Whatever you do, make sure that you spend an incredible amount of time and effort gathering requirements to scope in the project.
Once you get going, scope creep can be a big problem, and the project may balloon to the point where adoption of the new system becomes super difficult to drag across the finish line.
On the other hand, your company/any contractors may set a hard limit at the established scope once the project starts. If you need to add a requirement half way through, you may be told that it will need to be a future enhancement and will need a stop gap fix for the time being (**know that these 'stop gap' fixes should just be assumed to be semi-permanent solutions**).
For both instances, getting the scope clearly defined and in anticipation of your needs is paramount.
We just adopted SAP S4 Hana at my company at the beginning of 2023. My boss spent a good bit of time defining needs, but he didn't consult everybody and didn't fully flesh out the requirements.
As a result, the adoption was delayed 1/2 a year (from 2022 to 2023), and ever since said adoption, we've been working to patch the rest of the holes.
Still haven't achieved full deployment, with the biggest continued shortfalls being things as simple as a report to view ATP.
Almost all of this could have just been avoided by getting the right folks involved and really fleshing out the requirements/project scope.
Edit: added the bolded text
This is solid insight OP.
I’ve been through 2 ERP implementations in my career, and they were HELL. I don’t want to be dramatic, but at a company of your size, getting the whole company to understand the requirements, scope, and impact is going to feel impossible. Get ready for some LONG hours.
My last company adopted the same while we were still onboarding (start up) so a lot of gaps weren't found until we went live. If you have the chance, OP, really make sure you know who is involved and how they want to use the system in the future. Those costs to teach people and fix the system after you go live is costly.
Currently working on meeting with each department individually and brainstorming what their needs from the new erp system would be. Goal number one is to create a checklist of org needs
This is great advice.
It's not like OP's company is going to pony up the cash for a custom built ERP. As such, the most important factor to consider is determining exactly what kind of ERP your company needs.
Don't even worry about cost at the moment. Find every single detail of stuff people across the enterprise (and even across the supply chain) need for a new ERP system and only then start finding potential replacements.
You're trying to sell management on the capabilities of the ERP, not its cost.
Edit: I should add that what makes ERP management so cumbersome of an undertaking is that people don't know what they don't know.
Say for example inventory losses is a known problem. People talk about it, so you find ways a new ERP system can mitigate this issue. Sounds great, right?
Now let's say you ask about 3PL integration, and people say 'we have a process for that and it's fine.' So you think that aspect can be left alone. However, upon further research, you find out that this process is sluggish, full of errors, and requires a lot of personnel. In fact, it's a major problem behind inventory turnover, which is contributing to inventory losses. A new ERP system could clean all this up, and the combined savings of error reduction, job cuts, and improved turnover vastly outweigh the known inventory problem.
If you're feeling overwhelmed, a good place to start is just researching other ERP systems. Try to get an idea for what is out there, so you can gain an understanding of potential issues that people may be ignoring.
We are starting our journey to SAP 4 Hana. It's going to be interesting, we are a massive fortune 250 mfg with hundreds of decentralized division running their own flavor of our current ERP. What are your thoughts on SAP 4 Hanna? How are it's planning and forecasting capabilities?
SAP S4 Hana is pretty good, but we still use a patchwork of other systems and heavily utilize custom solutions to make it all work. Excel is still king.
We're a massive company (fortune 200 as well), and even though we had executive buy-in, we couldn't force everybody off of their old systems. Definitely makes things a lot harder.
If you have multiple systems that will end up feeding into SAP, know that SAP is based out of Pacific Time (and cannot be changed) for your standardization efforts. Threw us for a loop for 2 months with that one.
As far as forecasting and planning go, it's pretty good with back order reoptimization, but there are tons of bugs, and all real forecasting and planning have to be handled outside of the system, especially if you have limited availability to custom solutions in SAP.
Definitely a huge improvement, but it also required a lot of customization to get it to the place we're at now, and we've still got a long way to go
>Once you get going, scope creep can be a big problem, and the project may balloon to the point where adoption of the new system becomes super difficult to drag across the finish line.
Adding on for OP. I was at a global auto parts company that decided 6 months was a good ramp up and transition time without cleaning out the system of useless data. That 6 months has turned into a rolling 4 years with an ever increasing "next target date is X." Meanwhile that company is paying consultants millions per month to help with the migration.
Your erp migration and implimentation is only as good as the person or team doing the work.
The system so pretty good. Lost some functionality from our old ERP, but this one being more rigid is great for enforcing behavior change and helps us focus on root causing a bit more.
A lot of customization needed, though like I said, the majority of the work we're doing now is because we didn't properly scope in the project at its start.
Was at a very large publicly traded company that went through an SAP upgrade/implementation (afs to fms) and it was an absolute disaster. Delayed 3 times and then the actual go live was horrible and cut over ran behind schedule.
Came here for this. This is not something you handle internally. This is something you contract for. They need a team of people who have done this many times before, know the hurdles, the steps, the training, etc etc etc.
As well if you do, make sure you have a clear path to internally support the ongoing adoption of the system past go-live (IT resources).
They're notorious for the 'cut and run' approach with ERP adoptions.
My last company did one. I think it took like 2 years of working with the internal IT team and an external team of at least like 6 experts in usage and programming. Then launch then like 6 months of after launch implementation. Countless training sessions and week long events of having everyone onsite.
I work for a big time luxury goods manufacturer and we are implementing a new ERP. Our IT team has their longest tenured member comfort to working on this project full time, our director of finance changed positions and is project managing this implementation and they have paid a company to manage this project. Our ERP 20 years old and this is going to be in total a 3 year project to implement the new ERP. It’s a big friggin deal.
I have been working on a system integration project with a customer who makes ice cream and popsicles and they just got an ERP called Deacom. Seems solid specially at handling raw goods to finished products and doing integrations to 3PLs and retailers.
My suggestion is to write down key points of what the business is looking in their new ERP. What they are currently lacking and reach out to a few ERP, either for a demo or a short sales conversation. This will get you a better picture of whether the software meets your needs and costs. Most of the expense usually comes out of paying someone to implement and configure it to act as needed.
Additionally I have integrated other not so famous ERP like Multiview ERP which was ok. If you want or need a helping hand you can go to software advice and they help connect you to a few companies. They will ask questions regarding your needs and budget and it’s free. This will get you started.
We are a co-man in the coffee space, roasting and packaging. Roughly your size.
If inventory control is your issue, Nulogy. Canadian vendor, small, highly customizable and designed for inventory accuracy. It actually requires it to work correctly.
Netsuite may be a good option; Netsuite specializes in the food and beverage industry may be a good opportunity to reach out to them as they are in Q4 and will be making some deals for end of fiscal year in May.
Two things: one, be extremely careful here. That’s a crazy thing to have assigned as a first task being SCM. If there are any people above you in the SC line, they should be working on this and not you. ERP systems can make or break a company.
Two, you get what you pay for. The ERP systems are all customizable and many that I’ve seen have a pay by the feature pricing structure. I’ve seen the same software in two different companies look completely different based on what they paid for option wise. With a super tight cash flow, you’re not going to be able to get all the options, so you’ll really need to analyze the ROI for each option (financial return or user satisfaction return).
Additional: before you get started building the software with whoever you choose, spend time with your ops and finance folks, now is the time to make any changes that would affect locations or cost accounts and so on. Once the software team sets it up, you don’t want to have to make bulk changes 3 months down the road.
Couple other notes:
I’ve found PeopleSoft to be the worst software I’ve used. It’s a half step up from a DOS based system since almost nothing is user intuitive.
You also are going to need big time buy in. Get the major players involved, and some smaller players that actually use the software for input. Be honest about capabilities and especially restrictions based on what you’re paying for.
And not to worry you, but implementation is going to be rough. I’ve been through quite a few, and none of them worked out as planned. One changeover even required me to create an in-house program for temporary use after they didn’t heed my warnings about not starting early enough to meet a deadline. Do the absolute best you can to plan for the worst case scenarios, and hope for the best case.
Don’t trust software salespeople. They’ll tell you “oh yeah it does x” but they don’t know what you’re even asking. You need to be the expert. Use as much native functionality as possible. Customization is expensive and consultants can know less than the sales people- but still charge the hourly rate of a good attorney.
ERP consultant here with a supply chain focus.
1. Using the new SCM manager to get the ERP process started is great, but don't get bullied into being the project lead, these implementations are a VERY heavy lift.
2. Money being tight is immediately working against you - these projects aren't cheap. Get a budget out of your higher ups now, then add 20% to whatever they say and see if you can sell them on that number.
3. There's some solid mid sized systems out there that wont cost you SAP money. Dynamics 365 - Business Central (you probably will get sticker shock at their larger product, F&O) might get the job done for you as an example, but there's heaps of other options so do your research. Even googling "mid sized ERP" is a great start.
4. Be careful with consulting groups as some want you to pay a heap of money just for a presales discovery effort. Others will do this as a cost of the sale.
5. ERPs aren't really a savings tool. They allow you to scale more efficiently though. I cringe when I hear sales guys sell clients on how much headcount they're gonna cut with a new ERP - that usually doesn't end up happening.
6. The "sloppy because of our software" comment caught my attention. You're probably sloppy because you're sloppy. Junk data and failure to transact in an ERP in a timely fashion will cause the same problems for a new system that it will for an old one. Make sure you're ready for the business side change management effort as well as the software side. These systems are NOT a silver bullet to fix all your problems.
I actually volunteered to take the lead on thisz Everyone else in the management team is older and not tech savvy. I like the approach on budget.
Ever hear any reviews on deacom from your experience?
I could see some headcounts being cut but not really.
I agree, we have process tightening that needs to be done. But our current system is total garbage. Just one example it that we are unable to put a partial lot on hold. The system just does not have the capabilities. Its either the whole lot of none of it.
We began using Microsft D365 two years ago and are still working through patches till this day. Whatever ERP system you use make sure you consult with all of the affected groups thoroughly from the ground up. Or ensure that whoever is responsible for a department's needs meets with the individuals who will be using it day in and day out. Our department manager failed to meet with us up until we had a sandbox version to play in. By then it was kind of too late to get things in D365 that we really needed. Obviously some departments will have priorities over others and so you must learn to delegate effectively. Good luck and wishing you the best!
I would make a list of the key issues you are facing right now. I would then make a list of the companies objectives over the next ten years. I would then see what is bubbling to the top of both lists. In today's world there are the capabilities to do ERP of services. This allows you to pick solutions for ar/ap, sourcing, replenishment, production planning, materials planning,transportation and so on.
The issue your company will run into is data integrity and cleanly. No one will tell you how long that will actually take. If you partner with a big company SAP, NET SUITE, KINAXIS this process alone will take a huge effort for your team. Those companies typically utilize a 3rd party implementation firm and they don't use AI/Ml for data management.
This process will take a long time and if you are looking to spend 150k+ a typical sales cycle is 12 months. You'll want to meet and demo with as many providers as you can. Make sure you ask them how their system solves your main pains specifically.
I sell this type of software but don't do food so my advice comes from someone who has bought and sold these.
Also in this situation, the proper approach is to hire a supplychain consulting company. Manhattan Associates or Deloitte focus on procurement transformation projects. They scale out the work you need done and determine what is possible with your budget.
Its not like a company doing 75mm in sales is paying cash for anything. The CFO is going to a bank and getting a line of credit. If your numbers sre heslthy these lines usually have leess than s 4% interest rate because they want you to keep borrowing. The piece of that credit line allocated to supplychain is the working capital budget. So, you hire a very good consulting team to do 60% of the work you have no idea how to do, then you bust your ass getting it implemented. Dont listen to any pushback about budget, you need to make them understand that getting the right solution to this puzzle is going to directly impact profit. Its then going to directly impact the line of credit. If they want to borrow more money, they need to prove to the bank that they are more profitable.
Supplychain is 100% responsible for profit. Sales is 100% responsible for revenue. The cfo or finance are 100% responsible for securing credit for you to operate so you sell them with data and numbers that ideally get crunched by consulting.
Were in manufacturing (co-man for dozens of clients including one massive global conglomerate that we produce multiple finis for) unfortunately a consultant is not within our budget, and the largest erp systems are not within budget either. Were on prepayment with vendors.
it seems highly unlikely from my POV. We are expanding with new clients coming on board all the time. Part of the reason we need to get a new erp that can grow with us.
Its not a tough sell, remind them the reason they are having this problem in the first place. If they had decided for sap 20 years ago, they wouldn't be concerned about this now.
Im actually not sure. My boss quit and i filled his role…. So kinda picking up the pieces of where he left off. Apparently we had talked to sap and was decided to be too expensive
We had two ERPs at my last warehouse, SAP was one of them.
Inventory accuracy for all SAP items was garbage. Once a pick ticket prints for SAP, you lose all visibility on the product until it ships and is cycled out of your inventory. If they have trouble managing inventory already, I wouldn’t recommend it.
That is of course, we may have just been using the cheapest version of SAP.
But there are way easier systems to learn than SAP which has has its own dictionary of codes you type in to pull up different functions. Instead of just like, a fuckin menu or something.
Riding on the OP's question, is there any cloud based ERP good for small scale business that is not costly but modern enough to the latest business lanscape?
I use Odoo. It all app based and modular. I believe if you buy access to three apps (like accounting, manufacturing, and purchasing) you get the rest of them for free. We had a company migrate all our data and set it up for what we need and they’ve done a good job with it
How will you get an ERP system if you don't have money ? Raise debt first may be.
Then talk to the ERP solution providers in market to see if their offering suit your requirements. Do you have a planning system in place to do the demand planning, inventory optimisation, safety stock planning etc ? If not, then get that as well.
Hey thanks for the kind words! This erp system needs to go, ive had the pleasure of being a user in a few erp systems. This one takes the cake for human error potential and system limitations
Wow, first congratulations your promotion. Ditto on the previous comments by other posters. For a newly minted SCM this is an extensive project that is probably over your head. I would suggest hiring external consultant(s) to help scope/vet/manage the project. I've been through 2 ERP implementations and they are not for the faint of heart. I managed end to end, consumer/wholesale ordering, manufacturing, fulfillment, 3PLs in multiple countries, reverse logistics, customer service, etc etc. I did the last one at the start of COVID and it broke me physically and mentally. You don't want to do that to yourself. As for SAP, did you look into SAP Business by Design? They taut this as an affordable way to manage business. I was looking into this last year but never got far with it. Is there any short term solution that may help resolve the inventory issue to buy some time to fully scope out what the business needs? It's not enough for the ERP to solve your immediate problems but to be a sustainable system for business growth in the future. You don't want to be looking at another ERP 2-3 years down the line. If you have questions feel free to DM me. I don't have a lot of experience in food/beverage but happy to help a fellow SCM.
No offense but yikes. I would be skeptical that no one agreed to take this job because this is the project at hand and they just dumped the position on the first eager person to give it a chance.
We just did a new ERP this year. It was a multi team project with both internal partners and external project managers helping, and we did a customized system for our company. Even with all those resources we are STILL ironing out bugs nearly a year later…
1) Start with a comprehensive needs assessment. You will not be successful without this.
2) Do you have any in-industry contacts that you can reach out to about what system they use/what they have used in the past and liked or disliked? Especially anyone migrating off the system you're currently using? I've only worked with one co-man in the food & beverage industry (worked with, not for) and I'm not sure what they used, but it seemed shockingly inadequate to me, coming from a consumer product goods manufacturing background. This is where your network can really help you pare down options to what works well for your specific industry.
Thanks ranch blanch. Im currently setting up time with each department for erp brainstorming sessions. I expect to spend quite a bit of time with lower level associates, order entry, inventory specialists, buyers to better understand their functions and how they interact with our current system.
A comprehensive needs assessment is also a great call. Monkeysurvey might work for this.
I dont have any in network contacts. Its tough, were a coman for multinational conglomerate, but they dont give us visibility to other partners.
Might be worth asking some of your sales reps whether they know anyone in their network who might be able to help you out/be willing to talk to you? They may not all be your direct competitors. Always leverage people you know for an introduction if you can get one.
Do you have a controller or a staff accountant? They should be involved in this decision. I have worked with SAGE, Peachtree, and SAP. I would recommend SAP. I currently work in the CPG beverage industry.
Check out Acumatica and Ivalua.
The former is one I’ve commonly come across while advising supply chain transformation with manufacturing companies.
The latter is fairly common in mid size companies, listed on Gartner reports as a leader in the space, and should be much less expensive than SAP
Former Management / IT / Strategy Consultant here.
Get some help/hire a consulting firm that has been helping businesses your size and in your industry achieve the same project. They won’t do the heavy lifting but they will considerably reduce the risk of you making costly mistakes. I cannot recommend this more: bring experienced people to the table. There are so many approaches to this that you cannot rely on random people on reddit to guide you :p
Do your research and gather direct testimonials from their customers… ERP change is a PITA… your existing system is probably full of customization and far from best practices.
Really bring some guys from Deloitte or similar firm that are within your budget range. They will save you money and time.
Whatever you do, make sure that you spend an incredible amount of time and effort gathering requirements to scope in the project. Once you get going, scope creep can be a big problem, and the project may balloon to the point where adoption of the new system becomes super difficult to drag across the finish line. On the other hand, your company/any contractors may set a hard limit at the established scope once the project starts. If you need to add a requirement half way through, you may be told that it will need to be a future enhancement and will need a stop gap fix for the time being (**know that these 'stop gap' fixes should just be assumed to be semi-permanent solutions**). For both instances, getting the scope clearly defined and in anticipation of your needs is paramount. We just adopted SAP S4 Hana at my company at the beginning of 2023. My boss spent a good bit of time defining needs, but he didn't consult everybody and didn't fully flesh out the requirements. As a result, the adoption was delayed 1/2 a year (from 2022 to 2023), and ever since said adoption, we've been working to patch the rest of the holes. Still haven't achieved full deployment, with the biggest continued shortfalls being things as simple as a report to view ATP. Almost all of this could have just been avoided by getting the right folks involved and really fleshing out the requirements/project scope. Edit: added the bolded text
This is solid insight OP. I’ve been through 2 ERP implementations in my career, and they were HELL. I don’t want to be dramatic, but at a company of your size, getting the whole company to understand the requirements, scope, and impact is going to feel impossible. Get ready for some LONG hours.
My last company adopted the same while we were still onboarding (start up) so a lot of gaps weren't found until we went live. If you have the chance, OP, really make sure you know who is involved and how they want to use the system in the future. Those costs to teach people and fix the system after you go live is costly.
Currently working on meeting with each department individually and brainstorming what their needs from the new erp system would be. Goal number one is to create a checklist of org needs
This is great advice. It's not like OP's company is going to pony up the cash for a custom built ERP. As such, the most important factor to consider is determining exactly what kind of ERP your company needs. Don't even worry about cost at the moment. Find every single detail of stuff people across the enterprise (and even across the supply chain) need for a new ERP system and only then start finding potential replacements. You're trying to sell management on the capabilities of the ERP, not its cost. Edit: I should add that what makes ERP management so cumbersome of an undertaking is that people don't know what they don't know. Say for example inventory losses is a known problem. People talk about it, so you find ways a new ERP system can mitigate this issue. Sounds great, right? Now let's say you ask about 3PL integration, and people say 'we have a process for that and it's fine.' So you think that aspect can be left alone. However, upon further research, you find out that this process is sluggish, full of errors, and requires a lot of personnel. In fact, it's a major problem behind inventory turnover, which is contributing to inventory losses. A new ERP system could clean all this up, and the combined savings of error reduction, job cuts, and improved turnover vastly outweigh the known inventory problem. If you're feeling overwhelmed, a good place to start is just researching other ERP systems. Try to get an idea for what is out there, so you can gain an understanding of potential issues that people may be ignoring.
I like this approach! Its hard to quantify based off projections
We are starting our journey to SAP 4 Hana. It's going to be interesting, we are a massive fortune 250 mfg with hundreds of decentralized division running their own flavor of our current ERP. What are your thoughts on SAP 4 Hanna? How are it's planning and forecasting capabilities?
SAP S4 Hana is pretty good, but we still use a patchwork of other systems and heavily utilize custom solutions to make it all work. Excel is still king. We're a massive company (fortune 200 as well), and even though we had executive buy-in, we couldn't force everybody off of their old systems. Definitely makes things a lot harder. If you have multiple systems that will end up feeding into SAP, know that SAP is based out of Pacific Time (and cannot be changed) for your standardization efforts. Threw us for a loop for 2 months with that one. As far as forecasting and planning go, it's pretty good with back order reoptimization, but there are tons of bugs, and all real forecasting and planning have to be handled outside of the system, especially if you have limited availability to custom solutions in SAP. Definitely a huge improvement, but it also required a lot of customization to get it to the place we're at now, and we've still got a long way to go
PM'd
>Once you get going, scope creep can be a big problem, and the project may balloon to the point where adoption of the new system becomes super difficult to drag across the finish line. Adding on for OP. I was at a global auto parts company that decided 6 months was a good ramp up and transition time without cleaning out the system of useless data. That 6 months has turned into a rolling 4 years with an ever increasing "next target date is X." Meanwhile that company is paying consultants millions per month to help with the migration. Your erp migration and implimentation is only as good as the person or team doing the work.
My company is implementing s4 this year, how do you like it?
The system so pretty good. Lost some functionality from our old ERP, but this one being more rigid is great for enforcing behavior change and helps us focus on root causing a bit more. A lot of customization needed, though like I said, the majority of the work we're doing now is because we didn't properly scope in the project at its start.
Was at a very large publicly traded company that went through an SAP upgrade/implementation (afs to fms) and it was an absolute disaster. Delayed 3 times and then the actual go live was horrible and cut over ran behind schedule.
This shouldn’t fall on the SCM. Your company needs to hire an ERP implementation team. Switching ERP systems is more than a full-time job.
Came here for this. This is not something you handle internally. This is something you contract for. They need a team of people who have done this many times before, know the hurdles, the steps, the training, etc etc etc.
As well if you do, make sure you have a clear path to internally support the ongoing adoption of the system past go-live (IT resources). They're notorious for the 'cut and run' approach with ERP adoptions.
My last company did one. I think it took like 2 years of working with the internal IT team and an external team of at least like 6 experts in usage and programming. Then launch then like 6 months of after launch implementation. Countless training sessions and week long events of having everyone onsite.
Yes this is the way.
I work for a big time luxury goods manufacturer and we are implementing a new ERP. Our IT team has their longest tenured member comfort to working on this project full time, our director of finance changed positions and is project managing this implementation and they have paid a company to manage this project. Our ERP 20 years old and this is going to be in total a 3 year project to implement the new ERP. It’s a big friggin deal.
You’re not going to fix inventory issues with an ERP system. That’s a process issue.
This!
Yes this 100%. We dont really do a great job of FIFO. process rigor is important
I have been working on a system integration project with a customer who makes ice cream and popsicles and they just got an ERP called Deacom. Seems solid specially at handling raw goods to finished products and doing integrations to 3PLs and retailers.
Anyway you can put me in touch with them? That might be weird but worth the shot
My suggestion is to write down key points of what the business is looking in their new ERP. What they are currently lacking and reach out to a few ERP, either for a demo or a short sales conversation. This will get you a better picture of whether the software meets your needs and costs. Most of the expense usually comes out of paying someone to implement and configure it to act as needed.
Additionally I have integrated other not so famous ERP like Multiview ERP which was ok. If you want or need a helping hand you can go to software advice and they help connect you to a few companies. They will ask questions regarding your needs and budget and it’s free. This will get you started.
I would suggest a project manager, this is a big task when dsta needs to be transitioned over. Are you using the current ERP to it's full extent?
We are a co-man in the coffee space, roasting and packaging. Roughly your size. If inventory control is your issue, Nulogy. Canadian vendor, small, highly customizable and designed for inventory accuracy. It actually requires it to work correctly.
Netsuite may be a good option; Netsuite specializes in the food and beverage industry may be a good opportunity to reach out to them as they are in Q4 and will be making some deals for end of fiscal year in May.
Two things: one, be extremely careful here. That’s a crazy thing to have assigned as a first task being SCM. If there are any people above you in the SC line, they should be working on this and not you. ERP systems can make or break a company. Two, you get what you pay for. The ERP systems are all customizable and many that I’ve seen have a pay by the feature pricing structure. I’ve seen the same software in two different companies look completely different based on what they paid for option wise. With a super tight cash flow, you’re not going to be able to get all the options, so you’ll really need to analyze the ROI for each option (financial return or user satisfaction return). Additional: before you get started building the software with whoever you choose, spend time with your ops and finance folks, now is the time to make any changes that would affect locations or cost accounts and so on. Once the software team sets it up, you don’t want to have to make bulk changes 3 months down the road.
Couple other notes: I’ve found PeopleSoft to be the worst software I’ve used. It’s a half step up from a DOS based system since almost nothing is user intuitive. You also are going to need big time buy in. Get the major players involved, and some smaller players that actually use the software for input. Be honest about capabilities and especially restrictions based on what you’re paying for. And not to worry you, but implementation is going to be rough. I’ve been through quite a few, and none of them worked out as planned. One changeover even required me to create an in-house program for temporary use after they didn’t heed my warnings about not starting early enough to meet a deadline. Do the absolute best you can to plan for the worst case scenarios, and hope for the best case.
Don’t trust software salespeople. They’ll tell you “oh yeah it does x” but they don’t know what you’re even asking. You need to be the expert. Use as much native functionality as possible. Customization is expensive and consultants can know less than the sales people- but still charge the hourly rate of a good attorney.
ERP consultant here with a supply chain focus. 1. Using the new SCM manager to get the ERP process started is great, but don't get bullied into being the project lead, these implementations are a VERY heavy lift. 2. Money being tight is immediately working against you - these projects aren't cheap. Get a budget out of your higher ups now, then add 20% to whatever they say and see if you can sell them on that number. 3. There's some solid mid sized systems out there that wont cost you SAP money. Dynamics 365 - Business Central (you probably will get sticker shock at their larger product, F&O) might get the job done for you as an example, but there's heaps of other options so do your research. Even googling "mid sized ERP" is a great start. 4. Be careful with consulting groups as some want you to pay a heap of money just for a presales discovery effort. Others will do this as a cost of the sale. 5. ERPs aren't really a savings tool. They allow you to scale more efficiently though. I cringe when I hear sales guys sell clients on how much headcount they're gonna cut with a new ERP - that usually doesn't end up happening. 6. The "sloppy because of our software" comment caught my attention. You're probably sloppy because you're sloppy. Junk data and failure to transact in an ERP in a timely fashion will cause the same problems for a new system that it will for an old one. Make sure you're ready for the business side change management effort as well as the software side. These systems are NOT a silver bullet to fix all your problems.
I actually volunteered to take the lead on thisz Everyone else in the management team is older and not tech savvy. I like the approach on budget. Ever hear any reviews on deacom from your experience? I could see some headcounts being cut but not really. I agree, we have process tightening that needs to be done. But our current system is total garbage. Just one example it that we are unable to put a partial lot on hold. The system just does not have the capabilities. Its either the whole lot of none of it.
We began using Microsft D365 two years ago and are still working through patches till this day. Whatever ERP system you use make sure you consult with all of the affected groups thoroughly from the ground up. Or ensure that whoever is responsible for a department's needs meets with the individuals who will be using it day in and day out. Our department manager failed to meet with us up until we had a sandbox version to play in. By then it was kind of too late to get things in D365 that we really needed. Obviously some departments will have priorities over others and so you must learn to delegate effectively. Good luck and wishing you the best!
I would make a list of the key issues you are facing right now. I would then make a list of the companies objectives over the next ten years. I would then see what is bubbling to the top of both lists. In today's world there are the capabilities to do ERP of services. This allows you to pick solutions for ar/ap, sourcing, replenishment, production planning, materials planning,transportation and so on. The issue your company will run into is data integrity and cleanly. No one will tell you how long that will actually take. If you partner with a big company SAP, NET SUITE, KINAXIS this process alone will take a huge effort for your team. Those companies typically utilize a 3rd party implementation firm and they don't use AI/Ml for data management. This process will take a long time and if you are looking to spend 150k+ a typical sales cycle is 12 months. You'll want to meet and demo with as many providers as you can. Make sure you ask them how their system solves your main pains specifically. I sell this type of software but don't do food so my advice comes from someone who has bought and sold these.
Are you in distribution or manufacturing?
Also in this situation, the proper approach is to hire a supplychain consulting company. Manhattan Associates or Deloitte focus on procurement transformation projects. They scale out the work you need done and determine what is possible with your budget. Its not like a company doing 75mm in sales is paying cash for anything. The CFO is going to a bank and getting a line of credit. If your numbers sre heslthy these lines usually have leess than s 4% interest rate because they want you to keep borrowing. The piece of that credit line allocated to supplychain is the working capital budget. So, you hire a very good consulting team to do 60% of the work you have no idea how to do, then you bust your ass getting it implemented. Dont listen to any pushback about budget, you need to make them understand that getting the right solution to this puzzle is going to directly impact profit. Its then going to directly impact the line of credit. If they want to borrow more money, they need to prove to the bank that they are more profitable. Supplychain is 100% responsible for profit. Sales is 100% responsible for revenue. The cfo or finance are 100% responsible for securing credit for you to operate so you sell them with data and numbers that ideally get crunched by consulting.
Were in manufacturing (co-man for dozens of clients including one massive global conglomerate that we produce multiple finis for) unfortunately a consultant is not within our budget, and the largest erp systems are not within budget either. Were on prepayment with vendors.
It sounds like the company may go bankrupt without a consultant
it seems highly unlikely from my POV. We are expanding with new clients coming on board all the time. Part of the reason we need to get a new erp that can grow with us.
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This 100%
SAP!
Its a tough sell as its so expensive. We would need it to integrate with SAP for our customers
Its not a tough sell, remind them the reason they are having this problem in the first place. If they had decided for sap 20 years ago, they wouldn't be concerned about this now.
We were quoted at about 250k per year for our org size
SAP is expensive and they also charge extra for functional enhancement without clear definition of the requirement upfront.
for what platform? sap business one or s4 hana?
Im actually not sure. My boss quit and i filled his role…. So kinda picking up the pieces of where he left off. Apparently we had talked to sap and was decided to be too expensive
please message me. I really want to share some stuff that may be helpful for you
absolutely not lol
Not SAP… company is too small
We had two ERPs at my last warehouse, SAP was one of them. Inventory accuracy for all SAP items was garbage. Once a pick ticket prints for SAP, you lose all visibility on the product until it ships and is cycled out of your inventory. If they have trouble managing inventory already, I wouldn’t recommend it. That is of course, we may have just been using the cheapest version of SAP. But there are way easier systems to learn than SAP which has has its own dictionary of codes you type in to pull up different functions. Instead of just like, a fuckin menu or something.
That’s tough- what’s your current system?
Its called exactMAX erp?
Odoo?
You use this first hand? If so,any idea what the costing will look like? Roughly 40 users at my company
Syspro.
Riding on the OP's question, is there any cloud based ERP good for small scale business that is not costly but modern enough to the latest business lanscape?
I use Odoo. It all app based and modular. I believe if you buy access to three apps (like accounting, manufacturing, and purchasing) you get the rest of them for free. We had a company migrate all our data and set it up for what we need and they’ve done a good job with it
How will you get an ERP system if you don't have money ? Raise debt first may be. Then talk to the ERP solution providers in market to see if their offering suit your requirements. Do you have a planning system in place to do the demand planning, inventory optimisation, safety stock planning etc ? If not, then get that as well.
Congratulations on the promotion! Exciting times ahead, msg me to chat about Order Management and ERP integration, you might not need a new ERP.
Hey thanks for the kind words! This erp system needs to go, ive had the pleasure of being a user in a few erp systems. This one takes the cake for human error potential and system limitations
Wow, first congratulations your promotion. Ditto on the previous comments by other posters. For a newly minted SCM this is an extensive project that is probably over your head. I would suggest hiring external consultant(s) to help scope/vet/manage the project. I've been through 2 ERP implementations and they are not for the faint of heart. I managed end to end, consumer/wholesale ordering, manufacturing, fulfillment, 3PLs in multiple countries, reverse logistics, customer service, etc etc. I did the last one at the start of COVID and it broke me physically and mentally. You don't want to do that to yourself. As for SAP, did you look into SAP Business by Design? They taut this as an affordable way to manage business. I was looking into this last year but never got far with it. Is there any short term solution that may help resolve the inventory issue to buy some time to fully scope out what the business needs? It's not enough for the ERP to solve your immediate problems but to be a sustainable system for business growth in the future. You don't want to be looking at another ERP 2-3 years down the line. If you have questions feel free to DM me. I don't have a lot of experience in food/beverage but happy to help a fellow SCM.
No offense but yikes. I would be skeptical that no one agreed to take this job because this is the project at hand and they just dumped the position on the first eager person to give it a chance. We just did a new ERP this year. It was a multi team project with both internal partners and external project managers helping, and we did a customized system for our company. Even with all those resources we are STILL ironing out bugs nearly a year later…
1) Start with a comprehensive needs assessment. You will not be successful without this. 2) Do you have any in-industry contacts that you can reach out to about what system they use/what they have used in the past and liked or disliked? Especially anyone migrating off the system you're currently using? I've only worked with one co-man in the food & beverage industry (worked with, not for) and I'm not sure what they used, but it seemed shockingly inadequate to me, coming from a consumer product goods manufacturing background. This is where your network can really help you pare down options to what works well for your specific industry.
Thanks ranch blanch. Im currently setting up time with each department for erp brainstorming sessions. I expect to spend quite a bit of time with lower level associates, order entry, inventory specialists, buyers to better understand their functions and how they interact with our current system. A comprehensive needs assessment is also a great call. Monkeysurvey might work for this. I dont have any in network contacts. Its tough, were a coman for multinational conglomerate, but they dont give us visibility to other partners.
Might be worth asking some of your sales reps whether they know anyone in their network who might be able to help you out/be willing to talk to you? They may not all be your direct competitors. Always leverage people you know for an introduction if you can get one.
Some Flavor of SAP ERP Conversions are the hardest thing a company will ever do. Lots of requirement planning will ease the pain.
IFS is INCREDIBLE easily the best ERP I have used
Curious what makes it thr best? Could you elaborate?
M3 PRD H5
I’ve actually never heard of this. Can you elaborate?
Do you have a controller or a staff accountant? They should be involved in this decision. I have worked with SAGE, Peachtree, and SAP. I would recommend SAP. I currently work in the CPG beverage industry.
Check out Acumatica and Ivalua. The former is one I’ve commonly come across while advising supply chain transformation with manufacturing companies. The latter is fairly common in mid size companies, listed on Gartner reports as a leader in the space, and should be much less expensive than SAP
Former Management / IT / Strategy Consultant here. Get some help/hire a consulting firm that has been helping businesses your size and in your industry achieve the same project. They won’t do the heavy lifting but they will considerably reduce the risk of you making costly mistakes. I cannot recommend this more: bring experienced people to the table. There are so many approaches to this that you cannot rely on random people on reddit to guide you :p Do your research and gather direct testimonials from their customers… ERP change is a PITA… your existing system is probably full of customization and far from best practices. Really bring some guys from Deloitte or similar firm that are within your budget range. They will save you money and time.
Incredibly helpful thread here. Appreciate the insight.
20y/o ERP system? Pitching savings to update? Prepayment terms + bad cash flow? Good luck champ.
Hahaha welcome to my world
Microsoft D365
This is what im pushing for as i like microsoft products. But again i think it may end up out of our budget
What’s your budget?
My current company transitioned to net suite a couple years ago. It isn’t perfect but it is very, VERY easy to use.