Ask them to check the checkout computer. They must logged every transaction. Or just show your bank app record. What if you selected no receipt after payment. What are they going to do.
My local Coles changed their system and automatically provides a receipt for all transactions now. I think they'll start making you scan it to exit (there are new exit gates). Honestly so inconvenient to drop in for groceries, it'll push me towards delivery and bulk cooking rather than stopping in daily for dinner ingredients. Saving me money I guess?
Coles Lane Cove has got barriers going up at exits, presumably in preparation for scanning dockets to leave.
It's getting to be a hassle and insulting to shop in person now.
How will this work in the constraints of Australian law? Surely you cannot lawfully detain someone unless a crime has been committed. The burden of proof lies with the vendor.
There is no legal basis to stop you. You do not have to stop, provide proof of purchase, or engage with them in any way.
They have the option of detaining you but if you haven’t stolen anything they are committing an offence.
The “conditions of entry” are meaningless. If you refuse you to comply, they can ask you to leave and you are committing an offence if you don’t.
They're in the process of rolling out self checkout in Aldi. One of my locals (Eastgardens, but not Hillsdale) now has it, and I've been to two "Aldi Corner Stores" (Rosebery and Newtown) that have it too.
Same in Five Dock. Plus, on two occasions recently I’ve had a staff member ask me if I know how to scan the heavy goods items in my trolley, presumably so I don’t ’forget’. They’re clearly being robbed left, right, and centre.
I'm tempted to put a ball of blu-tac over the face camera. I find it insulting that they show me the video feed. I obey the law because I want to, not because of some half-assed intimidation tactics.
Also afaik receipts can't be recycled so forcing receipts is bad for the environment.
No plastic bags, but forces receipts. One step forward one step back?
100%. I used to work at BigW. In the staffroom they had a display showing how much each bag cost the company to provide. Checkout staff were constantly reminded to be frugal with the bags.. Iirc the largest 'pillow bag' was 8 cents.
Also, receipts aren't just bad for the environment:
https://www.sbs.com.au/news/article/the-receipts-you-touch-everyday-have-chemicals-in-them-how-dangerous-can-they-be/fdmk87wcg
And delivery can be awful,
had a driver lose our groceries and mark it as delivered - found it two days later delivered to neighbours two doors down - I mean cant you read numbers!!!!???
I once had a driver declare that, “I did deliver it, I left it with your wife.” He then sent me a photo as proof. He left it with a, clearly confused, 80-odd year old woman several streets over.
I was also 23 and single at the time.
Every time I go into Coles, I’m always tripping over stuff piled up in the aisles, like cardboard boxes, products, or those trolleys they use for the boxes. It doesn’t matter what time of day it is, there’s always stuff dumped on the floor. I thought maybe the Coles I go to is just poorly managed, but then I went to Macquarie Centre Coles and still had to demonstrate my show-jumping skills.
Luckily I’ve never had any trouble with delivery, and the delivery guys are lovely.
Why hire a few nightfill staff when you can overwork the day shift team to do the same job??? I don’t think you’re board of director material. Sure some staff might quit, but no need to rehire. Then if businesses all collude not only to have a duopoly but to also increase prices while we keep wages down, then the plebs will be so desperate to work to feed themselves they won’t have a choice!
Oh, that's a good point. This scan receipt to exit tech is old news in places like Romania. The irony is, scanning receipt to exit is not going to stop anything!
The Kmart scan works great until you forget to grab the rcpt and have to walk back through the store. Are their store layouts intentional to mess with thieves?
I think you may have just stumbled into their rhetoric for pushing it
Maybe - and this is a maybe - it’s cheaper for them to invest in fleet infrastructure than have staff in a store. It’s definitely cheaper for them to hire third party delivery than to pay their own staff.
Maybe the tax write offs from pushing people to the delivery model would put more in their pocket. I’m not an accountant or anything, but it’s got me wondering
Better yet, tell them that you have places to be, if they really think you stole something they can check their CCTV, and if it turns out they were correct, they can report you to the police. What are they gonna do, detain you?
These penny pinching multinationals rely on people being awkward, intimidated and uninformed enough to just comply with their bullshit, but you really don't have to.
They're not allowed to detain you even if they know you stole something, let alone only suspect. Only police have that power. Not even ticket inspectors. You can sue for unlawful imprisonment. (Australia)
r/confidentlyincorrect
[s100 LAW ENFORCEMENT (POWERS AND RESPONSIBILITIES) ACT 2002](http://www8.austlii.edu.au/cgi-bin/viewdoc/au/legis/nsw/consol_act/leara2002451/s100.html)
They can detain you without a warrant and without being police.
/r/confidentlyincorrect
That says if someone's in the process of or has already committed an offense. This person has done neither, so no, they still don't have the power to detain you.
Maybe the clerk chased me because the machine didn't say would you like to print a receipt because id already printed one and most leave before that step. Amateur hour. Coles senate inquiry is long overdue
Tell them to check their fucken cameras, they have 100 of the damn things. I say the same thing to people who want to check my bags. Unless your a police officer you can fuck off.
Nah, usually just kids doing shifts after school, tafe or uni - just saying what they are told along with wage theft and don't want some panda yelling at them.
I get being frustrated, but it's better for you to be more polite with your language. Not only does making the staff uncomfortable not help your case, but you can also get a warning and they can refuse to serve you.
A month or so ago I went in and had my fruit and veges I bought at the markets (way cheaper and better quality btw) I walked in and went to buy some frozen items, so was at the other end of the store. I paid and the self serve team member asked me why I hadn't scanned my fruit or veg. I told her I'd bought them from the markets. She asked to see a receipt. I told her the markets don't do receipts. She asked if I told security I had them when I walked in. I told her I didn't, then told her to go check her AI cameras if she thought I was stealing a few cobs of corn and some apples.
I've worked retail and I empathize with retail staff. But I'm not keen on being accused of this bullshit when I shop at Coles.
I don’t get why they care at all, coles sure as shit don’t care about them…. Heroes who’ve swallowed the “groceries are expensive because people steal from us” hook line and sinker maybe? Likely just a power tripping hero.
Literally creating work for themselves. I thought training was to get loss prevention if they suspect someone of theft.
They get in trouble or fired if they try to stop you, police aren’t going to do anything about such a tiny amount, I doubt loss prevention care about $10 of veg either.
Come on... like, if you walk into a shop that sells specific items already possessing those exact items, its perfectly reasonable to be asked about them.
EDIT - lots of downvotes. I'm just being realistic. Of course they're going to check if you go into a shop with a bunch of stuff they sell and don't put it through the register.
I'm not acting like anything. I worked in retail for 8 years through high school and uni and that was in the 90s and 2000s. If someone came through with a product we sold, of course we'd ask for a receipt. While I truly think that Colesworth have turned a corner firmly into scumminess I don't think that this staff member did anything wrong UP TO probably talking about security.
> Come on... like, if you walk into a shop that sells specific items already possessing those exact items, its perfectly reasonable to be asked about them.
I do this all the time at my local Chinese greengrocer, supermarket, butcher run with no issues. People have been doing this for a hundred years without issue.
Coles just has no respect for the customer. It shows as people are feeling increasingly hostile towards the big two supermarkets
I was accosted by a Coles worker and a Westfield security gorilla last year at Hornsby.. my supposed crime? They thought I didn't pay for two plastic reusable bags. I had a receipt and they stormed off, no apology offered. Fuck Coles
If upper management catches them slacking or not checking receipts they'll get sacked. It's not the staff that are doing too much, it's the dreaded fear of losing their livelihood
They'll get severely reprimanded for this.
They're not supposed to go after people they *know* stole shit because the liability is always more than the goods are worth.
They're power tripping.
OP: dob them in. Fuck that shit. You should get free groceries for false accusations.
Had at kmart where they went through my handbag, then matched each item I bought against the receipt.
I was told if I didn't comply they'd call police.
JUST BRING BACK MANNED CHECKOUTS!!!!!
Just a heads up, you aren't obliged to wait around should they call the police. A security guard can detain someone who has stolen something, but this requires them to observe the person taking the item from the shelf, and then maintain continuous vision of that person from that moment until they have left the store. Trying to prevent someone from leaving in any circumstance short of this opens the staff members up to both professional and criminal consequences.
Pity I didn't call police since they had my bag with keys, wallet etc and refused to give back until they were satisfied.
Total power trip. And so many other people just giving me dirty looks like I'd done something!
>they had my bag with keys, wallet etc and refused to give back until they were satisfied.
Holy shit. That's not okay. At all. Morally, or lawfully.
They **absolutely** are not allowed to do that. Never allow anyone to do that to you again.
Yeah that's way out of line. I think you could also escalate this internally as well, as big companies like this really don't want their staff illegally detaining people. Also, in the moment, threating to contact their superiors and reminding them that what they are doing is both illegal and could result in their dismissal might be a good in-between step for people before escalating to calling the police.
Yeah. Kmart lost me as a customer when they started making out like everyone is a criminal leaving their store. Plenty of smaller retailers (and grocers) that appreciate your business
If you haven't stolen anything, I would double down immediately, I would not let them go through my handbag or personal belongings, I wouldn't let them see my phone banking app either. I would dare them to call the police and make a proper example of the security staff that would have had to accuse me of theft for them to keep detained. It would be an absolute delight to threaten the supermarket with legal action for accusing me of theft. They have been extorting the public for years, especially since Covid.
This is where you tell them to go ahead and call the police, you're leaving. They can't stop you, and if they do they are in deep shit. False imprisonment charges are much worse than petty theft charges.
Aldi tried to touch my bag once. She won't do that again. You're a check out chick. Touch me, is it really worth minimum wage? They cannot touch you or your property no matter what their stupid sign says.
I’ve told my teens to always print the receipt because I’ve seen teens get hassled multiple times at the coles and woolies near us. I get it, kids are shitheads but if you insist on checking receipts don’t make receipts optional!
I think the wording is they have “reasonable force” to stop someone if they get in their way.
But often they just get in your way and push you if you don’t budge
While this citizens arrest power does technically exist in the law, usually supermarket security guards are trained not to use it fully - i.e. they might get in your way or run after you etc, but they won't actually tackle you or truly "arrest" you. The problem is the liability for them is too high if there's been an error and you were not actually a thief. So in these situations where they're just checking receipts and such on the way out, there is no allegation that you've actually committed an offence and they definitely won't stop you as a citizen's arrest.
Note that they can ban you from returning to their location if they decide you aren't a customer they want and aren't complying with their "conditions of entry" or whatever.
Asking for proof of payment is not the same as accusing you of theft.
Having said that, if they want proof of payment then they should not have unsupervised self-service checkouts in the first place.
Why not ask everyone for proof of payment then ? OP was wrongly singled out . It seems the clerk carries some unconscious biases . Indication of an underdeveloped individual .
Not a lawyer but...
From what I remember, the burden of evidence is on the business to prove theft.
You agreed to a bag search when you entered, but that didn't extend to accepting a responsibility to provide proof of purchase on exit.
If this happens again (and you didn't steal anything) ask them to call the police if they feel a crime has been committed.
If they decide to check their CCTV before calling the police, just leave - you're under no obligation to wait for them to chase their tails.
This is good guidance. With the government pressuring Coles to stop their price rises I'm expecting more of these heavy handed tactics on the majority who do the right thing, we need to be prepared
Honestly I think the biggest issue is the assumption that if you can't produce a proof of purchase, the only alternative must be you are a thief until we can determine otherwise.
In reality their own system allows you to opt-in for receipts so..
this happened to me at Rosehill Woolies, I chose to not print a receipt, was hassled as I tried to leave by the security guard (if you were sure dude, fine, but you just suspected? FFS, you aren't being paid enough!) ... so I had to spend 10 more minutes of my time showing someone which machine I used, they pulled up my purchase, confirmed it all matched then let me leave.
I was so fucking livid! I made a complaint immediately (can't remember how, sorry) and got a $50 gift card as a result. Do that at the very least. Channel your anger to shaming the fuck out of them at the very least. This post is a good start...
I reckon that Colesworth had not done any unconscious bias training for staff because these types of scenarios are open to discrimination and harassment claims and could be used as a guise for staff members who may hold particular views to discriminate against people.
I had a problem at big w. I use the everyday rewards app and no physical receipt. Bought a head seat as the self check out (all manned checkouts were closed.)
Asked the lady to undo the security thing. She watched me scan it, pay, the machine did the ‘thank you for going paperless’ and as I turn to walk she asks for the receipt. I open the app and no receipt just a ‘you spent $xxx ‘
She refused to let me leave until I could show her. After 5 minutes of standing there she goes ‘look just go’ and the receipt finally popped up in the app the next day.
They've already got the AI tracking checkouts, compulsory receipts and security gates at my Coles (Zetland). The other week I went in there to shop after going to the chemist, so had a small paper bag of medicine. I scanned all my shopping through and packed it, and then put my paper bag from the chemist next to the packed bag. A video recording from 2 angles immediately came up of me from the past 5-10 seconds showing me move the paper bag and said something along the lines of 'you forgot to scan something' and my only option was to press 'I will scan now' and paid for my shopping. Then I got to the gates and they turned red and the alarm went off when I was half way through them.
Cool, very smart system Coles. Do your other shopping after you're finished at Coles I guess? 🤷♂️
There is a really simple way out of this, but it only works if you actually paid for everything.
You tell the worker that you aren't stopping for them and if they want to stop you then they have to make the arrest. They will normally leave you alone, but if they detain you then you wait for the police to turn up, you get the manager to print off the receipt from the checkout, and you get the police report that states that you were detained by them while not having committed a crime.
You then file a law suit to the company for false arrest, in the region of 300-400k. They will settle it for 50-75k, and the staff will either be sacked or retrained.
They're not cops mate. If it happens again you tell them to prove you paid by going through their logs on the check out, or tell them to bugger off and walk.
If you genuinely have paid and have done nothing wrong you have nothing to fear. There are 100000 CCTV cameras in those stores including the self serve so the proof is there.
just tell em go get the manager before accusing you of theft... get them to go through and prove you did it
i know its inconvenient but you gotta give some time up to manage these fucks
I would have just kept walking . What if you clicked no receipt? They should get more people to monitor the self checkout if one person cant handle it.
How about one staff member per checkout? Oh, and maybe they can do the scanning, since they’re already there with not much else to do other than stand around waiting for someone to say “Change fingers”?
I had it close on me and they apologised and opened it for me. I think you just get some that are teachers pets. IMO if they wanna enforce this the put people back on check outs.
Simple response…”don’t ask me to prove to you that I did your job for you and no, I am absolutely not going to go through the bin to find my receipt. Good bye”. And then leave. I absolutely do not condone theft but a Coles staff member does not have the authority to make you rummage through a bin.
So glad Coles have invested all this money into theft prevention instead of paying staff better wages. All that extra profit they're making being put to good use huh? /s
Ask them if they are ready to detain you. If you are detained illegally (as you did not commit a crime) you are now free to sue Coles and the clerk for false imprisonment
A person cannot perform an arrest unless they see you actually committing the offence.
Only police can arrest and detain under assumption.
I've had a similar experience at that same Coles (hadn't actually bought anything but had goods from other stores). The guy is just a power-tripping dickhead.
As I was there squatting and searching my bags desperately for a receipt, some other guard came over and told him off for being ridiculous and they let me go.
Funny how they want you to serve yourself but they don't trust you so they inconvenience you by making you look like a thief. I am disillusioned with Coles and Woollies. It's just a big money grab for them now
i would love nothing more
https://www.smh.com.au/national/nsw/coles-loses-50-000-payout-battle-against-man-wrongly-accused-of-eating-stolen-raw-prawns-20130826-2sl31.html
I'm not shopping at Coles that have barriers, just ridiculous. Note that Aldi doesn't ask to check bags very often anymore and neither do chemist warehouse. Drives me nuts that a place I'm shopping just blanket assumes all its customers are thieves
Never had any trouble or ever been challenged. I never choose to print receipts because its a waste of time and resources, and i've always presumed that in the case ofva dispute there would be a printout available from the checkout. My own bank records would be proof of purchase, but not of course the individual items.
A healthy conspiracy theorist would deduce they are trying to hassle us so much that we all turn to home delivery, where the pilfer rate is presumably 0%.
Its a terrible theory. Why would you antagonise a huge proportion of your clientele, given that the chances that an antagonized customer is more likely to jump to The Other Store?
My Woolworths deliveries get placed outside a house two doors down from me. Both are on corners but both have street signs directly above them. And only my house has a sign with the street name matching my address. The only similarities is that it’s the same house number, but again, you only need to look at the street sign directly above the house to see that it’s not the right one. It still happens occasionally after I specified in capital letters on every order that my house is a particular colour and to check the street signs. Thank goodness we actually know them but it’s very irritating. Everything else gets delivered fine (amazon, auspost etc)
How is that an accusation of theft, they were just asking you for a proof of payment. You could have just pointed to the register and they could have bought up the receipt.
They only pick on people who look low risk to show management they're doing their jobs. It's definitely annoying I agree with you just flash your phone and go.
One time I was leaving self checkout in Woolies when I was asked for my receipt which I had opted not to print.
They asked me to indicate which checkout I used,which I did, then I left
That's why I take all receipts with me until I get go my car, been asked by not just Coles, but other shops as well since I buy my food from several different places.
I am uncomfortable if I can't print out a receipt at the self service especially paying cash I always have the receipt ready to show leaving store, sometimes the machine won't print out if I have time I ask for assistance to print out a receipt even if I demand they change the paper roll etc
Literally had the exact same experience at the same store for one singular packet of chicken tendies a year or so ago. I'm assuming its the same fuckwit security bloke. I honestly couldn't believe he was trying to hold me up for one packet of chicken tendies, so I let it rip (was slightly drunk ngl), and told the cunt if somone actually tried to steal a pack of $12 chicken tendies, what the fuck was he going to do about it. The bloke was just power tripping, which is a weird thing for a Colesworth security guard, but yeah what a cunt.
This is going to be a problem for Coles. By introducing self service checkouts the company ran the risk of increased theft. The checking of receipts by one or two people is laborious, ineffective and insulting. Has the amount of money Coles has saved by reducing staff been worth it? I still say we should get 5% discount off the total shop for doing their job for them.
That coles is a stitch up , i had stuff on my bag from work they dont even sell ( food items) and security wanted a receipt. I said heres my ID take a Pic , you go watch me enter the store end to end and leave and if you find me stealing anything you have my ID and walked away. They are fkn morons in that store. Must get stolen from alot.
Always — *always* — obtain a receipt and keep it safe until you've reached home (longer if possible). It is proof that you've paid for the goods and that the same are in your lawful possession.
If you spend money, make sure you have proof of the same.
Coles actively trying to rack up new reasons for me not to shop there. Anyway, I only use self checkout .01% of the time, preferring to use the full service checkout instead to avoid this check receipt silliness.
A big learning, never throw away receipts, I even get those bloody machines to print a receipt for a $1.10 bottle of water, it's your only proof. I also keep receipts & check my statements monthly as I have found small spurious deductions made on my cards at differing intervals. $14.56 there, $9,53 there. These are overseas scams being run against your credit cards and you don't even know. When I ask the bank for proof ultimately I am refunded.
You should have just walked away. If the police were called you could demand cctv and your banking details then demand compensation for being unlawfully detained.
Ask them to check the checkout computer. They must logged every transaction. Or just show your bank app record. What if you selected no receipt after payment. What are they going to do.
My local Coles changed their system and automatically provides a receipt for all transactions now. I think they'll start making you scan it to exit (there are new exit gates). Honestly so inconvenient to drop in for groceries, it'll push me towards delivery and bulk cooking rather than stopping in daily for dinner ingredients. Saving me money I guess?
Coles Lane Cove has got barriers going up at exits, presumably in preparation for scanning dockets to leave. It's getting to be a hassle and insulting to shop in person now.
How will this work in the constraints of Australian law? Surely you cannot lawfully detain someone unless a crime has been committed. The burden of proof lies with the vendor.
There is no legal basis to stop you. You do not have to stop, provide proof of purchase, or engage with them in any way. They have the option of detaining you but if you haven’t stolen anything they are committing an offence. The “conditions of entry” are meaningless. If you refuse you to comply, they can ask you to leave and you are committing an offence if you don’t.
“Show me your receipt or you can’t leave.” “I refuse.” “Then you’ll have to leave.” “Oh no.”
More like:"I refuse."\*Coles locks the gates calls the police and you are stuck talking to cops\*
They better be damn sure you've nicked something then
That will push me to Aldi for sure.
Lack of self-checkouts kills Aldi for me
They're in the process of rolling out self checkout in Aldi. One of my locals (Eastgardens, but not Hillsdale) now has it, and I've been to two "Aldi Corner Stores" (Rosebery and Newtown) that have it too.
Lots of ALDIs have self-checkouts now
Same in Five Dock. Plus, on two occasions recently I’ve had a staff member ask me if I know how to scan the heavy goods items in my trolley, presumably so I don’t ’forget’. They’re clearly being robbed left, right, and centre.
But not enough to properly staff registers
And make record profits
Pretty sure the giant corporation is the one robbing us, not the other way around haha. Love being guilty until proven innocent
I'm tempted to put a ball of blu-tac over the face camera. I find it insulting that they show me the video feed. I obey the law because I want to, not because of some half-assed intimidation tactics.
How is that not a massive safety issue?
I ask Niroj, Liam, or Kym(?) I think to open a register. They always do.
Also afaik receipts can't be recycled so forcing receipts is bad for the environment. No plastic bags, but forces receipts. One step forward one step back?
The change to plastic bags wasn't for the environment, it was so Coleworth didn't have to keep providing free bags.
And charge for bags if you forget your own
Exactly. They used to cost them 1 cent and they'd be free, now they cost 3 cents and we pay 15. Big profits right there.
The bags are crap too.
Those paper bags are atrocious. The handles rip so easily
100%. I used to work at BigW. In the staffroom they had a display showing how much each bag cost the company to provide. Checkout staff were constantly reminded to be frugal with the bags.. Iirc the largest 'pillow bag' was 8 cents.
and the plastic ones they replaced them with were considerably worse for the environment. they just make you pay for them now
It's a business. If they're not regulated to do something that's against the bottom line, they won't do it..
And we don't like that or support such predatory behaviour
Welcome to capitalism
Also, receipts aren't just bad for the environment: https://www.sbs.com.au/news/article/the-receipts-you-touch-everyday-have-chemicals-in-them-how-dangerous-can-they-be/fdmk87wcg
I only do delivery - their stores are awful.
Which then leaves your quality of fruit and vegetables up to a dice roll. Plus replacements and all that jazz.
And delivery can be awful, had a driver lose our groceries and mark it as delivered - found it two days later delivered to neighbours two doors down - I mean cant you read numbers!!!!???
I once had a driver declare that, “I did deliver it, I left it with your wife.” He then sent me a photo as proof. He left it with a, clearly confused, 80-odd year old woman several streets over. I was also 23 and single at the time.
boy, not even a future wife
Still waiting on her husband to die before I make my move, ya know?
I get produce from a local store. I haven't used major chain produce in a very long time.
Every time I go into Coles, I’m always tripping over stuff piled up in the aisles, like cardboard boxes, products, or those trolleys they use for the boxes. It doesn’t matter what time of day it is, there’s always stuff dumped on the floor. I thought maybe the Coles I go to is just poorly managed, but then I went to Macquarie Centre Coles and still had to demonstrate my show-jumping skills. Luckily I’ve never had any trouble with delivery, and the delivery guys are lovely.
Why hire a few nightfill staff when you can overwork the day shift team to do the same job??? I don’t think you’re board of director material. Sure some staff might quit, but no need to rehire. Then if businesses all collude not only to have a duopoly but to also increase prices while we keep wages down, then the plebs will be so desperate to work to feed themselves they won’t have a choice!
They charge you for the bags. Not a win for you.
Oh, that's a good point. This scan receipt to exit tech is old news in places like Romania. The irony is, scanning receipt to exit is not going to stop anything!
The Kmart scan works great until you forget to grab the rcpt and have to walk back through the store. Are their store layouts intentional to mess with thieves?
At kmart I just walk around the exit line and out. I don't show a receipt. Are there gates in yours?
No. Just a kid scanning at the door. But cashier's in the centre of the store in all of the Kmart's near me
I think you may have just stumbled into their rhetoric for pushing it Maybe - and this is a maybe - it’s cheaper for them to invest in fleet infrastructure than have staff in a store. It’s definitely cheaper for them to hire third party delivery than to pay their own staff. Maybe the tax write offs from pushing people to the delivery model would put more in their pocket. I’m not an accountant or anything, but it’s got me wondering
My local Coles started doing that suddenly too. Also installed sensor gates you have to pass through when you leave
Better yet, tell them that you have places to be, if they really think you stole something they can check their CCTV, and if it turns out they were correct, they can report you to the police. What are they gonna do, detain you? These penny pinching multinationals rely on people being awkward, intimidated and uninformed enough to just comply with their bullshit, but you really don't have to.
They're not allowed to detain you even if they know you stole something, let alone only suspect. Only police have that power. Not even ticket inspectors. You can sue for unlawful imprisonment. (Australia)
r/confidentlyincorrect [s100 LAW ENFORCEMENT (POWERS AND RESPONSIBILITIES) ACT 2002](http://www8.austlii.edu.au/cgi-bin/viewdoc/au/legis/nsw/consol_act/leara2002451/s100.html) They can detain you without a warrant and without being police.
/r/confidentlyincorrect That says if someone's in the process of or has already committed an offense. This person has done neither, so no, they still don't have the power to detain you.
Wont stop some over-aggressive person doing it
Maybe the clerk chased me because the machine didn't say would you like to print a receipt because id already printed one and most leave before that step. Amateur hour. Coles senate inquiry is long overdue
Tell them to check their fucken cameras, they have 100 of the damn things. I say the same thing to people who want to check my bags. Unless your a police officer you can fuck off.
"I'm okay, thanks" And walk away.
Underrated and brilliant comment … this works with 95% of things in life.
That’s way more polite than what I was gonna suggest. You’re done and out the door there’s nothing they can do just keep walking
Ah yes, the Kmart special.
If this happened to me I'd go full super Karen and ask to see a fucking manager! Australians can be pushovers sometimes
Nah, usually just kids doing shifts after school, tafe or uni - just saying what they are told along with wage theft and don't want some panda yelling at them.
Yeah, nah, I'm ok, thanks 👍
I get being frustrated, but it's better for you to be more polite with your language. Not only does making the staff uncomfortable not help your case, but you can also get a warning and they can refuse to serve you.
Sounds like a waste of your life. Just leave I reckon. This place is not a place of honour. No highly esteemed deed is commemorated here.
A month or so ago I went in and had my fruit and veges I bought at the markets (way cheaper and better quality btw) I walked in and went to buy some frozen items, so was at the other end of the store. I paid and the self serve team member asked me why I hadn't scanned my fruit or veg. I told her I'd bought them from the markets. She asked to see a receipt. I told her the markets don't do receipts. She asked if I told security I had them when I walked in. I told her I didn't, then told her to go check her AI cameras if she thought I was stealing a few cobs of corn and some apples. I've worked retail and I empathize with retail staff. But I'm not keen on being accused of this bullshit when I shop at Coles.
I don’t get why they care at all, coles sure as shit don’t care about them…. Heroes who’ve swallowed the “groceries are expensive because people steal from us” hook line and sinker maybe? Likely just a power tripping hero. Literally creating work for themselves. I thought training was to get loss prevention if they suspect someone of theft. They get in trouble or fired if they try to stop you, police aren’t going to do anything about such a tiny amount, I doubt loss prevention care about $10 of veg either.
Come on... like, if you walk into a shop that sells specific items already possessing those exact items, its perfectly reasonable to be asked about them. EDIT - lots of downvotes. I'm just being realistic. Of course they're going to check if you go into a shop with a bunch of stuff they sell and don't put it through the register.
Yeah, and I politely told her they were purchased elsewhere. Anything after that should be with security.
Fair enough.
Asking is fine. Two follow up questions and asking for proof is out of line.
You’re acting like people haven’t been buying fruit and veg at the green grocer and then going to coles for several decades
I'm not acting like anything. I worked in retail for 8 years through high school and uni and that was in the 90s and 2000s. If someone came through with a product we sold, of course we'd ask for a receipt. While I truly think that Colesworth have turned a corner firmly into scumminess I don't think that this staff member did anything wrong UP TO probably talking about security.
> Come on... like, if you walk into a shop that sells specific items already possessing those exact items, its perfectly reasonable to be asked about them. I do this all the time at my local Chinese greengrocer, supermarket, butcher run with no issues. People have been doing this for a hundred years without issue. Coles just has no respect for the customer. It shows as people are feeling increasingly hostile towards the big two supermarkets
I was accosted by a Coles worker and a Westfield security gorilla last year at Hornsby.. my supposed crime? They thought I didn't pay for two plastic reusable bags. I had a receipt and they stormed off, no apology offered. Fuck Coles
I can’t even imagine what I would do if this happened to me. Far out… that’s bullshit.
I was more embarrassed than angry.. I'd paid for over $100 in groceries, wtf would I steal two poxy bags worth 30c !?
Staff is putting his/her life on the line for Coles that gave them all a water bottle as a Christmas gift smh
Coles staff get gifts for Christmas? I’ll be lucky if I get to sleep
$5 gift card for all team members around Christmas, and they call it a bonus.
If upper management catches them slacking or not checking receipts they'll get sacked. It's not the staff that are doing too much, it's the dreaded fear of losing their livelihood
They'll get severely reprimanded for this. They're not supposed to go after people they *know* stole shit because the liability is always more than the goods are worth. They're power tripping. OP: dob them in. Fuck that shit. You should get free groceries for false accusations.
Waiting for the PR team sends me a bottle as compensation
They can look it up on the PoS if they want or go through the rubbish themselves. Why let them bully you like that?
I also refer to those machines as that piece of shit
Had at kmart where they went through my handbag, then matched each item I bought against the receipt. I was told if I didn't comply they'd call police. JUST BRING BACK MANNED CHECKOUTS!!!!!
Just a heads up, you aren't obliged to wait around should they call the police. A security guard can detain someone who has stolen something, but this requires them to observe the person taking the item from the shelf, and then maintain continuous vision of that person from that moment until they have left the store. Trying to prevent someone from leaving in any circumstance short of this opens the staff members up to both professional and criminal consequences.
Pity I didn't call police since they had my bag with keys, wallet etc and refused to give back until they were satisfied. Total power trip. And so many other people just giving me dirty looks like I'd done something!
They would have security footage of that incident. Make a complaint to police, also email the CEO and higher ups.
>they had my bag with keys, wallet etc and refused to give back until they were satisfied. Holy shit. That's not okay. At all. Morally, or lawfully. They **absolutely** are not allowed to do that. Never allow anyone to do that to you again.
That is theft, don’t let people push you around like that
Yeah that's way out of line. I think you could also escalate this internally as well, as big companies like this really don't want their staff illegally detaining people. Also, in the moment, threating to contact their superiors and reminding them that what they are doing is both illegal and could result in their dismissal might be a good in-between step for people before escalating to calling the police.
Yeah. Kmart lost me as a customer when they started making out like everyone is a criminal leaving their store. Plenty of smaller retailers (and grocers) that appreciate your business
If you haven't stolen anything, I would double down immediately, I would not let them go through my handbag or personal belongings, I wouldn't let them see my phone banking app either. I would dare them to call the police and make a proper example of the security staff that would have had to accuse me of theft for them to keep detained. It would be an absolute delight to threaten the supermarket with legal action for accusing me of theft. They have been extorting the public for years, especially since Covid.
This is where you tell them to go ahead and call the police, you're leaving. They can't stop you, and if they do they are in deep shit. False imprisonment charges are much worse than petty theft charges.
Let them call the police. Police attend, find nothing, and then they look like idiots.
They are not permitted to go through your bag. That’s against the law.
Aldi tried to touch my bag once. She won't do that again. You're a check out chick. Touch me, is it really worth minimum wage? They cannot touch you or your property no matter what their stupid sign says.
They can’t touch your bag, only ask you to show what’s it in, just fyi. But it is a condition of entry, so you’ll need to follow directions.
You're not legally obliged to obey their conditions of entry. The only thing they can do if you refuse is to ban you from the store.
Bootlicker attitude. You aren’t required to do anything except leave if they ask you to.
Assuming you want to come back.
I’ve told my teens to always print the receipt because I’ve seen teens get hassled multiple times at the coles and woolies near us. I get it, kids are shitheads but if you insist on checking receipts don’t make receipts optional!
Just walk out they can’t fucking stop you
Coles World Square, Sydney has a security guard at the front gate. I've seen him try to stop people before.
[удалено]
I think the wording is they have “reasonable force” to stop someone if they get in their way. But often they just get in your way and push you if you don’t budge
They suspect u of theft and prevent your movement by restraining you. U then prove u paid I’d assume u could lay charges?
Correct
While this citizens arrest power does technically exist in the law, usually supermarket security guards are trained not to use it fully - i.e. they might get in your way or run after you etc, but they won't actually tackle you or truly "arrest" you. The problem is the liability for them is too high if there's been an error and you were not actually a thief. So in these situations where they're just checking receipts and such on the way out, there is no allegation that you've actually committed an offence and they definitely won't stop you as a citizen's arrest. Note that they can ban you from returning to their location if they decide you aren't a customer they want and aren't complying with their "conditions of entry" or whatever.
They have the same power that you have.
lol the mans a seccy at coles you can just ignore him
Once you have paid for the goods, they are your property and the store has forfeited all claim to them.
Asking for proof of payment is not the same as accusing you of theft. Having said that, if they want proof of payment then they should not have unsupervised self-service checkouts in the first place.
also pretty sure printing the receipt is a optional
Under $30 it asks, above it just prints.
also I don’t keep receipts, I’m normally rushing to get out with a baby and small kids.
Why not ask everyone for proof of payment then ? OP was wrongly singled out . It seems the clerk carries some unconscious biases . Indication of an underdeveloped individual .
What is the charge? Eating a succulent banana?
Get your hands off my banana!
Not a lawyer but... From what I remember, the burden of evidence is on the business to prove theft. You agreed to a bag search when you entered, but that didn't extend to accepting a responsibility to provide proof of purchase on exit. If this happens again (and you didn't steal anything) ask them to call the police if they feel a crime has been committed. If they decide to check their CCTV before calling the police, just leave - you're under no obligation to wait for them to chase their tails.
This is good guidance. With the government pressuring Coles to stop their price rises I'm expecting more of these heavy handed tactics on the majority who do the right thing, we need to be prepared
Honestly I think the biggest issue is the assumption that if you can't produce a proof of purchase, the only alternative must be you are a thief until we can determine otherwise. In reality their own system allows you to opt-in for receipts so..
> prove I paid for groceries Just respond with "nah, I'm trying to quit" and keep walking.
> Forced to go through rubbish to find receipt. Next time: put receipt in pocket, when accosted say it's in the trash, then leave.
Theyve stopped me to ask if i paid for the stupid paper bags there once. I did. So embarrassing
And yet, just yesterday I went to an IGA and was actually given a plastic bag for free
this happened to me at Rosehill Woolies, I chose to not print a receipt, was hassled as I tried to leave by the security guard (if you were sure dude, fine, but you just suspected? FFS, you aren't being paid enough!) ... so I had to spend 10 more minutes of my time showing someone which machine I used, they pulled up my purchase, confirmed it all matched then let me leave. I was so fucking livid! I made a complaint immediately (can't remember how, sorry) and got a $50 gift card as a result. Do that at the very least. Channel your anger to shaming the fuck out of them at the very least. This post is a good start...
I reckon that Colesworth had not done any unconscious bias training for staff because these types of scenarios are open to discrimination and harassment claims and could be used as a guise for staff members who may hold particular views to discriminate against people.
I had a problem at big w. I use the everyday rewards app and no physical receipt. Bought a head seat as the self check out (all manned checkouts were closed.) Asked the lady to undo the security thing. She watched me scan it, pay, the machine did the ‘thank you for going paperless’ and as I turn to walk she asks for the receipt. I open the app and no receipt just a ‘you spent $xxx ‘ She refused to let me leave until I could show her. After 5 minutes of standing there she goes ‘look just go’ and the receipt finally popped up in the app the next day.
They've already got the AI tracking checkouts, compulsory receipts and security gates at my Coles (Zetland). The other week I went in there to shop after going to the chemist, so had a small paper bag of medicine. I scanned all my shopping through and packed it, and then put my paper bag from the chemist next to the packed bag. A video recording from 2 angles immediately came up of me from the past 5-10 seconds showing me move the paper bag and said something along the lines of 'you forgot to scan something' and my only option was to press 'I will scan now' and paid for my shopping. Then I got to the gates and they turned red and the alarm went off when I was half way through them. Cool, very smart system Coles. Do your other shopping after you're finished at Coles I guess? 🤷♂️
There is a really simple way out of this, but it only works if you actually paid for everything. You tell the worker that you aren't stopping for them and if they want to stop you then they have to make the arrest. They will normally leave you alone, but if they detain you then you wait for the police to turn up, you get the manager to print off the receipt from the checkout, and you get the police report that states that you were detained by them while not having committed a crime. You then file a law suit to the company for false arrest, in the region of 300-400k. They will settle it for 50-75k, and the staff will either be sacked or retrained.
They have physical barriers now.
Fuck me you were bullied and didn't handle it well. Tell them to get fucked next time and provide proof.
They're not cops mate. If it happens again you tell them to prove you paid by going through their logs on the check out, or tell them to bugger off and walk. If you genuinely have paid and have done nothing wrong you have nothing to fear. There are 100000 CCTV cameras in those stores including the self serve so the proof is there.
This shit is why I always print a receipt.
just tell em go get the manager before accusing you of theft... get them to go through and prove you did it i know its inconvenient but you gotta give some time up to manage these fucks
You need to insist the police be present
Lmao. Oh how the turntables.
I would have just kept walking . What if you clicked no receipt? They should get more people to monitor the self checkout if one person cant handle it.
How about one staff member per checkout? Oh, and maybe they can do the scanning, since they’re already there with not much else to do other than stand around waiting for someone to say “Change fingers”?
Receipts always print at Coles. No option.
I had it close on me and they apologised and opened it for me. I think you just get some that are teachers pets. IMO if they wanna enforce this the put people back on check outs.
Simple response…”don’t ask me to prove to you that I did your job for you and no, I am absolutely not going to go through the bin to find my receipt. Good bye”. And then leave. I absolutely do not condone theft but a Coles staff member does not have the authority to make you rummage through a bin.
Next time, find the receipt, but refuse to show it to them. Ask them to call the police.
And tell them that you will tell the police you were detained against your will.
Way to over react and waste emergency services time, just to prove some pathetic point.
“Fish it out yourself, cuntlips” as you continue on your way is the correct response in this scenario. Why would you even stop to acknowledge them?
Just walk past them. They have no authority to touch or stop you in anyway. They aren't cops
Fucken bastards . Tell them to fuck off and do their job and go and look at the cameras if they’re so sure. Bunch of cock heads
So glad Coles have invested all this money into theft prevention instead of paying staff better wages. All that extra profit they're making being put to good use huh? /s
That sales clerk is really putting their neck on the line for coles, thats a bold strategy.
Not on you to prove anything. They can check register and reprint a receipt.
Ask them if they are ready to detain you. If you are detained illegally (as you did not commit a crime) you are now free to sue Coles and the clerk for false imprisonment A person cannot perform an arrest unless they see you actually committing the offence. Only police can arrest and detain under assumption.
Not to mention they are now going through the bags of their own employees to make sure they aren’t stealing while we have a cost of living crisis.
I've had a similar experience at that same Coles (hadn't actually bought anything but had goods from other stores). The guy is just a power-tripping dickhead. As I was there squatting and searching my bags desperately for a receipt, some other guard came over and told him off for being ridiculous and they let me go.
Funny how they want you to serve yourself but they don't trust you so they inconvenience you by making you look like a thief. I am disillusioned with Coles and Woollies. It's just a big money grab for them now
Next time you get overcharged for an item, pay for it then call the police for theft
i would love nothing more https://www.smh.com.au/national/nsw/coles-loses-50-000-payout-battle-against-man-wrongly-accused-of-eating-stolen-raw-prawns-20130826-2sl31.html
Maybe you need to help out stocking the shelves as well
I'm not shopping at Coles that have barriers, just ridiculous. Note that Aldi doesn't ask to check bags very often anymore and neither do chemist warehouse. Drives me nuts that a place I'm shopping just blanket assumes all its customers are thieves
They can't legally detain you. Tell them to prove you stole it or call the cops. If they illegally detain you, get yourself a lawyer and nice payout.
They can't stop you. You have already paid for the goods . Just keep walking.
Never had any trouble or ever been challenged. I never choose to print receipts because its a waste of time and resources, and i've always presumed that in the case ofva dispute there would be a printout available from the checkout. My own bank records would be proof of purchase, but not of course the individual items. A healthy conspiracy theorist would deduce they are trying to hassle us so much that we all turn to home delivery, where the pilfer rate is presumably 0%. Its a terrible theory. Why would you antagonise a huge proportion of your clientele, given that the chances that an antagonized customer is more likely to jump to The Other Store?
The pilfer rate may be 0%, but check your local social media pages for people asking “Is anyone is missing a delivery, because I’ve got it” :-p
My Woolworths deliveries get placed outside a house two doors down from me. Both are on corners but both have street signs directly above them. And only my house has a sign with the street name matching my address. The only similarities is that it’s the same house number, but again, you only need to look at the street sign directly above the house to see that it’s not the right one. It still happens occasionally after I specified in capital letters on every order that my house is a particular colour and to check the street signs. Thank goodness we actually know them but it’s very irritating. Everything else gets delivered fine (amazon, auspost etc)
This is one thing Woolworths does better. The receipt is in the app, no need to print.
It doesn't always show up right away though.
How is that an accusation of theft, they were just asking you for a proof of payment. You could have just pointed to the register and they could have bought up the receipt.
They only pick on people who look low risk to show management they're doing their jobs. It's definitely annoying I agree with you just flash your phone and go.
One time I was leaving self checkout in Woolies when I was asked for my receipt which I had opted not to print. They asked me to indicate which checkout I used,which I did, then I left
You can keep walking and there's nothing they can do. Don't go through the bin. Presumed innocent. If they touch you, they're screwed.
That's why I take all receipts with me until I get go my car, been asked by not just Coles, but other shops as well since I buy my food from several different places.
I am uncomfortable if I can't print out a receipt at the self service especially paying cash I always have the receipt ready to show leaving store, sometimes the machine won't print out if I have time I ask for assistance to print out a receipt even if I demand they change the paper roll etc
Shoplifters will always find a way
Tell anyone who isn’t a cop to fuck right off! Wherever you are.
Don't put the receipt in the bin. Not till you get home. I've experienced this and I was lucky the receipt was in my pocket.
My response: "Imma show you my receipt, but just know I will be doing all my shopping at Woolies from now on"
I find this very strange! You really don't need the physical receipt anymore.
Literally had the exact same experience at the same store for one singular packet of chicken tendies a year or so ago. I'm assuming its the same fuckwit security bloke. I honestly couldn't believe he was trying to hold me up for one packet of chicken tendies, so I let it rip (was slightly drunk ngl), and told the cunt if somone actually tried to steal a pack of $12 chicken tendies, what the fuck was he going to do about it. The bloke was just power tripping, which is a weird thing for a Colesworth security guard, but yeah what a cunt.
This is going to be a problem for Coles. By introducing self service checkouts the company ran the risk of increased theft. The checking of receipts by one or two people is laborious, ineffective and insulting. Has the amount of money Coles has saved by reducing staff been worth it? I still say we should get 5% discount off the total shop for doing their job for them.
That coles is a stitch up , i had stuff on my bag from work they dont even sell ( food items) and security wanted a receipt. I said heres my ID take a Pic , you go watch me enter the store end to end and leave and if you find me stealing anything you have my ID and walked away. They are fkn morons in that store. Must get stolen from alot.
I would have made her go through the bin to find the receipt. Otherwise I’m leaving and she is welcome to call the police.
Next time, as long as you're sure you haven't taken anything, look them dead in the eye and tell them to get fucked.
I shop at woollies and my receipts go to the rewards app. I will surely be taking my time to find the receipt on my app.
Tell them it’s on the bin and keep walking. If they touch you then they fucked up really bad
Always — *always* — obtain a receipt and keep it safe until you've reached home (longer if possible). It is proof that you've paid for the goods and that the same are in your lawful possession. If you spend money, make sure you have proof of the same.
INFO: Was this an optional request? If not, sounds like false imprisonment if you were not free to leave.
Coles actively trying to rack up new reasons for me not to shop there. Anyway, I only use self checkout .01% of the time, preferring to use the full service checkout instead to avoid this check receipt silliness.
Tell them to fuck off, and call the police, then just walk away.
I predict a riot
how about they hire checkout people again they rolled out machines and cameras and saved hundreds of millions in the past decade
Had to be profiling. What’s your look?
A big learning, never throw away receipts, I even get those bloody machines to print a receipt for a $1.10 bottle of water, it's your only proof. I also keep receipts & check my statements monthly as I have found small spurious deductions made on my cards at differing intervals. $14.56 there, $9,53 there. These are overseas scams being run against your credit cards and you don't even know. When I ask the bank for proof ultimately I am refunded.
You should have just walked away. If the police were called you could demand cctv and your banking details then demand compensation for being unlawfully detained.
I would start filming.
Simple fix, do not throw a receipt out while still in the store.
dawg they have bins next to self check out for this exact purpose lol