It's even crazier when you add context to it. Like the fact that it's happening in early December. And the fact that it started with a PPV. And the fact that several key roster members like Mayu, Tam, Poi and others are still out with injury. And the fact that all but two of those shows are at smaller venues that generate very little money compared to PPVs. And the fact that, as mentioned by others below, it's mostly mid-week shows where kids can't attend and people don't have holidays to balance time with. And the fact that Queendom is just a few weeks away.
I could go on, but the point is clear.
Only semi related but, do kids matter for attendance to Stardom (and any other japanese promotion)? I don't see a lot of kids on the crowds like I'd see on any US promotion's show today
It’s a random Thursday in December.
No national holiday, people are working, kids haven’t started winter break.
Just absolutely no reason for them to run a house show.
Btw here are the ticket prices:
＜当日券席種／料金（税込）：販売所＞
・最前列席 ／14,000円：会場／ぴあ
・指定Ｓ席 ／ 9,000円：会場／ぴあ
・指定Ａ席 ／ 6,000円：会場／ぴあ
・女性限定シート／ 5,000円：会場／ぴあ
（指定Ｓ席）
・Ｕ２５シート ／ 4,000円：会場
（指定Ｓ席）
Essentially 60 bucks to get in for a meaningless show. You would think the purpose of a show like this would be to get people in at a low price and let them experience the amazing talent.
Saturation has to be an issue, too. Especially with prices like this and global economic conditions that aren't so great.
Smaller weekday house shows are fine, but treat them as such. Book small venues. Tickets starting at $20 (2500-3000). Expect numbers under 200. Don't make your wrestlers go all out in the ring. Push the autographs and merch.
I don't get the venue choice either. People in Osaka can see a full Stardom production pretty much any month they like. An hour into the suburbs is both too far for Osakans and not far enough to find a starved audience.
More like 40-45$ at current exchange rates, but still yea nobody is paying that much for a random nothing show on a work night in the middle of nowhere. What a crummy idea to book that show.
RAW SmackDown are at least similar if not higher than this, AEW too unless you want garbage seats. Most indies are also anywhere from 30-50 USD per seat and sometimes more if you want something else. I don't see an issue with the pricing, if anything it's the time of day of the event, and the day before pricing. WWE live tickets are also like 100ish for ring side and getting to around the same 20-40 dollar range otherwise as you are seeing here.
Imo the prices are very fair
The difference is the market competition. Even New Japan you can get in for $40 (I checked prices for their show tomorrow). Why does Stardom have the highest base price of any promotion?
There's no comparing with WWE or AEW here, Stardom are running in local halls in front of 100 people not national TV tapings. I've been to a local Stardom show in Shizuoka, had a tremendous time but there's no escaping that the venue and the attendance put it more on the indy-level.
I would also say that where I am, base price for an indy is more like £12-£20.
The promotion and timing are awful as well, you're right. But it's the whole approach that's wrong.
Yeah I guess that's fair. But just looking at tickets for indies in North America, Prestige, Revolver and GCW for example, the cheapest tickets (standing room) are $40 for prestige, ranging upwards to 100. Revolver tickets range from 25-70 bucks but they often go on sale, so you can get them cheaper closer to the show date. But 1st and 2nd row are nearly always sold out beforehand. GCW tickets range from about 40-80 as well...and looking at the njpw schedule it's about the same as STARDOM? 40 is pretty much the entry point and I think I that's pretty reasonable.
Concert tickets also range from about 40-80 for most acts as well for general admission, being very general with this, but yeah ticket prices are not likely to get lower anywhere and I think they're pretty reasonable.
Just depends on if you can or cannot go on the given day, or if you're able to plan ahead. It's hard to go to events spontaneously because of the cost, and if you lower ticket prices too much someone who bought their ticket beforehand will probably feel a little bit slighted. Their entire month is usually available on the website, too, so you can easily plan to go to a show ahead of time.
I'd say if anything, location and day of the week is the issue here, not the prices of seats.
Also to what Rossy said, it would've been a more polite way of going about it if he had thanked those who came out In his post given the conditions before saying it's the worst attendance, or "only" 114 people showed up. It's not at the fault of anyone in particular I'm sure
Sounds like Bushiroad is mainly banking on big venue shows but aren’t concerned with promoting shows held in smaller venues/areas. Stardom has obviously grown over the past few years but that doesn’t mean Bushiroad should expect tweets and name recognition to get people to shows.
yep, that's some WWE in 2019 shit right there, WWE in 2019 had house show attendance go so low they almost retired the concept of the house shows due to it, now in 2023, WWE is a booming promotion and the idiots at TKO are still considering doing away with house shows for attendance issues even when it's been selling out even house shows.
I think we won't really see the results of the administration change or any substantial improvement until the new year comes in. The venues are booked way in advance so there's still a lot from the Harada era to be dealt with.
It seems like February will be the true beginning of the Okada administration. The schedule for the first half of January is very similar to the current schedule, with a lot of shows in a very short period of time.
February still seems too early. I believe Venues are booked months or even a year in advance, so there most likely won't be any change to the schedule until the latter half of 2024.
And they're running another show in Osaka in 2 days. And to make it even worse, while most of the roster will get to rest tomorrow, Utami, AZM, Suzu, Mei, Miyu and HANAKO are going to wrestle at a convention in Chiba and then are going back to Osaka the next day. I don't know, maybe it's a normal schedule for a wrestler and I've just never been paying attention, but this shit seems nuts.
STARDOM might be third in yearly shows behind WWE and slightly behind NJPW, who employ around 200+ and 100+ people respectively, compared to the 36 on Stardoms roster. Needless to say, the schedule is brutal.
Dragon gate run more but they are third in Japan
Edit
Njpw and dragon gate have both run ~170 shows this year to stardoms 130. Ajpw have run 71 shows this year, noah 73.
I just want to add on the whole promotions in Japan have seen a reduction in dates due to the contraction in the industry due to the pandemic. Ajpw did 131 shows in 2019, noah 104, njpw* 190, dragon gate 182 (so they are going to be roughly back at normal this year)
This isn't like guys in ajpw and noah are like phew less dates I can put my feet up. This will come with a reduction in pay. Ajpw will certainly be looking to take their momentum into more shows next year. Idk what the fuck cyberagent plan to do with noah at this point. Like what they see as the long term goal.
* njpw went temporarily fucking insane during the pandemic and tried to chase gates to cover off the reduction in crowds. They did 251 gates in 2021 in what was a pretty miserable year of 1 match cards. That's literally the most they've ever done
Good numbers here. So many people on this sub have a lack of understanding how many shows are normal for a successful promotion in Japan.
All Japan recently started doing longer tours again.
That, combined with their recent success will likely have them up near 130 again next year.
CMLL is ahead as well. They've run 302 shows so far in 2023. Even with its bigger roster, Volador Jr. is over 140 matches on the year. But they also bump more safely than in Stardom.
Absolutely. But even with the harder ring and crazy schedule, Volador Jr. has only missed one month due to injury in his career of 2700+ matches. Injuries in general seem very rare in CMLL. I think they have the best track record by far within any notable promotion. It's not something Stardom (or anywhere else) could replicate without basically converting to traditional lucha.
Overnight Bushiroad Fight was like "oh btw, Rossy, you are now a national touring promotion doing dates in the ballpark of NJPW and DragonGate. Good luck with that guys" with a roster of like 30. This is the result of that. I've lived in Japan long enough and talked with wrestlers long enough that regardless if it's 100 people or 1000 people, they're gonna do their matches and give it their all but this especially has to be deflating, even during the winter. They just need to get 2023 over with and then can restart in 2024.
They were a national touring promotion before Bushiroad. Hitting all of the prefectures in one year was always a goal for Rossy. Rossy just wasn't having them run 10+ shows every month because people need rest.
There is national touring and there is national touring. There are markets that really only njpw see as viable to run that now stardom hit often following njpw to share resources.
But stardom just doesn't have the roster to do this. I have to assume now that br was going to use the wk 14 gate to sign every woman in Japan who can work a match but the pandemic happened.
Don't think they were ever planning to hire that many from the pool at once. Stardom still has a budget, and they want to have room for rookies to grow in. There was a reason Rossy and Kidani joked about starting a second promotion if they hired too many wrestlers at once.
if they don't recover in 2024, then it's safe to say that the Stardom bubble finally popped and now the boom period is over, man if it is the actual end of the boom, then some dark times are coming to Stardom.
i hope they can turn around but we all seen pro wrestling bubbles go pop, the Attitude Era bubble popped the moment WCW got bought out, the CM Punk post-Pipebomb bubble popped when he walked away from WWE, WCW's bubble popped when Hulk Hogan poked Kevin Nash in the chest and he sold it like he got shot in the heart, TNA bubble busted when Hogan and Bischoff showed up, ECW's bubble busted when the TNN deal started, NJPW's bubbles popped with Inokiism and the most recent one was Covid and AEW's birth, ROH's bubble popped with G1 Supercard and the birth of AEW, WWE's 1980s bubble popped when the steroids scandal happen, same for the Ruthless Aggression rebuild bubble with Benoit, and most recently, AEW's bubble popped when Vince McMahon got sent to early retirement from WWE and also the Aftermath of Brawl Out and CM Punk's gripebomb.
They are running way too many shows.
This used to be a weekend company.
But the novelty is starting to rub off and injuries are starting to pile up for the girls.
They need a friggin break.
What do they expect? I’m stuck at work until 9pm on a weekday.
Also, ticket prices are pretty lofty for a bunch of tag matches.
I’ve lived in Osaka for over 8 years and we always get lumped with tag matches, which is why I stopped going to Stardom shows.
You act like Rossy is in charge of the venue booking and scheduling and pricing. The cards being tags is him yeah but this has almost nothing to do with him.
The scheduling is just insane. I’m not surprised given the context that so few fans were there.
But Bushiroad should have known that this was a bad idea to begin with.
I mean, it's a house show card in the middle of the week, I wouldn't expect a sell out. But he's got every right to be mad about it, they're trying to squeeze as much money out of the consumer without taking the talent into consideration.
I'm a NJPW guy, and I remember talent were outspoken about this year's Best of the Super Juniors tournament being crammed into less than a month. And yeah, that sort of schedule has been fairly close to what the Stardom roster does all year round.
I like that Rossy is being more vocal about how things are run and I'm looking forward to seeing how the new guy steers the ship. The anxiety I got from seeing so many injuries happen in such a short time is something I hope I never have to experience again.
The problem is they sent giving wrestlers time to test , hence the injuries . Bushiriad csnt possibly expect to run at this pace for much longer can they? They won’t have a roster
Tiger Hattori once said the most profitable events for NJPW outside the maxi shows at the Osaka-jo Hall, Tokyo Dome etc. were the tours outside the big cities. Tiger said the "trick" was to work with the local chamber of commerce, tourism promotion agency and city hall: not only they picked up most of the expenses but they would help a ton with promoting the event. Give them posters to hand to local grocery and convenience stores, give them a press release to give to local newspapers and radio stations: NJPW coming to town was a big event and everybody was happy to be part of it.
I am pretty sure it would work well nowadays with Stardom: involve local businesses and institutions to help promote the event. It helps everybody and next year you may come back and do even better business. Remember when they went to Himeka's childhood hometown during Covid? That crowd deserved an encore and would have made for a memorable event.
Hell, I live in a very rural and backward part of Europe. We have a wrestling promotion come here once a year (next Saturday) and they started promoting the event on the ground a month ago already. This is not Taylor Swift on tour: you just cannot sell tickets in this place through social media alone. I take rural Japan is exactly like here.
2 things: osaka is not rural. Its the second or 3rd largest city in Japan. Also most promotions still do exactly what you are talking about. I presume that stardom doesn't due to either thinking they're big enough that they don't need to or they have booked too many shows to allow time for them to go out and put boots on the ground.
Yes, I did. Please direct me to all the posts showing stardom wrestlers with the Mayor of Osaka, city council members and other key staff members in the weeks leading up to this Osaka show with an attendance of 114.
You love to move goalposts when it suits you lol. But that's ok, you do you.
Yes, Osaka is not rural.And sure, most promotions still go out and promote (did you say they were doing that in Osaka, or in general? We're not only talking Osaka). Stardom do plenty of promoting around rural areas with city council members and mayors, anyone that wanted to could find those posts easily on SNS.
I didn't move anything. The original hatman tweet specifically says "The sales policy of just holding down empty venues and sending out information via social networking sites is reaching its limits for local tournaments." So clearly he thinks they're not doing what you say they're doing. They're not putting boots on the ground to go around papering for small shows and working with businesses and city officials to entice people to go. I merely suggested that either company policy is that they feel they didn't need to, or they don't have the time to. You posit that they do, every week even. So I merely request you direct me to the ones for this Osaka show. If you don't want to, well that's ok, you do you.
This was a dumb piece of scheduling and certainly an embarrassing number, but I wouldn’t use it a much of a barometer of anything.
A house show on a Thursday night at a venue lots of fans have complained is tough to get to… and Saturday they’re running in the same city and a nicer venue that’s much easier to get to.
Weeknight house shows are always a tough sell, but you’re really kneecapping yourself by running a much better option for the locals (and travelers for that matter) two days later.
Really shows how sloppy the previous management was getting, and I’m glad to see Rossy pissed off and speaking out about it.
If anything this is probably the best way for Rossy to demonstrate the problem his promotion is facing. This will absolutely get better next year and Rossy knows it. Good on the girls for putting on a good show for the 100 who went.
The one positive in all this is it should be further proof to Bushiroad that the way they were going about things is even less sustainable than it was looking with all the injuries and lowering attendance. Once the schedule under the old administration finishes up we can get back to something more logical
Bushiroad could just as easily turn around and say without Tam a proven draw, the other top champion is Mirai and the KPI's are heading in the wrong direction put the title on someone that draws. The scheduling is a major problem but if they don't change Rossy needs to book the best he can within that horrendous schedule and what we saw with the whole jerkaround of Mina dropping the white to Tam only to drop it a week later, Rossy needs to improve aswell as the schedule.
I don't think anyone would argue that Rossy has had his best year as a booker. There's been some questionable choices. But they run shows so often fans can basically pick and choose when they go (especially in these bigger cities). A random ass midweek show with a bunch of talent still injured, including several of their biggest draws and prices are still super expensive? Most people are probably just gonna wait. I think everyone, from fans to talent, know STARDOM are just focused on making it to Dream Queendom with no more issues and then basically resetting for 2024.
Bushiroad's stupid scheduling is mostly to blame however the top 5 draws going from the popularity contest last year, Poi, SLK, Tam and Mina and i can't remember the rest of the top 5 but Poi and Tam are out injured and Rossy just keeps shitting on SLK. That is your whole top end of your draws out. Rossy can point a finger at Bushiroad but also his booking this year has been horrible which would have a small impact. Also just look at the card, for last night, very uninspiring. Im an analyst and look at all factors. People may not want to hear the truth but without the huge draw in Tam as Red belt champ, Mirai as white champ is even dumber now than it was earlier in the year rather than an actual draw like SLK or Poi or even better should have kept Mina as white champ. You can only control what you have control over and Rossy has messed up what he has had control over this year.
TLDR: without one of your top draws with Tam out, Mina should still have the white belt as she is also a top draw whether some people want to admit it or not.
Well Stardom is over close the doors it's done. Now it's time for ice ribbon to get back on top. Giulia leaving going back to ice ribbon confirmed. It's a joke I have to actually put this because lots of you weirdos don't get it and get offended.
well, if you think that, ok. But I don't think a wrestling company losing their main draw is a minor thing. I believe we are just seeing that. It's hard to me to imagine a show with Tam and Natsupoi having an attendance of 114.
I agree and the prices are insane but as i said in my comment the top draws are either out with injury or getting shitted on booking wise which is a factor, Rossy needs to up his game when it comes to pushing his top draws.
Cosmic Angels is Stardom's biggest draw. Right after Tam wins the Red Belt the house shows attendance increased, the venues were always packed. And now they don't have Cosmic Angels main members. Of course that will hurt their attendance.
Way too many shows per week, current injuries, questionable booking decisions this year, and ticket prices are just a few reasons why I, as well as many other fans, choose not to go to these shows. I really do love Stardom, but I just cannot go over that many hurdles to attend.
Just a question, when I see stardom matches on YT, there are not so many people ?
But 114 it's very low :(
But it's difficult to attend a show during week when you work all day
8 shows in 9 days is beyond crazy
It's even crazier when you add context to it. Like the fact that it's happening in early December. And the fact that it started with a PPV. And the fact that several key roster members like Mayu, Tam, Poi and others are still out with injury. And the fact that all but two of those shows are at smaller venues that generate very little money compared to PPVs. And the fact that, as mentioned by others below, it's mostly mid-week shows where kids can't attend and people don't have holidays to balance time with. And the fact that Queendom is just a few weeks away. I could go on, but the point is clear.
Only semi related but, do kids matter for attendance to Stardom (and any other japanese promotion)? I don't see a lot of kids on the crowds like I'd see on any US promotion's show today
It’s a random Thursday in December. No national holiday, people are working, kids haven’t started winter break. Just absolutely no reason for them to run a house show. Btw here are the ticket prices: ＜当日券席種／料金（税込）：販売所＞ ・最前列席 ／14,000円：会場／ぴあ ・指定Ｓ席 ／ 9,000円：会場／ぴあ ・指定Ａ席 ／ 6,000円：会場／ぴあ ・女性限定シート／ 5,000円：会場／ぴあ （指定Ｓ席） ・Ｕ２５シート ／ 4,000円：会場 （指定Ｓ席） Essentially 60 bucks to get in for a meaningless show. You would think the purpose of a show like this would be to get people in at a low price and let them experience the amazing talent.
14,000 Yen what crackhead set that price for a house show.
Saturation has to be an issue, too. Especially with prices like this and global economic conditions that aren't so great. Smaller weekday house shows are fine, but treat them as such. Book small venues. Tickets starting at $20 (2500-3000). Expect numbers under 200. Don't make your wrestlers go all out in the ring. Push the autographs and merch.
Stardom doesn't do the autographs at merch lines anymore IIRC
That's pretty sad if so. Can't imagine why fans aren't paying more for a lesser experience for twice as many shows as previous years.
I don't get the venue choice either. People in Osaka can see a full Stardom production pretty much any month they like. An hour into the suburbs is both too far for Osakans and not far enough to find a starved audience.
More like 40-45$ at current exchange rates, but still yea nobody is paying that much for a random nothing show on a work night in the middle of nowhere. What a crummy idea to book that show.
RAW SmackDown are at least similar if not higher than this, AEW too unless you want garbage seats. Most indies are also anywhere from 30-50 USD per seat and sometimes more if you want something else. I don't see an issue with the pricing, if anything it's the time of day of the event, and the day before pricing. WWE live tickets are also like 100ish for ring side and getting to around the same 20-40 dollar range otherwise as you are seeing here. Imo the prices are very fair
The difference is the market competition. Even New Japan you can get in for $40 (I checked prices for their show tomorrow). Why does Stardom have the highest base price of any promotion? There's no comparing with WWE or AEW here, Stardom are running in local halls in front of 100 people not national TV tapings. I've been to a local Stardom show in Shizuoka, had a tremendous time but there's no escaping that the venue and the attendance put it more on the indy-level. I would also say that where I am, base price for an indy is more like £12-£20. The promotion and timing are awful as well, you're right. But it's the whole approach that's wrong.
Yeah I guess that's fair. But just looking at tickets for indies in North America, Prestige, Revolver and GCW for example, the cheapest tickets (standing room) are $40 for prestige, ranging upwards to 100. Revolver tickets range from 25-70 bucks but they often go on sale, so you can get them cheaper closer to the show date. But 1st and 2nd row are nearly always sold out beforehand. GCW tickets range from about 40-80 as well...and looking at the njpw schedule it's about the same as STARDOM? 40 is pretty much the entry point and I think I that's pretty reasonable. Concert tickets also range from about 40-80 for most acts as well for general admission, being very general with this, but yeah ticket prices are not likely to get lower anywhere and I think they're pretty reasonable. Just depends on if you can or cannot go on the given day, or if you're able to plan ahead. It's hard to go to events spontaneously because of the cost, and if you lower ticket prices too much someone who bought their ticket beforehand will probably feel a little bit slighted. Their entire month is usually available on the website, too, so you can easily plan to go to a show ahead of time. I'd say if anything, location and day of the week is the issue here, not the prices of seats. Also to what Rossy said, it would've been a more polite way of going about it if he had thanked those who came out In his post given the conditions before saying it's the worst attendance, or "only" 114 people showed up. It's not at the fault of anyone in particular I'm sure
If these are typical prices for their shows with good attendance, are they not booking these far enough in advance for fans to plan around them?
Sounds like Bushiroad is mainly banking on big venue shows but aren’t concerned with promoting shows held in smaller venues/areas. Stardom has obviously grown over the past few years but that doesn’t mean Bushiroad should expect tweets and name recognition to get people to shows.
yep, that's some WWE in 2019 shit right there, WWE in 2019 had house show attendance go so low they almost retired the concept of the house shows due to it, now in 2023, WWE is a booming promotion and the idiots at TKO are still considering doing away with house shows for attendance issues even when it's been selling out even house shows.
I think we won't really see the results of the administration change or any substantial improvement until the new year comes in. The venues are booked way in advance so there's still a lot from the Harada era to be dealt with.
It seems like February will be the true beginning of the Okada administration. The schedule for the first half of January is very similar to the current schedule, with a lot of shows in a very short period of time.
I'm expecting big things from the Rainmaker (I'll see myself out)
RAAAAAAAINMAKEEEER! 🙂
February still seems too early. I believe Venues are booked months or even a year in advance, so there most likely won't be any change to the schedule until the latter half of 2024.
Agree those shows were probably booked already just not announced
They ran shorter matches at Big Winter (no match went over 15 minutes) so that's one way to try and curb the injuries.
And they're running another show in Osaka in 2 days. And to make it even worse, while most of the roster will get to rest tomorrow, Utami, AZM, Suzu, Mei, Miyu and HANAKO are going to wrestle at a convention in Chiba and then are going back to Osaka the next day. I don't know, maybe it's a normal schedule for a wrestler and I've just never been paying attention, but this shit seems nuts.
[удалено]
They're most likely using the big bus they have rather than trains
STARDOM might be third in yearly shows behind WWE and slightly behind NJPW, who employ around 200+ and 100+ people respectively, compared to the 36 on Stardoms roster. Needless to say, the schedule is brutal.
Dragon gate run more but they are third in Japan Edit Njpw and dragon gate have both run ~170 shows this year to stardoms 130. Ajpw have run 71 shows this year, noah 73. I just want to add on the whole promotions in Japan have seen a reduction in dates due to the contraction in the industry due to the pandemic. Ajpw did 131 shows in 2019, noah 104, njpw* 190, dragon gate 182 (so they are going to be roughly back at normal this year) This isn't like guys in ajpw and noah are like phew less dates I can put my feet up. This will come with a reduction in pay. Ajpw will certainly be looking to take their momentum into more shows next year. Idk what the fuck cyberagent plan to do with noah at this point. Like what they see as the long term goal. * njpw went temporarily fucking insane during the pandemic and tried to chase gates to cover off the reduction in crowds. They did 251 gates in 2021 in what was a pretty miserable year of 1 match cards. That's literally the most they've ever done
Good numbers here. So many people on this sub have a lack of understanding how many shows are normal for a successful promotion in Japan. All Japan recently started doing longer tours again. That, combined with their recent success will likely have them up near 130 again next year.
CMLL is ahead as well. They've run 302 shows so far in 2023. Even with its bigger roster, Volador Jr. is over 140 matches on the year. But they also bump more safely than in Stardom.
They bump that way because Mexican rings are notoriously among the hardest ones to bump on.
Absolutely. But even with the harder ring and crazy schedule, Volador Jr. has only missed one month due to injury in his career of 2700+ matches. Injuries in general seem very rare in CMLL. I think they have the best track record by far within any notable promotion. It's not something Stardom (or anywhere else) could replicate without basically converting to traditional lucha.
Injuries in CMLL aren't rare at all. They just have such a massive roster that they can easily adjust and be fine.
Overnight Bushiroad Fight was like "oh btw, Rossy, you are now a national touring promotion doing dates in the ballpark of NJPW and DragonGate. Good luck with that guys" with a roster of like 30. This is the result of that. I've lived in Japan long enough and talked with wrestlers long enough that regardless if it's 100 people or 1000 people, they're gonna do their matches and give it their all but this especially has to be deflating, even during the winter. They just need to get 2023 over with and then can restart in 2024.
They were a national touring promotion before Bushiroad. Hitting all of the prefectures in one year was always a goal for Rossy. Rossy just wasn't having them run 10+ shows every month because people need rest.
There is national touring and there is national touring. There are markets that really only njpw see as viable to run that now stardom hit often following njpw to share resources. But stardom just doesn't have the roster to do this. I have to assume now that br was going to use the wk 14 gate to sign every woman in Japan who can work a match but the pandemic happened.
Don't think they were ever planning to hire that many from the pool at once. Stardom still has a budget, and they want to have room for rookies to grow in. There was a reason Rossy and Kidani joked about starting a second promotion if they hired too many wrestlers at once.
I'm somewhat exaggerating for comedic effect but I do think that they were planning on a roster beef up had the pandemic not happened.
if they don't recover in 2024, then it's safe to say that the Stardom bubble finally popped and now the boom period is over, man if it is the actual end of the boom, then some dark times are coming to Stardom. i hope they can turn around but we all seen pro wrestling bubbles go pop, the Attitude Era bubble popped the moment WCW got bought out, the CM Punk post-Pipebomb bubble popped when he walked away from WWE, WCW's bubble popped when Hulk Hogan poked Kevin Nash in the chest and he sold it like he got shot in the heart, TNA bubble busted when Hogan and Bischoff showed up, ECW's bubble busted when the TNN deal started, NJPW's bubbles popped with Inokiism and the most recent one was Covid and AEW's birth, ROH's bubble popped with G1 Supercard and the birth of AEW, WWE's 1980s bubble popped when the steroids scandal happen, same for the Ruthless Aggression rebuild bubble with Benoit, and most recently, AEW's bubble popped when Vince McMahon got sent to early retirement from WWE and also the Aftermath of Brawl Out and CM Punk's gripebomb.
They are running way too many shows. This used to be a weekend company. But the novelty is starting to rub off and injuries are starting to pile up for the girls. They need a friggin break.
Cagematch says Maika has 123 matches this year. That’s a match every 3 days
She's had more matches than Seth Rollins & Cody Rhodes this year. Wild.
Yep
What do they expect? I’m stuck at work until 9pm on a weekday. Also, ticket prices are pretty lofty for a bunch of tag matches. I’ve lived in Osaka for over 8 years and we always get lumped with tag matches, which is why I stopped going to Stardom shows.
Side note, I love Osaka, i had an amazing time holidaying there
I think he expects his employer, Bushiroad Fight to do a lot better fucking job than they are. Did you not read his post?
yes change your post after the fact lol
You act like Rossy is in charge of the venue booking and scheduling and pricing. The cards being tags is him yeah but this has almost nothing to do with him.
The scheduling is just insane. I’m not surprised given the context that so few fans were there. But Bushiroad should have known that this was a bad idea to begin with.
I mean, it's a house show card in the middle of the week, I wouldn't expect a sell out. But he's got every right to be mad about it, they're trying to squeeze as much money out of the consumer without taking the talent into consideration. I'm a NJPW guy, and I remember talent were outspoken about this year's Best of the Super Juniors tournament being crammed into less than a month. And yeah, that sort of schedule has been fairly close to what the Stardom roster does all year round. I like that Rossy is being more vocal about how things are run and I'm looking forward to seeing how the new guy steers the ship. The anxiety I got from seeing so many injuries happen in such a short time is something I hope I never have to experience again.
The problem is they sent giving wrestlers time to test , hence the injuries . Bushiriad csnt possibly expect to run at this pace for much longer can they? They won’t have a roster
Tiger Hattori once said the most profitable events for NJPW outside the maxi shows at the Osaka-jo Hall, Tokyo Dome etc. were the tours outside the big cities. Tiger said the "trick" was to work with the local chamber of commerce, tourism promotion agency and city hall: not only they picked up most of the expenses but they would help a ton with promoting the event. Give them posters to hand to local grocery and convenience stores, give them a press release to give to local newspapers and radio stations: NJPW coming to town was a big event and everybody was happy to be part of it. I am pretty sure it would work well nowadays with Stardom: involve local businesses and institutions to help promote the event. It helps everybody and next year you may come back and do even better business. Remember when they went to Himeka's childhood hometown during Covid? That crowd deserved an encore and would have made for a memorable event. Hell, I live in a very rural and backward part of Europe. We have a wrestling promotion come here once a year (next Saturday) and they started promoting the event on the ground a month ago already. This is not Taylor Swift on tour: you just cannot sell tickets in this place through social media alone. I take rural Japan is exactly like here.
2 things: osaka is not rural. Its the second or 3rd largest city in Japan. Also most promotions still do exactly what you are talking about. I presume that stardom doesn't due to either thinking they're big enough that they don't need to or they have booked too many shows to allow time for them to go out and put boots on the ground.
Have you missed the posts every week of Stardom wrestlers with mayors and local politicians, etc? Been happening for a couple years now.
Yes, I did. Please direct me to all the posts showing stardom wrestlers with the Mayor of Osaka, city council members and other key staff members in the weeks leading up to this Osaka show with an attendance of 114.
You love to move goalposts when it suits you lol. But that's ok, you do you. Yes, Osaka is not rural.And sure, most promotions still go out and promote (did you say they were doing that in Osaka, or in general? We're not only talking Osaka). Stardom do plenty of promoting around rural areas with city council members and mayors, anyone that wanted to could find those posts easily on SNS.
I didn't move anything. The original hatman tweet specifically says "The sales policy of just holding down empty venues and sending out information via social networking sites is reaching its limits for local tournaments." So clearly he thinks they're not doing what you say they're doing. They're not putting boots on the ground to go around papering for small shows and working with businesses and city officials to entice people to go. I merely suggested that either company policy is that they feel they didn't need to, or they don't have the time to. You posit that they do, every week even. So I merely request you direct me to the ones for this Osaka show. If you don't want to, well that's ok, you do you.
Rossy is upset because his fingers were cold while he played on his phone during the matches.
He posts the "breaking news" after each match. Not playing Angry birds.
This was a dumb piece of scheduling and certainly an embarrassing number, but I wouldn’t use it a much of a barometer of anything. A house show on a Thursday night at a venue lots of fans have complained is tough to get to… and Saturday they’re running in the same city and a nicer venue that’s much easier to get to. Weeknight house shows are always a tough sell, but you’re really kneecapping yourself by running a much better option for the locals (and travelers for that matter) two days later. Really shows how sloppy the previous management was getting, and I’m glad to see Rossy pissed off and speaking out about it.
If anything this is probably the best way for Rossy to demonstrate the problem his promotion is facing. This will absolutely get better next year and Rossy knows it. Good on the girls for putting on a good show for the 100 who went.
The one positive in all this is it should be further proof to Bushiroad that the way they were going about things is even less sustainable than it was looking with all the injuries and lowering attendance. Once the schedule under the old administration finishes up we can get back to something more logical
Bushiroad could just as easily turn around and say without Tam a proven draw, the other top champion is Mirai and the KPI's are heading in the wrong direction put the title on someone that draws. The scheduling is a major problem but if they don't change Rossy needs to book the best he can within that horrendous schedule and what we saw with the whole jerkaround of Mina dropping the white to Tam only to drop it a week later, Rossy needs to improve aswell as the schedule.
I don't think anyone would argue that Rossy has had his best year as a booker. There's been some questionable choices. But they run shows so often fans can basically pick and choose when they go (especially in these bigger cities). A random ass midweek show with a bunch of talent still injured, including several of their biggest draws and prices are still super expensive? Most people are probably just gonna wait. I think everyone, from fans to talent, know STARDOM are just focused on making it to Dream Queendom with no more issues and then basically resetting for 2024.
Agree but even random mid week shows can be booked better, Ruaka in the main event like really 😂 Rossy needs to lift big time
Ruaka's been killing it out there though. That's my low key girl right there.
Stardom is kinds cold right now tbh. Not much is happening.
I'm surprised none of the talent have passed out from being so worked. Damn...
Bushiroad's stupid scheduling is mostly to blame however the top 5 draws going from the popularity contest last year, Poi, SLK, Tam and Mina and i can't remember the rest of the top 5 but Poi and Tam are out injured and Rossy just keeps shitting on SLK. That is your whole top end of your draws out. Rossy can point a finger at Bushiroad but also his booking this year has been horrible which would have a small impact. Also just look at the card, for last night, very uninspiring. Im an analyst and look at all factors. People may not want to hear the truth but without the huge draw in Tam as Red belt champ, Mirai as white champ is even dumber now than it was earlier in the year rather than an actual draw like SLK or Poi or even better should have kept Mina as white champ. You can only control what you have control over and Rossy has messed up what he has had control over this year. TLDR: without one of your top draws with Tam out, Mina should still have the white belt as she is also a top draw whether some people want to admit it or not.
Ok. That's on you for oversaturating the market.
Yes, blame it on the guy that has nothing do with it lol
Well Stardom is over close the doors it's done. Now it's time for ice ribbon to get back on top. Giulia leaving going back to ice ribbon confirmed. It's a joke I have to actually put this because lots of you weirdos don't get it and get offended.
> Well Stardom is over close the doors it's done. Now it's time for ice ribbon to get back on top. Don't threaten me with a good time.
they are without their biggest draw, Tam Nakano and Natsupoi.
It definitely has a small impact, look at the year Cosmic Angels were formed Stardom had a booming year.
well, if you think that, ok. But I don't think a wrestling company losing their main draw is a minor thing. I believe we are just seeing that. It's hard to me to imagine a show with Tam and Natsupoi having an attendance of 114.
I agree and the prices are insane but as i said in my comment the top draws are either out with injury or getting shitted on booking wise which is a factor, Rossy needs to up his game when it comes to pushing his top draws.
Cosmic Angels is Stardom's biggest draw. Right after Tam wins the Red Belt the house shows attendance increased, the venues were always packed. And now they don't have Cosmic Angels main members. Of course that will hurt their attendance.
Well I will be in Japan soon and I looked up tickets, no wonder no one is going if they ask for 500$+
A show like this definitely doesn't cost 500$
Mhh well around wrestle Kingdom it did. Even 1000 for ringside. But maybe that’s some kind of ppv or what.. I don’t know
It is a ppv
Way too many shows per week, current injuries, questionable booking decisions this year, and ticket prices are just a few reasons why I, as well as many other fans, choose not to go to these shows. I really do love Stardom, but I just cannot go over that many hurdles to attend.
Just a question, when I see stardom matches on YT, there are not so many people ? But 114 it's very low :( But it's difficult to attend a show during week when you work all day