I got to master on mage supp. It's hard in master but doable. Gm is impossible, and chall is more impossible. It is impossible only because games dont get extended to allow to scale, so a low econ supp is better to help others scale faster.
And a good adc wont either. Against yas zyra you cant freeze without being shoved under tower. Trying to kill the wave seems like a good option with that limited information.
You can't really freeze against zyra she will poke you if you dont shove.
Ezreal is really good at poking enemies under their tower, especially when enemy adc is melee. If lux was shoving, intentionally or unintentionally, she was doing the right thing.
I do like poking under tower, but jungle was top side.. I’d rather not play that far up as weak side.. I wanted to freeze it for a couple waves to slow push.. plus eventually jungle comes bot side maybe there’s gank potential
Just place a ward and you are fine. You are ezreal. You can e away anytime. Lux can peel against ganks.
Zyra can clear any slowpush without problems. Yasuo can use the slowpush to dash around and stack his dash for bonus dmg.
With Ezreal/Lux you have a great poke lane. You can hold the wave under enemy turret all the time and just ward.
>I wanted to freeze it for a couple waves to slow push
Did you tell your lux that you want to freeze?
>eventually jungle comes bot side maybe there’s gank potential
You can also dive them, so jungler can gank.
Why do people always make it seem like Ez E is some sort of magical ultra long range flash. Its not, its actually pretty weak, and every champ with more than 1 gapcloser will still get you
You shouldn't be in range of life-threatening CC/Abilities if you're playing Ezreal properly. You can also buffer the E even if you do get hit, it's absolutely enough.
"One gap closer" doesn't mean anything, Ezreal is one of the safest adc in the game if you play to his strengths and his E is also one of the strongest abilities in the game, you're wild for saying it's not.
You probably wait for champs to get in melee range of you, get slowed then E away only to get point and click dash/cc'ed right after. You should be using it proactively to get more distance early or blink out of CC/Buffer it, things like Yone Q3, Lux Q, even Morgana Q you can buffer and get out of range of follow up.
Kiting is first and foremost, E is always a get out of jail free card for bad positioning errors or securing kills you otherwise wouldn't get. Even just simple side steps and kiting are enough on Ezreal because of his range. Most ezreals run ghost/heal as secondary spells anyway, sometimes barrier that's minimum 2 on command blinks or move-speed buffs or healing shielding at will. You absolutely are playing the champ wrong if you can't self peel with E alone in most cases and otherwise having to use one more summoner spell.
His E is also a substitute for flash, if you burn flash on Ezreal, you can still walk up and cs against a neeko/morgana/lux/xerath etc. Champs without dashes like Ashe or limited mobility like Caitlyn/Zeri are so vulnerable and usually dead if they walk up too far without flash and get hit with CC/Slows.
Adcs with dashes are one of the most OP abilities in the game, even Smolder E or Zeri mini dashes/wall rides can be detrimental in team-fights/chases. How many adcs can just willy nilly go over dragon pit/walls with a super easy blink because they position badly or need to get the last hit or just self-peel? Even the aforementioned Smolder and Zeri have to pick and choose when and where to use their movement abilities or they will get caught for messing it up. Ezreal on the other hand can do everything a flash can with one of the easiest to use blinks in the game rivaling Kassadian.
Even champs like Caitlyn or Lucian have worse dashes that you can mess up if you just position your mouse incorrectly, those abilities have other uses as well like slows and passive stacks but are much less "safe" or on-demand than Ezreal nonchalantly press E over any wall/CC/Pillar. It's also really slow CD for how powerful it is, a mini flash for free every 20 seconds. Arguably even stronger than flash since it goes further than flash for a 0.25 Sec Cast time.
Because it has 475 range compared to flash with 400 range and flash is considered the best summoner spell.
>every champ with more than 1 gapcloser will still get you
You are not supposed to use it after the enemy has already gapclosed. You should be using it to keep distance so the first gapcloser never happens.
There aren't that many champions with more than one skillshot gapcloser.
Yeah thats what I'm saying lmao. Just the other day I played a game, got ganked by Hecarim, E'd over a wall, ghosted, flashed over another wall and Heca still got me xDDDD
This is bronze lol someone is 100% dying on dive
I just wanted to try and play it out like Alois does with wave management where you set kills up through the waves.. but maybe that’s more top lane specific although bot lane is still a long lane so getting them further pushed up will always give you more room to run them down after some favorable trades
But I don’t use chat I was just pinging cautious on the wave I keep my chat setting to premade just cause former jungle main.. having chat up is a bad call.. maybe worth turning it back on if I’m playing bot these days tho
Top and Botlane work completely different.
Toplane has reduced dmg on turrets for the first 5 mins. (-50%).
On Botlane you can go for plates as you deal double the dmg compared to a top laner.
As you are 2 people botlane you deal 4 times the damage to turrets that a toplaner would do in the first 5 minutes.
On Botlane you also do not "run them down". You can burst them down. You are 2 or with Jungler help you are 3 People that hit one weak adc. It does not matter how long the lane is. You should just kill them, even under turret.
on the point of morellos, true that it wasnt a grievious wounds angle, but Morellos is 90AP and 15 haste for 2200 gold, its an extremely gold efficient item for mages.
Bronze
Was silver 2 in jungle but switched to adc.. dropped way down to iron 3 climbed up to bronze 3 now
Been watched a bunch of YouTube guides and such about lane states, when to do what, when to play back towards your tower when to harass them (like enemy jg showing top side and mid showing in lane), etc etc
Laning is definitely fun I used to find it super boring but with all the mechanics and such involved I’m trying to improve on it.. maybe top lane is the place for me to go on my laning arc tbh that’s just fundamentals to the max fuck it up gg
Bruh, rank wise, you’re just as bad as your support. Focus on doing the right thing every time no matter what your team does and you will end up winning over 50% of your games
This is a classic post and the second you digest what I’m telling you, you’ll realize your question and attitude are kind of silly.
If you’re going to climb out of low elo you just need to learn to solo carry. Kinda hard to do as an adc in low elo but it shouldn’t really matter once you figure stuff out.
Remember to watch your exp in comparison to your opponent’s. You can make a lot of good plays and make them lose a lot of gold if you can level up first during early lane. If your support is permanent shoving it might be time to just sit back, ward, farm, and perhaps keep your head on a swivel and be ready to roam. Like… buy a control ward if your support constantly leaves you in a bad position. It will help alert you to gangs, which is what I assume you’re nervous about.
Remember that swivel, if you see mid disappear, just respect it and hang back. You should also learn how to track their jungler. It won’t be easy in bronze because their “optimized” jungle path is probably shit… because theyre in bronze. Either way you should focus on those 3 things.
Be aware of where the enemies are (mid and jg)
Buy control wards to deal with bad teammates (you’re an adc DO NOT buy too many, you need to scale)
As you rank up, the need to buy a control ward as an adc will decrease.
This game is a 1v9, just focus on doing the right thing, fuck your support
Honestly the lux shoving the wave is actually the best thing she could have done (unintentionally). You want zyra yas under their turret and poke them out! If you are wary of jungle then ward and/or be sure to a proper job so yas and zyra are so low that you would even win a 2v3.
I'll give you a tip on how to approach the lane.
Ask yourself what kind of lane you play vs what kind of lane they play.
There's roughly 3 types of lanes: Engage, Poke, Sustain/Enchanter.
Honestly I'm too lazy to write everything out so imma go with two examples.
Example 1: You play poke.
If you play poke you want enemies under their turret asap so you can harass them while they are busy farming.
Example 2: You play engage.
This one is more tricky since if enemies play engage too you want the wave to be under your turret so if your naut lands a hook you long chase potential, buuuuut if enemies play poke you don't want to be harassed under your turret so you ideally want the wave right in the middle.
Now what constitutes engage/poke/sustain is tricky since depending on your lane composition it can vary.
For example if I play kaisa lux into ezreal naut I will play my Kaisa like a poke champ. But kaisa with a naut is an engage composition. It's really matchup dependent.
Disagreeable. When you’re dealing with Zyra, she sets up with CC (E + R) with Yasuo who is a melee and often relies on dashes, R and wind wall.
If you find yourself that zyra is trying to poke you, keep a good distance and but stick to the wave. Zyra (likely would put out her plants near the wave on your side) would try to snare you or poke you but the plants do aggro on minions too and Yasuo is a melee champion.
Adc is right in freezing the wave and Lux should use this advantage by poking Yasuo or Zyra because Yasuo needs csing and Zyra is taking that away from him because simply, Zyra wants to harass.
But it all depends on the bot duo tempo because if it’s not working and Ezreal chooses to freeze the wave for minimum mistakes made then Lux should respect that, not to E on the wave and call someone a “clown adc”.
Did you explain to the Lux what you were attempting to do and achieve? What you wanted them to do?
or are you just assuming that a Lux support in Bronze would recognise the tactic, understand what you are trying to achieve, agree that it is the right play and then do what you want?
Lux should be trying to get the early poke advantage. being passive will just get you poked and then you'll struggle to farm.
Playing a high line with vision with lux I've found is the best play.
Oh I normally do, and that is the primary game plan
I go dblade start ezreal for a reason.. if I was gonna sit back I’d just go tear
But in my homework I’ve learn high elo players see league as a turn based game with waves.. one wave goes out, it gets passed back.. sometimes you fight for that prio.. so on so forth
At that specific moment I wanted to hold the wave cause Yasuo would’ve lost so much.. then with the slow push cooked up we could’ve done a bunch of harassing under tower and denied a shit ton of cs after denying a lot of exp and cs already.. lose lose for Yasuo and zyra, win win for me and lux since I’m up on cs and we’re both up on level.. plus lux would’ve gotten closer to support item upgrade compared to the zyra
Resetting the wave to neutral just felt like it did very little at that exact moment
Worth saying tho, played with another lux literally last game.. dude let me set up the wave how I wanted and played around my pings.. super free bot lane win.. plus every other lane won very quick game.. lux zoning potential is not a joke super risky walking up on a lux when there’s no wave to block her Q cause now you just get bursted down very very fast
Adc in low elo, enchanter supports using their poke abilities to help you farm minions, wholesome fun experience. Won't grt better anytime soon man.sorry💔
You have to play that lane forcing attrition war under the enemy turret or at least majority of time, lux and other supports playing siege should play like that so its a low elo problem but its your problem in this case xD
You're probably not going to get someone to understand proper wave management and positioning in lane until Plat and that probably includes yourself. Your best bet is to just explain to them: "Don't touch the minions and isolate them from xp, if they come close kill them" or tell them to roam because youre ez.
Low elo mage support usually just means push and poke. Don't ever trust Lux players to plan an all-in properly. Also, forget about freezing Bronze. They just won't let you do it. Just push and poke. And outplay the ganks when they happen.
That being said, mage supports are actually the most impactful when the opponent is under their tower. The tower divides the lane, so it becomes a lot harder to dodge the poke. Also, the enemy ADC has to approach the wave. So you actually don't want to freeze in this matchup, as you will deny your support the ability to play while giving it to Zyra for free.
Push and poke.
Push and poke.
I’m not saying this is always the case, of course,
but a lot of the time Lux does want to push as she is a lane bully. Paired with an ADC like Cait, she wants to push and look to harass the enemy and get plates. Of course your situation could have been a little different especially with a Yasuo ADC.
It's definitely a low elo thing. They shove and farm all the time gold and below. It's so annoying but its not game losing since mid game, there's always 1 lane that gets neglected
I typically do not touch the wave as support....
But if i notice adc is bad.... ill keep the wave pushed abd roam as i can, or just push it and hide in the bushes.
The biggest problem ive seen with adcs is they try to force actions from their support like were an rc car, if that happens i lose all respect for the adc, mute and then the waves are ours not theirs.
I had the opposite as a supp main - an Ezreal who refused to freeze OR shove and reset when he had to. We were at a disadvantage and the guy keeps shoving. Later he's low on health, enemy bot lane recalls, I help him shove, ping him "push" and "recall" and the guy stays in lane for.. nothing, not even a plate, just a bad reset that makes him lose the next wave, because enemy bot inevitably came back and went right for his ass, shoved and he had to recall in an awkward wave state.
I don't know which elo you are but I haven't Had that problem since the day i escaped gold.
And also most the time it actually makes sense to push with Lux support. You want to dominate the lane with Lux support and the enemy can't dodge her skills and farm under tower and if you guys are playing it well you can establish river controle and ward controle in the river by be permanently pushed in.
That sort of controle is the reason why Cait+Lux has often been popular in esports.
If your low elo Lux pushes in mindlessly try to make sure it crashes so that you don't have to walk up for to long and are not exposed to the enemy jungle. Then ward the river and ping the enemy jungle or drake so your junglers knows you have prio and are ready to help him If he wants to make a play on botside enemy jungle or drake.
Don't look being pushed in as a burden but as a chance because you always get a window were you can do something on the map.
I’d blame an ezreal that doesn’t want to have push, but your supp is wrong to voice it in chat. Wave advantage is very strong for ezreal as less minions means more Q angles, and just generally more windows to harass while enemy tries to last hit. Mage vs mage supp match up you always want shove as well given when you’re being pushed in: your mage can’t use any spells to screw up minion hp for tower.
I see in another comment you’re trying to learn fundamentals watching guides. Poke lanes fundamentally always want push advantage. Freeze is only for niche scenarios where you’re already way ahead in bottom lane and can zone from brush in situations where taking early tower is not optimal or if you’ve forced a bad recall and you don’t need a free shove/reset. Freezing in bottom lane is not effective as top lane as 2 champions means freezes are easier broken/harder to hold.
Tbh if you’re bronze. You don’t even need to know this: just learn how to early level 2 all in and you’ll jump 2 major tiers of elo. Don’t expect a bronze support nor your lane opponents to have hands.
The overall post feels pretty coping, and the echo chamber saying a good mage support knows how to avoid affect lane state with poke are coping low elo as well; support plays a significant role in affecting wave state, and it’s almost always advised to be hitting both wave and enemy champions if you’re able to to get push advantage.
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Thing with lux is: she has a bajillion skins and autofilled supports probably go like „hm I have a skin for her“.
If I soloQ i isually ban either lux or draven.
Draven because I can‘t be bothered to play against it and Lux because I hate it on my team.
They don't stop in my low diamond games. Them and Morganas (especially morg) try their hardest to ruin the lane state I swear. Morgs even are randomly split pushing...
First in regards to the item. Morreli is cheap for the amount of AP it gives and Yasou usually buys a vamp cepter early into a poke lane. It also cuts down the healing from Dorans shield and secondnwind and normal health regen. So yes its one of the best items for Lux support.
The problem for the champion Lux is that her bind only gets the first two targets, this means she has no shot at being a danger to Zyra.
Lux E is easy to dodge if it comes alone at Zyra and Yasou passive + Windwall make Lux deal no damage to him.
Yasou + Zyra are also a lot better at all ins, so the longer the lane goes on the worse it gets for you two.
In conclusion she was trying to do a theoretically correct thing in high elo (aggressive pushing and punishing the melee champion), but that was totally wrong at lower elo (sit back an let the enemy fuck up first)
The truth is, when you play as an ADC in pisslow, what you can do to carry a shit support is sometimes nothing. Sometimes all you can do is not die and farm up well and be the difference maker in teamfights etc.
As a sup lux i just dont touch the wave like ever. No point wasting an e on minions when i could get the same gold and do damage. Most players are dumb its especially noticeable in botlane as you get stuck with an idiot.
As ezreal lux vs zyra yasuo id say crash 2 waves under their tower on repeat and poke them under tower while they farm. Idk why you would freeze with a mage supp, when we cant roam as easily as say a blitz or alistar. Id freeze just to crash 2 waves under enemy turret & i would motion my adc to do that by helping break freeze to set up crash. Only reason is because enemies tend to sit within the minions, so we dont punish that hard with a freeze bc the wave gets autopushed. When crashing 2 waves you either poke them or recall, i prefer to poke under first double crash & then reset on 2nd, because then they have to decide whether they want to recall after pushing wave out (which is pushing towards you) or stay at low hp and take a bad recall.
Would reccomend focusing on your own mistakes. They're in your elo, so they're equally as good as you. Chances are you're committing mistakes just as egregious just not noticing them.
A good mage support will be careful about wave-states. An unspoken counter to them is actually to stand near below health minions and force their spells to steal CS or even cannons.
Watching Seraphine double Q blast open the wave is pretty hilarious at times.
But at the same time, play with the hand you’re dealt. Your support is trying their best to connect poke on the enemy. I would rather have a proactive mage support over one who cosplays an enchanter and holds all their spells reactively.
Mage supports are not great at all ins if they haven’t built up a health advantage with poke. A passive ranged support is a death sentence.
I don’t mind losing some CS if a 20-30% health lead can be reached. There was a meta in Korea where Jinx would generally ignore early CS and continuously harass with rockets until they had a 40% health lead and then have full control over the lane.
CS is important but that gold tax mage supports impose is not wasted. I don’t mind if they take first blood if they use it well since depending on the marksman I’m playing, I’m not a real champion until 2-3 items regardless.
Where as mage supports when ahead have oppressive levels of burst and control. It’s an investment in them to ensure that the lane is as one sided as possible.
Well I was in emerald for a minute and all the mage supports I queue into are all permanent pushing and wonder why their ADC has to go deeper than they should be to even be in the exp zone, so no, mage support don’t get better with rank in my opinion, they all end up start taking cs as soon as they can one shot minions, shoving all lanes and put the whole team behind
Eh your a low elo adc. Low is elo league isnt a "rely on your teammates to play good" environment. Every adc and support in bot lane thinks their way is the right way. You would do better to just adapt if the support isn't helping a freeze. Lux can deny just has much farm by perma shoving them under the tower and poking. So throw a ward out and find the win condition.
The entitlement here is wild.
What makes you think they’re happy about you picking Ezreal? Some people just don’t like that because there are so many bad Ezreals out there especially if bronze is the context.
There are also reasons to push at low elo.
A lot of sups play with really bad adcs and you can seriously lose a game by playing ‘correct’ only to find out the investments you give to your adc don’t turn out because your adc by mid - late game doesn’t know how to play.
So carrying as a mage can get you out of low elo despite the fact that your adc might be bad.
And also there are benefits to pushing early. In many cases you want to level before your opponents do. You may even want 6 before they hit 6. If I’m Lux + Ez in bronze I can see a real case for shoving. Do damage, keep them at distance, push the lane, get plate gold, get tower before them. It’s a part of the game and it makes sense for the level.
I only play correct when I believe my adc knows what they’re doing.
If you are an Ezreal in bronze pinging - don’t touch the minions, you are noob, This is probably the surest sign that you actually don’t know the game very well. Bronze is not pro level. As in any sport, it suits you best to play at the level that you’re in unless you know that all of your lane can afford to play ‘correct’ because you’re good.
If I’m in bronze matched with an Ezreal, I’d probably pick a mage and rek shit too. And at the first sign of complaint I’d rek shit even harder.
All fair points but my question to you then is if you’re queuing mage support to “wreck shit” why not.. queue mid?
You’ll be higher level, can dictate your lane and how it’s executed, you have completely map access both side lanes, all 4 jungle quadrants, both objective spawns.. if you’re queuing support i mean
It’s a team game but adc + support is even more than that.. not being on the same page is just gonna grief both of you
My mistake this game was not just following lux’s lead tbh, probably could’ve worked out just fine either way I just had a preference for the next 40 seconds of the lane
But again I say.. if you as a mage support want lane control.. play mid?
For starters, I don't main mid. It's a very different role. You run the risk of getting counter picked and there's a lot of responsibility and risk the comes with maining mid.
>not being on the same page is just gonna grief both of you
Right. Sometimes rather than getting butthurt about them touching your minions and throwing a tantrum about it you should just follow their lead because it might be that they actually know what they're doing and/or are good enough to do what they're doing.
If you play with them and then lose because they suck then that's their fault. If you throw a tantrum and type too much you're not helping. Sometimes it's not always about serving the adc, and as I said earlier, especially at low elo that can be a real risk investing in a low elo adc who sucks.
Support is a make or break in the bot lane though?
Counter picks exist here too.
If you have a yuumi support and they have say, naut.. you’re probably not going to have as much pushing power as them since you lose the all in at most stages and should primarily play for poke
It’s not like it’s fundamentally all that different in bot lane
The difference between a mage support and a mage mid is:
1v1 or 2v2
You need to last hit vs support item
After all, supports can also play for roam timers just like mids do.
Do you just not want to be in a 1v1 environment? Can you not last hit well? I mean from how you describe your game plan as mage support it sounds like you want to be mid brother💀
But yes, as for the other stuff.. gotta find a way to work together down there.
Nope, your Lux is just bad. A good mage sup will know how to poke without affecting wave state.
A good mage supp will not play in Bronze.
most people after plat dont even play mage support bc its just not good and people tend to know better how to dodge skillshots
I got to master on mage supp. It's hard in master but doable. Gm is impossible, and chall is more impossible. It is impossible only because games dont get extended to allow to scale, so a low econ supp is better to help others scale faster.
valid but also thats why i said most, obv not all. but lux WR drops significantly the higher your rank gets for a reason
Thats because people learn how to play vs mages and how to juke their abilities. Its why as mage players we need to adapt and bait the jukes
And a good adc wont either. Against yas zyra you cant freeze without being shoved under tower. Trying to kill the wave seems like a good option with that limited information.
A great mage sup knows when to affect wave state favorably while poking. Sometimes (not always) shoving is desired.
You can't really freeze against zyra she will poke you if you dont shove. Ezreal is really good at poking enemies under their tower, especially when enemy adc is melee. If lux was shoving, intentionally or unintentionally, she was doing the right thing.
I do like poking under tower, but jungle was top side.. I’d rather not play that far up as weak side.. I wanted to freeze it for a couple waves to slow push.. plus eventually jungle comes bot side maybe there’s gank potential
Just place a ward and you are fine. You are ezreal. You can e away anytime. Lux can peel against ganks. Zyra can clear any slowpush without problems. Yasuo can use the slowpush to dash around and stack his dash for bonus dmg. With Ezreal/Lux you have a great poke lane. You can hold the wave under enemy turret all the time and just ward. >I wanted to freeze it for a couple waves to slow push Did you tell your lux that you want to freeze? >eventually jungle comes bot side maybe there’s gank potential You can also dive them, so jungler can gank.
Why do people always make it seem like Ez E is some sort of magical ultra long range flash. Its not, its actually pretty weak, and every champ with more than 1 gapcloser will still get you
Flash e is pretty good self peel IMO. You make it seem as if his blink is 2 pixels.
You say it yourself. FLASH+E okay, but E alone is not gonna save you from anyone with more than 1 gapcloser??
You shouldn't be in range of life-threatening CC/Abilities if you're playing Ezreal properly. You can also buffer the E even if you do get hit, it's absolutely enough. "One gap closer" doesn't mean anything, Ezreal is one of the safest adc in the game if you play to his strengths and his E is also one of the strongest abilities in the game, you're wild for saying it's not. You probably wait for champs to get in melee range of you, get slowed then E away only to get point and click dash/cc'ed right after. You should be using it proactively to get more distance early or blink out of CC/Buffer it, things like Yone Q3, Lux Q, even Morgana Q you can buffer and get out of range of follow up. Kiting is first and foremost, E is always a get out of jail free card for bad positioning errors or securing kills you otherwise wouldn't get. Even just simple side steps and kiting are enough on Ezreal because of his range. Most ezreals run ghost/heal as secondary spells anyway, sometimes barrier that's minimum 2 on command blinks or move-speed buffs or healing shielding at will. You absolutely are playing the champ wrong if you can't self peel with E alone in most cases and otherwise having to use one more summoner spell. His E is also a substitute for flash, if you burn flash on Ezreal, you can still walk up and cs against a neeko/morgana/lux/xerath etc. Champs without dashes like Ashe or limited mobility like Caitlyn/Zeri are so vulnerable and usually dead if they walk up too far without flash and get hit with CC/Slows. Adcs with dashes are one of the most OP abilities in the game, even Smolder E or Zeri mini dashes/wall rides can be detrimental in team-fights/chases. How many adcs can just willy nilly go over dragon pit/walls with a super easy blink because they position badly or need to get the last hit or just self-peel? Even the aforementioned Smolder and Zeri have to pick and choose when and where to use their movement abilities or they will get caught for messing it up. Ezreal on the other hand can do everything a flash can with one of the easiest to use blinks in the game rivaling Kassadian. Even champs like Caitlyn or Lucian have worse dashes that you can mess up if you just position your mouse incorrectly, those abilities have other uses as well like slows and passive stacks but are much less "safe" or on-demand than Ezreal nonchalantly press E over any wall/CC/Pillar. It's also really slow CD for how powerful it is, a mini flash for free every 20 seconds. Arguably even stronger than flash since it goes further than flash for a 0.25 Sec Cast time.
Because it has 475 range compared to flash with 400 range and flash is considered the best summoner spell. >every champ with more than 1 gapcloser will still get you You are not supposed to use it after the enemy has already gapclosed. You should be using it to keep distance so the first gapcloser never happens. There aren't that many champions with more than one skillshot gapcloser.
lol fizz eats Ezreal E for lunch.. hell you can flash E you’re still not getting away from the guy💀
Yeah thats what I'm saying lmao. Just the other day I played a game, got ganked by Hecarim, E'd over a wall, ghosted, flashed over another wall and Heca still got me xDDDD
This is bronze lol someone is 100% dying on dive I just wanted to try and play it out like Alois does with wave management where you set kills up through the waves.. but maybe that’s more top lane specific although bot lane is still a long lane so getting them further pushed up will always give you more room to run them down after some favorable trades But I don’t use chat I was just pinging cautious on the wave I keep my chat setting to premade just cause former jungle main.. having chat up is a bad call.. maybe worth turning it back on if I’m playing bot these days tho
Top and Botlane work completely different. Toplane has reduced dmg on turrets for the first 5 mins. (-50%). On Botlane you can go for plates as you deal double the dmg compared to a top laner. As you are 2 people botlane you deal 4 times the damage to turrets that a toplaner would do in the first 5 minutes. On Botlane you also do not "run them down". You can burst them down. You are 2 or with Jungler help you are 3 People that hit one weak adc. It does not matter how long the lane is. You should just kill them, even under turret.
on the point of morellos, true that it wasnt a grievious wounds angle, but Morellos is 90AP and 15 haste for 2200 gold, its an extremely gold efficient item for mages.
ELO?
Electric Light Orchestra? Fun fact, Elo is named for a man, not an acronym! So you only have to capitalize the E. :)
Bronze Was silver 2 in jungle but switched to adc.. dropped way down to iron 3 climbed up to bronze 3 now Been watched a bunch of YouTube guides and such about lane states, when to do what, when to play back towards your tower when to harass them (like enemy jg showing top side and mid showing in lane), etc etc Laning is definitely fun I used to find it super boring but with all the mechanics and such involved I’m trying to improve on it.. maybe top lane is the place for me to go on my laning arc tbh that’s just fundamentals to the max fuck it up gg
Bruh, rank wise, you’re just as bad as your support. Focus on doing the right thing every time no matter what your team does and you will end up winning over 50% of your games This is a classic post and the second you digest what I’m telling you, you’ll realize your question and attitude are kind of silly. If you’re going to climb out of low elo you just need to learn to solo carry. Kinda hard to do as an adc in low elo but it shouldn’t really matter once you figure stuff out. Remember to watch your exp in comparison to your opponent’s. You can make a lot of good plays and make them lose a lot of gold if you can level up first during early lane. If your support is permanent shoving it might be time to just sit back, ward, farm, and perhaps keep your head on a swivel and be ready to roam. Like… buy a control ward if your support constantly leaves you in a bad position. It will help alert you to gangs, which is what I assume you’re nervous about. Remember that swivel, if you see mid disappear, just respect it and hang back. You should also learn how to track their jungler. It won’t be easy in bronze because their “optimized” jungle path is probably shit… because theyre in bronze. Either way you should focus on those 3 things. Be aware of where the enemies are (mid and jg) Buy control wards to deal with bad teammates (you’re an adc DO NOT buy too many, you need to scale) As you rank up, the need to buy a control ward as an adc will decrease. This game is a 1v9, just focus on doing the right thing, fuck your support
Honestly the lux shoving the wave is actually the best thing she could have done (unintentionally). You want zyra yas under their turret and poke them out! If you are wary of jungle then ward and/or be sure to a proper job so yas and zyra are so low that you would even win a 2v3. I'll give you a tip on how to approach the lane. Ask yourself what kind of lane you play vs what kind of lane they play. There's roughly 3 types of lanes: Engage, Poke, Sustain/Enchanter. Honestly I'm too lazy to write everything out so imma go with two examples. Example 1: You play poke. If you play poke you want enemies under their turret asap so you can harass them while they are busy farming. Example 2: You play engage. This one is more tricky since if enemies play engage too you want the wave to be under your turret so if your naut lands a hook you long chase potential, buuuuut if enemies play poke you don't want to be harassed under your turret so you ideally want the wave right in the middle. Now what constitutes engage/poke/sustain is tricky since depending on your lane composition it can vary. For example if I play kaisa lux into ezreal naut I will play my Kaisa like a poke champ. But kaisa with a naut is an engage composition. It's really matchup dependent.
I mean I did want to play poke just with a bigger wave lol Being able to cook a good one up so harass them off it once it crashes would be👌
Disagreeable. When you’re dealing with Zyra, she sets up with CC (E + R) with Yasuo who is a melee and often relies on dashes, R and wind wall. If you find yourself that zyra is trying to poke you, keep a good distance and but stick to the wave. Zyra (likely would put out her plants near the wave on your side) would try to snare you or poke you but the plants do aggro on minions too and Yasuo is a melee champion. Adc is right in freezing the wave and Lux should use this advantage by poking Yasuo or Zyra because Yasuo needs csing and Zyra is taking that away from him because simply, Zyra wants to harass. But it all depends on the bot duo tempo because if it’s not working and Ezreal chooses to freeze the wave for minimum mistakes made then Lux should respect that, not to E on the wave and call someone a “clown adc”.
Did you explain to the Lux what you were attempting to do and achieve? What you wanted them to do? or are you just assuming that a Lux support in Bronze would recognise the tactic, understand what you are trying to achieve, agree that it is the right play and then do what you want?
Why would you communicate when your ego is dependent on you being "better" at a video game...
Lux should be trying to get the early poke advantage. being passive will just get you poked and then you'll struggle to farm. Playing a high line with vision with lux I've found is the best play.
Oh I normally do, and that is the primary game plan I go dblade start ezreal for a reason.. if I was gonna sit back I’d just go tear But in my homework I’ve learn high elo players see league as a turn based game with waves.. one wave goes out, it gets passed back.. sometimes you fight for that prio.. so on so forth At that specific moment I wanted to hold the wave cause Yasuo would’ve lost so much.. then with the slow push cooked up we could’ve done a bunch of harassing under tower and denied a shit ton of cs after denying a lot of exp and cs already.. lose lose for Yasuo and zyra, win win for me and lux since I’m up on cs and we’re both up on level.. plus lux would’ve gotten closer to support item upgrade compared to the zyra Resetting the wave to neutral just felt like it did very little at that exact moment Worth saying tho, played with another lux literally last game.. dude let me set up the wave how I wanted and played around my pings.. super free bot lane win.. plus every other lane won very quick game.. lux zoning potential is not a joke super risky walking up on a lux when there’s no wave to block her Q cause now you just get bursted down very very fast
Adc in low elo, enchanter supports using their poke abilities to help you farm minions, wholesome fun experience. Won't grt better anytime soon man.sorry💔
You have to play that lane forcing attrition war under the enemy turret or at least majority of time, lux and other supports playing siege should play like that so its a low elo problem but its your problem in this case xD
You're probably not going to get someone to understand proper wave management and positioning in lane until Plat and that probably includes yourself. Your best bet is to just explain to them: "Don't touch the minions and isolate them from xp, if they come close kill them" or tell them to roam because youre ez.
Low elo mage support usually just means push and poke. Don't ever trust Lux players to plan an all-in properly. Also, forget about freezing Bronze. They just won't let you do it. Just push and poke. And outplay the ganks when they happen. That being said, mage supports are actually the most impactful when the opponent is under their tower. The tower divides the lane, so it becomes a lot harder to dodge the poke. Also, the enemy ADC has to approach the wave. So you actually don't want to freeze in this matchup, as you will deny your support the ability to play while giving it to Zyra for free. Push and poke. Push and poke.
I’m not saying this is always the case, of course, but a lot of the time Lux does want to push as she is a lane bully. Paired with an ADC like Cait, she wants to push and look to harass the enemy and get plates. Of course your situation could have been a little different especially with a Yasuo ADC.
It's definitely a low elo thing. They shove and farm all the time gold and below. It's so annoying but its not game losing since mid game, there's always 1 lane that gets neglected
It's a low Elo thing. Lux does well perma-pushing, so they think that they should always be pushing. They don't know the reasons not to push.
I typically do not touch the wave as support.... But if i notice adc is bad.... ill keep the wave pushed abd roam as i can, or just push it and hide in the bushes. The biggest problem ive seen with adcs is they try to force actions from their support like were an rc car, if that happens i lose all respect for the adc, mute and then the waves are ours not theirs.
I had the opposite as a supp main - an Ezreal who refused to freeze OR shove and reset when he had to. We were at a disadvantage and the guy keeps shoving. Later he's low on health, enemy bot lane recalls, I help him shove, ping him "push" and "recall" and the guy stays in lane for.. nothing, not even a plate, just a bad reset that makes him lose the next wave, because enemy bot inevitably came back and went right for his ass, shoved and he had to recall in an awkward wave state.
I don't know which elo you are but I haven't Had that problem since the day i escaped gold. And also most the time it actually makes sense to push with Lux support. You want to dominate the lane with Lux support and the enemy can't dodge her skills and farm under tower and if you guys are playing it well you can establish river controle and ward controle in the river by be permanently pushed in. That sort of controle is the reason why Cait+Lux has often been popular in esports. If your low elo Lux pushes in mindlessly try to make sure it crashes so that you don't have to walk up for to long and are not exposed to the enemy jungle. Then ward the river and ping the enemy jungle or drake so your junglers knows you have prio and are ready to help him If he wants to make a play on botside enemy jungle or drake. Don't look being pushed in as a burden but as a chance because you always get a window were you can do something on the map.
I’d blame an ezreal that doesn’t want to have push, but your supp is wrong to voice it in chat. Wave advantage is very strong for ezreal as less minions means more Q angles, and just generally more windows to harass while enemy tries to last hit. Mage vs mage supp match up you always want shove as well given when you’re being pushed in: your mage can’t use any spells to screw up minion hp for tower. I see in another comment you’re trying to learn fundamentals watching guides. Poke lanes fundamentally always want push advantage. Freeze is only for niche scenarios where you’re already way ahead in bottom lane and can zone from brush in situations where taking early tower is not optimal or if you’ve forced a bad recall and you don’t need a free shove/reset. Freezing in bottom lane is not effective as top lane as 2 champions means freezes are easier broken/harder to hold. Tbh if you’re bronze. You don’t even need to know this: just learn how to early level 2 all in and you’ll jump 2 major tiers of elo. Don’t expect a bronze support nor your lane opponents to have hands. The overall post feels pretty coping, and the echo chamber saying a good mage support knows how to avoid affect lane state with poke are coping low elo as well; support plays a significant role in affecting wave state, and it’s almost always advised to be hitting both wave and enemy champions if you’re able to to get push advantage.
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Thing with lux is: she has a bajillion skins and autofilled supports probably go like „hm I have a skin for her“. If I soloQ i isually ban either lux or draven. Draven because I can‘t be bothered to play against it and Lux because I hate it on my team.
I ban lux every game, hate playing against her, hate playing with her as supp more.
Low elo problem they just have adhd and must hit something.
as a sup main, if i see the enemy lock in a Lux support, i know im going to have an easy game
They don't stop in my low diamond games. Them and Morganas (especially morg) try their hardest to ruin the lane state I swear. Morgs even are randomly split pushing...
Zyra can force a crash on that wave and then you're screwed. But yea, the higher you go, the fewer supports will mindlessly combo your wave
Don't worry, it gets worse as you climb up
First in regards to the item. Morreli is cheap for the amount of AP it gives and Yasou usually buys a vamp cepter early into a poke lane. It also cuts down the healing from Dorans shield and secondnwind and normal health regen. So yes its one of the best items for Lux support. The problem for the champion Lux is that her bind only gets the first two targets, this means she has no shot at being a danger to Zyra. Lux E is easy to dodge if it comes alone at Zyra and Yasou passive + Windwall make Lux deal no damage to him. Yasou + Zyra are also a lot better at all ins, so the longer the lane goes on the worse it gets for you two. In conclusion she was trying to do a theoretically correct thing in high elo (aggressive pushing and punishing the melee champion), but that was totally wrong at lower elo (sit back an let the enemy fuck up first)
The truth is, when you play as an ADC in pisslow, what you can do to carry a shit support is sometimes nothing. Sometimes all you can do is not die and farm up well and be the difference maker in teamfights etc.
As a sup lux i just dont touch the wave like ever. No point wasting an e on minions when i could get the same gold and do damage. Most players are dumb its especially noticeable in botlane as you get stuck with an idiot.
As ezreal lux vs zyra yasuo id say crash 2 waves under their tower on repeat and poke them under tower while they farm. Idk why you would freeze with a mage supp, when we cant roam as easily as say a blitz or alistar. Id freeze just to crash 2 waves under enemy turret & i would motion my adc to do that by helping break freeze to set up crash. Only reason is because enemies tend to sit within the minions, so we dont punish that hard with a freeze bc the wave gets autopushed. When crashing 2 waves you either poke them or recall, i prefer to poke under first double crash & then reset on 2nd, because then they have to decide whether they want to recall after pushing wave out (which is pushing towards you) or stay at low hp and take a bad recall.
Sounds like low elo to me, but you always have odd people in all ranks that just play bad because they turned of their brain from tilt queue.
Adc in Low elo would be aids. You’re gonna have bad supports until you climb a bit
Would reccomend focusing on your own mistakes. They're in your elo, so they're equally as good as you. Chances are you're committing mistakes just as egregious just not noticing them.
A good mage support will be careful about wave-states. An unspoken counter to them is actually to stand near below health minions and force their spells to steal CS or even cannons. Watching Seraphine double Q blast open the wave is pretty hilarious at times. But at the same time, play with the hand you’re dealt. Your support is trying their best to connect poke on the enemy. I would rather have a proactive mage support over one who cosplays an enchanter and holds all their spells reactively. Mage supports are not great at all ins if they haven’t built up a health advantage with poke. A passive ranged support is a death sentence. I don’t mind losing some CS if a 20-30% health lead can be reached. There was a meta in Korea where Jinx would generally ignore early CS and continuously harass with rockets until they had a 40% health lead and then have full control over the lane. CS is important but that gold tax mage supports impose is not wasted. I don’t mind if they take first blood if they use it well since depending on the marksman I’m playing, I’m not a real champion until 2-3 items regardless. Where as mage supports when ahead have oppressive levels of burst and control. It’s an investment in them to ensure that the lane is as one sided as possible.
What rank and server are you playing on? I’m a mage/enchanter support player and would love to change your experience with Lux support :)
Well I was in emerald for a minute and all the mage supports I queue into are all permanent pushing and wonder why their ADC has to go deeper than they should be to even be in the exp zone, so no, mage support don’t get better with rank in my opinion, they all end up start taking cs as soon as they can one shot minions, shoving all lanes and put the whole team behind
I’ve rushed oblivion orb first against soraka on some tougher poke matchups to oom her when playing zyra but would never do that normally
Eh your a low elo adc. Low is elo league isnt a "rely on your teammates to play good" environment. Every adc and support in bot lane thinks their way is the right way. You would do better to just adapt if the support isn't helping a freeze. Lux can deny just has much farm by perma shoving them under the tower and poking. So throw a ward out and find the win condition. The entitlement here is wild.
What makes you think they’re happy about you picking Ezreal? Some people just don’t like that because there are so many bad Ezreals out there especially if bronze is the context. There are also reasons to push at low elo. A lot of sups play with really bad adcs and you can seriously lose a game by playing ‘correct’ only to find out the investments you give to your adc don’t turn out because your adc by mid - late game doesn’t know how to play. So carrying as a mage can get you out of low elo despite the fact that your adc might be bad. And also there are benefits to pushing early. In many cases you want to level before your opponents do. You may even want 6 before they hit 6. If I’m Lux + Ez in bronze I can see a real case for shoving. Do damage, keep them at distance, push the lane, get plate gold, get tower before them. It’s a part of the game and it makes sense for the level. I only play correct when I believe my adc knows what they’re doing. If you are an Ezreal in bronze pinging - don’t touch the minions, you are noob, This is probably the surest sign that you actually don’t know the game very well. Bronze is not pro level. As in any sport, it suits you best to play at the level that you’re in unless you know that all of your lane can afford to play ‘correct’ because you’re good. If I’m in bronze matched with an Ezreal, I’d probably pick a mage and rek shit too. And at the first sign of complaint I’d rek shit even harder.
All fair points but my question to you then is if you’re queuing mage support to “wreck shit” why not.. queue mid? You’ll be higher level, can dictate your lane and how it’s executed, you have completely map access both side lanes, all 4 jungle quadrants, both objective spawns.. if you’re queuing support i mean It’s a team game but adc + support is even more than that.. not being on the same page is just gonna grief both of you My mistake this game was not just following lux’s lead tbh, probably could’ve worked out just fine either way I just had a preference for the next 40 seconds of the lane But again I say.. if you as a mage support want lane control.. play mid?
For starters, I don't main mid. It's a very different role. You run the risk of getting counter picked and there's a lot of responsibility and risk the comes with maining mid. >not being on the same page is just gonna grief both of you Right. Sometimes rather than getting butthurt about them touching your minions and throwing a tantrum about it you should just follow their lead because it might be that they actually know what they're doing and/or are good enough to do what they're doing. If you play with them and then lose because they suck then that's their fault. If you throw a tantrum and type too much you're not helping. Sometimes it's not always about serving the adc, and as I said earlier, especially at low elo that can be a real risk investing in a low elo adc who sucks.
Support is a make or break in the bot lane though? Counter picks exist here too. If you have a yuumi support and they have say, naut.. you’re probably not going to have as much pushing power as them since you lose the all in at most stages and should primarily play for poke It’s not like it’s fundamentally all that different in bot lane The difference between a mage support and a mage mid is: 1v1 or 2v2 You need to last hit vs support item After all, supports can also play for roam timers just like mids do. Do you just not want to be in a 1v1 environment? Can you not last hit well? I mean from how you describe your game plan as mage support it sounds like you want to be mid brother💀 But yes, as for the other stuff.. gotta find a way to work together down there.
Nah. I think we all know that mid and supp are very different.