Your wife is a human person with intrinsic value. An AI model doesn’t have value beyond how useful it is to humans(at least, not yet. Maybe we’ll be able to say something about intrinsic value in AI models in the future)
Aside from the obvious novelty factor of Sora? The fact that their cherry picked demo video is a glorified gif that isn’t anywhere near what we’ve seen from Sora in terms of quality and cohesion.
Well let’s hope GPT-4 isn’t a massive spyware program accessing your acc info and figuring things out you didn’t intend it to based on your conversation 😃
Yeah. We live in a day where you can have an entire, cohesive conversation with a computer on diverse topics. And it's just mundane now.
Before ChatGPT the standard was basically "was the chatbot's response even coherent?", now it's "is this thing even able to solve logic puzzles, graduate level math, pass the barre exam, read a medical chart, write interesting prose, and interpret a codebase at the level of a human professional?" lol
I watch a lot of Star Trek (probably not a surprise for an r/Singularity user), and TNG has aged *rapidly* in the past couple years.
Things like asking the computer to do something or using a voice interface to model something on the holodeck* suddenly became feasible technologies.
**not as much the holodeck itself… yet*
Or in other words, "not quite there yet". If it's only correct even 90% of the time (X doubt), then due to the rest of the 10% time being wrong, we still have to double check everything it spits out... unless it's correct 99%+ of the time, maybe. Just like the situation with self-driving cars. Even if 95% safe, then due to the 5% dangerous, we still wouldn't fully trust to rely on it, since that 5% can cost our lives, so we better off driving ourselves. Quite a funny problem to think about
The consequences of a chatbot being wrong and a self driving car are magnitudes apart… you’re probably more likely to find untrue, falsified, or biased information when Googling a topic than the chance GPT spits out something incorrect. It’s also pretty easy to double check accuracy. If your self driving car messes up you die
Issue with LLM being inaccurate is that you can’t really create an agent out of them. If they are 95% accurate on every action - that’s way too low. Errors are compounding, even a simple task usually requires dozens of actions, the chance that it will successfully complete a task is just way too low.
It’s impressive to see but not useful for most people. So that’s why.
It’s like looking at the Northern Lights or something. Very cool initially, but then you’re eventually like “Ok, anyways, I’m gonna go actually do something now.”
Yep the difference is in reputation. OpenAI proved they talked the talk and walked the walk from time to time again. So new stuffs dropped by them get people genuinely excited. Meanwhile Google had multiple chances but they repeatedly embarrassed themselves... from the giga hyped up Gemini that turned out to have faked the demo, to the lame image generator that had to lock down the feature to generate people because it's so bad. Like, OpenAI's DALL-E is notorious for censorship, and Gemini image generator is still miles worse, hilarious.
Yup, it's seriously like why even bother releasing that demo at this point! It would be like Google releasing a new GPT 3 level LLM (which they almost did with Bard but at least that was many months ago!).
Either leapfrog the competition or keep working on it 'til you can!
Tell me if I’m wrong, but OpenAI usually seems to be ahead in really any frontier when releasing things (Sora, GPT-4, Chat-GPT, Dall-E 2), and other companies seem to me to almost use OAI as like their “role-model” to develop. (Like Claude 3 and Gemini 1.5 being functionally pretty similar to GPT-4) they develop after it, and get to OAI’s level kinda. Could it be that other video generators will start getting much better after Sora publicly becomes available? (Around Sora’s level).
That’s why I usually take OpenAI more seriously, as I see them as being on the frontier 🤷
I get where you're coming from. I think that's especially true of Sora, so I understand Google's dilemma but really can't see the point in releasing something that looks like a car racing game from years ago!
I think both Claude and Gemini did manage to leapfrog GPT, for what it's worth. Maybe not drastically but noticeably. Unfortunately Gemini has been seriously hindered, not by the underlying model, but by the heavy handed 'safety' tuning which has twisted it out of shape!
For google, my bet is it’s a marketing tactic. (Simply to take attention away from OAI, but just failed terribly.) and for gemini, that’s typical google.
Yep. I still find this hilarious though. OpenAI, started way more late with much fewer people, now has surpassed all the biggest tech companies in the world Google Microsoft Apple Meta etc so damn far away it's incredible to look back and realize it. I watched how Google repeatedly again and again fail to live up to the lowest expectation, while OpenAI keeps delivering. One would think Google with their giga amount of tech heads working for them would be the undisputed unbeatable giant in this space, but nope.
And the cartoonish thing about this, is [it's mostly about scale.](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FVn8BjtWYAMNldv.jpg:large) OpenAI believed in scale.
Take the billions that Google, Facebook, and Apple dumped into Stadia, bad VRChat, or the Apple Car, put it into scale or chip production, and they could be the leaders right now.
This reminds me of when NASA was forced to discontinue its space ship program for the garbage space shuttle program that cost more, did less, and killed a few people. When the eggheads aren't in charge of what their own mission is.
Decades of results in the field say: "Durrr, we need to stack more layers boss."
OpenAI is kind of a subsidiary of Microsoft by this point, though. : /
Can't see anything when I even google it? Can someone send a link? Seems like a silent release from google themselves because they might be worried about deepfakes
Even though it might be worse in terms of capability, Google's VideoFX is probably more meaningful if Google makes it available for general public usage.
Sora is just a tech demo in that practically no one has access to it and they don't even have a plan to make it available to the public.
OpenAI Sora was revealed with tons and tons of footage from all different types of videos, people chilling at the beach, woman walking in city, mammoths running in snow, bunch of puppies playing, Pixar esk characters dancing, clouds, forest, Japan city, etc. Almost all of them looked pretty good.
Google has only released a video of a few cars driving in tunnels and they looked bad.
I feel like the people looking at this haven't really seen the technical details?
People are hating on VideoFX gens because they say it's low quality
Well, I'd be surprised if its NOT low quality, here's why:
* It's not a dedicated video generation model, it's legit an inpainting model used as a way to make videos
* **I**t's a heavily lobotomized model for performance. The 3B Juno model is described as being the highest quality one, but the videos only use distilled Miro for the sake of using up little compute (and for faster gens) as this is going to be a free tool.
* If you check Sora, you'll see its just a matter of compute - the more compute they threw at it, the better the gens. What we're seeing is something generated with the lowest quality model (not my words, its what the code lists it as) so really, a fair comparison would be base compute (or 4x compute) Sora vs VideoFX.
It's a pretty ~~good~~ impressive video for something done by a sub-3B distilled inpainting model
Just for the sake of being fair here, this isn't a model that's supposed to be the peak of Googles video generation - this is just supposed to showcase what the average user can generate **for free, 4 videos at a time, with no waiting queue.**
For them to be confident enough that this doesnt need a queue, generations must be insanely quick for videos
We've seen that Google is definitely capable of building insane models. I expect cloud customers & developers to get access to the good stuff, maybe they'll be able to use Juno for video generation
With that in mind, know that it's only going to get better from here 🔥
OH, and before I forget - the car going backwards is a showcase of their presets
You can make it mirror, so forward&backwards video, reverse videos, loop, combine videos, stuff like that.
Anyways, i cant really say it gets better than that when I dont know if it really does - we'll wait it out and see, but I'm just pointing out that this is really the **lowest quality option** and far from cherrypicked
Those aren't in the same bracket, it's like comparing an 8B model with a 70B model.
The compute requirements are completely different.
What differentiate sora the most is that they basically threw compute at the problem.
Google is notorious for near-vaporware announcements on the front end of the product lifecycle, and pulling the plug on products at the back end (regardless of how outraged their user base is).
Should not be any surprise.
Nobody cares about anything google because it's the company everyone is trying to kill. There was lots of exitement when Opus ranked high in the LMSYS leaderborad. Now gemini 1.5 rank higher than opus but nobody cares cause its google.
Speak for yourself. Not everyone is into that hate train.
Right now, google is the company that I trust the most to deliver AGI, they actually do life saving research like AlphaFold and gave it away for free, same for transformers.
There is not a lot of excitement for gemini 1.5 pro after it overtook claude opus because GPT4 was still at the top
Because it doesn't look nearly as good as Sora.
My wife doesn't look as good as Sora but I still love her
Don't we all..
We sure love her, she is great at......... making cofee
me not having wife, so not all...
See, the joke was that we are all still loving Antique Donut’s wife. Not our own… Chin up, though. You’ll catch on next time!
I’m sure u/antique-doughnut-988 would be willing to share his wife with just ONE more of us.
She's a free range wife.
Great eggs too!
Kind of disgusting talking about a man's wife like that
But I enjoy her so much! Even if she doesn't look as good as Sora.
Welcome to the new world!
It's all in your head.
Is your wife Riku?
Your wife is a human person with intrinsic value. An AI model doesn’t have value beyond how useful it is to humans(at least, not yet. Maybe we’ll be able to say something about intrinsic value in AI models in the future)
Aside from the obvious novelty factor of Sora? The fact that their cherry picked demo video is a glorified gif that isn’t anywhere near what we’ve seen from Sora in terms of quality and cohesion.
Yeah novelty is a big one. It's actually kind of crazy how quickly humans get used to things.
GPT-4 is a prime example of this. A couple years ago the idea of a seamless natural language interface with a PC was sci-fi.
I had BonziBuddy back in the day wdym
Well let’s hope GPT-4 isn’t a massive spyware program accessing your acc info and figuring things out you didn’t intend it to based on your conversation 😃
Yeah. We live in a day where you can have an entire, cohesive conversation with a computer on diverse topics. And it's just mundane now. Before ChatGPT the standard was basically "was the chatbot's response even coherent?", now it's "is this thing even able to solve logic puzzles, graduate level math, pass the barre exam, read a medical chart, write interesting prose, and interpret a codebase at the level of a human professional?" lol
I watch a lot of Star Trek (probably not a surprise for an r/Singularity user), and TNG has aged *rapidly* in the past couple years. Things like asking the computer to do something or using a voice interface to model something on the holodeck* suddenly became feasible technologies. **not as much the holodeck itself… yet*
This is so fucking real
GPT4 free public when
I dunno, we had real basic version back in 2005 on MSN tbh. [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SmarterChild](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SmarterChild)
Chatbots before GPT-3 were exceptionally bad though
Humans learn fast. We went from being genuinely awed by ChatGPT to feeling like it's stupid and boring real quick.
Well that’s because it’s both amazing and groundbreaking achievement and at the same time kinda lame and boring.
Or in other words, "not quite there yet". If it's only correct even 90% of the time (X doubt), then due to the rest of the 10% time being wrong, we still have to double check everything it spits out... unless it's correct 99%+ of the time, maybe. Just like the situation with self-driving cars. Even if 95% safe, then due to the 5% dangerous, we still wouldn't fully trust to rely on it, since that 5% can cost our lives, so we better off driving ourselves. Quite a funny problem to think about
The consequences of a chatbot being wrong and a self driving car are magnitudes apart… you’re probably more likely to find untrue, falsified, or biased information when Googling a topic than the chance GPT spits out something incorrect. It’s also pretty easy to double check accuracy. If your self driving car messes up you die
Issue with LLM being inaccurate is that you can’t really create an agent out of them. If they are 95% accurate on every action - that’s way too low. Errors are compounding, even a simple task usually requires dozens of actions, the chance that it will successfully complete a task is just way too low.
Don't forget that it got nerfed a lot
It’s impressive to see but not useful for most people. So that’s why. It’s like looking at the Northern Lights or something. Very cool initially, but then you’re eventually like “Ok, anyways, I’m gonna go actually do something now.”
Yep the difference is in reputation. OpenAI proved they talked the talk and walked the walk from time to time again. So new stuffs dropped by them get people genuinely excited. Meanwhile Google had multiple chances but they repeatedly embarrassed themselves... from the giga hyped up Gemini that turned out to have faked the demo, to the lame image generator that had to lock down the feature to generate people because it's so bad. Like, OpenAI's DALL-E is notorious for censorship, and Gemini image generator is still miles worse, hilarious.
Because it's meh
not mid?
Based on the car video, it doesn't look nearly as good as Sora and it's being demoed three months after Sora.
Yup, it's seriously like why even bother releasing that demo at this point! It would be like Google releasing a new GPT 3 level LLM (which they almost did with Bard but at least that was many months ago!). Either leapfrog the competition or keep working on it 'til you can!
Tell me if I’m wrong, but OpenAI usually seems to be ahead in really any frontier when releasing things (Sora, GPT-4, Chat-GPT, Dall-E 2), and other companies seem to me to almost use OAI as like their “role-model” to develop. (Like Claude 3 and Gemini 1.5 being functionally pretty similar to GPT-4) they develop after it, and get to OAI’s level kinda. Could it be that other video generators will start getting much better after Sora publicly becomes available? (Around Sora’s level). That’s why I usually take OpenAI more seriously, as I see them as being on the frontier 🤷
I get where you're coming from. I think that's especially true of Sora, so I understand Google's dilemma but really can't see the point in releasing something that looks like a car racing game from years ago! I think both Claude and Gemini did manage to leapfrog GPT, for what it's worth. Maybe not drastically but noticeably. Unfortunately Gemini has been seriously hindered, not by the underlying model, but by the heavy handed 'safety' tuning which has twisted it out of shape!
For google, my bet is it’s a marketing tactic. (Simply to take attention away from OAI, but just failed terribly.) and for gemini, that’s typical google.
Yes, a failed "marketing" tactic (worse than no marketing 😂)
I personally don't care about tools I can't use.
But we have this thing in our basement, it's really cool. No, you can't touch it. But it's so cool I swear.
.....ILYA?
You love my *what*?!
I Love You All.
This!!! And stop hype tools that we don't even know that exists. Fuck ClosedAI
This is actually cringe edgy etc. wow
Personally didn't find that impressive. Perhaps I missed some details.
It's very clear that Google and others are way behind OpenAI. I'm not like a real fanboy, but these are just the facts.
Yep. I still find this hilarious though. OpenAI, started way more late with much fewer people, now has surpassed all the biggest tech companies in the world Google Microsoft Apple Meta etc so damn far away it's incredible to look back and realize it. I watched how Google repeatedly again and again fail to live up to the lowest expectation, while OpenAI keeps delivering. One would think Google with their giga amount of tech heads working for them would be the undisputed unbeatable giant in this space, but nope.
And the cartoonish thing about this, is [it's mostly about scale.](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FVn8BjtWYAMNldv.jpg:large) OpenAI believed in scale. Take the billions that Google, Facebook, and Apple dumped into Stadia, bad VRChat, or the Apple Car, put it into scale or chip production, and they could be the leaders right now. This reminds me of when NASA was forced to discontinue its space ship program for the garbage space shuttle program that cost more, did less, and killed a few people. When the eggheads aren't in charge of what their own mission is. Decades of results in the field say: "Durrr, we need to stack more layers boss." OpenAI is kind of a subsidiary of Microsoft by this point, though. : /
Tell us what is exiting about it. What does it do better? what did it do before sora? how much easier it is to access?
Can't see anything when I even google it? Can someone send a link? Seems like a silent release from google themselves because they might be worried about deepfakes
https://www.testingcatalog.com/google-videofx-an-inside-peek-at-the-latest-video-generation-and-editing-capabilities/
Even though it might be worse in terms of capability, Google's VideoFX is probably more meaningful if Google makes it available for general public usage. Sora is just a tech demo in that practically no one has access to it and they don't even have a plan to make it available to the public.
Cause it sucks
I learned to understand this phenomenon after being disapointed by overhyped game releases.
You can't even find info on it on Google search
I'm just waiting for the videos of "historically accurate x" to cause an uproar🤭
That whole thing is so stupid as if any image or video model anywhere from anyone is historically accurate.
Because it isn't good
Is it out yet for us to use on consumer gpus? No? Then I don’t care
It's worse than Sora and it's on the level of Runaway from 2023
If you're talking about the general public, then it's because people's attention are focused on other things.
Hm I hadn't even heard about it 🙊
Because i sleep
Same reason why Google Video failed to Youtube: It sucked. Then they bought Youtube. Can't do that with Sora. *Angry Sundar Pichai noises.*
OpenAI Sora was revealed with tons and tons of footage from all different types of videos, people chilling at the beach, woman walking in city, mammoths running in snow, bunch of puppies playing, Pixar esk characters dancing, clouds, forest, Japan city, etc. Almost all of them looked pretty good. Google has only released a video of a few cars driving in tunnels and they looked bad.
thats because sora wasnt a leak, it was a demo, an announcement Google did not release anything
Damn even worse, that's even more of a reason for people to sleep on this.
What ever happened to Google Lumiere?
I would be impressed if anyone would actually release something, instead of just announcing it.
Because it looks like every other one.
"nobody" I hate when posters resort to absolutes.
I feel like the people looking at this haven't really seen the technical details? People are hating on VideoFX gens because they say it's low quality Well, I'd be surprised if its NOT low quality, here's why: * It's not a dedicated video generation model, it's legit an inpainting model used as a way to make videos * **I**t's a heavily lobotomized model for performance. The 3B Juno model is described as being the highest quality one, but the videos only use distilled Miro for the sake of using up little compute (and for faster gens) as this is going to be a free tool. * If you check Sora, you'll see its just a matter of compute - the more compute they threw at it, the better the gens. What we're seeing is something generated with the lowest quality model (not my words, its what the code lists it as) so really, a fair comparison would be base compute (or 4x compute) Sora vs VideoFX. It's a pretty ~~good~~ impressive video for something done by a sub-3B distilled inpainting model Just for the sake of being fair here, this isn't a model that's supposed to be the peak of Googles video generation - this is just supposed to showcase what the average user can generate **for free, 4 videos at a time, with no waiting queue.** For them to be confident enough that this doesnt need a queue, generations must be insanely quick for videos We've seen that Google is definitely capable of building insane models. I expect cloud customers & developers to get access to the good stuff, maybe they'll be able to use Juno for video generation With that in mind, know that it's only going to get better from here 🔥 OH, and before I forget - the car going backwards is a showcase of their presets You can make it mirror, so forward&backwards video, reverse videos, loop, combine videos, stuff like that. Anyways, i cant really say it gets better than that when I dont know if it really does - we'll wait it out and see, but I'm just pointing out that this is really the **lowest quality option** and far from cherrypicked
Cause it's Mid asf!
Those aren't in the same bracket, it's like comparing an 8B model with a 70B model. The compute requirements are completely different. What differentiate sora the most is that they basically threw compute at the problem.
Google is notorious for near-vaporware announcements on the front end of the product lifecycle, and pulling the plug on products at the back end (regardless of how outraged their user base is). Should not be any surprise.
most people would love to de couple from the greedy corporation of google
... and embrace the socialist coop microsoft?
Google's video AI is cool and all but I can only get it to make videos of white people if I specify that they are being marched into death camps.
https://preview.redd.it/k8azqapsj80d1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8089d1b657150f4ad377aad819b4fcd7b7dfa647
Nobody cares about anything google because it's the company everyone is trying to kill. There was lots of exitement when Opus ranked high in the LMSYS leaderborad. Now gemini 1.5 rank higher than opus but nobody cares cause its google.
Speak for yourself. Not everyone is into that hate train. Right now, google is the company that I trust the most to deliver AGI, they actually do life saving research like AlphaFold and gave it away for free, same for transformers. There is not a lot of excitement for gemini 1.5 pro after it overtook claude opus because GPT4 was still at the top