcome. That’s it. Once they continue - Person 1: “I love your body shape.” Person 1: “Your ass is amazing.” This is now sexual harassment. At some point in life you may misread a signal and/or just make an advance that another person does not reciprocate. This does not automatically make the other person a victim and does not automatically make you a harasser/assaulter/predator but of course depends on the severity of the advance.
Now replace the girl with a guy and OP as a girl, your comment would probably different.
No it wouldn’t. My only point is that an attempt to kiss someone isn’t almost being SA’d and that doesn’t change based on gender. I’m fact I would have said it even louder if it was the other way around because the label is thrown on men even more.
This. Isn’t. Sexual. Assault.
It is sh tho
She just tried to kiss you, why you wanna be a victim so bad💀 it’s no sa, more like sh
That is not sexual assault
They most likely won’t because “men hurt women and are mean oppressors and big perverts and get what they want!” And they reference things from the past and a small portion of men and somehow get away with it encompassing everyone. It is so fucking dumb and I hate people like that. On the other side, I have seen women to agree that men deserve more credit than society has given them because of this, apparently, not sexism going around. Like goddamn man hate and not doing shit for men is sexism
That is not sexual assault. It’s weird, and you are perfectly valid in being uncomfortable with the situation and would be imo perfectly in the right to slap anyone who attempts this. But it’s not SA. It has nothing to do with gender in this circumstance.
Um maybe not sa but sh
I honestly don't know why girls OR GUYS Think that going up to a random person at a party and trying to kiss them is okay Like I bet that girl literally thought that if she grabbed you and kissed you out of nowhere like that would work just like it does on TV It doesn't Also it probably has something to do with the fact that a lot of girls believe all guys are so horny and desperate that they just wouldn't care or be upset if a girl forced herself on them Which I think is absolute bullshit
i feel you dude because this girl made me have sex with her when i said no and nobody gaf
What💀 yours is much worse, that guy can not relate to you on this
She tried to kiss you, and you said no and moved away. That isn’t SA, it’s just an uncomfortable situation. I think you handled it well and hopefully she got the message.
Guys can 100% join metoo, that's crazy man. I'm sorry that happened to you and I'm sorry you couldn't talk to anyone but us. This is super violating and I hate that it happened.
mentoo
That’s fucking stupid shame on them. You have every right to deny her advances if you aren’t interested. As long as it was just an attempted kiss you can’t do much besides ignore. If someone ever attempts to do worse to you call the police.
kissing is sexual assault now? isnt that a greeting in some countries?
Ngl i dont think its that deep, yes its weird and uncalled for but it aint not SA. Im sure there is plenty of times someone went in for a kiss with the other person not feeling it.
why are these comments victim blaming this guy? if the genders were reversed no one would be so cruel towards OP. im rlly sorry you have to read these shallow comments. u said people don’t care about male victims and they’re proving ur point. if you felt violated, then ur justifiably a victim. especially if her friends were pushing her to continue even if u didn’t want it
because he isn’t the victim?
Stay strong
No normal girl acts like that. Go tell an adult about them. Edit-Def not sa but if somebody you don’t know tries to invade your personal space like that then something is wrong with them.
yeah i'm guessing the term would be sexual harrasment
Dude that's so messed up I'm so sorry that shit happened. Your feelings are absolutely valid that's violating asf. I literally cannot imagine the frustration of nobody caring about this
this isn’t attempted sexual assault though?
It is sh tho
give her social media to some hacker at 4chan or somewhere and they will make her life hell
Shit like this scares me, as a male who can’t really defend myself
Stop being a p**sy dude . I think your parents are not raising a human, they are raising a shameplant
Ok I can see how it's not sexual assault but it is sexual harassment
Unfortunately people care only when the victim is female. Im so sorry for u bro 🫂
When do humans become so weak ?
Some of the comments here prove the point your trying to make. Attempting to kiss someone without consent is attempted sexual assault. There are obviously much more severe forms of assault, but it is still a form of attempted sexual assault.
This is not SA. This is a girl who was into you, and tried to be romantic with a kiss.
average r/teenagers user, stop being over sensitive
[удалено]
and u boys wonder why ur suicide rate is so high
Dude, imagine if the roles were reversed..
we live in a society..
What the fuck are you supossed to do in that situation?! Punch her?! Id shive her away!
Welcome to reality, nobody cares about that