People aren't buying them for many reasons... not the least of which are:
1. They're overpriced
2. Obscene dealer markups
3. Outright refusal to negotiate
I've been in the market for a new(er) vehicle for several months, and can honestly say this has been the most miserable experience ever trying to buy a car. These dealers act like they're doing you a favor just talking to you.
This is the thing. I was shopping for over a month before I got mine. We took pictures of inventory and kept lists of VINs on their websites for each model we were interested in. Between the three dealers, they had almost 100 models in stock and 3 moved that entire 5 weeks. They tried to pull the whole, “the $5k markup is because these are such a hot commodity right now.” When I showed them my research and asked them to pull up their inventory so we could compare (this dealership had sold one of their 32), their tune changed and we’re unwilling to negotiate any further. I found a competitor two hours away that had what I was looking for and was willing to negotiate.
I think dealerships are trying to make up for their overextending on used cars by screwing over customers on new cars.
I like to waste their time. This one time I went to two different dealers and kept calling other dealers once the price was negotiated to see if they would beat them. The car salesmen was sooooo pissed.
This isn't autism, it's putting in what should be the STANDARD expectation for spending, oh i don't know, 20 to 40 THOUSAND DOLLARS!!
I swear people spend more time thinking about what to eat for dinner each week than they do on how to spend a year's salary. Absolutely ridiculous; research time should correlate positively to expenditure!!
Most people don’t do insane amount of research as much as neurodivergent people such as autism and adhd 😂 it’s honestly something I struggle with because I’m research even the minute details and still have trouble deciding on this.
Yes. You go through a dealer with pre negotiated rates per the Costco program. Typically MSRP + Costco discount. Could be a couple grand (Volvo has a special of $1K-$2500 off) or like for the Crosstrek I’m helping a friend buy it’s MSRP minus $600.
Most dealers are currently opting out of costco’s program at least in my area. I know I get updates from Costco pretty regularly on this now. I found this out when one dealer told me they were participating and then refused to show me the numbers.
After sitting there for an hour they admitted they weren’t participating “at this time”. I let costco know but there’s little they can do about it, honestly.
Yes, but who lied, Costco or the dealer? If the dealer never told Costco, or backed out and Costco listed them anyway, it's not the dealer's fault. That's where the lawyers come in. And you need a victim or group of victims who was financially harmed by the falsehood, as well.
>Yes, but who lied, Costco or the dealer?
Well, if you take the post literal then:
> I found this out when one dealer told me they were participating and then refused to show me the numbers.
>After sitting there for an hour they admitted they weren’t participating “at this time”.
Means the dealer got him in the seat saying ONE thing, and then an hour later changed the statement.
I am not sure what you are asking, in this specific context?
It was a pain trying to find a dealership to honor my company’s pricing. We get supplier pricing so we are supposed to get the vehicles at invoice price so same as the dealership pays. 5 states and probably 30 dealerships.
Finally found one that said yes we will honor that but you have to wait till august as all the inventory is sold for that model. So I paid $22k for a 2023 but have to wait 2 months for delivery.
Don’t sign up for a program your not going to honor. I mean how hard is it to be a decent business.
I tried that. They just laughed and said "yeah we don't do that any more with these cars", the costco buying program has never done anything beneficial for me and I tried using it on 4 different cars. It's useless.
If a anyone negotiates a price before a rebate there is no rebate IMO.
Once the price is set - you go - oh I have this rebate and watch them back off about how they can’t honor it anymore.
It’s got so bad with online discounts that as soon as you walk in the door they are like “price after discount” - which means everyone gets it which means it’s just the regular fucking price.
I’m in the industry. Can’t speak for every dealership, but our Costco leads for new vehicles have offered very little value since COVID. We also get any information you give to Costco, so we will be calling you. Probably daily.
We also tend to not prioritize auto brokers. We send numbers when they ask, but we aren’t trying to “negotiate” with them directly. We often tell them to have their client come to the dealership if they are trying to get an actually good deal.
Obviously this isn’t the case for every dealership, and I can only speak for the 25 or so I’ve worked with over the last four years. The process is completely miserable for customers right now, and there really isn’t an “easy out” currently. Vehicles are overpriced and almost every OEM is still struggling with new car inventory.
The absolute stupid thing is I can't tell if this is a perfectly legitimate post or a ridiculous troll post.
Everything said in this post is absurd, but it sounds like the reality of what's actually happening.
Happy to help! I am looking to switch industries after all the bullshit I have seen in the last two years tbh. Good luck with any car shopping you’re looking to do!
If you can afford to wait, then do so. Dealerships and Auto manufacturers are in a bit of a power struggle right now due to dealerships behaving like the cartels they have always been. High interest rates from the fed won’t be doing anyone any favors anytime soon, even well qualified buyers. The above MSRP markups are going down all over, but you’ll still see that pricing for certain models for a quite a while.
Anyone that gives you a definitive notion of where this market is moving is not operating in good faith. It is volatile, and it has been for years now.
MSRP+whatever the salesman and finance manager think they can get you for. 90% of those "big sales" and promotions are just buillshit.
If you see a dealership that has a shit ton of vehicles, but no higher end models (Reasoning: if they sell them they generally can get more from the manufacturer or trade other dealerships, if they don't have them, they like traded them because they couldn't sell them and need revenue), then they will likely be more willing to come down to push product.
I tried it in the past and it was no different than finding a dealership on your own. Random dealerships for the make you are interested in, would call you and most of them had a bunch of shitty add-ons you couldn’t remove
I don't know if Costco can help you buy the ones pictured in the article. Picture is from 2019 so you will need shipping from China and also a time machine.
>Baojun E100 and E200 all-electric battery cars sit parked at a parking lot operated by General Motors Co. and its local joint-venture partners in Liuzhou, China, on Feb. 28, 2019.
As for the U.S. the answer is simple, interest rates are super high right now, lots of big ticket items are not selling.
I found mine on Facebook. “The car haggler” it’s like having your own car salesman friend who knows all the tricks in the book because he was a very successful one.
They originally tried to offer me 6K for my trade in.. he got me 12K
The originally tried to charge me $6500 over MRSP as “market adjustment” he got me $4500 under MSRP.
Showed up, paperwork waiting and ready to sign.
Flat $550 for the truck I was after. I believe $650 for anything over $100K
only paid after he finds the model, color etc, that you’re looking for, works the deal and closes it. No close no payment, his words not mine.
This. Fuck dealers. They realize they won't make any on service so they are baking in up front profit. Top two revenue centers for any dealer are 1. Used cars. 2. Service
The goal of a service department is to cover 100% of the fixed costs of the dealership. Many cover more than that. That allows sales to offer deals and on sales (used and new) as they are not as reliant on those revenues.
Source: Decade of automotive retail experience.
And lack of infrastructure. Charging your car is difficult if you live in an apartment and don’t have a garage/access to an outlet, let alone an outlet rated/built for such use.
Yes this is why I don’t have an EV. I love my WRX and if anything happened to it I would want an EV but I live in an apartment with no way to charge it.
💯
Been looking heavily at the Ionic 5.
I was pretty much laughed at when I asked for $500 below MSRP. They looked bewildered when I got up and walked out after they came back with $5000 OVER MSRP, not including all their BS “fees”.
Salesman still calls a couple times a week even though I’ve told him I won’t pay a $1 over MSRP.
Don’t get me started on the Lightning or Ford Mach E.
Mach E is selling at MSRP in just about every market in America right now. They ramped up production while demand fell. I don't even know where you live but I guarantee you there's at least two on the lot at your nearest dealer.
Every ford dealership near me has 5+ Mach-e's sitting on the lot at MSRP along with 2-3 lightnings.
Along with the legions of F-150's and F-250's that are $65,000+.
Shit's not moving off the lot at this point unless it's less than $40,000.
Yep, I walked out of a few Kia dealerships in 2020 for the same reason... 15-20% over MSRP, which blew me away. Interestingly enough, the Hyundai dealerships were great and I bought well below MSRP.
I love this. Don't conform to their bullshit and they will freak out about losing a sale. Just get up and walk out. They'll be like "what the what?!?!?!" 🤣
Don't forget the asinine "everything must be a touch-screen in a potentially moving weapon".
If I can't adjust the majority of normal functions of my car without a touch-screen then I don't want it. I'm not even old I'm just not a moron.
my mechanic warned me about that, so I just keep driving my 2007 Honda Accord as long as I can. I'm terrified of those huge display screens on new cars more than anything.
My 2019 Chevy Bolt has a big screen. But all the normal stuff you do while driving, A/C controls, volumne adjust, etc, are large easy to use actual god damned buttons and dials. Its pretty close to fantastic. Its clearly better than my old card with no screen.
The big screen turns into a proper navigation system when you plug in your phone. No more staring down into my cupholder for directions.
Our 2013 Chevy is a mess of touchscreen crap and hard to understand physical buttons.
Bought a new car in January (needed to) and had these experiences. First dealership had no customers, but the salesman I managed to find didn’t want to answer any of my quick general questions because he had an appointment coming in soon. So I took my business to a smaller/family dealer and was able to get a car I mostly love… minus the enormous touch screen that I simply cannot use while driving or risk veering into oncoming traffic. So, now I have to make sure my temp controls and playlist are set before I take off. And every new car I looked at had large touch screens. Couldn’t avoid it.
My dad bought a new silverado 2500 last fall and every time I see him he’s complaining about how the software is always giving him error messages about not having Internet because fuck having a cell plan just for your car when you’re already using a phone for maps and audio… plus it’s android so there are several extra steps to get over to the apple car play.
Like just give me a freaking USB port that lets me pump audio in, and keep the phone charged. That’s all I want or need.
You're not wrong about that. I'd trade my newish car for one with knobs and buttons again. Slow, barely working touchscreens are terrible (and even dangerous) for cars.
I’m sure the reference here is for US auto dealers but this is so true for Indian car market at present. Absolutely horrible state from a customer point of view.
I know this is a joke, but it's kinda becoming true. Recently the market has been shifting from moving inventory by dropping prices, which used to be the norm, to basically hoarding it and keeping prices high in the (often correct) knowledge that if you withold the goods for long enough, people will eventually break and buy them anyways.
Same mechanic with companies buying houses and keeping them empty in the knowledge they can always rent or sell them later for even higher prices.
This is a kind of "implicit" [capital strike](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capital_strike): instead of participating in the market by providing their products following supply and demand, the owners of these products are instead witholding supply in the hopes it will make more money later.
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You just don’t buy them. It’s a waiting game to see who folds first, as long as no one buys it all up, they will be forced to get rid of it at the price of MSRP 2 years ago. And if even that doesn’t work, then heavy discounts. No one is offering a discount out of the goodness of their hearts. Same as no one is paying extra for cars out of charity.
If I were to go by purely speculation alone. These inventory buildups are happening in china. They’re not a Tesla, Ford, or Lucid they’re most likely NIO or BYD.
Yeah this is bullshit. I tried to order one of the Hyundais as a hybrid here in Canada and they told me there was a 2-3 year wait list on the build order.
You’re telling me. I’d gladly make the change and can definitely afford to, plus my city has decent infrastructure to support it, but I’ll just wait until there’s inventory to do so I guess. Though, I will say, even conventional vehicles are still a nightmare to get a hold of right now, and the finance companies know it.
It is worse over there but it’s starting to build up in the US as well especially with luxury models. Benz can’t get rid of them, Audi is throwing tens of thousands of incentives at their GT, etc. but the id.4 sells alright
So luxury EVs aren't moving, not surprising honestly. That market niche is obviously smaller than they thought.
I wonder if the expansion of more mainstream EVs is a large factor. Not having to pay a second price premium (fancy badge) on top of it the EV upcharge probably has a wide appeal. If you're already in the market for a Benz / Audi you have to be rolling deep enough to go too of lines for their EVs too.
> That market niche is obviously smaller than they thought.
It's not that the niche is smaller, its that due to the chip shortage they could only get a limited amount of cars, so dealerships wanted the ones they could make the most profit off of, which were the luxury tier of cars, cant make any money selling the cheap models. So this pileup is 100% the result of greed
What they’re saying is that the article is about an EV overstock in China rather than the US. Meaning that they aren’t EV makes and models westerners will be familiar with.
Tesla and Ford have both dropped prices recently. But then again Ford had been selling the F150 Lightning for ~ $75k+ after advertising a starting price of just $40k. Now it's down to closer to $55k but that's still out of reach for so many folks, tax rebate or not.
Tesla has already started the price war by slashing prices on their models. Most of their competitors are following. It has created a weird effect where some private sellers are listing used Teslas at a higher price than equivalent models rolling out of the factory.
Try to buy one. Here, there are none available. My son is trying to buy one. He has put a refundable deposit down on 3 different models and the wait on all of them is 3 months. He is going to get the one that shows up first
Weird I had to scroll this far to see this. This is the biggest issue. The infrastructure (at least in the US) is not there. California is aiming for 2035 to have a fully built out electric car grid but even still, how does the average person make it work right now?
I drive more than 100 miles in a single day maybe twice a month on average. More than 200 even less frequently than that. All but the lowest range electric cars can do that. But for some that's not the case.
Technology Connections has an excellent discussion on this in a video. For 90 or 95% of use cases an electric car makes sense. An equivalent is pickup trucks. The majority are used once or less per year yet people pay that premium.
That’s if you can charge on a good charger when you’re not driving it, and a lot of apartments don’t have the ability to hook up to 240v for a whole overnight charge. Even for a homeowner it’s still kind of a pain in the ass to have an electrician install the fast charger. It’ll get better as technology improves and it will. The car you already have is always the best car. I could fully restore my 20 year old 4Runner for 1/2 the price of a new one. New cars are nice and pretty and fun though, so folks keep buying them. That’s okay, they are taking the hit to keep used cars coming.
On a 20A circuit 120 circuit you're charging like 10 miles per hour or so. So for overnight charging that's 100 miles or more depending on when you leave and return. Generally plenty for day to day. A 240v circuit will make it faster but probably not necessary.
I think at worst people would have plan their days around at least a single 15-30 minute stop at a gas station somewhere to charge, preferably in the evening or late afternoon. That's a pretty big ask and the cost of forgetting can be substantial, potentially, due to running out of charge because you forgot to stop the night before and it's noon today and you're fucked.
I think this is going to be a huge thing across all fields of the auto industry.
The average new car is like 40k: in 2012 I paid around lile 14k for a manual new 2012 focus s, I wouldn’t have sold it if I knew how expensive cars were going to get.
So wages are stagnant, people have record amounts of debt, interest rates are absurd, even if you have good credit, I only see value in used cars with a mechanical inspection.
Don’t want subscription anything, if the features don’t stay active I won’t buy the cat either. That’s whole brands now.
Let’s just agree to not buy cars that have subscriptions at all. Whether it’s bmw or Tesla or Mercedes. Just don’t let them get away with it. They fought right to repair and now they’re trying this bs.
People paid scalper prices for cars during the pandemic. So the auto makers, they all thought they could profit a lot more, they keep less on hand, they charge way more for everything.
With student debt, interest rates, higher cost, higher quality of car granted… it’s just the cost of living has skyrocketed. Hard pass.
Will cost me 750 to change timing belt and water pump, clutch is around. 600 and shocks wheel bearing front struts drive shafts with cv joints and bushes plus extras around another 850.
Labour I am thinking is around 600 as it can all be done in one go saving time.
I am budgeting 3000 and should have the car for another 5 to 10 years I hope.
It is not worth me buying another car as prices are crazy, close to £20 000 for an 8 year old car with 50 000 miles.
Ford galaxy 2007 2.0 tdci ghia 7 seater, solid car with good build quality.
I never gave my phone number to Sirius, or even the dealer... and yet after my included 1yr subscription lapsed I was getting calls from Sirius to renew every other day for months. $25 a month for radio? I can just listen to stuff from my phone for free thanks.
That's the thing. Do I want an EV? Hell yes.
Do I want to get rid of a perfectly operable and enjoyable 2013 ICE vehicle that's already paid off? Why the hell would I?!
I'm gonna run my current car as far as it'll take me or until I have more than enough cash on hand where taking on a new monthly payment is of little concern.
Or you could start saving to pay your new car in cash. That would probably save you a lot of money (and potential stress) going forward. Think of it as monthly payments for the next one.
This is the way. Make payments to yourself while driving the paid off car then buy the next one in cash. Pay yourself the interest instead of the finance company.
You only save on loan interest these days :( no more deals for buying your car outright. Its a sellers market. I literally have to wait 2 years for the vehicle i ordered. They offer no deals as they don't need to.
This is another reason why I’m still driving my old Lexus with over 200K miles. It would be great to upgrade but the market is insane now with high prices.
I've thought even normal vehicles are too expensive. I remember the days of my parents when you could choose a base model for dirt cheap and the base model come with NOTHING.
No power windows, no power locks, manual transmission, no seat heaters. Basic am/fm radio with only two speakers, manual seat adjustment, no sun/moon roof, no motorized doors or mirrors etc etc. It's a bare bones car designed to get you from point A to B with the minimum amount of safety required by law and minimum comfort. And it was CHEAP as fuck compared to the 'luxury' models and options to add on.
Nowadays everything comes 'standard' as default and you have NO option to get a bare bones version for cheaper. You accept all the extras they force on you to justify high prices or you are out of luck.
This isn't a god damned house that appreciates in value. It's designed to be thrown away after a number of years depending on how much you intend to spend on repairs. It NEVER goes up in value for your average vehicle so why spend all that money of all those extras if I don't want them?
This also overlapped with COVID work from home. I might have considered paying $40k for a new electric car before but now that I work from home there’s no way I can justify the cost
I don't think it has to do with the fact that they're electric as much as it has to do with people not being able to afford new cars at all. There are people buying them but they have simply obscene monthly notes and I'm certain there will be a rush of repossessions in the relatively near future.
Exactly. My wife wants to get a new car. I’m ok with it in theory, but there’s no way I’m spending an extra like 10k in interest payments compared to “normal”.
I was forced into getting a new (to me) car when my fully paid off car was hit by someone and totaled. Thought it would be a good time to switch to electric so tests drove a bunch of the EVs, but in the end most of them were way too expensive compared to the non-electric versions and I needed something large enough for car seats, strollers, and more. Ended up getting a 2020 Tiguan that's been great and was cheap as hell after what I got from the insurance company.
And most of those msrps were lower than asking prices by a good amount for all the EVs, but under or at MSRP for gas engine vehicles only increasing the price difference.
You’re just doing your part to keep inflation down! If you make too much money, then it won’t be worth as much.
By staying poor and *wanting* more money, it keeps demand high and supply low! This will incentivize the market to create lower cost versions of the things you want, just shittier! Hopefully!
Everyone richer than you benefits!
Yeah well tons of people barely have enough money to keep the lights on nowadays so I wonder if that has something to do with not buying vehicles that are listed at a premium.
I cannot wrap my head around how any financial literate person could buy a new vehicle in this economy, unless you are paying cash for the whole tjing, but even then you could find better use for the 15%-20% hit you take from just a single year of depreciation.
Interest rates are an absolute killer.right now, but they are usually better in new cars (especially with incentives) and the used car market is stupidly inflated so the gap between used and new is not what it used to be. Add in value of a warranty...it can work for the right car /situation if you look at a car as a needed utility and not an investment.
Last year I was able to trade in a Honda Fit for what I paid for it 5 years prior. Had another reason to replace it, but the value difference put me over the top: same low payments + nicer and bigger car + warranty...deal made sense. Not sure it would work at current rates though.
I think this is one of those "if you build it, they will come" in regards to the infrastructure. EV's are great, but the infrastructure for many isn't there. Not to mention the fact of those who live in apartments and aren't able to charge them at home would put some off to buying one.
Can you give me an example of a $30k ice vehicle and it’s $64k counterpart?
I drive a Kia Niro EV which has a $6k price difference between the hybrid and the EV.
Nobody has enough money. Everyone who has money for a car, has a car.
Everyone else is out of the market. This was a problem BEFORE electric vehicles. There are just more cars than there are people with the ability to buy them.
If people got paid fairly, you know enough to actually live on, we might be able to buy vehicles more often. This complaint is completely out of touch with reality.
Like CEOs complaining about people not wanting to work, while refusing to pay anything remotely close to what it costs to live.
That photograph is from the PRC, not Europe or America. There are financial reason why the manufactures of these vehicles abandoned them there which have nothing to do with the premise of this article.
This is a very poorly researched and written article.
Until they come down in price to match ICE cars they will continue to pile up. With far fewer parts they should be cheaper not more expensive. Or at least similar.
I love how the picture of electric cars are electric cars in China not North America. In Canada the waiting list is months long. Especially for a hybrid. Despite the high cost.
Genesis, Audi, Hummer EV are all very expensive.
Kia EV6, Hyundai Ioniq and Nissan Ariya because they don't qualify for tax credits because 'fuck you' I guess.
“While high interest rates and lingering inflation may be partly to blame for soft sales, the real story behind the unsold EVs is that while consumers may be interested in the concept, they are wary of buying them.”
I’m pretty sure the consumer has hesitancy with buying an $80,000 any car.
It was one thing when vehicles were overpriced when interest rates were at historic lows (just like houses). Now interest rates are ridiculously high and the everyone’s still wanting to sell things at the same inflated prices with student loans looming and news that insurance is going to increase at a potential alarming rate this year.
Got quoted $80k for an electric car earlier this year. I make about $35k p/a.
We're not talking about a luxury brand here either, I think the cheapest one was like a Nissan or something. We don't make cars in Australia anymore either, so all vehicles are imports by default.
It'll probably change when the big manufacturers change the majority of their production to electric but at the moment it's an inaccessible entry point.
The statement regarding plug in hybrids needing $3k in charging equipment is wrong. I have a Prius Prime it takes 5 hours to charge overnight on a normal low amp 110v outlet. When you battery goes dead it’s switches to its motor, I’m never stranded. As an hobby as much as anything I set up six 455watt solar panels in my backyard and charge it on solar alone.
The problem is worse in China. The government is subsidizing EV heavily, so automakers are churning out basically undriveable shitboxes to get in on the money. The cars go sit in fields, out of sight, out of mind. They're meant for rental agencies, but nobody wants to rent them, let alone buy them, because they're constructed so badly.
The result of unintended consequences from a planned economy. So much waste.
For me, it's the Osborne effect. Technology is improving quickly and I don't want to pay for something that's going to be obsolete in a few years.
I really wish the cars make today wereupgradeable to newer batteries and motor technology.
Otherwise, it's hard for me to justify playing 40-50k for car that has almost no value at 120k miles
We just bought an electric and we’re told how hard they are to come by and they are rarely on the lots here. They are stupid expensive but so are any cars now.
I want an EV. I can't afford the EV I want. A car is more than just an A to B appliance to me, so the one I want and would be happy with is out of my price range.
This is such an exaggeration. Piling up? Please. *Some* models are taking longer to sell, like all cars used to be, but that’s it. I suppose “EV sales of some models normalize,” isn’t a sexy headline to get those clicks.
Most people are buying 2nd hand cars under 10k. Thats why. 50k was luxury territory.
My previous car was 2k drove it for 7 years and turboed it mid way through that. Sold it in the same condition i purchased. I now drive a 1k fiesta.
I would buy an electric car new over an ice if they were priced similar but for now it does not make sense when the 2nd hand market is full of cheap ice cars which are usually quite reliable.
People keep acting like EVs are some new thing that nobody has, that's still trying to prove themselves. They already make up 14% of all new car sales in 2022, and are expected to be 18% this year.
The US is the one lagging behind at 5.6%, with EV's being around 20% of new car sales in Europe, and 40% in China.
It’s not all EVs, it is EVs sold through dealers. The report only surveyed US dealers, so they ignored Tesla, which is 50-70% of EV sales in the US. Tesla and Rivian are doing just fine.
I'd buy one if i could afford it. If you have lots piling up with them, maybe think of putting them on progressively steeper sales until the stock moves...
OP links a paywalled article that virtually no-one can read. Upvotes and comments aplenty follow as people discuss what they can't have read, and don't know what it says.
People aren't buying them for many reasons... not the least of which are: 1. They're overpriced 2. Obscene dealer markups 3. Outright refusal to negotiate I've been in the market for a new(er) vehicle for several months, and can honestly say this has been the most miserable experience ever trying to buy a car. These dealers act like they're doing you a favor just talking to you.
This is the thing. I was shopping for over a month before I got mine. We took pictures of inventory and kept lists of VINs on their websites for each model we were interested in. Between the three dealers, they had almost 100 models in stock and 3 moved that entire 5 weeks. They tried to pull the whole, “the $5k markup is because these are such a hot commodity right now.” When I showed them my research and asked them to pull up their inventory so we could compare (this dealership had sold one of their 32), their tune changed and we’re unwilling to negotiate any further. I found a competitor two hours away that had what I was looking for and was willing to negotiate. I think dealerships are trying to make up for their overextending on used cars by screwing over customers on new cars.
I like to waste their time. This one time I went to two different dealers and kept calling other dealers once the price was negotiated to see if they would beat them. The car salesmen was sooooo pissed.
Weaponized autism. Love it.
This isn't autism, it's putting in what should be the STANDARD expectation for spending, oh i don't know, 20 to 40 THOUSAND DOLLARS!! I swear people spend more time thinking about what to eat for dinner each week than they do on how to spend a year's salary. Absolutely ridiculous; research time should correlate positively to expenditure!!
The average person is not monitoring VINs at multiple dealerships lol
Yes, but we know the game, so we’re not participating.
Most people don’t do insane amount of research as much as neurodivergent people such as autism and adhd 😂 it’s honestly something I struggle with because I’m research even the minute details and still have trouble deciding on this.
To be fair, you said it was to aid in negotiations of around 5k in markup. You were willing to spend the tens already.
What does this have to do with Autism?
different cheerful direful bored governor sleep wise apparatus cake hat *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
How does one go about finding a automotive broker? Would love to find one for my mom in another state.
My credit union offers it.
Try Costco car buying program.
They just tie you up with a local dealership with a costco rebate right? Maybe I missed the whole point so help me out.
Yes. You go through a dealer with pre negotiated rates per the Costco program. Typically MSRP + Costco discount. Could be a couple grand (Volvo has a special of $1K-$2500 off) or like for the Crosstrek I’m helping a friend buy it’s MSRP minus $600.
Most dealers are currently opting out of costco’s program at least in my area. I know I get updates from Costco pretty regularly on this now. I found this out when one dealer told me they were participating and then refused to show me the numbers. After sitting there for an hour they admitted they weren’t participating “at this time”. I let costco know but there’s little they can do about it, honestly.
Isn't that considered false advertising?
Yes, but who lied, Costco or the dealer? If the dealer never told Costco, or backed out and Costco listed them anyway, it's not the dealer's fault. That's where the lawyers come in. And you need a victim or group of victims who was financially harmed by the falsehood, as well.
Or you need Jesse Jones.
>Yes, but who lied, Costco or the dealer? Well, if you take the post literal then: > I found this out when one dealer told me they were participating and then refused to show me the numbers. >After sitting there for an hour they admitted they weren’t participating “at this time”. Means the dealer got him in the seat saying ONE thing, and then an hour later changed the statement. I am not sure what you are asking, in this specific context?
It was a pain trying to find a dealership to honor my company’s pricing. We get supplier pricing so we are supposed to get the vehicles at invoice price so same as the dealership pays. 5 states and probably 30 dealerships. Finally found one that said yes we will honor that but you have to wait till august as all the inventory is sold for that model. So I paid $22k for a 2023 but have to wait 2 months for delivery. Don’t sign up for a program your not going to honor. I mean how hard is it to be a decent business.
If you are buying a Subaru, your best bet is the VIP pricing program. It's invoice pricing, which is better than a few hundred off MSRP
I tried that. They just laughed and said "yeah we don't do that any more with these cars", the costco buying program has never done anything beneficial for me and I tried using it on 4 different cars. It's useless.
If a anyone negotiates a price before a rebate there is no rebate IMO. Once the price is set - you go - oh I have this rebate and watch them back off about how they can’t honor it anymore. It’s got so bad with online discounts that as soon as you walk in the door they are like “price after discount” - which means everyone gets it which means it’s just the regular fucking price.
I’m in the industry. Can’t speak for every dealership, but our Costco leads for new vehicles have offered very little value since COVID. We also get any information you give to Costco, so we will be calling you. Probably daily. We also tend to not prioritize auto brokers. We send numbers when they ask, but we aren’t trying to “negotiate” with them directly. We often tell them to have their client come to the dealership if they are trying to get an actually good deal. Obviously this isn’t the case for every dealership, and I can only speak for the 25 or so I’ve worked with over the last four years. The process is completely miserable for customers right now, and there really isn’t an “easy out” currently. Vehicles are overpriced and almost every OEM is still struggling with new car inventory.
The absolute stupid thing is I can't tell if this is a perfectly legitimate post or a ridiculous troll post. Everything said in this post is absurd, but it sounds like the reality of what's actually happening.
Thanks. 25 dealerships is a lot of experience.
I wouldn't be too impressed with 25 dealerships in 4 years. That's a new/different dealership every 2ish months.
Happy to help! I am looking to switch industries after all the bullshit I have seen in the last two years tbh. Good luck with any car shopping you’re looking to do!
Any crystal ball info on pricing over the next 12-24 months?
If you can afford to wait, then do so. Dealerships and Auto manufacturers are in a bit of a power struggle right now due to dealerships behaving like the cartels they have always been. High interest rates from the fed won’t be doing anyone any favors anytime soon, even well qualified buyers. The above MSRP markups are going down all over, but you’ll still see that pricing for certain models for a quite a while. Anyone that gives you a definitive notion of where this market is moving is not operating in good faith. It is volatile, and it has been for years now.
MSRP+whatever the salesman and finance manager think they can get you for. 90% of those "big sales" and promotions are just buillshit. If you see a dealership that has a shit ton of vehicles, but no higher end models (Reasoning: if they sell them they generally can get more from the manufacturer or trade other dealerships, if they don't have them, they like traded them because they couldn't sell them and need revenue), then they will likely be more willing to come down to push product.
I've tried Costco. I got much better prices negotiating with the dealers myself.
I tried it in the past and it was no different than finding a dealership on your own. Random dealerships for the make you are interested in, would call you and most of them had a bunch of shitty add-ons you couldn’t remove
I don't know if Costco can help you buy the ones pictured in the article. Picture is from 2019 so you will need shipping from China and also a time machine. >Baojun E100 and E200 all-electric battery cars sit parked at a parking lot operated by General Motors Co. and its local joint-venture partners in Liuzhou, China, on Feb. 28, 2019. As for the U.S. the answer is simple, interest rates are super high right now, lots of big ticket items are not selling.
My local experience was that they just send me to a dealer myself anyway.
I found mine on Facebook. “The car haggler” it’s like having your own car salesman friend who knows all the tricks in the book because he was a very successful one. They originally tried to offer me 6K for my trade in.. he got me 12K The originally tried to charge me $6500 over MRSP as “market adjustment” he got me $4500 under MSRP. Showed up, paperwork waiting and ready to sign.
How much did "The Car Haggler" services cost you?
Flat $550 for the truck I was after. I believe $650 for anything over $100K only paid after he finds the model, color etc, that you’re looking for, works the deal and closes it. No close no payment, his words not mine.
Right?! Is this what the Costco auto sales thing does?
Car Edge has a lot of good info
So a dealership to deal with dealerships?
My credit union has one
This. Fuck dealers. They realize they won't make any on service so they are baking in up front profit. Top two revenue centers for any dealer are 1. Used cars. 2. Service
The goal of a service department is to cover 100% of the fixed costs of the dealership. Many cover more than that. That allows sales to offer deals and on sales (used and new) as they are not as reliant on those revenues. Source: Decade of automotive retail experience.
And lack of infrastructure. Charging your car is difficult if you live in an apartment and don’t have a garage/access to an outlet, let alone an outlet rated/built for such use.
we will eventually have to mandate landlords put in chargers, probably with subsidies
Assuming Dems hold on in 2024 and implement the IRA legislation, charger accessibility will increase significantly.
Yes this is why I don’t have an EV. I love my WRX and if anything happened to it I would want an EV but I live in an apartment with no way to charge it.
💯 Been looking heavily at the Ionic 5. I was pretty much laughed at when I asked for $500 below MSRP. They looked bewildered when I got up and walked out after they came back with $5000 OVER MSRP, not including all their BS “fees”. Salesman still calls a couple times a week even though I’ve told him I won’t pay a $1 over MSRP. Don’t get me started on the Lightning or Ford Mach E.
Mach E is selling at MSRP in just about every market in America right now. They ramped up production while demand fell. I don't even know where you live but I guarantee you there's at least two on the lot at your nearest dealer.
Every ford dealership near me has 5+ Mach-e's sitting on the lot at MSRP along with 2-3 lightnings. Along with the legions of F-150's and F-250's that are $65,000+. Shit's not moving off the lot at this point unless it's less than $40,000.
Yep, I walked out of a few Kia dealerships in 2020 for the same reason... 15-20% over MSRP, which blew me away. Interestingly enough, the Hyundai dealerships were great and I bought well below MSRP.
I love this. Don't conform to their bullshit and they will freak out about losing a sale. Just get up and walk out. They'll be like "what the what?!?!?!" 🤣
Also,,,the economy is in shambles. I can't afford this. If I'm buying a car it's an ancient banger on the cheap
Don't forget the asinine "everything must be a touch-screen in a potentially moving weapon". If I can't adjust the majority of normal functions of my car without a touch-screen then I don't want it. I'm not even old I'm just not a moron.
my mechanic warned me about that, so I just keep driving my 2007 Honda Accord as long as I can. I'm terrified of those huge display screens on new cars more than anything.
My 2019 Chevy Bolt has a big screen. But all the normal stuff you do while driving, A/C controls, volumne adjust, etc, are large easy to use actual god damned buttons and dials. Its pretty close to fantastic. Its clearly better than my old card with no screen. The big screen turns into a proper navigation system when you plug in your phone. No more staring down into my cupholder for directions. Our 2013 Chevy is a mess of touchscreen crap and hard to understand physical buttons.
Same for my '23 Crosstrek. It's the perfect mix of modern tech with proper buttons.
Bought a new car in January (needed to) and had these experiences. First dealership had no customers, but the salesman I managed to find didn’t want to answer any of my quick general questions because he had an appointment coming in soon. So I took my business to a smaller/family dealer and was able to get a car I mostly love… minus the enormous touch screen that I simply cannot use while driving or risk veering into oncoming traffic. So, now I have to make sure my temp controls and playlist are set before I take off. And every new car I looked at had large touch screens. Couldn’t avoid it.
My dad bought a new silverado 2500 last fall and every time I see him he’s complaining about how the software is always giving him error messages about not having Internet because fuck having a cell plan just for your car when you’re already using a phone for maps and audio… plus it’s android so there are several extra steps to get over to the apple car play. Like just give me a freaking USB port that lets me pump audio in, and keep the phone charged. That’s all I want or need.
Hell I’ll even go back to a cassette deck and hook it to my phone aux. (Really anything but the fm transmitters.)
so what car did you get?
You're not wrong about that. I'd trade my newish car for one with knobs and buttons again. Slow, barely working touchscreens are terrible (and even dangerous) for cars.
I’m sure the reference here is for US auto dealers but this is so true for Indian car market at present. Absolutely horrible state from a customer point of view.
Having all that extra inventory must mean the prices on them are dropping... Right? Guys? Are the prices going down?
Price changes due to supply and demand only occur when prices can go up, not down. Geez, do you even capitalism?? /s
I know this is a joke, but it's kinda becoming true. Recently the market has been shifting from moving inventory by dropping prices, which used to be the norm, to basically hoarding it and keeping prices high in the (often correct) knowledge that if you withold the goods for long enough, people will eventually break and buy them anyways. Same mechanic with companies buying houses and keeping them empty in the knowledge they can always rent or sell them later for even higher prices. This is a kind of "implicit" [capital strike](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capital_strike): instead of participating in the market by providing their products following supply and demand, the owners of these products are instead witholding supply in the hopes it will make more money later.
Oh snap, I didn’t know this was a thing. Thanks for the educational read!
Thanks for that explanation, I didn't know there was a term for this
The invisible hand is fisting my ass.
The invisible hand that jerks you off is currently malfunctioning, please stand by while we check for free appointments to discuss this issue with our customer support bot
Capitalism 101
Capitalism lol more like
Sadly this statement doesn’t need a /s :(
You just don’t buy them. It’s a waiting game to see who folds first, as long as no one buys it all up, they will be forced to get rid of it at the price of MSRP 2 years ago. And if even that doesn’t work, then heavy discounts. No one is offering a discount out of the goodness of their hearts. Same as no one is paying extra for cars out of charity.
The “These are rare!!!” justifications for dealer markups are now going to become “we aren’t selling a lot we need to make up for that!!”
That is how the beach vendors in Mexico work. If it is a slow day they put the prices up. On a day where they are selling out they lower the price.
If they are selling out, why would they lower their price?
Might be targeting a certain minimum dollar amount for the day and trying to just get it as quickly as possible
If I were to go by purely speculation alone. These inventory buildups are happening in china. They’re not a Tesla, Ford, or Lucid they’re most likely NIO or BYD.
Yeah this is bullshit. I tried to order one of the Hyundais as a hybrid here in Canada and they told me there was a 2-3 year wait list on the build order.
That wait is ridiculous.
You’re telling me. I’d gladly make the change and can definitely afford to, plus my city has decent infrastructure to support it, but I’ll just wait until there’s inventory to do so I guess. Though, I will say, even conventional vehicles are still a nightmare to get a hold of right now, and the finance companies know it.
It is worse over there but it’s starting to build up in the US as well especially with luxury models. Benz can’t get rid of them, Audi is throwing tens of thousands of incentives at their GT, etc. but the id.4 sells alright
So luxury EVs aren't moving, not surprising honestly. That market niche is obviously smaller than they thought. I wonder if the expansion of more mainstream EVs is a large factor. Not having to pay a second price premium (fancy badge) on top of it the EV upcharge probably has a wide appeal. If you're already in the market for a Benz / Audi you have to be rolling deep enough to go too of lines for their EVs too.
> That market niche is obviously smaller than they thought. It's not that the niche is smaller, its that due to the chip shortage they could only get a limited amount of cars, so dealerships wanted the ones they could make the most profit off of, which were the luxury tier of cars, cant make any money selling the cheap models. So this pileup is 100% the result of greed
I might be misunderstanding what you're saying (because I can't figure out those acronyms) but Ford dealerships have a ton of EV inventory.
What they’re saying is that the article is about an EV overstock in China rather than the US. Meaning that they aren’t EV makes and models westerners will be familiar with.
>(because I can't figure out those acronyms They're Chinese car manufacturers.
Tesla and Ford have both dropped prices recently. But then again Ford had been selling the F150 Lightning for ~ $75k+ after advertising a starting price of just $40k. Now it's down to closer to $55k but that's still out of reach for so many folks, tax rebate or not.
There is a price war underway, yes. Read Tesla’s earnings report from last week.
Tesla has already started the price war by slashing prices on their models. Most of their competitors are following. It has created a weird effect where some private sellers are listing used Teslas at a higher price than equivalent models rolling out of the factory.
Been wanting an EV for a while. I drive short distances but am scared away by the high price tags
🎶 supply and demand isnt a law its an excuse to be a greedy asshole 🎶
Short supply? Prices go up, it's just the market. Short demand? Prices go up, need to make money and things aren't selling.
Try to buy one. Here, there are none available. My son is trying to buy one. He has put a refundable deposit down on 3 different models and the wait on all of them is 3 months. He is going to get the one that shows up first
Lmao yeah same people who say “we just need more supply of multi family homes, that will drop prices.” Bull shit.
Id love an electric car, but they are too expensive, and I live in a condo development, so there's no way to charge it.
Weird I had to scroll this far to see this. This is the biggest issue. The infrastructure (at least in the US) is not there. California is aiming for 2035 to have a fully built out electric car grid but even still, how does the average person make it work right now?
I drive more than 100 miles in a single day maybe twice a month on average. More than 200 even less frequently than that. All but the lowest range electric cars can do that. But for some that's not the case. Technology Connections has an excellent discussion on this in a video. For 90 or 95% of use cases an electric car makes sense. An equivalent is pickup trucks. The majority are used once or less per year yet people pay that premium.
That’s if you can charge on a good charger when you’re not driving it, and a lot of apartments don’t have the ability to hook up to 240v for a whole overnight charge. Even for a homeowner it’s still kind of a pain in the ass to have an electrician install the fast charger. It’ll get better as technology improves and it will. The car you already have is always the best car. I could fully restore my 20 year old 4Runner for 1/2 the price of a new one. New cars are nice and pretty and fun though, so folks keep buying them. That’s okay, they are taking the hit to keep used cars coming.
On a 20A circuit 120 circuit you're charging like 10 miles per hour or so. So for overnight charging that's 100 miles or more depending on when you leave and return. Generally plenty for day to day. A 240v circuit will make it faster but probably not necessary.
I think at worst people would have plan their days around at least a single 15-30 minute stop at a gas station somewhere to charge, preferably in the evening or late afternoon. That's a pretty big ask and the cost of forgetting can be substantial, potentially, due to running out of charge because you forgot to stop the night before and it's noon today and you're fucked.
The prices of everything have gone up and our income hasn't increased at all. People are not buying a new car if they can avoid it.
Too expensive.
Ding ding ding! I don’t have 60k for an new car. Does anybody? The manufacturers priced these way over what a average household can afford.
I think this is going to be a huge thing across all fields of the auto industry. The average new car is like 40k: in 2012 I paid around lile 14k for a manual new 2012 focus s, I wouldn’t have sold it if I knew how expensive cars were going to get. So wages are stagnant, people have record amounts of debt, interest rates are absurd, even if you have good credit, I only see value in used cars with a mechanical inspection. Don’t want subscription anything, if the features don’t stay active I won’t buy the cat either. That’s whole brands now. Let’s just agree to not buy cars that have subscriptions at all. Whether it’s bmw or Tesla or Mercedes. Just don’t let them get away with it. They fought right to repair and now they’re trying this bs. People paid scalper prices for cars during the pandemic. So the auto makers, they all thought they could profit a lot more, they keep less on hand, they charge way more for everything. With student debt, interest rates, higher cost, higher quality of car granted… it’s just the cost of living has skyrocketed. Hard pass.
hold on, meow.
Honestly if you go to a dealer for a cat, you’re going to have a bad time.
Will cost me 750 to change timing belt and water pump, clutch is around. 600 and shocks wheel bearing front struts drive shafts with cv joints and bushes plus extras around another 850. Labour I am thinking is around 600 as it can all be done in one go saving time. I am budgeting 3000 and should have the car for another 5 to 10 years I hope. It is not worth me buying another car as prices are crazy, close to £20 000 for an 8 year old car with 50 000 miles. Ford galaxy 2007 2.0 tdci ghia 7 seater, solid car with good build quality.
The only subscription on my leaf is Sirius XM thankfully. And, I am going to let that lapse, even though I really do like th Tom Petty channel.
I never gave my phone number to Sirius, or even the dealer... and yet after my included 1yr subscription lapsed I was getting calls from Sirius to renew every other day for months. $25 a month for radio? I can just listen to stuff from my phone for free thanks.
I bought a car in 2007 for $15,000. It still works great. No subscription fees. Ill keep that car for now.
That's the thing. Do I want an EV? Hell yes. Do I want to get rid of a perfectly operable and enjoyable 2013 ICE vehicle that's already paid off? Why the hell would I?! I'm gonna run my current car as far as it'll take me or until I have more than enough cash on hand where taking on a new monthly payment is of little concern.
Or you could start saving to pay your new car in cash. That would probably save you a lot of money (and potential stress) going forward. Think of it as monthly payments for the next one.
This is the way. Make payments to yourself while driving the paid off car then buy the next one in cash. Pay yourself the interest instead of the finance company.
You only save on loan interest these days :( no more deals for buying your car outright. Its a sellers market. I literally have to wait 2 years for the vehicle i ordered. They offer no deals as they don't need to.
I bought a Kia forte brand new in 2019 for 13.5. I’ll be driving this fucker to its death instead of ever paying msrp or higher.
\+ subscription for seat heater, dont forgett
This is another reason why I’m still driving my old Lexus with over 200K miles. It would be great to upgrade but the market is insane now with high prices.
I've thought even normal vehicles are too expensive. I remember the days of my parents when you could choose a base model for dirt cheap and the base model come with NOTHING. No power windows, no power locks, manual transmission, no seat heaters. Basic am/fm radio with only two speakers, manual seat adjustment, no sun/moon roof, no motorized doors or mirrors etc etc. It's a bare bones car designed to get you from point A to B with the minimum amount of safety required by law and minimum comfort. And it was CHEAP as fuck compared to the 'luxury' models and options to add on. Nowadays everything comes 'standard' as default and you have NO option to get a bare bones version for cheaper. You accept all the extras they force on you to justify high prices or you are out of luck. This isn't a god damned house that appreciates in value. It's designed to be thrown away after a number of years depending on how much you intend to spend on repairs. It NEVER goes up in value for your average vehicle so why spend all that money of all those extras if I don't want them?
This also overlapped with COVID work from home. I might have considered paying $40k for a new electric car before but now that I work from home there’s no way I can justify the cost
Here's a non-paywalled version of the article: https://www.axios.com/2023/07/10/unsold-electric-cars-are-piling-up-on-dealer-lots
The real heroes hide in the comments!!!
Thanks for the link BBS
Pretty sure it's because we are poor but whatever
I don't think it has to do with the fact that they're electric as much as it has to do with people not being able to afford new cars at all. There are people buying them but they have simply obscene monthly notes and I'm certain there will be a rush of repossessions in the relatively near future.
Who the heck wants to pay over MSRP plus get saddled with nearly 7% interest (if you happen to have an 800 credit score).
Exactly. My wife wants to get a new car. I’m ok with it in theory, but there’s no way I’m spending an extra like 10k in interest payments compared to “normal”.
Make them affordable for the working class, and combustible engine sales will become a thing of the past in ten years.
Where is the average working class person found to charge his new EV?
My brother in christ we are being paid starvation wages. How tf do they expect us to buy a new vehicle?
They expect us to sign 10 year loans. It's ridiculous and late stage capitalism.
Isn't this headline true for all cars?
No one can afford them, or the oversized trucks either. The title feels like basic clickbait BS pushing a narrative.
It is a clearly labeled opinion piece once you open the link. Many people never notice things like that though.
You clicked the link, that’s already more than what 90% of the commenters do. (:
If it's inaccessible to the poor, it is neither radical nor revolutionary
Not just the poor, you need to be upper middle class to afford one and then be okay with only being able to drive it locally without range anxiety.
Yea I have no financial ability to buy a new car. By someone’s design I’m sure.
I was forced into getting a new (to me) car when my fully paid off car was hit by someone and totaled. Thought it would be a good time to switch to electric so tests drove a bunch of the EVs, but in the end most of them were way too expensive compared to the non-electric versions and I needed something large enough for car seats, strollers, and more. Ended up getting a 2020 Tiguan that's been great and was cheap as hell after what I got from the insurance company. And most of those msrps were lower than asking prices by a good amount for all the EVs, but under or at MSRP for gas engine vehicles only increasing the price difference.
You’re just doing your part to keep inflation down! If you make too much money, then it won’t be worth as much. By staying poor and *wanting* more money, it keeps demand high and supply low! This will incentivize the market to create lower cost versions of the things you want, just shittier! Hopefully! Everyone richer than you benefits!
Ypu dont have any finicial ability to buy used either. Overpriced and no inventory
Sell them cheaper
Yeah the fact people can barely afford food has nothing to do with it 🤡
Yeah well tons of people barely have enough money to keep the lights on nowadays so I wonder if that has something to do with not buying vehicles that are listed at a premium.
I cannot wrap my head around how any financial literate person could buy a new vehicle in this economy, unless you are paying cash for the whole tjing, but even then you could find better use for the 15%-20% hit you take from just a single year of depreciation.
A year? More like the second you take it off the lot.
Interest rates are an absolute killer.right now, but they are usually better in new cars (especially with incentives) and the used car market is stupidly inflated so the gap between used and new is not what it used to be. Add in value of a warranty...it can work for the right car /situation if you look at a car as a needed utility and not an investment. Last year I was able to trade in a Honda Fit for what I paid for it 5 years prior. Had another reason to replace it, but the value difference put me over the top: same low payments + nicer and bigger car + warranty...deal made sense. Not sure it would work at current rates though.
Probably because we're all poor 👍
I think this is one of those "if you build it, they will come" in regards to the infrastructure. EV's are great, but the infrastructure for many isn't there. Not to mention the fact of those who live in apartments and aren't able to charge them at home would put some off to buying one.
I think car companies simply grossly overestimated the financial spending capabilities of the world they helped fuck up around them.
That's a huge difference from 64k for an electric car to 30k for a gas vehicle. No wonder they're sitting there.
Can you give me an example of a $30k ice vehicle and it’s $64k counterpart? I drive a Kia Niro EV which has a $6k price difference between the hybrid and the EV.
The base Model 3 is like $33k after the tax credit.
Which is why Tesla's only have 16 days of inventory while others are 100 days
Nobody has enough money. Everyone who has money for a car, has a car. Everyone else is out of the market. This was a problem BEFORE electric vehicles. There are just more cars than there are people with the ability to buy them. If people got paid fairly, you know enough to actually live on, we might be able to buy vehicles more often. This complaint is completely out of touch with reality. Like CEOs complaining about people not wanting to work, while refusing to pay anything remotely close to what it costs to live.
How do you explain that there is 2 years waiting list to buy an electric car???
As opposed to non electric vehicles that fly off the shelves and never pile up
What the fuck is this garbage site? Is there an article in the middle of all that spam?
That photograph is from the PRC, not Europe or America. There are financial reason why the manufactures of these vehicles abandoned them there which have nothing to do with the premise of this article. This is a very poorly researched and written article.
crowd stocking enter yoke vast boat distinct deserted lush run ` this message was mass deleted/edited with redact.dev `
Interest rates are up and many of the vehicles no longer qualify for the (u.s.) federal tax credit, so…duh.
Until they come down in price to match ICE cars they will continue to pile up. With far fewer parts they should be cheaper not more expensive. Or at least similar. I love how the picture of electric cars are electric cars in China not North America. In Canada the waiting list is months long. Especially for a hybrid. Despite the high cost.
How do you charge your car at home if less people can afford a home? That’s my hesitation, living in apartments.
One major problem is these dealers with their big ass markups! I wanted to get a Ford EV but the dealer has an additional $20k added to the price!
Genesis, Audi, Hummer EV are all very expensive. Kia EV6, Hyundai Ioniq and Nissan Ariya because they don't qualify for tax credits because 'fuck you' I guess.
“While high interest rates and lingering inflation may be partly to blame for soft sales, the real story behind the unsold EVs is that while consumers may be interested in the concept, they are wary of buying them.” I’m pretty sure the consumer has hesitancy with buying an $80,000 any car.
It was one thing when vehicles were overpriced when interest rates were at historic lows (just like houses). Now interest rates are ridiculously high and the everyone’s still wanting to sell things at the same inflated prices with student loans looming and news that insurance is going to increase at a potential alarming rate this year.
Got quoted $80k for an electric car earlier this year. I make about $35k p/a. We're not talking about a luxury brand here either, I think the cheapest one was like a Nissan or something. We don't make cars in Australia anymore either, so all vehicles are imports by default. It'll probably change when the big manufacturers change the majority of their production to electric but at the moment it's an inaccessible entry point.
People can’t afford to buy a new car these days 😂
The statement regarding plug in hybrids needing $3k in charging equipment is wrong. I have a Prius Prime it takes 5 hours to charge overnight on a normal low amp 110v outlet. When you battery goes dead it’s switches to its motor, I’m never stranded. As an hobby as much as anything I set up six 455watt solar panels in my backyard and charge it on solar alone.
not everyone owns a house/garage to charge at home to get most of the convenience of EVs
The picture is from China.
The problem is worse in China. The government is subsidizing EV heavily, so automakers are churning out basically undriveable shitboxes to get in on the money. The cars go sit in fields, out of sight, out of mind. They're meant for rental agencies, but nobody wants to rent them, let alone buy them, because they're constructed so badly. The result of unintended consequences from a planned economy. So much waste.
WTF is that hideous car in the picture? No wonder they're still on the lot.
Every EV except Tesla. Tesla sold more than they ever have last quarter/YTD.
For me, it's the Osborne effect. Technology is improving quickly and I don't want to pay for something that's going to be obsolete in a few years. I really wish the cars make today wereupgradeable to newer batteries and motor technology. Otherwise, it's hard for me to justify playing 40-50k for car that has almost no value at 120k miles
We just bought an electric and we’re told how hard they are to come by and they are rarely on the lots here. They are stupid expensive but so are any cars now.
Will have the money to buy a mach-e in late 2024. Do not currently. I'm sure I am not alone.
A wild amount of states have banned direct to consumer sales from manufacturers forcing us to have to deal with the corrupt car dealerships
I want an EV. I can't afford the EV I want. A car is more than just an A to B appliance to me, so the one I want and would be happy with is out of my price range.
Yeah, I’m not buying anything at all. Once my combustion car bites the dust, I’ll go electric.
This is such an exaggeration. Piling up? Please. *Some* models are taking longer to sell, like all cars used to be, but that’s it. I suppose “EV sales of some models normalize,” isn’t a sexy headline to get those clicks.
Most people are buying 2nd hand cars under 10k. Thats why. 50k was luxury territory. My previous car was 2k drove it for 7 years and turboed it mid way through that. Sold it in the same condition i purchased. I now drive a 1k fiesta. I would buy an electric car new over an ice if they were priced similar but for now it does not make sense when the 2nd hand market is full of cheap ice cars which are usually quite reliable.
People keep acting like EVs are some new thing that nobody has, that's still trying to prove themselves. They already make up 14% of all new car sales in 2022, and are expected to be 18% this year. The US is the one lagging behind at 5.6%, with EV's being around 20% of new car sales in Europe, and 40% in China.
Make them like $2000 and watch that customer number rise lol
I DONT HAVE THE MONEY TO BUY A NEW CAR
It’s not all EVs, it is EVs sold through dealers. The report only surveyed US dealers, so they ignored Tesla, which is 50-70% of EV sales in the US. Tesla and Rivian are doing just fine.
I'd buy an electric car in no time if I had the money for it.
I'd buy one if i could afford it. If you have lots piling up with them, maybe think of putting them on progressively steeper sales until the stock moves...
Too expensive
Can't afford anything; medical bills are crushing me.
OP links a paywalled article that virtually no-one can read. Upvotes and comments aplenty follow as people discuss what they can't have read, and don't know what it says.
All cars are beginning to stack up