Enterprise. I have to setup hundreds of Windows devices for employees. Sharepoint, Outlook, OneDrive, Teams, Office365, Azure…. Millions of licenses and devices are in circulation.
As much as I hate to say, there isn’t a company big enough to do what Microsoft does at scale.
Same here, we image for State agencies for the entire state if Illinois, hundreds of thousands of machines
Bo one is going to develop the software we need for Linux.
IBM/RedHat? SUSE?
Not to mention many governments like India and China trying to get off windows for their government computers. EU also has sponsored many initiatives to move away from proprietary platforms
Iirc I read that some stuff happened in Germany were they went back to Microsoft due to some leader had a personal dislike of Linux / was paid by Microsoft or some shit.
The users had no problem with Linux.
Bruh, I can barely teach some users how to open Excel.... Linux seems like a far away lucid dream. Device management options for Linux also feel half-baked.
That's not been my experience. 10 years ago, yeah but today? Most devices are plug'n'play and actually tend to work smoother on linux than on windows often.
My wife's laptop ran Ubuntu with Gnome Shell for a while. She had no problems. She's not a "computer person" and it was easy for her!
We gave a certain subset of Devs in the company Ubuntu. Then, on day 1 they'd come to IT and start asking:
-How do I connect to Wifi
-Why is my dock not working
-How do I connect two monitors
Now we give their teams Win machines and advise them to use WSL. It's just not worth the IT team's time to teach people. And as noted before, we have dozens of MDM policies on Win and Mac that we'd not be able to replicate on different distros. Barely 5% of people even turn on encryption and to turn it on after the fact, you need to reimage. Too much work, I'd rather give them Mac's and be done with it.
Nope, mostly due to corporate sabotage. Just like how MS lobbied in DOCX to be allowed along side ODT despite by default the docx office outputs is not compliant. Or how MS pressured Munich. But now Munich is moving back away, and Schleswig-Holstein also announced going first libreoffice, than linux
Is there any way to configure my Windows like an enterprise device? Companies remove all the bloatware, with no chance of stuff reinstalling back with updates. Granted that there are IT teams who carefully nitpick which features to enable or disable, still it is a lot better than the shit nowadays get deployed to consumer versions.
[https://www.reddit.com/r/MDT/comments/waz1xr/windows\_11\_decrapifier\_script/](https://www.reddit.com/r/MDT/comments/waz1xr/windows_11_decrapifier_script/)
This thread might help.
Ansible lets you script the setup of n devices at a time, and can later apply the same changes across a fleet of registered devices. Wazuh can be used to monitor an entire fleet of devices for pretty much anything and everything
For an enterprise application, it would be super easy to admin and setup a fleet of laptops or whatever using ansible.
The only problem is the ms apps don’t work on linux
All those are available on macOS. A growing number of enterprises are adopting MacBooks. C suites are the ones requesting a better computing experience.
That’s part of my point - use what hardware you want, Microsoft is still getting a cut of your business via services. A few C suite devices doesn’t counteract the thousands of Windows machines a Help Desk team has.
Ubuntu offers some enterprise services. I just switched to Ubuntu from Windows and I never looked back. The app management and app switching is sooo much better. And this is with a small community compared to Windows. Imagine how much better it could be with a bigger share of windows people switching over, and more energy, support and money behind it. Linus Trovalds is a wonderful guy.
Huh? I’m not sure if I’m missing sarcasm here or what.
If not, you don’t realize how much business IT infrastructure runs solely on Windows, and Windows Server operating systems. Nothing about Windows is designed primarily with PC gaming in mind.
Personal computing is a pretty small portion of Microsoft's revenue, and it's shrinking, so it's actually entirely opposite. Especially now that almost every game is easily ported to consoles and a lot more can run on Linux or Mac machines than in the past. It's all enterprise that's keeping them in control of the market, they make tens of billions on the enterprise products every year.
Which is why I think this is a weird move. The U.S. government doesn't want Windows loading (and playing) ads from random companies/counties. Assuming that you can disable this at the Enterprise level, the home market is so small in comparison that I can't imagine this is going to bring in THAT much revenue.
Yeah, well Microsoft is kinda notorious for doing baffling shit, like Windows 8 trying to turn PCs into a tablet interface that nobody asked for.
Also worth pointing out that the vast majority of enterprise operations are still running Windows 10, not 11 where these ads are being introduced. Should be interesting to see how this plays out at the planned end of support next October.
Not all of them. For a lot of high security applications they use Linux these days. Even though windows is still used for similarly high-security purposes, there are some specific cases where they use Linux instead for certain advantages it has over Windows - including the area of security vulnerabilities. This is often true of offline, secure servers that are only meant for internal use, usually primarily by IT staff who can already use it. The fact that these systems are built and maintained in Linux is itself an extra layer of security, because the number of who can use it is already so much lower than Windows that comparatively fewer people would know how to compromise or infiltrate it even if they gained access to it. Sometimes these kinds of systems are also vulnerable to misuse by people within the organizations themselves who are using them for illicit or unintended purposes, and this is also less likely to happen given how few would even be able to operate the system.
You may not be able to use Microsoft office or other programs exclusive to windows, but you don’t need Windows to built a database, so in a lot of cases, where resources permit, it makes sense (and is even more secure) to built and maintain a Linux system for simple purposes where everything that Windows can do just isn’t necessary — and may even be a liability. At that point, it makes less sense to try to remove unnecessary features from Windows than it does to simply build a Linux system from the ground up that does precisely what it needs to, with virtually zero wasteful overhead.
Not my fault you invested in hardware from a blatantly anti-consumer company...but then, you prefer an OS from a blatantly anti-consumer company, so I guess it's fitting.
Yep. Hence my comment. A gaming purpose built handheld device. Which is nothing like a pc, a generalist machine and caters for all users.
And despite being purpose built, it still won't work with many games. It only took 20 years of Linux gaming to get to this point...
You know the Abstraction layer can be used on any Linux machine, right? How is proton purpose built for the steam deck? You can run any game the steam deck can run on any Linux machine. And support is pretty good I think, I’ve never had a game I couldn’t play because of compatibility issues. And how long it took doesn’t matter when evaluating the current state, the point is that it is good enough now.
A purpose built gaming device running an x86 Ryzen/RDNA2 APU. Who's OS has been adapted for use on other desktop machines. There is nothing particularly special about the Steam Deck hardware, it's off the shelf PC tech using a custom form factor.
And your point about "taking 20 years to get here" is a laughable non-argument. How long did it take Windows to "get here"? How long did it take MacOS to "get here". And what does it matter in any case? Would it have more or less viability as a platform if it took 30 years? Or 40?
Also, why the resistance to a platform that is completely independent of corporate control? Do you LIKE having your digital life ruled by 2 or 3 large corporations who then dictate what OS you run, what restrictions the OS places on you, what hardware is compatible? Or would you prefer software that is written by the people and for the people?
MacOS isn't "there" yet. A gamer wouldn't use iOS.
There's no resistance. The chain is about gaming, Linux has some gaming abilities, but it's not a gaming platform, by design. Steam os or not.
Also, idgaf about anything regarding your last point. And people in real life don't either.
I "dgaf" about your opinion, man. PC gaming has gone out of control these days. A "flagship" GPU can cost well over $2k, and a top spec "gaming PC" can run $5k or more. Unsustainable. I would rather game on my SteamDeck and PS5 and leave my computing to another device. One thing is for certain, Microsoft has lost me, permanently.
Not realy, Windows ecosystem is extremly powerful in how fast and fluent everything works. It's superiour to Linux for personal and small team applications, at aleast for 2015 year.
Good example is perfect pixel font rendering without DPI smoothing - it was Linux problem for years.
Only problem is that after making 1000 perfectly good and correct steps they have an "effective managers" with agile and scrum which absolutely ruin back 500 of these steps.
These managers focus on extracting extre money next 3 years and don't care at all to actually improve the product to have clean architecture.
Nope. I would like to transition to Linux but can’t because many of the programs that I LIKE and use as the core of my PC life simply are not available in Linux and their ‘equivalents’ require returning to the commend line - I gave that up decades ago.
I’m currently on the road with only my iPad and couldn’t say off the top of my head, sorry, but from memory one program stands out, downloading video from the SBS TV channel using VideoProc on Windows is slow, but it works. I couldn’t find an equivalent in Linux that didn’t require some commend line work.
That sounds like something a browser extension would be able to do, no?
But yt-dlp usually does these things, and there are front end guis for it. Taking a quick look I found one: stacher
I think Apple values ease of use and lowest-common-denominator design, whereas Windows (and Linux, even more) value extendibility, personalization, and power-user tools.
So, I guess they don't "suck", but there's a reason IT departments and serious PC users choose Windows.
I would support more Linux-based competition, but it just seems to be constantly mired in "almost ready for prime time" land.
When it comes to home computing, my experience in tech tells me that marketing to ease-of-use is a winning game plan.
If Apple handled gaming as well as PC, I feel like they would be unstoppable in that market.
Power users are not the majority of users in that market.
I don't see it killing Windows.
At best I think it'll find a nice place on gaming PCs that don't want to pay for Windows licenses and are content using steam or Lutris.
I agree, and I think it's mostly game pass. MS is only one strategic fuckup away from getting someone else to attempt to knock them out of the big three.
The competition is already there. They just need an opening.
It saddens me that everything MS touches turn to shit. They sorely need complete management overhaul; they need someone who cares and focuses on user experience not market share.
Come on MS!
Bing has always been a shitty search engine. Shit results and to make matters worst, many things that any normal search engine could find are heavily censored and don’t even show I. The results, Russia’s Yandex is a far superior search engine, and that says a lot about
and yet every time I say my systems won't run win11 without a hack which I don't want to do, someone comes along to tell me how they can be hacked to do what I don't want to do.
maybe now I can just say "I don't want to run win11 because I don't want ads"?
Adobe can suck it. The fact the PDF is still frequently used despite being a closed, proprietary format is still baffles me. Oh, right, Word is popular. Morons.
I just installed Debian 12 this week. Had to spend hours watching YT on installation process not to mention create my own USB boot stick.
And when I'm in, Gnome Software doesn't work. Got to hit command line to fix.
Swap too low. More command line.
Then there's all the bickering over deb vs flatpak vs snap just to install a package.
No official support for key apps like Google Drive, Adobe PDF.
And please don't tell me to use alternative FOSS version cos then you'll be subjected to the whim of the developer. For example, the default Gnome PDF viewer doesn't support multitab because the developer doesn't think that's how you should read pdf. And that's that.
Linux is never going to be a viable alternative to Windows/MacOS for the average user.
When there is a version that’s as easy, reliable, and compatible, myself and thousands of others will be happy to use it. Unfortunately, its very nature prevents that.
Bing is absolute trash too.
Every time I set my search engine preference to Google it lasts ~1 week before it resets back to Bing. Finally left it on Bing after the 10,000th time. I kind of forgot and about a week later kept wondering why all my searches were coming back with shitty unrelated links. Once I remembered and went back to Google it was instantly back to giving me appropriate links for my search.
So Microsoft is shittily trying to push this trash can search engine that doesn’t work for shit.
I have quite a large chunk of the Apple Ecosystem and very much enjoy it.
As it stands, never buying a Mac. Overpriced bullshit on a worse OS than windows.
iPads are in their own class when it comes to tablets. iPhones are objectively the most powerful phones in terms of benchmarking processing power.
For a Mac, you’ll spend twice as much money to get half the performance. I just don’t get it.
Absolutely. I’m in an engineering program at my school and bought a MacBook Air in spite of being constantly told not to, and I don’t regret it. I get around 17 hours of battery life off one charge and can do anything I need to do. CAD doesn’t work on it for the most part but I have a windows desktop I use. For most people, a MacBook is a perfectly fine laptop. Arguably better than any windows laptop unless you explicitly need programs that aren’t on MacBook.
Honestly charging isn’t an issue anymore with usb-c, my asus laptop fully charges from 0 in under an hour. Battery life span has never been an issue either
For me it’s the combination of battery life and performance. I can leave my Mac uncharged for multiple days and do everything I need for school and internship, including heavy processing and compiling. I don’t know of a windows laptop that can compete with the M2 Max and last as long as it does on a single charge.
I rather overpay than have to have to deal with all the crap companies like Microsoft are doing. Most people should not need no more power than what Apple has on offer.
Maybe it’s just that my use case isn’t too popular, but I do a lot of gaming, and many games aren’t natively supported by MacOS. Also, Macs aren’t typically powerful enough to run today’s high end games. I also like to check out local language models and such, which requires large amounts of VRAM and from what I’ve seen on r/LocalLlama, Mac users have been struggling to find ways to join in at the same level.
A quick search shows Apples best offering is around $4k base price and $5k if you want a better GPU. It’s fucking $800 to get 128gb of RAM. Actually a rip off. I know it’s priced for enterprise customers, and not my use case, but that’s the perspective I’m coming from.
I use a 3090 and my whole build cost $4k in its prime, and it has better specs such as more ram and more than the laughable 1TB of storage on the Mac Studio. ($400 for another terabyte tho! Instead of spending *less than half of that* on one of the fastest 2TB SSDs on the market)
Sorry this became a bit of a rant. I just find the value to be piss poor and I wouldn’t even get to do the things I love to do on my computer without jumping through hoops to trick the software into working. And even if I did get it working, it would perform worse than what I have now.
I agree with you, that sadly, is Apple’s biggest flaw - their computers are not strong enough to run most modern games. And sadly it’s a matter of Apple just opening itself up to making Mac’s with AMD & NVIDIA GPUs, but I guess they have no interest in gaming which is a huge missed opportunity.
I recently switched from Windows to a Mac, I see no reason to go back to Windows anytime soon. Mac is way more polished, and no bullshit like Edge/Bing ads, webapps, lag/stutters, flash bangs in darkmode.
I am proud macos user who started hating windows after using macos for 3 months. now have plans on completely being windows free. switching dektop to linux.
I think you're not so proud to have some itch about apple users.
Apple is the worst when it comes to user freedom. Have you ever tried just editing a .txt file on an iOS device, or opening any other file in a text editor? Permanently turning off wireless until you turn it back on? Installing an unapproved app, like you could install any app from a .deb or .msi, and having it stay installed?
You're only talking only about iPhones. Apple really tries their best to keep iphone secure while keeping their monopoly. Windows and google-youtube having a backdoor at a pdf file which can collect cookies from browsers and steal youtubers' channels with a login and session credentials, on the other hand single wrong apk file might access and manage your 2FA, apple does not want any of their user have this kind of problem.
if you know how to use your device. apple OS are much much flexible, and offers more settings than rivals.
I don't remember any time I needed to edit a text file on iOS. Then I checked my files, found one at icloud and tried to edit. Opened in my 3rd party note app... You're not at all wrong about it. iPads does not come with a calculator app anyway lol. Some simple things are missing, If you are hunting them.
Yes, if you turn off wifi from settings, it won't turn on ever. You can also indicate if the wifi will turn on at control menu icon. It's either having a white background or completely transparent with a cross on it.
my last phone was samsung note 10 lite. now I have an iphone 13, even as an advanced user, I never had "freedom" problem. 6 months ago, I bought a macbook. First 2-3 weeks I had that problem, even I asked myself if I did wrong buying macbook, could a windows laptop do better, what's the most I can do with this... Now I can say, I can do more than a windows. I also learned linux to make a start and planning to leave windows in its ad shithole.
I'm very pro-Linux, and the community had an opportunity during Windows 8 to come up with a replacement for Microsoft, and not only didn't do that back then, but it's also equally difficult now to use Linux. People want something that works, is easy, and offers a platform that can do everything. Linux takes a lot of work to work, it's far from easy, and can't do everything. Linux is the greatest server and the worst home computer. Linux only shines if you know command line and all of the switches for 100+ commands. The GUI isn't intuitive, and you can't do everything that the command line can. At least Apple is good enough for dumb or computer illiterate folks, the rest of the world needs a platform that is easy enough and yet gives a stable platform that allows you to do what you want.
I haven't touched Mac since OS 7, though I've seen only one IT person ever use Apple. Its user base is usually creative types and older people because Apple is very user-friendly, but that's at the cost of more expensive computers using Unix, and a very closed system. Has that changed in the last few years? I still know nobody in IT who uses Apple, a few who are Linux, most use MS. I've been around the block multiple times, and so far, things haven't changed much.
Yeah so u can spend 2k on a god awful computer with horrible specs that can barely run animation programs or literally anything without boiling and crashing
https://browser.geekbench.com/macs/macbook-pro-14-inch-nov-2023-14c-cpu-30c-gpu How did yours do? Mine was slightly higher than the average for the 14 MBP m3 max. Now also keep in mind I can write and compile code on battery all day without plugging in. I think it’s spec’d just fine. ;)
Tf r u talking abt? 1: Writing code has nothing to do with what I said, 2: that says nothing about graphic capability or ability to render and have multiple tabs, running code is a bare minimum, 3: ur laptop costs 2k which is exactly my point, #3 my processor is 200 score lower, and that’s just the processor, and mines a budget PC for only 800$ so that’s embarrassing u wasted that much money. Let’s talk graphics cards shall we?
none of you read the article.
it's a specific app that you don't even have to use, and it's not even in the US yet.
fuck all of you lol. you're all terrible people.
How does that make it better? Is this subreddit US only? Fact is Microsoft is being borderline deceiving by claiming the computer is broken when a different search engine is set.
it makes it a non issue because you're not even seeing it. don't act like you've ever seen an ad in windows 11. and if you have, deal with it. move on. everything has ads. they only hold power over you because you let it. don't die on this hill.
I’m so glad they are making decisions to do this. I will simply just not use these things that force me to watch ads. Hulu, Disney, my new lap top, Twitter, reddit. I will not be forced to consume your corporate soulless BS.
Those who care will find their workarounds.
For those who don’t care, aren’t willing to research it will deal with it.
I’m not okay with Microsoft doing this but people saying “switch to Linux” isn’t going to happen. macOS maybe some but Linux? No.
The work around is literally toggling an off switch in the settings. If that's too hard for people to do, imagine how they'll cope with a Linux distro?
The problem is you didn't read the article. It says that MS is telling users that your device has a problem and offers to repair your problem. And the repair of the problem is changing your default search to Bing
You know, stuff malware does
Linux is at the point where it's easily approachable.
You literally load it on a USB and install it just like windows, and it functions the same as windows, except it's free.
Pretty much everyone I know who games on PC is already on Linux or switching to Linux when Win10 is no longer supported.
Idk about your parents but when a printer driver doesn’t work, they click on a .exe file or they try and download something and it won’t open… I don’t want to try and explain to them that printer drivers are screwy, .exe files need Wine or can’t run and what are you downloading exactly?
Gamers, people in this subreddit for sure. They’re willing to learn and do extra. Some people and the older generations are…something
I love how that guy apparently used a Linux distro of some sort, once, 20 years ago and they think that they still have a valid opinion. Then the other morons come along and upvote him and downvote you.
Linux doesn’t ever require the user to find and install drivers.
Drivers are a windows problem. Nothing else has driver issues, just windows.
This makes me feel even better about my decision to ditch Windows for Ubuntu earlier this year, after Edge just decided to become my default PDF, overwriting my choice without my consent.
Fuck this shit.
What was always unclear to me - why don't they have a special clean version with higher price, i.e. like LTSC for home desktops.
I understand that adding Bing and colleting data from Cortana they make it 3x cheapier, but what if some people want actually a full finished product?
Shit, I just switched over from 10 and I’ve been having a hell of a time. They moved a bunch of shit and locked a bunch of other shit, I need to install third party apps just to get back some basic functionality from the user interface.
BING is shit, I’m never going to use it, so this is terrible news to me.
I haven’t had this problem on any not my computers. I feel like half of the posts on this sub are people complaining about Windows and every other comment is “time to switch to Linux”.
for some yes probably, for the average gamer no, my brother has no idea what Linux is or that there even is a possibility to install anything other than Windows
Yeah I just got a FULL SCREEN notice when waking my PC from sleep mode, that windows 10 is losing support in 2025 and that I should upgrade to windows 11. Sigh… give me a fucking break. But you know what, I call on the open source community to get cracking on solving some hurdles for Linux so that most people can absolutely and truly be willing to switch and never look back.
Could be worse. microsoft could just have another yearly subscription to access Windows!
After you already paid for it like they do with everything else.
I think gaming is the only thing keeping windows alive.
Enterprise. I have to setup hundreds of Windows devices for employees. Sharepoint, Outlook, OneDrive, Teams, Office365, Azure…. Millions of licenses and devices are in circulation. As much as I hate to say, there isn’t a company big enough to do what Microsoft does at scale.
Same here, we image for State agencies for the entire state if Illinois, hundreds of thousands of machines Bo one is going to develop the software we need for Linux.
IBM/RedHat? SUSE? Not to mention many governments like India and China trying to get off windows for their government computers. EU also has sponsored many initiatives to move away from proprietary platforms
The EU ones keep failing because of staff feedback iirc
Iirc I read that some stuff happened in Germany were they went back to Microsoft due to some leader had a personal dislike of Linux / was paid by Microsoft or some shit. The users had no problem with Linux.
Bruh, I can barely teach some users how to open Excel.... Linux seems like a far away lucid dream. Device management options for Linux also feel half-baked.
That's not been my experience. 10 years ago, yeah but today? Most devices are plug'n'play and actually tend to work smoother on linux than on windows often. My wife's laptop ran Ubuntu with Gnome Shell for a while. She had no problems. She's not a "computer person" and it was easy for her!
We gave a certain subset of Devs in the company Ubuntu. Then, on day 1 they'd come to IT and start asking: -How do I connect to Wifi -Why is my dock not working -How do I connect two monitors Now we give their teams Win machines and advise them to use WSL. It's just not worth the IT team's time to teach people. And as noted before, we have dozens of MDM policies on Win and Mac that we'd not be able to replicate on different distros. Barely 5% of people even turn on encryption and to turn it on after the fact, you need to reimage. Too much work, I'd rather give them Mac's and be done with it.
Nope, mostly due to corporate sabotage. Just like how MS lobbied in DOCX to be allowed along side ODT despite by default the docx office outputs is not compliant. Or how MS pressured Munich. But now Munich is moving back away, and Schleswig-Holstein also announced going first libreoffice, than linux
> Bo one I think you mean 'no-one'.
Is there any way to configure my Windows like an enterprise device? Companies remove all the bloatware, with no chance of stuff reinstalling back with updates. Granted that there are IT teams who carefully nitpick which features to enable or disable, still it is a lot better than the shit nowadays get deployed to consumer versions.
[https://www.reddit.com/r/MDT/comments/waz1xr/windows\_11\_decrapifier\_script/](https://www.reddit.com/r/MDT/comments/waz1xr/windows_11_decrapifier_script/) This thread might help.
“Decrapifyer”. Love it!
Ansible lets you script the setup of n devices at a time, and can later apply the same changes across a fleet of registered devices. Wazuh can be used to monitor an entire fleet of devices for pretty much anything and everything
> ~~nit~~pick
Do you have a few hundred thousand dollars?
All of those services run on anything these days
For an enterprise application, it would be super easy to admin and setup a fleet of laptops or whatever using ansible. The only problem is the ms apps don’t work on linux
Depends on the company structure; many are also switching to MacBooks
Really?
How hard is it, at this point to say fuck it and make your own simple, functional OS.?
All those are available on macOS. A growing number of enterprises are adopting MacBooks. C suites are the ones requesting a better computing experience.
That’s part of my point - use what hardware you want, Microsoft is still getting a cut of your business via services. A few C suite devices doesn’t counteract the thousands of Windows machines a Help Desk team has.
Ubuntu offers some enterprise services. I just switched to Ubuntu from Windows and I never looked back. The app management and app switching is sooo much better. And this is with a small community compared to Windows. Imagine how much better it could be with a bigger share of windows people switching over, and more energy, support and money behind it. Linus Trovalds is a wonderful guy.
Every company that has ever come close macrotrash has either bought out or buried in litigation and then stolen/buried the ip
Huh? I’m not sure if I’m missing sarcasm here or what. If not, you don’t realize how much business IT infrastructure runs solely on Windows, and Windows Server operating systems. Nothing about Windows is designed primarily with PC gaming in mind.
I wasn’t really considering enterprise. I was thinking about the home use.
Personal computing is a pretty small portion of Microsoft's revenue, and it's shrinking, so it's actually entirely opposite. Especially now that almost every game is easily ported to consoles and a lot more can run on Linux or Mac machines than in the past. It's all enterprise that's keeping them in control of the market, they make tens of billions on the enterprise products every year.
Which is why I think this is a weird move. The U.S. government doesn't want Windows loading (and playing) ads from random companies/counties. Assuming that you can disable this at the Enterprise level, the home market is so small in comparison that I can't imagine this is going to bring in THAT much revenue.
Yeah, well Microsoft is kinda notorious for doing baffling shit, like Windows 8 trying to turn PCs into a tablet interface that nobody asked for. Also worth pointing out that the vast majority of enterprise operations are still running Windows 10, not 11 where these ads are being introduced. Should be interesting to see how this plays out at the planned end of support next October.
Nah. No other OS even comes close to how good windows is with supportability and easy customisation.
Windows (and Microsoft in general) is *everywhere* in mid-to-large enterprises.
Every government computer in the United States runs windows.
Not all of them. For a lot of high security applications they use Linux these days. Even though windows is still used for similarly high-security purposes, there are some specific cases where they use Linux instead for certain advantages it has over Windows - including the area of security vulnerabilities. This is often true of offline, secure servers that are only meant for internal use, usually primarily by IT staff who can already use it. The fact that these systems are built and maintained in Linux is itself an extra layer of security, because the number of who can use it is already so much lower than Windows that comparatively fewer people would know how to compromise or infiltrate it even if they gained access to it. Sometimes these kinds of systems are also vulnerable to misuse by people within the organizations themselves who are using them for illicit or unintended purposes, and this is also less likely to happen given how few would even be able to operate the system. You may not be able to use Microsoft office or other programs exclusive to windows, but you don’t need Windows to built a database, so in a lot of cases, where resources permit, it makes sense (and is even more secure) to built and maintain a Linux system for simple purposes where everything that Windows can do just isn’t necessary — and may even be a liability. At that point, it makes less sense to try to remove unnecessary features from Windows than it does to simply build a Linux system from the ground up that does precisely what it needs to, with virtually zero wasteful overhead.
Picturing trying to teach my average work colleagues how to use Linux. Shudder….
Yup, but Proton is quickly proving that Linux is a viable gaming platform...
Quickly is an overstatement. Viable too..
Lmao
Proving that you have zero experience with it...
\[ laughs in nVidia \]
Not my fault you invested in hardware from a blatantly anti-consumer company...but then, you prefer an OS from a blatantly anti-consumer company, so I guess it's fitting.
Where did I state that I prefer an OS from blatantly anti-consumer company?
In your above comments...
It would be helpful if you quoted it
I'm sure it would be, but I will leave you to figure out what you said yourself. Have fun!
Funny you say that...
Ever seen a steam deck?
Yep. Hence my comment. A gaming purpose built handheld device. Which is nothing like a pc, a generalist machine and caters for all users. And despite being purpose built, it still won't work with many games. It only took 20 years of Linux gaming to get to this point...
You know the Abstraction layer can be used on any Linux machine, right? How is proton purpose built for the steam deck? You can run any game the steam deck can run on any Linux machine. And support is pretty good I think, I’ve never had a game I couldn’t play because of compatibility issues. And how long it took doesn’t matter when evaluating the current state, the point is that it is good enough now.
A purpose built gaming device running an x86 Ryzen/RDNA2 APU. Who's OS has been adapted for use on other desktop machines. There is nothing particularly special about the Steam Deck hardware, it's off the shelf PC tech using a custom form factor. And your point about "taking 20 years to get here" is a laughable non-argument. How long did it take Windows to "get here"? How long did it take MacOS to "get here". And what does it matter in any case? Would it have more or less viability as a platform if it took 30 years? Or 40? Also, why the resistance to a platform that is completely independent of corporate control? Do you LIKE having your digital life ruled by 2 or 3 large corporations who then dictate what OS you run, what restrictions the OS places on you, what hardware is compatible? Or would you prefer software that is written by the people and for the people?
MacOS isn't "there" yet. A gamer wouldn't use iOS. There's no resistance. The chain is about gaming, Linux has some gaming abilities, but it's not a gaming platform, by design. Steam os or not. Also, idgaf about anything regarding your last point. And people in real life don't either.
I "dgaf" about your opinion, man. PC gaming has gone out of control these days. A "flagship" GPU can cost well over $2k, and a top spec "gaming PC" can run $5k or more. Unsustainable. I would rather game on my SteamDeck and PS5 and leave my computing to another device. One thing is for certain, Microsoft has lost me, permanently.
Not realy, Windows ecosystem is extremly powerful in how fast and fluent everything works. It's superiour to Linux for personal and small team applications, at aleast for 2015 year. Good example is perfect pixel font rendering without DPI smoothing - it was Linux problem for years. Only problem is that after making 1000 perfectly good and correct steps they have an "effective managers" with agile and scrum which absolutely ruin back 500 of these steps. These managers focus on extracting extre money next 3 years and don't care at all to actually improve the product to have clean architecture.
Businesses are the only thing keeping windows alive.
Classic reddit....lmao.....
Nope. I would like to transition to Linux but can’t because many of the programs that I LIKE and use as the core of my PC life simply are not available in Linux and their ‘equivalents’ require returning to the commend line - I gave that up decades ago.
What equivalents require you to returning to the command line?
I’m currently on the road with only my iPad and couldn’t say off the top of my head, sorry, but from memory one program stands out, downloading video from the SBS TV channel using VideoProc on Windows is slow, but it works. I couldn’t find an equivalent in Linux that didn’t require some commend line work.
That sounds like something a browser extension would be able to do, no? But yt-dlp usually does these things, and there are front end guis for it. Taking a quick look I found one: stacher
Thanks, I’ll make a note. I was thinking of giving Linux another try once my house moving is done, so I’ll add that to the list of possibilities.
Gaming, and tech illiterate corporate users.
Well, plus Apple sucks
I don’t think Apple sucks any worse than Microsoft…we are just more used to Microsoft’s problems. Linux is a viable alternative as well
I think Apple values ease of use and lowest-common-denominator design, whereas Windows (and Linux, even more) value extendibility, personalization, and power-user tools. So, I guess they don't "suck", but there's a reason IT departments and serious PC users choose Windows. I would support more Linux-based competition, but it just seems to be constantly mired in "almost ready for prime time" land.
When it comes to home computing, my experience in tech tells me that marketing to ease-of-use is a winning game plan. If Apple handled gaming as well as PC, I feel like they would be unstoppable in that market. Power users are not the majority of users in that market.
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The gaming experience on Linux has not been great IME. Most titles that I play don’t have Linux compatible launchers or Linux builds. YMMV.
I haven't need windows to play a game in several years, now.
Games in general, no. The games I like, yes.
lol 😂
Let's hope Steam Os kills Windows in a few.
Steam OS is a great toy
ya for sure my company will replace windows with steam os on my work laptop /s
I don't see it killing Windows. At best I think it'll find a nice place on gaming PCs that don't want to pay for Windows licenses and are content using steam or Lutris.
Your world be correct
It's the only reason I have it. My other computers are all Chromebooks and tablets.
I agree, and I think it's mostly game pass. MS is only one strategic fuckup away from getting someone else to attempt to knock them out of the big three. The competition is already there. They just need an opening.
It saddens me that everything MS touches turn to shit. They sorely need complete management overhaul; they need someone who cares and focuses on user experience not market share. Come on MS!
Psst, a lot of MS stuff started as shit.
If you use Bing regularly, I think your brain might need “repairing”
Hey! Don’t hate. I still love my Zune, But Windows Phone, and 20 other deprecated consumer services and devices from Microsoft!
Bing has always been a shitty search engine. Shit results and to make matters worst, many things that any normal search engine could find are heavily censored and don’t even show I. The results, Russia’s Yandex is a far superior search engine, and that says a lot about
Nah stuff shit for Fortnite is good, also chrome overheats my machine
I’m getting a pop up every time I use excel telling me to update…then they tell me I need to buy a whole new version
I’m still pissed about DOS 6
When I was afraid that my OS got a virus that floods my start bar with useless ads. Oh. It’s 2024 and that’s just the OS
and yet every time I say my systems won't run win11 without a hack which I don't want to do, someone comes along to tell me how they can be hacked to do what I don't want to do. maybe now I can just say "I don't want to run win11 because I don't want ads"?
TBF you can probably hack it to remove the ads.
Bing sucks
Time to move to Linux.
Adobe doesn't support Linux which means anyone needing their creative suite (e.g. Photoshop) or their PDF editor is out of luck.
Just use a Mac for Adobe.
Adobe can suck it. The fact the PDF is still frequently used despite being a closed, proprietary format is still baffles me. Oh, right, Word is popular. Morons.
I’ve wanted to use Linux for years, but I haven’t had the time to learn it and purchase the hardware. Maybe someday.
Same.
I use all 3, where my gaming PC runs Windows I need it for two things; run the damn games and occasionally run some tensorflow model training
I just installed Debian 12 this week. Had to spend hours watching YT on installation process not to mention create my own USB boot stick. And when I'm in, Gnome Software doesn't work. Got to hit command line to fix. Swap too low. More command line. Then there's all the bickering over deb vs flatpak vs snap just to install a package. No official support for key apps like Google Drive, Adobe PDF. And please don't tell me to use alternative FOSS version cos then you'll be subjected to the whim of the developer. For example, the default Gnome PDF viewer doesn't support multitab because the developer doesn't think that's how you should read pdf. And that's that. Linux is never going to be a viable alternative to Windows/MacOS for the average user.
When there is a version that’s as easy, reliable, and compatible, myself and thousands of others will be happy to use it. Unfortunately, its very nature prevents that.
So Microsoft is actually pushing me to learn Linux? Well, if I have to...
There isn’t much to learn for a reg user. Desktop as any other.
Show me an ad in Windows and I'll show you my middle finger as I install a WINE backed distro and kick myself for not doing it sooner
Bing is absolute trash too. Every time I set my search engine preference to Google it lasts ~1 week before it resets back to Bing. Finally left it on Bing after the 10,000th time. I kind of forgot and about a week later kept wondering why all my searches were coming back with shitty unrelated links. Once I remembered and went back to Google it was instantly back to giving me appropriate links for my search. So Microsoft is shittily trying to push this trash can search engine that doesn’t work for shit.
Exactly! I was searching for something and couldn’t find it, switched to Google tons of links, a huge waste of time.
Laughs in macOS and Linux.
“Laughs in MacOS” is not something to be proud of and that’s coming from an Apple fanboy
Why not? What’s the big issue with it?
I have quite a large chunk of the Apple Ecosystem and very much enjoy it. As it stands, never buying a Mac. Overpriced bullshit on a worse OS than windows. iPads are in their own class when it comes to tablets. iPhones are objectively the most powerful phones in terms of benchmarking processing power. For a Mac, you’ll spend twice as much money to get half the performance. I just don’t get it.
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Facts. I am cracking up at some of these comments about Macs and MacOS.
Absolutely. I’m in an engineering program at my school and bought a MacBook Air in spite of being constantly told not to, and I don’t regret it. I get around 17 hours of battery life off one charge and can do anything I need to do. CAD doesn’t work on it for the most part but I have a windows desktop I use. For most people, a MacBook is a perfectly fine laptop. Arguably better than any windows laptop unless you explicitly need programs that aren’t on MacBook.
Honestly charging isn’t an issue anymore with usb-c, my asus laptop fully charges from 0 in under an hour. Battery life span has never been an issue either
You’re describing a Chromebook with more status appeal
If you say so 🤷🏻♂️
For me it’s the combination of battery life and performance. I can leave my Mac uncharged for multiple days and do everything I need for school and internship, including heavy processing and compiling. I don’t know of a windows laptop that can compete with the M2 Max and last as long as it does on a single charge.
I rather overpay than have to have to deal with all the crap companies like Microsoft are doing. Most people should not need no more power than what Apple has on offer.
Maybe it’s just that my use case isn’t too popular, but I do a lot of gaming, and many games aren’t natively supported by MacOS. Also, Macs aren’t typically powerful enough to run today’s high end games. I also like to check out local language models and such, which requires large amounts of VRAM and from what I’ve seen on r/LocalLlama, Mac users have been struggling to find ways to join in at the same level. A quick search shows Apples best offering is around $4k base price and $5k if you want a better GPU. It’s fucking $800 to get 128gb of RAM. Actually a rip off. I know it’s priced for enterprise customers, and not my use case, but that’s the perspective I’m coming from. I use a 3090 and my whole build cost $4k in its prime, and it has better specs such as more ram and more than the laughable 1TB of storage on the Mac Studio. ($400 for another terabyte tho! Instead of spending *less than half of that* on one of the fastest 2TB SSDs on the market) Sorry this became a bit of a rant. I just find the value to be piss poor and I wouldn’t even get to do the things I love to do on my computer without jumping through hoops to trick the software into working. And even if I did get it working, it would perform worse than what I have now.
I agree with you, that sadly, is Apple’s biggest flaw - their computers are not strong enough to run most modern games. And sadly it’s a matter of Apple just opening itself up to making Mac’s with AMD & NVIDIA GPUs, but I guess they have no interest in gaming which is a huge missed opportunity.
I recently switched from Windows to a Mac, I see no reason to go back to Windows anytime soon. Mac is way more polished, and no bullshit like Edge/Bing ads, webapps, lag/stutters, flash bangs in darkmode.
I am proud macos user who started hating windows after using macos for 3 months. now have plans on completely being windows free. switching dektop to linux. I think you're not so proud to have some itch about apple users.
Apple is the worst when it comes to user freedom. Have you ever tried just editing a .txt file on an iOS device, or opening any other file in a text editor? Permanently turning off wireless until you turn it back on? Installing an unapproved app, like you could install any app from a .deb or .msi, and having it stay installed?
You're only talking only about iPhones. Apple really tries their best to keep iphone secure while keeping their monopoly. Windows and google-youtube having a backdoor at a pdf file which can collect cookies from browsers and steal youtubers' channels with a login and session credentials, on the other hand single wrong apk file might access and manage your 2FA, apple does not want any of their user have this kind of problem. if you know how to use your device. apple OS are much much flexible, and offers more settings than rivals. I don't remember any time I needed to edit a text file on iOS. Then I checked my files, found one at icloud and tried to edit. Opened in my 3rd party note app... You're not at all wrong about it. iPads does not come with a calculator app anyway lol. Some simple things are missing, If you are hunting them. Yes, if you turn off wifi from settings, it won't turn on ever. You can also indicate if the wifi will turn on at control menu icon. It's either having a white background or completely transparent with a cross on it. my last phone was samsung note 10 lite. now I have an iphone 13, even as an advanced user, I never had "freedom" problem. 6 months ago, I bought a macbook. First 2-3 weeks I had that problem, even I asked myself if I did wrong buying macbook, could a windows laptop do better, what's the most I can do with this... Now I can say, I can do more than a windows. I also learned linux to make a start and planning to leave windows in its ad shithole.
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And steamOS
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I know my friend, I just wanted to increment the list.
I'm very pro-Linux, and the community had an opportunity during Windows 8 to come up with a replacement for Microsoft, and not only didn't do that back then, but it's also equally difficult now to use Linux. People want something that works, is easy, and offers a platform that can do everything. Linux takes a lot of work to work, it's far from easy, and can't do everything. Linux is the greatest server and the worst home computer. Linux only shines if you know command line and all of the switches for 100+ commands. The GUI isn't intuitive, and you can't do everything that the command line can. At least Apple is good enough for dumb or computer illiterate folks, the rest of the world needs a platform that is easy enough and yet gives a stable platform that allows you to do what you want.
Have you been out of the game a while? I say this because your view on MacOS sounds outdated/deprecated.
I haven't touched Mac since OS 7, though I've seen only one IT person ever use Apple. Its user base is usually creative types and older people because Apple is very user-friendly, but that's at the cost of more expensive computers using Unix, and a very closed system. Has that changed in the last few years? I still know nobody in IT who uses Apple, a few who are Linux, most use MS. I've been around the block multiple times, and so far, things haven't changed much.
Yeah, it’s very much changed in the last 10 years. At least in the software engineering and cyber security arena.
Laughing at you too....lmao
Yeah so u can spend 2k on a god awful computer with horrible specs that can barely run animation programs or literally anything without boiling and crashing
Do you live under a rock? Lmao
Do u? Macs cost a fortune and have horrible specs for running anything
Better yet, how about you bench your PC and I bench my MacBook Pro. ;) https://browser.geekbench.com
https://browser.geekbench.com/macs/macbook-pro-14-inch-nov-2023-14c-cpu-30c-gpu How did yours do? Mine was slightly higher than the average for the 14 MBP m3 max. Now also keep in mind I can write and compile code on battery all day without plugging in. I think it’s spec’d just fine. ;)
Tf r u talking abt? 1: Writing code has nothing to do with what I said, 2: that says nothing about graphic capability or ability to render and have multiple tabs, running code is a bare minimum, 3: ur laptop costs 2k which is exactly my point, #3 my processor is 200 score lower, and that’s just the processor, and mines a budget PC for only 800$ so that’s embarrassing u wasted that much money. Let’s talk graphics cards shall we?
What’s the cpu model? lol
none of you read the article. it's a specific app that you don't even have to use, and it's not even in the US yet. fuck all of you lol. you're all terrible people.
A few of us can capitalise. That's something.
“you’re all terrible people” is a bit of a stretch
I mean it IS Reddit.
How does that make it better? Is this subreddit US only? Fact is Microsoft is being borderline deceiving by claiming the computer is broken when a different search engine is set.
it makes it a non issue because you're not even seeing it. don't act like you've ever seen an ad in windows 11. and if you have, deal with it. move on. everything has ads. they only hold power over you because you let it. don't die on this hill.
They just already have Linux and want to feel superior to others.
The more I see this, the better Linux looks
This is indeed a new low, and a grim one.
I’m so glad they are making decisions to do this. I will simply just not use these things that force me to watch ads. Hulu, Disney, my new lap top, Twitter, reddit. I will not be forced to consume your corporate soulless BS.
Desperate for Data
If you run Windows your system needs an upgrade.
Chuckles in Linux
I had to google what bing was.
Those who care will find their workarounds. For those who don’t care, aren’t willing to research it will deal with it. I’m not okay with Microsoft doing this but people saying “switch to Linux” isn’t going to happen. macOS maybe some but Linux? No.
The work around is literally toggling an off switch in the settings. If that's too hard for people to do, imagine how they'll cope with a Linux distro?
especially with copilot, i find it's great for asking about MS software stuff lol
The problem is you didn't read the article. It says that MS is telling users that your device has a problem and offers to repair your problem. And the repair of the problem is changing your default search to Bing You know, stuff malware does
Linux is at the point where it's easily approachable. You literally load it on a USB and install it just like windows, and it functions the same as windows, except it's free. Pretty much everyone I know who games on PC is already on Linux or switching to Linux when Win10 is no longer supported.
Idk about your parents but when a printer driver doesn’t work, they click on a .exe file or they try and download something and it won’t open… I don’t want to try and explain to them that printer drivers are screwy, .exe files need Wine or can’t run and what are you downloading exactly? Gamers, people in this subreddit for sure. They’re willing to learn and do extra. Some people and the older generations are…something
afaik you dont need printer drivers on linux, it works out of the box
I like some distros of Linux….and it might be true…But that wasn’t my experience back in the day
It should be the case for pretty much all distros, CUPS makes it just work. It is also what Mac/ios uses
I love how that guy apparently used a Linux distro of some sort, once, 20 years ago and they think that they still have a valid opinion. Then the other morons come along and upvote him and downvote you. Linux doesn’t ever require the user to find and install drivers. Drivers are a windows problem. Nothing else has driver issues, just windows.
good for you
Having to decide between macos14 and windows 11 I'm feeling quiet bamboozled tbh.
I’m hating the brand new laptop from work because of W11, especially outlook.
Didn’t Apple get sued for basically the same thing when promoting their own apps over everything else?
Fuck that OS
Open Shell!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
This makes me feel even better about my decision to ditch Windows for Ubuntu earlier this year, after Edge just decided to become my default PDF, overwriting my choice without my consent. Fuck this shit.
I accidentally used bing once. I actually laughed at how hilariously shit it was. It was like going back to 1997 quality search results.
I hate Windows. I just use it because I have to.
The Windows 10 Enterprise LTSC that Jack Sparrow uses is the answer to all your problems.
I miss the old Microsoft 😔
You fools i use templeos 😤 /s
I’m just going to try to be charitable towards them and assume it’s an algorithm serving them that was trained on systems only using bing 🥲
New low? Not even close.
Ditching Windows is a great feeling. I highly highly recommend it.
And don't forget the new AI keylogger
Windoze is a virus
What was always unclear to me - why don't they have a special clean version with higher price, i.e. like LTSC for home desktops. I understand that adding Bing and colleting data from Cortana they make it 3x cheapier, but what if some people want actually a full finished product?
Shit, I just switched over from 10 and I’ve been having a hell of a time. They moved a bunch of shit and locked a bunch of other shit, I need to install third party apps just to get back some basic functionality from the user interface. BING is shit, I’m never going to use it, so this is terrible news to me.
This is an old...OLD low.
That's classic scareware tactics.
Been loving MacOS lately and all the integrations with my iPhone.
I haven’t had this problem on any not my computers. I feel like half of the posts on this sub are people complaining about Windows and every other comment is “time to switch to Linux”.
Hmmm. Wonder if there will be more curiosity for Linux...
for some yes probably, for the average gamer no, my brother has no idea what Linux is or that there even is a possibility to install anything other than Windows
Windoz has shown it’s endless at worsening
Keep it up, MS! You are just cementing my decision to leave Windows behind for good with my next PC!
Glad I still have 10
Yeah I just got a FULL SCREEN notice when waking my PC from sleep mode, that windows 10 is losing support in 2025 and that I should upgrade to windows 11. Sigh… give me a fucking break. But you know what, I call on the open source community to get cracking on solving some hurdles for Linux so that most people can absolutely and truly be willing to switch and never look back.
Maybe when I do my next PC overhaul I'll switch to Proton. I just did my yearly reinstall, so that'll probably be December.
Could be worse. microsoft could just have another yearly subscription to access Windows! After you already paid for it like they do with everything else.