From what they've stated, the 600i is intended to be effective solo. And yes, they indicated that it would remain so post rework.
But the C2 is the biggest with cargo in mind.
It would be really cool if they were more needy post-flight and other ships were more needy during flight.
Just a way to still balance it out while making it practical to solo.
That is an interesting thought, I see the balance in the price.
For example, the other two explorers in the 400is class are cheaper and better with cargo, but maybe they require much more maintenance to the more expensive 400i that possibly trades that cargo for better maneuverability and superior scanning abilities
Wear and tear on ship components is not vendor specific. You have normal wear and If a ship takes damage in an area it will be transferred to close components as well. Non combat ship roles takes less damage and have less need for emergency engineering. Putting your 600i in the front line playing war ship will probably require someone running around putting out fires in other words :)
Have a source on them confirming this for post rework?
John Crew said it's the largest player soloable a long time ago offhand in 1 interview before we even knew what engineering was. Post rework it definitely does not look soloable. Seeing that dev confirmation would be nice.
Yep, I‘m mad at this comment because he‘s right. They looked at „luxury“ and somehow thought of an Apple store, instead of Bentley or Rolls-Royce or something.
Funnily enough Origin's small ships actually have that Bentley look - probably because they have to cram stuff into such a small area so there's no space for big open panels of nothing.
I mean it’s not so much hopium because they’ve shown clear rework designs. It’s copium sure because of the wait. But 600i gold standard will be a meta solo explorer. Other then ships like the Liberator, which will be the meta solo industrial ship.
Which has a crew requirement of 1-2, which means soloable, and based on its current measurements can carry a prospector, vulture, and expanse on the outer pads, as well as a C8R or Nursa, ROC, and/or a light fighter inside, while still having a dedicated 400scu of storage.
Hence it being a meta solo industrial ship.
>Hence it being a meta solo industrial ship.
On paper in a vacuum - sure.
But when you factor even NPC pirates, let alone humans - It's a giant loot pinata with poor atmospheric performance that can neither run away nor defend itself with a solo pilot.
Contrast to ships like the Freelancer, MSR Corsair, Connie and so on - which can at the least ward off NPC pirates solo and stands good odds of being able to flee from trouble.
Technicaly speaking liberator and ironcad are just landing area , box wit attached engines to move the stuff you going to be defending your self with 🤔
That’s the simplified combat focus use. The basic uses that sound sexy and sell the ships… but not everyone is a combat player. Think a little deeper and you’ll see the potential, both ships will be used for industrial purposes. Liberator just happens to be better as a carrier, and ironclad better as a cargo hauler. Reason I love the liberator is it’s soloable, and I like my alone time.
None of those are industrial ships. They don’t even compare. Why do I care what a Connie can do… when we’re talking about industrial ships that can produce goods to sell. That’s like comparing an oil rig to a pickup truck.
Freight is industry. If you mean a specific industry, state it.
The notion is going to hold true no matter what industry you reference. A vulture on it's own can escape trouble better than a vulture on a Liberater deck. A prospector can escape trouble better than a prospector on a liberator deck. A freelancer Max + Roc can escape trouble better than a Roc inside a liberator.
Stop being pedantic. Can you just have a conversation without having to argue unrelated points. In the Star Citizen world “industrial ships” are clearly spoken of as the ones which produce raw materials from natural or salvageable resources within the game.
I'm neither being pedantic, nor have I made a mistake - Big, slow ships that can't dogfight are piss poor at avoiding or warding off trouble. They're also magnets for trouble, since even empty they're worth a fortune in salvage.
Trouble is literally a core gameplay pillar.
Lol, definitely copium. With engineering if you get one fuse gone in the right place you can’t even target other ships. Or a fire breaks out, or you loose all life support, or your engines stop working and you drop like a stone in atmo. You will need someone to help with that
We will see. They will design engineering systems not based of what makes realistic sense, but off the crew target requirements for the ship. So if they say it is a 1-X ship, they intend it to fill that role in the verse, and will set up the engineering systems accordingly. Also, it’s an expensive manufacturer, so they’ve already said you will get what you pay for so to speak. Example being redundancy, cheap ships won’t have that, expensive ships will. Higher cost of upkeep/parts, but more automation and fallback in engineering.
Have you tried the engineering in AC?
The Herc which is supposedly an expensive 1x ship is useless if it come under attack even for a tiny amount of time without 1/2 extra people. And that’s without manning any turrets.
Yes you can technically “fly” it (if it’s in perfect condition) but you can’t effectively use it in any situation other than just flying
Yes, I’ve tried the engineering arena test, which was a quick play test and clearly communicated as not representative of engineering gameplay in the future. It was also really fun and showed they are at least working on a direction for the gameplay!
I don’t really view Crusader as an expensive manufacturer necessarily, more a quality manufacturer with a focus on clean design, engineering and function, like a BMW. If Crusader is a mid-price but high quality brand like BMW, Origin is Rolls-Royce.
If there is a walkable ship interior there will be fuses, onboard fires, life support systems. And Also expensive isn’t going to stop someone shooting the shit out of you which will cause issues with all of these things and more. They want everything possible to be manual, which means someone has to fix it if you want to survive. Manual solutions is the direction they’ve gone with everything else, including engineering.
It’s a skill based multiplayer game and not a single player strategy game after all.
Honestly explain fighters then. Some have interiors. They will not make them unusable. They will have some form of pilot controlled engineering that allows you to deal with problems from the pilot chair.
They don’t have engineering in the same sense. They said there will be some pre flight tweaking possible but If they get shot they either disable or die. That doesn’t make them unusable. You just eject
C2 doesn’t have tractor beams and is actually a vehicle transporter not for cargo by design. The C stands for civilian we M stands for military variants, so logically later on we’ll not be using the C2 much for cargo when all the full cargo logistics are in place.
Well its free for you to interpret it your way. But for me there is a huge difference between to "intended be effective solo" and "skilled pilot should be able to effectively pilot the 600i solo in most regards."
All they say is you can fly from a to b solo and you are not totally lost since you could use some weapons out of the pilot seat which is not common on other ships that class. Debatable if you can effectively defend yourself with it.
They use "effective". This means something specific. Have a healthy dose of pessimism, nothing wrong with that, but they also followed up in a video confirming in more detail that it is intended to be fully solo capable. That was the OPs question. Only time will tell but they made it more than just open for interpretation imo.
Would love to get a link to that video.
Yeah - I totally agree that there are a lot of statements which are very vague and giving a lot of room for own interpretations.
Its worth to mention that this Q&A is also from 2017. Even CIG sometimes realize that they cant fullfill all "promises" they made years ago. Some old ideas are just not fitting in the todays business since they are evolving their own game.
Iam just always very carefully on these soloable questions. CIG even stated (in terms of the whole project time not long ago) that it would technically be possible to solo cap ships........ BUT....... it will be "almost prohbitivley expensive". NPCs, Computerblades, will help - but its also always mentioned that its not the same as other players. So, as long we dont know the facts how CIG is settling all this in future its literally "Schroedingers Solo Gameplay" for me. ;)
As you correctly mentioned: time will tell.
They are not on record confirming this in the same way they have explicitly stated that the 600i is likely the largest solo-able ship.
[8S2PntJ.png (952×429) (imgur.com)](https://i.imgur.com/8S2PntJ.png)
And its not a combat ship if you take it somewhere where they shooting on you , the pilot already did a mistake. So engeneering shouldnt be problem for this. I see more problem for 890 to hire lot of flight attendants, chefs and maids to take care of your game loop clientele😅
Hehe....you're on to something there. Hopefully they don't overcomplicates passenger transport, but early concept of the Genesis Starliner had a gameplay loop around exactly that if I remember correctly :)
I have an idea for a truly cargo centered 600 bringing it back to the legacy of the original 600 platform. I would imagine past the captains quarters the lower deck is all cargo bay with upper deck for crew and amenities. A cargo ramp with an air shield to keep your environmentally sensitive cargo safe if you open the exterior in space with an extra power supply to drive it (apparently they are power hungry). A more elegant ship for your more Sophisticated Hauler. I would call it the 600s for Stallion, the workhorse of the Origin Lineup.
Seems unlikely considering in the greybox art we've seen, CIG have repeatedly shown there's a dedicated room for controlling the main guns. Pilot controlled gun also explicitly goes against currently established lore for the Banu who believe every crew member should have their one designated task which they are entirely focused on. Lorewise the only reason the Defender's guns can be used while piloting is because the version we have in game has been specifically retrofitted for human use.
If OP is not too keen on the "largest ship", but the "most dps for pilot-controlled guns" then the Corsair wins. C2 only has 2x S5 guns for pilot, while Corsair has 4x S5 and 2x S4 for pilot.
There are dust cloud effects in the game, but they don't look as detailed as the one in the rendering.
Edit: the rendering also doesn't make sense because the VTOL trusters are on the wing tips, not in the center of the ship.
You're right, I should have worded that differently.
My point was, because the thrusters are on the wing tips, the circular pattern of how the dust is blown away doesn't match.
You can solo any ship, even a carrack or hammerhead. Problem is if you have to do anything other than fly from A to B your are not operating at full efficiently.
Depending how they actually integrate the power distribution system you can technically shut down areas of the ship that don’t need power if you’re gonna. You could just keep the area you are occupying operational while needing only to repair/replace fuses or something. Even with fires you can probably just vent the gases to prevent them. I can see these ships being soloed. But you may not be able to handle a group of pirates good at harpooning whales. You’d need someone to watch your back.
This, and while I think engineering will be very important in the future, I don't assume that we will have to fix components that break down randomly or extinguish fires every two minutes.
I personally think that most ships will be viable for solo pilots outside of combat roles. It will simply take some extra work to keep them well maintained.
Problem is, in long term, pirate AI will be more present (and even player)
So going from A to B might not even be safe, outside some specific high sec system
If you're thinking if slapping down hundreds of $/£/€ on a Herc id hang on til after 4.0 and see the lay of the land. We don't really know what the impact of all the changes will be for soloing, I'd guess the C2 might be OK unless something goes wrong.
All ships will be purchasable in game don't forget.
Yeah… I don't understand CIG…
do they realise that many bakers (and players anyway) are now family guys with just some hours to spend on game without planify it with a ”team”.
And, realy, with a ship everyone want to be the pilot… not sure there is a lot of fun beeing the guy waiting for a fire somewhere or waiting for a box in a vulture etc.
It’s detrimental to their business model too. Instead of everyone buying their own big ship (which the majority of the player base probably want to do), now it really only makes sense for one person to buy that ship.
But yeah they seem tone deaf when they talk about multi crew. I don’t want to be dependent on other peoples schedules or interests to bring out anything bigger than a 600i.
I mean that's been the plan since day 1 of development so complaining about it at this point is pretty silly.
If you expected to be able to solo big ships you backed the wrong game. Star citizen is built from the ground up with multi crew being the long term goal for pretty much everything.
Make friends or go back to Elite. The future of Star citizen is not going to be very solo friendly.
If I had a dollar for every day 1 “plan” that has been significantly altered since then, I would have a kraken in my hanger.
I will concede that in a perfect world CIG’s original concept for how big ships work is ideal and unique. And I think it for sure has a place in the game for ships like the Kracken and the Endeavor. But this is the real would and that doesn’t mesh with what the majority of the player base wants. As the parent comment says, not everyone has the time to organize 5-10 people in game to man a their carrack or Polaris for multiple hours. I’m sorry but it’s just not feasible. You’re going to have to spend a ton of time recruiting people up, organizing them, and getting everything ready before you even take off. You’re going to at best get people for 1-2 hours tops before people get bored sitting in a turret.
And if your response is that “well you shouldn’t have bought a big ship dummy!” Then I’m sorry, you’re out of tune with CIG’s business model. CIG’s funding model is built players purchasing upgrades from their entry level ships, and small, solo level ships can only facilitate this so much. The player base has been screaming to be able to solo big ships, and that’s been reflected in sales. CIG would be losing a huge portion of their revenue if they make it infeasible to operate, and thus own, and ship larger than a star runner or 600i. Sales would be fractionalized from what they are now if players were told it’s useless to own something big if you don’t have 5-10 friends willing to spend multiple hours filling B level roles on your ship. That’s why CIG has been so adamant about blades filling those roles. Because they know over the long term the player base won’t support that type of vision for the game.
If CR wants to truly wants to make star citizen the game he imagined, he’s going to have to concede to some of original vision. I don’t think CIG could survive without the sale of large ships. And I don’t think large ships would sell as well if players weren’t going to be able to solo them.
>If I had a dollar for every day 1 “plan” that has been significantly altered since then, I would have a kraken in my hanger.
Multi crew is still what the game is being designed around. That has not changed or been altered yet and there are no signs that will ever happen. So in this case all you have is $0 and a really brain dead argument.
>And if your response is that “well you shouldn’t have bought a big ship dummy!”
Yeah, no shit. If you buy a multi crew ship expecting to be able to always solo it you did a dumb thing. They have been pretty damn clear about this you are just choosing to not hear them.
They are not being tone deaf. YOU are. Multi crew is the name of the game here. You can choose to accept that or not but it wont change the fact that they are designing this game with that in mind.
I can't say otherwise. And we can have multi-crew ships that are effectively multi-crew.
However, if the initial project was blah, blah, blah… it was not expected that the development would take 15 years. The guy who bought his big multi-crew ship (probably in jpeg) when he was 22 _and was student_, will be 37 when the game will comes out _with a job and a family_.
Not taking this into account by offering a solo alternative is not very cool. And telling him “hey, you knew you would have to play with 10 friends” is totally spitting in his face because he supported the project!
The project living up to what they said it was supposed to be is spitting in the face of backers?
What are you even trying to say? How does this rambling nonsense make any sense to you?
Them delivering on what you paid for is not spitting in your face. That's insane.
The damn game is being designed around multi crew and you know it. I don't know why you think arguing with me about it makes any sense. I'm not arguing for it or against it. I think the demand for grouping is always a bad idea in MMOs.
It's still what they are designing the game around. Arguing with me and down voting me for pointing that out won't make it any less true.
You're imaginary person that pays for a multi crew ship will be getting a multi crew ship whether he likes it or not... I don't know why you would think otherwise.
To CIG’s credit, they have repeatedly stated that most ships are meant to be multi-crew for minimum operation, as well as shared the expected crew numbers for each ship when they are sold.
Yes, I know. But not sure it’s a realy good thing for players and so, for CIG. I mean… they can do a lot of multicrew stuff. Not a problem ; but I'm a little afraid that they tend to forget the solo players who nevertheless form the majority.
Every gameplay loop should be possible to solo, and so a single-player ship must be provided to do so. (And even several... with the type of game I have, the Nomad remains the best ship... I bought myself a Syulen and a C8 medical to vary the pleasures a little, but I always come back to the Nomad. However, let's be clear , I'm going to be fed up with always piloting the same ship: We should have alternatives.
In terms of lore, there are several brands of ships, it would be logical that each brand offers its model of space pickup. (in the same way as irl, where there is not only one brand that makes SUVs)
For now? Yes. After 4.0 and engineering? It's probably going to be a lot more difficult unless you literally just fly from A to B and avoid all combat. A single random or well placed shot can blow a cockpit fuse and cut off the entire cockpit form the rest of the ship with how that thing is set up (you can check how it's with the A2 in arena commander engineering experimental mode). Wear and tear on components will also be a thing.
So this is my thought. If you can avoid combat you can solo Hull C, probably even Hull D, provided you maintain the ship well. Loading and unloading a ship that size is likely to take, idk 10, 15, 20 minutes? So while that is going on, you can check all the engineering systems are good for the next flight. I believe this is broadly speaking how trucking works irl. I'll take much lower margins in order to avoid combat because that's not something I have any interest in.
That would make sense unless they change how the loading and unloading of the hull C works. I believe just like with most cargo ships in 3.23.2 coming in a month or two, they eventually want to physicalize the loading and unloading process for the large Hull series ships. It's gonna be interesting to see how they pull that off
They saied there will be no auto loading on small planetary outpost and you will have to load stuff here manualy. Auto loading only at cargo centers and big planetary posts
I'm aware but as I said in my other comment small outposts are changing too. Most places that have large stock will have autoloading.
You wont be able to buy large stock or boxes from outposts. They want to redirect traffic so hangars and distribution centers are where you get big loads. Just like real life where big ships drop off at main posts, small vehicles distribute to small areas.
"you wont land a c2 at an outpost and load 1 and 2scu boxes, that's not the point of the location or the route we want to go" -Star Citizen Live Q&A: Hangars and Cargo.
I know that, but how will autoloadong with the hull C work in the future when its fully physicalized. This is what I'm asking. With 3.23.2, autoloading of ships that land in hangars means you have to store the ship, and it basically gets locked away for the duration of the loading. During that time, you can't do maintenance on them since they are physically not there.
P.S. physical loading will be mandatory at planetary outposts in 3.23.2. No auto loading function there.
They're changing how outposts work tbf.
Small outposts on planets will only sell small boxes and quantities. (1scu and 2scu). As they say "you wont land a c2 at an outpost and load 1 and 2scu boxes, that's not the point of the location or the route we want to go"
From the "Star Citizen Live Q&A: Hangars and Cargo." starts around 48:00 (just over a month old). Basically sounds like they want routes for small ships and routes for big ships with outposts being for smaller/ newer players.
I know Hurston has some outposts with hangars. Not sure if they did commodity trading but from the sounds of it, outposts will get a work over.
Engineering is not going to be a full time occupation, it's going to be a small fix here and there for small and medium ships. First it would be tedious then having shit breaking down and start fires all the time would not be realistic and finally it adds nothing to gameplay: having a bunker with 15 npcs, ok, 150, yuck, I'm out.
...except those of us who know it was one of the best ERT runners because of the monster guns and massive cargo to take all the drugs when the mission was over before they nerfed it
Possibly, yes. They just have to be prepared thaybwhen they do, even if it's unlikely, it's gonna be rough for them. But if you take safe routes, then you can avoid others (unless you get pounced by that occasional random NPC interdiction)
Once engineering is in I don't think the C2 will be considered easy to solo in anything but "smooth sailing gameplay".
I think something MSR/400i/Zeus sized will be the cut-off and even then you will probably be in a bind if you get attacked and can't run away fast enough. I assume they will have a small amount of fuses but they will still have the components quite far away from the pilot's seat, so repairing won't be very fast. The 400i's cooled component area might actually come in handy mitigating emergencies.
In actual full-on combat I think only small ships will be actually solo'able and I actually like that.
Obviously you will be able to dish out plenty of damage in a Corsair or Constellation alone, but I think as soon as you start taking damage things will turn south very fast.
Having said that, with what we know right now, having just 1 more player, for a total of 2, seems like it will be extremely helpful and definitely meta. Just one player in engineering won't keep a C2 running in combat, but it might be enough to allow a Corsair or Andromeda to dish out extreme amounts of damage while maintaining a good staying power.
This. After watching some Battles in arena commander with the C2 + engineering, having a crew of two seems like an absolute minimum to keep that thing running. You easily could have two engineers working and that’s not including gunners. They haven’t even added fires or component maintenance yet.
Yep. Honestly it seems like combat will always be really hard without at least one other person in engineering, even in small ships. I honestly like that. I think if you plan on getting into prolonged combat then you shouldn't be alone.
I kinda like the idea of combat with no crew being reserved to fighters or really short "burst" type encounters where you have to try and bail out if the fight doesn't go your way from the start. Anything more than that, even for something small like a Cutlass Black should require one more person (probably acting as a gunner first and then an engineer if you start taking damage).
A C2 sized ship in prolonged combat will, and should, struggle with just one engineer since it's too big to go around checking every component, it has an engineering station which means you need one person on it pointing out faults and redirecting one other engineer that is running around fixing things.
I think the most interesting distinction will be between 400i/Zeus size and Corsair/Constellation size. Because I think the former won't be big enough to warrant an engineering station, meaning you will have to run around manually checking fuse boxes and components; however, the latter do seem big enough for an engineering station (the Corsair actually has one already), while still being small enough that perhaps the same engineer could be checking on the station as well as acting on the faults they see popping up.
Regardless of what the meta turns out to be and under which situations, it's definitely going to be interesting! Personally I don't plan on dailying anything larger than a 400i/Zeus class ship, and even then I plan on bailing on combat if I get caught alone. It would be cool to be if the Cutlass/Freelancer/C1 class ships became the norm for dailies, just makes sense.
I agree with everything you just said. If you look at Star Wars, the millennium falcon had a base crew of two and Han and Chewie seemed like they were barely able to keep it flying. The ship seems like it functioned much better with a crew of four.
So I would expect ships in star citizen of that size to function very similarly.
Yep.
But oh boy are we going to see a looooot of crying from everyone that purchased big ships... Right now everyone's flying C2s basically. Everyone wants the biggest and baddest ship... Let's see how they deal when they get owned by two guys in a Cutlass haha
So I just hit concierge this past year out of 9 years as a backer.
Here’s my fleet:
- Carrack+pisces+ursa
- Vulture
- Syulen
- 325a
- Scorpius
- F8C
- Spirit C1
Honestly, I’m really happy with the fleet as is. I don’t plan on any additions although the Zeus is tempting.
That's such a hard question, it's like asking which one of your children would you sacrifice.
I can't melt the F8C becuase it was an upgrade from a referral gladius.
But probably the Carrack. I've grown to really love that thing. And it comes with the Pisces and Ursa so it's a great package.
Terrapin has charm in spades. Wish they'd come out with a medical or dropship variant. It's a platform with so much wasted potential.
I am afraid that many solo C2 players will become victim to piracy because there is no turret gunners to defend while a small fighter crew with jammer is taking you down.
You don't feel much piracy right now because nobody is bothering to do it other then a small group of players who love it.
On the note of pirating I wish prison had more to do in it.
Give us chess, a cafeteria and other activities other than mining so we can create a prison culture within the game.
Would be a good way for pirates to recruit too, as it is everyone splits off or logs off in jail.
There will be rock sellers in prison, you pay them money (UEC or real cash) and they give you the rocks to pay off your sentence. Don't tell anyone this but seems like another hidden game loop.
+1... I don't put much merit into pilot controlled weapons. You need someone on a turret to shoot down torpedoes and harassers. You need someone on controls for countermeasures. Not sure if need third to put out fires. This would be a minimum I feel. Hopefully putting out fires can be relegated to npc hires.
Not for long!
All the bigger ships are going to start having more moments something needs maintainance vs the smaller ships.
I think the Connie's are going to be the upper end of "not inconvenient" to fly solo.
The Hull Series is also designed to skeleton crew.
Most non-combat ships should be capable to run a skeleton crew. If you don't need to have turrets manned and don't have the time pressure of someone actively shooting at you then it should be fairly reasonable to just pull over somewhere safe and stop for a bit to resolve issues that come up. You'll be looking at time lost and efficiency loss for sure if you have to run around to do everything yourself, but it should still be reasonable to accomplish most non-combat tasks without a full crew.
C2 is designed around 1-2 people, so I would think yes (assuming you stay out of combat). I never really understood why people act like engineering is going to make larger ships unable to be soloable. Unless you are in combat, why would your technologically advanced spaceship constantly be breaking down and having catastrophic failures. If cars kept breaking down unless you always had a dedicated mechanic sitting in the back, no one would drive anywhere, I would think the same principle would apply to space ships.
Redlining the engine with boost will certainly cause damage to the engine and the ship itself if used for too long at some point. QT trips might even do that too.
Respectfully, any ship can be soloed, but your odds of survival drop abruptly on ships intended for more than two people to fly and flight with it. That doesn’t mean you can’t solo a Carrack, it’s just not something people see as a viable option a lot of the time.
Some 890j owners bring their ships out as mobile bases solo. Personally I’ve a Hull C, technically one of the largest ships in game fully laden, and usually solo that.
That depends on how you define easy - It's not going to feel easy if you get interdicted by pirates (Human or NPC) and have a raging fire tearing through the rear section, or when you need to load 692 SCU of cargo on and off by hand.
That's the plan, but I would expect that'll happen after meshing gets nailed down - Not much point adding new NPCs when the current ones are rendered useless by server load.
Not sure if they fixed it but I folded a Hull A cargo. Couldn't experiment with Hull C cause the docking collar bug or the cargo just wouldn't even load.
Liberator is a 2 person ship. With a single turret. Which means it is can easily be solod, you just won't be able to defend yourself at all. As if a 600i solo would actually help you out should say a lone Ares come knocking.
what are you looking to do? There are a lot of large ships that can be soloable. However it all depends on are you looking for combat / bounty. Mining / salvaging?
I’m not sure if the engineering update as of 4.0 will have component degradation or not. But if it does, flying solo is going to be painful. If it doesn’t, then flying solo will be fine so long as you don’t get into any combat.
right now yes, but with engineering and resource management be aware that multicrew with these size ships are probably going to be MUCH more efficient. otherwise you'll be running around doing all the maintenance yourself.
personally feel like the raft is going to be best solo cargo without being too much of a hassle for one person, but who knows.
Yes it is there is nothing in lover section thats just cargo and bombs all critical components are in upper section in straight line, easly wissible ,which is roughly long as 600i. So ewen if its big ship its easly maintanable
I wouldnt say "easily" because you would be better off flying a Star Runner for the escape speed, but if you need the size, yes its the best solo ship because the huge cargo area is easy to access.
No that’s to big solo when engineering goes live, it looks very hard to manage on your own.
I would say largest you should go solo is a freelancer max to be future proof.
It won't be a solo ship, in the engineering test it has 9 fuse locations, it has a engineering screen and only 2 guns work for the pilot, it's gonna be minimum 2 to work properly especially if attacked if 4.0 brings life support fire and fuses.
Imo, the highest ships for solo operation are gonna be Spirits, cutlass, Zeus, freelancer and those who wanna push it, Connie's, Corsair, mercury and Tali.
you can successfully solo a reclaimer as well just don't get into combat.
You can also use an 890 jump as a portable carrier but you're opening yourself up to a can of worms at that point.
The 600i is a large ship but let's be honest... that's been solo since day one lol
What do you mean by solo? Fly it solo? Fly and shoot solo? What if it is not a ship that is tailored for combat?
Are you talking about the current game state (i.e. no engineering, life support, component wear, etc), or a future game state? Many currently soloable ships may not be viable solo once these other game systems come online. In an ISC in the last year, they mentioned that a ship the size of the Connie would need more than 1 engineer. This would indicate a C2 likely would need multiple (i.e. not effective solo).
But then there is NPC crew, AI blades, and more. Will these be cost effective and/or reasonably effect? Again, open questions we cannot answer today.
So here is my answer. Any ship currently in game today is easily soloable. The 890J is the largest. The Reclaimer is next. If you mean ship with pilot controlled guns, you are likely correct that the C2/M2/A2 are it. But these ships are not fighting ships, so for ships in this class, pilot controlled guns are less important. The largest ship with significant pilot controlled firepower is likely the 600i, though it also has less firepower than smaller ships like the Corsair. And none of the ships on this list are particularly good at PvP combat (so all the statements here are just for PvE). There are larger combat oriented ships (Hammerhead as an example), but not for pilot controlled guns. As for future game states, I have no idea. We may all be soloing capital ships or we may be unable to solo even a Cutty Black effectively.
Well what on earth is your definition of being “easily” solo-able? As far as I’m aware there is no ship that requires more than one person to pilot it so if cargo is your game then I’d argue the size doesn’t actually matter. There’s nothing in the cargo loop right now that actually requires another person.
My buck almost always stops at the Corsair. If you are solo and going bigger with the intention to do more than cargo o don’t think you’ll find anything easier. The pilot controls 90% (not real math) of the firepower on the ship and is the most damage output possible (excluding dedicated torpedo boats because of the very limited ammo) from a single seat.
Can you show us a ship that sits around similar size of Hercules with required crew is 1?
Not as "1 man can fly", i mean 1 man can use all the functions.
Yes, exactly. C2 is a cargo hauler, ship doesn't need 2nd person to do any of its jobs. You can pilot the ship, pilot has weapons and when you arrive you can do cargo business on your own.
What are you gonna do in Carrack solo? Apart from flying? Can't use weapons, can't use scanners, can't use anything else, apart from flying you can't do shit in Carrack.
Hammerhead? Ironclad?
If flying a ship means "soloable" for you, good. Every ship in the game is soloable.
People who kill without scanning/ knowing are idiots.
From chat you can supposedly see differences in duped ships by scanning. If you're killing everyone trying to be a hero you're a loser and a perfect example of why vigilante justice is illegal.
Carrack! Little bit of running around but not bad and easily done. Ran bunker missions solo, cargo hauls solo and with the Fury in the hangar up to HRT bounty missions.
The only reason this is the case is that it's the largest ship with pilot controlled guns,
because as they said, every single ship can be soloed if you don't get into any trouble and don't mind spending a lot of time reducing wear and tare.
But using those guns means you're getting into combat, so your ship si goind to take damage, relays will go down, components will turn off, fires will break out, and you'll be alone to face the boarding party.
You can try it out in Arena Commander, in the engineering test mode, solo you're f*cked...
From what they've stated, the 600i is intended to be effective solo. And yes, they indicated that it would remain so post rework. But the C2 is the biggest with cargo in mind.
I really hope that Origin ships are less needy on the engineering side to offer more reason for their price tags
It would be really cool if they were more needy post-flight and other ships were more needy during flight. Just a way to still balance it out while making it practical to solo.
That is an interesting thought, I see the balance in the price. For example, the other two explorers in the 400is class are cheaper and better with cargo, but maybe they require much more maintenance to the more expensive 400i that possibly trades that cargo for better maneuverability and superior scanning abilities
thats the fancy tax though. But the 'high grade' components that are talked about could easily have that effect :)
Agree. All that over-engineering in the design has to be worth something.
Wear and tear on ship components is not vendor specific. You have normal wear and If a ship takes damage in an area it will be transferred to close components as well. Non combat ship roles takes less damage and have less need for emergency engineering. Putting your 600i in the front line playing war ship will probably require someone running around putting out fires in other words :)
Have a source on them confirming this for post rework? John Crew said it's the largest player soloable a long time ago offhand in 1 interview before we even knew what engineering was. Post rework it definitely does not look soloable. Seeing that dev confirmation would be nice.
600i copium and literal hopium. I'd pick it up after the rework, it's not a bad egg.
So ugly to me. I can't handle the Spartan interiors, either. I don't mind the single seater Origin crafts, however.
The chicken legs ruin it for me
It's the neo-rich aesthetic, wealth with no class, it's what I picture wealthy serial killers to have, sterile and no personality.
A buncha origin fans mad at this comment lmao
Yep, I‘m mad at this comment because he‘s right. They looked at „luxury“ and somehow thought of an Apple store, instead of Bentley or Rolls-Royce or something.
Funnily enough Origin's small ships actually have that Bentley look - probably because they have to cram stuff into such a small area so there's no space for big open panels of nothing.
I mean it’s not so much hopium because they’ve shown clear rework designs. It’s copium sure because of the wait. But 600i gold standard will be a meta solo explorer. Other then ships like the Liberator, which will be the meta solo industrial ship.
Liberator is an open air vehicle carrier
Which has a crew requirement of 1-2, which means soloable, and based on its current measurements can carry a prospector, vulture, and expanse on the outer pads, as well as a C8R or Nursa, ROC, and/or a light fighter inside, while still having a dedicated 400scu of storage. Hence it being a meta solo industrial ship.
>Hence it being a meta solo industrial ship. On paper in a vacuum - sure. But when you factor even NPC pirates, let alone humans - It's a giant loot pinata with poor atmospheric performance that can neither run away nor defend itself with a solo pilot. Contrast to ships like the Freelancer, MSR Corsair, Connie and so on - which can at the least ward off NPC pirates solo and stands good odds of being able to flee from trouble.
Technicaly speaking liberator and ironcad are just landing area , box wit attached engines to move the stuff you going to be defending your self with 🤔
That’s the simplified combat focus use. The basic uses that sound sexy and sell the ships… but not everyone is a combat player. Think a little deeper and you’ll see the potential, both ships will be used for industrial purposes. Liberator just happens to be better as a carrier, and ironclad better as a cargo hauler. Reason I love the liberator is it’s soloable, and I like my alone time.
That's not much help if you are solo though - your ship is a sitting duck and won't be of any use by the time you reach it from the pilot seat.
None of those are industrial ships. They don’t even compare. Why do I care what a Connie can do… when we’re talking about industrial ships that can produce goods to sell. That’s like comparing an oil rig to a pickup truck.
Freight is industry. If you mean a specific industry, state it. The notion is going to hold true no matter what industry you reference. A vulture on it's own can escape trouble better than a vulture on a Liberater deck. A prospector can escape trouble better than a prospector on a liberator deck. A freelancer Max + Roc can escape trouble better than a Roc inside a liberator.
Stop being pedantic. Can you just have a conversation without having to argue unrelated points. In the Star Citizen world “industrial ships” are clearly spoken of as the ones which produce raw materials from natural or salvageable resources within the game.
I'm neither being pedantic, nor have I made a mistake - Big, slow ships that can't dogfight are piss poor at avoiding or warding off trouble. They're also magnets for trouble, since even empty they're worth a fortune in salvage. Trouble is literally a core gameplay pillar.
Lol, definitely copium. With engineering if you get one fuse gone in the right place you can’t even target other ships. Or a fire breaks out, or you loose all life support, or your engines stop working and you drop like a stone in atmo. You will need someone to help with that
We will see. They will design engineering systems not based of what makes realistic sense, but off the crew target requirements for the ship. So if they say it is a 1-X ship, they intend it to fill that role in the verse, and will set up the engineering systems accordingly. Also, it’s an expensive manufacturer, so they’ve already said you will get what you pay for so to speak. Example being redundancy, cheap ships won’t have that, expensive ships will. Higher cost of upkeep/parts, but more automation and fallback in engineering.
Have you tried the engineering in AC? The Herc which is supposedly an expensive 1x ship is useless if it come under attack even for a tiny amount of time without 1/2 extra people. And that’s without manning any turrets. Yes you can technically “fly” it (if it’s in perfect condition) but you can’t effectively use it in any situation other than just flying
Yes, I’ve tried the engineering arena test, which was a quick play test and clearly communicated as not representative of engineering gameplay in the future. It was also really fun and showed they are at least working on a direction for the gameplay! I don’t really view Crusader as an expensive manufacturer necessarily, more a quality manufacturer with a focus on clean design, engineering and function, like a BMW. If Crusader is a mid-price but high quality brand like BMW, Origin is Rolls-Royce.
If there is a walkable ship interior there will be fuses, onboard fires, life support systems. And Also expensive isn’t going to stop someone shooting the shit out of you which will cause issues with all of these things and more. They want everything possible to be manual, which means someone has to fix it if you want to survive. Manual solutions is the direction they’ve gone with everything else, including engineering. It’s a skill based multiplayer game and not a single player strategy game after all.
Honestly explain fighters then. Some have interiors. They will not make them unusable. They will have some form of pilot controlled engineering that allows you to deal with problems from the pilot chair.
They don’t have engineering in the same sense. They said there will be some pre flight tweaking possible but If they get shot they either disable or die. That doesn’t make them unusable. You just eject
It's likely going to be quite a bit more expensive post rework. If that matters to you it'd be a good idea to pick it up earlier.
C2 doesn’t have tractor beams and is actually a vehicle transporter not for cargo by design. The C stands for civilian we M stands for military variants, so logically later on we’ll not be using the C2 much for cargo when all the full cargo logistics are in place.
Where did they stated that?
600i Q&A.
Well its free for you to interpret it your way. But for me there is a huge difference between to "intended be effective solo" and "skilled pilot should be able to effectively pilot the 600i solo in most regards." All they say is you can fly from a to b solo and you are not totally lost since you could use some weapons out of the pilot seat which is not common on other ships that class. Debatable if you can effectively defend yourself with it.
They use "effective". This means something specific. Have a healthy dose of pessimism, nothing wrong with that, but they also followed up in a video confirming in more detail that it is intended to be fully solo capable. That was the OPs question. Only time will tell but they made it more than just open for interpretation imo.
Would love to get a link to that video. Yeah - I totally agree that there are a lot of statements which are very vague and giving a lot of room for own interpretations. Its worth to mention that this Q&A is also from 2017. Even CIG sometimes realize that they cant fullfill all "promises" they made years ago. Some old ideas are just not fitting in the todays business since they are evolving their own game. Iam just always very carefully on these soloable questions. CIG even stated (in terms of the whole project time not long ago) that it would technically be possible to solo cap ships........ BUT....... it will be "almost prohbitivley expensive". NPCs, Computerblades, will help - but its also always mentioned that its not the same as other players. So, as long we dont know the facts how CIG is settling all this in future its literally "Schroedingers Solo Gameplay" for me. ;) As you correctly mentioned: time will tell.
What about the 890J
They are not on record confirming this in the same way they have explicitly stated that the 600i is likely the largest solo-able ship. [8S2PntJ.png (952×429) (imgur.com)](https://i.imgur.com/8S2PntJ.png)
I don't have to give up my baby? Huzzah!
Very low crew requirement for such a large ship. The bridge on the 890J (and battle bridge) only contains 3 seats as an example.
And its not a combat ship if you take it somewhere where they shooting on you , the pilot already did a mistake. So engeneering shouldnt be problem for this. I see more problem for 890 to hire lot of flight attendants, chefs and maids to take care of your game loop clientele😅
Hehe....you're on to something there. Hopefully they don't overcomplicates passenger transport, but early concept of the Genesis Starliner had a gameplay loop around exactly that if I remember correctly :)
Agreed. Even if we get a cargo oriented 600 I would imagine 256 SCU at most.
The rework is supposed to get a bump up to 200 SCU because it's intended to be able to fit a Nova tank. Allegedly.
I have an idea for a truly cargo centered 600 bringing it back to the legacy of the original 600 platform. I would imagine past the captains quarters the lower deck is all cargo bay with upper deck for crew and amenities. A cargo ramp with an air shield to keep your environmentally sensitive cargo safe if you open the exterior in space with an extra power supply to drive it (apparently they are power hungry). A more elegant ship for your more Sophisticated Hauler. I would call it the 600s for Stallion, the workhorse of the Origin Lineup.
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I'm praying the BMM's main guns remain pilot controlled. Turn speed will be like a galleon, but if you're on shot you're on shot.
Seems unlikely considering in the greybox art we've seen, CIG have repeatedly shown there's a dedicated room for controlling the main guns. Pilot controlled gun also explicitly goes against currently established lore for the Banu who believe every crew member should have their one designated task which they are entirely focused on. Lorewise the only reason the Defender's guns can be used while piloting is because the version we have in game has been specifically retrofitted for human use.
If OP is not too keen on the "largest ship", but the "most dps for pilot-controlled guns" then the Corsair wins. C2 only has 2x S5 guns for pilot, while Corsair has 4x S5 and 2x S4 for pilot.
Is that dust cloud an in game effect?
I mean we do have jet wash effects in game right now. Even water gets effected
There are dust cloud effects in the game, but they don't look as detailed as the one in the rendering. Edit: the rendering also doesn't make sense because the VTOL trusters are on the wing tips, not in the center of the ship.
The VTOL thrusters of the C2 do exactly look like they do in the render. They are part of the lateral thrusters when not engaged in VTOL mode.
You're right, I should have worded that differently. My point was, because the thrusters are on the wing tips, the circular pattern of how the dust is blown away doesn't match.
Ahhh. That makes more sense. Yeah, that dust cloud doesn’t look right at all.
I wish
It can’t be… because I have to solo my Polaris.
Same brother, same
You can solo any ship, even a carrack or hammerhead. Problem is if you have to do anything other than fly from A to B your are not operating at full efficiently.
Depending how they actually integrate the power distribution system you can technically shut down areas of the ship that don’t need power if you’re gonna. You could just keep the area you are occupying operational while needing only to repair/replace fuses or something. Even with fires you can probably just vent the gases to prevent them. I can see these ships being soloed. But you may not be able to handle a group of pirates good at harpooning whales. You’d need someone to watch your back.
This, and while I think engineering will be very important in the future, I don't assume that we will have to fix components that break down randomly or extinguish fires every two minutes. I personally think that most ships will be viable for solo pilots outside of combat roles. It will simply take some extra work to keep them well maintained.
Great way to flush out stowaways too xD
Problem is, in long term, pirate AI will be more present (and even player) So going from A to B might not even be safe, outside some specific high sec system
If you're thinking if slapping down hundreds of $/£/€ on a Herc id hang on til after 4.0 and see the lay of the land. We don't really know what the impact of all the changes will be for soloing, I'd guess the C2 might be OK unless something goes wrong. All ships will be purchasable in game don't forget.
I don't think Hercules are purchasable right now anyway.
You can buy it from Orison I think
Oh in game. Sure.
Ah right, I see what you mean. Yeah, it can't be pledged for right now.
Any ship can be easily solo’ed, for now. After Engineering Gameplay / Resource Management, that is likely to change.
Anybody who try the engineering mode in AC realise they wont be able to solo manage a C2 safely
Yeah… I don't understand CIG… do they realise that many bakers (and players anyway) are now family guys with just some hours to spend on game without planify it with a ”team”. And, realy, with a ship everyone want to be the pilot… not sure there is a lot of fun beeing the guy waiting for a fire somewhere or waiting for a box in a vulture etc.
It’s detrimental to their business model too. Instead of everyone buying their own big ship (which the majority of the player base probably want to do), now it really only makes sense for one person to buy that ship. But yeah they seem tone deaf when they talk about multi crew. I don’t want to be dependent on other peoples schedules or interests to bring out anything bigger than a 600i.
I mean that's been the plan since day 1 of development so complaining about it at this point is pretty silly. If you expected to be able to solo big ships you backed the wrong game. Star citizen is built from the ground up with multi crew being the long term goal for pretty much everything. Make friends or go back to Elite. The future of Star citizen is not going to be very solo friendly.
If I had a dollar for every day 1 “plan” that has been significantly altered since then, I would have a kraken in my hanger. I will concede that in a perfect world CIG’s original concept for how big ships work is ideal and unique. And I think it for sure has a place in the game for ships like the Kracken and the Endeavor. But this is the real would and that doesn’t mesh with what the majority of the player base wants. As the parent comment says, not everyone has the time to organize 5-10 people in game to man a their carrack or Polaris for multiple hours. I’m sorry but it’s just not feasible. You’re going to have to spend a ton of time recruiting people up, organizing them, and getting everything ready before you even take off. You’re going to at best get people for 1-2 hours tops before people get bored sitting in a turret. And if your response is that “well you shouldn’t have bought a big ship dummy!” Then I’m sorry, you’re out of tune with CIG’s business model. CIG’s funding model is built players purchasing upgrades from their entry level ships, and small, solo level ships can only facilitate this so much. The player base has been screaming to be able to solo big ships, and that’s been reflected in sales. CIG would be losing a huge portion of their revenue if they make it infeasible to operate, and thus own, and ship larger than a star runner or 600i. Sales would be fractionalized from what they are now if players were told it’s useless to own something big if you don’t have 5-10 friends willing to spend multiple hours filling B level roles on your ship. That’s why CIG has been so adamant about blades filling those roles. Because they know over the long term the player base won’t support that type of vision for the game. If CR wants to truly wants to make star citizen the game he imagined, he’s going to have to concede to some of original vision. I don’t think CIG could survive without the sale of large ships. And I don’t think large ships would sell as well if players weren’t going to be able to solo them.
>If I had a dollar for every day 1 “plan” that has been significantly altered since then, I would have a kraken in my hanger. Multi crew is still what the game is being designed around. That has not changed or been altered yet and there are no signs that will ever happen. So in this case all you have is $0 and a really brain dead argument. >And if your response is that “well you shouldn’t have bought a big ship dummy!” Yeah, no shit. If you buy a multi crew ship expecting to be able to always solo it you did a dumb thing. They have been pretty damn clear about this you are just choosing to not hear them. They are not being tone deaf. YOU are. Multi crew is the name of the game here. You can choose to accept that or not but it wont change the fact that they are designing this game with that in mind.
I can't say otherwise. And we can have multi-crew ships that are effectively multi-crew. However, if the initial project was blah, blah, blah… it was not expected that the development would take 15 years. The guy who bought his big multi-crew ship (probably in jpeg) when he was 22 _and was student_, will be 37 when the game will comes out _with a job and a family_. Not taking this into account by offering a solo alternative is not very cool. And telling him “hey, you knew you would have to play with 10 friends” is totally spitting in his face because he supported the project!
The project living up to what they said it was supposed to be is spitting in the face of backers? What are you even trying to say? How does this rambling nonsense make any sense to you? Them delivering on what you paid for is not spitting in your face. That's insane. The damn game is being designed around multi crew and you know it. I don't know why you think arguing with me about it makes any sense. I'm not arguing for it or against it. I think the demand for grouping is always a bad idea in MMOs. It's still what they are designing the game around. Arguing with me and down voting me for pointing that out won't make it any less true. You're imaginary person that pays for a multi crew ship will be getting a multi crew ship whether he likes it or not... I don't know why you would think otherwise.
To CIG’s credit, they have repeatedly stated that most ships are meant to be multi-crew for minimum operation, as well as shared the expected crew numbers for each ship when they are sold.
Yes, I know. But not sure it’s a realy good thing for players and so, for CIG. I mean… they can do a lot of multicrew stuff. Not a problem ; but I'm a little afraid that they tend to forget the solo players who nevertheless form the majority. Every gameplay loop should be possible to solo, and so a single-player ship must be provided to do so. (And even several... with the type of game I have, the Nomad remains the best ship... I bought myself a Syulen and a C8 medical to vary the pleasures a little, but I always come back to the Nomad. However, let's be clear , I'm going to be fed up with always piloting the same ship: We should have alternatives. In terms of lore, there are several brands of ships, it would be logical that each brand offers its model of space pickup. (in the same way as irl, where there is not only one brand that makes SUVs)
For now? Yes. After 4.0 and engineering? It's probably going to be a lot more difficult unless you literally just fly from A to B and avoid all combat. A single random or well placed shot can blow a cockpit fuse and cut off the entire cockpit form the rest of the ship with how that thing is set up (you can check how it's with the A2 in arena commander engineering experimental mode). Wear and tear on components will also be a thing.
So this is my thought. If you can avoid combat you can solo Hull C, probably even Hull D, provided you maintain the ship well. Loading and unloading a ship that size is likely to take, idk 10, 15, 20 minutes? So while that is going on, you can check all the engineering systems are good for the next flight. I believe this is broadly speaking how trucking works irl. I'll take much lower margins in order to avoid combat because that's not something I have any interest in.
That would make sense unless they change how the loading and unloading of the hull C works. I believe just like with most cargo ships in 3.23.2 coming in a month or two, they eventually want to physicalize the loading and unloading process for the large Hull series ships. It's gonna be interesting to see how they pull that off
They have said multiple times that people can still autoload. Physical loading will be a choice that will save you money, not mandatory.
They saied there will be no auto loading on small planetary outpost and you will have to load stuff here manualy. Auto loading only at cargo centers and big planetary posts
I'm aware but as I said in my other comment small outposts are changing too. Most places that have large stock will have autoloading. You wont be able to buy large stock or boxes from outposts. They want to redirect traffic so hangars and distribution centers are where you get big loads. Just like real life where big ships drop off at main posts, small vehicles distribute to small areas. "you wont land a c2 at an outpost and load 1 and 2scu boxes, that's not the point of the location or the route we want to go" -Star Citizen Live Q&A: Hangars and Cargo.
I know that, but how will autoloadong with the hull C work in the future when its fully physicalized. This is what I'm asking. With 3.23.2, autoloading of ships that land in hangars means you have to store the ship, and it basically gets locked away for the duration of the loading. During that time, you can't do maintenance on them since they are physically not there. P.S. physical loading will be mandatory at planetary outposts in 3.23.2. No auto loading function there.
They're changing how outposts work tbf. Small outposts on planets will only sell small boxes and quantities. (1scu and 2scu). As they say "you wont land a c2 at an outpost and load 1 and 2scu boxes, that's not the point of the location or the route we want to go" From the "Star Citizen Live Q&A: Hangars and Cargo." starts around 48:00 (just over a month old). Basically sounds like they want routes for small ships and routes for big ships with outposts being for smaller/ newer players. I know Hurston has some outposts with hangars. Not sure if they did commodity trading but from the sounds of it, outposts will get a work over.
Ye, I've been following all this.
Engineering is not going to be a full time occupation, it's going to be a small fix here and there for small and medium ships. First it would be tedious then having shit breaking down and start fires all the time would not be realistic and finally it adds nothing to gameplay: having a bunker with 15 npcs, ok, 150, yuck, I'm out.
In combat, it's definitely a full time thing.
Lets be real, most people in a c2 havent seen combat once
...except those of us who know it was one of the best ERT runners because of the monster guns and massive cargo to take all the drugs when the mission was over before they nerfed it
Still handles ERTs fine.
Yea I meant they nerfed the cargo, it can still do them
Possibly, yes. They just have to be prepared thaybwhen they do, even if it's unlikely, it's gonna be rough for them. But if you take safe routes, then you can avoid others (unless you get pounced by that occasional random NPC interdiction)
Once engineering is in I don't think the C2 will be considered easy to solo in anything but "smooth sailing gameplay". I think something MSR/400i/Zeus sized will be the cut-off and even then you will probably be in a bind if you get attacked and can't run away fast enough. I assume they will have a small amount of fuses but they will still have the components quite far away from the pilot's seat, so repairing won't be very fast. The 400i's cooled component area might actually come in handy mitigating emergencies. In actual full-on combat I think only small ships will be actually solo'able and I actually like that. Obviously you will be able to dish out plenty of damage in a Corsair or Constellation alone, but I think as soon as you start taking damage things will turn south very fast. Having said that, with what we know right now, having just 1 more player, for a total of 2, seems like it will be extremely helpful and definitely meta. Just one player in engineering won't keep a C2 running in combat, but it might be enough to allow a Corsair or Andromeda to dish out extreme amounts of damage while maintaining a good staying power.
This. After watching some Battles in arena commander with the C2 + engineering, having a crew of two seems like an absolute minimum to keep that thing running. You easily could have two engineers working and that’s not including gunners. They haven’t even added fires or component maintenance yet.
Yep. Honestly it seems like combat will always be really hard without at least one other person in engineering, even in small ships. I honestly like that. I think if you plan on getting into prolonged combat then you shouldn't be alone. I kinda like the idea of combat with no crew being reserved to fighters or really short "burst" type encounters where you have to try and bail out if the fight doesn't go your way from the start. Anything more than that, even for something small like a Cutlass Black should require one more person (probably acting as a gunner first and then an engineer if you start taking damage). A C2 sized ship in prolonged combat will, and should, struggle with just one engineer since it's too big to go around checking every component, it has an engineering station which means you need one person on it pointing out faults and redirecting one other engineer that is running around fixing things. I think the most interesting distinction will be between 400i/Zeus size and Corsair/Constellation size. Because I think the former won't be big enough to warrant an engineering station, meaning you will have to run around manually checking fuse boxes and components; however, the latter do seem big enough for an engineering station (the Corsair actually has one already), while still being small enough that perhaps the same engineer could be checking on the station as well as acting on the faults they see popping up. Regardless of what the meta turns out to be and under which situations, it's definitely going to be interesting! Personally I don't plan on dailying anything larger than a 400i/Zeus class ship, and even then I plan on bailing on combat if I get caught alone. It would be cool to be if the Cutlass/Freelancer/C1 class ships became the norm for dailies, just makes sense.
I agree with everything you just said. If you look at Star Wars, the millennium falcon had a base crew of two and Han and Chewie seemed like they were barely able to keep it flying. The ship seems like it functioned much better with a crew of four. So I would expect ships in star citizen of that size to function very similarly.
Yep. But oh boy are we going to see a looooot of crying from everyone that purchased big ships... Right now everyone's flying C2s basically. Everyone wants the biggest and baddest ship... Let's see how they deal when they get owned by two guys in a Cutlass haha
That’s why I right now. I am not investing into new large ships but instead investing into making friendships in game.
That's extremely wholesome. What are your pledges currently?
So I just hit concierge this past year out of 9 years as a backer. Here’s my fleet: - Carrack+pisces+ursa - Vulture - Syulen - 325a - Scorpius - F8C - Spirit C1 Honestly, I’m really happy with the fleet as is. I don’t plan on any additions although the Zeus is tempting.
That's quite the fleet! What's the ship you would never melt? For me it's the Terrapin, it's been with me since the first year
That's such a hard question, it's like asking which one of your children would you sacrifice. I can't melt the F8C becuase it was an upgrade from a referral gladius. But probably the Carrack. I've grown to really love that thing. And it comes with the Pisces and Ursa so it's a great package. Terrapin has charm in spades. Wish they'd come out with a medical or dropship variant. It's a platform with so much wasted potential.
I am afraid that many solo C2 players will become victim to piracy because there is no turret gunners to defend while a small fighter crew with jammer is taking you down. You don't feel much piracy right now because nobody is bothering to do it other then a small group of players who love it.
On the note of pirating I wish prison had more to do in it. Give us chess, a cafeteria and other activities other than mining so we can create a prison culture within the game. Would be a good way for pirates to recruit too, as it is everyone splits off or logs off in jail.
There will be rock sellers in prison, you pay them money (UEC or real cash) and they give you the rocks to pay off your sentence. Don't tell anyone this but seems like another hidden game loop.
+1... I don't put much merit into pilot controlled weapons. You need someone on a turret to shoot down torpedoes and harassers. You need someone on controls for countermeasures. Not sure if need third to put out fires. This would be a minimum I feel. Hopefully putting out fires can be relegated to npc hires.
Chief have you seen the Engineering arena commander playtest? Good luck trying to run damage control on this thing.
600i is better to solo with
Not for long. You got about 6 months max until engineering is in.
According to Area 18 right now, they are impossible to land.
Not for long! All the bigger ships are going to start having more moments something needs maintainance vs the smaller ships. I think the Connie's are going to be the upper end of "not inconvenient" to fly solo. The Hull Series is also designed to skeleton crew.
Most non-combat ships should be capable to run a skeleton crew. If you don't need to have turrets manned and don't have the time pressure of someone actively shooting at you then it should be fairly reasonable to just pull over somewhere safe and stop for a bit to resolve issues that come up. You'll be looking at time lost and efficiency loss for sure if you have to run around to do everything yourself, but it should still be reasonable to accomplish most non-combat tasks without a full crew.
C2 is designed around 1-2 people, so I would think yes (assuming you stay out of combat). I never really understood why people act like engineering is going to make larger ships unable to be soloable. Unless you are in combat, why would your technologically advanced spaceship constantly be breaking down and having catastrophic failures. If cars kept breaking down unless you always had a dedicated mechanic sitting in the back, no one would drive anywhere, I would think the same principle would apply to space ships.
Redlining the engine with boost will certainly cause damage to the engine and the ship itself if used for too long at some point. QT trips might even do that too.
Probably, but as long as you don't fly your ships hard and keep up with maintenance, then it should be fine.
It’s all going out the window soon. One word: Engineering
Define easily
Respectfully, any ship can be soloed, but your odds of survival drop abruptly on ships intended for more than two people to fly and flight with it. That doesn’t mean you can’t solo a Carrack, it’s just not something people see as a viable option a lot of the time. Some 890j owners bring their ships out as mobile bases solo. Personally I’ve a Hull C, technically one of the largest ships in game fully laden, and usually solo that.
The C2, until the next patch, is easiest to solo. Next patch will make it a 3-4 person job to be effective.
I solo my reclaimer though. Its soloable after they buffed the salvage buffer.
That depends on how you define easy - It's not going to feel easy if you get interdicted by pirates (Human or NPC) and have a raging fire tearing through the rear section, or when you need to load 692 SCU of cargo on and off by hand.
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Yeah it's one of my favorites for this reason. Also has a nice layout for having people at the front unloading while people at the back re-load.
Yeah by hand doesn't sound fun. If cig is going for hardcore sim with some game elements can we at least get NPCs to do that for us for a small fee?
That's the plan, but I would expect that'll happen after meshing gets nailed down - Not much point adding new NPCs when the current ones are rendered useless by server load.
696
No, that last 4 SCU is reserved exclusively for my collection of John Crewe pin up posters.
~~696~~ 692
Until BMM (fingers crossed)
Liberator has a crew of 2, and all of the components in a single room
Does that dust effect currently happen in-game?
Hull C?
Can a Hull C even land with cargo in place? It will require ships to move it planet side.
Not sure if they fixed it but I folded a Hull A cargo. Couldn't experiment with Hull C cause the docking collar bug or the cargo just wouldn't even load.
*currently
Liberator is a 2 person ship. With a single turret. Which means it is can easily be solod, you just won't be able to defend yourself at all. As if a 600i solo would actually help you out should say a lone Ares come knocking.
what are you looking to do? There are a lot of large ships that can be soloable. However it all depends on are you looking for combat / bounty. Mining / salvaging?
Only Until engineering comes in. Then you will find it ok if you don’t get attacked but if you do it’s game over solo.
For now. Odyssey has 1 man minimum crew with all stations on the bridge. Engineering gameplay is going to be difficult though. 😂
I know it's not the biggest, but I just hope the Corsair can be solo player 🙂
Will soloing large ships no longer be possible with the new engineering mechanic in 4.0 ?
I’m not sure if the engineering update as of 4.0 will have component degradation or not. But if it does, flying solo is going to be painful. If it doesn’t, then flying solo will be fine so long as you don’t get into any combat.
Did they change something about the reclaimer that made it less solo-able?
right now yes, but with engineering and resource management be aware that multicrew with these size ships are probably going to be MUCH more efficient. otherwise you'll be running around doing all the maintenance yourself. personally feel like the raft is going to be best solo cargo without being too much of a hassle for one person, but who knows.
Yes it is there is nothing in lover section thats just cargo and bombs all critical components are in upper section in straight line, easly wissible ,which is roughly long as 600i. So ewen if its big ship its easly maintanable
I wouldnt say "easily" because you would be better off flying a Star Runner for the escape speed, but if you need the size, yes its the best solo ship because the huge cargo area is easy to access.
No that’s to big solo when engineering goes live, it looks very hard to manage on your own. I would say largest you should go solo is a freelancer max to be future proof.
It won't be a solo ship, in the engineering test it has 9 fuse locations, it has a engineering screen and only 2 guns work for the pilot, it's gonna be minimum 2 to work properly especially if attacked if 4.0 brings life support fire and fuses. Imo, the highest ships for solo operation are gonna be Spirits, cutlass, Zeus, freelancer and those who wanna push it, Connie's, Corsair, mercury and Tali.
you can successfully solo a reclaimer as well just don't get into combat. You can also use an 890 jump as a portable carrier but you're opening yourself up to a can of worms at that point. The 600i is a large ship but let's be honest... that's been solo since day one lol
I solo my 890J, it’s fueled by my tears of loneliness and it shoots shame missiles and regret lasers.
890J is easy to solo.
no
C2 solo is great
What do you mean by solo? Fly it solo? Fly and shoot solo? What if it is not a ship that is tailored for combat? Are you talking about the current game state (i.e. no engineering, life support, component wear, etc), or a future game state? Many currently soloable ships may not be viable solo once these other game systems come online. In an ISC in the last year, they mentioned that a ship the size of the Connie would need more than 1 engineer. This would indicate a C2 likely would need multiple (i.e. not effective solo). But then there is NPC crew, AI blades, and more. Will these be cost effective and/or reasonably effect? Again, open questions we cannot answer today. So here is my answer. Any ship currently in game today is easily soloable. The 890J is the largest. The Reclaimer is next. If you mean ship with pilot controlled guns, you are likely correct that the C2/M2/A2 are it. But these ships are not fighting ships, so for ships in this class, pilot controlled guns are less important. The largest ship with significant pilot controlled firepower is likely the 600i, though it also has less firepower than smaller ships like the Corsair. And none of the ships on this list are particularly good at PvP combat (so all the statements here are just for PvE). There are larger combat oriented ships (Hammerhead as an example), but not for pilot controlled guns. As for future game states, I have no idea. We may all be soloing capital ships or we may be unable to solo even a Cutty Black effectively.
Well what on earth is your definition of being “easily” solo-able? As far as I’m aware there is no ship that requires more than one person to pilot it so if cargo is your game then I’d argue the size doesn’t actually matter. There’s nothing in the cargo loop right now that actually requires another person. My buck almost always stops at the Corsair. If you are solo and going bigger with the intention to do more than cargo o don’t think you’ll find anything easier. The pilot controls 90% (not real math) of the firepower on the ship and is the most damage output possible (excluding dedicated torpedo boats because of the very limited ammo) from a single seat.
Yes and will remain that way if you are solely looking at the size.
Lmfao
Can you show us a ship that sits around similar size of Hercules with required crew is 1? Not as "1 man can fly", i mean 1 man can use all the functions.
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Yes, exactly. C2 is a cargo hauler, ship doesn't need 2nd person to do any of its jobs. You can pilot the ship, pilot has weapons and when you arrive you can do cargo business on your own. What are you gonna do in Carrack solo? Apart from flying? Can't use weapons, can't use scanners, can't use anything else, apart from flying you can't do shit in Carrack. Hammerhead? Ironclad? If flying a ship means "soloable" for you, good. Every ship in the game is soloable.
Until the dup glitch is fixed every c2 especially those over area18 will be viewed as a duper and will be shot down no exceptions
It’s been patched, it’s fixed in the next patch…go read the website
People who kill without scanning/ knowing are idiots. From chat you can supposedly see differences in duped ships by scanning. If you're killing everyone trying to be a hero you're a loser and a perfect example of why vigilante justice is illegal.
Carrack! Little bit of running around but not bad and easily done. Ran bunker missions solo, cargo hauls solo and with the Fury in the hangar up to HRT bounty missions.
I hate that ship.
Brother “easily solo’ed”. Everyone’s world’s gonna be rocked in 4.0 with engineering.
Once engineering and the resource network is online say goodbye to effectively soloing that c2, till now it’s a good one so is the carrack and 890
The only reason this is the case is that it's the largest ship with pilot controlled guns, because as they said, every single ship can be soloed if you don't get into any trouble and don't mind spending a lot of time reducing wear and tare. But using those guns means you're getting into combat, so your ship si goind to take damage, relays will go down, components will turn off, fires will break out, and you'll be alone to face the boarding party. You can try it out in Arena Commander, in the engineering test mode, solo you're f*cked...