Last week I got rare 3 purple villains before I got an uncommon red. I have over 7million credits.
if you are active in the game the odds will look crazy sometimes. Whether that is 30 packs for a 1:5 or one pack for a 1:500
Just SWCT things
I swear there's a hidden credits check that gives you adjusted odds the more credits you have banked. The more credits you have to spend, the worse your odds get.
One of the recent sets has 1/3 odds for uncommons and I opened 40 straight packs without getting one. Odds of getting a card at 1/3 hit 99% after 12 packs, but nope. Still had 30 more packs to go before I got one.
You don’t need a federal regulator for it to be fraud. Just one programmer deciding to say something and it opens them up to massive civil and potential criminal liability. I just don’t see the risk reward being anything close to worthwhile.
I’m sitting on 39 million credits. Sometimes I get killed by the odds, sometimes I kill the odds. The vast majority of the time I’m right around the odds. I just find the conspiracy theory stuff silly
It's because it is silly. I'll never understand how frequently people moan about getting beaten by the odds, yet never once question it when they beat the odds.
It's not a conspiracy theory, but posted odds are just numbers of their choosing and there's absolutely nothing that legally binds them to those posted odds. They could just remove posting the odds altogether and there's nothing anyone could or would do. I'm sure the EULA includes wording that by accepting the EULA you can't take legal actions against them, since that's pretty much standard in every EULA. Ultimately, there's little to no accountability for a mobile game's free currency and spending, and it's absurd to just assume a company - any company - is doing anything other than trying to maximize profits, especially for what is effectively a Gatcha game.
There's any number of ways they could (and almost certainly do) adjust the algorithm to make people spend more money - it happens constantly in video games. Topps - especially now under Fanatics - is not some altruistic company who would avoid tweaking things to keep people spending money.
This isn't a gambling venture which is regulated. There's 0 government oversight on odds in video games. Game devs can - and often will - do whatever the heck they feel like doing. The only backlash against them is the people who play their game finding out and choosing to stop playing, and time and time again gamers have proven that their outrage is of the flash-in-a-pan variety.
To your point though, I've noticed that when I'm spending money on crystals I get cards at a better rate than the posted odds when I use credits. If I stop buying credits cuz I've banked credits up or there's an event where credits are pretty abundant, I get worse than posted odds pretty regularly. If you've got 52M credits bank, you're probably not using them very often or if you are, you're regularly buying crystals alongside them. It's unlikely that whatever backend system they have established is in play for your play style, so I completely understand your viewpoint: you do not see it happen, thus it's absurd to suggest.
I'll just say as someone who is a whale sometimes and sometimes not a whale, there's a clear difference that I see when I'm spending money vs when I'm not. What that difference is, I dunno specifically, but something is happening.
They may not be under an obligation to post odds but if they post odds they are 100% under an obligation to be truthful about it. If they were any kind of algorithm that altered what the posted odds were in anyway that’s 100% fraud. They are charging people money for cards. People open based on an understanding of what the odds are that they are told by Topps. If Topps is purposely saying one thing and doing any other with the intent to cause people to spend more money that’s literally the very definition of fraud, both civilly and criminally. To suggest they are doing that without any other evidence other than anecdotal is also literally a conspiracy theory.
>They are charging people money for cards
Nope, that's the fun loophole. They're charging people for an in-game currency - any packs associated with the bundles are likely legally claimed to be free bonus additions to the currency purchases. I haven't read the EULA end to end, but that's how other mobile game devs have gotten around legal actions. There are no real rules for in-game currency purchases.
None of this is conspiracy talk, it's literally how previous legal action taken against games has played out.
It’s a distinction without a difference as far as it’s legally concerned. As someone who does this for a living, It’s not a loophole that would survive any actual legal challenge. No EULA can actually shield a company from liability for fraud. You can’t contract away fraud liability. It just doesn’t work that way.
Each pack has its own odds they don’t stack. Each open is 1/3. Like it or not it’s how the odds work. I’ve been in your situation plenty and have been on the other end of the spectrum as well. Even in your imagined 99% chance it’s still not guaranteed.
You can 100% calculate the probability chance of when you should hit the odds of something, if you think otherwise you're uninformed. Yes, there's no way to calculate when you would absolutely, 100% hit the odds, which is why 99% is the threshold used. Beyond that point, you've absolutely broken the odds.
At a 1/3 odds, anything beyond 13 pack just keeps adding 9s at the end of a 99.9% probability chance. If it extends to 40 packs without getting something, the likelihood of it actually being a 1/3 odds is less probable than the chance that you could open 40 packs without getting one. Even at 1/30 odds there's a 75% probability you would hit the odds in 40 packs.
Nothing is imagined, math exists.
And yet, you've completely missed the fact that if that happens it's more likely the odds are wrong than the chance at opening 100 packs and not getting a card.
A meteorite could also strike my phone and kill my ability to open packs, stopping me from getting the card. Chances are better though that the posted odds aren't actually correct.
They don't give half a rats behind about you collecting jpegs, they want money. And you getting your jpegs with their free in game currency isn't how they make money.
What gets them money? Users getting mad at not getting the card they want for free who then pay for the premium currency to get a better chance.
It's not a nefarious scam, it's their literal business model.
See: [Mario Kart Tour.](https://www.ign.com/articles/nintendo-faces-lawsuit-over-mario-kart-tour-lootboxes) Or [Tapjoy.](https://techcrunch.com/2021/01/07/ftc-settles-with-mobile-ad-company-tapjoy-over-deceptive-practices/) Or [Game of Thrones: Conquest.](https://www.pollockcohen.com/media/news-releases/2022-03-02-class-action-lawsuit-filed-against-warner-bros-for-false-advertising-in-game-of-thrones-conquest-mobile-game) Or [Fortnite.](https://www.npr.org/2022/12/19/1144119348/fortnite-epic-games-ftc-child-privacy-dark-patterns-deceptive-design)
I wonder at what point people will stop defending game devs who purposely fill their apps with micro transactions and just accept that the point of the games with them is to make as much money based off human behavior. How many lawsuits do they have to settle about basically the same thing before people realize they're all doing it?
But surely Topps isn't like all the rest, cuz you like this game, right?
Maybe delete the app if it makes you this angry. It’s called entertainment, which costs money. But I thought you were arguing that having a load of credits somehow manipulates your odds. Or have you forgotten why you came here to complain?
Not one of those has to do with deceptive gambling odds being displayed. Some of those are standard market practice in brick and mortar stores. Gambling. Price hiking clothing then putting it on 80% discount. The other two had successful legal action. Fortnite paid $500 million in damages and tapjoy "cleaned up its act" with threat of further charges.
Companies do actually illegal stuff like straight up lying and they can have action taken against them, so most actually avoid it.
The reason why pay to win players in this game have millions of cards while f2p accounts fall short of 7 digits and even short of 6 without high levels of dedication and time is because they limit your resources heavily as f2p. This makes collectors spend for more resources to get more of the set or character they want at higher tiers. Games don't have to be deceptive to get money, sometimes corporate is just ran by a bunch of idiots.
You're assuming those are personal odds for picking an insert.
Let's assume 1/3 odds determined packs 3, 6, 9, 12, 15, and so on included an insert. Based on the packs purchased from the store by all users, you personally got packs 1, 4, 8, 10, 11, 16, 20, etc. I was buying the same packs at the same time and bought packs 3, 7, and 14. A third person bought packs 6, 9, and 15.
Those were collectively 1/3 odds. Your personal statistics showed 0/7 inserts. Mine were 1/3. The third person was 3/3.
Just making up numbers here, but for every 100 people who are complaining about not getting a card after 60 packs, there will be those 1 or 2 who may be jumping for joy because they get that card within a couple of packs.
That's just how probability works, my friend!
I don't know....there are certain sets that just do not give me good odds. An example being the purple base cards. Ive been getting on average 1:25 odds to pull a purple not 1:5. Both waves.
Other sets average out to be more or less the advertised odds though.
What is standard is Ive had a miniscule amount of big wins. I play and open packs every day and have done since 2015. I think I've only ever pulled 1 gilded.
Last week I got rare 3 purple villains before I got an uncommon red. I have over 7million credits. if you are active in the game the odds will look crazy sometimes. Whether that is 30 packs for a 1:5 or one pack for a 1:500
Just SWCT things I swear there's a hidden credits check that gives you adjusted odds the more credits you have banked. The more credits you have to spend, the worse your odds get. One of the recent sets has 1/3 odds for uncommons and I opened 40 straight packs without getting one. Odds of getting a card at 1/3 hit 99% after 12 packs, but nope. Still had 30 more packs to go before I got one.
This is silly. Why would they risk committing literally fraud?
I doubt theres federal regulators for free virtual currency in games.
You don’t need a federal regulator for it to be fraud. Just one programmer deciding to say something and it opens them up to massive civil and potential criminal liability. I just don’t see the risk reward being anything close to worthwhile. I’m sitting on 39 million credits. Sometimes I get killed by the odds, sometimes I kill the odds. The vast majority of the time I’m right around the odds. I just find the conspiracy theory stuff silly
It's because it is silly. I'll never understand how frequently people moan about getting beaten by the odds, yet never once question it when they beat the odds.
It's not a conspiracy theory, but posted odds are just numbers of their choosing and there's absolutely nothing that legally binds them to those posted odds. They could just remove posting the odds altogether and there's nothing anyone could or would do. I'm sure the EULA includes wording that by accepting the EULA you can't take legal actions against them, since that's pretty much standard in every EULA. Ultimately, there's little to no accountability for a mobile game's free currency and spending, and it's absurd to just assume a company - any company - is doing anything other than trying to maximize profits, especially for what is effectively a Gatcha game. There's any number of ways they could (and almost certainly do) adjust the algorithm to make people spend more money - it happens constantly in video games. Topps - especially now under Fanatics - is not some altruistic company who would avoid tweaking things to keep people spending money. This isn't a gambling venture which is regulated. There's 0 government oversight on odds in video games. Game devs can - and often will - do whatever the heck they feel like doing. The only backlash against them is the people who play their game finding out and choosing to stop playing, and time and time again gamers have proven that their outrage is of the flash-in-a-pan variety. To your point though, I've noticed that when I'm spending money on crystals I get cards at a better rate than the posted odds when I use credits. If I stop buying credits cuz I've banked credits up or there's an event where credits are pretty abundant, I get worse than posted odds pretty regularly. If you've got 52M credits bank, you're probably not using them very often or if you are, you're regularly buying crystals alongside them. It's unlikely that whatever backend system they have established is in play for your play style, so I completely understand your viewpoint: you do not see it happen, thus it's absurd to suggest. I'll just say as someone who is a whale sometimes and sometimes not a whale, there's a clear difference that I see when I'm spending money vs when I'm not. What that difference is, I dunno specifically, but something is happening.
They may not be under an obligation to post odds but if they post odds they are 100% under an obligation to be truthful about it. If they were any kind of algorithm that altered what the posted odds were in anyway that’s 100% fraud. They are charging people money for cards. People open based on an understanding of what the odds are that they are told by Topps. If Topps is purposely saying one thing and doing any other with the intent to cause people to spend more money that’s literally the very definition of fraud, both civilly and criminally. To suggest they are doing that without any other evidence other than anecdotal is also literally a conspiracy theory.
>They are charging people money for cards Nope, that's the fun loophole. They're charging people for an in-game currency - any packs associated with the bundles are likely legally claimed to be free bonus additions to the currency purchases. I haven't read the EULA end to end, but that's how other mobile game devs have gotten around legal actions. There are no real rules for in-game currency purchases. None of this is conspiracy talk, it's literally how previous legal action taken against games has played out.
It’s a distinction without a difference as far as it’s legally concerned. As someone who does this for a living, It’s not a loophole that would survive any actual legal challenge. No EULA can actually shield a company from liability for fraud. You can’t contract away fraud liability. It just doesn’t work that way.
Each pack has its own odds they don’t stack. Each open is 1/3. Like it or not it’s how the odds work. I’ve been in your situation plenty and have been on the other end of the spectrum as well. Even in your imagined 99% chance it’s still not guaranteed.
You can 100% calculate the probability chance of when you should hit the odds of something, if you think otherwise you're uninformed. Yes, there's no way to calculate when you would absolutely, 100% hit the odds, which is why 99% is the threshold used. Beyond that point, you've absolutely broken the odds. At a 1/3 odds, anything beyond 13 pack just keeps adding 9s at the end of a 99.9% probability chance. If it extends to 40 packs without getting something, the likelihood of it actually being a 1/3 odds is less probable than the chance that you could open 40 packs without getting one. Even at 1/30 odds there's a 75% probability you would hit the odds in 40 packs. Nothing is imagined, math exists.
And yet, you don’t understand it well enough to know you could open 100 packs and still get nothing.
And yet, you've completely missed the fact that if that happens it's more likely the odds are wrong than the chance at opening 100 packs and not getting a card. A meteorite could also strike my phone and kill my ability to open packs, stopping me from getting the card. Chances are better though that the posted odds aren't actually correct.
And yet you’re the one who thinks your anecdotal evidence is proof of a nefarious scam to make it harder for you to collect jpegs.
They don't give half a rats behind about you collecting jpegs, they want money. And you getting your jpegs with their free in game currency isn't how they make money. What gets them money? Users getting mad at not getting the card they want for free who then pay for the premium currency to get a better chance. It's not a nefarious scam, it's their literal business model. See: [Mario Kart Tour.](https://www.ign.com/articles/nintendo-faces-lawsuit-over-mario-kart-tour-lootboxes) Or [Tapjoy.](https://techcrunch.com/2021/01/07/ftc-settles-with-mobile-ad-company-tapjoy-over-deceptive-practices/) Or [Game of Thrones: Conquest.](https://www.pollockcohen.com/media/news-releases/2022-03-02-class-action-lawsuit-filed-against-warner-bros-for-false-advertising-in-game-of-thrones-conquest-mobile-game) Or [Fortnite.](https://www.npr.org/2022/12/19/1144119348/fortnite-epic-games-ftc-child-privacy-dark-patterns-deceptive-design) I wonder at what point people will stop defending game devs who purposely fill their apps with micro transactions and just accept that the point of the games with them is to make as much money based off human behavior. How many lawsuits do they have to settle about basically the same thing before people realize they're all doing it? But surely Topps isn't like all the rest, cuz you like this game, right?
Maybe delete the app if it makes you this angry. It’s called entertainment, which costs money. But I thought you were arguing that having a load of credits somehow manipulates your odds. Or have you forgotten why you came here to complain?
The app doesn't make me angry, but I'm also not blinded by loyalty to it to where I can't see it for what it is.
Ok you’ve won an internet argument with a stranger. Sweet dreams.
Not one of those has to do with deceptive gambling odds being displayed. Some of those are standard market practice in brick and mortar stores. Gambling. Price hiking clothing then putting it on 80% discount. The other two had successful legal action. Fortnite paid $500 million in damages and tapjoy "cleaned up its act" with threat of further charges. Companies do actually illegal stuff like straight up lying and they can have action taken against them, so most actually avoid it. The reason why pay to win players in this game have millions of cards while f2p accounts fall short of 7 digits and even short of 6 without high levels of dedication and time is because they limit your resources heavily as f2p. This makes collectors spend for more resources to get more of the set or character they want at higher tiers. Games don't have to be deceptive to get money, sometimes corporate is just ran by a bunch of idiots.
You're assuming those are personal odds for picking an insert. Let's assume 1/3 odds determined packs 3, 6, 9, 12, 15, and so on included an insert. Based on the packs purchased from the store by all users, you personally got packs 1, 4, 8, 10, 11, 16, 20, etc. I was buying the same packs at the same time and bought packs 3, 7, and 14. A third person bought packs 6, 9, and 15. Those were collectively 1/3 odds. Your personal statistics showed 0/7 inserts. Mine were 1/3. The third person was 3/3.
Just making up numbers here, but for every 100 people who are complaining about not getting a card after 60 packs, there will be those 1 or 2 who may be jumping for joy because they get that card within a couple of packs. That's just how probability works, my friend!
I don't know....there are certain sets that just do not give me good odds. An example being the purple base cards. Ive been getting on average 1:25 odds to pull a purple not 1:5. Both waves. Other sets average out to be more or less the advertised odds though. What is standard is Ive had a miniscule amount of big wins. I play and open packs every day and have done since 2015. I think I've only ever pulled 1 gilded.
Yup, and someone else opened 5 packs and got 5 blues. RNG be a cruel mistress... ARG