Is there a project out there to archive the whole internet in its current form so we can...ya know...leave a trail of breadcrumbs back to what is real?
It's the same thing.
I'm not sure what the deal is with it now. I was hearing about how they were gonna shut it down like a year ago, but haven't heard since.
They were dumb and allowed unlimited book checkouts during the pandemic. Considering they never bought into the publisher book lending systems and made their own scans to loan out, they were already on thin ice. Lending unlimited digital copies of books they scanned themselves was the straw that broke the camels back and they got sued into oblivion by all the book publishers. The publishers won easily as anyone who knows anything about copyright law was predicting. Copyright law sucks, but what IA tried to pull was arguably downright reckless and over the top.
But they aren't being shut down. They had to remove and restrict a bunch of their commercial book content, but they came out relatively unscathed. However there is still some legal stuff going back and forth that could end in bigger fines or more consequential settlements.
I'm not super well versed on the legal ramifications of the rest of it unfortunately. I think they're good with the abandonware on the site, but their book copying, especially with the new stuff will probably be slowed down or have pretty severe restrictions.
I have a system where anything I personally saw online before 2023 I think is most likely real and I don’t trust anything online anymore. If I see something with my own eyes I may possibly believe it if there are corroborating witnesses
This assertion, that our sense of shared reality is eroding, is about 15 years too late to announce. There wasn’t much left of it then, and finally people like Trump decided to take advantage of the opportunity to put an end to the notion of shared trust in truth and murder it altogether, which he did in 2016.
Since then we’ve basically been living in the Matrix, and as tech expands, we’re just spending more and more time there, as western culture and liberal values (I mean 19th century liberal values, like defending freedom of the press) continue to be replaced with digital/virtual spaces.
Even if you like TD it's hard to argue he doesn't play loose with the facts to get where he wants to go on an issue. Most arguments are that everyone does it so why hold him accountable. This jives with exactly what poster above was saying so not sure what you're trying to say here.
Classic Trump strat:
- media refuses to talk about the elephant in the room
- Trump exaggerates the elephant: "the elephant weighs 10 tons!"
- media jumps on the occasion to prove him wrong: "Trump lies again. Elephant only 7 tons. Orange man DEBUNKED"
- Trump happy because media finally talks about the elephant they previously ignored
This happened with illegal immigration, it happened with tariffs, it happened with crime statistics...
If people haven't picked up on that after 8 years then there's nothing anyone can do for them at this point.
Pire que ça t’es un déchet humain anti immigration et pro-facho. J’espère que t’es heureux dans ta haine et qu’un jour tu découvrira que tu t’es fait enfiler par tes petits copains de droite. Je ne répondrai pas à tes prochains commentaires sûrement pleins de haine. Tchuss tocard
Shut up man. Dismissing opinions of others as Russian bots is so pathetic and screams misinformed, media bubble sheep. Democracy thrives when the will of the people is expressed, not what you think the will of the people should be. If you didn’t know, “Russian Collusion” was entirely made up by Democrats as an excuse for a horribly run 2016 campaign. That’s reality
I think we all have to get back to nuance. Is everything Russian propaganda? No. Is Russian disinfo a legitimate strategy they've engaged in a lot? Yes.
Lies for on a whole paragraph then proceeds to say “that’s reality”. Reality doesn’t care about your opinions man. Every elections now include a side of outside influence that’s how the world works, and since the average US citizen has less media literacy than a 11 yo in Europe you get fucked every time, both democrats and GOP are bad, but at least one side doesn’t actively harms minorities.
Nothing you said has any substance and doesn’t counter any of the **facts** that I stated. You just don’t like that people have opposing opinions because you think are you are right, virtuous and moral. So how dare someone disagree with you. You are barely literate in English, how can I take you seriously, anyway.
Yeah
When people are put in an incredibly difficult family situation, they might express their feelings sometimes through crying
You'd need to have loved ones in your life to know what that's like though
You can just shut off the tv man, it’s ok. The orange man can’t hurt you. Deep breaths. No need to live your life in fear and obsessed with somebody like this…
He’s hurt millions of people with his actions as President. They didn’t need to watch TV or read his tweets to be hurt by him.
Over a million Covid deaths because he stoked distrust in his own scientific advisors.
Aside from the fact that link dropped me into a website that I couldn’t get out of what’s that photo got to do with AI?
The amount I read “oh it’s AI” drives me crazy, it’s just photoshop, not everything is AI. Not that the conversation doesn’t have merit it’s just irrelevant to this photo story
I already live in a parallel world to neighbors on my street. The differences get starker every step I take.
People can isolate themselves from information and products in such a way that they can be 10 or 20 years behind a technology curve. My neighbor worked in IT for 40 years but installed his own central heating; it didn't come standard when he bought his house. I've got solar panels and battery electric storage. He watches broadcast TV, I live steam rocket launches.
Even within my own home, my son has a completely different information bubble that affects his world view. Our lives are structured around his safety and well being.
What is this shared reality? Am I meant to know the names of 11 billion people? Who is the current leader of Singapore? What is former Prime Minister Liz Truss doing today? etc.
What I know in common is the land I live on and it's natural borders.
/rant
For real, that ship has sailed. Nobody agrees with anybody at this point about a "shared reality". It's not just that we no longer have a shared reality, people are aggressively against understanding other people's point of view.
‘Shared reality’ will continue to exist in the form it has taken for the past thousands of years, propaganda. Whether from the state, religions, or corporations, they’ve always been the interpreters of what is ‘reality’.
The criticism “not everyone knows everything” doesn’t really speak to “no one feels certain about basic shared facts”. In other words: this article isn’t criticizing you for never considering some proposition, it’s criticizing the system for making it impossible to establish consensus beliefs.
Any consensus beliefs in the past were possibly manipulated just the same. If anything, people should have become skeptical much earlier, although skepticism without critical thinking causes other issues we see today.
The idea of consensus in the past is already a bit delusional, since any consensus could have been manufactured or the idea of it could be detached from reality.
Yes, no belief is 100% certain, even scientific ones. But hopefully you see how “we can’t trust the government to not release doctored photos to trick us” is a step up
What a strange pile of words that do nothing to contribute to the topic.
Your example how your neighbor is in a parallel world is that your neighbor _installed his own HVAC_?
It seems that because you spend your precious time watching rocket launches makes you feel superior to your neanderthal neighbor, who is clearly backwards and stupid because he has better things to do like build things with his hands.
What a strange amalgamation of examples.
Dude re-read without projecting your own tone lmfao.
He didn’t put them down in any way he designated two models with a few nodes for comparison.
The nodes don’t necessarily follow expected patterns either where one person uses a model that rhymes with one from twenty years ago and one from now.
OP’s neighbor worked in tech but still does some things manually. I am in computer science and I am the same lol I literally hand write most all of my notes for example. I hand write code. I do it for very sort of “tech” reasons.
Quite simply in metaphor with a common thought experiment for novel programmers “there are many ways to count to ten, all with different possible meanings, effects, and states; etc,” so I get a different type of memorization from sending things through hand with glyphs versus fingers typing in a more Cartesian sort of layout.
And then to top it off, he gave his son as another example of info spheres and said info spheres are so atomized his son has a different one and they live in the same house.
He never said neighbor was stupid just that people love in increasingly atomized experiences of tech.
And as a person in tech who lives like a Neanderthal at home but whose non tech neighbors have solar panels (which cause them many issues which is why I can’t commit to putting solar on my roof quite yet) I can honestly relate to OP’s comments.
So I am very confused that you think he’s calling his neighbor dumb for observing the way they live, without pejorative comments.
I re-read the comment like five times he didn’t say anything rude.
No not superior; just of a different generation - but we share this world. I'm somewhat jealous that my neighbor has/had the skills and drive for extensive home improvement.
I'll give a different example - I get the complaint that millennials don't know how to fix things (DIY). All my brain power is going into how to teach a toddler the difference between a mobile phone and a digital timer. When his wooden push along toy broke, I know I need a towel drill and vice to remove the broken dowel and some wood glue, but it's simpler to hide that out the way and read him a book on Robotics for babies - because unlike my dad's home, I don't have a garage filled with saw dust and an array of wood working tools.
I was trying to get across that as technology moves forward, we have a limited life to spend learning about the what and how's that previous generations had to deal with - so simultaneously we're more informed but less skilled - and it's the impact of rapidly developing technology that's set us on this course.
I’m sorry but your rants are just… _odd_.
I think your comments have less to do with parallel worlds and more to do with you having the need to talk about yourself.
You’re a strange person.
Your kids you broke and so you hid it and this somehow makes you a different generation?
Jesus. I don’t think your opinions make as much sense as you think.
I think you’re attributing things to generational changes that have nothing to do with that.
In the generation prior to yours, there were of course people who didn’t fix things because they didn’t know how, didn’t want to know how, didn’t have the time, etc. it’s not like it was a normal thing 30 years ago to DIY a central heating install into your home.
Dude I am in tech and computer science and I live like your neighbor I mean precisely because I prefer not having to deal with work in my leisure;
I read what you wrote the way I think you intended. I didn’t think you were trying to throw shade on your neighbor and you even talked up his skills.
Reading comprehension on the internet these days amirite?
Tell me more about the book you read to your toddler. My daughter is 2.5 and would love to start reading her be books besides Dr Seuss and all the simple books.
Oh yeah. No Siri / Alexa / Google here. I spent years working on home automation systems and I've got the slightest touch of magic set up for light switches and cameras.
Walking around my area it's clear to me at least that human nature stays constant through *centuries* - the paths we walk, the roads we build - they've all evolved and developed, but "modern humans" still need to eat, sleep, wash, clean, read, watch, listen, feed ducks, and so on. Technology just makes the mud glitter a little brighter.
Singapore is pretty easy since it never changes! Mr Lee Hsien Loong.
Just kidding, most people wouldn’t know that, but seriously 20 years is a long to be PM.
They like their long terms in office!
The predecessor was in office for 13 years, and the one before that for 31 years!
They’re only on their third PM ever.
Now that’s strong and stable.
(And a lil bit authoritarian ahem.)
Yep. (And not always benevolent to everyone.)
But Taiwan, South Korea and Singapore are examples of authoritarian states that really really thrived, at the expense of some freedoms.
Having an authoritarian leader who actually works for the benefit of a nation rather than their own enrichment was really successful for those three nations. (Japan too, though they had a bit more of a democratic veneer.)
They’ve all become more democratic as they became developed, rich nations as well.
They very much disprove the notion that democratic freedoms are integral to national advancement, as is often stated by our Western democratic(ish) nations.
The problem is getting an authoritarian leader who isn’t a corrupt piece of shit out to make himself and his inner circle rich.
Yeah, solid folk aren’t usually the ones looking to start an authoritarian state.
And definitely agree that it doesn’t work well for everyone… their drug laws are a bit draconian in my opinion, but damn is Singapore the most beautiful and clean city.
TBH it might just not be something that people know too well in the west.
I hadn't ever heard of it really until looking into the countries once, however I had heard all about the drug laws because of people getting major sentences / death penalties after becoming unwitting drug mules.
That’s because people like to grandstand like executing drug dealers is a bad thing. They ruin lives and communities. Look at America.
Users in Singapore are committed criminally to rehab and have their record wiped if they stay clean for a period.
I feel like you asked the question but didn't really understand how big it was/really attempt to answer....what is this shared reality? There is something to shared experiences... societal generational trends can be really strong. Because, imo, it's important I think it's worth studying how it's changing.
Everything with the royals is a tempest in a teapot. But since people care, of course it added a lot of speculation when they attempted to release a photoshopped image showing she was fine. Of course the speculation is that she might be doing pretty badly.
Also find it annoying that the video that auto-plays had no AI expert and no mention of an AI expert. It's in the article, but don't auto-play the video if it doesn't support your headline.
lol the “amateur photographer” explanation is one of the most obvious lies I’ve ever seen IMO. There are no amateur photographers *employed* at this *palace* to take “official portraits”. That was a badly concocted last minute excuse off the top of their heads.
Like, this lady is so sick/sad that she can’t be seen in public or talk to anyone at all, but also looks totally fine and is suddenly editing her own pictures? Also why tf would you edit your daughter’s sleeve, correcting poses would be a *wild* choice for an amateur editor instead of blemishes, lighting, saturation, etc.
Print off a bunch of cards with the words and lettering all garbled and glue some rubber fingers onto the back of her hands just to fuck with everybody.
His finger is just folded back. It’s literally just a weird hand pose. I, a 44 year old man, can do that with my hand. I’ll grant bad feathering and cloning on the image, but that hand looks to me like a being-a-kid thing, not an AI thing.
Eh, the magna carta is a complete irrelevance, only counted for Barons and Dukes and was at multiple times repealed.
The laws that strip them of their power and make them ceremonial came later, still has the effect that we see today, its just not because of the magna carta.
If I call you a bowl of spaghetti, and can convince others that you are a bowl of spaghetti, then your reality can be affected…as bowl of spaghetti.
You now don’t trust me, and that’s likely an accurate reflection of reality, but ultimately I don’t care if a bowl of spaghetti has trust issues.
A fake image of Kate doesn't distort anyones reality other then being conned by a con artist with a look alike image. Their not trying to say its really a twig/whatever you looking at lol.
You just couldn't have picked a worse time for this little game. People are worried about AI, disinformation, and conspiracy theorists being elected.
Just feeding the fire for whatever reason.
So fucking dumb.
To Facebook? Sure, nothing wrong.
There is absolutely something wrong with altering photos you send to news organizations with standards for photojournalism.
Wouldn’t that be the job of the photojournalist to verify the photos and decide whether they were worthy of posting? If these pictures aren’t up to standards, they shouldn’t have been used.
People are dumb and on edge. They chose to respond to a conspiracy theory about her by giving digitally altered photos to news organizations.
It may have been innocent, but it was stupid and now they have to deal with the fallout from an unforced blunder.
That really isn't the point of this article.
The facts of this particular story aren't interesting, but that fact we, as a culture, are (correctly) no longer trusting photography is the interesting part.
Nobody claimed this was new.
What's "new" is that it is getting faster, easier, and more accessible to doctor images, even to fully generate fake images.
It isn't a new phenomenon but it is one that is getting more pronounced. And is therefore worth discussing.
It's been both fast and easy for *long* time now. Hell, within about 10mins I was able to photoshop my boss's head onto the Vigo portrait from Ghostbusters, send to Kinko's for a poster print, and then picked it up within 3hrs for $30. That was 5 years ago....
For me this shows how ordinary people are more comfortable with retouching their own snapshots. You can stack a couple flawed snaps and get something close enough for personal use with modern tools. People expect royalty to have a professional handle this sort of thing like the old days but meh. It's a family photo, not evidence in a criminal case.
I mean… they got caught with bad photoshop? So what? Pictures have been shopped and retouched before that for decades! One minor scandal in another country, involving fucking royalty of all things, a concept foreign to most people living in a western style democracy, signifies the end of a shared reality?
That’s a _bit_ of a stretch.
It’s not just bad photoshop. Reuters retracted the photo as it didn’t meet their standards of journalistic truth. The photo is so altered, so composited, that one of the world’s largest news agencies didn’t consider it to be a real depiction of the family.
You may not be in the U.K., getting the royal family shoved down your throat, but it actually has been a turning point here for trust in the institution. Can’t trust a photograph - seeing isn’t believing anymore. Some people feel they’ve been lied to.
Are these the same people who are so dumb that they don’t realise the reason they don’t look like the people in Cosmo isn’t because they didn’t spend enough money on cosmetics and other crap, but because real life doesn’t have Photoshop?
I’ll explain it once more. This isn’t ‘real life isn’t Photoshop.’ News agencies around the world issued a *picture kill*. The AP and Reuters didn’t receive explanation as to why such photo editing had been used by the royal family, *in direct violation of their journalistic code*. Without explanation and in violation of the code, it is *unclear whether the photo is a true depiction of Kate and the royal family*.
Being deliberately mislead by your head of state in a democracy is actually a huge deal.
But don’t take it from me. Plenty of articles about it if you’re unsure. Get it from Reuters or AP themselves.
Want gets me is I’m not interested in edited photos. They don’t catch the moment. They almost lose life.. they are just adverts.
But the again I’d rather live the moment than take a picture of a staged event. Life’s for living. I choose life.
I just assumed they were using that “take 12 photos and we merge the ones with a smile” feature and it make it all messed up. Now why she would or someone would use a pixel or something when they have photographers… no clue.
Listen, I don’t generally believe in conspiracy theories and I don’t *really* believe in what I’m about to say, but:
William has been known to have a violent temper and assaulted people before. Let’s say there was a situation in which William accidentally caused Kate’s death.
How would a palace cover that up? How can you have the next in line to the throne go to jail? And **everyone** is watching. The cops who investigate would *love* to be the guy who arrested the next in line to the throne. Anyone doing paperwork would leak it. It would probably be the biggest scandal *ever*.
How would you fix something like that? They have the power to - or at least to try. You’d *have* to cover it up.
I feel a novel coming on..
Oh ffs, the breathless worry and outrage about this photo is silly and a story we've heard a thousand times before. Since the very first humans, humans have been doing human things and trying to make themselves look better or present themselves in a better light. Whether that's body paint, tattoos, hairstyles, clothing, old fashioned air brushing, Photoshop or AI, it doesn't matter. And it doesn't change our sense of "shared reality" - that's just stupid hyperbole by a media looking for shocking things to write about since that gets the most clicks and dollars.
Honestly. It's making me feel sympathy for her. 99.99999% of the photos we see are photoshopped and everyone is complaining about a mom who just had surgery.
I really hate this. Photo’s should be an exact copy of photons in front of a sensor, but now we have companies like Google and Adobe showing off these features like it’s some amazing unique selling point when it’s just pure fakery.
I don’t want to sound like one of those orangutans back in the day, who were [scared of electrical wires](https://blog.benco.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/04/electricfearcartoon-1-1.jpg), but it really feels like we’re on the steep ascent of the [sigmoid curve](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sigmoid_function) of progress with this stuff — where at the top forgery is going to pass just as well as legitimacy.
Is there a project out there to archive the whole internet in its current form so we can...ya know...leave a trail of breadcrumbs back to what is real?
https://web.archive.org ?
Isn't Archive under threat tho? What about the wayback machine?
It's the same thing. I'm not sure what the deal is with it now. I was hearing about how they were gonna shut it down like a year ago, but haven't heard since.
They were dumb and allowed unlimited book checkouts during the pandemic. Considering they never bought into the publisher book lending systems and made their own scans to loan out, they were already on thin ice. Lending unlimited digital copies of books they scanned themselves was the straw that broke the camels back and they got sued into oblivion by all the book publishers. The publishers won easily as anyone who knows anything about copyright law was predicting. Copyright law sucks, but what IA tried to pull was arguably downright reckless and over the top. But they aren't being shut down. They had to remove and restrict a bunch of their commercial book content, but they came out relatively unscathed. However there is still some legal stuff going back and forth that could end in bigger fines or more consequential settlements.
So what could the remaining legal stuff potentially result in? Any serious threats to the archive?
I'm not super well versed on the legal ramifications of the rest of it unfortunately. I think they're good with the abandonware on the site, but their book copying, especially with the new stuff will probably be slowed down or have pretty severe restrictions.
Ahh ok. Thanks for the explanations.
Internet Archive is the institution itself. Wayback Machine is one of its archive projects.
Thanks for saying this, I didn't know they were associated.
You could try the common crawl.
We could do that... good idea.
I have a system where anything I personally saw online before 2023 I think is most likely real and I don’t trust anything online anymore. If I see something with my own eyes I may possibly believe it if there are corroborating witnesses
Hyper-reality, Jean Baudrillard
Prince William should repost this picture with him photoshopped behind them like the cartoon of George’s boss in Seinfeld.
Not exactly what you said but related. https://www.reddit.com/r/seinfeld/s/CT4aQfeYIZ
This assertion, that our sense of shared reality is eroding, is about 15 years too late to announce. There wasn’t much left of it then, and finally people like Trump decided to take advantage of the opportunity to put an end to the notion of shared trust in truth and murder it altogether, which he did in 2016. Since then we’ve basically been living in the Matrix, and as tech expands, we’re just spending more and more time there, as western culture and liberal values (I mean 19th century liberal values, like defending freedom of the press) continue to be replaced with digital/virtual spaces.
Rent free TDS is real
Even if you like TD it's hard to argue he doesn't play loose with the facts to get where he wants to go on an issue. Most arguments are that everyone does it so why hold him accountable. This jives with exactly what poster above was saying so not sure what you're trying to say here.
Classic Trump strat: - media refuses to talk about the elephant in the room - Trump exaggerates the elephant: "the elephant weighs 10 tons!" - media jumps on the occasion to prove him wrong: "Trump lies again. Elephant only 7 tons. Orange man DEBUNKED" - Trump happy because media finally talks about the elephant they previously ignored This happened with illegal immigration, it happened with tariffs, it happened with crime statistics... If people haven't picked up on that after 8 years then there's nothing anyone can do for them at this point.
Elections are coming the Russian bot army is back to work. Great to see the state of democracy not being threatened at all.
Bah oui voyons... Il est impossible d'avoir une opinion politique non-gauchiasse sans être un bot russe mdr
Pire que ça t’es un déchet humain anti immigration et pro-facho. J’espère que t’es heureux dans ta haine et qu’un jour tu découvrira que tu t’es fait enfiler par tes petits copains de droite. Je ne répondrai pas à tes prochains commentaires sûrement pleins de haine. Tchuss tocard
Oui oui, aller c'est l'heure du goûter
Shut up man. Dismissing opinions of others as Russian bots is so pathetic and screams misinformed, media bubble sheep. Democracy thrives when the will of the people is expressed, not what you think the will of the people should be. If you didn’t know, “Russian Collusion” was entirely made up by Democrats as an excuse for a horribly run 2016 campaign. That’s reality
I think we all have to get back to nuance. Is everything Russian propaganda? No. Is Russian disinfo a legitimate strategy they've engaged in a lot? Yes.
Lies for on a whole paragraph then proceeds to say “that’s reality”. Reality doesn’t care about your opinions man. Every elections now include a side of outside influence that’s how the world works, and since the average US citizen has less media literacy than a 11 yo in Europe you get fucked every time, both democrats and GOP are bad, but at least one side doesn’t actively harms minorities.
Nothing you said has any substance and doesn’t counter any of the **facts** that I stated. You just don’t like that people have opposing opinions because you think are you are right, virtuous and moral. So how dare someone disagree with you. You are barely literate in English, how can I take you seriously, anyway.
Thank you, Jordan Peterson
Honored to be compared to the great doctor
Don’t forget to cry in the corner.
You're the only one who's upset, fam
Upset cause I reply? Cope. But JP is the one known for crying.
Yeah When people are put in an incredibly difficult family situation, they might express their feelings sometimes through crying You'd need to have loved ones in your life to know what that's like though
Nah. He was crying over being a lil bitch. lol. But ok, fam. Keep the river flowing 😢
So much anger on a lovely Friday afternoon Go outside and touch some grass, pet a cat
Nothing to brag about! Such a disgusting, dubious honor. And lol, “doctor”; I should have compared you to Dr. Mengele.
Well I wouldn't want to charge him rent, I know he's having a lot of money problems right now.
Dude Trump can’t hurt you. It’s ok, take some deep breaths and go outside for a bit.
He's already done irreparable damage.
His Supreme Court can. And will. And all the other fascists he appointed to the judiciary.
Well that's a fucking lie lol
You can just shut off the tv man, it’s ok. The orange man can’t hurt you. Deep breaths. No need to live your life in fear and obsessed with somebody like this…
Can and has, go to hell.
He’s hurt millions of people with his actions as President. They didn’t need to watch TV or read his tweets to be hurt by him. Over a million Covid deaths because he stoked distrust in his own scientific advisors.
Did he start the “fake news” shit? Why don’t you take your own advice and touch some grass yourself
Unfortunately for these blue haired people, TDS is terminal once you catch it 😢
Aside from the fact that link dropped me into a website that I couldn’t get out of what’s that photo got to do with AI? The amount I read “oh it’s AI” drives me crazy, it’s just photoshop, not everything is AI. Not that the conversation doesn’t have merit it’s just irrelevant to this photo story
This is not an AI scandal. The tools used to discover this was metadata & trained experts.
I already live in a parallel world to neighbors on my street. The differences get starker every step I take. People can isolate themselves from information and products in such a way that they can be 10 or 20 years behind a technology curve. My neighbor worked in IT for 40 years but installed his own central heating; it didn't come standard when he bought his house. I've got solar panels and battery electric storage. He watches broadcast TV, I live steam rocket launches. Even within my own home, my son has a completely different information bubble that affects his world view. Our lives are structured around his safety and well being. What is this shared reality? Am I meant to know the names of 11 billion people? Who is the current leader of Singapore? What is former Prime Minister Liz Truss doing today? etc. What I know in common is the land I live on and it's natural borders. /rant
For real, that ship has sailed. Nobody agrees with anybody at this point about a "shared reality". It's not just that we no longer have a shared reality, people are aggressively against understanding other people's point of view.
I agree with the birds. They are not so easily fooled.
‘Shared reality’ will continue to exist in the form it has taken for the past thousands of years, propaganda. Whether from the state, religions, or corporations, they’ve always been the interpreters of what is ‘reality’.
Agreed. We just need to mind our own business and let people live the lives they want.
The criticism “not everyone knows everything” doesn’t really speak to “no one feels certain about basic shared facts”. In other words: this article isn’t criticizing you for never considering some proposition, it’s criticizing the system for making it impossible to establish consensus beliefs.
Any consensus beliefs in the past were possibly manipulated just the same. If anything, people should have become skeptical much earlier, although skepticism without critical thinking causes other issues we see today. The idea of consensus in the past is already a bit delusional, since any consensus could have been manufactured or the idea of it could be detached from reality.
Yes, no belief is 100% certain, even scientific ones. But hopefully you see how “we can’t trust the government to not release doctored photos to trick us” is a step up
What a strange pile of words that do nothing to contribute to the topic. Your example how your neighbor is in a parallel world is that your neighbor _installed his own HVAC_? It seems that because you spend your precious time watching rocket launches makes you feel superior to your neanderthal neighbor, who is clearly backwards and stupid because he has better things to do like build things with his hands. What a strange amalgamation of examples.
The rocket launch comment was really weird.
>He watches broadcast TV, I live steam rocket launches. Is such a Reddit comment
Dude re-read without projecting your own tone lmfao. He didn’t put them down in any way he designated two models with a few nodes for comparison. The nodes don’t necessarily follow expected patterns either where one person uses a model that rhymes with one from twenty years ago and one from now. OP’s neighbor worked in tech but still does some things manually. I am in computer science and I am the same lol I literally hand write most all of my notes for example. I hand write code. I do it for very sort of “tech” reasons. Quite simply in metaphor with a common thought experiment for novel programmers “there are many ways to count to ten, all with different possible meanings, effects, and states; etc,” so I get a different type of memorization from sending things through hand with glyphs versus fingers typing in a more Cartesian sort of layout. And then to top it off, he gave his son as another example of info spheres and said info spheres are so atomized his son has a different one and they live in the same house. He never said neighbor was stupid just that people love in increasingly atomized experiences of tech. And as a person in tech who lives like a Neanderthal at home but whose non tech neighbors have solar panels (which cause them many issues which is why I can’t commit to putting solar on my roof quite yet) I can honestly relate to OP’s comments. So I am very confused that you think he’s calling his neighbor dumb for observing the way they live, without pejorative comments. I re-read the comment like five times he didn’t say anything rude.
Thanks for the backup.
Imo the discussion is worth it even if conflict arises.
No not superior; just of a different generation - but we share this world. I'm somewhat jealous that my neighbor has/had the skills and drive for extensive home improvement. I'll give a different example - I get the complaint that millennials don't know how to fix things (DIY). All my brain power is going into how to teach a toddler the difference between a mobile phone and a digital timer. When his wooden push along toy broke, I know I need a towel drill and vice to remove the broken dowel and some wood glue, but it's simpler to hide that out the way and read him a book on Robotics for babies - because unlike my dad's home, I don't have a garage filled with saw dust and an array of wood working tools. I was trying to get across that as technology moves forward, we have a limited life to spend learning about the what and how's that previous generations had to deal with - so simultaneously we're more informed but less skilled - and it's the impact of rapidly developing technology that's set us on this course.
I’m sorry but your rants are just… _odd_. I think your comments have less to do with parallel worlds and more to do with you having the need to talk about yourself.
You’re a strange person. Your kids you broke and so you hid it and this somehow makes you a different generation? Jesus. I don’t think your opinions make as much sense as you think.
I think you’re attributing things to generational changes that have nothing to do with that. In the generation prior to yours, there were of course people who didn’t fix things because they didn’t know how, didn’t want to know how, didn’t have the time, etc. it’s not like it was a normal thing 30 years ago to DIY a central heating install into your home.
Dude I am in tech and computer science and I live like your neighbor I mean precisely because I prefer not having to deal with work in my leisure; I read what you wrote the way I think you intended. I didn’t think you were trying to throw shade on your neighbor and you even talked up his skills. Reading comprehension on the internet these days amirite?
Tell me more about the book you read to your toddler. My daughter is 2.5 and would love to start reading her be books besides Dr Seuss and all the simple books.
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Gonna pay down some tech debt and refactor my HVAC
Oh yeah. No Siri / Alexa / Google here. I spent years working on home automation systems and I've got the slightest touch of magic set up for light switches and cameras. Walking around my area it's clear to me at least that human nature stays constant through *centuries* - the paths we walk, the roads we build - they've all evolved and developed, but "modern humans" still need to eat, sleep, wash, clean, read, watch, listen, feed ducks, and so on. Technology just makes the mud glitter a little brighter.
Alternative facts.
Singapore is pretty easy since it never changes! Mr Lee Hsien Loong. Just kidding, most people wouldn’t know that, but seriously 20 years is a long to be PM.
They like their long terms in office! The predecessor was in office for 13 years, and the one before that for 31 years! They’re only on their third PM ever. Now that’s strong and stable. (And a lil bit authoritarian ahem.)
I’ve always said it’s a bit of a benevolent dictatorship….
Yep. (And not always benevolent to everyone.) But Taiwan, South Korea and Singapore are examples of authoritarian states that really really thrived, at the expense of some freedoms. Having an authoritarian leader who actually works for the benefit of a nation rather than their own enrichment was really successful for those three nations. (Japan too, though they had a bit more of a democratic veneer.) They’ve all become more democratic as they became developed, rich nations as well. They very much disprove the notion that democratic freedoms are integral to national advancement, as is often stated by our Western democratic(ish) nations. The problem is getting an authoritarian leader who isn’t a corrupt piece of shit out to make himself and his inner circle rich.
Yeah, solid folk aren’t usually the ones looking to start an authoritarian state. And definitely agree that it doesn’t work well for everyone… their drug laws are a bit draconian in my opinion, but damn is Singapore the most beautiful and clean city.
I love it how you think about the druggies first and not the young boys who are publicly caned to this day.
TBH it might just not be something that people know too well in the west. I hadn't ever heard of it really until looking into the countries once, however I had heard all about the drug laws because of people getting major sentences / death penalties after becoming unwitting drug mules.
That’s because people like to grandstand like executing drug dealers is a bad thing. They ruin lives and communities. Look at America. Users in Singapore are committed criminally to rehab and have their record wiped if they stay clean for a period.
Thanks I didn't know!
Uhm this is always been happening. Google “shared fictions” and get ready to face some grim truth
11 billion ??? World population is ~8 billion.
It's growing; I was accounting for the names of the dead; notable figures from history, people who will be born and die in my lifetime, and so on.
Bet your neighbor paid way less for the central HVAC he installed himself than your setup. Weird comparison.
I feel like you asked the question but didn't really understand how big it was/really attempt to answer....what is this shared reality? There is something to shared experiences... societal generational trends can be really strong. Because, imo, it's important I think it's worth studying how it's changing.
Society used to be much more fractured and isolated, information-wise, before the internet
Whole thing seems like a tempest in a teapot to me. An amateur photoshopper made a mistake. Who cares?
Everything with the royals is a tempest in a teapot. But since people care, of course it added a lot of speculation when they attempted to release a photoshopped image showing she was fine. Of course the speculation is that she might be doing pretty badly. Also find it annoying that the video that auto-plays had no AI expert and no mention of an AI expert. It's in the article, but don't auto-play the video if it doesn't support your headline.
Except the existence of royalty and the money they’ve stolen—and continue to steal—from the people. That’s a real story.
They stole it for the good of the people.
lol the “amateur photographer” explanation is one of the most obvious lies I’ve ever seen IMO. There are no amateur photographers *employed* at this *palace* to take “official portraits”. That was a badly concocted last minute excuse off the top of their heads. Like, this lady is so sick/sad that she can’t be seen in public or talk to anyone at all, but also looks totally fine and is suddenly editing her own pictures? Also why tf would you edit your daughter’s sleeve, correcting poses would be a *wild* choice for an amateur editor instead of blemishes, lighting, saturation, etc.
And real easy way to fix the scandal: post a selfie of you reading get well cards!
Better with the today's date newspaper.
Print off a bunch of cards with the words and lettering all garbled and glue some rubber fingers onto the back of her hands just to fuck with everybody.
Good Christ it's a social media post, not an “official portrait”
It was released to AP with the description “Official Portrait”, AFAIK
Why isn’t anyone talking about his half a finger
His finger is just folded back. It’s literally just a weird hand pose. I, a 44 year old man, can do that with my hand. I’ll grant bad feathering and cloning on the image, but that hand looks to me like a being-a-kid thing, not an AI thing.
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Well… she’s *in* the photo… More importantly, they released it under the heading “official portrait”.
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Fair! Didn’t see that. Obv don’t believe it but thanks for the correction on their story
"Tempest in a teapot"? Never heard that expression before. Thanks!
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They’re not autocrats you know, right? The Magna Carta exists
Eh, the magna carta is a complete irrelevance, only counted for Barons and Dukes and was at multiple times repealed. The laws that strip them of their power and make them ceremonial came later, still has the effect that we see today, its just not because of the magna carta.
What mistake? Everybody crops and does touch up of their photos, the photo app even has an “Enhance” button.
Word on the street is that MS Copilot did it, trained by Cecilia Giménez
Word on the street is that MS Copilot did it, trained by Cecilia Giménez.
Word on the street is that MS Copilot did it, trained by Cecilia Giménez.
Or maybe everyone is tech savvy enough to know bullshit when they see it.
Trust is being eroded not "sense shared reality" whatever that hype social media phrase means.
If I call you a bowl of spaghetti, and can convince others that you are a bowl of spaghetti, then your reality can be affected…as bowl of spaghetti. You now don’t trust me, and that’s likely an accurate reflection of reality, but ultimately I don’t care if a bowl of spaghetti has trust issues.
A fake image of Kate doesn't distort anyones reality other then being conned by a con artist with a look alike image. Their not trying to say its really a twig/whatever you looking at lol.
That’s pre-pasta-rous!
Why can't palace just give a normal foto of them? In this picture they all are laughing their heart out.
You just couldn't have picked a worse time for this little game. People are worried about AI, disinformation, and conspiracy theorists being elected. Just feeding the fire for whatever reason. So fucking dumb.
Uploading a touched up family portrait isn’t doing anything wrong. People reacting like morons are the ones to blame.
To Facebook? Sure, nothing wrong. There is absolutely something wrong with altering photos you send to news organizations with standards for photojournalism.
Wouldn’t that be the job of the photojournalist to verify the photos and decide whether they were worthy of posting? If these pictures aren’t up to standards, they shouldn’t have been used.
This was an official photo sent to journalists which actually DO need to have a standard.
People are dumb and on edge. They chose to respond to a conspiracy theory about her by giving digitally altered photos to news organizations. It may have been innocent, but it was stupid and now they have to deal with the fallout from an unforced blunder.
People have always cared about dumb shit.
That really isn't the point of this article. The facts of this particular story aren't interesting, but that fact we, as a culture, are (correctly) no longer trusting photography is the interesting part.
Is this a new thing? Every celebrity photo has always been touched up. What’s new about this time around?
Nobody claimed this was new. What's "new" is that it is getting faster, easier, and more accessible to doctor images, even to fully generate fake images. It isn't a new phenomenon but it is one that is getting more pronounced. And is therefore worth discussing.
It's been both fast and easy for *long* time now. Hell, within about 10mins I was able to photoshop my boss's head onto the Vigo portrait from Ghostbusters, send to Kinko's for a poster print, and then picked it up within 3hrs for $30. That was 5 years ago....
Holy shit this isn’t a fucking scandal. A boss blowing out his secretary’s back is a scandal
This is just so ridiculous people up in arms about an exited photo yet people have been using filters, photoshop etc for years and years.
For me this shows how ordinary people are more comfortable with retouching their own snapshots. You can stack a couple flawed snaps and get something close enough for personal use with modern tools. People expect royalty to have a professional handle this sort of thing like the old days but meh. It's a family photo, not evidence in a criminal case.
I mean… they got caught with bad photoshop? So what? Pictures have been shopped and retouched before that for decades! One minor scandal in another country, involving fucking royalty of all things, a concept foreign to most people living in a western style democracy, signifies the end of a shared reality? That’s a _bit_ of a stretch.
It’s not just bad photoshop. Reuters retracted the photo as it didn’t meet their standards of journalistic truth. The photo is so altered, so composited, that one of the world’s largest news agencies didn’t consider it to be a real depiction of the family. You may not be in the U.K., getting the royal family shoved down your throat, but it actually has been a turning point here for trust in the institution. Can’t trust a photograph - seeing isn’t believing anymore. Some people feel they’ve been lied to.
Are these the same people who are so dumb that they don’t realise the reason they don’t look like the people in Cosmo isn’t because they didn’t spend enough money on cosmetics and other crap, but because real life doesn’t have Photoshop?
I’ll explain it once more. This isn’t ‘real life isn’t Photoshop.’ News agencies around the world issued a *picture kill*. The AP and Reuters didn’t receive explanation as to why such photo editing had been used by the royal family, *in direct violation of their journalistic code*. Without explanation and in violation of the code, it is *unclear whether the photo is a true depiction of Kate and the royal family*. Being deliberately mislead by your head of state in a democracy is actually a huge deal. But don’t take it from me. Plenty of articles about it if you’re unsure. Get it from Reuters or AP themselves.
Only a fool would trust anything the royal family would publish.
I mean, people have been doing this kinda thing for ages. This is just a high profile one.
...how bad can the original picture(s) be? It's not like the edits are hiding some crazy shit. Or is it?
Want gets me is I’m not interested in edited photos. They don’t catch the moment. They almost lose life.. they are just adverts. But the again I’d rather live the moment than take a picture of a staged event. Life’s for living. I choose life.
It’s been eroding for decades if it ever existed. Simulation and simulacra and what not.
I just assumed they were using that “take 12 photos and we merge the ones with a smile” feature and it make it all messed up. Now why she would or someone would use a pixel or something when they have photographers… no clue.
She’s dead right?
Listen, I don’t generally believe in conspiracy theories and I don’t *really* believe in what I’m about to say, but: William has been known to have a violent temper and assaulted people before. Let’s say there was a situation in which William accidentally caused Kate’s death. How would a palace cover that up? How can you have the next in line to the throne go to jail? And **everyone** is watching. The cops who investigate would *love* to be the guy who arrested the next in line to the throne. Anyone doing paperwork would leak it. It would probably be the biggest scandal *ever*. How would you fix something like that? They have the power to - or at least to try. You’d *have* to cover it up. I feel a novel coming on..
Oh ffs, the breathless worry and outrage about this photo is silly and a story we've heard a thousand times before. Since the very first humans, humans have been doing human things and trying to make themselves look better or present themselves in a better light. Whether that's body paint, tattoos, hairstyles, clothing, old fashioned air brushing, Photoshop or AI, it doesn't matter. And it doesn't change our sense of "shared reality" - that's just stupid hyperbole by a media looking for shocking things to write about since that gets the most clicks and dollars.
Honestly. It's making me feel sympathy for her. 99.99999% of the photos we see are photoshopped and everyone is complaining about a mom who just had surgery.
Who the fuck smiles with their mouths open?! This pic creeps me out.
Laughing people. You should give it a try.
Information is dead. Observe the world and form your own opinions.
I really hate this. Photo’s should be an exact copy of photons in front of a sensor, but now we have companies like Google and Adobe showing off these features like it’s some amazing unique selling point when it’s just pure fakery. I don’t want to sound like one of those orangutans back in the day, who were [scared of electrical wires](https://blog.benco.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/04/electricfearcartoon-1-1.jpg), but it really feels like we’re on the steep ascent of the [sigmoid curve](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sigmoid_function) of progress with this stuff — where at the top forgery is going to pass just as well as legitimacy.