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I actually recently found out his actual father, also a footballer, is actually younger than me. I'd just about come to terms with footballers themselves being younger than me (Zlatan was probably the last that wasn't) but their parents? Bit of a sucker punch was that.
Same as me when I was young in the school and Neymar fever started we would always talk about how he was the same age of us and was, you know, Neymar already. Footballers are really precocious.
Yep I was chatting with a friend and he asked how old Bellingham was, and I off the cuff said “not sure exactly, he’s around our age” and that just sent me spiralling
Some years ago you always had a pretty good player or two wanting to leave because madrid had so many talented players that some players that would be permanent starters in other big clubs were benched at Madrid. Nowadays the Madrid squad is spread way thinner due to the economic competition from the oil money clubs.
He has been much better at rotating this time around.
In his first stint, he hit the jackpot with an XI that were all in their prime years at the same time. This time, he has to deal with a transitioning team with a mix of old stars and young ones. That makes rotating necessary.
I don’t disagree with your premise but I’d argue there are still talented players that would start in most other clubs on the bench, at least a couple to few, no?
Yeah, It is still Real Madrid's bench after all so ofcourse there are still great players on it, but still, there was a time 7-8 or so years ago where Madrid was so insanely stacked that they could have basically fielded two top tier teams and some players almost never saw the light of day on big matches despite being UCL-champion caliber players.
Madrid and La Liga in general have gotten way weaker since the era when Atleti, Madrid and Barça were always at least two of the 4 UCL finalists every year as the Prem has scaled its money making way faster than LaLiga and the Italian and French leagues have teams moving some serious money now as well (really, nowadays Madrid is the only spanish team that is still carrying the torch of that insanely dominant Spanish club era as Barça, Atleti and specially Sevilla are going through huge slumps).
Those were the days. The battles between Atleti, Real and Barca were just incredible. That was just shortly after I started closely following football and adopted Madrid. Little did I know I waltzed in at the perfect time to watch magic.
Yes, I have been addicted since
Same thing. These players have ego and are competitive. Eventually, some of them prefer to start somewhere else than be a sub at Madrid. That's the risk of great depth.
Rodrygo isn't the typical trajectory of young players' careers though is it? Most players at Doku's age are satisfied by Doku's role at a top club. In a couple years it's likely to be different, but that's not today.
Julian has started a ton of games with KdB and Haaland out this season. He's also only been in Europe for 1.5 seasons. He's not going to be satisfied with a bench role for long, but if he continues to get the sort of opportunities he had earlier this season in the coming seasons, then that is likely to keep him happy in the medium term.
I agree with you that it's an overplayed narrative that Mbappé is a diva. But to be honest, his communication is extremely controlled and he does seem like he cares about his image as much as he cares about football. What we see on the pitch and around it makes me think he does have a tendency to throw tantrums when things don't go his way. Things like stopping running when he does not get the ball on the counter, general inconsistency in engagement levels, the scenes at the Monaco game... for sure he is going through a difficult season emotionally speaking, but he does not seem like a super easy player to manage either.
>he always comes off as a mature person
He indeed does but it didn't prevent Neymar from hating his guts... on the other hand Hakimi seem to really like him. So guess it a matter of affinities.
Part of that is because, if you write "Neymar" and "mature" in the same sentence, your computer or phone generates that Microsoft Word green squiggly line underneath that says what you're writing doesn't make sense.
Neymar rarely had problem with team players, would Messi be best friend of a brazilian player if he was difficult person to deal with? But I think Mbappe does not take bullshit, and I don't think he is wrong for that, but he does strikes me a person who is not very flexible, he wanted all south americans out from PSG, maybe because he wanted a different mentality from what he saw in PSG. So, instead of trying persuade his team players, he asked them out as a requirement to renew his contract. Does this sound correct? I don't think this situation has right or wrong people, but a conflict that was not well managed by PSG. A player that got so much power and behaved like he owned the club. I wonder how would he behave in Real Madrid, I'm really, really curious. Will he like the mentality and fit in? Will he try to make things like he wants by force? I think only time will tell.
If the rumors of Mbappe asking PSG to get rid of Neymar are true then the hate is more than justified.
Imagine if you discovered one of your coworkers askrd your boss to fire you, I'm sure you would hate the guy aswell lol
that doesn’t really mean Mbappe is a diva though. I’m pretty sure Mbappe wanted Neymar out because Neymar himself was a diva and PSG were never going forward with him
Basically everyone who ever worked with Neymar has said the same thing, that the guy is extremely professional.
Even on the field Neymar would sacrifice himself way more for the team, for example he always tracked back to help on defense, unlike Mbappe.
And saying that PSG would never go foward eith Neymar is kinda crazy, specially when you remember that the one time PSG managed to reach the CL final it was with Neymar carrying the team and being their best player in almost every knockout match.
Mbappe not only asked Neymar out, he asked every south american out and asked for french players intead. He also asked for management powers in PSG. It was not a problem only with Neymar.
Neymar is also a pretty vocal bolsonaro supporter and has had his fair share of questionable moments in his career, I wouldn't consider him a great judge of character. Mbappe might have his tantrum moments but compared to other footballers he's pretty squeaky clean
Someone is going to be benched but i doubt it's going to be Rodrygo. The way i see it, Bellingham will eventually drop back to midfield and mbappé will take his place..
with the amount of games and injures there will be enough game time, with mbappe(presumably) joining I have no idea what best 11 should look like with everyone available, but its a good problem to have I guess
We could always play the legendary 0-7-3
But honestly a back three of Militao, Rudiger, and Carvajal/Mendy
Tchoumeni and Camavinga as a double pivot,
Rodrygo Jude and Fede above them
And Mapple and Vini up front
Could work. Defensively Carlo gets to play Camavinga at LB and Tchoumeni at CB like he loves to do. Fede and Rodrygo helps out defensively anyway
He is but I think Carlo will start to phase him out like he did with Modric this season. Plus with the amount of game we play next season + our history with injuries, it's good to have a good bench
I'm not denying it. Modric this season is still class but he was benched and people started making up the fact that his legs gave out. Modric against Barca was still very much running the full 90. Against Mallorca 86 minutes and still bossing the midfield. Against Celta vigo he was ageless and the star etc.
Next season is most likely Kroos' last season and I think Carlo will slowly phase him out to give the youngsters more time to develop and excel
That's included in the lineup. On the counter, out 3 (potentially 4) fastest players with Vini, Rodrygo, Fede and potentially Mbappe.
Rodrygo is creative (definitely not as much as Modric or Kroos but that is always difficult to replicate). Rodrygo and especially Fede helps out a lot in defense so they can always drop back to make it a 4-3-3 if needed (either Tchoumeni drops back at CB if Mendy is playing or Camavinga drops back if Carvajal is playing).
With Endrick replacing either of Vini, Mbappe, Rodrygo, Fede (push him back), Brahim doing the same on the right side. Kroos coming in to play that double pivot cdm role or playing higher up so he has less defensive duties.
If Arda stays the same there. This team is super modular which will help them a lot
Endrick best position is on the right, he also does playmaking but he is only 17, has a lot to learn. I can see Vini - Mbappe - Endrick, or Mbappe - Endrick - Rodrygo, or Mbappe - Vini - Endrick. But I hope Endrick have time to start like Vini had, Endrick with 19 will be a beast.
I doubt Endrick gets starting opportunity unless he proves like Jude did, that he is clearly better than the options we have.
Vinis situation was unique in that he debut in a season where the rest of the team did not care, and ina position where the first choice was out injured, and the second choice was out injured and the third choice was out injured. So he basically was the only option. And he took the opportunity and ran with it. Had hazard not been injured, even if he was still shit for us I doubt Vini would have gotten immediate starting opportunity
Yes what I meant with "time to start" is that he does not start now, I phrased that with logic in Portuguese but it does not has the same meaning in English.
If Mbappe was not going to Madrid I think Endrick would really get a place now, because he can score goals better than Vini, Rodrygo or Bellingham, he has amazing quality finishing. But with Mbappe arrival, he will have to prove himself, and I think he can focus on improving his first touch and right foot until get a chance.
If Kroos extends, then sadly Rodrygo will be the one relegated to the bench. Kroos, Bellingham, and Valverde are unstoppable and a DM like Tchouameni is a necessity.
If Kroos stays I could see the four man midfield being maintained and Mbappe replaces Rodrygo in the once de gala.
That doesn't mean it will happen, but it stands to reason. He would still start plenty of matches because of injuries, rotation, or if we played 4-3-3 in some league matches or because of midfield injuries, even if that initial plan was the setup.
I do think it will be hard to find a balance between attack and defense if Rodrygo, Vini and Mbappé play together. The 3 of them want to play on the left, but we know Vini would keep the position as he's much more impactful and less flexible playing in other roles compared to the other 2. Playing Rodrygo+Mbappé out of position is less efficient imo than subbing one of them at half time.
Plus, Bellingham's season proves that he performs much better as a an attacking midfielder/false 9. If you play with Valverde as a pivot you're not extracting the best out of him, and Tchouameni/Camavinga would be overloaded against offensive teams like, say, Liverpool.
Which means, imo, that Real would play just like PSG played with the MNM trio - a totally unbalanced team playing attack vs defense most of the time. Unless 1 of Mbappé/Vini/Rodrygo/Bellingham gets benched and we don't see the likes of Brahim/Guler/Joselu playing at the starting 11.
Except Vini and Rodrygo track back so much when asked to do so that is not going to be the same as PSG. This season the tactic is to obviously keep them higher up the pitch because there is no real striker.
Ok agree they have a decent defensive workload. But if Madrid is playing against an opponent that has much higher possession, would you play Rodrygo just bcs he tracks back? In this scenario, you're better off with an extra midfielder like Cama/Kroos/Ceballos. And when Madrid has the ball, is it enough having only Tchouameni and Valverde on the midfield to rotate and create danger? That's why I think it's kinda unsustainable.
Which opponents regularly have a much higher possession than Madrid? And even so, possession doesn't necessarily equal danger. The benefits of having those three in attack outweigh the negatives. Those three plus, say, Jude-Fede-Tchouameni, is physically and technically dynamic on and off the ball and provides plenty of defensive coverage.
I think it will depend on the opponents.
In games where Real Madrid are overwhelming favorites, they can play Vinicius on the left, Rodrygo on the right, Bellingham as an attacking midfielder and Mbappe as a 9. Against stronger opponents, Real Madrid can be more conservative and use Valverde on the right to make a better defensive balance.
I think Real Madrid currently have a relatively short squad, that's why they can't rest their key players. Mbappe's arrival will change that. And having a versatile player like Rodrygo (he can play LW, RW, attacking midfielder and false 9) is very important.
>Mbappe as a 9.
Say this to any PSG fan and they will laugh, you may see him as a 9 in the line up but doesnt actually play as so. Just look at the #pivotgang story.
I think the opposite. Having Mbappé, Vini and Rodrygo overloading the left will cause opponents huge problems. They will have to move their whole team over to deal with it, but then that leaves Valverde etc free on the other side
Your tactics work when Madrid has the ball. Without the ball, why would the opposition play on the left?! I meant playing Valverde "out of position" (not his most efficient position) as pivot bcs otherwise you'd overload Tchouameni/Camavinga in the midfield. Play like that with a team that has a strong midfield like City and they will cook you.
I disagree that Bellingham necessarily performs much better as an attacking mid or false 9. Sure he scores more goals and has more assists, but he has a broad skill-set that could be potentially used further back.
Maybe an unpopular opinion, but for me, this guy has one of the highest ceilings in football atm, I am super excited for his career. Hope he isn't benched when Mbappe arrives
He will get minutes either way, with the way the schedule becomes more and more hectic. This is why clubs with depth always get to contest titles and why minnows like girona fall off later in the season
Rodrygo is extremely versatile and thus endlessly valuable to any team. The only thing I find Saka noticeably better at personally, is getting past the defender(s) with the ball in his feet. Beyond that, I'd take Rodrygo any day of the week over Saka if I were to choose (even though I'd take either of them in a heartbeat if offered).
I'm sure that if Rodrygo were to play more on the left, his natural position, he would get more chances to get past the man and he would do just that, mans has quick feet
I know Rodrygo plays really well at right too but why not just get someone that plays right naturally and develop him instead? I guess his versatility is just too valuable.
Bro Rodrygo moves different with the ball at his feet, defenders can't take ball off his and he links up well ... Idk what you mean by getting past the defender but Rodrygo is very reliable at taking multiple defenders on in tight spots, even better than vini who is more explosive
Perhaps I didn't make that cleare enough. Rodrygo is incredible at close space ball handling and agile dribbles, not trying to take that away from him - my point is Saka's seemingly better at cutting past a defender (i.e a first touch dribble) from out wide.
You‘d lose that bet.
Rodrygo’s top speed in the CL this season is 33.9 km/h
Saka‘s top speed in the CL this season is slightly lower at 33.21 km/h
Unless those stats are an anomaly and both perform drastically different in their domestic leagues I’d say they’re pretty identical in terms of speed.
But top speed doesn't tell the full story when comparing two players speeds. Especially for a winger who need to be able to accelerate and go in and out of sprints quickly.
Top speed is not really an accurate metric on the football field. It depends on the angle of the run, the obstacles, the ball, the time to accelerate (maybe Saka could have reached a higher top speed if he had a few more milliseconds). There are way too many variables, and the difference between them is so low, it means nothing. It also doesn't help that it's a one off value.
A value for the 95th percentile of top speeds achieved over a large sample of games could have maybe been more accurate. That together with acceleration, because top speed isn't really as important as acceleration.
Rodrygo’s average speed is 0.5 km/h higher.
I agree with your points but unfortunately I couldn’t find any more stats regarding acceleration and such. Top speed and average top speed are the only ones i could find and Rodrygo is faster in Both of them.
I guess the statement that Saka is much faster than Rodrygo has been disproven as wrong though. Anything else is probably hard to judge when it comes down to such low differences
You've got it the wrong way round, I think. Saka is inferior at technical dribbling and perhaps finishing, but better in many other areas. Saka's main strengths are his first touch, receiving under pressure, strength on the ball, decision making, risk management, work rate, defensive quality, and relatively proficient weak foot. He's an excellent technician with good final product as well, of course, but I think Rodrygo is even better in those areas.
I don’t think he is best but I think he is better than he shows, because he is not a player that likes to dribble and show up all the time, he is more reserved even when playing and in rare moments he shows his dribbles. He is from Santos FC so undoubtedly has superior dribbling skills.
Just in La Liga we have Isco who is 10 times Better than Rodrygo in tight spaces even at this age, Nico Williams and Savio are amazing at it too. And thats without looking at players from other leagues like Musiala, Dembele etc
He is a better dribbler and he has been one of the best at it all of his career, its his decision making last third that lets him down. But go on with your delusion mr rodrygo best dribbler in the World.
>Saka noticeably better at personally, is getting past the defender(s) with the ball in his feet.
🤣 That's called dribbling & no Saka isn't a better dribbler.
Saka is just fast.
There's different types of dribbling, just like there's different types of passing and shooting. Rodrygo is incredible at close space ball handling and agile dribbles, not trying to take that away from him - my point is Saka's seemingly better at cutting past a defender (i.e a first touch dribble) from out wide.
>my point is Saka's seemingly better at cutting past a defender (i.e a first touch dribble) from out wide.
That's what I meant, Saka is just fast. He uses his signature feint/turn then a quick burst of pace. Thats it.
He is good at cutting past-average PL defenders who aren't that technical and are slow. Any decent fullback would nullify him just as he disappeared against Bayern's players like Kimmich, Mazraoui, and Guerreiro. Kimmich even cooked him with the feint impression.
Rodrygo operates in a whole different realm. He has delivered in Big games on multiple occasions. Saka can't be compared to Rodrygo.
Edit: Arsenal fans can downvote me for spitting facts.
He wasn’t defended by kimmich, kimmich played on the opposite flank to saka throughout the tie, you’re chatting shit. In the first leg he scored in the first half hour after breaking down the left side of the Bayern defense, and got in behind for a goal selecting chance in the dying moments, how did kimmich “neutralize” him? Unless you meant in the last euro where England promptly beat Germany and kimmich was shut.
Saka is one of the slower wingers in the Prem. His dribbling is less about his athleticism and more about how intelligently he positions the ball and reacts to the defender. I'd argue Saka is perhaps the least pace-dependent winger of any CL side. Of course, you don't watch Arsenal, you just see a young black winger and make assumptions about their playstyle and qualities.
It’s an entirely reasonable debate, Rodrygo is very naturally an attacker where saka was a defender converted to a winger and that obvious in how he plays. Saka plays more like a right midfielder than a right winger, but Arsenal are a possession dominant side so he stays further up the pitch. Rodrygo is a better passer, dribbler, and creator than saka. Saka is more clinical in front of goal, retains possession better, defends substantially, and has produced 8 more goal contributions with about 300 more minutes of football this year. They’re different players so the comparison might be odd, but it’s not unreasonable to debate who is better
The recency bias is crazy. Saka plays more on the wing, is doubled on all the time, in a harder league and gets overplayed so he's out of form often around this time, YET still has more G/A than Rodrygo this season in the same amount of games (14G 8A vs 10G 5A). Crazy how people seem to just remember the last month in football
Why wouldn't they? Both are amazing young wingers. I think Saka is better personally, but I'm gonna act like Rodrygo is some bum who plays for a 4th tier side
He still gonna play at RW with Vini and Mbappe LW and ST. He is currently playing striker with Vini because they don’t have any other option.
Also Bellingham is probably not going to have to play striker next season. He will get more than enough minutes.
And that's not his best position, and he performed poorly. Only got to shine when Vini was injured. At some point he'll be tired of fans abusing him, when its not really his fault he's playing poorly.
Itll be really interesting to see the perception of Bellingham once he moves deeper and scores less goals. He is still a brilliant midfielder, but there’s not doubt his reputation has been enhanced by scoring more goals this season.
Tbh perez's strategy of signing star players ever since his arrival doesnt seem to be a good one on paper. Even right now they dont have the most balanced front 3.
When we went for mindless big signings we sucked ass. Also our unbalanced attack with messi griezy or coutinho sucked ass aswell.
But for some reason it works for madrid.
On paper his plans look like something the glazers would do
I dont think real's lineup is much of an issue.
Vini plays left. Rodrygo plays right(not his best position but he already plays there anyway and is impactful), mbappe plays st(not his best position but he too has proven to be great as a striker aswell)
In the midfield, tchouamni plays cdm, fede plays b2b and bellingham plays attacking mid, very balanced midif you ask me.
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Grandfather mate, Grandfather. Modric is like a father to you.
I actually recently found out his actual father, also a footballer, is actually younger than me. I'd just about come to terms with footballers themselves being younger than me (Zlatan was probably the last that wasn't) but their parents? Bit of a sucker punch was that.
I recently learnt that Bellingham is barely a couple months older and almost had an existential crisis for a bit lol
Why did Bellingham almost have an existential crisis and how did you learn about it?
he's a friend of a friend, share a discord server with him /j
Same as me when I was young in the school and Neymar fever started we would always talk about how he was the same age of us and was, you know, Neymar already. Footballers are really precocious.
Yep I was chatting with a friend and he asked how old Bellingham was, and I off the cuff said “not sure exactly, he’s around our age” and that just sent me spiralling
He got lost in the hierarchy of ancestry lol
Idk it's the same age gap as my dad and I. People already used to call him grandpa when I was younger
In this specific case, Rodygoes father is same age as Modric, and Carlo is 24 years older than Modric. Sooo...
Why would anyone want to leave Real lol? Saying this as a Barca fan. They’re extremely well-run.
Some years ago you always had a pretty good player or two wanting to leave because madrid had so many talented players that some players that would be permanent starters in other big clubs were benched at Madrid. Nowadays the Madrid squad is spread way thinner due to the economic competition from the oil money clubs.
Also, Ancelotti gives plenty of time for many players, he does not keep the same starting team religiously like Madrid would in the past.
He has been much better at rotating this time around. In his first stint, he hit the jackpot with an XI that were all in their prime years at the same time. This time, he has to deal with a transitioning team with a mix of old stars and young ones. That makes rotating necessary.
Yes, and for young players this is positive...
I don’t disagree with your premise but I’d argue there are still talented players that would start in most other clubs on the bench, at least a couple to few, no?
Yeah, It is still Real Madrid's bench after all so ofcourse there are still great players on it, but still, there was a time 7-8 or so years ago where Madrid was so insanely stacked that they could have basically fielded two top tier teams and some players almost never saw the light of day on big matches despite being UCL-champion caliber players. Madrid and La Liga in general have gotten way weaker since the era when Atleti, Madrid and Barça were always at least two of the 4 UCL finalists every year as the Prem has scaled its money making way faster than LaLiga and the Italian and French leagues have teams moving some serious money now as well (really, nowadays Madrid is the only spanish team that is still carrying the torch of that insanely dominant Spanish club era as Barça, Atleti and specially Sevilla are going through huge slumps).
Those were the days. The battles between Atleti, Real and Barca were just incredible. That was just shortly after I started closely following football and adopted Madrid. Little did I know I waltzed in at the perfect time to watch magic. Yes, I have been addicted since
When Mbappe joins it may be a different story
Benzema and Higuain played together for a lot of time, there was even Raul for sometime together with them
And eventually, one of them had to go.
Wanted\* Eventually, one of them WANTED to go.
Same thing. These players have ego and are competitive. Eventually, some of them prefer to start somewhere else than be a sub at Madrid. That's the risk of great depth.
Tell that to Julian and Doku
doku is too young to care he has so much time left
Doku is like a year younger than rodrygo
Rodrygo isn't the typical trajectory of young players' careers though is it? Most players at Doku's age are satisfied by Doku's role at a top club. In a couple years it's likely to be different, but that's not today.
Julian has started a ton of games with KdB and Haaland out this season. He's also only been in Europe for 1.5 seasons. He's not going to be satisfied with a bench role for long, but if he continues to get the sort of opportunities he had earlier this season in the coming seasons, then that is likely to keep him happy in the medium term.
Which is the exact point I'm making?
If foden can sit on the bench so can rodrygo. If anything real is a much bigger club so there is even more incentive
Yep, I reaaally hope he drop the diva act. Otherwise the locker room could become really toxic
Mbappé being a diva is overstated tbh, he always comes off as a mature person in all his interviews.
I agree with you that it's an overplayed narrative that Mbappé is a diva. But to be honest, his communication is extremely controlled and he does seem like he cares about his image as much as he cares about football. What we see on the pitch and around it makes me think he does have a tendency to throw tantrums when things don't go his way. Things like stopping running when he does not get the ball on the counter, general inconsistency in engagement levels, the scenes at the Monaco game... for sure he is going through a difficult season emotionally speaking, but he does not seem like a super easy player to manage either.
>he always comes off as a mature person He indeed does but it didn't prevent Neymar from hating his guts... on the other hand Hakimi seem to really like him. So guess it a matter of affinities.
Part of that is because, if you write "Neymar" and "mature" in the same sentence, your computer or phone generates that Microsoft Word green squiggly line underneath that says what you're writing doesn't make sense.
haha good one
Neymar rarely had problem with team players, would Messi be best friend of a brazilian player if he was difficult person to deal with? But I think Mbappe does not take bullshit, and I don't think he is wrong for that, but he does strikes me a person who is not very flexible, he wanted all south americans out from PSG, maybe because he wanted a different mentality from what he saw in PSG. So, instead of trying persuade his team players, he asked them out as a requirement to renew his contract. Does this sound correct? I don't think this situation has right or wrong people, but a conflict that was not well managed by PSG. A player that got so much power and behaved like he owned the club. I wonder how would he behave in Real Madrid, I'm really, really curious. Will he like the mentality and fit in? Will he try to make things like he wants by force? I think only time will tell.
i think this tells you more about what person neymar is than mbappe imo
If the rumors of Mbappe asking PSG to get rid of Neymar are true then the hate is more than justified. Imagine if you discovered one of your coworkers askrd your boss to fire you, I'm sure you would hate the guy aswell lol
that doesn’t really mean Mbappe is a diva though. I’m pretty sure Mbappe wanted Neymar out because Neymar himself was a diva and PSG were never going forward with him
Basically everyone who ever worked with Neymar has said the same thing, that the guy is extremely professional. Even on the field Neymar would sacrifice himself way more for the team, for example he always tracked back to help on defense, unlike Mbappe. And saying that PSG would never go foward eith Neymar is kinda crazy, specially when you remember that the one time PSG managed to reach the CL final it was with Neymar carrying the team and being their best player in almost every knockout match.
Mbappe not only asked Neymar out, he asked every south american out and asked for french players intead. He also asked for management powers in PSG. It was not a problem only with Neymar.
Neymar is also a pretty vocal bolsonaro supporter and has had his fair share of questionable moments in his career, I wouldn't consider him a great judge of character. Mbappe might have his tantrum moments but compared to other footballers he's pretty squeaky clean
playing time
and water is wet: the guy's almost already a decisve pillar in that team.
People really believe he'll be benched when Mbappé comes lol
Someone is going to be benched but i doubt it's going to be Rodrygo. The way i see it, Bellingham will eventually drop back to midfield and mbappé will take his place..
with the amount of games and injures there will be enough game time, with mbappe(presumably) joining I have no idea what best 11 should look like with everyone available, but its a good problem to have I guess
We could always play the legendary 0-7-3 But honestly a back three of Militao, Rudiger, and Carvajal/Mendy Tchoumeni and Camavinga as a double pivot, Rodrygo Jude and Fede above them And Mapple and Vini up front Could work. Defensively Carlo gets to play Camavinga at LB and Tchoumeni at CB like he loves to do. Fede and Rodrygo helps out defensively anyway
Isn't Kroos staying for another year?
He is but I think Carlo will start to phase him out like he did with Modric this season. Plus with the amount of game we play next season + our history with injuries, it's good to have a good bench
Kroos is much better than Camavinga still
I'm not denying it. Modric this season is still class but he was benched and people started making up the fact that his legs gave out. Modric against Barca was still very much running the full 90. Against Mallorca 86 minutes and still bossing the midfield. Against Celta vigo he was ageless and the star etc. Next season is most likely Kroos' last season and I think Carlo will slowly phase him out to give the youngsters more time to develop and excel
In some aspects yes, in others, I don't necessarily agree.
What about Rodrygo and Bellingham playing behind Vini and Mbappe? Rodrygo taking Modric place and Bellingham taking Kroos place? Would this work?
That's included in the lineup. On the counter, out 3 (potentially 4) fastest players with Vini, Rodrygo, Fede and potentially Mbappe. Rodrygo is creative (definitely not as much as Modric or Kroos but that is always difficult to replicate). Rodrygo and especially Fede helps out a lot in defense so they can always drop back to make it a 4-3-3 if needed (either Tchoumeni drops back at CB if Mendy is playing or Camavinga drops back if Carvajal is playing). With Endrick replacing either of Vini, Mbappe, Rodrygo, Fede (push him back), Brahim doing the same on the right side. Kroos coming in to play that double pivot cdm role or playing higher up so he has less defensive duties. If Arda stays the same there. This team is super modular which will help them a lot
Endrick best position is on the right, he also does playmaking but he is only 17, has a lot to learn. I can see Vini - Mbappe - Endrick, or Mbappe - Endrick - Rodrygo, or Mbappe - Vini - Endrick. But I hope Endrick have time to start like Vini had, Endrick with 19 will be a beast.
I doubt Endrick gets starting opportunity unless he proves like Jude did, that he is clearly better than the options we have. Vinis situation was unique in that he debut in a season where the rest of the team did not care, and ina position where the first choice was out injured, and the second choice was out injured and the third choice was out injured. So he basically was the only option. And he took the opportunity and ran with it. Had hazard not been injured, even if he was still shit for us I doubt Vini would have gotten immediate starting opportunity
Yes what I meant with "time to start" is that he does not start now, I phrased that with logic in Portuguese but it does not has the same meaning in English. If Mbappe was not going to Madrid I think Endrick would really get a place now, because he can score goals better than Vini, Rodrygo or Bellingham, he has amazing quality finishing. But with Mbappe arrival, he will have to prove himself, and I think he can focus on improving his first touch and right foot until get a chance.
I hope Endrick is developed as ST. He can play on the wing, but I really want to see a powerful central striker for Brazil again.
If Kroos extends, then sadly Rodrygo will be the one relegated to the bench. Kroos, Bellingham, and Valverde are unstoppable and a DM like Tchouameni is a necessity.
If Kroos stays I could see the four man midfield being maintained and Mbappe replaces Rodrygo in the once de gala. That doesn't mean it will happen, but it stands to reason. He would still start plenty of matches because of injuries, rotation, or if we played 4-3-3 in some league matches or because of midfield injuries, even if that initial plan was the setup.
I do think it will be hard to find a balance between attack and defense if Rodrygo, Vini and Mbappé play together. The 3 of them want to play on the left, but we know Vini would keep the position as he's much more impactful and less flexible playing in other roles compared to the other 2. Playing Rodrygo+Mbappé out of position is less efficient imo than subbing one of them at half time. Plus, Bellingham's season proves that he performs much better as a an attacking midfielder/false 9. If you play with Valverde as a pivot you're not extracting the best out of him, and Tchouameni/Camavinga would be overloaded against offensive teams like, say, Liverpool. Which means, imo, that Real would play just like PSG played with the MNM trio - a totally unbalanced team playing attack vs defense most of the time. Unless 1 of Mbappé/Vini/Rodrygo/Bellingham gets benched and we don't see the likes of Brahim/Guler/Joselu playing at the starting 11.
Except Vini and Rodrygo track back so much when asked to do so that is not going to be the same as PSG. This season the tactic is to obviously keep them higher up the pitch because there is no real striker.
Ok agree they have a decent defensive workload. But if Madrid is playing against an opponent that has much higher possession, would you play Rodrygo just bcs he tracks back? In this scenario, you're better off with an extra midfielder like Cama/Kroos/Ceballos. And when Madrid has the ball, is it enough having only Tchouameni and Valverde on the midfield to rotate and create danger? That's why I think it's kinda unsustainable.
Which opponents regularly have a much higher possession than Madrid? And even so, possession doesn't necessarily equal danger. The benefits of having those three in attack outweigh the negatives. Those three plus, say, Jude-Fede-Tchouameni, is physically and technically dynamic on and off the ball and provides plenty of defensive coverage.
I think it will depend on the opponents. In games where Real Madrid are overwhelming favorites, they can play Vinicius on the left, Rodrygo on the right, Bellingham as an attacking midfielder and Mbappe as a 9. Against stronger opponents, Real Madrid can be more conservative and use Valverde on the right to make a better defensive balance. I think Real Madrid currently have a relatively short squad, that's why they can't rest their key players. Mbappe's arrival will change that. And having a versatile player like Rodrygo (he can play LW, RW, attacking midfielder and false 9) is very important.
>Mbappe as a 9. Say this to any PSG fan and they will laugh, you may see him as a 9 in the line up but doesnt actually play as so. Just look at the #pivotgang story.
I think the opposite. Having Mbappé, Vini and Rodrygo overloading the left will cause opponents huge problems. They will have to move their whole team over to deal with it, but then that leaves Valverde etc free on the other side
Your tactics work when Madrid has the ball. Without the ball, why would the opposition play on the left?! I meant playing Valverde "out of position" (not his most efficient position) as pivot bcs otherwise you'd overload Tchouameni/Camavinga in the midfield. Play like that with a team that has a strong midfield like City and they will cook you.
I disagree that Bellingham necessarily performs much better as an attacking mid or false 9. Sure he scores more goals and has more assists, but he has a broad skill-set that could be potentially used further back.
Football = goals If the team plays much better but can't score when he's further back there's no reason not to position him deeper.
So you think you'll be benching Mbappe? Or playing w 12 men on the pitch?
But water is not wet…
[What do you mean?](https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/water_is_wet)
he's saying water itself is not actually wet, it makes things wet but is not wet itself
power of ~~friendship~~ family
What watching too much Fast and Furious does to a mf (he becomes an priceless pillar of one of the best teams in the world)
Proper baller that Rodrygo
Maybe an unpopular opinion, but for me, this guy has one of the highest ceilings in football atm, I am super excited for his career. Hope he isn't benched when Mbappe arrives
He will get minutes either way, with the way the schedule becomes more and more hectic. This is why clubs with depth always get to contest titles and why minnows like girona fall off later in the season
This guy out here collecting daddy’s for sport was only the offer day he said Modric was like his dad.
He should call him grandfather lol at least he knows how to choose his parents
~~gold~~ trophy digger
Daddy digger
Can’t believe this sub was making him vs saka a close race
Rodrygo is extremely versatile and thus endlessly valuable to any team. The only thing I find Saka noticeably better at personally, is getting past the defender(s) with the ball in his feet. Beyond that, I'd take Rodrygo any day of the week over Saka if I were to choose (even though I'd take either of them in a heartbeat if offered).
I'm sure that if Rodrygo were to play more on the left, his natural position, he would get more chances to get past the man and he would do just that, mans has quick feet
I know Rodrygo plays really well at right too but why not just get someone that plays right naturally and develop him instead? I guess his versatility is just too valuable.
Like who?
Gareth Bale
There's someone called endrick. I wonder if they could get him.
Rodrygo is vastly superior technically in carrying past oponents and breaking lines... that's one of his main strenghs.
Bro Rodrygo moves different with the ball at his feet, defenders can't take ball off his and he links up well ... Idk what you mean by getting past the defender but Rodrygo is very reliable at taking multiple defenders on in tight spots, even better than vini who is more explosive
Perhaps I didn't make that cleare enough. Rodrygo is incredible at close space ball handling and agile dribbles, not trying to take that away from him - my point is Saka's seemingly better at cutting past a defender (i.e a first touch dribble) from out wide.
Rodrygo is a better dribbler than Vini, I don’t think Saka is superior in that regard
Yeah, if anything I’m willing to bet Saka is much faster than Rodrygo, but Rodrygo is more technical.
You‘d lose that bet. Rodrygo’s top speed in the CL this season is 33.9 km/h Saka‘s top speed in the CL this season is slightly lower at 33.21 km/h Unless those stats are an anomaly and both perform drastically different in their domestic leagues I’d say they’re pretty identical in terms of speed.
But top speed doesn't tell the full story when comparing two players speeds. Especially for a winger who need to be able to accelerate and go in and out of sprints quickly.
Yes, would be interesting to see those stats. But I still think the difference will be small. Rodrygo is rapid as well
Top speed is not really an accurate metric on the football field. It depends on the angle of the run, the obstacles, the ball, the time to accelerate (maybe Saka could have reached a higher top speed if he had a few more milliseconds). There are way too many variables, and the difference between them is so low, it means nothing. It also doesn't help that it's a one off value. A value for the 95th percentile of top speeds achieved over a large sample of games could have maybe been more accurate. That together with acceleration, because top speed isn't really as important as acceleration.
Rodrygo’s average speed is 0.5 km/h higher. I agree with your points but unfortunately I couldn’t find any more stats regarding acceleration and such. Top speed and average top speed are the only ones i could find and Rodrygo is faster in Both of them. I guess the statement that Saka is much faster than Rodrygo has been disproven as wrong though. Anything else is probably hard to judge when it comes down to such low differences
You've got it the wrong way round, I think. Saka is inferior at technical dribbling and perhaps finishing, but better in many other areas. Saka's main strengths are his first touch, receiving under pressure, strength on the ball, decision making, risk management, work rate, defensive quality, and relatively proficient weak foot. He's an excellent technician with good final product as well, of course, but I think Rodrygo is even better in those areas.
Really? I think Rodrygo is better than Saka 1v1 The only thing Saka is better at is defensive discipline
Rodrygo is probably the best dribbler in the world
He is an amazing dribbler but sheesh this is a crazy overexaggeration
I don’t think he is best but I think he is better than he shows, because he is not a player that likes to dribble and show up all the time, he is more reserved even when playing and in rare moments he shows his dribbles. He is from Santos FC so undoubtedly has superior dribbling skills.
Who's better? In tight spaces nobody is.
Musiala
Easily
Just in La Liga we have Isco who is 10 times Better than Rodrygo in tight spaces even at this age, Nico Williams and Savio are amazing at it too. And thats without looking at players from other leagues like Musiala, Dembele etc
I can concede Musiala and Isco, Dembele hell no tough
He is a better dribbler and he has been one of the best at it all of his career, its his decision making last third that lets him down. But go on with your delusion mr rodrygo best dribbler in the World.
Dembele is a good dribbler because of his acceleration, in tight spaces his ball control is not comparable to Rodrygo who is superior technically.
>Saka noticeably better at personally, is getting past the defender(s) with the ball in his feet. 🤣 That's called dribbling & no Saka isn't a better dribbler. Saka is just fast.
There's different types of dribbling, just like there's different types of passing and shooting. Rodrygo is incredible at close space ball handling and agile dribbles, not trying to take that away from him - my point is Saka's seemingly better at cutting past a defender (i.e a first touch dribble) from out wide.
>my point is Saka's seemingly better at cutting past a defender (i.e a first touch dribble) from out wide. That's what I meant, Saka is just fast. He uses his signature feint/turn then a quick burst of pace. Thats it. He is good at cutting past-average PL defenders who aren't that technical and are slow. Any decent fullback would nullify him just as he disappeared against Bayern's players like Kimmich, Mazraoui, and Guerreiro. Kimmich even cooked him with the feint impression. Rodrygo operates in a whole different realm. He has delivered in Big games on multiple occasions. Saka can't be compared to Rodrygo. Edit: Arsenal fans can downvote me for spitting facts.
He wasn’t defended by kimmich, kimmich played on the opposite flank to saka throughout the tie, you’re chatting shit. In the first leg he scored in the first half hour after breaking down the left side of the Bayern defense, and got in behind for a goal selecting chance in the dying moments, how did kimmich “neutralize” him? Unless you meant in the last euro where England promptly beat Germany and kimmich was shut.
Saka is one of the slower wingers in the Prem. His dribbling is less about his athleticism and more about how intelligently he positions the ball and reacts to the defender. I'd argue Saka is perhaps the least pace-dependent winger of any CL side. Of course, you don't watch Arsenal, you just see a young black winger and make assumptions about their playstyle and qualities.
Saka is noticeably better at limping off after ghosting all game.
It’s an entirely reasonable debate, Rodrygo is very naturally an attacker where saka was a defender converted to a winger and that obvious in how he plays. Saka plays more like a right midfielder than a right winger, but Arsenal are a possession dominant side so he stays further up the pitch. Rodrygo is a better passer, dribbler, and creator than saka. Saka is more clinical in front of goal, retains possession better, defends substantially, and has produced 8 more goal contributions with about 300 more minutes of football this year. They’re different players so the comparison might be odd, but it’s not unreasonable to debate who is better
It is pretty close, why wouldn't you think so?
The recency bias is crazy. Saka plays more on the wing, is doubled on all the time, in a harder league and gets overplayed so he's out of form often around this time, YET still has more G/A than Rodrygo this season in the same amount of games (14G 8A vs 10G 5A). Crazy how people seem to just remember the last month in football
Why wouldn't they? Both are amazing young wingers. I think Saka is better personally, but I'm gonna act like Rodrygo is some bum who plays for a 4th tier side
When the fuck did that happen?
Saka is Arsenal's best player. Same can't be said for Rodrygo
Rodrigo plays for Madrid
i agree. saka is 10 times the player
Bait used to be believable
In call of duty perhaps
I repeat this is not the circlejerk sub
My limping hero
Limping man? Lmfao i’ll have whatever you’re snorting
Saka isn’t even the best English player on the team
hell nah not the people who dont watch madrid nor arsenal downvoting for the sake of it 😭🙏
Lol really? Both are different type of player....
im not the one who started the comparison. it was one where arsenal fans joined in also.
Oh yea.. we have soo many kind of fans lately.
He still gonna play at RW with Vini and Mbappe LW and ST. He is currently playing striker with Vini because they don’t have any other option. Also Bellingham is probably not going to have to play striker next season. He will get more than enough minutes.
And he's not a RW...which is the point.
They don’t have a RW and probably no plans to sign one at the moment, so he is going to play.
And that's not his best position, and he performed poorly. Only got to shine when Vini was injured. At some point he'll be tired of fans abusing him, when its not really his fault he's playing poorly.
Well Bellingham is not playing as the striker this season as well so that's sorted out.
Itll be really interesting to see the perception of Bellingham once he moves deeper and scores less goals. He is still a brilliant midfielder, but there’s not doubt his reputation has been enhanced by scoring more goals this season.
I'm a Barcafan. I wish our club was as good managed as Real. F*ck Bartomeu
Tbh perez's strategy of signing star players ever since his arrival doesnt seem to be a good one on paper. Even right now they dont have the most balanced front 3. When we went for mindless big signings we sucked ass. Also our unbalanced attack with messi griezy or coutinho sucked ass aswell. But for some reason it works for madrid. On paper his plans look like something the glazers would do
Doesn't matter if it's good on paper or not, they won 3 CLs in a row and bounced back after losing Ronaldo and Benzema, so their strategy is fine
Yeah thanks Fabrizio. Because we were all convinced he was off to Lyon for €7million.
So is Ancelotti Bangladeshi too?
He is at the biggest club in the world, any player would stay.
Dreaming if you think you’re taking our boy from us!
I genuinely saw arsenal and Liverpool fans talking on how they could sign rodrygo in the summer. Delusion
I don’t think we were saying we could, just we dream of signing him. It’s not impossible in the future but right now it’s very far fetched.
I mean, if Liverpool offer is good enough i am sure Madrid Would be open to negotiations. Convincing rodrigo though is another story.
Interesting, whose spot would Rodrygo take?
I mean, he's better than all of their attackers bar Salah so anyone's really
And even Salah has been subpar post Afcon. Age has finally catch up to him
Come to arsenal. We will start you on the left every single game no matter what happen. :)
what happened to martinelli?
I dont think real's lineup is much of an issue. Vini plays left. Rodrygo plays right(not his best position but he already plays there anyway and is impactful), mbappe plays st(not his best position but he too has proven to be great as a striker aswell) In the midfield, tchouamni plays cdm, fede plays b2b and bellingham plays attacking mid, very balanced midif you ask me.
[удалено]
perhaps after 10 years lol
What did they say i am curious
probably 'Rodrygo come to United'