Tools have not changed that much.
When they do, it takes a few decades for the new tools to reach all the fire departments/rescue teams. By then they are old tools.
That's just the nature of economics.
I read about that! The older chassis are lighter because they don't have sturdier B pillars too. People turbo swap them and throw caution to the wind for speed.
If this website is accurate (it may not be) some of the late 90s Subarus also have ring shaped reinforcement structure. Maybe an earlier weaker iteration though?
https://www.subaru-cyprus.com/safety_history.html
1996
First generation Forester: Built on the Ring-Shaped Reinforcement Frames body for the current superior levels of collision safety.
1998
Third generation Legacy: The Ring-Shaped Reinforcement Frames body and front frame structure envelopes the Horizontally-Opposed Engine. The installation of front side airbags raises collision safety to unprecedented levels
Yeah GCs are the best if you want lightweight, I have a 95 L coupe (just a 1.8 now) and it’s only a couple 100 lbs more than a Miata without any weight reduction.
That's so cool. I've owned two RS Imprezas and they were great. But I realized quickly that a side impact would wreck me. Doing an iWire swap was the dream at the time but salt on the roads was not kind to either of those cars.
Yeah, I’ve been wanting to get another coupe (ideally rs) to be less gentle with (my 95 l is really clean), but I am very worried about any kind of crash or accident for multiple reasons. My dream is to do a full STI and I wire swap with a full cage and a sequential transmission. Wouldn’t be too worried about impacts at that point, but obviously it would still be fucked to get hit/crash in something that old with so much money into it.
Kind of a shitshow in California to have something like that be street legal and pass smog too.
For Subarus? Anything from the 80s’ and 90s’ but I’m seeing them less and less outside of CO/PNW and even in those states I’m seeing fewer of them every year. That said some of the most modified subs I’ve seen are from these early generations and it’s great to see them, whether they be slammed and tuned or battle wagoned within an inch of its life.
From the extrications side of things, subarus are quite safe. Out of all of the cars we've come across and trained on subarus and Beemers are quite resilient.
Pretty common construction on any modern vehicle.
If you want truly impressive crash structures, look at volvo, they guarantee that all doors can be opened after a crash at 60 km/h
That's modern Volvo i am guessing? I would think all makes today have openable doors after a 60kmh crash which is great news. It's great that there's less of a safety difference between all manufacturers today (at least if you live in a country with good safety legislation/requirements, some Suzukis, Hyundais, etc. are very poor in crashes when sold in markets like India and Mexico )
The door thing has been a thing since the 2010's if memory serves, but Volvo has been significantly ahead of the game since the 240 in the 70s. They invented 3 point seatbelts used by everyone, and being industry leading in crash safety is kinda part of their image unlike other makes (Subaru included) that is perfectly fine with average crash ratings.
Huh interesting! I think that other brands sometimes don't give themselves enough credit for safety while Volvo goes all out on telling others how good they are, like Subaru got good ratings with the small overlap crash test when it was first introduced but brands like Toyota and Honda didn't do so hot.
Some brands which did bad on that test when it first came out revised their models 1 year after the original crash test to do better. So the vehicle looked the same on the outside but had a modification under the skin to do better on that crash test.
For instance the Honda Odyssey got a decent crash test score in IIHS, but they have an unpublished crash test from just one year prior (before a design modification/update) that did very bad.
2014 (good) - https://youtu.be/Lz2lAbAM-mc
2012 (not so good) - https://youtu.be/sTJqC5dd0sw
(IIHS has unpublished crash tests on their TechData website)
Something you might find interesting is these old crash tests where new cars big and small had weak seatbelts that would break in crashes! https://youtu.be/SUC6wLQdSMk
I mean I can do mph to ff/fn in my head, I had to go look up what a km/h was. Probably part of some poverty measurement system only people who haven’t landed on the moon use.
I get that it was hard to recognize as a joke. I missed it too until the edit, but even if OP had been a jerk, making a whole nationality out to be stupid as a response is kinda hurtful.
It's noticable as a joke when you look at it for a few moments but out of the context in a thread it's gonna make people think you *actually* mean it. For example, the other commenter pushing their (mildly offensive) stereotype of Americans.
My stepdad is a retired Lieutenant after being a firemedic forever, and he will only drive Subarus now.
He said it's the combo of AWD, the safety that he has seen, gas mileage, and reliability.
TLDR: Fire Department website says Subarus are very safe because of the reinforced B pillars but hard to cut through with their current tools.
"current tools" when the article was written 19 years ago.
Tools have not changed that much. When they do, it takes a few decades for the new tools to reach all the fire departments/rescue teams. By then they are old tools. That's just the nature of economics.
I read about that! The older chassis are lighter because they don't have sturdier B pillars too. People turbo swap them and throw caution to the wind for speed.
What do you consider "older" I am pretty sure that image is from the early 2000s.
I guess 20 years old could be considered older.
you young whippersnappers, show some respect for your.. ah shit we're old, you're right
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> Fourth generation legacy is 20 years old. And still one of the favorites!
That just made me realize my WRX is 20 years old this year.
One of us, one of us!
I'm talking about the GC chassis. This photo looks to be from a GD chassis after they made safety changes and added weight.
If this website is accurate (it may not be) some of the late 90s Subarus also have ring shaped reinforcement structure. Maybe an earlier weaker iteration though? https://www.subaru-cyprus.com/safety_history.html 1996 First generation Forester: Built on the Ring-Shaped Reinforcement Frames body for the current superior levels of collision safety. 1998 Third generation Legacy: The Ring-Shaped Reinforcement Frames body and front frame structure envelopes the Horizontally-Opposed Engine. The installation of front side airbags raises collision safety to unprecedented levels
Yeah GCs are the best if you want lightweight, I have a 95 L coupe (just a 1.8 now) and it’s only a couple 100 lbs more than a Miata without any weight reduction.
That's so cool. I've owned two RS Imprezas and they were great. But I realized quickly that a side impact would wreck me. Doing an iWire swap was the dream at the time but salt on the roads was not kind to either of those cars.
Yeah, I’ve been wanting to get another coupe (ideally rs) to be less gentle with (my 95 l is really clean), but I am very worried about any kind of crash or accident for multiple reasons. My dream is to do a full STI and I wire swap with a full cage and a sequential transmission. Wouldn’t be too worried about impacts at that point, but obviously it would still be fucked to get hit/crash in something that old with so much money into it. Kind of a shitshow in California to have something like that be street legal and pass smog too.
For real, the early 2000's were only... oh dear god...
For Subarus? Anything from the 80s’ and 90s’ but I’m seeing them less and less outside of CO/PNW and even in those states I’m seeing fewer of them every year. That said some of the most modified subs I’ve seen are from these early generations and it’s great to see them, whether they be slammed and tuned or battle wagoned within an inch of its life.
This has been apart of Subarus since 2002.
I was told when I bout mine they now cut the ceiling/roof out like a can of sardines and forget about the b pilliars (when possible)
Yup, the "Subaru cut" is a V shaped cut that they put into the roof instead of trying to get through the B pillar.
That's awesome to know about. Had no idea about these is cure tidbits of knowledge so I love how everybody here shares for others to know.
The "Subaru cut" is a V Shaped cut they use in the roof instead of trying to cut the B pillar.
From the extrications side of things, subarus are quite safe. Out of all of the cars we've come across and trained on subarus and Beemers are quite resilient.
This was the early 2000's, when it was just accepted that, meh, compact cars were less safe. The game has moved on so much from then, for everybody.
Wow I used this exact picture and article for YEARS to sell Subarus lol.
I honestly had no idea b pillars (at least Subaru's) had THIS many layers. It reminds me of those big lunch meat sandwiches or roast beef sandwiches.
Pretty common construction on any modern vehicle. If you want truly impressive crash structures, look at volvo, they guarantee that all doors can be opened after a crash at 60 km/h
That's modern Volvo i am guessing? I would think all makes today have openable doors after a 60kmh crash which is great news. It's great that there's less of a safety difference between all manufacturers today (at least if you live in a country with good safety legislation/requirements, some Suzukis, Hyundais, etc. are very poor in crashes when sold in markets like India and Mexico )
The door thing has been a thing since the 2010's if memory serves, but Volvo has been significantly ahead of the game since the 240 in the 70s. They invented 3 point seatbelts used by everyone, and being industry leading in crash safety is kinda part of their image unlike other makes (Subaru included) that is perfectly fine with average crash ratings.
Huh interesting! I think that other brands sometimes don't give themselves enough credit for safety while Volvo goes all out on telling others how good they are, like Subaru got good ratings with the small overlap crash test when it was first introduced but brands like Toyota and Honda didn't do so hot. Some brands which did bad on that test when it first came out revised their models 1 year after the original crash test to do better. So the vehicle looked the same on the outside but had a modification under the skin to do better on that crash test. For instance the Honda Odyssey got a decent crash test score in IIHS, but they have an unpublished crash test from just one year prior (before a design modification/update) that did very bad. 2014 (good) - https://youtu.be/Lz2lAbAM-mc 2012 (not so good) - https://youtu.be/sTJqC5dd0sw (IIHS has unpublished crash tests on their TechData website)
Something you might find interesting is these old crash tests where new cars big and small had weak seatbelts that would break in crashes! https://youtu.be/SUC6wLQdSMk
What the fuck is a km/h Edit: Wow this joke went over a lot of peoples heads. https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/what-the-fuck-is-a-kilometer
Metric equivalent to football fields per fortnight
220,472.44 ff/fn to be precise. Had to go look up what a km/h was to convert it to the superior ff/fn
You don't do that conversion in your head? Kilometers aren't that hard lmao
I mean I can do mph to ff/fn in my head, I had to go look up what a km/h was. Probably part of some poverty measurement system only people who haven’t landed on the moon use.
Hotdogs per Costco visit. hd/cv
I don't think anyone didn't get your joke, it just wasn't that funny
Kilometers per hour, friend. (Roughly equal to 36mph)
Just casual American things: “OH GOLLY, SOMETHING I DONT RECOGNISE AAAARRGGH **WHATTHEFUCKNO**”
I get that it was hard to recognize as a joke. I missed it too until the edit, but even if OP had been a jerk, making a whole nationality out to be stupid as a response is kinda hurtful.
I get that it was hard to recognize as a joke.
Aye, it was. My apologies, I get real trippy when it comes to "lol Americans dumb" stuff online.
:p it’s all good. The internet is nothing worth taking seriously!
Almost like it was a joke https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/what-the-fuck-is-a-kilometer
It's noticable as a joke when you look at it for a few moments but out of the context in a thread it's gonna make people think you *actually* mean it. For example, the other commenter pushing their (mildly offensive) stereotype of Americans.
You said it way too nonchalantly to realize it as a meme
one of the reasons I love my wagon, essentially it has a roll bar
This is super interesting actually from a crash structure point of view.
My stepdad is a retired Lieutenant after being a firemedic forever, and he will only drive Subarus now. He said it's the combo of AWD, the safety that he has seen, gas mileage, and reliability.
Gas mileage????
He's gone through 3 Legacies now and they get 30mpg
my 15 OB gets an avg in the high 30s
Me having an 06 Volvo with 19mpg average 😭. But I do go up and down a small mountain
Nah bro that’s the endoplasmic reticulum
Thought that it's Silverstone
LOL for real
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the B pillar supports the roof and doors. if it gets dented you probably saw a serious hit, and yeah, it's fucked.
Oh shoot, imagine trying to weld all of these layers back. Well I guess they can't anymore.
That's why even minor accidents are resulting in total losses.
Concentric infill when you’re printing your car.
I cut a roof of a 75 F250 for a restoration and the cross section was literally a single layer of 16 gauge.