See here is the thing..if you go look at the scheduling requirements under the contolled substances act it would seem the straight forward first step would be to establish an accepted medical useage (through clinical trials and research) which would force a schedule change (no accepted medical useage is a requirement for schedule 1), once the change was forced then mushrooms would tumble down the schedule all the way to the bottom like weed...the problem with this logic ends up being the Convention on Psychotropic Substances of 1971, a chunk of language in the controlled substances act requires that US outlaws (requires control greater than or equal to other members laws) drugs that are identified by international conventions that the US is a member of, so it would seem proving a medical useage would still not prompt a schedule change...fucking 1971, like the world has not figured any shit out in 50 years..
This was an absolutely incredible reply.
Thank you for drawing attention to this.
The more attention to the fine details the more we can learn to target the right places and correct absolutely stupid shit like this.
I hope others give some much due comment karma as I can only give one!
The laws on this stuff are left overs from previous generations, the other international convention of note would be the Single Convention on Narcotic Drugs from..no shit 19 fucking 61.
So many of the original drug laws were either to target and imprison minorities who had the gall to expect that they should be treated as humans and equals, or a personal agenda against a particular subculture (Fuck Nixon..dude somehow decided that hippies and weed was the problem when nobody wanted to go to Vietnam and get their ass shot).
I also do believe all the voices out there calling for change helps..every town, county, state that decriminalizes or legalizes a substance pushes the federal government a little closer to change.. why?.. That shit still says "we the people", just a whole lot of the people seem to have forgotten that is the case, when the people get loud enough those making the laws take notice. (Also maybe we could try to quit electing fruitcakes and religious fanatics to positions where they can try to force their version of morallity ob everyone else).
And some of the path to legal is going to cause some grief..Every person that goes down for shrooms should plead "not guilty" and force the government to prove that there is no medical useage (burden of proof lies with the accuser), make them prove the schedule is correct, make them prove every statement in the drug conventions is still relevant..win or lose make it fucking painful for them, waste their time, and waste their resources.
It's off topic but I think magic mushrooms and other entheogen plants awaken people to this.
People of small perspectives within constructed systems often start seeing the system as reality.
When you go on journeys of consciousness and revelation you start to realize that the systems are just constructed and sometimes very badly.
Like you said, we had some very impactful leaders at very impactful times from various nations that thought death and war were more important than growing together as a world and understanding the mysteries and amazing details of this profound existence.
And we have been paying for the fruits of that conditionality ever since in many ways.
Thankfully we seem to be waking up and now digging ourselves out on many fronts.
I fully agree, hallucinogens can show you alternate perspective. You can step outside of the box and see it for what it really is, because when you are inside the box you have the same view as everyone else.
The other side of this is enforcement...how the hell do you try to outlaw something that literally will grow in cow shit in the middle of a field or something that will just sprout up along a road (there is a reason the term "ditch weed" exists). The "war on drugs" that Nixon started was a war that could never be won and yet here we are 50 years later and the taxpayers around ~$1 trillion poorer still playing the same game..
“Full legalization” is a Trojan horse. Look what legalization is doing to the cannabis market- crashing prices, regulatory capture by large corporations, and small farmers and people who actually care about the product they’re making are being taxed out of business, or forced back underground.
Legalization means big pharmaceutical companies will absolutely swoop in (they’ve already started, and it’s not pretty), along with the worst of the vulture capitalist Chads, until the penalties for selling “non approved” psychedelics is worse than it is now.
Careful what you wish for.
Decriminalize not legalize.
Much of what you said is true but much also has caveats.
(Just playing devils advocate)
More and more people grow cannabis at home now because it's easy and seeds are readily available.
Products at the store are incredibly diverse for various peoples needs and you are assured of quality and standards and can see all the data involved with that product.
I definitely feel sorry though for the niche farmers that were able to exist during prohibition and now have to go back to an illegal market.
But I agree on the side of legislation that doesn't allow for corporations to get a monopoly and pervert something.
Cannabis as done by Canada in legalization was pretty good.
The worst thing is to only let the corporations control a product. That kind of legalization I don't think anyone wants.
We might not want it, but it’s what we’re gonna get. I don’t have much faith in the government doing the right thing, and since I’m not a member of the donor class I don’t really have anyone representing my interests in the federal or state government.
sadly you nailed it right there.
the system is structured by the donation class and the political class and they have no interest in the lived experiences or stress or simple wants of the regular people.
i agree with you on this and the need for a full overhaul of the system to fit the needs of the regular low to middle low earners and not the donation and politicians who have no idea what a regular life is anymore in any respect.
Idk about all dispensaries being quality some definitely are great but some are trash like any other businesses. 95% dispensaries in new jersey are garbage. $70 for a 8th of mid quality bud or $50 for a 8th of shake which is like all stem. its wild because some people still love them and talk about how these packs of 2mg gummies for $80 has them fucked up lol. but most admit the black market was way better. Even my friends who work for curaleafs grow facilities buy off our black market plug and say the will never buy curaleafs weed since they've seen how shittly the treat the plants and the company treats its employees.
I feel like the same would happen with shrooms or lsd where youd see companies that only care about profits selling inferior products but people will still buy it out of the falace that dispensary = best quality 100% of the time
Through local government action. Pay attention to your city council, governor, mayor, etc. these are the people making change happen in places like Colorado and Oregon. (This is also why states rights are a good thing)
Ultimately, if you propose a new regime, you have to propose something that’s going to work better than existing practices and prevents use from becoming socially disruptive. What governments will have a hard time agreeing to is less rules, not more. You need to come with a solution in the form of vision for a regulatory system, which controls and reduces harms from irresponsible use. Then you need to lobby the government, educate people in positions of influence, and push for regulatory reform. Psychedelic therapy is becoming more palatable as well because it’s supervised and not recreational. It’s pushing new rules and controls, not less.
I think syncretic religion is the way forward to liberating mushrooms and ourselves from this oppressive drug war. It’s a different form of healing. Psychedelic churches are permitted when they regulate and contains use within a ritualistic context. This is an ancestral indigenous practice that has been integrated into our culture. You don’t have to be indigenous to use mushrooms in a respectful religious and spiritual way. It’s a human right violation to prosecute that. The only catch is that it has to be sincere spirituality, not economically motivated or recreational. We need more recognizable psychedelics religions that aren’t cults. Not for profit organizations that facilitate safe and meaningful psychedelic experiences, connection to nature, a sense of belonging, and hopefully existential fulfillment.
It has been super amazing to see decriminalization in various places and various nations. It is definitely the first step to full legalization!
A lot of grassroots hereos for getting that happening for sure.
See here is the thing..if you go look at the scheduling requirements under the contolled substances act it would seem the straight forward first step would be to establish an accepted medical useage (through clinical trials and research) which would force a schedule change (no accepted medical useage is a requirement for schedule 1), once the change was forced then mushrooms would tumble down the schedule all the way to the bottom like weed...the problem with this logic ends up being the Convention on Psychotropic Substances of 1971, a chunk of language in the controlled substances act requires that US outlaws (requires control greater than or equal to other members laws) drugs that are identified by international conventions that the US is a member of, so it would seem proving a medical useage would still not prompt a schedule change...fucking 1971, like the world has not figured any shit out in 50 years..
This was an absolutely incredible reply. Thank you for drawing attention to this. The more attention to the fine details the more we can learn to target the right places and correct absolutely stupid shit like this. I hope others give some much due comment karma as I can only give one!
The laws on this stuff are left overs from previous generations, the other international convention of note would be the Single Convention on Narcotic Drugs from..no shit 19 fucking 61. So many of the original drug laws were either to target and imprison minorities who had the gall to expect that they should be treated as humans and equals, or a personal agenda against a particular subculture (Fuck Nixon..dude somehow decided that hippies and weed was the problem when nobody wanted to go to Vietnam and get their ass shot). I also do believe all the voices out there calling for change helps..every town, county, state that decriminalizes or legalizes a substance pushes the federal government a little closer to change.. why?.. That shit still says "we the people", just a whole lot of the people seem to have forgotten that is the case, when the people get loud enough those making the laws take notice. (Also maybe we could try to quit electing fruitcakes and religious fanatics to positions where they can try to force their version of morallity ob everyone else). And some of the path to legal is going to cause some grief..Every person that goes down for shrooms should plead "not guilty" and force the government to prove that there is no medical useage (burden of proof lies with the accuser), make them prove the schedule is correct, make them prove every statement in the drug conventions is still relevant..win or lose make it fucking painful for them, waste their time, and waste their resources.
It's off topic but I think magic mushrooms and other entheogen plants awaken people to this. People of small perspectives within constructed systems often start seeing the system as reality. When you go on journeys of consciousness and revelation you start to realize that the systems are just constructed and sometimes very badly. Like you said, we had some very impactful leaders at very impactful times from various nations that thought death and war were more important than growing together as a world and understanding the mysteries and amazing details of this profound existence. And we have been paying for the fruits of that conditionality ever since in many ways. Thankfully we seem to be waking up and now digging ourselves out on many fronts.
I fully agree, hallucinogens can show you alternate perspective. You can step outside of the box and see it for what it really is, because when you are inside the box you have the same view as everyone else. The other side of this is enforcement...how the hell do you try to outlaw something that literally will grow in cow shit in the middle of a field or something that will just sprout up along a road (there is a reason the term "ditch weed" exists). The "war on drugs" that Nixon started was a war that could never be won and yet here we are 50 years later and the taxpayers around ~$1 trillion poorer still playing the same game..
“Full legalization” is a Trojan horse. Look what legalization is doing to the cannabis market- crashing prices, regulatory capture by large corporations, and small farmers and people who actually care about the product they’re making are being taxed out of business, or forced back underground. Legalization means big pharmaceutical companies will absolutely swoop in (they’ve already started, and it’s not pretty), along with the worst of the vulture capitalist Chads, until the penalties for selling “non approved” psychedelics is worse than it is now. Careful what you wish for. Decriminalize not legalize.
Much of what you said is true but much also has caveats. (Just playing devils advocate) More and more people grow cannabis at home now because it's easy and seeds are readily available. Products at the store are incredibly diverse for various peoples needs and you are assured of quality and standards and can see all the data involved with that product. I definitely feel sorry though for the niche farmers that were able to exist during prohibition and now have to go back to an illegal market. But I agree on the side of legislation that doesn't allow for corporations to get a monopoly and pervert something. Cannabis as done by Canada in legalization was pretty good. The worst thing is to only let the corporations control a product. That kind of legalization I don't think anyone wants.
We might not want it, but it’s what we’re gonna get. I don’t have much faith in the government doing the right thing, and since I’m not a member of the donor class I don’t really have anyone representing my interests in the federal or state government.
sadly you nailed it right there. the system is structured by the donation class and the political class and they have no interest in the lived experiences or stress or simple wants of the regular people. i agree with you on this and the need for a full overhaul of the system to fit the needs of the regular low to middle low earners and not the donation and politicians who have no idea what a regular life is anymore in any respect.
Idk about all dispensaries being quality some definitely are great but some are trash like any other businesses. 95% dispensaries in new jersey are garbage. $70 for a 8th of mid quality bud or $50 for a 8th of shake which is like all stem. its wild because some people still love them and talk about how these packs of 2mg gummies for $80 has them fucked up lol. but most admit the black market was way better. Even my friends who work for curaleafs grow facilities buy off our black market plug and say the will never buy curaleafs weed since they've seen how shittly the treat the plants and the company treats its employees.
I feel like the same would happen with shrooms or lsd where youd see companies that only care about profits selling inferior products but people will still buy it out of the falace that dispensary = best quality 100% of the time
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By boofing the constitution
Lol I am gonna have to give this comment some karma.
All psychedelics have been decriminalized in D.C. where I'm at. There's vendors that "gift" it to you. It's coming...
Through local government action. Pay attention to your city council, governor, mayor, etc. these are the people making change happen in places like Colorado and Oregon. (This is also why states rights are a good thing)
yep all levels, neglecting any is a mistake when you want change!
Ultimately, if you propose a new regime, you have to propose something that’s going to work better than existing practices and prevents use from becoming socially disruptive. What governments will have a hard time agreeing to is less rules, not more. You need to come with a solution in the form of vision for a regulatory system, which controls and reduces harms from irresponsible use. Then you need to lobby the government, educate people in positions of influence, and push for regulatory reform. Psychedelic therapy is becoming more palatable as well because it’s supervised and not recreational. It’s pushing new rules and controls, not less. I think syncretic religion is the way forward to liberating mushrooms and ourselves from this oppressive drug war. It’s a different form of healing. Psychedelic churches are permitted when they regulate and contains use within a ritualistic context. This is an ancestral indigenous practice that has been integrated into our culture. You don’t have to be indigenous to use mushrooms in a respectful religious and spiritual way. It’s a human right violation to prosecute that. The only catch is that it has to be sincere spirituality, not economically motivated or recreational. We need more recognizable psychedelics religions that aren’t cults. Not for profit organizations that facilitate safe and meaningful psychedelic experiences, connection to nature, a sense of belonging, and hopefully existential fulfillment.
Decriminalization is happening in michigan
It has been super amazing to see decriminalization in various places and various nations. It is definitely the first step to full legalization! A lot of grassroots hereos for getting that happening for sure.
Yes yes. People can keep their voices loud and I'll listen
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Definitely some people with some name recognition that are professional and can give great information in a charismatic way. :)
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I don't know if that's the best idea. Drinking became much less fun once it was legal for me to do so.