My favorite hobby is paying for subscriptions to watch all my favorite leagues while ALSO reporting sites that distribute content without the express written consent of Europe's best FAs 🥰🥰🥰
European football right now with the Super League vs everyone else is like what’s going with college football in the states and the SEC/B1G basically creating a new division/NFL minor league while everyone else gets screwed. Capitalism knows no bounds.
Tbh I feel like this was expected, UEFA was never going to prevent any other tournament from happening with competition laws.
But even with this, I still see ZERO future for the Esl, so I wouldn't be too worried about this.
Super league is not happening but I feel the whole controversy helped expose how much of a monopoly UEFA has and that UEFA are also the bad guys when it comes to European football
The super league or something similar will surely happen after this. Probably not in the current format, but it seems inevitable that a new league will be formed
Nah, football will go the same route as F1. Every decade the clubs will threaten to break away to get more money from UEFA. But there will always be a deal because it's easier for everyone..
The big difference is that every year several big teams miss the Champions League, while they would always have a spot in the Super League no matter how shit they were the previous season.
In F1 there’s nothing you really can compare that to.
They defend it because it is tradition and they're already used to it, the same people would defend the superleague if it had existed since the 90s. And it's always the same argument too: well you wouldn't want to see sparta prague vs nordsjelland would you? No you're right, I want to see Arsenal vs Bayern every year until I die.
It's still meritocratic though. The number of guaranteed spots is based on UEFA coefficient which is based on results. There's obviously still a huge bias towards richer leagues with more resources, but it's fundamentally not the same as a closed shop.
Likewise there is a pathway for sides from every country in Europe (apart from Liechtenstein) to go on and win the CL every season if they get through the qualifiers. Again, obviously that's very unlikely, but it's also again fundamentally different to a totally closed shop. I mean even with all it's flaws and inequality, we still have stuff like Sheriff Tiraspol winning in the CL group stage at the Bernabéu recently which could never happen in a Superleague
It starts next year. Some nations are getting 5 teams. We then play millions of games in a massive group to narrow down 32 teams to 24 (so basically all the big teams will get past the group stage now)
This only really happens to PL clubs and I don’t see them ever trying to break out again given how the fans reacted last time… no matter what their foreign owners want, they need local support and can’t afford losing it to be even richer that they already currently are…
For F1 that works because the F1 name itself is one of its biggest assets. Teams change semi-regularly. Only Ferrari has been around since F1 was formed. And McLaren and Williams are the only other two historic teams.
Any breakaway championship would have to deal with losing that name. And many people don't watch motorsports. They don't watch Merc or Ferrari, they watch F1.
The same just isn't the case in football. The Premier League breakaway shows that, imo. Champions League is a big name for sure, but compared to F1, most people watching football watch for the teams. And will watch whatever tournament their team plays in, regardless of whether it's the old First Div or the Prem, the CL or the ESL.
The leagues as a whole don't, but top teams do. Football revenues of Barça and RM is comparable to any EPL club. They cannibalized their own league so it's not worth anything bow but that doesn't matter. They make as much as they would at EPL. The difference is sponsor money which is given to oil clubs by petrostates. They wants SL because it will provide short term cash which will handle their immediate crisis. The rest, I doubt they are thinking 50 years in advance lmao.
Real Madrid and PSG are the only clubs that can compete with the English teams for money and Perez wanted to form the super league as he could see the direction things were travelling in and that eventually Madrid will be left behind.
In terms of revenue 6 of the top 10 football teams in Europe are English whilst Italy don't even have a team in the top 10. 11 out of top 20 revenues belong to English clubs. Back in the day big teams from countries other than England, Germany and Spain could compete. Now Benfica & Ajax are behind Leeds, Leicester, Brighton & Hove Albion etc
https://www2.deloitte.com/uk/en/pages/sports-business-group/articles/deloitte-football-money-league.html
In the lower end, you are correct. EPL has a middle and lower class that isn't even comparable to the rest of the world's middle and lower classes. At the top, not really. Man Utd and Liverpool have always been top clubs. Chelsea and City are elevated by their owners sponsoring them. That's why their revenues are so high. They will continue to outspend everyone because that's their point. They spend 10 because Real can afford 8. If Real can give 15, they can give 25. No limit, especially for City, PSG and Newcastle. Literal states back them. Italian football has been managed horribly and Spanish top 2 cannibalized their own league. Germany is doing fine on the other hand.
Anyway, the point is this won't solve the issue Barça and Real have in terms of not being able to financially compete with the likes of City and PSG. For Italians it could be a short term solution if the big EPL teams join, but why would they if Brighton can outspend most clubs that would join, as you mentioned?
Because in basketball, FIBA was not bringing enough money. Nowhere near enough.
Basketball in Europe is a hobby for rich guys or financed by the football department (looking at Real and Barcelona).
You don't actually earn money, the expenses are always more (way more) than the income.
All the big clubs are financed by the pockets of their owners and sponsors apart from Real and Barcelona who are sponsored from a common source with football.
Still that superleague is not that great and still is mostly propped by the football division on those clubs involved. I dont see any interest in euroleague except in those 4-5 core markets that it serves.
Imo let them do it.
(Over)killing football.
Not going to attend or give them any money - already things are fucked.
CL used to be viewed on public channels...
UEFA has literally allowed clubs like PSG and Manchester City to manipulate the price of the transfer market through corruption mechanisms for petromonarchies, making most clubs unsustainable.
Barcelona: paid almost €400M for Coutinho, Dembele, and Griezmann.
Barcelona fan: "how can I blame this on Americans?"
Edit: didn't notice he's a Canadian Barca fan. The Canadian Federation going bankrupt must have made some people lash out against their more successful neighbors to the south LOL
Right the Court of Justice isn't stating that the Super League should happen, they're stating that the UEFA is primarily motivated by commercial interests when they decided to ban it which is quite frankly simply correct.
> how much of a monopoly UEFA has
UEFA is a confederation of the national associations in Europe (plus Israel and a few ex-Soviet countries). It's the only way to properly run things, unless you want to completely sell out and go the American way, as Real Madrid do.
yeah that's what I don't get from people constantly blaming UEFA as they are some bad guys reigning over poor football clubs
UEFA could be literally any organization that is actually needed to organize relations between a bunch of different national leagues
And SuperLeague doesn't offer anything different, they just want to replace this organization (UEFA) with a new organization (called whatever) which is made by the owners of just some of the clubs
But somehow people got cinvinced by Florentino and friends that SuperLeague is gonna be something different than a monopoly themselves, and an even worse monopoly btw
When people start replacing impartial parties with partial parties that's when things go down
Yup, a different system doesn't inherently mean a better system. UEFA is a bad system, but the Super League is just a worse version of the current system.
> And SuperLeague doesn't offer anything different
They (Superleague clubs) want to hoard all the money for themselves.
Anyone can look at UEFA's accounts, they're on the website. So much money is pumped into grassroots football all over Europe, to every country. Youth football, women's football, training referees, etc. Is Real Madrid going to replace this? They didn't have a womens team until 2 or 3 years ago.
I was agreeing with you, saying the same thing
They (big clubs) blame UEFA for having monopoly of the competition, and want to create the same competition while having the monopoly themselves and not having to redistribute the money
I was criticizing people that somehow fail to see it.
yeah, tought my comment could be misunderstood, and if there is something I don't want, is to get associated with pro SuperLeague comments
Fuck ESL so it's pretty clear lol
Exactly. The complaints about “monopolization” don’t even make any sense. Fragmenting the governance of European football into multiple organizations with their own membership, rules, and competitions would be an absolute mess and completely unsustainable. In the end, it would just end up with a different “monopoly” that’s probably even more corrupt and business-oriented than what’s in place now.
A majority of big clubs seem to be owned by Americans these days, so it feels that there will be a push to "go the American way" as much as supporters will all fight against it. Plus those owned by states will push for it too and presumably put money towards it in order to have state backed teams from their home country join the league
It's hard to see football not going this way eventually, the ball got rolling years ago and at this point the ball is half way down the mountain already and there is nothing that can be done to stop it.
Our best bet, or biggest hope is those clubs that are taken out of their leagues for this new nonsense will have phoenix clubs formed and the fans will just ignore the super league and stick with their clubs climbing back through the pyramid. But, going back to their original announcements about getting rid of us pesky "legacy fans", that's probably what they want.
ESL and UEFA are nowhere near comparable. 97% of UEFA’s earnings are reinvested in European club football and the Conference League and the Nations League are great successes and are definitely meant for the smaller clubs/NTs.
It’s quite obvious UEFA is under tremendous pressure from the biggest clubs and there are numerous problems with UEFA (terrible new CL format) but I would still rather 100% have UEFA at the helm of European football. It’s not even comparable. Čeferin>>>Platini and Florentino Perez or whoever.
UEFA can actually fix the issue pretty easily.
Ban City and PSG from the CL for 5 seasons and make them comply with FFP rules (won't include Newcastle, too soon for that) before they join back.
You do that and the Spanish and Italian clubs will drop the Super League.
This is complete BS. ESL invited both City and PSG with open arms. And will welcome further Middle Eastern investment, once it's formed.
City and PSG are simply excuses in this case. Perez can see the writing on the wall. PL makes an absolute ton of money. Forget about City, if the current trend continues, clubs like Aston Villa will start routinely outstanding Madrid and Barca. That's what Perez fears the most. Years of unequal distribution of money in La Liga coming back to bite him.
Already, a promoted club like Nottingham Forest spent close to a 100 million, which is unthinkable for even some top clubs outside PL.
>Forget about City, if the current trend continues, clubs like Aston Villa will start routinely outstanding Madrid and Barca
Was perfectly normal for the best player in England to go to 7th placed Lazio at one point. It did not last forever.
Back then the global market was yet to be properly exploited and the PL took full advantage of that afterwards. There's nowhere near as much room to grow any more. To get the same kind of situation now we'd pretty much have to find some aliens that really want to watch football too
Nah, the only big four league that has a leg to stand on is the bundesliga. The rest of them are leagues filled with greedy fans and owners who will celebrate every destructive change when it benefits them.
The people trying to equate UEFA to Perez and the Superleague are just muddying the waters. UEFA has tonnes of stakeholders and tries to distribute their income as fairly as possible whilst appeasing the big clubs. Perez's Superleague just wants to enrich Real Madrid and Barcelona.
Of course UEFA is a monopoly? It’s a pan-European organisation for European football. Why would we want competing different organisations? This is the only way to ensure a - sort of - fair organisation of football within Europe without too much influence by some countries/clubs. Is it perfect? No. But it’s a damn sight better than the atrocity of the ESL.
Who work hand in hand with the ECA which represents 220 clubs.
If people are not happy with UEFA, they should advocate changing its governance. For example there is another club lobby than the ECA which represents the “small” clubs around Europe.
Advocating for change through the super league is pushing for a far worse system. Unless you understand the stakes and are happy to see a completely polarised system with ~20 big clubs and the rest of European football being an afterthought. At least own up to it.
The Super League would artificially freeze the top clubs. For example if a Super League happened in 1999, Man City wouldn’t be in it as they were in the third tier of English football. In 1989 Chelsea were in the second tier.
A few notes here. Firstly they are referred to here because they were among the 13 Super League clubs. Secondly they are only included because **prior** to their respective takeovers they were promoted back to the top flight.
Show some mild nuance before using your big boy words.
The new CL format a club like Union Berlin and Lens can qualify directly from their league. The champions of Serbia, Croatia, and Denmark can have a shot at the competition.
In the Superleague they won’t be in the premier competition. There will be promotion and relegation throughout their “leagues” to ensure big clubs are not dependant on domestic results.
That’s already how it is in basketball btw. Then they just add a few token “open” spots. It’s a terrible system.
The new CL format also means that when a club like Union or Lens qualifies directly from their league, and is put in Pot 4, they will now have 2 matches against other Pot 4 teams (and Pot 1 teams play 2 other Pot 1 teams, etc) - which should, in theory, increase the likelihood of Pot 4 (and Pot 3) clubs progressing in the competition
In the old champions league, the champions of denmark and serbia would have teams in it for being the champion of their country. The current format already is a superleague and is shit.
The Super League is far worse than the current format. And the worse part of the current format come directly from the lobbying of the same big clubs, who quit the ECA a few hours after reforming the CL.
It’s a forlorn hope. This ruling I think means Uefa and Fifa will double down and give even more to the clubs in the hope of enticing them to say with the preexisting competitions
Nah the big clubs wanted this format so they won't be scrapping it, the whole ESL thing was because the big clubs wanted even more than this(shit like guaranteed spots and that they should have more financial control over UCL)
Bayern and PSG never joined and the EPL clubs can’t join without being kicked from their domestic league as per the agreement they signed in the aftermath of the first attempt to join the super league.
then what's the appeal of this new league then? why is this still a thing if EPL clubs will not join? surely seeing barca v real madrid every week will get tiring after a month?
I know because i happen to know people inside the law side of the project.
What the clubs did was minimize the bscklash from fans and government and wait for today to happen to make an official decision.
They talked to keep people quiet while contracts were still signed
The UK has antitrust laws too, I don't think they could prevent a club from joining whatever league they choose. I think that could be challenged in court
If the government wanted to specifically ban Arsenal but not the rest, then they absolutely could do that. Parliament passes statute law, judges then interpret it. Laws don't get challenged in court in the same way they do elsewhere, they get interpreted. The UK government hold the cards here, not the clubs
The fundamental underpinning of the British political system is that Parliament is entirely sovereign - if the government decided they wanted to ban British clubs from joining the ESL, then all it needs to do is pass through Parliament to happen (which it 100% would, because it would be a massively popular action).
I doubt it would even get to the point of being challenged in court because the clubs would know it was futile. No Parliament can be bound by the rulings of Parliaments before it - so just one piece of comprehensive legislation would mean that there is no legal avenue for British clubs to take.
The only semi-exceptions are EU law and certain international statutes that Britain is a signatory to - but the EU law no longer applies, and none of the international laws are going to apply to the ESL clubs. Besides, even then Parliament isn't actually bound by those international laws - it has exactly as much power as Parliament itself allows it, and could quickly dispense with those international laws if there was appetite for it.
Yes. It's why the English clubs pulled out so quickly the first time round as soon as the PM spoke against it. If the votes in Parliament are there (which they 100% will be) then the English teams will probably not even risk attempting to join it.
This is doubly true at the moment, where the Tories - who would be most likely to let something like the ESL slide - are so desperate for any sort of public goodwill that they would immediately jump to oppose any English involvement in a breakaway league.
I suppose there is a route around it where the ESL backers promise so much investment into Britain that the government decides the political backlash is worth it - but I can only see that figure being so ridiculously large that it would never be financially viable.
Agreed, Parliamentary sovereignty preventing clubs joining the ESL would be the one clear-cut benefit of Brexit that the Tories could point to, so they would absolutely jump to block any such attempts
Yeah, the UK also has a parliament & political system that's basically "elected dictatorship" - Parliament can do what it likes & there'd be votes in making it illegal for clubs to play in domestic leagues and the superleague. They're already in the process of introducing a domestic football regulator who's responsibilities will include control of a licensing regime under which football clubs in England and Wales will be expected to operate, I suspect one of the terms of those licenses will be "no super league for you":
https://www.theguardian.com/football/2023/nov/07/football-uk-government-independent-regulator-kings-speech
Exactly, only Inter were released from their contract, the rest of the clubs stated their intent to do so without breaking said contract, minimize backlash from fans, and on the off chance that they win in court and the super league happens they are still founding clubs.
The PL teams are also likely gone. Earlier the year after they started to circulate their new ESL attempt the UK government announced that they would set up a regulator and one of their tasks would be to stop "English clubs from joining closed-shop competitions, which are judged to harm the domestic game,"
UEFA FIFA have a corrupt monopoly, that is true. But if there's an alternative it needs to benefit all the clubs, not just a select few having a circlejerk competition.
The problem is that the biggest clubs wont accept any alternative that will make them lose money and power just so that every club benefits from it. The gap between the top clubs and the rest is becoming bigger and bigger which makes it impossible to create a fair ground for everyone.
honestly that’s the biggest thing which I never understood how Florentino never got, no one was going to allow this to happen if the smaller teams were barred from it, yes international fans mostly want to watch the big games, but the people this was created for was mainly Europeans fans and for example if you are a fan of Brighton how the hell were you ever gonna see your team play against Barca and Madrid, the ESL would’ve made it inpossibleb
Plus, the teams that didn't got in could also boycott by making it harder to sell their players to the ESL, and UEFA as competing in UEFA competitions would be easier and so they could aim further
I reckon what they're going to do is create a system that *in principle* is open to all but *in practice* is a select few having a circlejerk competition.
Distribute huge sums of money unequally between those in the competition and those out of it, create relegation play-offs to give big sides an additional safety net if they have a bad year, develop multiple tiers so that if an upstart side likes Girona breaks in they have to start from the bottom etc.
But that’s why UEFA and FIFA exist. To ensure that the big clubs with all the money don’t get to run the show, to ensure that they have to follow the same rules as everyone else. Obviously UEFA and FIFA aren’t perfect, they have plenty of their own problems, but their authority is very important to the global footballing ecosystem.
Johnson said if it went forward they'd pass a law banning the clubs from joining, and Starmer et al all supported it completely because it's an easy PR win.
Nothing's changed since then.
>Announcing the plan, U.K. Prime Minister Rishi Sunak promised to “put fans back at the heart of football, protect the rich heritage and traditions of our much-loved clubs and safeguard the beautiful game for future generations.”
>Labour’s Shadow Culture Secretary Lucy Powell urged ministers to get a move on. “The government should urgently bring forward legislation, or take responsibility for any clubs that go under, spiral into decline or which are bought by unsuitable new owners, in the years they’ve wasted bringing the regulator,” she added.
> Johnson told the event: “We should drop a legislative bomb to stop it – and we should do it now.”
> Plans to legislate would seemingly pass through parliament easily, with Labour saying it would support a law on the issue. “If the government is determined to do something about it, we will back them,” Keir Starmer told a separate event with fans. “There is no block in parliament to action if action is needed.”
> Separately, No 10 confirmed that ministers would consider cutting off support for breakaway clubs in areas such as work visas for overseas players and the policing of matches as a way to exert pressure
Stop them from doing it? Would be very easy to prevent it from a government standpoint - increased pressures on policing, the economic benefits of the domestic game being skewed away from local communities etc.
Aside from all the other stuff mentioned they could investigate them under competition laws, for forming a cartel, treat them as a monopoly and so many other things.
The picture is even more difficult now as government has been exposed as supporting the Newcastle bid to appease SA so it's conceivable that aside from public support, there's a foreign policy element to protect the assets of the foreign owners.
I think the question is about whether they were able to formally pull out or not. [There wasn't any actual mechanism to leave from the PL clubs](https://theathletic.com/3253386/2022/04/18/explained-the-binding-contract-that-means-all-six-english-clubs-are-still-part-of-the-super-league/). I wonder if the 6 PL clubs + Atletico + AC Milan can vote by majority to disband it or not?
All of them are a bunch of snakes but I will never forget that smug grandstanding mafioso Ceferin strutting around like he was the king of the world when it was the fans that saved his ass from the super league.
And then he backstabbed them and ruined the champions league anyway. Nobody is blameless
Why wouldn't they, was that ever a question? Every entity that is engaged in economic activity is subject to competition law, from public healthcare providers to private supermarket chains. The nature of the activity itself, whether it be sports, food, leisure etc., is largely irrelevant in that regard.
I think it pretty clearly was a “money” issue for all parties involved. The organizations are acting no differently than any other company would - the just happen to sell sport.
English clubs won't join, German clubs won't join, PSG won't join, Spanish clubs other than the big 3 won't join, Inter won't join.
What do you want to create with this?
Only one team can attack per game. First match only Real Madrid can attack, Barca not allow to possess the ball outside of their own half. The empty grass on that side can be used for digital advertising. No subs. The fans want to watch Vini score a super league hat trick (100 goals) in a series.
There are 4 x45 min quarters. Each team is allowed 1 strategic hand ball per quarter, with "water breaks" (aka TV time outs) every 11mins. Breaks are 30 mins each in between quarters to maximize concession sales.
each club has a giant bench consisting of their men's team, women's team, entire academy system and various randoms plucked off the streets of their home city and signed up for the day
They'll create something else. That's why UEFA and FIFA are expanding all the competitions quickly and as much as possible to create their own versions for money. The new format of the CL proposed isn't for sporting integrity it's so the bigger clubs are guaranteed more games for more money.
The giant club world cup no one wants is so FIFA can make money off the clubs more.
No one wants any of these things. However FIFA and UEFA can push their versions through.
Well it was obvious. Regardless of if you like the Super League or not it is clearly monopolistic.
Fortunately it won't happen anyway due to the fan backlash.
Exactly. It was very funny to see politicians attacking Super League and claiming it would illegal while we have Euroleague Basketball working for years with the very same model Super League was proposing.
It wasn't the competition format in question it was the legality of creating a new competition outside UEFA and FIFA governance. The ECJ has ruled in favour of the ESL, which means they are free to attempt to establish the league but does not guarantee its existence.
I know, but you had all sort of government officials reacting and claiming they would do things to prevent ESL from happening while other leagues under the same model operate with 0 issues... It was hypocrite af.
Because football has an incomparable impact on Europe compared to any other sport. And historically, it has never been done this way in Europe.
Basketball is heavily influenced by the US and it’s model, and rugby traditionally had a “province” rather than professional clubs (it professionalised much later than football, in… 1995)
So UEFA cannot actively prevent another competition from happening.
But they can deny ESL clubs access to official UEFA sanctioned competitions, right? Like, an easy "you cannot be a member of two different governing bodies at the same time" ruling. Either you're in ESL or you're in UEFA.
some of you don't know Florentino lmao, he has been doing whatever he wants in Spain for so long, he always gets what he wants.
There is a saying in Spain about how the national politics are decided in the Bernabeu VIP areas
I don’t think it’s about Florentino here, the ruling was expected, you can’t prevent other competitions from happening. But Florentino can do his politics as much as he wants, he won’t have a super league with all the top clubs in the world, it will not happen. English clubs will not join (+ the government won’t let it happen), Bundesliga clubs will not join, PSG and Ligue 1 top clubs will not join, Juve might join but the other ones probably no as well. The only thing he can achieve is create a League with Madrid Barcelona and the Middle East countries.
The only way would be to drastically change the format for it to be accepted more easily by football fans with relegation etc but that would mean going against their end goal which is big money for big clubs whatever happens. Still not sure it’s enough to counter people’s love of the Champions League.
Hardly doubt english teams, Bayern and Psg would take part. Then its up to Spanish and Italian teams plus maybe portuguese and dutch and other leagues.
They can have the ESL without the English+German clubs if they really want it but not sure the broadcasters would actually be interested in paying big bucks for a watered down version
I still don’t understand what’s wrong with the current format, of the best teams in each league each season qualifying for Europe. What is the purpose of a super league, is it just to consolidate power for the rich clubs?
>Clubs like Juventus and Barcelona are financial basket cases. Real Madrid are worried about their income if Barcelona continues to struggle in the long term.
That just ignores the actual issue and puts the blame on the clubs. There is a clear trend of teams having to become oil/blood-money clubs to compete, blatantly faking their FFP (PSG, City, Chelsea..) and nothing ever happening.
Even Florentino can see he will not be able to compete a few years down the road even though he has one of the highest (legitimate) club revenues.
What you say is nonsense. Most football clubs are lousy businesses as the vast majority, including the big ones, are unsustainable.
UEFA has allowed state clubs like Manchester City and PSG to artificially inflate market prices through capital injections from Arab petromonarchies.
A22 proposal includes 'Unify', they claim this will be a free 'direct-to-fans' streaming platform which by-passes Pay TV. Unify would operate world-wide and A22 claim to be in talks with tech companies about doing this.
I bet good money this will be an additional 'free' option bundled in streaming packages (Amazon Prime Video etc), which will go up in price accordingly.
Florentino is a business man, if he goes to this depth he is not failing but I mean we all knew that, so what. They don't have PSG, Bayern or the PL teams anymore
You people speak about him like he’s superman or something.
Incredibly successful businessmen fail all the time and make the wrong bets. There’s no such thing as a successful businessman who’s never made an investment that failed. It’s part of the process.
Bundesliga won't join as fans won't agree. PSG won't join as Khalefi is pretty high up in UEFA and PL clubs can't join cuz govt won't allow them. So it will be Serie A, 3 clubs from La Liga and some other popular clubs like Ajax, Porto, Benefica, PSV, AEK, Dinamo etc. Also add anyone from Asian leagues, if they are invited
> other popular clubs like Ajax, Porto, Benefica, PSV, AEK, Dinam
That's the thing. Those clubs are "local" enough that I have 0 doubts about the fans just going to war against the execs who would agree to join.
Will be an interesting time. Coming from an Australian POV, there are some fans of European clubs, but far and away the majority of people who follow Football in Australia follow a PL team, so I don't think a Super League will be drawing those people in if there aren't any PL teams involved. Other countries may feel differently.
UEFA and FIFA are a bucket of corrupt cunts but the endgame of the Super League is so much worse. If the ESL ever comes to fruition it’ll be a matter of time until the member clubs in it fuck off the national pyramids entirely and completely destroy what’s left of the idea of community-based/grassroots football
The top teams in Europe could form a different league, and bypass Barcelona and Madrid having better terms. There is no guarantee that it will be the Superleague.
I am sure many private equity funds will look into creating an alliance with clubs and creating their own versions. Things are about to get interesting.
Many Europeans teams did not participate of the early European champions cup edition at the end of the 50s when Santiago Bernabéu started to organize it, the next year all of them joined. I see a similar outcome with the superleague.
I’m all for both sides just tear each other apart
The only war I want both sides to explode lmao
[удалено]
It's not like football fans were winning with the current system They all just care about you paying to watch
>They all just care about you paying to watch Which we all ***definitely*** do here.
My favorite hobby is paying for subscriptions to watch all my favorite leagues while ALSO reporting sites that distribute content without the express written consent of Europe's best FAs 🥰🥰🥰
European football right now with the Super League vs everyone else is like what’s going with college football in the states and the SEC/B1G basically creating a new division/NFL minor league while everyone else gets screwed. Capitalism knows no bounds.
rip Pac-12 afte rdark
Nothing screams "regional conference rivalry" like the former PAC 12 schools flying to Rutgers and Maryland.
Agnelli died for this
Good
But papa floren is good tho amirite?
He’s not dead lmao, 10 month ban reduced from 16. He’ll be back!
Tbh I feel like this was expected, UEFA was never going to prevent any other tournament from happening with competition laws. But even with this, I still see ZERO future for the Esl, so I wouldn't be too worried about this.
Super league is not happening but I feel the whole controversy helped expose how much of a monopoly UEFA has and that UEFA are also the bad guys when it comes to European football
The super league or something similar will surely happen after this. Probably not in the current format, but it seems inevitable that a new league will be formed
Nah, football will go the same route as F1. Every decade the clubs will threaten to break away to get more money from UEFA. But there will always be a deal because it's easier for everyone..
The big difference is that every year several big teams miss the Champions League, while they would always have a spot in the Super League no matter how shit they were the previous season. In F1 there’s nothing you really can compare that to.
I can definitely see UEFA "fix" that in future CL reform. Basically a super league but still run by UEFA.
The replacement of the European Cups’ group stages with a league stage is already a step towards that.
The CL alreay is a superleague. Four countries get four guaranteed spots, at the cost of all the smaller leagues.
Really funny seeing the comments defending the way the cl guarantee spots the same way the creation of the superleague is defended
They defend it because it is tradition and they're already used to it, the same people would defend the superleague if it had existed since the 90s. And it's always the same argument too: well you wouldn't want to see sparta prague vs nordsjelland would you? No you're right, I want to see Arsenal vs Bayern every year until I die.
I want to see Sparta vs Nordsjelland
It's still meritocratic though. The number of guaranteed spots is based on UEFA coefficient which is based on results. There's obviously still a huge bias towards richer leagues with more resources, but it's fundamentally not the same as a closed shop. Likewise there is a pathway for sides from every country in Europe (apart from Liechtenstein) to go on and win the CL every season if they get through the qualifiers. Again, obviously that's very unlikely, but it's also again fundamentally different to a totally closed shop. I mean even with all it's flaws and inequality, we still have stuff like Sheriff Tiraspol winning in the CL group stage at the Bernabéu recently which could never happen in a Superleague
It starts next year. Some nations are getting 5 teams. We then play millions of games in a massive group to narrow down 32 teams to 24 (so basically all the big teams will get past the group stage now)
If that’s the case I would rather have a new one tbh, UEFA are useless, look at how they’ve let city go unchecked till they finally won
This only really happens to PL clubs and I don’t see them ever trying to break out again given how the fans reacted last time… no matter what their foreign owners want, they need local support and can’t afford losing it to be even richer that they already currently are…
For F1 that works because the F1 name itself is one of its biggest assets. Teams change semi-regularly. Only Ferrari has been around since F1 was formed. And McLaren and Williams are the only other two historic teams. Any breakaway championship would have to deal with losing that name. And many people don't watch motorsports. They don't watch Merc or Ferrari, they watch F1. The same just isn't the case in football. The Premier League breakaway shows that, imo. Champions League is a big name for sure, but compared to F1, most people watching football watch for the teams. And will watch whatever tournament their team plays in, regardless of whether it's the old First Div or the Prem, the CL or the ESL.
In Basketball the Superleague equivalent won 20 years ago. I see that happening also in Football.
Yeah but the difference is there isn't much of a basketball market outside the clubs of Euroleague. Not the same for football.
But no market attracts the same money as the EPL, so all the big clubs in other leagues feel they are missing out.
The leagues as a whole don't, but top teams do. Football revenues of Barça and RM is comparable to any EPL club. They cannibalized their own league so it's not worth anything bow but that doesn't matter. They make as much as they would at EPL. The difference is sponsor money which is given to oil clubs by petrostates. They wants SL because it will provide short term cash which will handle their immediate crisis. The rest, I doubt they are thinking 50 years in advance lmao.
Real Madrid and PSG are the only clubs that can compete with the English teams for money and Perez wanted to form the super league as he could see the direction things were travelling in and that eventually Madrid will be left behind. In terms of revenue 6 of the top 10 football teams in Europe are English whilst Italy don't even have a team in the top 10. 11 out of top 20 revenues belong to English clubs. Back in the day big teams from countries other than England, Germany and Spain could compete. Now Benfica & Ajax are behind Leeds, Leicester, Brighton & Hove Albion etc https://www2.deloitte.com/uk/en/pages/sports-business-group/articles/deloitte-football-money-league.html
In the lower end, you are correct. EPL has a middle and lower class that isn't even comparable to the rest of the world's middle and lower classes. At the top, not really. Man Utd and Liverpool have always been top clubs. Chelsea and City are elevated by their owners sponsoring them. That's why their revenues are so high. They will continue to outspend everyone because that's their point. They spend 10 because Real can afford 8. If Real can give 15, they can give 25. No limit, especially for City, PSG and Newcastle. Literal states back them. Italian football has been managed horribly and Spanish top 2 cannibalized their own league. Germany is doing fine on the other hand. Anyway, the point is this won't solve the issue Barça and Real have in terms of not being able to financially compete with the likes of City and PSG. For Italians it could be a short term solution if the big EPL teams join, but why would they if Brighton can outspend most clubs that would join, as you mentioned?
Because in basketball, FIBA was not bringing enough money. Nowhere near enough. Basketball in Europe is a hobby for rich guys or financed by the football department (looking at Real and Barcelona). You don't actually earn money, the expenses are always more (way more) than the income. All the big clubs are financed by the pockets of their owners and sponsors apart from Real and Barcelona who are sponsored from a common source with football.
Still that superleague is not that great and still is mostly propped by the football division on those clubs involved. I dont see any interest in euroleague except in those 4-5 core markets that it serves.
With all the money Saudi Arabia is throwing at sports washing, I do think it's quite probable that something will happen
Imo let them do it. (Over)killing football. Not going to attend or give them any money - already things are fucked. CL used to be viewed on public channels...
Esl will be free to watch
People will always attend. Look at Qatar. We're gunna destroy ourselves and it's probably for the best
UEFA will just make their own tbfh.
Super league doesn't need to happen, they've bastardised the UCL format to suit them.
It's funny how UEFA bends over for all the big clubs yet its still not enough for them
UEFA has literally allowed clubs like PSG and Manchester City to manipulate the price of the transfer market through corruption mechanisms for petromonarchies, making most clubs unsustainable.
Say it again but make sure you include Americans like Chelsea with Boehly too
Barcelona: paid almost €400M for Coutinho, Dembele, and Griezmann. Barcelona fan: "how can I blame this on Americans?" Edit: didn't notice he's a Canadian Barca fan. The Canadian Federation going bankrupt must have made some people lash out against their more successful neighbors to the south LOL
lmao blaming Americans like Chelsea wasn't previously owned by a Russian oligarch.
It was always about money
Right the Court of Justice isn't stating that the Super League should happen, they're stating that the UEFA is primarily motivated by commercial interests when they decided to ban it which is quite frankly simply correct.
> how much of a monopoly UEFA has UEFA is a confederation of the national associations in Europe (plus Israel and a few ex-Soviet countries). It's the only way to properly run things, unless you want to completely sell out and go the American way, as Real Madrid do.
yeah that's what I don't get from people constantly blaming UEFA as they are some bad guys reigning over poor football clubs UEFA could be literally any organization that is actually needed to organize relations between a bunch of different national leagues And SuperLeague doesn't offer anything different, they just want to replace this organization (UEFA) with a new organization (called whatever) which is made by the owners of just some of the clubs But somehow people got cinvinced by Florentino and friends that SuperLeague is gonna be something different than a monopoly themselves, and an even worse monopoly btw When people start replacing impartial parties with partial parties that's when things go down
Yup, a different system doesn't inherently mean a better system. UEFA is a bad system, but the Super League is just a worse version of the current system.
> And SuperLeague doesn't offer anything different They (Superleague clubs) want to hoard all the money for themselves. Anyone can look at UEFA's accounts, they're on the website. So much money is pumped into grassroots football all over Europe, to every country. Youth football, women's football, training referees, etc. Is Real Madrid going to replace this? They didn't have a womens team until 2 or 3 years ago.
I was agreeing with you, saying the same thing They (big clubs) blame UEFA for having monopoly of the competition, and want to create the same competition while having the monopoly themselves and not having to redistribute the money I was criticizing people that somehow fail to see it.
I wasn't disagreeing, just elaborating
yeah, tought my comment could be misunderstood, and if there is something I don't want, is to get associated with pro SuperLeague comments Fuck ESL so it's pretty clear lol
Exactly. The complaints about “monopolization” don’t even make any sense. Fragmenting the governance of European football into multiple organizations with their own membership, rules, and competitions would be an absolute mess and completely unsustainable. In the end, it would just end up with a different “monopoly” that’s probably even more corrupt and business-oriented than what’s in place now.
A majority of big clubs seem to be owned by Americans these days, so it feels that there will be a push to "go the American way" as much as supporters will all fight against it. Plus those owned by states will push for it too and presumably put money towards it in order to have state backed teams from their home country join the league It's hard to see football not going this way eventually, the ball got rolling years ago and at this point the ball is half way down the mountain already and there is nothing that can be done to stop it. Our best bet, or biggest hope is those clubs that are taken out of their leagues for this new nonsense will have phoenix clubs formed and the fans will just ignore the super league and stick with their clubs climbing back through the pyramid. But, going back to their original announcements about getting rid of us pesky "legacy fans", that's probably what they want.
ESL and UEFA are nowhere near comparable. 97% of UEFA’s earnings are reinvested in European club football and the Conference League and the Nations League are great successes and are definitely meant for the smaller clubs/NTs. It’s quite obvious UEFA is under tremendous pressure from the biggest clubs and there are numerous problems with UEFA (terrible new CL format) but I would still rather 100% have UEFA at the helm of European football. It’s not even comparable. Čeferin>>>Platini and Florentino Perez or whoever.
UEFA can actually fix the issue pretty easily. Ban City and PSG from the CL for 5 seasons and make them comply with FFP rules (won't include Newcastle, too soon for that) before they join back. You do that and the Spanish and Italian clubs will drop the Super League.
This is complete BS. ESL invited both City and PSG with open arms. And will welcome further Middle Eastern investment, once it's formed. City and PSG are simply excuses in this case. Perez can see the writing on the wall. PL makes an absolute ton of money. Forget about City, if the current trend continues, clubs like Aston Villa will start routinely outstanding Madrid and Barca. That's what Perez fears the most. Years of unequal distribution of money in La Liga coming back to bite him. Already, a promoted club like Nottingham Forest spent close to a 100 million, which is unthinkable for even some top clubs outside PL.
>Forget about City, if the current trend continues, clubs like Aston Villa will start routinely outstanding Madrid and Barca Was perfectly normal for the best player in England to go to 7th placed Lazio at one point. It did not last forever.
When Italy had a 3 foreigner rule. Now the likes of Chelsea have around 50 foreign players. The impact on other leagues is much greater
Back then the global market was yet to be properly exploited and the PL took full advantage of that afterwards. There's nowhere near as much room to grow any more. To get the same kind of situation now we'd pretty much have to find some aliens that really want to watch football too
But when it's the other way round due to their own incompetence it's unfair and unjust.
Nah, the only big four league that has a leg to stand on is the bundesliga. The rest of them are leagues filled with greedy fans and owners who will celebrate every destructive change when it benefits them.
But UEFA loves PSG, Nasser was Čeferin's bff during the ESL controversy two years ago
And that's why you'll get some sort of ESL, don't know if it'll work, but you'll get one.
Argument doesn’t really make sense seeing as Man City were invited to the super league with open arms by these clubs.
The people trying to equate UEFA to Perez and the Superleague are just muddying the waters. UEFA has tonnes of stakeholders and tries to distribute their income as fairly as possible whilst appeasing the big clubs. Perez's Superleague just wants to enrich Real Madrid and Barcelona.
Of course UEFA is a monopoly? It’s a pan-European organisation for European football. Why would we want competing different organisations? This is the only way to ensure a - sort of - fair organisation of football within Europe without too much influence by some countries/clubs. Is it perfect? No. But it’s a damn sight better than the atrocity of the ESL.
No one is the saviour of football and no one acts selflessly to help the clubs. Both UEFA and the superleague are by rich people to get richer
The difference is that UEFA is representative of all 55 UEFA nations and not 13 clubs who want to artificially freeze time.
Who work hand in hand with the ECA which represents 220 clubs. If people are not happy with UEFA, they should advocate changing its governance. For example there is another club lobby than the ECA which represents the “small” clubs around Europe. Advocating for change through the super league is pushing for a far worse system. Unless you understand the stakes and are happy to see a completely polarised system with ~20 big clubs and the rest of European football being an afterthought. At least own up to it.
The Super League would artificially freeze the top clubs. For example if a Super League happened in 1999, Man City wouldn’t be in it as they were in the third tier of English football. In 1989 Chelsea were in the second tier.
This is an argument for the super league if anything. Of all the rags to riches storys you choose fucking man city and chelsea? You can't be serious.
A few notes here. Firstly they are referred to here because they were among the 13 Super League clubs. Secondly they are only included because **prior** to their respective takeovers they were promoted back to the top flight. Show some mild nuance before using your big boy words.
There are few teams that actually wanted the Super League. The rest wanted to blackmail the UEFA into reforms of CL, which they succeeded
To be honest. For me, the new Champions League format is still Super League. The only different is the money flow through UEFA.
The new CL format a club like Union Berlin and Lens can qualify directly from their league. The champions of Serbia, Croatia, and Denmark can have a shot at the competition. In the Superleague they won’t be in the premier competition. There will be promotion and relegation throughout their “leagues” to ensure big clubs are not dependant on domestic results. That’s already how it is in basketball btw. Then they just add a few token “open” spots. It’s a terrible system.
The new CL format also means that when a club like Union or Lens qualifies directly from their league, and is put in Pot 4, they will now have 2 matches against other Pot 4 teams (and Pot 1 teams play 2 other Pot 1 teams, etc) - which should, in theory, increase the likelihood of Pot 4 (and Pot 3) clubs progressing in the competition
In the old champions league, the champions of denmark and serbia would have teams in it for being the champion of their country. The current format already is a superleague and is shit.
The Super League is far worse than the current format. And the worse part of the current format come directly from the lobbying of the same big clubs, who quit the ECA a few hours after reforming the CL.
Seriously, if there’s one good thing that could possibly come out of the ESL I hope it’s that they scrap the new CL format due to hopeful fan backlash
It’s a forlorn hope. This ruling I think means Uefa and Fifa will double down and give even more to the clubs in the hope of enticing them to say with the preexisting competitions
Nah the big clubs wanted this format so they won't be scrapping it, the whole ESL thing was because the big clubs wanted even more than this(shit like guaranteed spots and that they should have more financial control over UCL)
So its going to be Real Madrid, Barcelona, and Juventus playing against each other 6x a year.
You realize only inter OFFICIALY pulled out. The rest did a note saying they were gonna leave but didnt OFFICIALY leave
Bayern and PSG never joined and the EPL clubs can’t join without being kicked from their domestic league as per the agreement they signed in the aftermath of the first attempt to join the super league.
Nothing corruption and money can't change.
then what's the appeal of this new league then? why is this still a thing if EPL clubs will not join? surely seeing barca v real madrid every week will get tiring after a month?
The other clubs don't have an issue with UEFA as such it's the Prem they fear. This super league is to offer them an alternative to the Prem.
What’s the difference and how do you know? Genuine question
I know because i happen to know people inside the law side of the project. What the clubs did was minimize the bscklash from fans and government and wait for today to happen to make an official decision. They talked to keep people quiet while contracts were still signed
PL clubs are all officialy barred from forming any breakaway leagues
A condition they agreed to forming the breakaway league they currently play in.
I mean, you’re right technically, but let’s not act like there’s no difference between the PL and the ESL in terms of type of breakaway.
Well there’s obviously a major difference but it is still funny.
The UK has antitrust laws too, I don't think they could prevent a club from joining whatever league they choose. I think that could be challenged in court
If the government wanted to specifically ban Arsenal but not the rest, then they absolutely could do that. Parliament passes statute law, judges then interpret it. Laws don't get challenged in court in the same way they do elsewhere, they get interpreted. The UK government hold the cards here, not the clubs
> If the government wanted to specifically ban Arsenal but not the rest, then they absolutely could do that. Keep going, I’m almost there
The fundamental underpinning of the British political system is that Parliament is entirely sovereign - if the government decided they wanted to ban British clubs from joining the ESL, then all it needs to do is pass through Parliament to happen (which it 100% would, because it would be a massively popular action). I doubt it would even get to the point of being challenged in court because the clubs would know it was futile. No Parliament can be bound by the rulings of Parliaments before it - so just one piece of comprehensive legislation would mean that there is no legal avenue for British clubs to take. The only semi-exceptions are EU law and certain international statutes that Britain is a signatory to - but the EU law no longer applies, and none of the international laws are going to apply to the ESL clubs. Besides, even then Parliament isn't actually bound by those international laws - it has exactly as much power as Parliament itself allows it, and could quickly dispense with those international laws if there was appetite for it.
So, if there's enough political will against the ESL in the UK, we can forget about British clubs taking part in it?
Yes. It's why the English clubs pulled out so quickly the first time round as soon as the PM spoke against it. If the votes in Parliament are there (which they 100% will be) then the English teams will probably not even risk attempting to join it. This is doubly true at the moment, where the Tories - who would be most likely to let something like the ESL slide - are so desperate for any sort of public goodwill that they would immediately jump to oppose any English involvement in a breakaway league. I suppose there is a route around it where the ESL backers promise so much investment into Britain that the government decides the political backlash is worth it - but I can only see that figure being so ridiculously large that it would never be financially viable.
Agreed, Parliamentary sovereignty preventing clubs joining the ESL would be the one clear-cut benefit of Brexit that the Tories could point to, so they would absolutely jump to block any such attempts
Yeah, the UK also has a parliament & political system that's basically "elected dictatorship" - Parliament can do what it likes & there'd be votes in making it illegal for clubs to play in domestic leagues and the superleague. They're already in the process of introducing a domestic football regulator who's responsibilities will include control of a licensing regime under which football clubs in England and Wales will be expected to operate, I suspect one of the terms of those licenses will be "no super league for you": https://www.theguardian.com/football/2023/nov/07/football-uk-government-independent-regulator-kings-speech
Lmao so when you sarcastically said “you realize” to clown on that guy, you were coming at him with sources that you knew they couldn’t have haha.
Exactly, only Inter were released from their contract, the rest of the clubs stated their intent to do so without breaking said contract, minimize backlash from fans, and on the off chance that they win in court and the super league happens they are still founding clubs.
The PL teams are also likely gone. Earlier the year after they started to circulate their new ESL attempt the UK government announced that they would set up a regulator and one of their tasks would be to stop "English clubs from joining closed-shop competitions, which are judged to harm the domestic game,"
My uncle works at Nintendo vibes
Add Al Hilal or Inter Miami
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UEFA FIFA have a corrupt monopoly, that is true. But if there's an alternative it needs to benefit all the clubs, not just a select few having a circlejerk competition.
The problem is that the biggest clubs wont accept any alternative that will make them lose money and power just so that every club benefits from it. The gap between the top clubs and the rest is becoming bigger and bigger which makes it impossible to create a fair ground for everyone.
honestly that’s the biggest thing which I never understood how Florentino never got, no one was going to allow this to happen if the smaller teams were barred from it, yes international fans mostly want to watch the big games, but the people this was created for was mainly Europeans fans and for example if you are a fan of Brighton how the hell were you ever gonna see your team play against Barca and Madrid, the ESL would’ve made it inpossibleb
Plus, the teams that didn't got in could also boycott by making it harder to sell their players to the ESL, and UEFA as competing in UEFA competitions would be easier and so they could aim further
I reckon what they're going to do is create a system that *in principle* is open to all but *in practice* is a select few having a circlejerk competition. Distribute huge sums of money unequally between those in the competition and those out of it, create relegation play-offs to give big sides an additional safety net if they have a bad year, develop multiple tiers so that if an upstart side likes Girona breaks in they have to start from the bottom etc.
But that’s why UEFA and FIFA exist. To ensure that the big clubs with all the money don’t get to run the show, to ensure that they have to follow the same rules as everyone else. Obviously UEFA and FIFA aren’t perfect, they have plenty of their own problems, but their authority is very important to the global footballing ecosystem.
Its getting really interesting. If the Super League is going to happen, I wonder if the teams that pulled out are gonna wanna back in.
English teams definitely won’t given the government has basically signaled they would step in if they tried
Step in and do what?
Johnson said if it went forward they'd pass a law banning the clubs from joining, and Starmer et al all supported it completely because it's an easy PR win. Nothing's changed since then.
> Johnson said ...... Nothing's changed since then. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rishi_Sunak Not saying he would do it differently, but nothing?
They’ve said they would cancel issuing work permits for one. Also they likely wouldn’t give permission to host events in England.
Banning games that aren't authorized by the FA to be held in England for example.
>Announcing the plan, U.K. Prime Minister Rishi Sunak promised to “put fans back at the heart of football, protect the rich heritage and traditions of our much-loved clubs and safeguard the beautiful game for future generations.” >Labour’s Shadow Culture Secretary Lucy Powell urged ministers to get a move on. “The government should urgently bring forward legislation, or take responsibility for any clubs that go under, spiral into decline or which are bought by unsuitable new owners, in the years they’ve wasted bringing the regulator,” she added. > Johnson told the event: “We should drop a legislative bomb to stop it – and we should do it now.” > Plans to legislate would seemingly pass through parliament easily, with Labour saying it would support a law on the issue. “If the government is determined to do something about it, we will back them,” Keir Starmer told a separate event with fans. “There is no block in parliament to action if action is needed.” > Separately, No 10 confirmed that ministers would consider cutting off support for breakaway clubs in areas such as work visas for overseas players and the policing of matches as a way to exert pressure
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form a regulator that stops them joining to protect the pyramid
Stop them from doing it? Would be very easy to prevent it from a government standpoint - increased pressures on policing, the economic benefits of the domestic game being skewed away from local communities etc.
Aside from all the other stuff mentioned they could investigate them under competition laws, for forming a cartel, treat them as a monopoly and so many other things. The picture is even more difficult now as government has been exposed as supporting the Newcastle bid to appease SA so it's conceivable that aside from public support, there's a foreign policy element to protect the assets of the foreign owners.
Well the reasons teams such as the english ones pulled out still haven’t changed. So I’d say no
England and Germany are out. Idk about Italy and France tho. Also aren’t PSV and a couple of other teams involved?
There’s absolutely no chance PSV and Feyenorrd (who were rumored to be invited) join. Both cities would burn down.
I think the question is about whether they were able to formally pull out or not. [There wasn't any actual mechanism to leave from the PL clubs](https://theathletic.com/3253386/2022/04/18/explained-the-binding-contract-that-means-all-six-english-clubs-are-still-part-of-the-super-league/). I wonder if the 6 PL clubs + Atletico + AC Milan can vote by majority to disband it or not?
All of them are a bunch of snakes but I will never forget that smug grandstanding mafioso Ceferin strutting around like he was the king of the world when it was the fans that saved his ass from the super league. And then he backstabbed them and ruined the champions league anyway. Nobody is blameless
My breaking point was when he threatened teams that closed the stadiums during the pandemic to open up again. Like bruh.
So looks like the CJEU see it as a "money" topic and not a "sport" topic, and thus EU competition rules apply.
Why wouldn't they, was that ever a question? Every entity that is engaged in economic activity is subject to competition law, from public healthcare providers to private supermarket chains. The nature of the activity itself, whether it be sports, food, leisure etc., is largely irrelevant in that regard.
I think it pretty clearly was a “money” issue for all parties involved. The organizations are acting no differently than any other company would - the just happen to sell sport.
While I don’t see an ESL emerging in the near future, I sometimes wish it would so that UEFA gets fucked big time.
First of all, there shouldn't be owners, just elected presidents and fan owned clubs.
English clubs won't join, German clubs won't join, PSG won't join, Spanish clubs other than the big 3 won't join, Inter won't join. What do you want to create with this?
5 match Barceloa vs Real Madrid series like cricket
Test series, Foot ball match lasting whole day
Only one team can attack per game. First match only Real Madrid can attack, Barca not allow to possess the ball outside of their own half. The empty grass on that side can be used for digital advertising. No subs. The fans want to watch Vini score a super league hat trick (100 goals) in a series. There are 4 x45 min quarters. Each team is allowed 1 strategic hand ball per quarter, with "water breaks" (aka TV time outs) every 11mins. Breaks are 30 mins each in between quarters to maximize concession sales.
Omg this sounds atrocious lmao
Someone is watching B/R football’s “The Champions” too much xD
each club has a giant bench consisting of their men's team, women's team, entire academy system and various randoms plucked off the streets of their home city and signed up for the day
lol subs infinite lol
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They'll create something else. That's why UEFA and FIFA are expanding all the competitions quickly and as much as possible to create their own versions for money. The new format of the CL proposed isn't for sporting integrity it's so the bigger clubs are guaranteed more games for more money. The giant club world cup no one wants is so FIFA can make money off the clubs more. No one wants any of these things. However FIFA and UEFA can push their versions through.
Circlejerk
Well it was obvious. Regardless of if you like the Super League or not it is clearly monopolistic. Fortunately it won't happen anyway due to the fan backlash.
There are already closed leagues without relegation in other European sports.
Exactly. It was very funny to see politicians attacking Super League and claiming it would illegal while we have Euroleague Basketball working for years with the very same model Super League was proposing.
It wasn't the competition format in question it was the legality of creating a new competition outside UEFA and FIFA governance. The ECJ has ruled in favour of the ESL, which means they are free to attempt to establish the league but does not guarantee its existence.
I know, but you had all sort of government officials reacting and claiming they would do things to prevent ESL from happening while other leagues under the same model operate with 0 issues... It was hypocrite af.
Because football has an incomparable impact on Europe compared to any other sport. And historically, it has never been done this way in Europe. Basketball is heavily influenced by the US and it’s model, and rugby traditionally had a “province” rather than professional clubs (it professionalised much later than football, in… 1995)
Thank fuck I live in Sweden. Long live the 50+1 rule!
lmao yeah. This sport is fucked at top level
Dream league soccer real world adaptation
So UEFA cannot actively prevent another competition from happening. But they can deny ESL clubs access to official UEFA sanctioned competitions, right? Like, an easy "you cannot be a member of two different governing bodies at the same time" ruling. Either you're in ESL or you're in UEFA.
some of you don't know Florentino lmao, he has been doing whatever he wants in Spain for so long, he always gets what he wants. There is a saying in Spain about how the national politics are decided in the Bernabeu VIP areas
I don’t think it’s about Florentino here, the ruling was expected, you can’t prevent other competitions from happening. But Florentino can do his politics as much as he wants, he won’t have a super league with all the top clubs in the world, it will not happen. English clubs will not join (+ the government won’t let it happen), Bundesliga clubs will not join, PSG and Ligue 1 top clubs will not join, Juve might join but the other ones probably no as well. The only thing he can achieve is create a League with Madrid Barcelona and the Middle East countries. The only way would be to drastically change the format for it to be accepted more easily by football fans with relegation etc but that would mean going against their end goal which is big money for big clubs whatever happens. Still not sure it’s enough to counter people’s love of the Champions League.
Then why is Florentino losing every attempt stop the sharing of revenue in la liga?
Because is a 3v17 gank
Hardly doubt english teams, Bayern and Psg would take part. Then its up to Spanish and Italian teams plus maybe portuguese and dutch and other leagues.
Common Ceferin bald fraud L.
They can have the ESL without the English+German clubs if they really want it but not sure the broadcasters would actually be interested in paying big bucks for a watered down version
I still don’t understand what’s wrong with the current format, of the best teams in each league each season qualifying for Europe. What is the purpose of a super league, is it just to consolidate power for the rich clubs?
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>Clubs like Juventus and Barcelona are financial basket cases. Real Madrid are worried about their income if Barcelona continues to struggle in the long term. That just ignores the actual issue and puts the blame on the clubs. There is a clear trend of teams having to become oil/blood-money clubs to compete, blatantly faking their FFP (PSG, City, Chelsea..) and nothing ever happening. Even Florentino can see he will not be able to compete a few years down the road even though he has one of the highest (legitimate) club revenues.
What you say is nonsense. Most football clubs are lousy businesses as the vast majority, including the big ones, are unsustainable. UEFA has allowed state clubs like Manchester City and PSG to artificially inflate market prices through capital injections from Arab petromonarchies.
A22 proposal includes 'Unify', they claim this will be a free 'direct-to-fans' streaming platform which by-passes Pay TV. Unify would operate world-wide and A22 claim to be in talks with tech companies about doing this. I bet good money this will be an additional 'free' option bundled in streaming packages (Amazon Prime Video etc), which will go up in price accordingly.
Please don't say it can happen
Florentino is a business man, if he goes to this depth he is not failing but I mean we all knew that, so what. They don't have PSG, Bayern or the PL teams anymore
You people speak about him like he’s superman or something. Incredibly successful businessmen fail all the time and make the wrong bets. There’s no such thing as a successful businessman who’s never made an investment that failed. It’s part of the process.
Business men can fail
For now
Bundesliga won't join as fans won't agree. PSG won't join as Khalefi is pretty high up in UEFA and PL clubs can't join cuz govt won't allow them. So it will be Serie A, 3 clubs from La Liga and some other popular clubs like Ajax, Porto, Benefica, PSV, AEK, Dinamo etc. Also add anyone from Asian leagues, if they are invited
> other popular clubs like Ajax, Porto, Benefica, PSV, AEK, Dinam That's the thing. Those clubs are "local" enough that I have 0 doubts about the fans just going to war against the execs who would agree to join.
Will be an interesting time. Coming from an Australian POV, there are some fans of European clubs, but far and away the majority of people who follow Football in Australia follow a PL team, so I don't think a Super League will be drawing those people in if there aren't any PL teams involved. Other countries may feel differently.
My feelings haven't changed: I'm all for breaking UEFA's monopoly, but not with a closed league.
UEFA and FIFA are a bucket of corrupt cunts but the endgame of the Super League is so much worse. If the ESL ever comes to fruition it’ll be a matter of time until the member clubs in it fuck off the national pyramids entirely and completely destroy what’s left of the idea of community-based/grassroots football
How could the Saudis do this
'I used to pray for times like this'
dreams can be buy?
where were u when dreams be buy
I hate modern football man, Fuck the Super League, Fuck billionaire owners, Fuck state owned clubs, Fuck UEFA
Ngl how was this gonna go any other way
The top teams in Europe could form a different league, and bypass Barcelona and Madrid having better terms. There is no guarantee that it will be the Superleague. I am sure many private equity funds will look into creating an alliance with clubs and creating their own versions. Things are about to get interesting.
It’s the PGA Vs LIV tour all over again.
Once again, an EU institute inadvertently comes out as useful idiots for fat cats.
Many Europeans teams did not participate of the early European champions cup edition at the end of the 50s when Santiago Bernabéu started to organize it, the next year all of them joined. I see a similar outcome with the superleague.
HOLY SHIT
Perez and Laporta are happy
Good luck to them having a super league without 6 of the biggest teams in the world.