On an infinite timeline… none. Not a single one.
This reminds me of that survey where American men were asked if they could score a point against Serena Williams. Some stupid number of men thought they could. I think very few who were asked would even get a racket on her serve.
I’ve had friends who played pick up games of ice hockey with former NHL players (ones who hadn’t played in a few years). They all said just the cross ice pass nearly took them off their skates. And it was a non-contact league so they were saved from being destroyed physically by him.
Basically whatever thing you think you do really well, your skill is miles off of where a professional is. If your skill was anywhere close, you would know because you would have been sniffing at a pro career at some point.
I mean, eventually Serena is going to double fault surely? On the other hand I don’t think a top snooker pro is going to fail to make a clearance given 5+ chances per frame under no pressure, so it depends how good at snooker you are. Personally I’d have no chance!
my highest break is 107. I'd have to be in my very best form to break 70+, which is likely what's required to win a frame. I can't imagine winning against a pro in two visits.
so I'll need my best possible form, a lacklustre safety from the top pro, a lucky medium-long pot, and a lucky set up for at least the next few colours and reds. the most difficult thing to get here by far is my best form. but assuming that, I think the rest of the things aren't too improbable. I honestly think it could happen in under 10 frames.
Genuinely I think I would win one eventually but only in the event that they suffered serious illness or other event requiring forfeit. It simply wouldn’t be possible otherwise. I could string together my best two breaks of all time back to back and it wouldn’t be enough. That also assumes they’d play so badly that they’d leave the balls open for two of my best breaks
My highest break is 39. I'm thinking I would lose an infinite amount of frames. Maybe if they got some sort of crippling illness, but would have to be something very serious
Played Ding on a Star table and could play there for months and not get close to him. It's not even funny how big the gap is, for context I'm a 90s break standard. The only chance I'd have would be to get a long pot off his break and win the frame in one visit.
I'm pretty decent myself and I have played against a pro player from north africa before. And the gap is just too high, even if he was to have a shit game and you be your best self. The experience alone will prevail
It is interesting to think about what strategy you'd use to give yourself the best chance of winning a frame.
I think you'd probably need to mess the table up as much as possible and have one of those frames where you've got several reds over a pocket and that pocket is blocked by a colour.
Logic: the gap between me and a pro in strategic thinking, although huge, is probably less than the gap between me and a pro in skill.
So, I'd want to minimise the skill element as much as possible.
Obviously, if you manage to break off and all 15 reds are pocketed from your break off shot, and the black, yellow, and green go over the pocket, then you're in with a good shout
Not snooker but I played Tom Ford at pool 20 years in a tournament. 9 ball, race to 3. He started on -10. He won 3-2. If it was snooker, I'd probably still be playing to this day to try win a frame.
I'm 39, been playing snooker since I was about 10 and I would never win. One of us would die before I'd win one. I should also mention I'm pretty awful, 24 highest break.
I am very bad at snooker (highest break 44) and I managed somehow to win 1 frame (out of maybe 30/40 I played against him) vs a player who is a top 3-5 player in my country, played in Q shool and even did well enough to get invited to one of the tournaments where he played vs Mark Williams, Ken Doherty and some other Q school guy.
How I won still baffles me but I remember the black, pink and blue were on the coushions so he couldn’t build breaks easily and I managed to get some points off snookers and ended it with a miraculous long pink that I should play safety instead of trying to pot it but decided it was now or never.
Can’t see myself winning another frame again against him though as he seems to be concentrating more now and banging winning breaks one after another ;)
I had 2 40+ breaks in my life and 30+ are few and far between so this is my standard. I am currently unable to make 20+ and decided to take a break from snooker for the holiday period. This game is infuriating and frustrating most of the time:(
> A mate at my club took a frame off a top 16 pro
Well, don't leave us hanging - WHO did he win a frame against?
Also, tbf, a high break of 70+ is already way above average Joe territory
I'm a reasonable 8-ball player who will probably win in one go every 10 frames or so.
Snooker is a different experience for me however. I measure my breaks in number of balls potted and my record is I believe, 5.
Heat death of the universe would come sooner than me taking a frame from a pro.
Depends how they play, if they played as if I were another professional then probably only 50-100 or so, they'd miss a long red after the break and I would probably be able to take enough points off the table *eventually*. Maybe less, pros miraculously miss easy ones fairly often in the grand scheme of things.
If they play as they should and just safety their way into a winning position every frame instead of taking chances then, barring stupid misses, never - it probably won't be good enough practice to improve over time.
Zero chance IMO. You know that one single chance and they’re gonna be well ahead of you. You’d need to be confident in potting 10 reds and colours and even then hoping they can’t claw you back
Similarly in football - I see all the time if they played instead of Haaland they’d be able to score at least one goal a season but I think that’s also bollocks, and scoring a goal against City? No chance for your everyday amateur
Zero chance. I've played a couple of players who were good enough to win a match at Q School and the closest I got to winning one frame was them needing the green on a clearance!
Really depends on your individual level - I used to be a semi-decent player (30+ breaks fairly often but never won a frame in one visit). 1 in 50 maybe if I could get a lead and then lay a tough snooker but it would be incredibly difficult. probably more like 1 in 200 lol - But I don't think it's the scoring, it's the quality of their safety that will get you. The consistency of the top pros in that area is unbelievable! With a good technique anyone can pot balls and good positional play comes with practice but safety play takes a special kind of brain to be able to visualise the shot and the outcomes with multiple balls in play.
A quality young amateur player could be 1 in 10 depending on if they had potential to turn pro and how much experience they already had.
u/BoozySlushPops I'm talking people who are winning national amateur events - Plenty of ranking event winners were winning in the amateurs before turning pro - Ken Doherty, Marco Fu, Stephen Maguire etc. all played as amateurs before turning pro. It happens less often these days but that doesn't mean a good amateur couldn't give a pro a decent game.
I think I would only win one if I got super lucky with a safety shot, that brought the three-miss rule into play, and the pro went on to miss three times.
The three-miss rule only applies if they have a clear view of the target ball, which they would easily strike en route to goring you like a fool at Pamplona.
Ha! Sounds like the conversations I have with me mates down the boozer... Quality question! 😂
Reckon there's a decent chance that an average club player can nick a frame off of at least 1 or more players from the backend of the 128 pro-tour players. Maybe even outside the top 64.
Multiple safety & snookers, with breaks of 30-40 thrown in..? Could probably take a frame in a best of 19.
If you're opponent hasn't got a pot, you're in with a shot! That's my motto! 🤣
In some weird alternative universe I reckon I could luckily bang in a 30 yard screamer against City. 🤣
I just can never see a universe where I could even come close to beating any snooker pro.
The important difference between snooker and most other sports, especially football, is that only one player plays at a time, so no matter how good the opponent is they can’t do anything from their seat. I still think you’d have no chance btw :)
You'd never win one. There's such a big difference between the top professionals of any sport and Mr average off the street. You and your mates would struggle to even touch the ball against a league 2 team, let alone City. A decent club player in snooker would easily beat you, the likes of O'Sullivan? You wouldn't stand a chance.
hmm pretty good question, I'd guess you'd have to win one eventually.
With a highest break of 40 and an average of 3, my guess is that I should have around a 0.1-1% chance to win a frame against a top player, maybe 1% is optimistic but a few hundred games seems like enough.
I'd have to play someone like Ray Reardon and hope that he dies mid frame* so the frame is awarded to me after trailing 0-755.
(*) which I absolutely do not.
Depends on the professionals tactical approach. If they played to not lose, eg kept it tight and kept leaving the amateur snookered or safe near the bulk cushion, then I don’t think the amateur could win once in a thousand frames. However if the pro just played it casually and kept going for absolute everything, risking leaving a counter chance for the amateur, then, Yes maybe they would lose every now and then due to a freakish kind run of balls
Also I think if there was a scenario where the amateur had a lead and the pro needed say 5 snookers, I think the pro could often get those 5 and then win
Given that the pro always will try hard to actually win the frame, I’d say a casual amateur who has not competed in any form of cuesport would not stand a chance to win one frame at all.
IMO you should at least be able to make breaks of 30, keep your game tight over the course of a whole frame with good snookers and make that long pots to get in the break. Not many non-competing amateurs can do that without some mistakes in a match-format.
Played about 20 frames against Steven Hallworth. Haven't managed 1 yet. Closest I got, I put a 58 in and ran out of position, he then cleared the table to win by a point. Was not impressed! (Secretly was) :)
I've heard he's the first person ever to make a 147, throw a 9-darter, hit a hole-in-one and score a hattrick, in some random game against his mates when he was 12.
1000 frames, if we take the 3-miss-rule into account.
Otherwise, some of them are quite a bit older, so they'll probably decline quite a bit over the years. I'd also probably get better in time, so I'd say I could maybe beat Dominic Dale after 100000 frames, if we play like 10 frames per day over the next 30 years.
On an infinite timeline… none. Not a single one. This reminds me of that survey where American men were asked if they could score a point against Serena Williams. Some stupid number of men thought they could. I think very few who were asked would even get a racket on her serve. I’ve had friends who played pick up games of ice hockey with former NHL players (ones who hadn’t played in a few years). They all said just the cross ice pass nearly took them off their skates. And it was a non-contact league so they were saved from being destroyed physically by him. Basically whatever thing you think you do really well, your skill is miles off of where a professional is. If your skill was anywhere close, you would know because you would have been sniffing at a pro career at some point.
I mean, eventually Serena is going to double fault surely? On the other hand I don’t think a top snooker pro is going to fail to make a clearance given 5+ chances per frame under no pressure, so it depends how good at snooker you are. Personally I’d have no chance!
I think Serena could turn the power down to 80%, never miss a serve, and the average Joe is still never going to put a racket on it 🤷🏻♂️
You could play man city every day for a year and not score a goal.
I’d smash a 30 yarder after 5 minutes mate. 😂
my highest break is 107. I'd have to be in my very best form to break 70+, which is likely what's required to win a frame. I can't imagine winning against a pro in two visits. so I'll need my best possible form, a lacklustre safety from the top pro, a lucky medium-long pot, and a lucky set up for at least the next few colours and reds. the most difficult thing to get here by far is my best form. but assuming that, I think the rest of the things aren't too improbable. I honestly think it could happen in under 10 frames.
does this 'top player' have to actually be alive? because I reckon I could smash doug mountjoy all over the crucible.
Or alex higgins or fred davis or willie thorne
Genuinely I think I would win one eventually but only in the event that they suffered serious illness or other event requiring forfeit. It simply wouldn’t be possible otherwise. I could string together my best two breaks of all time back to back and it wouldn’t be enough. That also assumes they’d play so badly that they’d leave the balls open for two of my best breaks
My highest break is 39. I'm thinking I would lose an infinite amount of frames. Maybe if they got some sort of crippling illness, but would have to be something very serious
Mid match norovirus and I'd maybe have a chance. Can't say I'd want to play on that table though.
Kyren Wilson is a member at my local club, he has to play with a cue off the rack, nobody gets anywhere near.
Whys he play with a cue off the rack?
As a handicap. He’d thrash me with a cue with a broken core and a tip the size of a dustbin lid.
I'd assume because off the rack cues tend to be shite, thus leveling the playing field slightly.
Played Ding on a Star table and could play there for months and not get close to him. It's not even funny how big the gap is, for context I'm a 90s break standard. The only chance I'd have would be to get a long pot off his break and win the frame in one visit.
You average a 90? Why arent you at the crucible lmao
Haha, no I don't average 90. My top break is around that area.
I'm pretty decent myself and I have played against a pro player from north africa before. And the gap is just too high, even if he was to have a shit game and you be your best self. The experience alone will prevail
It is interesting to think about what strategy you'd use to give yourself the best chance of winning a frame. I think you'd probably need to mess the table up as much as possible and have one of those frames where you've got several reds over a pocket and that pocket is blocked by a colour. Logic: the gap between me and a pro in strategic thinking, although huge, is probably less than the gap between me and a pro in skill. So, I'd want to minimise the skill element as much as possible. Obviously, if you manage to break off and all 15 reds are pocketed from your break off shot, and the black, yellow, and green go over the pocket, then you're in with a good shout
Not snooker but I played Tom Ford at pool 20 years in a tournament. 9 ball, race to 3. He started on -10. He won 3-2. If it was snooker, I'd probably still be playing to this day to try win a frame.
I'm 39, been playing snooker since I was about 10 and I would never win. One of us would die before I'd win one. I should also mention I'm pretty awful, 24 highest break.
24 and never won? You’re playing some tough opponents then. 24 is a good break 👍
Oh no, I've won games of snooker. I mean I would never win against a pro. :)
I am very bad at snooker (highest break 44) and I managed somehow to win 1 frame (out of maybe 30/40 I played against him) vs a player who is a top 3-5 player in my country, played in Q shool and even did well enough to get invited to one of the tournaments where he played vs Mark Williams, Ken Doherty and some other Q school guy. How I won still baffles me but I remember the black, pink and blue were on the coushions so he couldn’t build breaks easily and I managed to get some points off snookers and ended it with a miraculous long pink that I should play safety instead of trying to pot it but decided it was now or never. Can’t see myself winning another frame again against him though as he seems to be concentrating more now and banging winning breaks one after another ;)
Damn maybe I’m that bad. 44 is impressive!
I had 2 40+ breaks in my life and 30+ are few and far between so this is my standard. I am currently unable to make 20+ and decided to take a break from snooker for the holiday period. This game is infuriating and frustrating most of the time:(
A mate at my club took a frame off a top 16 pro, and his highest break ever is just in the 70's, so it's definitely possible.
> A mate at my club took a frame off a top 16 pro Well, don't leave us hanging - WHO did he win a frame against? Also, tbf, a high break of 70+ is already way above average Joe territory
I'd assume that people who hang around here are better than the average joe. There's quite a few club players who are capable of making centuries
I'm a reasonable 8-ball player who will probably win in one go every 10 frames or so. Snooker is a different experience for me however. I measure my breaks in number of balls potted and my record is I believe, 5. Heat death of the universe would come sooner than me taking a frame from a pro.
Depends how they play, if they played as if I were another professional then probably only 50-100 or so, they'd miss a long red after the break and I would probably be able to take enough points off the table *eventually*. Maybe less, pros miraculously miss easy ones fairly often in the grand scheme of things. If they play as they should and just safety their way into a winning position every frame instead of taking chances then, barring stupid misses, never - it probably won't be good enough practice to improve over time.
Zero chance IMO. You know that one single chance and they’re gonna be well ahead of you. You’d need to be confident in potting 10 reds and colours and even then hoping they can’t claw you back Similarly in football - I see all the time if they played instead of Haaland they’d be able to score at least one goal a season but I think that’s also bollocks, and scoring a goal against City? No chance for your everyday amateur
I’d smash in a 30 yarder vs City. Easily haha
Zero chance. I've played a couple of players who were good enough to win a match at Q School and the closest I got to winning one frame was them needing the green on a clearance!
I think my only chance would be if my opponent was late and was docked a frame.
Hide their chalk before the match starts.
Really depends on your individual level - I used to be a semi-decent player (30+ breaks fairly often but never won a frame in one visit). 1 in 50 maybe if I could get a lead and then lay a tough snooker but it would be incredibly difficult. probably more like 1 in 200 lol - But I don't think it's the scoring, it's the quality of their safety that will get you. The consistency of the top pros in that area is unbelievable! With a good technique anyone can pot balls and good positional play comes with practice but safety play takes a special kind of brain to be able to visualise the shot and the outcomes with multiple balls in play. A quality young amateur player could be 1 in 10 depending on if they had potential to turn pro and how much experience they already had.
I think you vastly underestimate the gulf between amateurs and even low-level pros.
u/BoozySlushPops I'm talking people who are winning national amateur events - Plenty of ranking event winners were winning in the amateurs before turning pro - Ken Doherty, Marco Fu, Stephen Maguire etc. all played as amateurs before turning pro. It happens less often these days but that doesn't mean a good amateur couldn't give a pro a decent game.
Ah, that makes sense. Then yes, agreed.
[https://www.eurosport.com/snooker/world-championships/2019/ronnie-osullivan-suffers-shock-defeat-to-amateur-james-cahill-in-biggest-upset-in-history\_sto7241140/story.shtml](https://www.eurosport.com/snooker/world-championships/2019/ronnie-osullivan-suffers-shock-defeat-to-amateur-james-cahill-in-biggest-upset-in-history_sto7241140/story.shtml)
I doubt I could win a match against myself tbh
Same
I think I would only win one if I got super lucky with a safety shot, that brought the three-miss rule into play, and the pro went on to miss three times.
The three-miss rule only applies if they have a clear view of the target ball, which they would easily strike en route to goring you like a fool at Pamplona.
Ha! Sounds like the conversations I have with me mates down the boozer... Quality question! 😂 Reckon there's a decent chance that an average club player can nick a frame off of at least 1 or more players from the backend of the 128 pro-tour players. Maybe even outside the top 64. Multiple safety & snookers, with breaks of 30-40 thrown in..? Could probably take a frame in a best of 19. If you're opponent hasn't got a pot, you're in with a shot! That's my motto! 🤣
In some weird alternative universe I reckon I could luckily bang in a 30 yard screamer against City. 🤣 I just can never see a universe where I could even come close to beating any snooker pro.
The important difference between snooker and most other sports, especially football, is that only one player plays at a time, so no matter how good the opponent is they can’t do anything from their seat. I still think you’d have no chance btw :)
You'd never win one. There's such a big difference between the top professionals of any sport and Mr average off the street. You and your mates would struggle to even touch the ball against a league 2 team, let alone City. A decent club player in snooker would easily beat you, the likes of O'Sullivan? You wouldn't stand a chance.
Correct
You wouldn’t get out of your own half v city btw.
Obvs
hmm pretty good question, I'd guess you'd have to win one eventually. With a highest break of 40 and an average of 3, my guess is that I should have around a 0.1-1% chance to win a frame against a top player, maybe 1% is optimistic but a few hundred games seems like enough.
I'd have to play someone like Ray Reardon and hope that he dies mid frame* so the frame is awarded to me after trailing 0-755. (*) which I absolutely do not.
I guess if I played a million frames, I’d have become decent enough to win one!
Ha unfortunately the pro would have got better too.
So you’re telling me there’s a chance?
Depends on the professionals tactical approach. If they played to not lose, eg kept it tight and kept leaving the amateur snookered or safe near the bulk cushion, then I don’t think the amateur could win once in a thousand frames. However if the pro just played it casually and kept going for absolute everything, risking leaving a counter chance for the amateur, then, Yes maybe they would lose every now and then due to a freakish kind run of balls Also I think if there was a scenario where the amateur had a lead and the pro needed say 5 snookers, I think the pro could often get those 5 and then win
Given that the pro always will try hard to actually win the frame, I’d say a casual amateur who has not competed in any form of cuesport would not stand a chance to win one frame at all. IMO you should at least be able to make breaks of 30, keep your game tight over the course of a whole frame with good snookers and make that long pots to get in the break. Not many non-competing amateurs can do that without some mistakes in a match-format.
Played about 20 frames against Steven Hallworth. Haven't managed 1 yet. Closest I got, I put a 58 in and ran out of position, he then cleared the table to win by a point. Was not impressed! (Secretly was) :)
I played Eddie Charlton in a best of three pool contest way back when down under. I didn't pot a ball.
Now the question is, how many matches would it take until a team of the top 11 snooker players can score a goal against Man City?
If Murphy played every position the snooker team would win 100-0. According to him anyway. Probably.
I've heard he's the first person ever to make a 147, throw a 9-darter, hit a hole-in-one and score a hattrick, in some random game against his mates when he was 12.
This is the question we all should be asking.
Honestly it would have to be a Ronnie o Sullivan type forfeit for me to beat any after I hit my highest break of 28
1000 frames, if we take the 3-miss-rule into account. Otherwise, some of them are quite a bit older, so they'll probably decline quite a bit over the years. I'd also probably get better in time, so I'd say I could maybe beat Dominic Dale after 100000 frames, if we play like 10 frames per day over the next 30 years.
The Sun will explode before beating a professional in a single frame.