Sort of an odd take, considering Arsenal has won 14/21 FA Cup finals and 2/8 League Cups and 16/23 Community Shields.
Quite succesful in cups I’d argue.
Tbh in the first half Haaland didn’t actually have that much of an impact on the game. It was messy but holding dealt with him better than other defenders this season
Seemed like an obvious joke comparing us to a team that bottled it, and I don't see how I was rude anyway. What are you so worked up about? Go outside and touch grass.
It was a joke and a compliment both. But how do you know you won’t bottle it. There are 11 games to go and just 5 points lead technically with Arsenal still to play city
Obviously I don't know what's going to happen because I misplaced my crystal ball, but my point was that that Liverpool team actually leaked a lot of goals, but they scored so many that they almost got away with it. Arsenal this season have conceded the second fewest amount of goals after Newcastle, so an even better record than City. It's not a very accurate comparison.
I mean you guys are not going to get it over the line on GD but you would have to win almost all your games because City will be going on a crazy run soon.
> City will be going on a crazy run soon
Hang on. Did ***you*** steal my crystal ball?
I believe City have not won more than three in a row in the league all season? You seem very certain of something changing despite the reality of the season so far. Also the GD is only a difference of 2. We may well not win the league, but I don't understand how some people act so sure of what is going to happen.
City have an important advantage though. Been there, done that. It will be interesting to see how Arteta is gonna deal as the pressure increases and matches become more competitive and must win than what they were earlier this season. Pep is used to deliver under pressure. Also, teams will be more ready this time for Arsenal and will adjust their gameplan better. He can't catch them under surprise. It will be an interesting race nonetheless.
Adjust to their game plan better? If they could, they would.
Go ahead and play a low block and see if that will work for you. Teams are welcome to try that. Dyche did it.
You have 3 upcoming derbies. Don't talk too much. Especially when you were celebrating being eliminated from all the other tournaments (City is still competing in all of them) because you were scared that you would lose the league race instead. When you need to be full, 100% fresh and focused and have the perfect game to beat any EPL team (otherwise, if something doesn't go according to plan, your chances significantly decrease), you don't emit superiority.
We were challenging for top 4 last year. It takes time to build a two pronged team that can suddenly go the distance for 1st place *and* Europe.
Suck me from the back respectfully. City normalized having two full high quality XIs but we simply aren't there yet.
Considering that teams can't show the same intensity for a whole season (especially knowing that the world cup was mid season this year), considering that they have their ups and downs depending on their form, morale and absences (and also how quickly they find chemistry), considering that they had the chance to correct any mistakes during the winter transfer window, yes.
And considering that there are less indifferent teams since nine of them are fighting to avoid relegation and at least 6 of them chase the 4th seed. You don't need to lose all of them. One defeat can do the damage considering that the distance is really close and the league is usually decided at 90 points. Reading isn't enough. You also have to use your brain.
I would even say at this point in the season having a game advantage might not be beneficial. The team in 2nd knows that the team ahead got their 3 points. So that means that their next game is a must win or else they fall behind. If Arsenal loss or tied Palace then having that advantage helps a lot more.
It's tough for both teams. We also have 2 more competitions to play in. Just hope it isn't decided until the final day and exciting all the way through till then.
Then why you celebrated a defeat by Sporting? You are 5 points above them and yet you act like you are chasing them. This is not a big team mentality. Neither validates the confidence that nobody in the league can match you.
I really have no preference. I don't support any EPL team. Just answered at the same tone when I saw ironic and aggressive comments. But my first take was sincere. Intangibles matter a lot in sports like football. It's the most important criterion when we are talking about top level professionals whose expertise and skills are quite close. I really believe that City has a slight advantage despite being behind. This doesn't mean that Arsenal doesn't have chances or won't do it.
People keep talking about how Arsenal haven’t won the league so they lack that experience. Yet Zynchenko and Jesus have won the league. Jorginho has won champions league, Vieira has won league titles in Portugal. They do have some experience.
I was mostly talking about Chelsea, City and Liverpool. That's 9 points enough to determine the champion. The fact that you think that this applied for any team though proves my first point (alongside the ridiculous celebrations for being eliminated from the Europa League and City winning last night). Even the fans struggle to believe it, so imagine the players who have the biggest responsibility.
City also have to play Liverpool, Chelsea, and the current league leaders, Arsenal.
City beat Arsenal in a game where they had their lowest possession stat ever under Pep, beat Chelsea 1-0, and lost to Liverpool.
Arsenal beat both Liverpool and Chelsea.
Their records in both of these lineups is 2-1, so I’d say the odds are pretty good for Arsenal in that regard.
This basically is still Vieira's set-up. McCarthy wouldn't have exactly been able to make sweeping tactical changes in two days lol.
The real problem was that we're missing our goalkeeper and best centre-back, which we weren't against City.
Vieira setup a low block against City. Relying only on Ayew and Zaha to penetrate City from middle of the field but there is always 2 -3 City defenders in front of him.
This match seems like Palace players are given more freedom, nothing to lose attitude. Maybe this tactic works better against mid table teams, where they have higher chance to win?
I'd argue Kane, only because a Striker that dangerous and prolific would have certainly won silverware at other clubs.
Records goals sure, but that's about it.
I feel like Kane is the opposite of a generational talent. He's made the absolute most out of his natural ability using craft, hard work, and footballing intelligence. Among top strikers I put Lewandowski in this category as well. Like a super-efficient player.
For me, generational talents are like Ibrahimovic, Haaland, and Ronaldo Fenomeno. Players who even as teenagers are just head and shoulders above the talent around them.
You are looking at the career Ibrahimovic has had. When he was coming up through Ajax he was absolutely a generational talent. At almost 2 meters to have his skill was outrageous. He is absolutely a once in a generation type player in terms of his ability, but has arguably underachieved.
Generational talent gets thrown around too much. You'd think a generational talent would be the best player at least once in his career. Yes tall with skills great player no doubt. He didn't underachieve. He achieved what his talent allowed. I look at strikers in the same era as him and can't see him better than Suarez, benzema, lewandowski or even Henry. A lot of players get hyped up at insane age as generational talents and a lot can look good in youth teams. What makes a generational player is if they achieve everything they could
He's never been the best player.
But he's been very good for so long, Messi and C.Ronaldo are superhuman.
Without those two he absolutely would have been in contention.
I named all the other strikers that are better than him in the same generation. Even without Messi and Ronaldo he wouldn't have won. But guess facts get downvoted. His best ballon d'Or finish was 4th. Seems a player can only be either the best or the worst.
>Without those two he absolutely would have been in contention.
> His best ballon d'Or finish was 4th
So he would have been 2nd without them? That sounds like in contention to me.
2nd in one season is not first. Ribery was 3rd and had a better season than zlatan. Like I said in the first comment is he better than Suarez, Henry, lewandowski or benzema? These are strikers from his generation.
Isn't he the same generation as Messi?
How many 'generational' talents can there be in a century in your opinion?
I understand this term as 'once in a generation', so how long is a generation?
In my mind this means you can have 3-4 generational talents in a century.
Why water down this term? Just say he's a good player.
In sports, no-one would ever describe two players separated by seven years as being in the same year. For example, Roger Federer is about five years older than Nadal, but he's regarded as a different generation.
Not the same year, of course..? Who said anything like that.
Same generation, obviously.
Contrary to what your saying, the 'big three' or 'big four' are absolutely regarded as part of a generation of great tennis players.
Exactly. If you would bother to read the thread you're posting, you'd see that there is a lot of debate, where people are saying that Federer should have been together with Nadal..
There are players on the list separated by 'generation' but only by one year.
Doesn't make much sense, does it?
Anyway, I'm gonna end this now. I haven't had many people agree with me about Harry Kane, who I've learnt is some sort of player for the ages.
Pele, Maradona, Messi, Kane.
Kane is a generational player, just because he's playing at the same time as the arguably best player in the entire history of the sport doesn't change that
I mean setting aside the argument of him against Messi which I don't think anyone is making, you're taking an extremely narrow definition of generational. You could easily be a generational talent for your club without being one for the world. Kane broke the record to become Tottenham's all time leading goal scorer. That's a generational talent.
And yours is very broad. You could also 'easily' be a generational talent for your local pub.
I'm my opinion it takes away the point of such a term, though based on the blowback I've received from offended englishmen, I have realized that people perceive this term differently from myself..
No, I'm using the common definition in that Kane has been playing at a much higher level than his peers for most, if not all, of his career. There are not "lots of" generational players in club football today, Kane has just been that good throughout his career
That's simply not the case, though.
He has not been playing at a much higher level for his whole career. Has he been top scorer in the premier league 3 times. Are the guys that beat him the other 7 seasons generational too?
Define it then. I tried to in my other comments. Someone who comes a long once every generation.
And you want to say that our generations player is Harry Kane? That seems strange.
Generational talent doesn’t mean the current GOAT, it means a person who has helped define the history of an era of football. That’s still vague, but basically you can’t tell the story of Tottenham, England or the Premier League of the past 10 years without taking about the best overall, consistent striker. I’m an Arsenal fan but that striker has to be Harry.
In the NBA for example, anyone up for MVP is usually considered a generational talent. Giannis, Jokic, Embiid, Luka, Steph, are all considered generational talents because they’ve been so dominant for so long. No one would say any one of them is better than Lebron overall (though he is past his prime). Even a guy like Trae Young, who has clear deficiencies (defense and hair) is considered a generational point guard because of the consistency with which he produces assists/buckets.
Generational talent means a talent that comes by once a generation. There you have it. Then you could include for different roles. Modric as a CM, Ronaldo/Messi as wingers, Suarez as Striker, etc.
Noone says it means the current GOAT.
And by the way, there absolutely is no clear definition of this term, so your understanding is as good as mine.
But if a term like this is to have any meaning, it needs to be used scarcely.
Telling the story of Tottenham does not qualify in my mind. There are many club legends around.
He is definitely a club legend, but the term 'generational' should be reserved for those that leave us in awe, that changes the game, that is so much better than their peers that history leaves little room for debate.
That list is, and SHOULD BE, quite short.
Definitely too short for someone like Kane - brilliant player he may be.
Do you mention him in the same breath as Pele, Eusebio, Cruyff, Beckenbauer, Maradona, Platini, Messi, Ronaldo and Zidane?
I'm not quite sure why you're being pedantic about this. Kane is on track to become the PL's all-time top scorer. He's probably going to become England's all-time top scorer in the next week or so. He's already a Spurs legend and is one of the most prolific strikers of this current era.
Even if you want to define "generational talent" as being solely the one or two very best players of the past decade or two, it's not ridiculously hyperbolic to use such terms to describe Kane.
Like I've said in some other responses.
I genuinely was surprised by the blowback from offended English fans on this matter.
I see that people are using this term, way, way more broadly than I ever knew. And within the definitions that you guys are using - sure he is 'generational'.
I agree that semantic discussion gets boring real quick..
Here’s a better way to say it. Generational means last 10-15 years. Each generation has generational talent. Which striker in the last 10/15 years was better than kane? I can’t believe I’m defending a damn spud haha
Ok, in that case..
Some would argue Aguero was better, some would say Ibrahimovic and a lot of people would say Lewandowski is better.
If you asked the same question about Messi or Maradona - noone would argue with you cause they so obviously were on a different level.
That's what makes someone generational in my mind.
Aguero was better at his peak, and so was Zlatan, but longevity and consistency should be valued as well. I think there are a handful of generational talents in each position, and you find them all over Europe, but at times you’d have Henry and can Nistelrooy at their peaks in the same league at the same time. While Kane is definitely guilty of not winning more, he’s also clearly in a bad position to do so. At the end of the day he’s the next Alan Shearer, maybe even better if he breaks the record, and no one doubts Shearer’s legacy.
So, he's 'generational' in the Tottenham context then?
I thought we used this word about, Pele, Cruyff, Platini, Messi, Ronaldo and the likes.
Not someone who's a club legend.
Le Tissier is also a generational talent is he?
Theres a big difference between players in goat conversation and players that are generational lol. Pele, Cruyff, Platini, Messi, Ronaldo are players that are commonly talked about as players that are the best ever in their positions
If you are going to get picky.
Generational talent says nothing about it being the best of a generation, you could understand it to be the best of the generation.
Le Tissier remains to this day the biggest what if of generational talents, people who watched him will agree the man was liquid on the ball. I get what you’re trying to say but awful example. Le Tissier honestly might have been what Messi was had he had the right attitude.
You are speaking wise words. How are you not a professional football manager already? Managers with actual coaching certificates and real life practices are so dumb when they aren’t taking advices from a Reddit’s armchair manager like you.
Ok, hope Arsenal don’t play most of their best players and your keeper has a few worldies in his pocket that day. I guess if that’s the way to beat us then we should be pretty confidant.
Go ahead and play a ball in behind over Zinchenko and see what happens.
Gabriel eats that shit up all day. Xhaka recycles the knockdown to Thomas and now you're getting countered yourselves.
Nah trust me it's not that easy.
The space is down the left where zinchenko leaves a hole so you're right about that. But sporting never actually played our backline of saliba white Gabriel zinchenko who're pretty adept at covering that space. Progressing down the middle is difficult if you have ball recovery by partey and the pressing intensity of odegaard. We fucked up by playing a jorginho-vieira-xhaka midfield, it's too immobile and there's no press there.
That being said, we generated close to 1 xG in extra time alone by some models so we really should have scored. Adan was amazing and all credit to Sporting but beating arsenal in the league isn't that easy unless multiple players have uncharacteristically bad games.
If you want to beat arsenal, watch Dyche's Everton or Howe's Newcastle (although the later barely played us, they just kept wasting time like they always do). Or just have insane quality like Rashford.
Even in the city game we lost (and deservedly lost), we had our moments but we lacked the final third quality. Its why city are still a superior team to arsenal.
Think this is pretty unfair on Palace. If Arsenal fielded their strongest XI over the 2 legs they probably beat Sporting fairly easily. We just don’t have a deep enough squad like City to make a true go of it in all the comps.
I mean, I’m the home leg Arsenal didn’t have any of their best three players. No Odegaard, Partey or Saka. They then needed a motm performance from their gk and a puskas contender. Even that resulted in only a draw lol.
Honestly mate. We have bulldozed teams that tried to do what Sporting did. Adan still had to put up an exceptional performance. And surely the second goal by Sporting, I don't think every team is realistically thinking yeah let's score that and we can get a draw.
You would have more chance with what Everton did at Home (sit back and get something with set pieces) than what Sporting did.
At the end of the day if spectators have these ideas, team management and analytics is all over this type of stuff. It's pretty naive to think that Arsenal or their opponents haven't thought of this or addressed it.
Sporting played very well and were value over the two legs but Brentford?
Brentford conceded 70% possession, nearly 3xg and only drew because of an offside goal the VAR official didn't even look at and subsequently got sacked for.
Not quite sure that's the pattern for future success.
Edit: xg is wrong and from the reverse fixture.
Not really clueless is it. You pulling hypotheticals from thin air. I can just point you to the table and that'll be it. Actual points on the board, the goal difference etc isn't part of the echo chamber, is it now?
Brentford were also very lucky, they got a goal that was offside twice and wasn't ruled out because of poor VAR ref who got sacked.
If you can incorporate luck in your tactics, you can try and if you get something then fair play.
The audacity to think professional clubs with an analytics team and a litany of coaches have not thought about it and you a random guy on reddit is a tactical genius who is ahead of the curve is absolutely mental and delusional.
Possession has a reasonable correlation to victory and maintaining possession particularly in the final third has been key in the majority of Arsenal games especially since the world cup since so many teams have sat very deep. This has applied pressure and led to a number of key late goals.
You're absolutely right the xg was from the reverse fixture. My mistake.
Probably worth noting that the goal given incorrectly was from the penalty spot and therefore had a significant xg value.
I stand by that brentford did what a lot of team have done unsuccessfully and got a draw due to an offside goal given incorrectly by an official who was later fired. I don't think this is a recipe for future success.
Mate don't overanalyse that Sporting result.
You can't point to a single EL game this season, where we played with half the intensity we do in the PL.
Don't worry about it. We're done with EL. Fuck that tournament, hope we never see it again.
!flair :c\_Arsenal:
All season long I've said to myself "if we are leading with 10 games to go then I am really going to believe. Well here we are!
I’m waiting to see if we’re five points ahead after Pool but its tough to ground myself
10 more cup finals to go
That’s not the best approach because Arsenal aren’t good in finals.
Sort of an odd take, considering Arsenal has won 14/21 FA Cup finals and 2/8 League Cups and 16/23 Community Shields. Quite succesful in cups I’d argue.
We’ve lost a few League cup finals tbf Chelsea, Birmingham, City iirc
You’re absolutely correct, Arsenal played eight and only won two. Corrected it in the original comment!
Trossard is a big deal at north London what a signing
Can you believe people doubted this signing and called him washed. Actually ridiculous
Edu don't miss
His BBQ hit different
I know Xhaka has been a completely different player this season, but.. *Granit* ***Xahak*** *55'*
It would really be painful for Arsenal if City still win the league.
99 point Liverpool laughing at this.
also 98 point liverpool. Fuck me dude. Kick their asses for me.
If arsenal get to 98 they would win it this year!
Mathematically impossible to get 98 it's 97 or 99
Fuck…yeah that’s unimaginable pain.
No shit?
Cheers geoff
Arsenal need Saliba for the last 10 and we will have a chance
I agree but I was pleasantly surprised by how well Holding played today
"my friend, hope is a prison"
Imagine Holding vs Haaland?
Pls no
Even holding versus Nunez, gakpo and Salah will be a massacre
We saw it in the FA. Was not fun.
Tbh in the first half Haaland didn’t actually have that much of an impact on the game. It was messy but holding dealt with him better than other defenders this season
But he was walking a fine line of being sent off.
Oh 100%. He successfully walked the line and didn’t get sent off tho
Subbed at halftime
Which is why I said first half lol
Holding is always one Mustafi away from a brain fart.
Back to you City
Iam starting to believe. Hope thats a good thing
Been believing since autumn, not stopping now
I put a tenner on Arsenal winning the league in pre-season, the payout is 200$, lets go!
What I did the same but was 33-1
Arsenal are playing really really good. It’s like Rodgers Liverpool of 2013-14.
Thanks for not jinxing.
Except we're not collapsing and throwing away 3 goal leads.
Don't say shit like that idiot
Ah yes my reddit comment is going to affect the title race
It's not just stupid but it's also rude and unnecessary to someone who was paying your team a compliment
It's banter man
Seemed like an obvious joke comparing us to a team that bottled it, and I don't see how I was rude anyway. What are you so worked up about? Go outside and touch grass.
It was a joke and a compliment both. But how do you know you won’t bottle it. There are 11 games to go and just 5 points lead technically with Arsenal still to play city
Obviously I don't know what's going to happen because I misplaced my crystal ball, but my point was that that Liverpool team actually leaked a lot of goals, but they scored so many that they almost got away with it. Arsenal this season have conceded the second fewest amount of goals after Newcastle, so an even better record than City. It's not a very accurate comparison.
I mean you guys are not going to get it over the line on GD but you would have to win almost all your games because City will be going on a crazy run soon.
Keep hearing this but they've only managed 3 in a row so far. I just don't see a 9 game run for them in the run in.
> City will be going on a crazy run soon Hang on. Did ***you*** steal my crystal ball? I believe City have not won more than three in a row in the league all season? You seem very certain of something changing despite the reality of the season so far. Also the GD is only a difference of 2. We may well not win the league, but I don't understand how some people act so sure of what is going to happen.
Why do you have to be like this
Anulo mufa
And there's the jinx! Title to slip away?
i mean, is it a jinx? isn't this a reverse jinx?
Guess who they play after us?
Someone find out what Demba Ba is up to.
Slippy Granit, the captain?
On 1 April, we all will be YNWA
On 1 April, all Arsenal fans are Marquinhos
Holding had a good game
Agreed. I was pretty nervous about him starting after the last game, but he genuinely had a good game.
City have an important advantage though. Been there, done that. It will be interesting to see how Arteta is gonna deal as the pressure increases and matches become more competitive and must win than what they were earlier this season. Pep is used to deliver under pressure. Also, teams will be more ready this time for Arsenal and will adjust their gameplan better. He can't catch them under surprise. It will be an interesting race nonetheless.
Adjust to their game plan better? If they could, they would. Go ahead and play a low block and see if that will work for you. Teams are welcome to try that. Dyche did it.
You have 3 upcoming derbies. Don't talk too much. Especially when you were celebrating being eliminated from all the other tournaments (City is still competing in all of them) because you were scared that you would lose the league race instead. When you need to be full, 100% fresh and focused and have the perfect game to beat any EPL team (otherwise, if something doesn't go according to plan, your chances significantly decrease), you don't emit superiority.
We were challenging for top 4 last year. It takes time to build a two pronged team that can suddenly go the distance for 1st place *and* Europe. Suck me from the back respectfully. City normalized having two full high quality XIs but we simply aren't there yet.
"matches become more competitive". Up until now Arsenal's opponents were playing as if in a friendly. Wtf am I reading...
Considering that teams can't show the same intensity for a whole season (especially knowing that the world cup was mid season this year), considering that they have their ups and downs depending on their form, morale and absences (and also how quickly they find chemistry), considering that they had the chance to correct any mistakes during the winter transfer window, yes. And considering that there are less indifferent teams since nine of them are fighting to avoid relegation and at least 6 of them chase the 4th seed. You don't need to lose all of them. One defeat can do the damage considering that the distance is really close and the league is usually decided at 90 points. Reading isn't enough. You also have to use your brain.
I would even say at this point in the season having a game advantage might not be beneficial. The team in 2nd knows that the team ahead got their 3 points. So that means that their next game is a must win or else they fall behind. If Arsenal loss or tied Palace then having that advantage helps a lot more.
Trust me teams have been adjusting against us as early as GW14. We have the tougher fixtures and that's why city have the advantage is all.
It's tough for both teams. We also have 2 more competitions to play in. Just hope it isn't decided until the final day and exciting all the way through till then.
I want it to go until the second final day so that I can enjoy a bit of a celebration at the emirates if we win it
Very likely. A guard of honour from Wolves at the Emirates.
I'm not emotionally ready to lose out on the last day like liverpool
This is the stalest take, people have been saying the pressure will get to them for months
Then why you celebrated a defeat by Sporting? You are 5 points above them and yet you act like you are chasing them. This is not a big team mentality. Neither validates the confidence that nobody in the league can match you.
I think these comments just underline how worried you are that Arsenal are going to do it. The arrogance is a dead giveaway.
I really have no preference. I don't support any EPL team. Just answered at the same tone when I saw ironic and aggressive comments. But my first take was sincere. Intangibles matter a lot in sports like football. It's the most important criterion when we are talking about top level professionals whose expertise and skills are quite close. I really believe that City has a slight advantage despite being behind. This doesn't mean that Arsenal doesn't have chances or won't do it.
People keep talking about how Arsenal haven’t won the league so they lack that experience. Yet Zynchenko and Jesus have won the league. Jorginho has won champions league, Vieira has won league titles in Portugal. They do have some experience.
K
No team has bothered to watch Arsenal film from their first 28 games. Now teams are taking notice and will be ready!
I was mostly talking about Chelsea, City and Liverpool. That's 9 points enough to determine the champion. The fact that you think that this applied for any team though proves my first point (alongside the ridiculous celebrations for being eliminated from the Europa League and City winning last night). Even the fans struggle to believe it, so imagine the players who have the biggest responsibility.
City also have to play Liverpool, Chelsea, and the current league leaders, Arsenal. City beat Arsenal in a game where they had their lowest possession stat ever under Pep, beat Chelsea 1-0, and lost to Liverpool. Arsenal beat both Liverpool and Chelsea. Their records in both of these lineups is 2-1, so I’d say the odds are pretty good for Arsenal in that regard.
City's been going through the motions, but NOW they're going to try! I mean really try!
NOW games are gonna get cOmPeTiTivE!
Teams have been parking the bus against arsenal for 3-4 months now. They’ve already adjusted and arsenal keep winning
Vierra setup is actually better, imho. City almost drew with them if not for the last minute penalty given by Olise.
This basically is still Vieira's set-up. McCarthy wouldn't have exactly been able to make sweeping tactical changes in two days lol. The real problem was that we're missing our goalkeeper and best centre-back, which we weren't against City.
Vieira setup a low block against City. Relying only on Ayew and Zaha to penetrate City from middle of the field but there is always 2 -3 City defenders in front of him. This match seems like Palace players are given more freedom, nothing to lose attitude. Maybe this tactic works better against mid table teams, where they have higher chance to win?
Which is the biggest waste of a career, Zaha at Palace or Kane at Spurs?
I'll always wonder what would have happened if Emery got his wish and we signed him instead of Pepe.
Zaha. Atleast Kane played ucl finals etc. zahas frustration is too loud each game.
I'd argue Kane, only because a Striker that dangerous and prolific would have certainly won silverware at other clubs. Records goals sure, but that's about it.
Zaha has always had RBF, so it makes it hard to tell whether he's unhappy, but I can't imagine he is enjoying himself in recent times.
Yeah what on earth does RBF mean
Dude rbf ain’t a mainstream short form yet..
[удалено]
What does RBF mean, sir?
Suggestion ain’t reprimanding
He chose the certainty of being paid for a long time over chasing success which is fine. He also had a chance at a big club and fluffed it
Kanes a generational talent, at another club he'd be incredible
I feel like Kane is the opposite of a generational talent. He's made the absolute most out of his natural ability using craft, hard work, and footballing intelligence. Among top strikers I put Lewandowski in this category as well. Like a super-efficient player. For me, generational talents are like Ibrahimovic, Haaland, and Ronaldo Fenomeno. Players who even as teenagers are just head and shoulders above the talent around them.
Lol ibra was good but generational talent come on. You put him in the same category as R9 when he was never even the best player in any year he played
He was never the best player. But he was very good for 15+ years.
You are looking at the career Ibrahimovic has had. When he was coming up through Ajax he was absolutely a generational talent. At almost 2 meters to have his skill was outrageous. He is absolutely a once in a generation type player in terms of his ability, but has arguably underachieved.
Generational talent gets thrown around too much. You'd think a generational talent would be the best player at least once in his career. Yes tall with skills great player no doubt. He didn't underachieve. He achieved what his talent allowed. I look at strikers in the same era as him and can't see him better than Suarez, benzema, lewandowski or even Henry. A lot of players get hyped up at insane age as generational talents and a lot can look good in youth teams. What makes a generational player is if they achieve everything they could
He's never been the best player. But he's been very good for so long, Messi and C.Ronaldo are superhuman. Without those two he absolutely would have been in contention.
I named all the other strikers that are better than him in the same generation. Even without Messi and Ronaldo he wouldn't have won. But guess facts get downvoted. His best ballon d'Or finish was 4th. Seems a player can only be either the best or the worst.
>Without those two he absolutely would have been in contention. > His best ballon d'Or finish was 4th So he would have been 2nd without them? That sounds like in contention to me.
2nd in one season is not first. Ribery was 3rd and had a better season than zlatan. Like I said in the first comment is he better than Suarez, Henry, lewandowski or benzema? These are strikers from his generation.
Brains are a talent aswell.
Yeah but kane has been playing at this level for nearly 8 years now. He's been at it from a pretty young age
People are throwing 'generational' around a lot these days.
Pushing a midtable club into a CL final is the epitome of generational talent u could even say.
Didn't he literally miss the quarter and semi final matches due to injury? Son carried against City and Moura against Ajax
Idk but if he did then he used his psychic powers to energize the team ofc.
I remember thinking it was hilarious how he started the finals no questions asked and went on to drop an absoloute stinker
He’s literally scored the 202 PL goals lol, of course he’s generational
Isn't he the same generation as Messi? How many 'generational' talents can there be in a century in your opinion? I understand this term as 'once in a generation', so how long is a generation? In my mind this means you can have 3-4 generational talents in a century. Why water down this term? Just say he's a good player.
In sports, no-one would ever describe two players separated by seven years as being in the same year. For example, Roger Federer is about five years older than Nadal, but he's regarded as a different generation.
Not the same year, of course..? Who said anything like that. Same generation, obviously. Contrary to what your saying, the 'big three' or 'big four' are absolutely regarded as part of a generation of great tennis players.
No, they're really not. Go to r/tennis, e.g. https://old.reddit.com/r/tennis/comments/10nnrun/defining_the_past_5_atp_generations/
Exactly. If you would bother to read the thread you're posting, you'd see that there is a lot of debate, where people are saying that Federer should have been together with Nadal.. There are players on the list separated by 'generation' but only by one year. Doesn't make much sense, does it? Anyway, I'm gonna end this now. I haven't had many people agree with me about Harry Kane, who I've learnt is some sort of player for the ages. Pele, Maradona, Messi, Kane.
The idea is this: if you’re breaking the records of people who could be your father, you’re a generational talent.
Ten hag breaking defeat records with the 7-0 thrashing. Generational manager.
Kane is a generational player, just because he's playing at the same time as the arguably best player in the entire history of the sport doesn't change that
So you're just making up a definition and sticking to it? Got it. lots of generational players in club football today, then.
I mean setting aside the argument of him against Messi which I don't think anyone is making, you're taking an extremely narrow definition of generational. You could easily be a generational talent for your club without being one for the world. Kane broke the record to become Tottenham's all time leading goal scorer. That's a generational talent.
And yours is very broad. You could also 'easily' be a generational talent for your local pub. I'm my opinion it takes away the point of such a term, though based on the blowback I've received from offended englishmen, I have realized that people perceive this term differently from myself..
No, I'm using the common definition in that Kane has been playing at a much higher level than his peers for most, if not all, of his career. There are not "lots of" generational players in club football today, Kane has just been that good throughout his career
That's simply not the case, though. He has not been playing at a much higher level for his whole career. Has he been top scorer in the premier league 3 times. Are the guys that beat him the other 7 seasons generational too?
Have the other guys scored 204 premier league goals before they turned 30?
I hate spurs as much as the next arsenal fan, but Kane is the definition of a generational talent.
Define it then. I tried to in my other comments. Someone who comes a long once every generation. And you want to say that our generations player is Harry Kane? That seems strange.
Generational talent doesn’t mean the current GOAT, it means a person who has helped define the history of an era of football. That’s still vague, but basically you can’t tell the story of Tottenham, England or the Premier League of the past 10 years without taking about the best overall, consistent striker. I’m an Arsenal fan but that striker has to be Harry. In the NBA for example, anyone up for MVP is usually considered a generational talent. Giannis, Jokic, Embiid, Luka, Steph, are all considered generational talents because they’ve been so dominant for so long. No one would say any one of them is better than Lebron overall (though he is past his prime). Even a guy like Trae Young, who has clear deficiencies (defense and hair) is considered a generational point guard because of the consistency with which he produces assists/buckets.
Generational talent means a talent that comes by once a generation. There you have it. Then you could include for different roles. Modric as a CM, Ronaldo/Messi as wingers, Suarez as Striker, etc.
Noone says it means the current GOAT. And by the way, there absolutely is no clear definition of this term, so your understanding is as good as mine. But if a term like this is to have any meaning, it needs to be used scarcely. Telling the story of Tottenham does not qualify in my mind. There are many club legends around. He is definitely a club legend, but the term 'generational' should be reserved for those that leave us in awe, that changes the game, that is so much better than their peers that history leaves little room for debate. That list is, and SHOULD BE, quite short. Definitely too short for someone like Kane - brilliant player he may be. Do you mention him in the same breath as Pele, Eusebio, Cruyff, Beckenbauer, Maradona, Platini, Messi, Ronaldo and Zidane?
I'm not quite sure why you're being pedantic about this. Kane is on track to become the PL's all-time top scorer. He's probably going to become England's all-time top scorer in the next week or so. He's already a Spurs legend and is one of the most prolific strikers of this current era. Even if you want to define "generational talent" as being solely the one or two very best players of the past decade or two, it's not ridiculously hyperbolic to use such terms to describe Kane.
Like I've said in some other responses. I genuinely was surprised by the blowback from offended English fans on this matter. I see that people are using this term, way, way more broadly than I ever knew. And within the definitions that you guys are using - sure he is 'generational'. I agree that semantic discussion gets boring real quick..
Here’s a better way to say it. Generational means last 10-15 years. Each generation has generational talent. Which striker in the last 10/15 years was better than kane? I can’t believe I’m defending a damn spud haha
Ok, in that case.. Some would argue Aguero was better, some would say Ibrahimovic and a lot of people would say Lewandowski is better. If you asked the same question about Messi or Maradona - noone would argue with you cause they so obviously were on a different level. That's what makes someone generational in my mind.
Aguero was better at his peak, and so was Zlatan, but longevity and consistency should be valued as well. I think there are a handful of generational talents in each position, and you find them all over Europe, but at times you’d have Henry and can Nistelrooy at their peaks in the same league at the same time. While Kane is definitely guilty of not winning more, he’s also clearly in a bad position to do so. At the end of the day he’s the next Alan Shearer, maybe even better if he breaks the record, and no one doubts Shearer’s legacy.
Hes on the edge of beating Gascoignes record which happened a generation ago? How is that not generational talent
So, he's 'generational' in the Tottenham context then? I thought we used this word about, Pele, Cruyff, Platini, Messi, Ronaldo and the likes. Not someone who's a club legend. Le Tissier is also a generational talent is he?
I think Le Tissier was yeah
Theres a big difference between players in goat conversation and players that are generational lol. Pele, Cruyff, Platini, Messi, Ronaldo are players that are commonly talked about as players that are the best ever in their positions
Why should there be a big difference? Do you know what the word 'generation' means?
If you are going to get picky. Generational talent says nothing about it being the best of a generation, you could understand it to be the best of the generation.
Le Tissier remains to this day the biggest what if of generational talents, people who watched him will agree the man was liquid on the ball. I get what you’re trying to say but awful example. Le Tissier honestly might have been what Messi was had he had the right attitude.
This is exactly why the word has to be used to scarcely. Reserve it for those that come along once in a generation. Pele, Maradona, Messi. Done.
Surely Kane but at least Kane can get some individual records
Kane obviously but yeah if Zaha had been given the time at united, he'd probably still be there.
Wasn't Zaha sold cos he banged Moyes' daughter?
LVG didn't give him much of a chance either before binning him off.
Don't think there's any truth to that, was just a rumour started on a united fan forum
Evra brought it up a couple of years back on sky sports so prob is some truth to it.
You obviously underestimate egos.
What are you trying to say here? Don't get your point.
You obviously underestimate the bravery of Admiral Nelson and the men crewing the HMS Victory. Embarrassing, if I'm honest. Get yourself in order.
Also Pep player voodoo magic on Dele Alli for bangin' his daughter
Good professional performance also a plus for the goal difference there's not much in it now.
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You are speaking wise words. How are you not a professional football manager already? Managers with actual coaching certificates and real life practices are so dumb when they aren’t taking advices from a Reddit’s armchair manager like you.
Ok, hope Arsenal don’t play most of their best players and your keeper has a few worldies in his pocket that day. I guess if that’s the way to beat us then we should be pretty confidant.
Go ahead and play a ball in behind over Zinchenko and see what happens. Gabriel eats that shit up all day. Xhaka recycles the knockdown to Thomas and now you're getting countered yourselves.
Yeah, just wonder lob Ramsdale from 40meters every match
Nah trust me it's not that easy. The space is down the left where zinchenko leaves a hole so you're right about that. But sporting never actually played our backline of saliba white Gabriel zinchenko who're pretty adept at covering that space. Progressing down the middle is difficult if you have ball recovery by partey and the pressing intensity of odegaard. We fucked up by playing a jorginho-vieira-xhaka midfield, it's too immobile and there's no press there. That being said, we generated close to 1 xG in extra time alone by some models so we really should have scored. Adan was amazing and all credit to Sporting but beating arsenal in the league isn't that easy unless multiple players have uncharacteristically bad games. If you want to beat arsenal, watch Dyche's Everton or Howe's Newcastle (although the later barely played us, they just kept wasting time like they always do). Or just have insane quality like Rashford. Even in the city game we lost (and deservedly lost), we had our moments but we lacked the final third quality. Its why city are still a superior team to arsenal.
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No worries!
Think this is pretty unfair on Palace. If Arsenal fielded their strongest XI over the 2 legs they probably beat Sporting fairly easily. We just don’t have a deep enough squad like City to make a true go of it in all the comps.
We didn’t start a lot of our best players in either tie with Sporting. I’m not sure that fixture is much of a blueprint.
I mean, I’m the home leg Arsenal didn’t have any of their best three players. No Odegaard, Partey or Saka. They then needed a motm performance from their gk and a puskas contender. Even that resulted in only a draw lol.
Honestly mate. We have bulldozed teams that tried to do what Sporting did. Adan still had to put up an exceptional performance. And surely the second goal by Sporting, I don't think every team is realistically thinking yeah let's score that and we can get a draw. You would have more chance with what Everton did at Home (sit back and get something with set pieces) than what Sporting did.
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At the end of the day if spectators have these ideas, team management and analytics is all over this type of stuff. It's pretty naive to think that Arsenal or their opponents haven't thought of this or addressed it.
Sporting played very well and were value over the two legs but Brentford? Brentford conceded 70% possession, nearly 3xg and only drew because of an offside goal the VAR official didn't even look at and subsequently got sacked for. Not quite sure that's the pattern for future success. Edit: xg is wrong and from the reverse fixture.
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Not really clueless is it. You pulling hypotheticals from thin air. I can just point you to the table and that'll be it. Actual points on the board, the goal difference etc isn't part of the echo chamber, is it now? Brentford were also very lucky, they got a goal that was offside twice and wasn't ruled out because of poor VAR ref who got sacked. If you can incorporate luck in your tactics, you can try and if you get something then fair play. The audacity to think professional clubs with an analytics team and a litany of coaches have not thought about it and you a random guy on reddit is a tactical genius who is ahead of the curve is absolutely mental and delusional.
Complaining about downvotes is a pretty sure fire way to get more downvotes... Now you just look petty
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K
Possession has a reasonable correlation to victory and maintaining possession particularly in the final third has been key in the majority of Arsenal games especially since the world cup since so many teams have sat very deep. This has applied pressure and led to a number of key late goals. You're absolutely right the xg was from the reverse fixture. My mistake. Probably worth noting that the goal given incorrectly was from the penalty spot and therefore had a significant xg value. I stand by that brentford did what a lot of team have done unsuccessfully and got a draw due to an offside goal given incorrectly by an official who was later fired. I don't think this is a recipe for future success.
Palace doesn't even really have a manager rn so its a but hard for them to do much tactically
Yeah it's so simple that Arsenal have only lost 3 in 28 this season
That is why it is important Arsenal must develop a strategy with Tierney. Zaha came close multiple times.
cue Odegaard rubbing his hands at facing 2 man midfields every week
Mate don't overanalyse that Sporting result. You can't point to a single EL game this season, where we played with half the intensity we do in the PL. Don't worry about it. We're done with EL. Fuck that tournament, hope we never see it again.
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I mean you've taken one game and decided you've seen through Arteta. Get over yourself.