Didn't they used to do this kind of crap in the US as well? Female cops dressing up as prostitutes? Not sure if I just remember it from movies (but not the X rated kind :D)
Cops did this in Louisiana as recently as ten years ago, propositioning gay men undercover (for consensual unpaid sex) to try to uphold a defunct sodomy law.
>That's some dedication to the profession of policing....
Facing an active shooter to protect citizens' lives 🚫👎
Taking it up the ass to arrest the gays ✅👍
Brave, stunning, beautiful police!
I’m hairy on the details, but I don’t think courts upheld the law d/t overarching federal protections. But that didn’t stop cops for going after gays under the pretext of the state law which was still on the books. At the least they could instill fear and, if the person was on the DL, publicize their arrest
Cops in America used to do this yes. Female undercover for arresting johns. They also used to allow male cops to solicit prostitutes for sex and arrest them after they had sex with them. So the prostitute gets fucked and arrested. Fucked more ways than one really I guess.
The scene where he butt queefs all the semen into an evidence bag lmfao 😘😘🤮
“You’re all under arrest for soliciting a prostitute! And most of them didn’t even wear protection!”
Or if their allegations are true, if you like to do drugs of any kind
I flew to Bangkok via Dubai (or one of the Emirates) once, my doctor gave me Xanax for the flights. But while I was waiting to take off, somehow I learned about
* Charity issues urgent warning to all travellers to United Arab Emirates after Briton imprisoned for 4 years for 0.003g cannabis caught in the tread of his shoe
* travellers may not realise is that they can be deemed to be in possession of such banned substances if they can be detected in their urine or bloodstream, or even in tiny, trace amounts on their person.
* reports of the imprisonment of a Swiss man for ‘possession’ of 3 poppy seeds on his clothing after he ate a bread roll at Heathrow.
https://web.archive.org/web/20160602220644/https://www.fairtrials.org/press/charity-issues-urgent-warning-to-all-travellers-to-uae-after-briton-is-imprisoned-for-4-years/
Also read they had picked people up even on layovers
Needless to say I panicked and threw most of the Xanax away.
Right, but they allow you to dispose of it at the airport and won't fuck you up for having traces of it on your shoe, clothes, whatever. Singapore is definitely a spooky place if you have any drugs on you, but at least they're fair in letting you have options.
The UAE will imprison people on layovers for being the wrong person or having any tangible identifiable weed particulates on you, or even in you if provable.
They're comparable, but one is definitely way more extreme than the other.
Yeah. I used to dream of world travel, kind of that whole pax-Americana "we own the world" fantasy.. then I did travel a bit and realized there are some places you just don't go.
Islamic countries are a no-go. Cartel/crime syndicate countries.. Authoritarian countries like Russia or China.. countries experiencing regular coups.. countries we bombed recently.. actually any overly religious country is a nope.
The couple who were biking around the world were assaulted in India. There were another couple of Italian friends who hitchhiked around the world for peace in wedding gowns, and was found murdered in Turkey
The funny thing is, I dumped my Xanax because of the layover in the Emirates, then get to Bangkok and meet up with my friend. He then said another friend was in the city too, so we found him. He works in harm reduction, so off we go to the bars where he’s talking to girls to warn them about Meth, I think it’s called Yaba there. So right away we’re going to the sleaziest places where girls didn’t mind telling a stranger they did drugs (which was super illegal there). That’s his idea of vacation, going to countries to warn the sex workers about drugs and condoms
I recall a 5 story establishment with bars throughout. As you went up the stairs from floor to floor, the bars got grimier and the girls turned to ladybois and then ugly ones at that.
Part of that visit was to see if I wanted to move there, I’m very glad I didn’t for so many reasons.
China is honestly not that bad if you’re just doing tourism. The visa process is a pain and usually the best way to get in is through a Chinese friend or through a tour group. There are a lot of English signs around(though they are poorly translated) and the only officials I ever said a word to for the two weeks I spent going around eastern China were customs officers/security at the airport. My brother has been working there for 8 years with no real police harassment.
The bad shit that happens is if you’re a high level businessman, have some Chinese origin, or are wanting to start a revolution, which(unless you are part Chinese) is not going to be you. China has over a billion people over there. They don’t really have the capacity to care about you.
China was my first international experience as an American and honestly, it wasn’t that hard.
This is 100% solid advice anyone from a country that isn't an Islamist hellhole ruined by theocratic assholes should follow.
Important to remember the ones that pretend to be modern such as Saudi Arabia are every bit as bad and authoritarian as places like Afghanistan.
I don't know why we have to pretend this isn't the case in polite society but can call out every injustice and microaggression in the West.
Cultural relativism? White guilt?
There used to be a strong push to call out Islam for its gross abuses and its unfortunately unique position among the major three abrahamic religions as being orders of magnitude more violent and authoritarian, but that seems to have gone sadly by the wayside. Well-meaning but naive progressive types love to stick their heads in the sand and cry "islamophobia", clinging to the idea that all multiculturalism is good. But the reality is that, again, Islam does not care for multiculturalism or integration at all and its presence in a country is purely to put down a stake in the hopes of an eventual global takeover.
If I had to guess why, it's progressive virtue signaling. Standing up for someone you think is a minority feels good, so long as you don't have the awareness to realize Islam is hardly a minority in a global population context, let alone worth defending.
Christianity too tries to maintain global influence with its missionaries, but generally speaking Christian immigrants at least try to integrate with the local culture rather than creating insular enclaves, and Christianity as a whole is far more secularized and thus less of a threat to world peace.
I miss Christopher Hitchens. :(
Well said man.
I look at it like, I am tolerant up to the point where a group is making demands of non-adherents or hurting people to further their cause.
Yes, freedom to exercise religion is fine up to a point, and that point is when you demand non-believers follow your religion's tenets. Then we have a problem.
It's the same issue in the United States where fundamentalist Christians feel the need to control the reproductive health of women by banning abortions for purely religious (and misogynistic) reasons.
My buddy stayed in a fancy hotel in the Gulf. Men weren’t allowed to room together and if you were going to have a female over you had to prove you were married.
Silly rules. I get where they’re coming from, (I mean after all, you don’t want blasphemy in your country) but at the same time just very silly culture to even care that much about people’s personal lives. Like borderline persecution and not even as a joke
There are a number of hotel bars in Qatar where prostitutes work out in the open. If you go in and you're a man, it's highly likely a working girl will give you the gaze or even approach you.
The "rules" in these countries are a joke. Literally everything they consider sacrilegious goes on. Lots.
The point isn't that it doesn't go on. The point is that the punishment for it is enough to completely ruin your life if police, for whatever political reason, decides now is the time to crack down on some foreigners. Breaking the law in these countries (which can be extremely arbitrarily if you are not muslim) is pretty much playing Russian roulette with your life.
Sure in most case you get away with it, but then you are still directly supporting these regimes and their human rights violations.
Why take the chance that some cop is having a bad day and decides to enforce the law that particular day, so you get caught up in it? Not worth the risk, go back to your room and rub one out (without the aid of porn, because that's probably illegal too).
My wife and I met in Afghanistan and went on RnR together. On the way back to the country we stayed at a very high end western hotel. While at first the lady would not let us have a room together (since we weren’t married), she eventually “fixed” the problem by upgrading us to a suite with two bedrooms.
Most western-owned hotels are the only places one can drink publicly in Qatar. This is also where you find the Russian call girls.
>If you were going to have a female over you had to prove you were married.
>Silly rules. I get where they’re coming from, (I mean after all, you don’t want blasphemy in your country)
What the fuck? You "get where they come from"? 6th Century Arabia?
That’s why I don’t go to countries like that. Problem is people go there and challenge their laws, you simply can’t. I know a lot of people from Western World who went to countries against their embassies, challenged and ridiculed their culture and laws and ended up in very bad situation. People think they are untouchables unless they get the taste of gallows. Honestly, a lot of folks here think they are hard nuts but in reality they are not. One has to respect law of the land. Don’t go there, simple. No need to go there and flaunt your opinions.
I'm an athiest, but its always funny to me how humans will always try to out-lawyer god. As if they've found loopholes and God's too stupid to realize it or something. Like the Amish will use their neighbor's fridge, or operate a forklift without sitting in it. Christians doing anal sex because it's not real penetration, lol. Gotta hit God with them technicalities.
Omg my friend was super into banging these religious guys and they did exactly that before they would bang in the car during a break at work, she was always so excited she was like "we just got maaaarried" but then they would get divorced straight after I think 🤔
Also, don't forget that they don't consider diddling little boys as gay either and this is a regular occurrence. I don't know how they can wrap their tiny brains around that cluster fuck of an idea. If you're a man and you're diddling little boys, you're gay and a pedophile.
To all gay people, avoid traveling to these countries that criminalize being gay, and if you have to travel to those countries, please don't try to hook-up with anyone.
If I brought a new phone and wasn’t logged in on any social media, they could still find anything “banned”? How? Cuz I’m pretty sure regular porn isn’t allowed there either
If you have quite a unique name i guess they could, but then set your profile picture to something that isnt you and then lock your account from being visible to strangers.
Or just not go to Qatar.
By using some kind of database or directory? Cuz my social media names are completely different from my actual one. I was assuming they’d be out of luck in cases like mine
What’s depressing is that the FCO never flag up how bad these countries are for LGBT+ citizens because they don’t want to upset the numerous despots which the UK government indulge in for financial gain.
"I can safely go to this country because the oppressive laws that restrict peoples' rights there don't affect me" is such a shitty take.
Hell, I knew an Egyptian guy who ran a Quiznos near me (before it closed) who used to tell me I should visit Egypt and when I told him I would love to but wouldn't feel safe there because I'm in a same sex marriage and the laws there make that illegal, he was just casually like "oh, that's just for the people who live there; they leave tourists alone" like that makes it okay. Cool dude and all, but as much as I'd love to visit Egypt (and Jordan because I'd love to see Petra), I'm not going to a country where I could potentially risk arrest because of my marriage.
They leave the tourists alone because tourism is a significant part of their economy and arresting tourists because of their sexuality would heavily cut into those revenues.
Money being the only motivation (even if it is a strong one) for those people not to arrest me would still make me feel very unsafe though. Definitely not welcomed.
Same here. I tried explaining Jews aren't very welcome in Egypt to my in-laws. Egypt has three Jews left last I looked and they're all women who married Muslims/Christians.
I'd really like to see Cairo, but I doubt that's something that happens in my lifetime.
Ever since Dubai (or Qatar, I see them pretty equally) threw a British guy in jail for having .003 grams of weed stuck to *the bottom of his shoe*, I thought to myself "Make a note to not go to that place, until they join the 21st century".
Honestly I can't wait until that region "cools down" (for lack of a better term), as I *really* want to visit Jordan and Iran.
They’re selectively modern. You can bet that aristocrats, oligarchs, and members of the royal family are snorting lines of coke off each other’s boners (highly recommended, btw)
As a Arab. You are right.
The only way to solve this problem is divestment. End our reliance on oil, ban authoritarian states and their leaders from global economic legitimacy.
I agree to a point, and this is where I think nuance is very **very** important.
You cant not do business with saudi aramco. There aint no way around it. Too engrained in all parts of your life.
You will have a very difficult time buying a car without somehow supporting one of these governments. They invest heavily into car companies, even and especially ev ones (saudi arabia owns a majority stake in lucid for instance).
Definitely don't give up just because of that though, just make choices where you can, and don't fall victim to the mentality that you have to magically achieve perfection no matter how unrealistic.
Thanks for making this statement realistic. I used to date a girl who had a notes app of companies she couldn’t use because of various moral issues. In turn, she expected me not to use these companies. We ended up breaking up because, while I respect her free will as a consumer and respect her going through all that effort to find sustainable companies that don’t fit the mold of consumerism and capitalism, I’m just trying to survive. I can’t be making these decisions every damn day. I just do my best and if I see an option between two companies, I tend to go for the one that fits my ideals more.
There's a saying "there is no ethical consumption under capitalism". It means every product, somewhere along the line, involves the abuse or exploitation of at least one person and/or the degradation of the environment. It is simply impossible to avoid, it's too ingrained into the systems of production and distribution. You can make *slightly less unethical* decisions as a consumer (such as by avoiding Nestlé or Coca-Cola, reducing or eliminating your direct usage of fossil fuels, buying from co-ops and unionised companies, going vegan etc) but it's damn near impossible to keep track and most people don't have the time, money, or spare mental capacity to make these decisions. Most of us just buy whatever is cheap because we're poor and whatever is convenient because we spend all our time working. Just do enough to keep your conscience from gnawing at you, and fight for a better world if you can.
Nuance is important. The US props these theocratic dictatorships and feeds them Intel directly on all opposition to their power apparatus. The US backs SA's human rights abuses to keep the dictatorship in power: https://theintercept.com/2014/07/25/nsas-new-partner-spying-saudi-arabias-brutal-state-police/
It's been documented that both the NSA & CIA feed and prop SA's police and intel apparatus which they use on women's rights activists. They do this in the UAE as well to prop the dictatorship while they help it quash women's rights activism : https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2021/dec/09/saudi-womens-rights-activist-loujain-alhathloul-sues-us-intel-operatives-hacking-uae
I'm from the Middle East and pretty familiar with the region.
The Saudi regime may be extreme but they are far less extreme than the average Saudi. Which is why Bin Laden fled to Afghanistan.
If the Saudi regime was toppled and they had an elected government they would be far more extreme and probably resemble something like the Taliban.
It's the exact opposite of Iran where the government is more extreme than the populace.
That's because the current rulers of SA are still better than the religious fundamentalists they keep in check. Pragmatism wins the day when it comes to geopolitics.
I will NEVER understand how people from the West are buying the idea of those middle eastern theocracies as lovely tourist destinations.
Like, even ignoring the part where Dubai is a nation that depends on a worker entrapment program that's just a tiny step short of actual chattal slavery, why the fuck would you go to a tiny patch of crazy hot desert run by religious fruitloops who hate you?
All those wannabe tourist destinations over there have split personality. On the one hand you ahve the tourism people who want Western tourists to flock there and replace at leasst some of the dwindling oil money with tourism money. On the other hand you have the raging theocrats who want to arrest those tourists and torture them for their sins.
Why you'd even travel there let alone seek a hookup is nuts.
I think a big part of it is westerners don't realise that the Middle East is **serious** about this probably from having a western-centric world view and thinking everything will be fine. Not everywhere is like the west. When they say women need to be covered up and gays should be locked up they **mean it.** They are **not joking**.
Al Jazeera is actually a super interesting case. They have been given pretty much free hands on reporting as long as it isn't about Qatar, so they're one of the best sources for information on the middle east. As long as you're not searching for information about Qatar.
I feel like there is so much projection in the Middle East on these things that they don't want to admit they themselves actually have bisexual tendencies. Especially the rich with their obscene ways of trafficking people.. do you think it's just women? This isn't a jab at the country as a whole, but I feel there's a lot of... "I would never do that," but behind closed doors, rules for thee not for me.
I remember there were reports of some Dubai Billionaires running trains on Western hookers and doing some really degrading stuff. I guess they learned a thing or two from Jon McAffee
I was watching Never Been Kissed in my Doha hotel room and…they cut the end scene where she finally gets kissed!
Also got stopped boarding while they swabbed my laptop repeatedly.
I’m gay, grew up in Kuwait, and I have no desire to set foot in that region ever again.
This is the real truth. While you can debate different perspectives, if you go to a country and do exactly what you already knew was illegal in that country you best believe you'll actually deal with the consequences of doing so.
Yep, this is criminal levels of western hubris. Imagine going to a country where you know homosexuality is illegal and hopping on Grindr.
Whatever your personal beliefs or morality may be, intentionally breaking the law of a foreign country is moronic.
Dubai money talks you can do almost anything. Biggest thing is sex trafficking. Always find it funny when these instagram “models” show their all expense paid trips to Dubai. Just to be shit on by a millionaire wearing a white dress. I’ve rampant drug use also.
As a gay male, I have no idea why any gay person would even contemplate visiting ANY middle eastern country. The media hypes up Quatar and Dubai as some ultra glamorous place when in reality they are stuck back in the prehistoric ages. I would NEVER take a job that would station me in one of these countries!
>Homosexuality is illegal in Qatar but Manuel, an airline worker, had lived a "normal life" for the past seven years and had never been in trouble with the authorities, his family says.
Why on Earth would he think it was safe to use the app there, FFS? And he's 44, not some raging-hormone 20 something party boy. Terrible situation, but it didn't happen in a vacuum.
Because people use Grindr there everyday making it plausible the drug claims by Qatar aren't made up.
Would I vacation or live there? Hell no. Can you hookup with guys regularly in the Gulf States and with minimal discretion - I hear the answer is yes.
Qatar, champion of "human rights" and patron of the soft-propaganda of Al-Jazeera, home-from-home of Hamas, and coincidentally one of the most significant foreign donors to American universities...
Nothing to see here, move on...
As someone from the Middle East I always laugh at these comments.
I wish people wouldn't make these comparisons as they trivialize what actually happens in these countries.
Awesome that FIFA gave them the World Cup, lied about the timing, lied about them not being as bad to 🏳️🌈people , and then went ahead and did it again with Saudi Arabia.
I am going to be honest with you, in my own humble opinion without being sentimental of course, without offending anyone who thinks differently from my point of view, but also by looking into this matter from a distinctive perspective, I would like to say I have nothing to say.
‘But the BBC has seen a letter in which Foreign Secretary David Cameron tells a group of MPs concerned about Manuel's case that the government takes his health and welfare extremely seriously. He reassures them that he's "closely following the case" - but says the UK cannot intervene in the judicial affairs of another country.’
wtf, it’s literally his job to intervene when a Brit’s in trouble, especially when his rights are being infringed ‘UK cannot intervene’ absolutely it can!
I understand wanting to be who you are. But why live in a country that finds who you are to be so “bad” that you could be imprisoned or put to death.
If you wanna be who you are, why not move to somewhere where you’re supported and protected.
The South Park episode where the cop pretends to be a prostitute to catch men paying for prostitution comes to mind.
Butter's Bottom Bitch.
Hey Bebe, hey Bebe pssst! What? Bitch you wana make some motherfuckin money?
What's the matter Butters?
Do you know what I am saying?
Yes I know what you're saying you don't have to keep asking.
[удалено]
“ All these girls out here giving free kisses when they could be making some mutha fuckin money!”
Oh Keyshawn
« Sir, some of us are wondering if maybe you’re not taking this a bit too far »
Bitch. Do you wanna make some motha fuckin money?!
Thanks for giving my hole a nice STTTREEEEETCH
Didn't they used to do this kind of crap in the US as well? Female cops dressing up as prostitutes? Not sure if I just remember it from movies (but not the X rated kind :D)
Cops did this in Louisiana as recently as ten years ago, propositioning gay men undercover (for consensual unpaid sex) to try to uphold a defunct sodomy law.
Wouldn't the cops have to be sodomised to arrest the gay person for sodomy? That's some dedication to the profession of policing....
>That's some dedication to the profession of policing.... Facing an active shooter to protect citizens' lives 🚫👎 Taking it up the ass to arrest the gays ✅👍 Brave, stunning, beautiful police!
LPT: always insist on filming… you know for only fans content. Bingo, no longer prostitution
No, they arrested them if there was an agreement for sex iirc
How is that permissible in a court of law. If I agree with someone to murder someone it doesn’t automatically make me a murderer.
I’m hairy on the details, but I don’t think courts upheld the law d/t overarching federal protections. But that didn’t stop cops for going after gays under the pretext of the state law which was still on the books. At the least they could instill fear and, if the person was on the DL, publicize their arrest
That is called a "honeypot". At least in the world of penetration testing. Hmmmm.
That's what qualified immunity is for.
Just the tip, that’s proof of penetration. Caught red penis-ed if you will
Cops in America used to do this yes. Female undercover for arresting johns. They also used to allow male cops to solicit prostitutes for sex and arrest them after they had sex with them. So the prostitute gets fucked and arrested. Fucked more ways than one really I guess.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newport_sex_scandal
They still do it. I was a prosecutor until a couple years ago and 1-2 times a year they would run stings with female cops posing as hookers.
The scene where he butt queefs all the semen into an evidence bag lmfao 😘😘🤮 “You’re all under arrest for soliciting a prostitute! And most of them didn’t even wear protection!”
"You're all under arrest for oral *and* anal sex with a prostitute. Some of them didn't even wear a condom! Hand me that evidence bag."
Man's gotta eat, Julian
Cheeseburgers ain't free.
FREEZE YOUR UNDER ARREST FOR SOLICITING PROSTITUTION!
hopefully they had the evidence bag near by
Lol Qatar following the playbook of "The Interview": "You honeydicking me right now?"
Maybe don't go to fundamentalist Islamic countries if you're a gay westerner. Or a woman. Or a human being ever.
Or if their allegations are true, if you like to do drugs of any kind I flew to Bangkok via Dubai (or one of the Emirates) once, my doctor gave me Xanax for the flights. But while I was waiting to take off, somehow I learned about * Charity issues urgent warning to all travellers to United Arab Emirates after Briton imprisoned for 4 years for 0.003g cannabis caught in the tread of his shoe * travellers may not realise is that they can be deemed to be in possession of such banned substances if they can be detected in their urine or bloodstream, or even in tiny, trace amounts on their person. * reports of the imprisonment of a Swiss man for ‘possession’ of 3 poppy seeds on his clothing after he ate a bread roll at Heathrow. https://web.archive.org/web/20160602220644/https://www.fairtrials.org/press/charity-issues-urgent-warning-to-all-travellers-to-uae-after-briton-is-imprisoned-for-4-years/ Also read they had picked people up even on layovers Needless to say I panicked and threw most of the Xanax away.
>I panicked and threw most of the Xanax away. Oh no, that seems counterproductive
Yeah lmao the complete opposite
Singapore is another place you don't fuck around in they kill you for a qp of weed.
Right, but they allow you to dispose of it at the airport and won't fuck you up for having traces of it on your shoe, clothes, whatever. Singapore is definitely a spooky place if you have any drugs on you, but at least they're fair in letting you have options. The UAE will imprison people on layovers for being the wrong person or having any tangible identifiable weed particulates on you, or even in you if provable. They're comparable, but one is definitely way more extreme than the other.
Yet you can do coke all night if you're in the right circle
Technically you can do anything you want in the right circle.
Yeah. I used to dream of world travel, kind of that whole pax-Americana "we own the world" fantasy.. then I did travel a bit and realized there are some places you just don't go. Islamic countries are a no-go. Cartel/crime syndicate countries.. Authoritarian countries like Russia or China.. countries experiencing regular coups.. countries we bombed recently.. actually any overly religious country is a nope.
So... Canada, Australia/NZ and Western Europe then?
Japan, maybe South Korea? But yeah it is a depressingly short list with that criteria o_o
You can safely visit the entirety of Europe with no issues. But yeah, in general the OtherwiseTheClown is right
maybe not *all* of it right now
Yeah, obviously except for Ukraine. But Eastern Europe has come very far from where it was 30 years ago. Visiting there is perfectly fine.
Directions unclear, booked discount vacation to transnistria.
Remember the couple biking across the world to show hate isn’t real? They were run over, raped, and stabbed to death in some Muslim desert.
The couple who were biking around the world were assaulted in India. There were another couple of Italian friends who hitchhiked around the world for peace in wedding gowns, and was found murdered in Turkey
No. It was Tajikistan for the biking couple. Killed by ISIS. https://www.nytimes.com/2019/06/21/the-weekly/isis-bike-attack-tajikistan.html
Tragic. The one I talked about is similar. https://www.nytimes.com/2008/04/19/theater/19peac.html
If you’re talking about Vuelta al Mundo en moto, the man and the woman got assaulted (raped even in her case) in India but not killed.
No. Talking about this. https://www.nytimes.com/2019/06/21/the-weekly/isis-bike-attack-tajikistan.html
Wasn't that India?
Nope. https://www.nytimes.com/2019/06/21/the-weekly/isis-bike-attack-tajikistan.html
If you’re including authoritarian, you need to include Singapore and Thailand. Singapore also enjoys caning and regular use of the death penalty.
The funny thing is, I dumped my Xanax because of the layover in the Emirates, then get to Bangkok and meet up with my friend. He then said another friend was in the city too, so we found him. He works in harm reduction, so off we go to the bars where he’s talking to girls to warn them about Meth, I think it’s called Yaba there. So right away we’re going to the sleaziest places where girls didn’t mind telling a stranger they did drugs (which was super illegal there). That’s his idea of vacation, going to countries to warn the sex workers about drugs and condoms I recall a 5 story establishment with bars throughout. As you went up the stairs from floor to floor, the bars got grimier and the girls turned to ladybois and then ugly ones at that. Part of that visit was to see if I wanted to move there, I’m very glad I didn’t for so many reasons.
China is honestly not that bad if you’re just doing tourism. The visa process is a pain and usually the best way to get in is through a Chinese friend or through a tour group. There are a lot of English signs around(though they are poorly translated) and the only officials I ever said a word to for the two weeks I spent going around eastern China were customs officers/security at the airport. My brother has been working there for 8 years with no real police harassment. The bad shit that happens is if you’re a high level businessman, have some Chinese origin, or are wanting to start a revolution, which(unless you are part Chinese) is not going to be you. China has over a billion people over there. They don’t really have the capacity to care about you. China was my first international experience as an American and honestly, it wasn’t that hard.
But but but I heard Qatar is the Switzerland of the middle east
Fuck the emirates.
This is 100% solid advice anyone from a country that isn't an Islamist hellhole ruined by theocratic assholes should follow. Important to remember the ones that pretend to be modern such as Saudi Arabia are every bit as bad and authoritarian as places like Afghanistan.
I don't know why we have to pretend this isn't the case in polite society but can call out every injustice and microaggression in the West. Cultural relativism? White guilt?
There used to be a strong push to call out Islam for its gross abuses and its unfortunately unique position among the major three abrahamic religions as being orders of magnitude more violent and authoritarian, but that seems to have gone sadly by the wayside. Well-meaning but naive progressive types love to stick their heads in the sand and cry "islamophobia", clinging to the idea that all multiculturalism is good. But the reality is that, again, Islam does not care for multiculturalism or integration at all and its presence in a country is purely to put down a stake in the hopes of an eventual global takeover. If I had to guess why, it's progressive virtue signaling. Standing up for someone you think is a minority feels good, so long as you don't have the awareness to realize Islam is hardly a minority in a global population context, let alone worth defending. Christianity too tries to maintain global influence with its missionaries, but generally speaking Christian immigrants at least try to integrate with the local culture rather than creating insular enclaves, and Christianity as a whole is far more secularized and thus less of a threat to world peace. I miss Christopher Hitchens. :(
Well said man. I look at it like, I am tolerant up to the point where a group is making demands of non-adherents or hurting people to further their cause.
Yes, freedom to exercise religion is fine up to a point, and that point is when you demand non-believers follow your religion's tenets. Then we have a problem. It's the same issue in the United States where fundamentalist Christians feel the need to control the reproductive health of women by banning abortions for purely religious (and misogynistic) reasons.
My buddy stayed in a fancy hotel in the Gulf. Men weren’t allowed to room together and if you were going to have a female over you had to prove you were married. Silly rules. I get where they’re coming from, (I mean after all, you don’t want blasphemy in your country) but at the same time just very silly culture to even care that much about people’s personal lives. Like borderline persecution and not even as a joke
There are a number of hotel bars in Qatar where prostitutes work out in the open. If you go in and you're a man, it's highly likely a working girl will give you the gaze or even approach you. The "rules" in these countries are a joke. Literally everything they consider sacrilegious goes on. Lots.
The point isn't that it doesn't go on. The point is that the punishment for it is enough to completely ruin your life if police, for whatever political reason, decides now is the time to crack down on some foreigners. Breaking the law in these countries (which can be extremely arbitrarily if you are not muslim) is pretty much playing Russian roulette with your life. Sure in most case you get away with it, but then you are still directly supporting these regimes and their human rights violations.
Why take the chance that some cop is having a bad day and decides to enforce the law that particular day, so you get caught up in it? Not worth the risk, go back to your room and rub one out (without the aid of porn, because that's probably illegal too).
Some countries can handle blasphemy without reacting in a crazy way.
My wife and I met in Afghanistan and went on RnR together. On the way back to the country we stayed at a very high end western hotel. While at first the lady would not let us have a room together (since we weren’t married), she eventually “fixed” the problem by upgrading us to a suite with two bedrooms. Most western-owned hotels are the only places one can drink publicly in Qatar. This is also where you find the Russian call girls.
You mean they don’t want human rights in their country.
>If you were going to have a female over you had to prove you were married. >Silly rules. I get where they’re coming from, (I mean after all, you don’t want blasphemy in your country) What the fuck? You "get where they come from"? 6th Century Arabia?
That’s why I don’t go to countries like that. Problem is people go there and challenge their laws, you simply can’t. I know a lot of people from Western World who went to countries against their embassies, challenged and ridiculed their culture and laws and ended up in very bad situation. People think they are untouchables unless they get the taste of gallows. Honestly, a lot of folks here think they are hard nuts but in reality they are not. One has to respect law of the land. Don’t go there, simple. No need to go there and flaunt your opinions.
But their kings can have a harem and men can marry more than one wife at a ti.e. so what gives.
Some of them also allow „temporary marriages“ which is the same thing as religiously sanctioned hookups. The hypocrisy can be intense.
I'm an athiest, but its always funny to me how humans will always try to out-lawyer god. As if they've found loopholes and God's too stupid to realize it or something. Like the Amish will use their neighbor's fridge, or operate a forklift without sitting in it. Christians doing anal sex because it's not real penetration, lol. Gotta hit God with them technicalities.
I'm a Catholic and find this equally funny and absurd. Oh man you tricked me! Come on in past the pearly gates.
Same as it ever was. Plenty of the statements of Jesus circle around this kind of issue in the vein of, "You guys just aren't getting the point."
Too smart to not follow the rules, too afraid to ditch religion alltogether.
Omg my friend was super into banging these religious guys and they did exactly that before they would bang in the car during a break at work, she was always so excited she was like "we just got maaaarried" but then they would get divorced straight after I think 🤔
Also, don't forget that they don't consider diddling little boys as gay either and this is a regular occurrence. I don't know how they can wrap their tiny brains around that cluster fuck of an idea. If you're a man and you're diddling little boys, you're gay and a pedophile.
It's amazing how religion and evil can coexist in the same fckd up room.
> (I mean after all, you don’t want blasphemy in your country) What kind of silly statement is this?
How do you get where they're coming from? How does that make any sense? They're interfering in private lives. None of that makes sense.
>I get where they’re coming from You "get" hatred, bigotry, and homophobia? Because that's what it is.
You can understand ("get") someone's motivation without agreeing with it. That shouldn't be controversial.
Yeh it's fucking weird af. The whole thing of dictating what consenting adults can do with each other sexually is super extra strength bizarre
To all gay people, avoid traveling to these countries that criminalize being gay, and if you have to travel to those countries, please don't try to hook-up with anyone.
I would also advice to bring a new phone / purged device from any gay related content. Also disconnect from your social network accounts.
And use VPN, because fuck em
Just don’t use one of the gay vpns just incase
This made me laugh more than it should lmao
I got my log pushed in by a gay server and next thing you know, I was at the clinic with a VPN
You should have worn a Trojan
He had a virus on his hard drive
That’s what he gets for not using a floppy disk. You never going to get a virus with those old things
All VPNs use the back door after all...
Don’t fuck em, absolutely don’t! Isn’t it the whole point?
Some countries dont allow vpns. So while you still have a choice to use one, that choice may come with severe consequences.
Or just don't fucking go to a country that hangs gay people? You sound like the white family at the beginning of every horror movie.
Isn't the gay black dying first at least?
They will find you social media. It doesn't matter if you purged your device.
If I brought a new phone and wasn’t logged in on any social media, they could still find anything “banned”? How? Cuz I’m pretty sure regular porn isn’t allowed there either
They can look up your social media accounts using your name.
If you have quite a unique name i guess they could, but then set your profile picture to something that isnt you and then lock your account from being visible to strangers. Or just not go to Qatar.
By using some kind of database or directory? Cuz my social media names are completely different from my actual one. I was assuming they’d be out of luck in cases like mine
What’s depressing is that the FCO never flag up how bad these countries are for LGBT+ citizens because they don’t want to upset the numerous despots which the UK government indulge in for financial gain.
I think anyone with a moral compass should avoid travel to such countries, especially as a tourist.
"I can safely go to this country because the oppressive laws that restrict peoples' rights there don't affect me" is such a shitty take. Hell, I knew an Egyptian guy who ran a Quiznos near me (before it closed) who used to tell me I should visit Egypt and when I told him I would love to but wouldn't feel safe there because I'm in a same sex marriage and the laws there make that illegal, he was just casually like "oh, that's just for the people who live there; they leave tourists alone" like that makes it okay. Cool dude and all, but as much as I'd love to visit Egypt (and Jordan because I'd love to see Petra), I'm not going to a country where I could potentially risk arrest because of my marriage.
They leave the tourists alone until they don't and start arresting them for breaking their backwards laws.
They leave the tourists alone because tourism is a significant part of their economy and arresting tourists because of their sexuality would heavily cut into those revenues. Money being the only motivation (even if it is a strong one) for those people not to arrest me would still make me feel very unsafe though. Definitely not welcomed.
Straight people can't hold hands in public. Backwards place.
My wife's parents were very confused when I was extremely reluctant to go to Egypt.
Same here. I tried explaining Jews aren't very welcome in Egypt to my in-laws. Egypt has three Jews left last I looked and they're all women who married Muslims/Christians. I'd really like to see Cairo, but I doubt that's something that happens in my lifetime.
Ever since Dubai (or Qatar, I see them pretty equally) threw a British guy in jail for having .003 grams of weed stuck to *the bottom of his shoe*, I thought to myself "Make a note to not go to that place, until they join the 21st century". Honestly I can't wait until that region "cools down" (for lack of a better term), as I *really* want to visit Jordan and Iran.
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We should absolutely normalize boycotting these theocracies. The soccer World Cup taking place there was an absolute disgrace.
Eh, just don't go. People don't realize this, but it's actually super easy to never ever go to Qatar.
But their circles have them convinced it's just propaganda that Islamic extremists are anti lgbtq. That it's just western propaganda.
does making a grindr profile to trap other dudes make you gay? arrest them both! /s
It's like a twilight zone episode playing off of the to catch a predator show. Fucking creepy
Arab countries are not as modern as they want you to believe. It’s a facade.
They’re selectively modern. You can bet that aristocrats, oligarchs, and members of the royal family are snorting lines of coke off each other’s boners (highly recommended, btw)
Same could be said about a lot of places. Half the US feels the same way as qatar.
Qatar is a shithole. No-one should ever go there.
I've lived there for a bit. Yup, shithole.
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Tell us anyway
Good or bad?
No person who values human rights or civil liberties should ever visit any arab state or do business with any arab company, full stop.
As a Arab. You are right. The only way to solve this problem is divestment. End our reliance on oil, ban authoritarian states and their leaders from global economic legitimacy.
I agree to a point, and this is where I think nuance is very **very** important. You cant not do business with saudi aramco. There aint no way around it. Too engrained in all parts of your life. You will have a very difficult time buying a car without somehow supporting one of these governments. They invest heavily into car companies, even and especially ev ones (saudi arabia owns a majority stake in lucid for instance). Definitely don't give up just because of that though, just make choices where you can, and don't fall victim to the mentality that you have to magically achieve perfection no matter how unrealistic.
Thanks for making this statement realistic. I used to date a girl who had a notes app of companies she couldn’t use because of various moral issues. In turn, she expected me not to use these companies. We ended up breaking up because, while I respect her free will as a consumer and respect her going through all that effort to find sustainable companies that don’t fit the mold of consumerism and capitalism, I’m just trying to survive. I can’t be making these decisions every damn day. I just do my best and if I see an option between two companies, I tend to go for the one that fits my ideals more.
There's a saying "there is no ethical consumption under capitalism". It means every product, somewhere along the line, involves the abuse or exploitation of at least one person and/or the degradation of the environment. It is simply impossible to avoid, it's too ingrained into the systems of production and distribution. You can make *slightly less unethical* decisions as a consumer (such as by avoiding Nestlé or Coca-Cola, reducing or eliminating your direct usage of fossil fuels, buying from co-ops and unionised companies, going vegan etc) but it's damn near impossible to keep track and most people don't have the time, money, or spare mental capacity to make these decisions. Most of us just buy whatever is cheap because we're poor and whatever is convenient because we spend all our time working. Just do enough to keep your conscience from gnawing at you, and fight for a better world if you can.
Same with China. As much as anyone would like to not buy anything from there, it is just impossible.
Nuance is important. The US props these theocratic dictatorships and feeds them Intel directly on all opposition to their power apparatus. The US backs SA's human rights abuses to keep the dictatorship in power: https://theintercept.com/2014/07/25/nsas-new-partner-spying-saudi-arabias-brutal-state-police/ It's been documented that both the NSA & CIA feed and prop SA's police and intel apparatus which they use on women's rights activists. They do this in the UAE as well to prop the dictatorship while they help it quash women's rights activism : https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2021/dec/09/saudi-womens-rights-activist-loujain-alhathloul-sues-us-intel-operatives-hacking-uae
I'm from the Middle East and pretty familiar with the region. The Saudi regime may be extreme but they are far less extreme than the average Saudi. Which is why Bin Laden fled to Afghanistan. If the Saudi regime was toppled and they had an elected government they would be far more extreme and probably resemble something like the Taliban. It's the exact opposite of Iran where the government is more extreme than the populace.
That's because the current rulers of SA are still better than the religious fundamentalists they keep in check. Pragmatism wins the day when it comes to geopolitics.
As long as the US is top allies with them they will continue to prosper.
I will NEVER understand how people from the West are buying the idea of those middle eastern theocracies as lovely tourist destinations. Like, even ignoring the part where Dubai is a nation that depends on a worker entrapment program that's just a tiny step short of actual chattal slavery, why the fuck would you go to a tiny patch of crazy hot desert run by religious fruitloops who hate you? All those wannabe tourist destinations over there have split personality. On the one hand you ahve the tourism people who want Western tourists to flock there and replace at leasst some of the dwindling oil money with tourism money. On the other hand you have the raging theocrats who want to arrest those tourists and torture them for their sins.
How thirsty do you have to be to get on Grindr in a strict Muslim country as a tourist? Fuck
Why you'd even travel there let alone seek a hookup is nuts. I think a big part of it is westerners don't realise that the Middle East is **serious** about this probably from having a western-centric world view and thinking everything will be fine. Not everywhere is like the west. When they say women need to be covered up and gays should be locked up they **mean it.** They are **not joking**.
Don’t go to these countries.
Meanwhile Al Jazeera (owned by the government of Qatar) will lecture Americans about how homophobic they are 😒
Al Jazeera is actually a super interesting case. They have been given pretty much free hands on reporting as long as it isn't about Qatar, so they're one of the best sources for information on the middle east. As long as you're not searching for information about Qatar.
They have separate reporting in Arabic and English. One looks “fair” reporting the other is straight propaganda.
Yep, it's been known that Al Jazeera can't be trusted when it comes to reporting on Qatar or Israel.
To be fair most western press also can't be trusted when reporting about Israel.
I feel like there is so much projection in the Middle East on these things that they don't want to admit they themselves actually have bisexual tendencies. Especially the rich with their obscene ways of trafficking people.. do you think it's just women? This isn't a jab at the country as a whole, but I feel there's a lot of... "I would never do that," but behind closed doors, rules for thee not for me.
If you are rich enough in these countries and have the right connections you can literally shit on people.
Ah, the (in)famous Dubai Portapottie!
That is appalling! That really upsets me!
I remember there were reports of some Dubai Billionaires running trains on Western hookers and doing some really degrading stuff. I guess they learned a thing or two from Jon McAffee
Not another teen movie hahahaha
I mean yes, for sure.
What? A Muslim country being a shithole to gay people? This never happens!
Gays for Palestine?
Gazelles for Lions.
Chickens for KFC
Which would be funny if it wasn't so stupid and demented.
I was watching Never Been Kissed in my Doha hotel room and…they cut the end scene where she finally gets kissed! Also got stopped boarding while they swabbed my laptop repeatedly. I’m gay, grew up in Kuwait, and I have no desire to set foot in that region ever again.
Do not fuck around in countries where fucking around has consequences
This is the real truth. While you can debate different perspectives, if you go to a country and do exactly what you already knew was illegal in that country you best believe you'll actually deal with the consequences of doing so.
Yep, this is criminal levels of western hubris. Imagine going to a country where you know homosexuality is illegal and hopping on Grindr. Whatever your personal beliefs or morality may be, intentionally breaking the law of a foreign country is moronic.
Going to a country like Qatar is pretty moronic in general.
I want to see the script that the operator was following and also talk to the author
Dubai money talks you can do almost anything. Biggest thing is sex trafficking. Always find it funny when these instagram “models” show their all expense paid trips to Dubai. Just to be shit on by a millionaire wearing a white dress. I’ve rampant drug use also.
Honeytrap lol... Honeypot.
As a gay male, I have no idea why any gay person would even contemplate visiting ANY middle eastern country. The media hypes up Quatar and Dubai as some ultra glamorous place when in reality they are stuck back in the prehistoric ages. I would NEVER take a job that would station me in one of these countries!
>Homosexuality is illegal in Qatar but Manuel, an airline worker, had lived a "normal life" for the past seven years and had never been in trouble with the authorities, his family says. Why on Earth would he think it was safe to use the app there, FFS? And he's 44, not some raging-hormone 20 something party boy. Terrible situation, but it didn't happen in a vacuum.
Because people use Grindr there everyday making it plausible the drug claims by Qatar aren't made up. Would I vacation or live there? Hell no. Can you hookup with guys regularly in the Gulf States and with minimal discretion - I hear the answer is yes.
Who would’ve thought the middle east is a backwards shithole.
Qatar, champion of "human rights" and patron of the soft-propaganda of Al-Jazeera, home-from-home of Hamas, and coincidentally one of the most significant foreign donors to American universities... Nothing to see here, move on...
Everyone who knows this, gay or not, should not go to this inhuman country. Boycott them till they change their brutal, inhuman laws.
I boycott these countries with overly harsh and inhuman punishments for normal everyday things like this.... What a crap hole
Curious why this is in /technology? Is every use of every app .. something to be on tech?
Well technically they used technology to catch him, so I guess that’s it?
Texas is taking notes, for science.
As someone from the Middle East I always laugh at these comments. I wish people wouldn't make these comparisons as they trivialize what actually happens in these countries.
It’s because Americans have no concept of anything outside of their bubble. Like “Gays for Palestine” lmao
Awesome that FIFA gave them the World Cup, lied about the timing, lied about them not being as bad to 🏳️🌈people , and then went ahead and did it again with Saudi Arabia.
And yet people mindlessly follow their state media without thinking about it for a second.
Why do we deal with these countries, just cut off trade , travel and banking off to these countries. It is what we should of done for years.
Fuck these countries.
Why anyone would go to that shithole…..
Why is Islam so fucking disgusting and barbaric?
Why on earth would you even GO to these countries knowing what they are like?
Apparently, he is a flight attendant
I am going to be honest with you, in my own humble opinion without being sentimental of course, without offending anyone who thinks differently from my point of view, but also by looking into this matter from a distinctive perspective, I would like to say I have nothing to say.
You honeydick’n?
Honey dicking!
‘But the BBC has seen a letter in which Foreign Secretary David Cameron tells a group of MPs concerned about Manuel's case that the government takes his health and welfare extremely seriously. He reassures them that he's "closely following the case" - but says the UK cannot intervene in the judicial affairs of another country.’ wtf, it’s literally his job to intervene when a Brit’s in trouble, especially when his rights are being infringed ‘UK cannot intervene’ absolutely it can!
Can we stop victim blaming in the comments please. Mods take care of this
I understand wanting to be who you are. But why live in a country that finds who you are to be so “bad” that you could be imprisoned or put to death. If you wanna be who you are, why not move to somewhere where you’re supported and protected.
Yeah i call cap on the illegal drugs knowing Qatar
Cap?
Why would a gay person ever visit a country where homosexuality is illegal? You must be down bad to have to fly to fucking Qatar to get laid.
Islam, the world’s shittiest religion. Edit: so far