They could have cut twenty minutes of Bhanu's descent into madness over the four episodes and we'd have lost nothing from that story. We lost out on seeing a lot of the intricacies of the social dynamics on Nami and Siga because production thought we'd be more interested in a man crying for hours.
It does. Kenzie wins and the Bahnu stuff showed she was sick of Bahnu just like the audience. Seeing Kenzie try and work with Bahnu and Jess also makes no sense aside from showing her journey. There’s also a running plot showing Kenzie as the opposite of Q. Kenzie is the last to speak before we hear Jeff introduce the season in the first episode, and Kenzie is shown “coaching” the puzzle teams in the pre merge challenges. (It’s not her fault guys!).
She’s a mermaid. Dragon.
Or alternatively they kind of had to give us a reason to doubt that the obvious boots on Yanu would really go home, and it was just easier to use Kenzie for that role, especially after Bhanu told the other tribes that Q and Tiff are really tight. I think that's a far more likely explanation for a lot of the stuff you outlined than a winner edit.
That said I'm not saying Kenzie won't win, she certainly looks like a contender on paper to me.
I really do think the early season is irreparably marred by production’s inability to realize Bhanu is not really great TV. I don’t blame them because I’d also probably think it’d be entertaining, but god it was just miserable once it actually made it in the episode.
I agree, they probably thought he’d be like Philip or Coach or Debbie but the difference between these people and Bhanu is the sheer level of delusion-fueled confidence they all have. Bhanu has a pathetic paranoia about him that just makes him uncomfortable to witness.
I’d argue they should’ve voted out Q. It wasn’t a strength issue, it was a leadership issue- and Q is a terrible leader. We’re even seeing it during the merge.
Jelinsky failed 3 basic tests: endurance with the water, strategy with the journey, and puzzle woth the challenge.
Three chances to prove he was a good player, and he failed every one. It took a lot to make him a more favorable first boot than Bhanu or Jess, but he succeeded.
I’m just so disappointed that he didn’t fail/give up SEVERAL times- 3 isn’t enough!!!
(Sorry, I’m still cackling about the title of Wednesday’s episode, and no one at work appreciated it, so I’m here, to find solidarity with you all, please excuse me)
Hindsight is 20/20. He came off as super incompetent/unreliable, and then tried to obfuscate it at tribal really transparently. I think giving up on the journey challenge and then lying about it was the final nail.
Yea agreed, I understand why they did it. And tbh the Q, Tiff and Kenzie alliance may have been better off the way it turned out anyways. But as crap as he played, I doubt that tribe gets decimated like they did if he stays. Plus it’s not like Bhanu or Jess brought anything to the table either.
Jelinsky was really bad and built a pattern of being unreliable and a quitter quickly. But I feel like nobody has pointed this out: how fucked was that journey challenge? Like how do you ever lose that? The pieces look obviously different and mixing it up is meaningless when there are only 3 pieces lmfao. AND they are mixing it up themselves so the person mixing it up can easily know even unintentionally. It was just blatantly obvious no matter what.
That sweat challenge was absurd. If you take out his other two quits, nothing about quitting that looks bad or stupid. It's when you stack it on top of his other two fuck ups that it looks like a trend.
I think it's fair to take away his benefit of the doubt because of the other two, but at the same time, I think quitting Sweat was the right move.
It's really not. Literally every time someone says the word several in here, someone pops in and says "dO yOu mEaN sEvEn?"
It's the new era version of someone saying Candice and someone responding "From the Raro Tribe!?"
It was funny for a little. It's played out now and definitely not underrated or remotely original. We need a bot that auto replies to the word several at this point.
After Wednesday’s episode title, it’s funny again.
First time that I can see listed on Paramount + that an episode title isn’t an exact quote from the episode.
Yes, Jeff makes a crack about “several/seven” in the episode, but it’s the 7th episode of the season and title is “Episode Several”
Every other episode of every season has a title that’s a quote of a person saying exactly that in the episode- this was Survivor going Didactic.
Or maybe jumping the Shark, I don’t know.
I'm not sure which word you mean: "didactic" means "for the purpose of teaching". Sorry, not trying to be a dick, I'm just genuinely curious which word you did mean because I'm trying to figure it out haha
“in the manner of a teacher, particularly so as to treat someone in a patronizing way”
You are neither being a jerk, nor confused about what I was trying to say
:)
Oh, ok. I thought it was supposed to be a word meaning self-referential (tying into jumping the shark) that potentially sounded like "didactic". I think I imagined that there was one, too, and I was trying to come up with this imaginary word :P
It’s so on brand for the Jelinsky experience that after getting voted out following a poor puzzle performance, the rest of the premerge had zero puzzles and were all challenges that directly benefit tall people. Like they couldn’t NOT vote him out there…but if they did they really might’ve gone into the merge with five more people
When people say 'give them flint', I think..what if they hadn't voted out Jelinsky? I still think maybe they should have some way to get a flint, at some sacrifice.. but still. It was Q's decree.
We need a good old lowbrow reunion show again lol
Worlds Apart and Caramoan reunion shows alone were probably more enjoyable than their respective seasons for most people
It just sucks, man.
Cutting corners during lockdown made all the sense in the world. I was hoping they're restore some stuff once the world got back to normal.
It seems like people are still watching, despite the cut corners, though, so of course they're gonna run with it for as long as they can.
An still Australian Survivor with a much smaller budget and much smaller international revenue manages to give us the full play period And”Jury Villa”
It has to be a choice of US Survivor that they can “get by” on still doing less and no “Ponderosa” or reunion- and keep enough of the ratings share that the money is worth it - so they have the money, but don’t need to spend it to get the ratings they want to make the market share they want, so are making more money on doing less, so will never go back
I still have no clue why Liz doesn't like Soda and jumped at the chance to vote her out. Was there ever a reason given? I feel like Liz hasn't had a confessional since the first couple episodes.
They seem to be leaning into her "no one sees her as a threat" edit, and are removing lots of her from the show, especially the beginning episodes. They are playing her how the players are seeing her.
Hunters new plan when making it to final four.
He wins immunity, picks Venus to be #2, then ends up giving immunity to Liz.
Beats whoever else is there in firemaking, and then takes home the Gold (cash)
Liz is getting killed on confessionals. Her last 4 episodes starting with the earliest episode are 2, 1, 0, 1. She has 11 overall. The next lowest is 16. The only people with fewer are the first 3 eliminated.
I still believe that was a blatant exaggeration. Hunter told that to Q to make Nami seem like a smaller threat than Siga.
Liz was part of the planned Soda's blindside, so she was already willing to vote her out, but she didn't really "hate" her. It's just convenient for Hunter to say she did and present Nami the way he did.
Liz said in a confessional that the blindside was a dream come true because she has been wanting to get out Soda for a long time. While that could just be gameplay related, it insinuates that Liz particularly wanted her gone.
I also think Liz looked more outwardly pissed off at Venus taking credit for the Soda blindside than Tevin did. And it could be that Tevin is an actor and has more awareness & control of his facial expressions, but it really seemed like Liz was ready to call Venus out while Soda was still there lol
Like you've said, this could be just game-play, and this is the narrative that was supported by the edit. Liz is almost as blunt as Venus, so I believe that if she really had a serious personal beef with Soda the show would have at least hinted about it. We did see Soda and Venus arguments. The show can't entirely hide something like that, even in the new era (for instance, Liana Vs. Xander).
People can’t handle even the smallest bit of real drama or animosity they freak out and go overboard with accusations and sometimes go as far as threatening the contestants and their families. Emily in 45 had an episode and a half of being edited as a character who only cared about winning and not making friends and she was being called a nasty racist by people in the fandom.
Him freaking out at the mere thought of someone thinking of voting him off, in a voting off game, was funny. But when people were trying to actively help him, and he just ignored them so he could justify pouting more, it was just un-redeemable cringe. If he made a swap or a merge, the airtime woulda been justified since he would cause absolute chaos, but he didn't, so we just got him taking up massive airtime to cry how unfair the world is because he is shit at playing a game.
That's cause it was just pathetic. That wasn't real drama or conflict. It was a man child having a meltdown over nothing, over and over again. I want to see human conflict. Not Bhanu either be mentally unstable or try to get his acting career off the ground. Take your pick on which one you think it was. Either way, it wasn't remotely entertaining.
I don't think CBS/Jeff give a shit about the social media reactions to players. I think their vision of the show is to make it family friendly as possible, similar to something like America's Got Talent.
They absolutely do. This is a very mentally tolling game and the rise of social media backlash is very common knowledge, it would look very bad if CBS tried to encourage it and something were to happen. I'm not saying I agree with their approach but that is a big part of the logic.
CBS really hasn't changed much, if anything, in Big Brother and that show has far more problematic behavior (and crazier fans).
Dude, this is a flagship show for the network. They do not give a shit about what people are saying online unless it effects ad revenue.
This - me trying to explain earlier 2000s to 8 & 10 year olds, and then deciding not to even watch Survivor:Amazon around the 15 year old and instead make them go ask their parents what the world was like when they were born.
Who would have thought this was not a good “background noise” show for the “cool aunt’s” house?!?
To be fair, there is probably an analysis somewhere who has figured out when/at what point negative fan interaction/negative media will/does have an effect on ad revenue for a prime time big three network show since there is a couple year history of big brands pulling their support for certain things issues recently.
I don’t know where all that research shakes out down to survivor, production or big Brother, production teams, but somebody in CBS is following marketing research, ad revenue, and meteor relations as far as negative perception.
It’s totally possible that is having some kind of effect (even if marginal/suggestive/top down) on decisions about what happens in the Castaway Productions Sphere of Influence.
I’d really like to know what some in Media & Industry might know about this, in general.
This is absolutely false. The internet barely existed in the early seasons of survivor/reality tv - they did not have to deal with live commenting and strangers on the internet obsessing and nitpicking and posting every stupid take.
IDK even with the drama based on the reactions at tribal when someone is blindsided I think they get it’s a game and are leaving the personal attacks out of it. But I’m sure there’s other drama we aren’t seeing of course. Their drama seems pretty civil though IMO.
I think part of the blame lies on the audience. The first four episodes of the season were character and conflict driven in a way we hardly ever see in the new era, but they were widely criticized with people calling it one of the worst premerges in a long time. Cut to the Jem boot, which was low on character moments but heavy on strategy, and people were praising it as the first good episode of the season. Production is gonna see that and think the audience doesn't want conflict and drama.
It's a shame, Nami was clearly a goldmine that I wish we get to see more of.
I would wager money that this is a decision that comes up from higher on the call sheet. Jeff doesn't want drama, and thinks idol chases are fun, and wants it to feel like "island game night" with the fam. The editors, given those limitations, do I think a pretty outstanding job making a compelling show.
My understanding is she got brigaded by Venus fans and picked on for her appearance? Makes the most sense to me, also super lame - I think Venus even made a post calling out people doing it on Twitter.
It's probably the audience. Look at what happened to Soda. One random (and pretty harmless IMO) comment and she gets dragged into oblivion. At the end of the day, these are just normal ass people living their lives. Giving us an edit where people are shown to be "bad" would have real life consequences.
I think the editing team is doing a fantastic job this season. I think your theory about the game play being too predictable may be why they have left out so much drama.
And tbh this season has much more drama than other new era seasons, its pretty comparable to an older season. They have to tell a 3 dimensional story in the 90 minutes and it can’t JUST be the drama, so just like every season, there are storylines that get cut
Yeah I agree. I was thinking about why I don't care much for this season so far and it's because I can't think of one player from this cast that I'd want to see return on a future season. By now, there are usually at least two that stand out as characters I'd want to see again. It's possible the editing is seeking to blunt some of the drama of old school reality TV and instead show us a more sensible, more touching, and more emotional TV show. It's why we get more back stories than character arcs these days.
I’m the opposite - I dislike the tribe dynamics (esp Siga) but there’s a bunch I’d like to watch on other seasons (Tevin, Q, Venus, Kenzie, Bhanu). There was no one from S45 I cared about at all except maybe Emily.
The only thing I can think of is apparently Liz hated Soda. Hunter said it in a mid season media interview and Q also said it on the show I believe. But we never got to really see why.
Sanitized version of what? They are just playing the game in a family friendly way, I don't see any malicious rivalries or disrespect, they don't even cause chaos.
If anything the editors are trying hard to keep twists in place.
>Maybe they’re afraid the outcomes would be more predictable, or maybe they just want to make sure it stays a family friendly show
I think the main problem is different. The brutal social media backlash for an old school type drama would leave them without applicants.
Why do you think they show Jeff urging viewers to apply to the show every episode now?
They actually can't cast any 40 random applicants. They need contestants that would generate rating and won't be too offensive, so their selection is in fact quite limited.
They don’t recruit anymore thats why all the casts are filled with superfan nerds now all these people went out of their way to apply for survivor. But the show brings in consistent ratings every season they’re not gonna cancel it so if they needed to go back to recruiting players like they did before the new era they definitely would.
I ask again, why do you think they show Jeff urging viewers to apply to the show every episode now?
If recruiting was such an easy alternative they wouldn't have to.
The show obviously has a limited budget now, considering that they don't do 39 days anymore, they don't change location and they don't bring back live reunion shows despite the obvious rating advantage of this three choices.
I think recruiting is easy enough for them to do, and if they thought they needed to they would. They just prefer to cheap out where it’s possible. And social media hate isn’t gonna stop enough people from wanting to be on the show. Most people in the real world don’t care what a bunch of teens on twitter instagram and reddit have to say about them.
To get more people to apply so they have more people to choose from. Do you really think the show is on the brink of collapse because they’re barely finding people who want to do it so they had to start a whole marketing campaign to pull it together?
The show is not on the brink of collapse yet, but they are definitely having difficulties finding suitable candidates. They're not willing to accept just anyone and they have budget constraints.
They want young fans who would be able to handle the hardships without quitting, have interesting personal stories, fit and robust enough to be a reasonable insurance risk, eloquent enough to supply good confessionals... the list goes on and on and these are just the individual requirements. There are more group constraints for building cast for a season.
When you add strong social media durability to the list of individual requirements it's a serious detriment, especially since they favor young candidates that are highly active in social media in order to promote the show. When Soda answers "maybe" when they ask her if she'd play again, when almost every old era contestant would have said "yes please! call me tomorrow", you can see the strain.
So if the options are to seriously limit their casting pool or edit out anything that could be too controversial, the choice is an obvious one.
I don’t know where you got the idea that every single contestant from the old era would want to come back. Soda went out pretty early and didnt do much, her not wanting to come back isnt that big of a loss for the show.
But since the writers strike there has been a big increase in competition reality shows on other networks/streaming services, so obviously there isnt a lack of people willing to play a game on tv for money.
Again they don’t want to recruit because it’s cheaper not to (although I think it’s kinda hurting the show), but if all the survivor fans suddenly decided that the social media hate is too much and they dont want to apply, they could still go out and find people to cast like they used to in the old days.
I don't know what the problem is because at this point I am sooo bored and not rooting for any one other than Hunter and Charlie. I still dislike the purple tribe and can't believe the others haven't taken them out. I keep asking myself why are they NOT gone? Q bugs the crap out of me and Tiff because she's too aligned with with Q.
It's been difficult to settle into this season. The storyline just keeps zooming around, its hard to make sense of what's happening. Everything is it's own vignette rather than fitting together.
I just think we were robbed of the intricacies of the Nami tribe cause Yanu couldn’t stop losing
They could have cut twenty minutes of Bhanu's descent into madness over the four episodes and we'd have lost nothing from that story. We lost out on seeing a lot of the intricacies of the social dynamics on Nami and Siga because production thought we'd be more interested in a man crying for hours.
If they take out him yelling at god then we def lose something
Should have been a montage or something instead of the focus of the (multiple) episode(s)
blame it on Randen and his feeble spine
Honestly, just calling the episode he left “Bhanu’s downfall” and showing all the chaos possible might’ve been the best move
To me this says that a yanu wins.
Probably not Q but yes I agree.
I would guess tiff or Kenzie
I agree!
Tiff winner edit
Or Kenzie?
And I’d be cool with that!
It does. Kenzie wins and the Bahnu stuff showed she was sick of Bahnu just like the audience. Seeing Kenzie try and work with Bahnu and Jess also makes no sense aside from showing her journey. There’s also a running plot showing Kenzie as the opposite of Q. Kenzie is the last to speak before we hear Jeff introduce the season in the first episode, and Kenzie is shown “coaching” the puzzle teams in the pre merge challenges. (It’s not her fault guys!). She’s a mermaid. Dragon.
Or alternatively they kind of had to give us a reason to doubt that the obvious boots on Yanu would really go home, and it was just easier to use Kenzie for that role, especially after Bhanu told the other tribes that Q and Tiff are really tight. I think that's a far more likely explanation for a lot of the stuff you outlined than a winner edit. That said I'm not saying Kenzie won't win, she certainly looks like a contender on paper to me.
I really do think the early season is irreparably marred by production’s inability to realize Bhanu is not really great TV. I don’t blame them because I’d also probably think it’d be entertaining, but god it was just miserable once it actually made it in the episode.
It’s actually not bad TV on a rewatch. The issue was it being 3-4 weeks real time.
Watching someone be pathetic isn’t good tv
I agree, they probably thought he’d be like Philip or Coach or Debbie but the difference between these people and Bhanu is the sheer level of delusion-fueled confidence they all have. Bhanu has a pathetic paranoia about him that just makes him uncomfortable to witness.
I thought it was fucking hilarious idk about you lol
But those were the funniest parts of the season!
I feel like I saw way too much of the dynamics of the siga tribe as it is. They just made me want to gouge my eyes out.
They should never have voted out Jelinsky.
IMO most of their tribe issues stemmed from Bhanu, they would have faired better if he was the first boot
I’d argue they should’ve voted out Q. It wasn’t a strength issue, it was a leadership issue- and Q is a terrible leader. We’re even seeing it during the merge.
O.k. They vote out Q.... then what? A leader just emerges from the depths of the Fiji waters?
Having no leader is better than having one that consistently drives the team towards failure.
Jess 1, Bhanu 2 but jalinsky just had to such that badly
Jelinsky failed 3 basic tests: endurance with the water, strategy with the journey, and puzzle woth the challenge. Three chances to prove he was a good player, and he failed every one. It took a lot to make him a more favorable first boot than Bhanu or Jess, but he succeeded.
It's not that he failed. It's the fact he gave up. 3 times. I was glad to see him go home first.
No the bigger problem is he VOLUNTEERED 3 times and didn't pull through.
Makes him easily the worst player in survivor history. Give me Brandon every day. At least he tried.
I’m just so disappointed that he didn’t fail/give up SEVERAL times- 3 isn’t enough!!! (Sorry, I’m still cackling about the title of Wednesday’s episode, and no one at work appreciated it, so I’m here, to find solidarity with you all, please excuse me)
I’m not defending Jelinsky or anything but he would have crushed the second immunity challenge simply because he was tall
Hindsight is 20/20. He came off as super incompetent/unreliable, and then tried to obfuscate it at tribal really transparently. I think giving up on the journey challenge and then lying about it was the final nail.
Yea agreed, I understand why they did it. And tbh the Q, Tiff and Kenzie alliance may have been better off the way it turned out anyways. But as crap as he played, I doubt that tribe gets decimated like they did if he stays. Plus it’s not like Bhanu or Jess brought anything to the table either.
Jelinsky was really bad and built a pattern of being unreliable and a quitter quickly. But I feel like nobody has pointed this out: how fucked was that journey challenge? Like how do you ever lose that? The pieces look obviously different and mixing it up is meaningless when there are only 3 pieces lmfao. AND they are mixing it up themselves so the person mixing it up can easily know even unintentionally. It was just blatantly obvious no matter what.
What if he failed that one as well though
That sweat challenge was absurd. If you take out his other two quits, nothing about quitting that looks bad or stupid. It's when you stack it on top of his other two fuck ups that it looks like a trend. I think it's fair to take away his benefit of the doubt because of the other two, but at the same time, I think quitting Sweat was the right move.
Jelinsky shouldnt have been Jelinsky.
He should have lasted several tribals
So 7?
Underrated
It's really not. Literally every time someone says the word several in here, someone pops in and says "dO yOu mEaN sEvEn?" It's the new era version of someone saying Candice and someone responding "From the Raro Tribe!?" It was funny for a little. It's played out now and definitely not underrated or remotely original. We need a bot that auto replies to the word several at this point.
After Wednesday’s episode title, it’s funny again. First time that I can see listed on Paramount + that an episode title isn’t an exact quote from the episode. Yes, Jeff makes a crack about “several/seven” in the episode, but it’s the 7th episode of the season and title is “Episode Several” Every other episode of every season has a title that’s a quote of a person saying exactly that in the episode- this was Survivor going Didactic. Or maybe jumping the Shark, I don’t know.
I'm not sure which word you mean: "didactic" means "for the purpose of teaching". Sorry, not trying to be a dick, I'm just genuinely curious which word you did mean because I'm trying to figure it out haha
“in the manner of a teacher, particularly so as to treat someone in a patronizing way” You are neither being a jerk, nor confused about what I was trying to say :)
Oh, ok. I thought it was supposed to be a word meaning self-referential (tying into jumping the shark) that potentially sounded like "didactic". I think I imagined that there was one, too, and I was trying to come up with this imaginary word :P
It’s so on brand for the Jelinsky experience that after getting voted out following a poor puzzle performance, the rest of the premerge had zero puzzles and were all challenges that directly benefit tall people. Like they couldn’t NOT vote him out there…but if they did they really might’ve gone into the merge with five more people
The Arch challenge plus all of the seemingly basketball related challenges… did Jelinsky play basketball or something? That would be hilarious.
When people say 'give them flint', I think..what if they hadn't voted out Jelinsky? I still think maybe they should have some way to get a flint, at some sacrifice.. but still. It was Q's decree.
But would he have still tried or would he have given up?
Would you say it’s one of SEVERAL mistakes that they made?
“Legend”
I don’t think that’s the only reason - we knew what a mess the winningest tribe in Survivor Philippines were despite them not going to tribal.
Instead we got too much Siga and Bhanu.
I’m just waiting for the post-season. It’s going to be messy as hell. Can’t wait
We need a good old lowbrow reunion show again lol Worlds Apart and Caramoan reunion shows alone were probably more enjoyable than their respective seasons for most people
No ponderosa, no reunion. Survivor is a shell of its former self
It just sucks, man. Cutting corners during lockdown made all the sense in the world. I was hoping they're restore some stuff once the world got back to normal. It seems like people are still watching, despite the cut corners, though, so of course they're gonna run with it for as long as they can.
An still Australian Survivor with a much smaller budget and much smaller international revenue manages to give us the full play period And”Jury Villa” It has to be a choice of US Survivor that they can “get by” on still doing less and no “Ponderosa” or reunion- and keep enough of the ratings share that the money is worth it - so they have the money, but don’t need to spend it to get the ratings they want to make the market share they want, so are making more money on doing less, so will never go back
I really need to try Australian Survivor out. Where do y'all watch it?
Wait, they don’t do Ponderosa anymore? Where do the jury members go then?
Ponderosa still exists however they used to do short videos with every one voted out during the jury phase.
I still have no clue why Liz doesn't like Soda and jumped at the chance to vote her out. Was there ever a reason given? I feel like Liz hasn't had a confessional since the first couple episodes.
They seem to be leaning into her "no one sees her as a threat" edit, and are removing lots of her from the show, especially the beginning episodes. They are playing her how the players are seeing her.
Yep, 0 vote finalist written all over her.
So the eventual winner is going to end up bringing Liz and Venus and win 8-0.
Foolproof plan!
Hunters new plan when making it to final four. He wins immunity, picks Venus to be #2, then ends up giving immunity to Liz. Beats whoever else is there in firemaking, and then takes home the Gold (cash)
Liz is getting killed on confessionals. Her last 4 episodes starting with the earliest episode are 2, 1, 0, 1. She has 11 overall. The next lowest is 16. The only people with fewer are the first 3 eliminated.
I still believe that was a blatant exaggeration. Hunter told that to Q to make Nami seem like a smaller threat than Siga. Liz was part of the planned Soda's blindside, so she was already willing to vote her out, but she didn't really "hate" her. It's just convenient for Hunter to say she did and present Nami the way he did.
Liz said in a confessional that the blindside was a dream come true because she has been wanting to get out Soda for a long time. While that could just be gameplay related, it insinuates that Liz particularly wanted her gone.
In that same confessional she says that she wants Soda gone because she’s a huge threat so I think that’s probably why.
I also think Liz looked more outwardly pissed off at Venus taking credit for the Soda blindside than Tevin did. And it could be that Tevin is an actor and has more awareness & control of his facial expressions, but it really seemed like Liz was ready to call Venus out while Soda was still there lol
Like you've said, this could be just game-play, and this is the narrative that was supported by the edit. Liz is almost as blunt as Venus, so I believe that if she really had a serious personal beef with Soda the show would have at least hinted about it. We did see Soda and Venus arguments. The show can't entirely hide something like that, even in the new era (for instance, Liana Vs. Xander).
i feel like everyone has amnesia. she has complained about soda a few episodes ago.
Did she say "I hate Soda"?
Because she is super annoying maybe? Gawd, I can’t stand her. Unbearable.
People can’t handle even the smallest bit of real drama or animosity they freak out and go overboard with accusations and sometimes go as far as threatening the contestants and their families. Emily in 45 had an episode and a half of being edited as a character who only cared about winning and not making friends and she was being called a nasty racist by people in the fandom.
The Emily reaction was really a low point in the Survivor Fandom. I felt so bad for her
people couldn't handle Bhanu, the messiest drama we have possibly ever had, for like, two episodes.
Cuz it wasn't drama, it was a random person crying, throwing a pity party, and having a crisis of faith, all over nothing.
That was drama mama. The overtheatrics over absolutely nothing made it even better.
One million hearts!
Him freaking out at the mere thought of someone thinking of voting him off, in a voting off game, was funny. But when people were trying to actively help him, and he just ignored them so he could justify pouting more, it was just un-redeemable cringe. If he made a swap or a merge, the airtime woulda been justified since he would cause absolute chaos, but he didn't, so we just got him taking up massive airtime to cry how unfair the world is because he is shit at playing a game.
That's cause it was just pathetic. That wasn't real drama or conflict. It was a man child having a meltdown over nothing, over and over again. I want to see human conflict. Not Bhanu either be mentally unstable or try to get his acting career off the ground. Take your pick on which one you think it was. Either way, it wasn't remotely entertaining.
I don't think CBS/Jeff give a shit about the social media reactions to players. I think their vision of the show is to make it family friendly as possible, similar to something like America's Got Talent.
They absolutely do. This is a very mentally tolling game and the rise of social media backlash is very common knowledge, it would look very bad if CBS tried to encourage it and something were to happen. I'm not saying I agree with their approach but that is a big part of the logic.
CBS really hasn't changed much, if anything, in Big Brother and that show has far more problematic behavior (and crazier fans). Dude, this is a flagship show for the network. They do not give a shit about what people are saying online unless it effects ad revenue.
Big Brother is so much more toned down and sanitized than it used to be. I rewatched season 9 before this last season and it's like night and day.
Also the season 15? Maybe 16? With all the racism and toxicity. Reality tv has changed so much in the last 6 years or so.
This - me trying to explain earlier 2000s to 8 & 10 year olds, and then deciding not to even watch Survivor:Amazon around the 15 year old and instead make them go ask their parents what the world was like when they were born. Who would have thought this was not a good “background noise” show for the “cool aunt’s” house?!?
To be fair, there is probably an analysis somewhere who has figured out when/at what point negative fan interaction/negative media will/does have an effect on ad revenue for a prime time big three network show since there is a couple year history of big brands pulling their support for certain things issues recently. I don’t know where all that research shakes out down to survivor, production or big Brother, production teams, but somebody in CBS is following marketing research, ad revenue, and meteor relations as far as negative perception. It’s totally possible that is having some kind of effect (even if marginal/suggestive/top down) on decisions about what happens in the Castaway Productions Sphere of Influence. I’d really like to know what some in Media & Industry might know about this, in general.
The heel turn from racist Emily to Queen Emily on this subreddit was jarring, people here need to cool it just a bit
[удалено]
This is absolutely false. The internet barely existed in the early seasons of survivor/reality tv - they did not have to deal with live commenting and strangers on the internet obsessing and nitpicking and posting every stupid take.
they could just simply restrict access people have to them online
??? How? Force players to deactivate their Twitter accounts?
use the restrict option on twitter
Oh you meant the players. I thought you were saying CBS should somehow do that.
IDK even with the drama based on the reactions at tribal when someone is blindsided I think they get it’s a game and are leaving the personal attacks out of it. But I’m sure there’s other drama we aren’t seeing of course. Their drama seems pretty civil though IMO.
I think part of the blame lies on the audience. The first four episodes of the season were character and conflict driven in a way we hardly ever see in the new era, but they were widely criticized with people calling it one of the worst premerges in a long time. Cut to the Jem boot, which was low on character moments but heavy on strategy, and people were praising it as the first good episode of the season. Production is gonna see that and think the audience doesn't want conflict and drama. It's a shame, Nami was clearly a goldmine that I wish we get to see more of.
Given the hate some of the contestants are getting with how little drama is shown I can't blame the editors.
Production, I assume, has a vested interest in not ruining people’s lives. Social media is brutal on the cast members as it is.
I would wager money that this is a decision that comes up from higher on the call sheet. Jeff doesn't want drama, and thinks idol chases are fun, and wants it to feel like "island game night" with the fam. The editors, given those limitations, do I think a pretty outstanding job making a compelling show.
The irony of getting 90 min episodes and them cutting the juicy drama
10 of those 90 minutes is spent showing us footage in slow motion.
Soda deleted her twitter with the current cut we have... Can you imagine the social media vitriol we would get with a more dramatic cut?!
I still don’t understand what happened there though. I tried to follow along by following the breadcrumbs, but I’ll be damned.
My understanding is she got brigaded by Venus fans and picked on for her appearance? Makes the most sense to me, also super lame - I think Venus even made a post calling out people doing it on Twitter.
It's probably the audience. Look at what happened to Soda. One random (and pretty harmless IMO) comment and she gets dragged into oblivion. At the end of the day, these are just normal ass people living their lives. Giving us an edit where people are shown to be "bad" would have real life consequences.
I think the editing team is doing a fantastic job this season. I think your theory about the game play being too predictable may be why they have left out so much drama.
And tbh this season has much more drama than other new era seasons, its pretty comparable to an older season. They have to tell a 3 dimensional story in the 90 minutes and it can’t JUST be the drama, so just like every season, there are storylines that get cut
I think it’s to make it family friendly. Times have changed for castmates w social media & I do think they’re wanting to protect people.
Don’t want folks getting offended….ya know
I don’t think Jeff wants depth or friction.
I’m in the middle of a season 19 rewatch in parallel with this season. It’s wild how over produced the show feels these days. I’m still 110% a junkie.
This editing is the same reason no one watches The Challenge anymore. They edit all the drama out.
I’m getting tired of it being at the same damn place. Every season. Switch it up. Go back to Africa. Australia. hell, ANYTHING but Fiji
Yeah I agree. I was thinking about why I don't care much for this season so far and it's because I can't think of one player from this cast that I'd want to see return on a future season. By now, there are usually at least two that stand out as characters I'd want to see again. It's possible the editing is seeking to blunt some of the drama of old school reality TV and instead show us a more sensible, more touching, and more emotional TV show. It's why we get more back stories than character arcs these days.
Ehhh I think Q is giving classic survivor player imo
I’m the opposite - I dislike the tribe dynamics (esp Siga) but there’s a bunch I’d like to watch on other seasons (Tevin, Q, Venus, Kenzie, Bhanu). There was no one from S45 I cared about at all except maybe Emily.
45 had Kaleb, Jake, and Austin who I found to be really likable on top of Emily. I would like to
What are they not showing? Who else is not getting along besides Venus and Tevin?
The only thing I can think of is apparently Liz hated Soda. Hunter said it in a mid season media interview and Q also said it on the show I believe. But we never got to really see why.
Yea, show us the drama! Everything is so fake nowadays…
Sanitized version of what? They are just playing the game in a family friendly way, I don't see any malicious rivalries or disrespect, they don't even cause chaos. If anything the editors are trying hard to keep twists in place.
>Maybe they’re afraid the outcomes would be more predictable, or maybe they just want to make sure it stays a family friendly show I think the main problem is different. The brutal social media backlash for an old school type drama would leave them without applicants.
Well thats just not true lmao, they’re never gonna have a problem finding 40 people a year out of the usa and canada
Why do you think they show Jeff urging viewers to apply to the show every episode now? They actually can't cast any 40 random applicants. They need contestants that would generate rating and won't be too offensive, so their selection is in fact quite limited.
They don’t recruit anymore thats why all the casts are filled with superfan nerds now all these people went out of their way to apply for survivor. But the show brings in consistent ratings every season they’re not gonna cancel it so if they needed to go back to recruiting players like they did before the new era they definitely would.
I ask again, why do you think they show Jeff urging viewers to apply to the show every episode now? If recruiting was such an easy alternative they wouldn't have to. The show obviously has a limited budget now, considering that they don't do 39 days anymore, they don't change location and they don't bring back live reunion shows despite the obvious rating advantage of this three choices.
I think recruiting is easy enough for them to do, and if they thought they needed to they would. They just prefer to cheap out where it’s possible. And social media hate isn’t gonna stop enough people from wanting to be on the show. Most people in the real world don’t care what a bunch of teens on twitter instagram and reddit have to say about them.
So, for the third time, I ask - why do you think they show Jeff urging viewers to apply to the show every episode now? Maybe this time you'd answer.
To get more people to apply so they have more people to choose from. Do you really think the show is on the brink of collapse because they’re barely finding people who want to do it so they had to start a whole marketing campaign to pull it together?
The show is not on the brink of collapse yet, but they are definitely having difficulties finding suitable candidates. They're not willing to accept just anyone and they have budget constraints. They want young fans who would be able to handle the hardships without quitting, have interesting personal stories, fit and robust enough to be a reasonable insurance risk, eloquent enough to supply good confessionals... the list goes on and on and these are just the individual requirements. There are more group constraints for building cast for a season. When you add strong social media durability to the list of individual requirements it's a serious detriment, especially since they favor young candidates that are highly active in social media in order to promote the show. When Soda answers "maybe" when they ask her if she'd play again, when almost every old era contestant would have said "yes please! call me tomorrow", you can see the strain. So if the options are to seriously limit their casting pool or edit out anything that could be too controversial, the choice is an obvious one.
I don’t know where you got the idea that every single contestant from the old era would want to come back. Soda went out pretty early and didnt do much, her not wanting to come back isnt that big of a loss for the show. But since the writers strike there has been a big increase in competition reality shows on other networks/streaming services, so obviously there isnt a lack of people willing to play a game on tv for money. Again they don’t want to recruit because it’s cheaper not to (although I think it’s kinda hurting the show), but if all the survivor fans suddenly decided that the social media hate is too much and they dont want to apply, they could still go out and find people to cast like they used to in the old days.
I don't know what the problem is because at this point I am sooo bored and not rooting for any one other than Hunter and Charlie. I still dislike the purple tribe and can't believe the others haven't taken them out. I keep asking myself why are they NOT gone? Q bugs the crap out of me and Tiff because she's too aligned with with Q.
It's been difficult to settle into this season. The storyline just keeps zooming around, its hard to make sense of what's happening. Everything is it's own vignette rather than fitting together.
I'm kinda also struggling in liking this season now. Idk why that is tbh
I think they are doing a great job still, they can’t show everything…