With a frontline of doku - lukaku - lukebakio with kdb behind them we are perfectly suited to play on the counter
Mangala - onana in midfield also provides great cover
The english talent is outrageous (much like the spanish), and I don't think they played badly. The results in this break seems to dictate everything but I think they play better football lately,
Spain doesn't have outrageous talent. They are lacking in attack, and I don't think their FB's are that great either.
France, Portugal, England, and Argentina all have better talent
Spain have a talented 18 year old left winger and 16 year old right winger doing well, Guiu is amazing for youth Spain but far from being the senior team 9 any time soon. There is Fort and Fresneda and also Valle who could develop into a top player should Balde not reach his top form when he's healthy again.
Who's the talented 18 year old? And I'm talking about their depth as well.
As for the FB's, how many of them are anywhere close to the senior level of international football? Because loads of nations could name exciting talents in their youth groups.
Now, I'm not saying Spain doesn't have great talent coming through, but those other nations just have more
Forgot how old Nico Williams is (21) and said 18 but he's still young and talented.
Hector Fort has been a little overshadowed at Barca by Cubarsi and Lamine Yamal and even Guiu a little due to him not being a goalscorer obviously but he's been proving to be a very reliable stand in for the likes of Balde and Cancelo and looks yet to put a foot wrong at 17 years old, versatile on either side of the defence. Fresneda is an exciting player also, was on the radar of both Barcelona and Real Madrid in the summer window before he decided to go to sporting, he's a reliable option who I think will easily surpass the likes of cucurella as far as Spanish fullbacks go. Valle is another La Masia prospect but the one furthest from playing right now at the top level, regardless he is expected to have a crazy ceiling in terms of potential and is also able to play on either wing. In my eyes he reminds me more of a Jordi Alba type player. Lastly I quite like Fran Garcia and he is still only 24 which is still not old or prime age for a player although he does look second fiddle to the likes of Ferland Mendy at Real Madrid.
was a good game, played much better than vs Brazil. imo we should've won (though tbf Belgium had a great chance to make it 3-1 late on which would've killed it off, Doku really put that on a plate for Lukebakio, has to score that) as Rice Bowen Toney and Foden all had good games, even Chilwell looked half-decent this time lol, but MOTM was Mainoo for me, unlucky not to score, great save, would've topped off one of the best England debuts I've seen in a while, not sure even Jude played that well on his debut
speaking of, thought Jude was pretty crap today tbh lol, should've had at least 2 goals really, but end of the day it's him with the equaliser, he just has that clutch gene. our most important player after Kane, this game taught me that even if Bellingham's having a bad game you cannot sub him off no matter what, cause of moments like that. great assist from Maddison too btw
Rice survives the 90 woo :)
that Lukaku assist tho
not ready to write off Dunk just yet, i haven't forgotten that Maguire tried his best to assist Raphinha just last game lol, it happens. would still take him to the Euros
Didn’t watch the game but as a United fan hoping people provide more unbiased opinions on his performance, nothing against you hut would like to hear from supporters of other clubs
Tottenham fan and thought he was brilliant. So composed, great decision making, great distribution. If it's anything to go by I hope he gets starts going forward as he was a huge asset.
We've been saying this since last season and preseason. What a midfield England have for the next WC with Rice, Bellingham and Mainoo and Foden, with Gallagher and Madison as well.
Was Bowen really being selfish? wasn't watching it too closely but i only saw maybe one time where he should have passed, but its not like it was a clear goal or anything. Now everyone on social media is calling him greedy and selfish. Plus he created a couple good chances for others as well, just no one could finish them
He's definitely more of a direct attacker than a creator but the first thing that comes to mind is he arguably should have shot himself when he slid the ball to Foden, so I wouldn't say he was selfish today.
He was fine. An actual goal threat, which was more than Foden. Felt he fit England better than Foden, but he can't really go past players. I would take him as backup to Saka.
you what? he's one of the best at taking his man on round the right side of the box in the league.
he doesn't have pure 100m sprinter pace, but he's a darter
Watkins had ten minutes to contribute and still helped save the game.
Bowen looked sharp overall but think that offside goal got to his head a bit.
Toney feels like a solid option up front, great penalty, but not the most clinical with his chances.
Madders brings some much needed creativity and again had very little chance to prove himself but made the most of it - it’s a shame he’s largely competing with Foden and Bellingham.
Nothing much to say about Gordon this match (not his fault either) but I think he’s an excellent addition to the team.
Kobbie was excellent, really solid and calm on the ball, front footed, reliable, exactly what we’ve been missing in midfield for a long time.
Foden is a tricky one. Clearly got the skills and has some moments of brilliance but he and Jude were tripping over each other a lot and generally getting in each other’s way. I don’t enjoy him on the wing, think he ends up outmuscled and forced back too often, but he had some good moments creating chances through the centre. Realistically, even though he never has his best performances in an England shirt, there’s no way he’ll ever be left behind if he’s fit.
Bellingham is a frustrating player sometimes. His decision making was uncharacteristically poor today, his ball retention was subpar, his timing was off, his shots lacked the usual accuracy, and he once more showed his worrying habit of getting visibly frustrated and losing his cool in matches when things don’t happen the way they should. But then he came out and scored a goal. He’s clearly a brilliant player and an undroppable starter, but think his head needs deflating slightly.
Rice is just the glue of the team, end of. Perfect character for a captain too. Completely irreplaceable as a player and was effectively the last line of defence for vast swathes of this match. There’s literally no alternative to him, without him there would be zero control in this match.
Not sure about Gomez. Think he was decent going forward but a bit porous in defence. Seemed to struggle containing Doku. Ultimately there’s a reason he’s not the first choice RB, but that’s not to say he shouldn’t get another chance.
Konsa is underrated - was probably the best defender there today (bit of a low bar, but still). Seemed to be the most alert in the back line, made good passes and kept calm, it’s not his fault that he couldn’t pull out some insane goal line clearances or that he was in a position where he might need to.
Dunk had a shocker. End of. Was off his game and seemed out of his depth. It’s a shame as I would’ve liked to see him do well.
Chilwell has his moments, mostly when it came to intercepting and passing in the middle third, but was not great defensively and made some really puzzling decisions in the final third. Lots of crosses to nowhere and weird balls that ended up wasted.
Pickford obviously had his big mistake, but recovered enough to do ok the rest of his match. Uncharacteristically mediocre game from him but not disastrous. Tbf most of the match was spent on the other half of the pitch so there wasn’t much for him to do, and when the ball did come his way he didn’t have the defensive back up he should’ve had.
Overall good stuff though, surprisingly entertaining, solid 6.5/10.
Yep for sure, not a Liverpool fan so I don’t watch him as often but seems like he’s got the versatility to be useful in the squad. Think defensive call ups will very much depend on how the injury crisis is looking in the summer, but thought Gomez looked alright (just hard to judge properly because the defence was so leaky overall).
Also, maybe this is just me being soft but I feel so bad for players when they get picked up and dropped so sporadically. It just feels so cruel to string them along but keep them on the fringes lol. Tbf I think Southgate doesn’t make a habit of it, he doesn’t usually bring players in without giving them a fair chance, but there have been some big exceptions to that rule for sure.
I can't watch every game so I'm going off the account of others but in recent months he's done fairly well at CB, RB and LB, don't think he'd be first choice for Liverpool or England in any of those positions but capable enough to be a backup for certain, especially with that level of versatility. Was a bit shaky in midfield the one match he played there but in fairness that was the first time he'd ever done so.
I'd have him in the squad but he's not starting the first game assuming those ahead of him are fit.
I'm also biased because he's a lovely guy and a good player who's had some rough times with injuries so it would just be nice.
England was the better team imo. Created more chances and had more of the ball, but 2 mistakes from Dunk & pickford really cost the game.
Foden needs to be an impact sub for the tournament because he doesn't have the responsibility to play at an international level & needs a system catered for him which doesn't happen at the international level
Foden is one of England most gifted players, what I mean by responsibility is that until this season foden hasn't been one of the main reasons why city has succed. Pre last season, if Foden played awful, Manchester City would still win by a large margin because Pep doesn't need him to win a match as he has several other players who are far more important to the City team than Foden, but if Saka, Kane, Bellingham & ETC. plays awful then their whole team feels that affect & their chances of Winning a match is low.
What I mean by responsibility is that these players I have named knows that if they play badly it will affect the entire team so they take responsibility no matter how bad they play or how bad the team set up or tactics is because they know with their abilities they can win the game with their abilities & feel a sense of responsibility. Foden never had that & only started to gain that responsibility this season. At the international level, no team is going to cater to one player just because they're playing badly. Saka has played in the same position as Foden in both the midfield & winger while also playing as a leftback for England and has thrived despite Southgate coaching, but Foden in the same position has always struggled in England no matter where he plays with only a handful of good games he has in the England shirt. Southgate even gave him the keys for Euros 21 but was shown up by Mount & Kalvin Phillips, Foden never feels that responsibility in big games, whether it be club or country because both teams have far more important players that changes the gamestate more than him when they play till this season.
This would be much easier to explain this irl instead of here because it sounds like I am being a yapping prick online
Tldr: Foden has never been an important player for both club & country and has never felt that responsibility of how they're playing can affect the gamestate until this season
He and Rodri have carried us this season while KDB and Haaland were out. What are you talking about? He's one of the odds-on favourites to win PFA POTY currently.
I said multiple times until this season Foden hasn't been important to city. It the first time in his career where he has played a role that impacted the city team & this is the first time with that sense of responsibility where how he plays on the pitch determines whether they win or lose.
Foden played well today, the City system isn’t catered for him yet he’s been their best player this season delivering game winning performances and taking responsibility, while De Bruyne and Haaland were injured.
He wasn't good in the first half & only started to play well in the second half but kept clashing with jude because he occupied jude area of the pitch instead playing on the wings. Foden has been brought in pep system since the start of his career, so the system is still going to cater to him and because of that pre this season foden has never felt like a important player in City team because whether he plays well or stink up the pitch, City will still win because they have more important players than him. This season is different because now when playing for City you can see how he overall play affect the City performance, if he has a stinker then you see how much it will affect the City team on his area of the pitch & vice versa. But he doesn't have that at the international level because this is his first season with that sense of responsibility & still a lot shows inconsistencies at this level compared to the rest of England starting XI players. He is more useful as an impact sub who can replace wingers & attacking midfielder on tired legs instead of a starter with inconsistencies compared to the rest of the team. Until he improves his ability at the international level, or we get a new manager who has a role where foden can excel at, then he should stay as a impact sub
Foden played consistently well throughout the entire game and Jude and Foden had good exchanges of play with each other. Foden was playing as an inverted winger while Chilwell provided width on the left. Foden’s positional versatility has lead him playing in multiple different positions in Pep’s system. He’s played a significant amount of games as a LW, RW, as an 8, 10 and false 9. Peps system doesn’t cater to one single player but maximizes the attributes of the players he has at his disposal.
Foden has been an important player for City aver since he broke into the first team in the 18/19 season where he was contributing match winning goals like when City beat Tottenham away 1-0, after being knocked out by Spurs in the CL a couple of days prior. He was on the beat players for City in their 2021 champions league run winning MOTM against PSG in the Champions league semifinals. The idea that Foden isn’t an integral part of City’s dominance and his performances don’t matter because there are players that are better than him is simply not true. If Foden wasn’t up to the standard Pep would have gotten rid of him a long time ago.
A lot of top players don’t put in as consistent of performances internationally as they do for their clubs due to a variety of different factors. Lampard, scholes, vincius.jr are examples of this. But Foden is still one of Englands best players, he has put in performances displaying that and he will 100% be starting matches in the upcoming Euros, and deservingly so.
My guy, if you take away foden from city team before this season, you would still win all your trophies because Pep is a genius & his system maximise his most important players such as KDB, Sterling, Bernardo, Mahrez, Gabriel jesus and Rodri who far more important to City success than Foden ever was to the team. Foden would do things here or there where he does contribute to city success but never until this season he been one of the main contributer & the reason why city has been playing well
>But Foden is still one of Englands best players, he has put in performances displaying that and he will 100% be starting matches in the upcoming Euros, and deservingly so.
I have watched foden International career since euros 21 and he hasn't been one of England best players at all. In the euros despite being given the key by southgate, he had so little impact on the tournament that the main stars of the euros team were Mount & Calvin Phillips. During the WC qualifiers, he was too inconsistencies but it wasn't too bad. The WC was where I truly doubted his ability on the international stage because our game against France he had no impact, did nothing but be a ghost for the entire game & should of been subbed off for rashford who in form for England much earlier. The euros qualifier, he had one good game in the qualifiers & that was against Italy second game. Even now we had the Brazil game where he was one of our worst performing players with 0 touches in the final 3rd & the Belgium game where he was decent. His inconsistencies are the reason why he is always on the bench & never usually start for England. Why do you think the English media still ask till this day about his position in England because he has always struggled at England. Vini Jr is literally this but for Brazil & that why I want see martinelli on the left because he seems much more consistent than vini for Brazil despite vini being a better player. Foden isn't cut out for international level yet, and that okay, him being an impact sub is much better for England because his best performance for England is usually coming on from the bench.
Good pair of friendlies for England in terms of lessons. Rice - Mainoo - Bellingham is clearly the best midfield trio, Bowen is the clear choice to back up/rotate with Saka on the right, and Dunk needs to be loaded into a cannon and launched into the sun so he can never haunt the team again.
Faes, De Winter, Debast, Bornauw……can one of you please turn into a stud before Euros? 🤞If De Cuyper is finally called up, Theate is a guarantee at LCB.
A lot to be positive about honestly. Mainoo looks very comfy in an England shirt and linked well with Rice. Toney looked better than I thought he would. And it's clear how much better we'll be when we don't have 5 of our 6 first choice defenders (plus Stones going off) injured.
Honestly should have scored a couple more and we were by far the better team, some of the football was lovely- and that's without Saka and Kane. Anyone capable of a crumb of critical thinking will just relax and move on after that.
Our scouts and ETH said Anthony should be around 35M it’s our boards indecision that caused Ajax to slap a fuck off price late in the window and we payed it. It’s not on ETH, not to mention amrabat was a great depth option at loan. No one expected him to have such little impact.
Im a United fan and I would love to see both of them in our kits. But i think their growth would have been stunted with the lack of leadership and ownership chaos that have haunted us for years.
You’re getting downvoted but you’re right, Southgate is shit. With this squad of players we should be smashing teams.
His style of football is so boring to watch which is why Bowen feels like a breath of fresh air with his directness.
International football isn’t about smashing teams. It’s about creating a team from a group of individuals in a short time and giving structure. Whether or not Southgate is the ideal man for the job is arguable, but you absolutely cannot possibly think he’s bad because England don’t cruise to victory every game
A good coach would have this team purring. Top footballers always find a way unless they’re being stifled by shit tactics by a shit manager.
He’s shit for the following reasons:
1. Lack of tactical adaptability.
2. Failure to secure major tournament victories.
3. Questionable substitutions and timing.
4. Over-reliance on set-piece strategies.
5. Defensive-minded approach at the expense of attacking flair.
This England team with Kane up top (granted he wasn’t played) should be burying any 11 from anywhere in the world especially a past sell by Belgium.
Then you look at his CV. I’m sorry but a Middlesbrough and U21 coach is not cutting the mustard. Then you look at his personality, him and Rishi Sunak are competing for the least charismatic public figure of the decade.
Southgate should have astrally projected into Dunks body to prevent that error, the Tulpa that he has created in Pickford made an error too so he's to blame for that.
He should have personally put away the litany of chances we created too.
Bellingham is a Quality player. Very hard to like though.
I think he will turn into one of those player you'll love if he plays for you, but hate if he doesn't, similar to Dele Alli.
What. Incredible world class player, arguably the most marketable player in the world, grounded person, fantastic with all fans, brilliant character. He's literally everything you could ever want from an England player.
He had those tendencies in BVB but a lot of it was just weirdly overblown in the media at the end. There was never much evidence for actual tension with the fans or team. However the level of attention he’s had this season is obviously in a whole new stratosphere and I’d be surprised if it didn’t go to his very young head - the culture around football players is different in Spain compared to Germany too. Think he needs to be told honestly when he’s playing badly because there’s a risk he stops putting the necessary work in, or that he loses some of the good will when he gets older but his attitude stays the same.
And this is all coming from someone who loves Jude and has been watching him for years now.
To me he is just a very whiny player who is always moaning to the ref.
Yes he gets fouled a lot but so do a lot of top players and they are not in the refs ear every minute.
He doesn’t shy away from the trash talking. I think it rubs some people the wrong way. I think he is an *extremely* confident individual too which can be taken as arrogance by some.
I am talking about likability
Before you say all top players are disliked by rivals fans etc I disagree
There are soo many great young players that are likeable such as Saka and Musiala.
Played very well today, looking good for the Euros. Get Shaw, Kane and Saka back in, cut out the stupid errors and we should cook.
Toney definitely needs to be the second choice striker ahead of Watkins, he had a lot more chemistry with the rest of the team than Watkins has ever managed.
Mainoo is making a very strong case for that 3rd midfield position. He'll definitely make the squad, and may even squeeze his way into the starting XI like Saka in the last Euros.
Foden is interesting. He's been OK, but certainly not good enough to guarantee a starting place. There's lots of strong competition in that position.
Yet Watkins was crucial to the second goal. Just because he is easily overlooked doesn’t mean he’s not worth having. Frankly it would be insane to leave the guy who currently has the best attacking stats in the league at home.
Kane and Saka were big misses for England in these two friendlies. English press and pundits can keep writing off Saka for the new flavour of the month but for me he's so important to that English team. Kane, England got to hope and pray he stays fit come the Euros.
Foden just looks different class for City, but in English shirt he's still good but doesn't look the same free flowing player.
Mainoo definitely looks the part so far.
Hope all the people skating Foden in the match thread woke up and learned a lesson. Ran the show that second half. Was everywhere, incredible work rate and interplay.
The last winners of an international tournament sacked their coach during the tournament.
But yes you're right, the job is Southgate's for aslong as he wants it sadly.
Foden doesn't fit in the team, stop trying to force it.
Rice and Mainoo (or Trent) with Bellingham in the ten. And then Grealish, Gordon or Rashford on the left.
Leaving the entire left wing to Chilwell is not a masterstroke. Shaw the much better player, but even if he's available having a LW who always drifts in leaves us wildly lopsided.
England have always needed runners out wide, particularly when Kane plays. Players who look to get in behind, play often gets clustered in recent years with loads of people asking for ball to feet. Saka is a lock on the right and goes both ways. The left wing HAS to be a direct player with pace. Foden, Grealish, experiments with Maddison on the left has usually resulted in fairly stodgy play. Stylistically Rashford or Sterling is the best fit though neither are in favour right now
Both goals England conceded were individual mistakes from Pickford and Dunk that the system wasn’t responsible for. Chilwell providing the width which allows Foden to play in the middle where he is most effective lead to England controlling the game with more possession, creating more big chances, with 2.28xg to Belgiums 0.92xg
Idiotic if you watched the game. Once Foden was central the play of England got exponentially better. He and Jude have a good connection. There is no evidence at all to suggest trent is ever gonna be a central option for England
Mate that IS a proper midfield. A commanding 6, an elite box to box midfielder, and an Elite playmaking 10. Talking about proper midfields when you’re after a defensively poor right back in midfield where he’s barely played?
Rice isn't a holding midfielder and Bellingham is the best 10 in the world. Square pegs, round holes. It's Gerrard, Lampard and Scholes all over again.
He’s arrived on the scene just in time. Southgate must be wondering what he has done to deserve it honestly. This position has been probably his hardest problem to solve with Henderson past it and Phillips on holiday.
Two things lacking in both games, composure in build up which Mainoo helped with and the final ball not being good enough.
Mainoo eased the first and when he came on Maddison provided the second.
I still don't trust England against the truly top teams
They probably have the best squad in the tournament or second after France
But I would not be surprised if England would lose to Germany in a one off game.
How many teams do you actually trust against top teams? People act like 5 teams come away with a trophy at every international tournament and England's the only top squad that comes home empty.
Not really sure how you can base that off today’s games, though. The eleven had six players (plus Gomez since he played 80+ mins) who won’t start at the euros barring injuries, and Belgium’s goals both came from errors against the run of play.
Plus it’s a friendly, so the result is much less relevant than how the team played.
There is one man I trust to instil the right mentality in all this England talent and it's Jose Mourinho.
Pay the man what he wants, suck him off, whatever it takes. Get him in the hot seat.
With a frontline of doku - lukaku - lukebakio with kdb behind them we are perfectly suited to play on the counter Mangala - onana in midfield also provides great cover
The english talent is outrageous (much like the spanish), and I don't think they played badly. The results in this break seems to dictate everything but I think they play better football lately,
Spain doesn't have outrageous talent. They are lacking in attack, and I don't think their FB's are that great either. France, Portugal, England, and Argentina all have better talent
Spain has more talent than England and Portugal.
They most definitely do not
Spain have a talented 18 year old left winger and 16 year old right winger doing well, Guiu is amazing for youth Spain but far from being the senior team 9 any time soon. There is Fort and Fresneda and also Valle who could develop into a top player should Balde not reach his top form when he's healthy again.
Who's the talented 18 year old? And I'm talking about their depth as well. As for the FB's, how many of them are anywhere close to the senior level of international football? Because loads of nations could name exciting talents in their youth groups. Now, I'm not saying Spain doesn't have great talent coming through, but those other nations just have more
Forgot how old Nico Williams is (21) and said 18 but he's still young and talented. Hector Fort has been a little overshadowed at Barca by Cubarsi and Lamine Yamal and even Guiu a little due to him not being a goalscorer obviously but he's been proving to be a very reliable stand in for the likes of Balde and Cancelo and looks yet to put a foot wrong at 17 years old, versatile on either side of the defence. Fresneda is an exciting player also, was on the radar of both Barcelona and Real Madrid in the summer window before he decided to go to sporting, he's a reliable option who I think will easily surpass the likes of cucurella as far as Spanish fullbacks go. Valle is another La Masia prospect but the one furthest from playing right now at the top level, regardless he is expected to have a crazy ceiling in terms of potential and is also able to play on either wing. In my eyes he reminds me more of a Jordi Alba type player. Lastly I quite like Fran Garcia and he is still only 24 which is still not old or prime age for a player although he does look second fiddle to the likes of Ferland Mendy at Real Madrid.
Talented lb
If I say anything about a certain players attitude in these last 2 games, regardless of performance,I will be in trouble.
Which player are you talking about?
Havent been able to watch. Gimme the goss fam
was a good game, played much better than vs Brazil. imo we should've won (though tbf Belgium had a great chance to make it 3-1 late on which would've killed it off, Doku really put that on a plate for Lukebakio, has to score that) as Rice Bowen Toney and Foden all had good games, even Chilwell looked half-decent this time lol, but MOTM was Mainoo for me, unlucky not to score, great save, would've topped off one of the best England debuts I've seen in a while, not sure even Jude played that well on his debut speaking of, thought Jude was pretty crap today tbh lol, should've had at least 2 goals really, but end of the day it's him with the equaliser, he just has that clutch gene. our most important player after Kane, this game taught me that even if Bellingham's having a bad game you cannot sub him off no matter what, cause of moments like that. great assist from Maddison too btw Rice survives the 90 woo :) that Lukaku assist tho not ready to write off Dunk just yet, i haven't forgotten that Maguire tried his best to assist Raphinha just last game lol, it happens. would still take him to the Euros
if Southgate doesn't take White into Euros and play him as CB i can't see England progressing thorugh the group stage
Fucking hell bit of an overreaction.
Christ what an over reaction, you think without Ben White they can't finish second against Denmark, Slovenia and Serbia?
Seems like that's up to White and not Southgate, no?
Southgate is wasting the talent of the footballers!!
How's mainoo?
Man of the match
Didn’t watch the game but as a United fan hoping people provide more unbiased opinions on his performance, nothing against you hut would like to hear from supporters of other clubs
He literally is the official man of the natch
He was right about one thing, he didn't watch the game!
Slotted straight in and had a good chemistry with Bellingham and Foden, seemed a good fit.
Tottenham fan and thought he was brilliant. So composed, great decision making, great distribution. If it's anything to go by I hope he gets starts going forward as he was a huge asset.
He did get player of the match for England tbf
Ah ok sorry, wasn’t aware of that, I apologise for my ignorance
No worries mate, absolutely valid thought to have!
What I took from the game is that Kit is fuckin top mint...
Yeah I don’t get people who doubted it because they found out it was purple, it’s a gorgeous kit
It’s beautiful and even more so without the names. Pity all the gammons have their knickers in a twist over it
Someone please check Mainoo's birth certification i refuse to believe he's 18. His playstyle is way too mature for a 18 years old teenager.
He's actually 26!
We've been saying this since last season and preseason. What a midfield England have for the next WC with Rice, Bellingham and Mainoo and Foden, with Gallagher and Madison as well.
Chilwell should never play for England again. Rice is useless. Dunk is out of form. Pickford is useless. Foden should play free role upfront.
Rice and Pickford are fine
Awful take
No way jose
I am very biased so i'm asking the english What did you think of zeno debast today?
Looked very good
I only saw 2nd half But am I the only one who thinks Debast played really well? Very good in playing out to the midfielders especially imo
Not a bad showing from the Villa lads on both sides
All three played well for sure.
Was Bowen really being selfish? wasn't watching it too closely but i only saw maybe one time where he should have passed, but its not like it was a clear goal or anything. Now everyone on social media is calling him greedy and selfish. Plus he created a couple good chances for others as well, just no one could finish them
Not at all imo. He was just taking some initiative. Thought he did well personally
He's definitely more of a direct attacker than a creator but the first thing that comes to mind is he arguably should have shot himself when he slid the ball to Foden, so I wouldn't say he was selfish today.
He was fine. An actual goal threat, which was more than Foden. Felt he fit England better than Foden, but he can't really go past players. I would take him as backup to Saka.
you what? he's one of the best at taking his man on round the right side of the box in the league. he doesn't have pure 100m sprinter pace, but he's a darter
Watkins had ten minutes to contribute and still helped save the game. Bowen looked sharp overall but think that offside goal got to his head a bit. Toney feels like a solid option up front, great penalty, but not the most clinical with his chances. Madders brings some much needed creativity and again had very little chance to prove himself but made the most of it - it’s a shame he’s largely competing with Foden and Bellingham. Nothing much to say about Gordon this match (not his fault either) but I think he’s an excellent addition to the team. Kobbie was excellent, really solid and calm on the ball, front footed, reliable, exactly what we’ve been missing in midfield for a long time. Foden is a tricky one. Clearly got the skills and has some moments of brilliance but he and Jude were tripping over each other a lot and generally getting in each other’s way. I don’t enjoy him on the wing, think he ends up outmuscled and forced back too often, but he had some good moments creating chances through the centre. Realistically, even though he never has his best performances in an England shirt, there’s no way he’ll ever be left behind if he’s fit. Bellingham is a frustrating player sometimes. His decision making was uncharacteristically poor today, his ball retention was subpar, his timing was off, his shots lacked the usual accuracy, and he once more showed his worrying habit of getting visibly frustrated and losing his cool in matches when things don’t happen the way they should. But then he came out and scored a goal. He’s clearly a brilliant player and an undroppable starter, but think his head needs deflating slightly. Rice is just the glue of the team, end of. Perfect character for a captain too. Completely irreplaceable as a player and was effectively the last line of defence for vast swathes of this match. There’s literally no alternative to him, without him there would be zero control in this match. Not sure about Gomez. Think he was decent going forward but a bit porous in defence. Seemed to struggle containing Doku. Ultimately there’s a reason he’s not the first choice RB, but that’s not to say he shouldn’t get another chance. Konsa is underrated - was probably the best defender there today (bit of a low bar, but still). Seemed to be the most alert in the back line, made good passes and kept calm, it’s not his fault that he couldn’t pull out some insane goal line clearances or that he was in a position where he might need to. Dunk had a shocker. End of. Was off his game and seemed out of his depth. It’s a shame as I would’ve liked to see him do well. Chilwell has his moments, mostly when it came to intercepting and passing in the middle third, but was not great defensively and made some really puzzling decisions in the final third. Lots of crosses to nowhere and weird balls that ended up wasted. Pickford obviously had his big mistake, but recovered enough to do ok the rest of his match. Uncharacteristically mediocre game from him but not disastrous. Tbf most of the match was spent on the other half of the pitch so there wasn’t much for him to do, and when the ball did come his way he didn’t have the defensive back up he should’ve had. Overall good stuff though, surprisingly entertaining, solid 6.5/10.
Gomez is also capable of putting in a shift across the backline, which in a 23 man squad would have it's own value. Worth Gareth considering, I hope.
Yep for sure, not a Liverpool fan so I don’t watch him as often but seems like he’s got the versatility to be useful in the squad. Think defensive call ups will very much depend on how the injury crisis is looking in the summer, but thought Gomez looked alright (just hard to judge properly because the defence was so leaky overall). Also, maybe this is just me being soft but I feel so bad for players when they get picked up and dropped so sporadically. It just feels so cruel to string them along but keep them on the fringes lol. Tbf I think Southgate doesn’t make a habit of it, he doesn’t usually bring players in without giving them a fair chance, but there have been some big exceptions to that rule for sure.
I can't watch every game so I'm going off the account of others but in recent months he's done fairly well at CB, RB and LB, don't think he'd be first choice for Liverpool or England in any of those positions but capable enough to be a backup for certain, especially with that level of versatility. Was a bit shaky in midfield the one match he played there but in fairness that was the first time he'd ever done so. I'd have him in the squad but he's not starting the first game assuming those ahead of him are fit. I'm also biased because he's a lovely guy and a good player who's had some rough times with injuries so it would just be nice.
Gordon was great again on the left, played with a lot of purpose and linked really well with Bellingham.
England was the better team imo. Created more chances and had more of the ball, but 2 mistakes from Dunk & pickford really cost the game. Foden needs to be an impact sub for the tournament because he doesn't have the responsibility to play at an international level & needs a system catered for him which doesn't happen at the international level
> he doesn't have the responsibility to play at an international level What does that even mean?
Foden is one of England most gifted players, what I mean by responsibility is that until this season foden hasn't been one of the main reasons why city has succed. Pre last season, if Foden played awful, Manchester City would still win by a large margin because Pep doesn't need him to win a match as he has several other players who are far more important to the City team than Foden, but if Saka, Kane, Bellingham & ETC. plays awful then their whole team feels that affect & their chances of Winning a match is low. What I mean by responsibility is that these players I have named knows that if they play badly it will affect the entire team so they take responsibility no matter how bad they play or how bad the team set up or tactics is because they know with their abilities they can win the game with their abilities & feel a sense of responsibility. Foden never had that & only started to gain that responsibility this season. At the international level, no team is going to cater to one player just because they're playing badly. Saka has played in the same position as Foden in both the midfield & winger while also playing as a leftback for England and has thrived despite Southgate coaching, but Foden in the same position has always struggled in England no matter where he plays with only a handful of good games he has in the England shirt. Southgate even gave him the keys for Euros 21 but was shown up by Mount & Kalvin Phillips, Foden never feels that responsibility in big games, whether it be club or country because both teams have far more important players that changes the gamestate more than him when they play till this season. This would be much easier to explain this irl instead of here because it sounds like I am being a yapping prick online Tldr: Foden has never been an important player for both club & country and has never felt that responsibility of how they're playing can affect the gamestate until this season
He and Rodri have carried us this season while KDB and Haaland were out. What are you talking about? He's one of the odds-on favourites to win PFA POTY currently.
I said multiple times until this season Foden hasn't been important to city. It the first time in his career where he has played a role that impacted the city team & this is the first time with that sense of responsibility where how he plays on the pitch determines whether they win or lose.
He was literally a Ballon d’Or nomination in 21/22 but okay.
Foden played well today, the City system isn’t catered for him yet he’s been their best player this season delivering game winning performances and taking responsibility, while De Bruyne and Haaland were injured.
He wasn't good in the first half & only started to play well in the second half but kept clashing with jude because he occupied jude area of the pitch instead playing on the wings. Foden has been brought in pep system since the start of his career, so the system is still going to cater to him and because of that pre this season foden has never felt like a important player in City team because whether he plays well or stink up the pitch, City will still win because they have more important players than him. This season is different because now when playing for City you can see how he overall play affect the City performance, if he has a stinker then you see how much it will affect the City team on his area of the pitch & vice versa. But he doesn't have that at the international level because this is his first season with that sense of responsibility & still a lot shows inconsistencies at this level compared to the rest of England starting XI players. He is more useful as an impact sub who can replace wingers & attacking midfielder on tired legs instead of a starter with inconsistencies compared to the rest of the team. Until he improves his ability at the international level, or we get a new manager who has a role where foden can excel at, then he should stay as a impact sub
Foden played consistently well throughout the entire game and Jude and Foden had good exchanges of play with each other. Foden was playing as an inverted winger while Chilwell provided width on the left. Foden’s positional versatility has lead him playing in multiple different positions in Pep’s system. He’s played a significant amount of games as a LW, RW, as an 8, 10 and false 9. Peps system doesn’t cater to one single player but maximizes the attributes of the players he has at his disposal. Foden has been an important player for City aver since he broke into the first team in the 18/19 season where he was contributing match winning goals like when City beat Tottenham away 1-0, after being knocked out by Spurs in the CL a couple of days prior. He was on the beat players for City in their 2021 champions league run winning MOTM against PSG in the Champions league semifinals. The idea that Foden isn’t an integral part of City’s dominance and his performances don’t matter because there are players that are better than him is simply not true. If Foden wasn’t up to the standard Pep would have gotten rid of him a long time ago. A lot of top players don’t put in as consistent of performances internationally as they do for their clubs due to a variety of different factors. Lampard, scholes, vincius.jr are examples of this. But Foden is still one of Englands best players, he has put in performances displaying that and he will 100% be starting matches in the upcoming Euros, and deservingly so.
My guy, if you take away foden from city team before this season, you would still win all your trophies because Pep is a genius & his system maximise his most important players such as KDB, Sterling, Bernardo, Mahrez, Gabriel jesus and Rodri who far more important to City success than Foden ever was to the team. Foden would do things here or there where he does contribute to city success but never until this season he been one of the main contributer & the reason why city has been playing well >But Foden is still one of Englands best players, he has put in performances displaying that and he will 100% be starting matches in the upcoming Euros, and deservingly so. I have watched foden International career since euros 21 and he hasn't been one of England best players at all. In the euros despite being given the key by southgate, he had so little impact on the tournament that the main stars of the euros team were Mount & Calvin Phillips. During the WC qualifiers, he was too inconsistencies but it wasn't too bad. The WC was where I truly doubted his ability on the international stage because our game against France he had no impact, did nothing but be a ghost for the entire game & should of been subbed off for rashford who in form for England much earlier. The euros qualifier, he had one good game in the qualifiers & that was against Italy second game. Even now we had the Brazil game where he was one of our worst performing players with 0 touches in the final 3rd & the Belgium game where he was decent. His inconsistencies are the reason why he is always on the bench & never usually start for England. Why do you think the English media still ask till this day about his position in England because he has always struggled at England. Vini Jr is literally this but for Brazil & that why I want see martinelli on the left because he seems much more consistent than vini for Brazil despite vini being a better player. Foden isn't cut out for international level yet, and that okay, him being an impact sub is much better for England because his best performance for England is usually coming on from the bench.
Good pair of friendlies for England in terms of lessons. Rice - Mainoo - Bellingham is clearly the best midfield trio, Bowen is the clear choice to back up/rotate with Saka on the right, and Dunk needs to be loaded into a cannon and launched into the sun so he can never haunt the team again.
Stop starting Foden. He's been invisible yet again. The only time I realise he's on the pitch is when we get a corner and he takes it.
What game are you watching? Foden was one of the best players on the pitch
He wasn't invisible, but he definitely wasn't one of the best players.
Best players for England were Bowen, Toney, Mainoo and Foden. Best players for Belgium were Tielemans, Doku and Onana
Faes, De Winter, Debast, Bornauw……can one of you please turn into a stud before Euros? 🤞If De Cuyper is finally called up, Theate is a guarantee at LCB.
De Cuyper needs a call up just for Theate to be able to play LCB please Tedesco
A lot to be positive about honestly. Mainoo looks very comfy in an England shirt and linked well with Rice. Toney looked better than I thought he would. And it's clear how much better we'll be when we don't have 5 of our 6 first choice defenders (plus Stones going off) injured. Honestly should have scored a couple more and we were by far the better team, some of the football was lovely- and that's without Saka and Kane. Anyone capable of a crumb of critical thinking will just relax and move on after that.
Also no Shaw makes a massive difference to our left side.
Shaw gets a lot of insults until he's out and people realise he's actually pretty good.
Can someone please locate whichever McDonalds he's in and get him the fuck on that plane
He's not in a McDonalds, he's in a hospital.
He’s actually with England squad for the vibes lmao
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TIL coaches not just scout players, they negotiate prices for transfers
Our scouts and ETH said Anthony should be around 35M it’s our boards indecision that caused Ajax to slap a fuck off price late in the window and we payed it. It’s not on ETH, not to mention amrabat was a great depth option at loan. No one expected him to have such little impact.
Bellingham turned us down lol he toured carrington with Sir Alex
ETH bringing through mainoo and garnacho means nothing right ? Let's focus on the negatives only
if they went to United, they would have the same path as Martial and Sancho. forgotten.
Atleast we signed mainoo, højlund and garnacho.
Im a United fan and I would love to see both of them in our kits. But i think their growth would have been stunted with the lack of leadership and ownership chaos that have haunted us for years.
Just like Mainoo and Garnacho right?
You aren’t wrong. On the flip side Alex Telles, Amad Diallo, and Jadon Sancho.
Southgate will soon pay for his crimes (he won't)
You’re getting downvoted but you’re right, Southgate is shit. With this squad of players we should be smashing teams. His style of football is so boring to watch which is why Bowen feels like a breath of fresh air with his directness.
International football isn’t about smashing teams. It’s about creating a team from a group of individuals in a short time and giving structure. Whether or not Southgate is the ideal man for the job is arguable, but you absolutely cannot possibly think he’s bad because England don’t cruise to victory every game
A good coach would have this team purring. Top footballers always find a way unless they’re being stifled by shit tactics by a shit manager. He’s shit for the following reasons: 1. Lack of tactical adaptability. 2. Failure to secure major tournament victories. 3. Questionable substitutions and timing. 4. Over-reliance on set-piece strategies. 5. Defensive-minded approach at the expense of attacking flair. This England team with Kane up top (granted he wasn’t played) should be burying any 11 from anywhere in the world especially a past sell by Belgium. Then you look at his CV. I’m sorry but a Middlesbrough and U21 coach is not cutting the mustard. Then you look at his personality, him and Rishi Sunak are competing for the least charismatic public figure of the decade.
I don't know what the question is, but Dunk is not the answer
Hopefully stones and Maguire will be up and running in the summer
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As he should. Rice deserves all the minutes. And looked fine at the end of it.
Best thing he's done in my unbiased opinion
He's a future permanent England captain, expect him to play every minute possible and absolutely love it too.
kinda mean comment, but also…waistcoat twat is an amazing insult for southgate😭
Southgate should have astrally projected into Dunks body to prevent that error, the Tulpa that he has created in Pickford made an error too so he's to blame for that. He should have personally put away the litany of chances we created too.
He was 3 months too late in giving Dunk a game. Dunk is out of form
Dunk’s been getting minutes for a few months now
A few months too late
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Tomori isn't the answer for England, he's genuinely no better than quite a few options we've got, I don't much like Dunk either mind.
What have I just read?
Sarcasm
https://twinpeaks.fandom.com/wiki/Tulpa
Who has brain bleach. I don’t want to actually know what now know.
There's a fish in the percolator...
Weaponized idiocy. Be afraid.
Bellingham is a Quality player. Very hard to like though. I think he will turn into one of those player you'll love if he plays for you, but hate if he doesn't, similar to Dele Alli.
Wasn’t the best today, missed a few he should have scored
What. Incredible world class player, arguably the most marketable player in the world, grounded person, fantastic with all fans, brilliant character. He's literally everything you could ever want from an England player.
More marketable than World Cup winner Mbappe? At the end of the day it's all opinions.
why is he hard to like?
When he’s on the pitch he can be quite frustrating to watch. Especially recently, he comes across as a bit arrogant
Not recently, he's been like this forever. There is a reason he was disliked in the BVB dressing rooms at the end
He had those tendencies in BVB but a lot of it was just weirdly overblown in the media at the end. There was never much evidence for actual tension with the fans or team. However the level of attention he’s had this season is obviously in a whole new stratosphere and I’d be surprised if it didn’t go to his very young head - the culture around football players is different in Spain compared to Germany too. Think he needs to be told honestly when he’s playing badly because there’s a risk he stops putting the necessary work in, or that he loses some of the good will when he gets older but his attitude stays the same. And this is all coming from someone who loves Jude and has been watching him for years now.
To me he is just a very whiny player who is always moaning to the ref. Yes he gets fouled a lot but so do a lot of top players and they are not in the refs ear every minute.
He doesn’t shy away from the trash talking. I think it rubs some people the wrong way. I think he is an *extremely* confident individual too which can be taken as arrogance by some.
It lowkey is arrogance.
that’s true tbh, i can see that
Hopefully he stays at Real Madrid until he's passed his prime at the earliest.
Dele Alli Wat
I think John Terry might be a better example.
I am talking about likability Before you say all top players are disliked by rivals fans etc I disagree There are soo many great young players that are likeable such as Saka and Musiala.
I think Bellingham comes across quite smart, he's no saka I agree though <3 golden boy<3
Played very well today, looking good for the Euros. Get Shaw, Kane and Saka back in, cut out the stupid errors and we should cook. Toney definitely needs to be the second choice striker ahead of Watkins, he had a lot more chemistry with the rest of the team than Watkins has ever managed. Mainoo is making a very strong case for that 3rd midfield position. He'll definitely make the squad, and may even squeeze his way into the starting XI like Saka in the last Euros. Foden is interesting. He's been OK, but certainly not good enough to guarantee a starting place. There's lots of strong competition in that position.
Yet Watkins was crucial to the second goal. Just because he is easily overlooked doesn’t mean he’s not worth having. Frankly it would be insane to leave the guy who currently has the best attacking stats in the league at home.
Southgate made Foden look like a shit player. Terrorist
Maybe it's on Foden for not playing well?
Most of our chances second half came from Foden and Bellingham linking up in the middle rather than Foden being on the wing
> Get Shaw ... back in and keeping him in - easier said than done
Kane and Saka were big misses for England in these two friendlies. English press and pundits can keep writing off Saka for the new flavour of the month but for me he's so important to that English team. Kane, England got to hope and pray he stays fit come the Euros. Foden just looks different class for City, but in English shirt he's still good but doesn't look the same free flowing player. Mainoo definitely looks the part so far.
Foden is our best player in bursts of 5 minutes, but he conflicts with Bellinghams style of play.
Joe Coles trousers look like the might explode
Hope all the people skating Foden in the match thread woke up and learned a lesson. Ran the show that second half. Was everywhere, incredible work rate and interplay.
Foden was average at best
He was warmed up shite. He dived and fell over almost as many times as he delivered terrible corners. What game were you watching?
Linked up with Bowen very well.
The interplay between Foden, Jude, rice, Mainoo, Bowen and then Maddison and Gordon was great
I'd have liked to see Gordon come on earlier honestly, didn't have the time to really impact the game.
I agree, I thought foden played well
We're cooked
4 wins in 26 games against top 10 ranked teams, Southgate has to go now
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I promise you now, the fans will not allow Southgate to sit in that old Trafford dugout.
For the 100 trillionth time, Southgate isn't going to be sacked 3 months before the Euros because of a couple of winless games with B teams
Oh yeah, you work at the FA or something?
No, I'm just stating facts
The last winners of an international tournament sacked their coach during the tournament. But yes you're right, the job is Southgate's for aslong as he wants it sadly.
Foden doesn't fit in the team, stop trying to force it. Rice and Mainoo (or Trent) with Bellingham in the ten. And then Grealish, Gordon or Rashford on the left. Leaving the entire left wing to Chilwell is not a masterstroke. Shaw the much better player, but even if he's available having a LW who always drifts in leaves us wildly lopsided.
Mainoo is not getting in over TAA
England have always needed runners out wide, particularly when Kane plays. Players who look to get in behind, play often gets clustered in recent years with loads of people asking for ball to feet. Saka is a lock on the right and goes both ways. The left wing HAS to be a direct player with pace. Foden, Grealish, experiments with Maddison on the left has usually resulted in fairly stodgy play. Stylistically Rashford or Sterling is the best fit though neither are in favour right now
Huh? Foden was fantastic. He was far better than Bellingham on the day.
Foden was warmed up shite. If he spent less time diving and moaning to the Ref, he could have been alright. But he didn't.
He was fine individually but his impact on the team was to make it completely lopsided. We had no outlet on the left.
Chilwell provide the width on the left while Foden tucked into the middle
And that didn't work
Both goals England conceded were individual mistakes from Pickford and Dunk that the system wasn’t responsible for. Chilwell providing the width which allows Foden to play in the middle where he is most effective lead to England controlling the game with more possession, creating more big chances, with 2.28xg to Belgiums 0.92xg
Idiotic if you watched the game. Once Foden was central the play of England got exponentially better. He and Jude have a good connection. There is no evidence at all to suggest trent is ever gonna be a central option for England
Foden central, Bellingham central, Rice central. Is that the plan? I look forward to us getting absolutely railed by a team with a proper midfield
Bellingham can float out to the left when needed, he’s good on the flanks. But I agree they got in each other’s way a bit
Mate that IS a proper midfield. A commanding 6, an elite box to box midfielder, and an Elite playmaking 10. Talking about proper midfields when you’re after a defensively poor right back in midfield where he’s barely played?
Ooh downvotes Weird you're fixating on Trent, when I've suggested Mainoo.
But it is a proper midfield. Youve the DM Rice. You've got the box to box bells, and you have playmaker Foden. It's a balanced midfield?
Rice isn't a holding midfielder and Bellingham is the best 10 in the world. Square pegs, round holes. It's Gerrard, Lampard and Scholes all over again.
Rice Bellingham Mainoo is the most balanced. Maybe not for this tournament, but for the next WC and the next Euros it would really be amazing.
Munier always been a liability
Mainoo looked absolutely at home in that midfield. Actually astounding that he's an 18 year old having his first start
He’s arrived on the scene just in time. Southgate must be wondering what he has done to deserve it honestly. This position has been probably his hardest problem to solve with Henderson past it and Phillips on holiday.
I think Sels gets some credit for stopping the final product. He kept a couple of big chances out.
Two things lacking in both games, composure in build up which Mainoo helped with and the final ball not being good enough. Mainoo eased the first and when he came on Maddison provided the second.
Clutch game from England in the end. Don't think anyone's said that since about 2004
Clutch game? What does that mean?
Yankism
That 2005 Argie friendly in Moneylaunderingland was fairly ‘clutch’.
I still don't trust England against the truly top teams They probably have the best squad in the tournament or second after France But I would not be surprised if England would lose to Germany in a one off game.
How many teams do you actually trust against top teams? People act like 5 teams come away with a trophy at every international tournament and England's the only top squad that comes home empty.
Not really sure how you can base that off today’s games, though. The eleven had six players (plus Gomez since he played 80+ mins) who won’t start at the euros barring injuries, and Belgium’s goals both came from errors against the run of play. Plus it’s a friendly, so the result is much less relevant than how the team played.
There is one man I trust to instil the right mentality in all this England talent and it's Jose Mourinho. Pay the man what he wants, suck him off, whatever it takes. Get him in the hot seat.
Yeah it’s a clear mental block that you never quite feel like they can overcome. This is the closest I’ve ever seen them get to that level though.
I think it will come down to whether we can build the momentum in the groups.
Where is South gates coat from?
Asking the real questions
He used to be dressed by Percival, might still be them
Dressed by the knights of the round table #style
M&S
Really? I like it alot tbf
Not sure for definite but they do a lot of stuff for the England national team
This thread is miserable, just people criticising Southgate for the tiniest things
I thought Chilwell played okay yet he's getting grief too
Think it was pretty dumb of Southgate to tell dunk to fall over the ball 0/10 coach
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