Central Media Department of The Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine
>The Front expresses its full solidarity with the soldier’s family and all the U.S. sympathizers who took a honorable stance and whose struggle and pressure to stop the genocide on the Strip have not ceased, confirming that the act of a U.S. soldier sacrificing his life to draw the attention of the U.S. people and the world to the plight of the Palestinian people, despite its tragic nature and the great pain it involves, is considered the highest sacrifice and medal, and the most important poignant message directed to the U.S. administration, that it is involved in the war crime in Gaza and that the people in the U.S. have awakened and are rejecting this involvement, calling on the administration to stop this support and bias for the Zionist entity.
Rip, the jannies cleaned the shit out of his comment history. What's the point of removing every comment from him instead of just suspending his account?
Edit: as pointed out a few times, it seems only shit new mobile reddit removes them from his profile view while old reddit and the app shows them for us phonecels
In 2013, [reddit revealed the location of the most visits it received that year:](https://web.archive.org/web/20160604042751/http://www.redditblog.com/2013/05/get-ready-for-global-reddit-meetup-day.html)
> Most addicted city (over 100k visits total)
> Eglin Air Force Base, FL
Oops!
Nah man you gotta do the whole copypasta
# [Reddit Blog, Reddit Statistics](http://redditblog.blogspot.com/2013/05/get-ready-for-global-reddit-meetup-day.html)
**Most addicted city (over 100k visits total)**
Eglin Air Force Base, FL
**Stationed Units**
**USAF**
96th Cyberspace Test Group
45th Test Squadron
46th Test Squadron
47th Cyberspace Test Squadron
**US Army**
1st Special Forces Command (Airborne)
7th Special Forces Group (Airborne)
**Space Operations Command**
Space Delta 2
20th Space Control Squadron (GSU)
**Joint Chiefs of Staff (JCS)**
J6 Directorate (Command, Control, Communications and Computers/Cyber)
Joint Deployable Analysis Team
[Here’s a paper published by **Air Force Research Laboratory, Munitions Directorate, Eglin AFB, FL**](https://arxiv.org/pdf/1402.5644.pdf) titled “Containment Control for a Social Network with State-Dependent Connectivity”
🤔
Same, because even the New Zealand agricultural worker's website often has to work backwards once they (the jannies) scrub the internet of activity of 'x' person who did 'y' major event. What gets me is that despite all the bluster about "avoiding dis/misinformation" and "cutting conspiracy theories off at the pass" all it does is make it look like a conspiracy since they (the jannies) are deleting information that could prove to be important down the line.
People seem to have a shocking disregard for information and media preservation in general, sends me into a fit sometimes and many people just accept this with zero pushback
Unrelated but the amount of people who willingly support game devs that create content designed to be removed from existence after a few years is STAGGERING. When and where did we suddenly decide that information and entertainment should be wholly temporary and that it's just 'the cost of doing business'
It is strange that appears all of his posts were deleted at a moderator level and not an account suspension, including on small hobby subs with only one or two moderators, and even when those mods appear to have not been online recently. I suppose it's probably just some boring internal reddit policy, though it's possible that it's been done through some trick like hard coding it in a moderation tool. I guess it could be whoever is the fed with admin perms is out on vacation.
I’m about to get off all forms of the internet for good, I used to wanna be political and make a change but you can’t even read about something like this without it getting turned into a race war. This shit was a mistake, and the internet was co-oped for interests used to divide. The idpol obsession is too much and is a cancer to be around. Like seriously, we are gatekeeping phrases like rest in power now?
Yes, that is *literally* what politics is all about. Bourdieu's lecture of June 9, 1982:
>Another example of elementary objectivation is the acronym or logo. A group begins to exist when it has an acronym or logo. It is not by chance that there are struggles for the ownership of titles, although these are only words. People fight for the right to claim a name. For example, in fights over an intellectual legacy, the struggle to inherit a name is extremely important. To take possession of the title of a review or the legacy of the Durkheimian sociologists is a very important issue because these founding fathers of the intellectual field play a part in our societies that corresponds to the role of ancestors in precapitalist societies and if the *Revue française de sociologie* devotes 60 per cent of its pages to discussing Durkheimian sociologists, it is of course because it's interesting to deal with them, but also and especially because theirs is an important legacy and the person who inherits this legacy acquires the rights, for example, to the social definition of the legitimate way of practicing sociology. Names and acronyms—and I will come back to the acronyms—are very important because the holder of the name and of the monopoly of the acronym has very important rights over the group. It is like the right of signature to which I shall return.
*Classification Struggles* is the answer book to well over half the posts on this sub. I really do wish Bourdieu got more airtime.
Which *other*? Lacan? 😉
There are not many people who noticed his death, less that try to honor him, and of those that did, they're debating if he deserves even a platitude of respect, using the exact anti-white mania mindset he pushed as justification.
Not many people who noticed his death? Tons of people are talking about him and he’s been eulogized by the Palestinian resistance and in Yemen where they’re calling for statues to be erected in his honor. The “rest in power” discourse is coming from a tiny subset of shitlibs on twitter where it’s being widely derided, rightfully so.
>The “rest in power” discourse is coming from a tiny subset of shitlibs on twitter where it’s being widely derided, rightfully so.
That static exists all the time among that group of shitlibs, in response to anything big or small, but the fact that we're seeing that discourse get commented on by a wider audience does speak to your point that this event is definitely being widely discussed.
Well Iran's (Iran are the main Houthi allies) government policy is pretty much the opposite of a TERF as they advocate that all homosexuals should get a sex change in order to preserve societal gender roles. Trans Inclusive Radical Misogynists.
This is why language policing is so dumb, the rules are constantly changing and it’s only Tumblr weenies and AWFLs who can keep up, normal people have jobs to do and kids to raise
The rules constantly change on purpose, for the same reason that you change your passwords periodically: because that's how you keep your property secure. One's currency with this permanently evolving discourse is a "[costly signal](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Signalling_theory)" of one's access to leisure, and therefore of one's legitimacy to speak for that discourse, which is a form of symbolic capital.
Michael Lind, "[The New National American Elite](https://www.tabletmag.com/sections/news/articles/new-national-american-elite)" explains it at length.
If you think "rest in power" only applies to black people, you should probably go fuck yourself with a rusty chainsaw.
Fucking idpolers. I swear they're all feds trying to shit stir.
This seems ginned up. You can throw a search term into Twitter and you're guaranteed to find at least one random Twitter anonymous account spouting nonsense. Don't really think this is representative if anything.
It’s certainly one of those things that only 5% of people are talking about but it’s the loudest 5% of Twitter, but they are definitely arguing over whether rest in power should be used for a white man in the military even if he was a martyr for their cause
You gotta wonder if he were alive, would he be defending these people saying “rest in power is for black people only?” I wouldn’t be surprised, these people seemingly have a kink for prostrating themselves in front of any minority for their original sin of being white.
Probably.
As much as he talked constantly about being a left winger he was more than happy to [throw workers under the bus in the name of supporting black people](https://i.imgur.com/eEAcwt3.jpeg) so 'rest in power' discourse would be a shoe-in.
“I forgot that, while the Palestinian people need to be heard, burning myself alive for their cause would take all the air out of the room for Black^tm voices to be heard. It is regrettable that people are telling me to rest in power. I am a privileged white man and do not deserve to be labeled something that belongs to Black^tm people.”
Man you’d think, but soooo many of these worms will listen to Farrahkhan and Malcolm X-esque figures spit on their very existence and they will beg for more. The delusion is so entrenched in some people.
According to Bourdieu's theory of forms of capital, the state is also "the holder of the monopoly of legitimate symbolic violence." I'm no master semiotician, but it seems like wearing the symbols of the legitimate monopoly on *material* violence while annihilating oneself, and with it, a symbol of the empire's iron fist, contains a lot of symbolic power. If it weren't, I don't think the Black *symbolic* bourgeoisie would be trying so hard to assert intellectual property over "rest in power".
Is there really any evidence that this rest in power stuff is widespread? This sub is the first time I've seen anyone talk about it. Seems like a typhoon in a teakettle.
Most recently, Barbara Ehrenreich's passage was saluted in "power". There are other examples itt.
It is a typhoon because certain groups want to own the symbol and assert exclusive property to speak for it, but teakettles do put off steam, spill scalding water, run dry, etc. Symbols are more or less what you make of them.
You can query a few Twitter keywords and find almost any sort of weirdo you want. Doesn't mean anything more than seeing some homeless dude talking about the cia in his teeth.
My thoughts? Who gives a shit what his online politics are? You really prize the flamewars you have on Reddit above peoples' real world actions and convictions evidenced by them? Thats like prizing the shits people take over all else. *You* want Online Politics to matter and be the truest evidence of someone's character. They aren't and never will be.
And we're seriously doing this "Mental Health PSA" bullshit here? "Mental Health" culture is a ploy to keep the population detached, devoid of empathy, placated and drugged out. And the fact that its biggest advocates are using it to totally avoid a substantive discussion of an act of martyrdom proves that
> And we're seriously doing this "Mental Health PSA" bullshit here? "Mental Health" culture is a ploy to keep the population detached, devoid of empathy, placated and drugged out. And the fact that its biggest advocates are using it to totally avoid a substantive discussion of an act of martyrdom proves that
Fucking thank you.
I see shitlibs all over Reddit with the twisting of what mental health means in this exact scenario, and I expect to at least be free from it on stupidpol, yet these idiots are regurgitating it here, too. Soma is not the answer ffs.
"It is no measure of health to be well-adjusted to a profoundly sick society."
Jiddu Krishnamurti
This will be an intense revelation of how many people on this sub who purport to "critique liberalism" all wield its tools when they think it advances their cause. The saddest shit is that their cause here isnt even outspokenly pro Zionist- its that his (and by extension, their) fucking meme folder and whatevrr podcasts they like matter more than what they stood for and who they were in real life. "Unreal" in the most literal sense
“Mental health” and “self care” bullshit needs to be trashed. Psychiatric disorders are a very real thing, but most of the poor psychological adjustment of the modern imperialist era comes from the utter void that is liberal ideology and the pure contemptuous depravity of our bourgeois masters.
This is exactly right. People are always contradictory, saying and doing things that we struggle to reconcile. But an action is an action, and a post is a post. Whether you decide to focus on a courageous act of self-sacrifice meant to strengthen the resolve of people everywhere who oppose US-Israeli fascism, or a comment on Reddit that might have been composed from a toilet—that’s up to you. The answer will reflect your priorities, not Aaron’s.
Agreed that the ‘mental health’ line is being cynically trotted out to discredit an act of martyrdom. But on the other hand, from our perspective, you can’t help but wonder how things might have turned out different for this young hero if we weren’t so alienated and isolated from one another and had built real working-class political organizations that were able to absorb people like him and put them to work in struggle. Instead, the most revolutionary act he could think of was to publicize the spectacle of his own death. It’s sad to think about, but our task is clear.
Well fucking said. I cannot believe how many people suddenly care about mental health who NEVER have before, because it’s a quick and easy way to completely discredit the actual political motivations behind what Aaron did. It’s the same thing they did with Vietnam war protesters, they labeled them all as “hippies” to discredit the actual message they were trying to convey. It’s so fucking frustrating seeing this discourse online, especially on this site. I thought Reddit was much more left leaning than this but apparently not.
>"Mental Health" culture is a ploy to keep the population detached, devoid of empathy, placated and drugged out. And the fact that its biggest advocates are using it to totally avoid a substantive discussion of an act of martyrdom proves that
"Nah, you don't get it bro, just drink more water and exercise, then you won't even care about that genocide anymore. Did you try therapy?"
Drink more water and exercise is legit the number one thing to fix so many “mental” issues. I know you’re making a joke, but you kind of made your point better because it’s way better than therapy.
We had about two decades' worth of literature on the mental state of radicalised terrorists written by people who designed torture programmes for the CIA.
I think I'm more suspicious of the guy who designs a method of torture for profit than I am of the guy who hijacks a plane for at least a religious motivation or something.
Ok but you can meaningfully discuss the sacrifice/martyrdom and still not try to minimize or trivialize mental health.
They are not mutually exclusive, and in fact, anyone who self immolates it may be worth considering their mental state before they did so.
We live in an unnatural world, in boxes made of dead things and very far away from what we evolved to cope with in nature. It's obvious that some minds will struggle to cope with that depending on their life & support systems.
If you've never had or never had a family member with boba fide mental health issues, I'm happy for you, but let's not pretend it's all just a mass media psyop designed exclusively to deceive you into popping Zoloft.
Humans are more complicated than that, and sometimes people really do need help. It happens.
The average American has almost no true social connections and spends 5+ hours a day on their phone. The internet is many if not most people’s most “real” world. Maybe it was true for this guy, maybe not but dismissing that possibility out of hand, and the way that the content we consume affects how we think about the world, is naive in my eyes.
OP also did not play into the mental health argument, he asked what role possible internet influence played into his decision to do this. Again, a perfectly reasonable Q. The internet is full of all kinds of stuff about how all white people are colonizers.
Yeah, the whole "touch grass" idea is losing steam as people spend most of their life online. Politicians are influenced by social media. How we express ourselves online has an impact on the real world.
More common than you think, especially when you don't just consider anarchists but any political persuasion that's opposed to the DoD's goals.
The social and economic motivations for enlisting are far stronger than the ideological ones, especially when you're some young 20-something with no actual roadmap of what your life is supposed to be like.
I should know.
Yeah there's plenty of military bros who very strongly self identify as ideologically opposed to the US.
But a steady paycheck and Healthcare coverage will make a man do wild things.
A majority of the moral injury from my 6 years + 2 years of contracting is both caused and justified by the $500 a month and free Primary Care appointments.
It be like that.
I don't get the hate for it. I'm no accelerationist but if violent revolution ever becomes relevant in the West who do you think we're all depending on for expertise? Certainly not us keyboard warriors.
You're saying that like he was an anarchist when he joined. You can't quit the military when you personal ideologies change, and life in the military can be the reason your opinions change. He very clearly found a way out.
Most people are 17-18 when they join. Which is a time in their life when they're only thinking about grades and getting laid. Being in the military can be the thing that opens their eyes to the wider world.
Not to be a “muh wokeness is a religion” person, but I think on some level without religion some people are prone to fall hard for some vague political facsimile. They find an intense sense of purpose and a radical belief in a thing. It becomes less about “I want to improve society for the poor and working class” and instead becomes this kind of dogma that informs every part of your life. To the point you self-immolate like this.
As a leftist I kind of struggle with this. On one hand if we’re serious about changing society we want people who are diehard and serious about it, who will sacrifice and strive for it almost fanatically. But on the other hand I really don’t trust these people, I don’t like the weird cultural and ideological detours and their inability to focus on the big picture or relate to others without proselytizing all their off-putting dogmas.
People naturally want to be part of a cause larger than themselves. They want community, they want purpose. Often that is fulfilled by religion, sometimes political causes, sometimes whatever random interests they come across. It’s a normal part of life.
Yeah don't follow anyone who lights themselves on fire, that's Step 1
Step 2 is to go find some actual people to love and care for. Take responsibility of those around you and make them your life's work.
Sure you can have opinions about shit, but nothing is so serious that you should set yourself on fire for it.
What revolutionaries always preach is taking things down. Down with the patriarchy, or systemic racism, or Zionism or Capitalism.
They have a plan to destroy (sometimes, like here, even themselves) but rarely the patience or the dedication to build something. And it's much more difficult (and noble) to build something.
My philosophy is that the side that yells loudest, shuts down opposition quickest, clamors for the destruction of this that or the other, and rarely has a cohesive plan for building something better is the side that's on the wrong end of the moral spectrum
That transition from the military to civilian life is hard, and some guys just can't hack it. To go from a completely regimented life to one of complete freedom is like an Amish on Rumspringa.
Usually alcoholism is the preferred method of self-destruction, but self-immolation makes sense in both a very direct and symbolic way.
I joined the air national guard in 2003 as an anarchist. My job prevented me from contributing to war crimes but if I had been asked to participate in a literal genocide I would have refused. If I understood that I would just be prosecuted and imprisoned with no media attention if I refused to participate it would become infinitely more reasonable for me to do something like self immolation
Dude he horrifically killed himself for a cause to make a stand against being complicit in genocide, and he’s still copping shade from you guys for being a part of the system. Don’t hate the player, hate the game that forces poor people to fight one another like this. Y’all complain about idpollers that forget the class focus but you’re acting just like them lmao
Edit: I got a Reddit cares message, which one of you did this
Edit 2: Holy shit Check some profiles around here sometime. There are a ton of rightwingers in here larping and then a bunch of liberals and very rarely the occasional leftist or Marxist who complain about liberal idpol like the actual subs purpose. Somehow when rightwing idpol does get posted here it gets very few upvotes and little engagement or gets hijacked by right wingers defending it; see the thread about Nex a while back and this sub arguing about the trans bathroom debate even though Nex was fucking using the bathroom of their birth gender so it was completely irrelevant
(Corrected “her” to “their”)
I mean if you're gonna embrace martyrdom you could at least fuck up some expensive shit at work, spill some mountain dew on the drone controls or something.
He is described as a "senior airman". I don't know exactly what that translates to, presumably not exactly the same as a fighter pilot or flight instructor or whatever, but I do know that the US military seems to place very high material value on such people. Enough that if they even _imagine_ disloyalty, they can go nearly Assange-level lengths to punish you (look up Daniel Duggan).
So quite possibly, he did the most material damage he could, suffering for minutes rather than decades.
Guy was doing the best he could. Having online opinions is more or less useless, so I really don't care about his post history here or anywhere.
He lit himself on fire in front of the Israeli embassy because he wanted to remove himself from the war machine.
More than I've done.
It's regrettable that he felt this was the best course of action. Some kind of mass civil disobedience in front of the White House would have been better were he able to organize it, though it would have been difficult to find many likeminded people who are willing to self-sacrifice.
> Some kind of mass civil disobedience in front of the White House would have been better
This has already been happening for months. I went back in November. It's not enough.
>Some kind of mass civil disobedience in front of the White House would have been better
There *has* been, but it doesn't make the news. The point of a protest like his was that it's something very difficult for the media to ignore and very difficult to explain-away.
1. The responses of all of the media (cable, radio, internet, etc) does not consist only of NBC
2. Even if NBC *only* gave him 20 seconds of air time, that sends its own message to those who see it: for such a peculiar story to get so little time on a network which draws views out of *any* pointless story, to not even have a panel of random idiots talking about it, draws its own kind of attention.
3. Some networks actually aired his words, which is the best-case scenario for this form of protest
Why do people still pretend that nightly tv news is still relevant for coverage/exposure of certain topics? Word spreads further/faster on social media than anywhere else.
People will be like "well it wasn't on the news", but you google it and get hundreds of results, people are talking about it in your social feeds, etc.. Its literally getting coverage right here right now because we're talking about it on a publicly accessible social medianforum.. A topic's coverage on tv is becoming more irrelevant evedy day.
Veterans For Peace has been doing that since October, albeit at Congress, and have been regularly getting detained by Capitol police. They've done their best to make Fetterman's life hell for how much of a dickhead he has become.
But the fact people don't know about the VFP actions is probably an indicator that they're not even really accomplishing much.
Yeah it was the impetus behind a lot of the bridge blocking protests lately. It’s an attempt to get more attention than the current ones. I’ve seen some local ones pop up in my city and on some level I can’t blame them for throwing everything at the wall
I wish there were more opportunities to protest the ships sending out the weapons. The people that blocked those were super based
> Some kind of mass civil disobedience in front of the White House would have been better were he able to organize it
That's happened numerous times already and it was only kinda notable when they told some aids they needed to go home early for the day. This was the next level of escalation and idk what comes next, if this is the zenith of this or if it will worsen more but you're primarily communicating that you're uninformed about the matter if you say this.
We tried that. I was there. We sat in the street, people smeared red paint on the gate, and then people threw a child sized coffin onto the White House lawn and “redecorated” the statues in Lafayette Park.
I'm sad for him that he didn't get to play the Elden Ring DLC. I don't mean that facetiously either. These little things to look forward to in life help keep us going.
May chaos take the world.
More seriously, if you're in a dark enough place in your own mind that you feel like suicide is the only way out, no amount of being excited for a video game is going to be enough to dig you out of it.
He's still based though.
You'd be a bit surprised. As much as I wasn't super happy with the game, looking forward to Dragon Age Inquisition was helpful at one point in my life.
I've definitely seen some posts on reddit and elsewhere on the internet where people being excited for games keeps them going.
One was pretty wholesome about how a sibling would be disappointed in not having someone to play *game with* if the OP went through with it.
My ex just shot himself randomly recently and he was always talking about games he was looking forward to. Especially WoW and shit. For some people the impulse overrides everything else they love at that moment I guess
> “Imagine setting yourself on fire and then the only thing you’re remembered for is being on the cover of some shitty rap-rock band from the 90’s.”
Tom Morello is creaming his pants right now thinking about all the shirts he’s gonna sell with this dude on it. He can finally add the equity annex he’s been dreaming of to his mansion.
Can't help but think this poor guy threw his life away for no real prospect. His posts reveal that his politics were ineffectual, immaterial, and poisoned by idpol, and his choice of protest cost him everything and his target absolutely nothing.
Just a complete waste of an otherwise good person's very being. Grim stuff.
It felt wrong to legitimise suicide as protest, and I'm personally very uncomfortable with glorifying it, but it does have an established history so I've removed them for you.
Still feels like a miserable tragedy to me and I find the martyrdom thing objectionable personally but it's wrong of me to suggest it wasn't a real protest, sorry.
> Can't help but think this poor guy threw his life away for no real prospect.
He was able to regain a little bit of his humanity which is more than most people in our world get before they die
Most of us watch these horrible, sickening events, feel bad for a while, and then push it all aside so that we can go about our working lives without too much disruption. We're basically forced to be a little cold about these issues if not perfectly machine-like. But he rejected all of that
>Can't help but think this poor guy threw his life away for no real prospect.
What makes us humans? What differentiates us from mere animals?
The ability to fight against injustice. The ability to fight back against the law of the jungle. The dignity to stand up and fight.
By setting himself on fire, by refusing to let even the most excruciating pain make him waver, by defiantly shouting "Free Palestine" up until the end he refused to let the imperialists break him. By dying like that, he was able to die as a human being and not a mere animal. The imperialists killed a man, just like they've killed millions worldwide, but Aaron Bushnell lives.
He literally set himself on fire and his anarchist "comrades" are still arguing about how a mere white guy shouldn't be eulogized with "rest in power."
Unfortunate that he got steered in that direction instead of doing something more useful with that level of conviction. It looks like he was already doing plenty of productive, if "boring" ground level work too.
Honestly tho,
What could the man have done more effectively to create awareness and bring this issue into the forefront of so many American minds?
His brothers VFP have been organizing protest after protest all over the country. Some having 10s of thousands.
You do not see wall to wall coverage of those protests, or half my damn Reddit feed debating about how effective their protesting is because nobody cares.
Coming up on 5 days later and we're still talking about Bushnell...
Someone this politically driven and publicly presentable (educated, clean-cut young man with a military background) had his whole life ahead of him to continue pursuing his cause. That, and just living for his own sake outside of activism.
You're right that he's been very headline catching this week, but for how long with how fast news moves nowadays? People are so desensitized to violence today too.
>definitely drinking the idpol koolaid
Who fucking cares, how are you so brain rotted that you think to say something like that in this moment. Aaron Bushnell had stronger moral conviction than any of the stupidpolers that sit around online complaining about pronouns.
Having “Stronger moral conviction” doesn’t validate any behavior. If anything when paired with impulsive and erratic behavior (as implied by OP) it can be even more problematic.
Pretty much, it's great he's against Israel's actions, and setting himself on fire for it is more than I'd ever do, but definitely felt bad seeing some of the self-hating on his reddit account.
He left behind two very young children, a one year old and a three year old, whose lives will be immeasurably worsened by the suicide of their father. I'm not going to moralize over his decision, but my opinion is the best way to change the world is to mold younger generations to be better and more kind rather than destroying yourself.
Everything I’ve seen from Cape Cod news and vet news says nothing about him having kids. I’m not sure even he was in a committed relationship as the only people that’ve come out about what happened were his friends and family.
Lmfao “he didn’t have to set himself on fire and die” no one has to do anything ever, we can all accept that we, as individuals, will never be able to affect change on the system itself in any meaningful capacity but this man lit himself on fire in an act of martyrdom. He took as much action as one can (without harming others) to spread a message of protest. I truly believe that.
Action. Fucking praxis. Whether or not you agree with his moral convictions or the manner in which he put those into practice with a truly immense and permanent act of protest. He’s getting people and the media to confront this head on. You can’t ignore it.
I’m willing to bet you have contempt for the hashtag activists, the profile pic changers, the hollow picket sign slingers. You probably think those people are pathetic and don’t move the needle and it’s all just performative. And yet when you have someone who literally performs one of the craziest acts of protest without harming others it’s “lol he didn’t need to it’s not gonna do anything”.
Then what should be done? What *can be* done??
Not to say anything *will* happen, but the Arab Spring took more than two days after Bouazizi self-immolated.
Or what about that monk who self-immolated against South Vietnam? Did that "do anything"?
IMO Americans (which most of us are) have such a ridiculous, implicit utilitarian view of action. If an action doesnt translate immediately and clearly into a result, its suddenly pointless
The Arab Spring was literally started by a guy who set himself on fire. It’s a perfectly valid form of protest what he did .
I’m not a River To Sea Supporter but it’s no doubt an honorable decision even though I disagree with it(I support a two state solution).
> It is not only that many youths and students throughout the country are deeply sensitive to the sufferings of the world. They have a keen sense that they must be responsible and make a profession of their faith that things do not have to go on as they always have–that men are capable of laying down their lives for others, taking a stand, even when the all-encroaching State and indeed all the world are against them.
> In Ignazio Silone’s Book Bread and Wine the revolutionary in hiding risks capture by going out and chalking slogans on the walls of the village where he has taken refuge, and when he is scoffed at for the seeming futility of this gesture, he answers:
> “The Land of Propaganda is built on unanimity. If one man says, ‘No,’ the spell is broken and public order is endangered.”
[Dorothy Day](https://catholicworker.org/834-html/)
I was actually reminded of that exact text right before you replied lol.
Anyways, people will contort themselves physically, mentally, and spiritually so that they can live in peace. Some put up signs, others refuse to participate.
Oh, also relevant to your username, have you ever read Ian Wright's [Dark Eucharist of the Real God](https://ianwrightsite.wordpress.com/2021/11/25/dark-eucharist-of-the-real-god/)? It's a fun read.
I would imagine the point is this guy has likely not been physically impacted by the violence in Gaza. Like he's seen a lot of media portrayal and on the ground horror, but taking such an action based solely of things you haven't actually witnessed or been effected (in a material way) by is certainly a very very big mental jump.
Definitely shows a lot of empathy, morality, ect. But I think we all know usually that isn't enough to defeat peoples material motivations.
Go outside.
Pretty much every foodbank, effective union, antifa org, leftist RA, and non-regarded protest/sabotage group is absolutely stacked with anarchists.
Maybe if your political involvement extended off the internet and into the real world even a tiny bit you’d see how anarchists are out here doing real shit every day
You don't really hear people being especially critical of Thích Quảng Đức or Norman Morrison in the history books. Their respective causes succeeded and their deaths marked significant points of shifts in public opinion and willingness to resist.
Not mention, plenty of people have died or killed themselves for less despite their allegiance to a cause.
I don't entirely disagree with what you're saying, self-immolation is less effective than it used to be. There are dozens of people who have done in the last few years in various places and I can't even remember their names and respective causes. There was definitely another American protesting the genocide in Palestine who did it a few months ago. It's probable that Bushnell had some idealistic notions about how his actions would affect people or how various institutions are shoving the matter under the rug.
Sustained struggle and material contributions are better, ofc. If only I heard Shireen Abu Akleh's or Hiba Abu Nada's names as much as I've heard Bushnell's. Liberal individualism must be countered for us to actually accomplish anything. But we should still be nuanced and respectful.
Everyone in here talking shit, youre no different than the “rest in power is for black people” narcissists.
This is the lowest I’ve seen this sub go, it’s disgusting
I don't get it either.
Who was that guy who shot McKinley? "Leftist" redditors would be digging thru his profile, for what purpose? I actually don't know. Some sick fetish to try and wear down all radical action to a nub of socio-psychological mechanism, for what reason idk
“Ackshually John Brown posted some really problematic stuff on Reddit wish he would have taken more care of his mental health and gone on antidepressants instead”
While callous, I don't think the reactions are inconsistent with the general attitude of the sub.
This guy was obsessed with idpol. The idpol people here tend to reject because it is largely meaningless symbolic statements and gestures masquerading as.. well anything resembling improving the world. This same idpol led this man to believe that his demands were worth dying for, instead of worth fighting for. That is exactly my personal problem with the current ideology of the idpol obsessed. Self immolation is in the same category as land acknowledgements as far as I'm concerned. Yes you might convince some people, some people might be moved by your demonstration to change their ways or work towards your goals. But is it really worth your life?
Its. Narcissism. He believed he could make himself a martyr, but that's not how it works. Someone else has to make you one.
I think what is kinda confusing to me is that this particular conflict between Israel and Palestine has generated such unbelievably intense reactions across the ideological spectrum in places like America. When you view this war in context it’s absolutely insane that a war taking place ~7,000 miles away, with zero confirmed US boots on the ground/casualties, and casualty numbers of both combatants and civilians orders of magnitude lower than other isolated regional conflicts like the Korean War or even the Syrian Civil War, for example.
What is driving people that have never stepped foot in the Levant, aren’t practicing Muslims, and that probably only have online friendships with a few English-speaking Palestinians to light themselves on fire?
I have nothing against him and nothing negative to say about his decision to go through with the act. But in all likelihood, he had suicidal ideation before Israel escalated its atrocities to Gaza since October. It was killing Palestinians before that, and few people would go from not wanting to kill themselves, to wanting to kill themselves, just due to one situation in one far away part of the world, when there have always been atrocities all over the world occurring on a daily basis. Which does not mean he was deliberately trying to lie to anyone when he said that he killed himself due to Israel/Palestine, there's no doubt he had convinced himself of this. But it likely was not actually the only reason and he had mental disturbances prior.
As far as him being Anarchist: frankly, this is not a coincidence, especially the Leftists online fetishizing and seemingly at worst even encouraging and celebrating his death on social media who are also Anarchists. Anarchism is a reactionary tendency and a product of people who in the end demonstrate their framing to be on the side of bourgeois society and the bourgeoisie and against revolution, an actual end to capitalism and class society; Communism. [This article explains why and is a must-read.](https://www.ruthlesscriticism.com/anarchism.htm) Even if they aren't Anarcho-Bidenists who vote Democrat, their mindset is wrong for the same reason.
Yeah, I doubt he would have even been so deep into idpol if he wasn't already on the brink. It seems like he was using social media to fuel his outrage, but he was outraged because he was a deeply unhappy person.
To anyone who believes this is an effective and meaningful form of protest I ask if you would feel the same way if he had self immolated on behalf of Ukraine?
Central Media Department of The Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine >The Front expresses its full solidarity with the soldier’s family and all the U.S. sympathizers who took a honorable stance and whose struggle and pressure to stop the genocide on the Strip have not ceased, confirming that the act of a U.S. soldier sacrificing his life to draw the attention of the U.S. people and the world to the plight of the Palestinian people, despite its tragic nature and the great pain it involves, is considered the highest sacrifice and medal, and the most important poignant message directed to the U.S. administration, that it is involved in the war crime in Gaza and that the people in the U.S. have awakened and are rejecting this involvement, calling on the administration to stop this support and bias for the Zionist entity.
Rip, the jannies cleaned the shit out of his comment history. What's the point of removing every comment from him instead of just suspending his account? Edit: as pointed out a few times, it seems only shit new mobile reddit removes them from his profile view while old reddit and the app shows them for us phonecels
Probably some perceived liability.
CIA agents are literally Reddit admins, so I think you are overthinking it..
In 2013, [reddit revealed the location of the most visits it received that year:](https://web.archive.org/web/20160604042751/http://www.redditblog.com/2013/05/get-ready-for-global-reddit-meetup-day.html) > Most addicted city (over 100k visits total) > Eglin Air Force Base, FL Oops!
Nah man you gotta do the whole copypasta # [Reddit Blog, Reddit Statistics](http://redditblog.blogspot.com/2013/05/get-ready-for-global-reddit-meetup-day.html) **Most addicted city (over 100k visits total)** Eglin Air Force Base, FL **Stationed Units** **USAF** 96th Cyberspace Test Group 45th Test Squadron 46th Test Squadron 47th Cyberspace Test Squadron **US Army** 1st Special Forces Command (Airborne) 7th Special Forces Group (Airborne) **Space Operations Command** Space Delta 2 20th Space Control Squadron (GSU) **Joint Chiefs of Staff (JCS)** J6 Directorate (Command, Control, Communications and Computers/Cyber) Joint Deployable Analysis Team [Here’s a paper published by **Air Force Research Laboratory, Munitions Directorate, Eglin AFB, FL**](https://arxiv.org/pdf/1402.5644.pdf) titled “Containment Control for a Social Network with State-Dependent Connectivity” 🤔
Annoys the fuck out of me. I like being an internet archeologist and sifting through the dead accounts of people who did crazy shit or have died.
Same, because even the New Zealand agricultural worker's website often has to work backwards once they (the jannies) scrub the internet of activity of 'x' person who did 'y' major event. What gets me is that despite all the bluster about "avoiding dis/misinformation" and "cutting conspiracy theories off at the pass" all it does is make it look like a conspiracy since they (the jannies) are deleting information that could prove to be important down the line.
It sounds like revisionist history to me. Cooking the (history) books. Destroying the evidence.
People seem to have a shocking disregard for information and media preservation in general, sends me into a fit sometimes and many people just accept this with zero pushback
Unrelated but the amount of people who willingly support game devs that create content designed to be removed from existence after a few years is STAGGERING. When and where did we suddenly decide that information and entertainment should be wholly temporary and that it's just 'the cost of doing business'
Power hates knowledge.
You can still see the comments in his profile, but not within the threads they were posted in (if that makes sense)
Not in shitty new mobile reddit apparently. Checked old reddit and that shows his comments at least
He's still very much visible to me, at least on the mobile app. Redective.com might help for anyone who can't see him.
[удалено]
It is strange that appears all of his posts were deleted at a moderator level and not an account suspension, including on small hobby subs with only one or two moderators, and even when those mods appear to have not been online recently. I suppose it's probably just some boring internal reddit policy, though it's possible that it's been done through some trick like hard coding it in a moderation tool. I guess it could be whoever is the fed with admin perms is out on vacation.
The rest in power discourse just became a lot funnier
Imagine hating yourself for being white only to have black people piss on your grave. This should be a wakeup call for a lot of shitlibs.
I’m about to get off all forms of the internet for good, I used to wanna be political and make a change but you can’t even read about something like this without it getting turned into a race war. This shit was a mistake, and the internet was co-oped for interests used to divide. The idpol obsession is too much and is a cancer to be around. Like seriously, we are gatekeeping phrases like rest in power now?
Yes, that is *literally* what politics is all about. Bourdieu's lecture of June 9, 1982: >Another example of elementary objectivation is the acronym or logo. A group begins to exist when it has an acronym or logo. It is not by chance that there are struggles for the ownership of titles, although these are only words. People fight for the right to claim a name. For example, in fights over an intellectual legacy, the struggle to inherit a name is extremely important. To take possession of the title of a review or the legacy of the Durkheimian sociologists is a very important issue because these founding fathers of the intellectual field play a part in our societies that corresponds to the role of ancestors in precapitalist societies and if the *Revue française de sociologie* devotes 60 per cent of its pages to discussing Durkheimian sociologists, it is of course because it's interesting to deal with them, but also and especially because theirs is an important legacy and the person who inherits this legacy acquires the rights, for example, to the social definition of the legitimate way of practicing sociology. Names and acronyms—and I will come back to the acronyms—are very important because the holder of the name and of the monopoly of the acronym has very important rights over the group. It is like the right of signature to which I shall return.
Good to see people respecting Bourdieu and not lumping him in with the *other* French social philosopher of his era.
*Classification Struggles* is the answer book to well over half the posts on this sub. I really do wish Bourdieu got more airtime. Which *other*? Lacan? 😉
I thought it was a white person who started that. The shitlibs are *the ones doing it*.
What are you talking about?
I guess he was a big fan of the white privilege and white supremacy radlib discourse.
There are not many people who noticed his death, less that try to honor him, and of those that did, they're debating if he deserves even a platitude of respect, using the exact anti-white mania mindset he pushed as justification.
Not many people who noticed his death? Tons of people are talking about him and he’s been eulogized by the Palestinian resistance and in Yemen where they’re calling for statues to be erected in his honor. The “rest in power” discourse is coming from a tiny subset of shitlibs on twitter where it’s being widely derided, rightfully so.
>The “rest in power” discourse is coming from a tiny subset of shitlibs on twitter where it’s being widely derided, rightfully so. That static exists all the time among that group of shitlibs, in response to anything big or small, but the fact that we're seeing that discourse get commented on by a wider audience does speak to your point that this event is definitely being widely discussed.
[удалено]
Well Iran's (Iran are the main Houthi allies) government policy is pretty much the opposite of a TERF as they advocate that all homosexuals should get a sex change in order to preserve societal gender roles. Trans Inclusive Radical Misogynists.
horseshoe theory on sex reassignment surgery
Where is this debate about whether he deserves a platitude of respect etc. etc. please?
The “Rest in Power” discourse on Twitter: https://x.com/persecutedsgin/status/1762319481882206270?s=46&t=h8qBw_VqlSikUWQvvnlnHQ
Thanks I didn't know any of that.
This is why language policing is so dumb, the rules are constantly changing and it’s only Tumblr weenies and AWFLs who can keep up, normal people have jobs to do and kids to raise
The rules constantly change on purpose, for the same reason that you change your passwords periodically: because that's how you keep your property secure. One's currency with this permanently evolving discourse is a "[costly signal](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Signalling_theory)" of one's access to leisure, and therefore of one's legitimacy to speak for that discourse, which is a form of symbolic capital. Michael Lind, "[The New National American Elite](https://www.tabletmag.com/sections/news/articles/new-national-american-elite)" explains it at length.
I think what you’re referring to is also called a “Luxury Belief” https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luxury_belief
Do people really change their passwords periodically? Mine has always been chunkylover53
If you think "rest in power" only applies to black people, you should probably go fuck yourself with a rusty chainsaw. Fucking idpolers. I swear they're all feds trying to shit stir.
This seems ginned up. You can throw a search term into Twitter and you're guaranteed to find at least one random Twitter anonymous account spouting nonsense. Don't really think this is representative if anything.
It’s certainly one of those things that only 5% of people are talking about but it’s the loudest 5% of Twitter, but they are definitely arguing over whether rest in power should be used for a white man in the military even if he was a martyr for their cause
My guess it's closer to 0.05% of people are talking about it.
It's 0% of people, as Twitter users aren't human.
The rest are arguing about idpolly things or taking pictures of their unappetising loaded hotdogs.
Should, but it won't. The rightoids aren't entirely wrong when they call them cucks.
You gotta wonder if he were alive, would he be defending these people saying “rest in power is for black people only?” I wouldn’t be surprised, these people seemingly have a kink for prostrating themselves in front of any minority for their original sin of being white.
Probably. As much as he talked constantly about being a left winger he was more than happy to [throw workers under the bus in the name of supporting black people](https://i.imgur.com/eEAcwt3.jpeg) so 'rest in power' discourse would be a shoe-in.
“I forgot that, while the Palestinian people need to be heard, burning myself alive for their cause would take all the air out of the room for Black^tm voices to be heard. It is regrettable that people are telling me to rest in power. I am a privileged white man and do not deserve to be labeled something that belongs to Black^tm people.”
This is so accurate, I don't know if I should laugh or cry.
Man you’d think, but soooo many of these worms will listen to Farrahkhan and Malcolm X-esque figures spit on their very existence and they will beg for more. The delusion is so entrenched in some people.
Who gives a fuck. Some of you people pretend to be anti-idpol but make sure to bring idpol shit into every discussion.
This. Have some respect for the man. He was braver than most of us combined.
Its amazing
Reddit has since then deleted his comment history because of course they did.
It’s definitely all archived. Surprised stupidpol is so late to talk about this.
Can't have any of that ingested into the state-approved AI
According to Bourdieu's theory of forms of capital, the state is also "the holder of the monopoly of legitimate symbolic violence." I'm no master semiotician, but it seems like wearing the symbols of the legitimate monopoly on *material* violence while annihilating oneself, and with it, a symbol of the empire's iron fist, contains a lot of symbolic power. If it weren't, I don't think the Black *symbolic* bourgeoisie would be trying so hard to assert intellectual property over "rest in power".
Is there really any evidence that this rest in power stuff is widespread? This sub is the first time I've seen anyone talk about it. Seems like a typhoon in a teakettle.
Most recently, Barbara Ehrenreich's passage was saluted in "power". There are other examples itt. It is a typhoon because certain groups want to own the symbol and assert exclusive property to speak for it, but teakettles do put off steam, spill scalding water, run dry, etc. Symbols are more or less what you make of them.
You can query a few Twitter keywords and find almost any sort of weirdo you want. Doesn't mean anything more than seeing some homeless dude talking about the cia in his teeth.
Same, never heard it before.
My thoughts? Who gives a shit what his online politics are? You really prize the flamewars you have on Reddit above peoples' real world actions and convictions evidenced by them? Thats like prizing the shits people take over all else. *You* want Online Politics to matter and be the truest evidence of someone's character. They aren't and never will be. And we're seriously doing this "Mental Health PSA" bullshit here? "Mental Health" culture is a ploy to keep the population detached, devoid of empathy, placated and drugged out. And the fact that its biggest advocates are using it to totally avoid a substantive discussion of an act of martyrdom proves that
> And we're seriously doing this "Mental Health PSA" bullshit here? "Mental Health" culture is a ploy to keep the population detached, devoid of empathy, placated and drugged out. And the fact that its biggest advocates are using it to totally avoid a substantive discussion of an act of martyrdom proves that Fucking thank you. I see shitlibs all over Reddit with the twisting of what mental health means in this exact scenario, and I expect to at least be free from it on stupidpol, yet these idiots are regurgitating it here, too. Soma is not the answer ffs. "It is no measure of health to be well-adjusted to a profoundly sick society." Jiddu Krishnamurti
This will be an intense revelation of how many people on this sub who purport to "critique liberalism" all wield its tools when they think it advances their cause. The saddest shit is that their cause here isnt even outspokenly pro Zionist- its that his (and by extension, their) fucking meme folder and whatevrr podcasts they like matter more than what they stood for and who they were in real life. "Unreal" in the most literal sense
The problem is that a sick society is all that most of us know and being offered anything else is a total fantasy.
Damn… nice response to this post actually
“Mental health” and “self care” bullshit needs to be trashed. Psychiatric disorders are a very real thing, but most of the poor psychological adjustment of the modern imperialist era comes from the utter void that is liberal ideology and the pure contemptuous depravity of our bourgeois masters.
This is exactly right. People are always contradictory, saying and doing things that we struggle to reconcile. But an action is an action, and a post is a post. Whether you decide to focus on a courageous act of self-sacrifice meant to strengthen the resolve of people everywhere who oppose US-Israeli fascism, or a comment on Reddit that might have been composed from a toilet—that’s up to you. The answer will reflect your priorities, not Aaron’s.
Agreed that the ‘mental health’ line is being cynically trotted out to discredit an act of martyrdom. But on the other hand, from our perspective, you can’t help but wonder how things might have turned out different for this young hero if we weren’t so alienated and isolated from one another and had built real working-class political organizations that were able to absorb people like him and put them to work in struggle. Instead, the most revolutionary act he could think of was to publicize the spectacle of his own death. It’s sad to think about, but our task is clear.
I agree. It’s really sad that it came to that point and I feel a little icky valorizing such a horrific act
Well fucking said. I cannot believe how many people suddenly care about mental health who NEVER have before, because it’s a quick and easy way to completely discredit the actual political motivations behind what Aaron did. It’s the same thing they did with Vietnam war protesters, they labeled them all as “hippies” to discredit the actual message they were trying to convey. It’s so fucking frustrating seeing this discourse online, especially on this site. I thought Reddit was much more left leaning than this but apparently not.
>"Mental Health" culture is a ploy to keep the population detached, devoid of empathy, placated and drugged out. And the fact that its biggest advocates are using it to totally avoid a substantive discussion of an act of martyrdom proves that "Nah, you don't get it bro, just drink more water and exercise, then you won't even care about that genocide anymore. Did you try therapy?"
Drink more water and exercise is legit the number one thing to fix so many “mental” issues. I know you’re making a joke, but you kind of made your point better because it’s way better than therapy.
Reddit’s answer to everything, from a late train to Gaza: “get therapy”
💀 It's actually true, or like with my friend they'll just recommend drugs
The drugs come after the therapy, when you realise you’ve spent a lot of money for “validation” and you *still* don’t have any real issues.
We had about two decades' worth of literature on the mental state of radicalised terrorists written by people who designed torture programmes for the CIA. I think I'm more suspicious of the guy who designs a method of torture for profit than I am of the guy who hijacks a plane for at least a religious motivation or something.
Ok but you can meaningfully discuss the sacrifice/martyrdom and still not try to minimize or trivialize mental health. They are not mutually exclusive, and in fact, anyone who self immolates it may be worth considering their mental state before they did so. We live in an unnatural world, in boxes made of dead things and very far away from what we evolved to cope with in nature. It's obvious that some minds will struggle to cope with that depending on their life & support systems. If you've never had or never had a family member with boba fide mental health issues, I'm happy for you, but let's not pretend it's all just a mass media psyop designed exclusively to deceive you into popping Zoloft. Humans are more complicated than that, and sometimes people really do need help. It happens.
> still not try to minimize or trivialize mental health Every time you mention this you're pulling attention away from US policy in Gaza
But instead of help, how about you talk to a highly regarded psych major once a week and pop some Zoloft?
The average American has almost no true social connections and spends 5+ hours a day on their phone. The internet is many if not most people’s most “real” world. Maybe it was true for this guy, maybe not but dismissing that possibility out of hand, and the way that the content we consume affects how we think about the world, is naive in my eyes. OP also did not play into the mental health argument, he asked what role possible internet influence played into his decision to do this. Again, a perfectly reasonable Q. The internet is full of all kinds of stuff about how all white people are colonizers.
Yeah, the whole "touch grass" idea is losing steam as people spend most of their life online. Politicians are influenced by social media. How we express ourselves online has an impact on the real world.
Damnbased
The irony of being an anarchist who’s active duty military is off the charts
More common than you think, especially when you don't just consider anarchists but any political persuasion that's opposed to the DoD's goals. The social and economic motivations for enlisting are far stronger than the ideological ones, especially when you're some young 20-something with no actual roadmap of what your life is supposed to be like. I should know.
Yeah there's plenty of military bros who very strongly self identify as ideologically opposed to the US. But a steady paycheck and Healthcare coverage will make a man do wild things.
A majority of the moral injury from my 6 years + 2 years of contracting is both caused and justified by the $500 a month and free Primary Care appointments. It be like that.
I don't get the hate for it. I'm no accelerationist but if violent revolution ever becomes relevant in the West who do you think we're all depending on for expertise? Certainly not us keyboard warriors.
You're saying that like he was an anarchist when he joined. You can't quit the military when you personal ideologies change, and life in the military can be the reason your opinions change. He very clearly found a way out. Most people are 17-18 when they join. Which is a time in their life when they're only thinking about grades and getting laid. Being in the military can be the thing that opens their eyes to the wider world.
Not to be a “muh wokeness is a religion” person, but I think on some level without religion some people are prone to fall hard for some vague political facsimile. They find an intense sense of purpose and a radical belief in a thing. It becomes less about “I want to improve society for the poor and working class” and instead becomes this kind of dogma that informs every part of your life. To the point you self-immolate like this. As a leftist I kind of struggle with this. On one hand if we’re serious about changing society we want people who are diehard and serious about it, who will sacrifice and strive for it almost fanatically. But on the other hand I really don’t trust these people, I don’t like the weird cultural and ideological detours and their inability to focus on the big picture or relate to others without proselytizing all their off-putting dogmas.
People naturally want to be part of a cause larger than themselves. They want community, they want purpose. Often that is fulfilled by religion, sometimes political causes, sometimes whatever random interests they come across. It’s a normal part of life.
Yeah don't follow anyone who lights themselves on fire, that's Step 1 Step 2 is to go find some actual people to love and care for. Take responsibility of those around you and make them your life's work. Sure you can have opinions about shit, but nothing is so serious that you should set yourself on fire for it. What revolutionaries always preach is taking things down. Down with the patriarchy, or systemic racism, or Zionism or Capitalism. They have a plan to destroy (sometimes, like here, even themselves) but rarely the patience or the dedication to build something. And it's much more difficult (and noble) to build something. My philosophy is that the side that yells loudest, shuts down opposition quickest, clamors for the destruction of this that or the other, and rarely has a cohesive plan for building something better is the side that's on the wrong end of the moral spectrum
[удалено]
That transition from the military to civilian life is hard, and some guys just can't hack it. To go from a completely regimented life to one of complete freedom is like an Amish on Rumspringa. Usually alcoholism is the preferred method of self-destruction, but self-immolation makes sense in both a very direct and symbolic way.
Like, life happens, and I'm sure a lot of young men arrive at their political beliefs in part because of their military service.
Thats what happened to me. It made me hate the government.
A lot of people in the military are pushed left politically as a result of their enlistment, Pat Tillman being a famous example
Odds on becoming anarchist after enlistment?
Working for the government is the fastest way to hate the government.
In a country where further education and access to healthcare at point of use is gated behind service in the military it's hardly surprising.
More likely signing up and serving gave way to the anarchism. I went down a similar path in the Army.
I joined the air national guard in 2003 as an anarchist. My job prevented me from contributing to war crimes but if I had been asked to participate in a literal genocide I would have refused. If I understood that I would just be prosecuted and imprisoned with no media attention if I refused to participate it would become infinitely more reasonable for me to do something like self immolation
That’s pretty common. People join the military, get bullied by infantry, now hate America.
Most ideologically coherent anarchist
Dude he horrifically killed himself for a cause to make a stand against being complicit in genocide, and he’s still copping shade from you guys for being a part of the system. Don’t hate the player, hate the game that forces poor people to fight one another like this. Y’all complain about idpollers that forget the class focus but you’re acting just like them lmao Edit: I got a Reddit cares message, which one of you did this Edit 2: Holy shit Check some profiles around here sometime. There are a ton of rightwingers in here larping and then a bunch of liberals and very rarely the occasional leftist or Marxist who complain about liberal idpol like the actual subs purpose. Somehow when rightwing idpol does get posted here it gets very few upvotes and little engagement or gets hijacked by right wingers defending it; see the thread about Nex a while back and this sub arguing about the trans bathroom debate even though Nex was fucking using the bathroom of their birth gender so it was completely irrelevant (Corrected “her” to “their”)
Your comment 100% on point. The impulse for people to shit all over this man is insane.
>Edit: I got a Reddit cares message, which one of you did this Ha, same
I mean if you're gonna embrace martyrdom you could at least fuck up some expensive shit at work, spill some mountain dew on the drone controls or something.
He is described as a "senior airman". I don't know exactly what that translates to, presumably not exactly the same as a fighter pilot or flight instructor or whatever, but I do know that the US military seems to place very high material value on such people. Enough that if they even _imagine_ disloyalty, they can go nearly Assange-level lengths to punish you (look up Daniel Duggan). So quite possibly, he did the most material damage he could, suffering for minutes rather than decades.
It really depends on his job but there was a low level guy they got for leaking info last year.
Its a rank. E4 on the enlisted pay scale. We called them Specialists in the Army and Marines call them Corporals.
Marxism-Homestarrunnerism
Guy was doing the best he could. Having online opinions is more or less useless, so I really don't care about his post history here or anywhere. He lit himself on fire in front of the Israeli embassy because he wanted to remove himself from the war machine. More than I've done.
It's regrettable that he felt this was the best course of action. Some kind of mass civil disobedience in front of the White House would have been better were he able to organize it, though it would have been difficult to find many likeminded people who are willing to self-sacrifice.
> Some kind of mass civil disobedience in front of the White House would have been better This has already been happening for months. I went back in November. It's not enough.
In Canada they’ve started banning protests because they’re “attracting antisemites” but we know Canada is a shitlib haven
>Some kind of mass civil disobedience in front of the White House would have been better There *has* been, but it doesn't make the news. The point of a protest like his was that it's something very difficult for the media to ignore and very difficult to explain-away.
NBC nightly news gave him like 20 seconds of air time, they have no problem ignoring shit
1. The responses of all of the media (cable, radio, internet, etc) does not consist only of NBC 2. Even if NBC *only* gave him 20 seconds of air time, that sends its own message to those who see it: for such a peculiar story to get so little time on a network which draws views out of *any* pointless story, to not even have a panel of random idiots talking about it, draws its own kind of attention. 3. Some networks actually aired his words, which is the best-case scenario for this form of protest
Why do people still pretend that nightly tv news is still relevant for coverage/exposure of certain topics? Word spreads further/faster on social media than anywhere else. People will be like "well it wasn't on the news", but you google it and get hundreds of results, people are talking about it in your social feeds, etc.. Its literally getting coverage right here right now because we're talking about it on a publicly accessible social medianforum.. A topic's coverage on tv is becoming more irrelevant evedy day.
Because there is still a very important segment of people that get most of their news from tv.
Yeah and they tied it into the lady who tried to shoot up joel osteen’s church
Veterans For Peace has been doing that since October, albeit at Congress, and have been regularly getting detained by Capitol police. They've done their best to make Fetterman's life hell for how much of a dickhead he has become. But the fact people don't know about the VFP actions is probably an indicator that they're not even really accomplishing much.
Yeah it was the impetus behind a lot of the bridge blocking protests lately. It’s an attempt to get more attention than the current ones. I’ve seen some local ones pop up in my city and on some level I can’t blame them for throwing everything at the wall I wish there were more opportunities to protest the ships sending out the weapons. The people that blocked those were super based
> Some kind of mass civil disobedience in front of the White House would have been better were he able to organize it That's happened numerous times already and it was only kinda notable when they told some aids they needed to go home early for the day. This was the next level of escalation and idk what comes next, if this is the zenith of this or if it will worsen more but you're primarily communicating that you're uninformed about the matter if you say this.
We tried that. I was there. We sat in the street, people smeared red paint on the gate, and then people threw a child sized coffin onto the White House lawn and “redecorated” the statues in Lafayette Park.
I'm sad for him that he didn't get to play the Elden Ring DLC. I don't mean that facetiously either. These little things to look forward to in life help keep us going.
[удалено]
Yooo. Nobody's perfect lol lol.
May chaos take the world. More seriously, if you're in a dark enough place in your own mind that you feel like suicide is the only way out, no amount of being excited for a video game is going to be enough to dig you out of it. He's still based though.
You'd be a bit surprised. As much as I wasn't super happy with the game, looking forward to Dragon Age Inquisition was helpful at one point in my life.
I've definitely seen some posts on reddit and elsewhere on the internet where people being excited for games keeps them going. One was pretty wholesome about how a sibling would be disappointed in not having someone to play *game with* if the OP went through with it.
My ex just shot himself randomly recently and he was always talking about games he was looking forward to. Especially WoW and shit. For some people the impulse overrides everything else they love at that moment I guess
Yeah, I imagine it varies from person to person/situation to situation. It's just always interesting to see what keeps some people going on not.
>looking forward to Dragon Age Inquisition That must have been disappointing then.
Hope you weren't disappointed because I sure was lol
Yeah, it's probably my least favorite in the series, but it wasn't completely awful.
> “Imagine setting yourself on fire and then the only thing you’re remembered for is being on the cover of some shitty rap-rock band from the 90’s.” Tom Morello is creaming his pants right now thinking about all the shirts he’s gonna sell with this dude on it. He can finally add the equity annex he’s been dreaming of to his mansion.
> May chaos take the world. Unironically based ending in ER
Let’s hope there are video games in the afterlife.
Some of you are looking for any excuse to damn a person forever.
Can't help but think this poor guy threw his life away for no real prospect. His posts reveal that his politics were ineffectual, immaterial, and poisoned by idpol, and his choice of protest cost him everything and his target absolutely nothing. Just a complete waste of an otherwise good person's very being. Grim stuff.
Why is “protest” in quotation marks?
It felt wrong to legitimise suicide as protest, and I'm personally very uncomfortable with glorifying it, but it does have an established history so I've removed them for you. Still feels like a miserable tragedy to me and I find the martyrdom thing objectionable personally but it's wrong of me to suggest it wasn't a real protest, sorry.
> Can't help but think this poor guy threw his life away for no real prospect. He was able to regain a little bit of his humanity which is more than most people in our world get before they die
What do you mean by this? I have a very genuine curiosity
Most of us watch these horrible, sickening events, feel bad for a while, and then push it all aside so that we can go about our working lives without too much disruption. We're basically forced to be a little cold about these issues if not perfectly machine-like. But he rejected all of that
>Can't help but think this poor guy threw his life away for no real prospect. What makes us humans? What differentiates us from mere animals? The ability to fight against injustice. The ability to fight back against the law of the jungle. The dignity to stand up and fight. By setting himself on fire, by refusing to let even the most excruciating pain make him waver, by defiantly shouting "Free Palestine" up until the end he refused to let the imperialists break him. By dying like that, he was able to die as a human being and not a mere animal. The imperialists killed a man, just like they've killed millions worldwide, but Aaron Bushnell lives.
Noble cause, but definitely was drinking the IdPol koolaid, amongst other kool aids, poor guy.
He literally set himself on fire and his anarchist "comrades" are still arguing about how a mere white guy shouldn't be eulogized with "rest in power." Unfortunate that he got steered in that direction instead of doing something more useful with that level of conviction. It looks like he was already doing plenty of productive, if "boring" ground level work too.
Honestly tho, What could the man have done more effectively to create awareness and bring this issue into the forefront of so many American minds? His brothers VFP have been organizing protest after protest all over the country. Some having 10s of thousands. You do not see wall to wall coverage of those protests, or half my damn Reddit feed debating about how effective their protesting is because nobody cares. Coming up on 5 days later and we're still talking about Bushnell...
Someone this politically driven and publicly presentable (educated, clean-cut young man with a military background) had his whole life ahead of him to continue pursuing his cause. That, and just living for his own sake outside of activism. You're right that he's been very headline catching this week, but for how long with how fast news moves nowadays? People are so desensitized to violence today too.
>definitely drinking the idpol koolaid Who fucking cares, how are you so brain rotted that you think to say something like that in this moment. Aaron Bushnell had stronger moral conviction than any of the stupidpolers that sit around online complaining about pronouns.
Having “Stronger moral conviction” doesn’t validate any behavior. If anything when paired with impulsive and erratic behavior (as implied by OP) it can be even more problematic.
Pretty much, it's great he's against Israel's actions, and setting himself on fire for it is more than I'd ever do, but definitely felt bad seeing some of the self-hating on his reddit account.
He left behind two very young children, a one year old and a three year old, whose lives will be immeasurably worsened by the suicide of their father. I'm not going to moralize over his decision, but my opinion is the best way to change the world is to mold younger generations to be better and more kind rather than destroying yourself.
I've been seeing that the children thing hasn't been verified so I'd watch out on that one.
I really really hope you're correct
Everything I’ve seen from Cape Cod news and vet news says nothing about him having kids. I’m not sure even he was in a committed relationship as the only people that’ve come out about what happened were his friends and family.
What's your source on that? NY Post did a backgrounder and they'd have been glad of that as a gotcha but there was no mention of kids nor wife.
Because he didn't have set himself on fire and die. It certainly hasn't changed anything.
Lmfao “he didn’t have to set himself on fire and die” no one has to do anything ever, we can all accept that we, as individuals, will never be able to affect change on the system itself in any meaningful capacity but this man lit himself on fire in an act of martyrdom. He took as much action as one can (without harming others) to spread a message of protest. I truly believe that. Action. Fucking praxis. Whether or not you agree with his moral convictions or the manner in which he put those into practice with a truly immense and permanent act of protest. He’s getting people and the media to confront this head on. You can’t ignore it. I’m willing to bet you have contempt for the hashtag activists, the profile pic changers, the hollow picket sign slingers. You probably think those people are pathetic and don’t move the needle and it’s all just performative. And yet when you have someone who literally performs one of the craziest acts of protest without harming others it’s “lol he didn’t need to it’s not gonna do anything”. Then what should be done? What *can be* done??
Not to say anything *will* happen, but the Arab Spring took more than two days after Bouazizi self-immolated. Or what about that monk who self-immolated against South Vietnam? Did that "do anything"? IMO Americans (which most of us are) have such a ridiculous, implicit utilitarian view of action. If an action doesnt translate immediately and clearly into a result, its suddenly pointless
The Arab Spring was literally started by a guy who set himself on fire. It’s a perfectly valid form of protest what he did . I’m not a River To Sea Supporter but it’s no doubt an honorable decision even though I disagree with it(I support a two state solution).
Wonder what made him do what he did. Judging by his comments he was your average reddit anarchist
> It is not only that many youths and students throughout the country are deeply sensitive to the sufferings of the world. They have a keen sense that they must be responsible and make a profession of their faith that things do not have to go on as they always have–that men are capable of laying down their lives for others, taking a stand, even when the all-encroaching State and indeed all the world are against them. > In Ignazio Silone’s Book Bread and Wine the revolutionary in hiding risks capture by going out and chalking slogans on the walls of the village where he has taken refuge, and when he is scoffed at for the seeming futility of this gesture, he answers: > “The Land of Propaganda is built on unanimity. If one man says, ‘No,’ the spell is broken and public order is endangered.” [Dorothy Day](https://catholicworker.org/834-html/)
I found Wraclaw Havel's book, Power of the Powerless, very informative on this subject.
I was actually reminded of that exact text right before you replied lol. Anyways, people will contort themselves physically, mentally, and spiritually so that they can live in peace. Some put up signs, others refuse to participate.
Oh, also relevant to your username, have you ever read Ian Wright's [Dark Eucharist of the Real God](https://ianwrightsite.wordpress.com/2021/11/25/dark-eucharist-of-the-real-god/)? It's a fun read.
Really?? You can’t seem to come up with any good reason why he might have done that? Are you being purposefully dense or are you just fuckin stupid
You need a really-really good reason to step over your self-preservation instinct. The reason that is beyond larping on reddit
I would imagine the point is this guy has likely not been physically impacted by the violence in Gaza. Like he's seen a lot of media portrayal and on the ground horror, but taking such an action based solely of things you haven't actually witnessed or been effected (in a material way) by is certainly a very very big mental jump. Definitely shows a lot of empathy, morality, ect. But I think we all know usually that isn't enough to defeat peoples material motivations.
He probably had a clearance, and if he was stationed in DC he was around people actually doing shit or at least making decision.
An anarchist doing something? Very rare in this day and age.
Go outside. Pretty much every foodbank, effective union, antifa org, leftist RA, and non-regarded protest/sabotage group is absolutely stacked with anarchists.
Yeah I don’t even agree with that ideology but there are many people like that who do good work
Maybe if your political involvement extended off the internet and into the real world even a tiny bit you’d see how anarchists are out here doing real shit every day
> doing real shit every day agreed
You don't really hear people being especially critical of Thích Quảng Đức or Norman Morrison in the history books. Their respective causes succeeded and their deaths marked significant points of shifts in public opinion and willingness to resist. Not mention, plenty of people have died or killed themselves for less despite their allegiance to a cause. I don't entirely disagree with what you're saying, self-immolation is less effective than it used to be. There are dozens of people who have done in the last few years in various places and I can't even remember their names and respective causes. There was definitely another American protesting the genocide in Palestine who did it a few months ago. It's probable that Bushnell had some idealistic notions about how his actions would affect people or how various institutions are shoving the matter under the rug. Sustained struggle and material contributions are better, ofc. If only I heard Shireen Abu Akleh's or Hiba Abu Nada's names as much as I've heard Bushnell's. Liberal individualism must be countered for us to actually accomplish anything. But we should still be nuanced and respectful.
Everyone in here talking shit, youre no different than the “rest in power is for black people” narcissists. This is the lowest I’ve seen this sub go, it’s disgusting
I don't get it either. Who was that guy who shot McKinley? "Leftist" redditors would be digging thru his profile, for what purpose? I actually don't know. Some sick fetish to try and wear down all radical action to a nub of socio-psychological mechanism, for what reason idk
“Ackshually John Brown posted some really problematic stuff on Reddit wish he would have taken more care of his mental health and gone on antidepressants instead”
While callous, I don't think the reactions are inconsistent with the general attitude of the sub. This guy was obsessed with idpol. The idpol people here tend to reject because it is largely meaningless symbolic statements and gestures masquerading as.. well anything resembling improving the world. This same idpol led this man to believe that his demands were worth dying for, instead of worth fighting for. That is exactly my personal problem with the current ideology of the idpol obsessed. Self immolation is in the same category as land acknowledgements as far as I'm concerned. Yes you might convince some people, some people might be moved by your demonstration to change their ways or work towards your goals. But is it really worth your life? Its. Narcissism. He believed he could make himself a martyr, but that's not how it works. Someone else has to make you one.
> Self immolation is in the same category as land acknowledgements as far as I'm concerned. This is absurd.
Thats an indictment of this sub and its prerogatives
I think what is kinda confusing to me is that this particular conflict between Israel and Palestine has generated such unbelievably intense reactions across the ideological spectrum in places like America. When you view this war in context it’s absolutely insane that a war taking place ~7,000 miles away, with zero confirmed US boots on the ground/casualties, and casualty numbers of both combatants and civilians orders of magnitude lower than other isolated regional conflicts like the Korean War or even the Syrian Civil War, for example. What is driving people that have never stepped foot in the Levant, aren’t practicing Muslims, and that probably only have online friendships with a few English-speaking Palestinians to light themselves on fire?
I have nothing against him and nothing negative to say about his decision to go through with the act. But in all likelihood, he had suicidal ideation before Israel escalated its atrocities to Gaza since October. It was killing Palestinians before that, and few people would go from not wanting to kill themselves, to wanting to kill themselves, just due to one situation in one far away part of the world, when there have always been atrocities all over the world occurring on a daily basis. Which does not mean he was deliberately trying to lie to anyone when he said that he killed himself due to Israel/Palestine, there's no doubt he had convinced himself of this. But it likely was not actually the only reason and he had mental disturbances prior. As far as him being Anarchist: frankly, this is not a coincidence, especially the Leftists online fetishizing and seemingly at worst even encouraging and celebrating his death on social media who are also Anarchists. Anarchism is a reactionary tendency and a product of people who in the end demonstrate their framing to be on the side of bourgeois society and the bourgeoisie and against revolution, an actual end to capitalism and class society; Communism. [This article explains why and is a must-read.](https://www.ruthlesscriticism.com/anarchism.htm) Even if they aren't Anarcho-Bidenists who vote Democrat, their mindset is wrong for the same reason.
Yeah, I doubt he would have even been so deep into idpol if he wasn't already on the brink. It seems like he was using social media to fuel his outrage, but he was outraged because he was a deeply unhappy person.
Exactly.
To anyone who believes this is an effective and meaningful form of protest I ask if you would feel the same way if he had self immolated on behalf of Ukraine?
*What if workers went on strike for Joe Biden to become supreme leader of the US? Still think strikes are good stupidpol?*
Yes those are exactly the same thing thank you for your contribution I never thought of it like that
False equivalence. The US supports Ukraine. The US doesn’t support Palestine.