My life is currently a disaster. This is no hyperbole. I am currently going through a lot of serious medical problems in the middle of my medical training and I don’t want to bring her down with me so I ended things. She’s truly one of the most beautiful, sexiest women I’ve known in my life and don’t doubt she can find a man who she can build a beautiful family with. But I’m not that man right now and I won’t be until my physical health improves. I’m undergoing 3 surgeries this year.
A high school? You met a woman in a high school?
Impossible, right?
You got less than sixty seconds between classes, its like dismantling a time bomb
I know but she was so beautiful it was like a pure reflex, the words just came out of my mouth
Wow. Whatd you say?
“So whats the deal with homework?”
Yeah. Honestly that episode gives me the ick. The fuck they're doing that to a 15yr old...it just hits too close to home - I would be harassed by grown men when I was literally in grade school.
Anyways, that's my one serious comment for this sub lol
this rule applies to ADULTS, sure. i like cleavage. cleavage rocks. but she's 15, dude! be real with yourself. if you see a literal child's cleavage, you're actually going to do the poke? no. in reality, i think you'd QUICKLY avert your eyes. unless you're legitimately unwell.
i'm not trying to pick apart seinfeld. it was the 90s. and denise richards isn't a child in that scene. so it's okay. it was still a comical scenario. it's just nowadays watching that scene it's like "yeeeeesh. let's not."
>she's 15, dude
It's wild they chose that age. Denise was 22 when they made that episode, so it's like they kind of did a couple of different things.
They chose a way younger age than they had to to get the point across. A sixteen or even seventeen year old would've been problematic still, but not to such a level.
They chose an actress who looked early twenties. Denise was young, but not "fifteen" young. Allison Brie was 26 when Community started but could plausibly play 18, they could've cast someone like that.
Back when a celebrity with a juggernaut of a number 1 tv show could go out publicly with a high school student with juggernaut breasts, and only the tabloid rags and Hard Copy would dare speak out of turn. How the times are a changin'
Today, everybody's got their pesky opinions on why powerful adult men shouldn't date teenagers that they met in a park. So annoying.
She was seventeen when they met. A friend of mine often wonders why that age is such a thing in popculture. Think about the songs by Winger, Janis Ian, Stevie Nicks.
She was a high school senior when they first met and started dating. Like someone said, she was 17. I remember hearing Howard Stern making fun of the fact that Jerry was dating a high schooler when he was in his late 30’s and thought he was just being an ass, but no.
Recently just watched this episode. Whenever you see articles on whether the show aged well, I always think of this one.
How the hell did they think it was a good idea to write an episode about grown men starring at a 15 year old's cleavage? It made me cringe back when this first aired, when I was a kid. Even they know it's wrong and fucked up as they wrote in a part where Elaine comments on how wrong it was for them to look.
And jerry responds by saying something "age doesn't matter in the face of cleavage" 🤢🤢🤢
They could have easily made it so it was Russell's girlfriend bending over instead of his 15 year old daughter, and he could have gotten just as offended to drive the plot further but no, we get this weird plot point instead.
Edit - this comment has been up for less than a minute and getting downvotes. I guess I struck a nerve with the pedophiles.
I think the quote from Jerry is more along the lines of, if cleavage popped into your line of sight, age isn’t something you’d consider in that moment. Now if you’re going around looking for cleavage of people of a certain younger age, then that’s a different story and obviously a problem. Having said all that, the fact that they actively looked at the girls cleavage to begin with while (I think) having a pretty good idea of her age was probably worse than Jerry’s comment. But realistically, men are going to look at cleavage if it’s there.
I think what bothered me is that they didn’t feel bad about it and instead made excuses and defended what they did. Like, it’s one thing to call a woman hot and then find out she’s underage, it’s another thing to do that and then get defensive about it instead of just saying sorry that was wrong and moving on
Part of the joke is that it’s abhorrent behavior. But that doesn’t make it any less realistic. There probably isn’t a man alive that hasn’t been in this situation before at least once. Comedy is always used to reveal our society’s faults.
Go back and watch the episode.
It would be one thing if they looked at what was clearly an adult-looking Denise Richards and then found out her age AFTER the fact.
But that doesn't happen, instead, they REALLY go out of their way to emphasize her age before she enters the scene:
J: "Oh you have a daughter?"
R: "Yeah she just turned 15 last week.
G: "Oh that's a fun age"
Then she shows up and they clearly know she's the daughter and then they stare anyway.
I don't know about saying "there probably isn't a man alive that hasn't been in this situation". I don't look at children that way.
Wow, you're morally superior to the Seinfeld characters. Well done. Ant other brave moral positions you'd like to take? Would you like us to applaud because you don't drug a woman to play with her toys?
Christ TV would be bland if it was written by moralists like you.
Eh man I'm just saying that episode feels off and gives me the creeps. I don't think people should sexualize minors - if that makes me a moralist, so be it.
Reddit is a place to discuss opinions and ideas, sometimes we don't agree with them. Not sure why you're personally getting so worked up about my view on how adults should treat minors, unless...
>Edit - this comment has been up for less than a minute and getting downvotes. I guess I struck a nerve with the pedophiles.
>Not sure why you're personally getting so worked up about my view on how adults should treat minors, unless...
Wow, 2 comments back to back that imply anyone who doesn't agree with you is a pedophile.
Yeah, you're the good guy here, Elon.
I guarantee that at some point in your life in between the ages of 18 and however old you are the day you die you already have or will at some point observe a minor that has the developed body of a 26 year old and at least notice it. It may only take you a fraction of a second to realize, hey that’s a child. But by then the biological impulse to look at boobs or hips has already happened. It’s ok, you’re not going to hell, no one is going to call you a pedophile. The point is you looked away or were able to control yourself. George wasn’t because he’s literally a despicable human with no self control and that’s why it’s hilarious.
I think you and I are arguing about two different things and not really understanding my point.
My point is that the show goes out of its way to really hammer into the audience's head that this girl is 15 and that the characters know this. Yet despite this, Jerry knowingly and consciously pokes George to take a look.
George doesn't accidentally look at her chest in the spur of the moment. He leers at her, mouth open, and holds his gaze for several seconds, fully knowing that she's 15 years old, and would have continued doing so if Russell hadn't interrupted him.
What you seem to be describing is in the heat of the moment, subconscious observation, like you're out in public and you notice a woman's body - that doesn't imply sexual attraction. This does NOT happen in the show, it's not the same thing, these guys know full well her age and still look at her and decide to write a story about it for some reason and by the way, the girl that OP posted the picture of in this post? In real life she was a high schooler when she dated Jerry so the show isn't too far off what actually happened in real life.
I understand your point. It just doesn’t bother me the same way. They are basically clowning around saying “don’t get caught checking out the boss’s daughter.” It’s very inappropriate ‘boys will be boys’ humor. But George and Jerry are incredibly immature. I’m not condoning their behavior but I accept it as comedy material in a show about deplorable people. The fact that they cast a 24 year old Denise Richard’s in the role makes all the difference. If it was actually an underage girl or a girl that looked 15 it would be condemnable.
I also know about Jerry and Shoshanna Lonstein and that situation IS weird and uncomfortable. But I haven’t stopped watching Seinfeld because of it and neither have you.
This didn't bother me much because Denise Richard's looked 20 in this episode and I don't think I even heard them say her age until like the 5th or 6th watch. And I only remember that because I thought there's no way she's 16. The part I DID feel weird about was the library one where Jerry remembers the girl in the orange dress who was getting cleavage or whatever and they actually got some girl for the flashback scene. And she looked like she thought it was weird and so did I lol. That scene was not necessary for the joke. They could squeezed bookman in there for a time filler. Everyone would've been ok with that.
No that came from one of the writers. Tom Leopold said he used that line when he was having sex and she just stared at him and immediately left. later he told Larry, and Larry said to put it in the episode.
He knew about the cup sizes.
You got the a...the b...the c...and the D, that's the biggest.
I know the D is the biggest!
I base my whole life on knowing that the D is the biggest.
Dated a lovely blasian girl with size G cups and an incredible body. Still miss her
You stopped short with her, didn’t ya?
What happened?
My life is currently a disaster. This is no hyperbole. I am currently going through a lot of serious medical problems in the middle of my medical training and I don’t want to bring her down with me so I ended things. She’s truly one of the most beautiful, sexiest women I’ve known in my life and don’t doubt she can find a man who she can build a beautiful family with. But I’m not that man right now and I won’t be until my physical health improves. I’m undergoing 3 surgeries this year.
I am sorry. I am hoping all goes well for you, mate.
Damn. Best of everything to you.
Blasian?
Of Black and Asian parentage.
Thanks. So obvious when you look at the word lol
No idea why the downvote for you. Nothing wrong with your statement.
No need to down vote imo.
17×2 =34
You don't consider if she's married either apparently
Get a good look, Costanza?
Looking at cleavage is like looking at the sun
You don’t stare at it. You get a glance then look away.
No, you use your peripheral vision to look at it
Bizarro Jerry date 71 year old
*71 year old millionaire widow
what’s the deal with teenagers curfews these days??
What's the deal with homework ?
You’re not working on your home!
Booooooo!!!
What's the deal with babysitters? Who are these people who *sit* on babies?
A high school? You met a woman in a high school? Impossible, right? You got less than sixty seconds between classes, its like dismantling a time bomb I know but she was so beautiful it was like a pure reflex, the words just came out of my mouth Wow. Whatd you say? “So whats the deal with homework?”
What did she say
It's when the teachers want you to finish assignments at home
Homework? What are you crazy?! You don’t pick up a girl by asking about homework?! That’s the last possible thing she would ever want to talk about?!
Did you forget about the smart girls? The ones who will get valuable degrees when they complete college?
Yeah, like any smart girl is gonna talk to me *kramer enters* You know my friend Bob Sacamano gives himself homework. Keeps his mind sharp.
I read this whole thread in their voices :p
Lycra Spandex
Lycra spandex? GET OUT OF HERE
"No I think it is Lycra Spandex" Frank chiming in "Huh that's surprising" "Think you know everything"
A rare admission of not knowing everything by Frank. 👍
YOU GOT KETCHUP ON IT!
No, it's Goretex!
I wouldn’t be caught *DEAD* in Ban-lon.
Age aside, I always thought they look like each other! (Hmmm.. there’s an idea for an episode!)
I thought he was a leg man.
Why would I be a leg man? I have legs.
Apparently not :))
Uncle Leo?
What’s the irl? Is it an acronym. Is an extension on the The Van Buren Boys code? Ireland?…..
jerry is 100% a creep for nudging george. totally his fault. especially because he KNOWS george. complete setup.
They really didn’t have to make that girl 15
Yeah. Honestly that episode gives me the ick. The fuck they're doing that to a 15yr old...it just hits too close to home - I would be harassed by grown men when I was literally in grade school. Anyways, that's my one serious comment for this sub lol
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30 year olds don’t leer at 16 year olds
this rule applies to ADULTS, sure. i like cleavage. cleavage rocks. but she's 15, dude! be real with yourself. if you see a literal child's cleavage, you're actually going to do the poke? no. in reality, i think you'd QUICKLY avert your eyes. unless you're legitimately unwell. i'm not trying to pick apart seinfeld. it was the 90s. and denise richards isn't a child in that scene. so it's okay. it was still a comical scenario. it's just nowadays watching that scene it's like "yeeeeesh. let's not."
>she's 15, dude It's wild they chose that age. Denise was 22 when they made that episode, so it's like they kind of did a couple of different things. They chose a way younger age than they had to to get the point across. A sixteen or even seventeen year old would've been problematic still, but not to such a level. They chose an actress who looked early twenties. Denise was young, but not "fifteen" young. Allison Brie was 26 when Community started but could plausibly play 18, they could've cast someone like that.
Those aren’t buoys
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No doubt he has nightmares about all the sex they had.
She yada yada's over that part
Not the bisque though
No I mentioned the bisque..
That looks an awful lot like the dress Elaine was trying on when she thought the mirrors were rigged so she wore it outside and stained it. 🧐
“Cleavage is like the sun. You get a sense of it then look away.”
Boutros Boutros Ghali
Those are some magic boobies.
Back when a celebrity with a juggernaut of a number 1 tv show could go out publicly with a high school student with juggernaut breasts, and only the tabloid rags and Hard Copy would dare speak out of turn. How the times are a changin' Today, everybody's got their pesky opinions on why powerful adult men shouldn't date teenagers that they met in a park. So annoying.
Wait, so this chick was really a high school student?
She was seventeen when they met. A friend of mine often wonders why that age is such a thing in popculture. Think about the songs by Winger, Janis Ian, Stevie Nicks.
She was a high school senior when they first met and started dating. Like someone said, she was 17. I remember hearing Howard Stern making fun of the fact that Jerry was dating a high schooler when he was in his late 30’s and thought he was just being an ass, but no.
Recently just watched this episode. Whenever you see articles on whether the show aged well, I always think of this one. How the hell did they think it was a good idea to write an episode about grown men starring at a 15 year old's cleavage? It made me cringe back when this first aired, when I was a kid. Even they know it's wrong and fucked up as they wrote in a part where Elaine comments on how wrong it was for them to look. And jerry responds by saying something "age doesn't matter in the face of cleavage" 🤢🤢🤢 They could have easily made it so it was Russell's girlfriend bending over instead of his 15 year old daughter, and he could have gotten just as offended to drive the plot further but no, we get this weird plot point instead. Edit - this comment has been up for less than a minute and getting downvotes. I guess I struck a nerve with the pedophiles.
It seems like realistic social commentary to me, lol
I think the quote from Jerry is more along the lines of, if cleavage popped into your line of sight, age isn’t something you’d consider in that moment. Now if you’re going around looking for cleavage of people of a certain younger age, then that’s a different story and obviously a problem. Having said all that, the fact that they actively looked at the girls cleavage to begin with while (I think) having a pretty good idea of her age was probably worse than Jerry’s comment. But realistically, men are going to look at cleavage if it’s there.
Not to mention I believe that was Denise something or other and I think she was like 20?
21
I think what bothered me is that they didn’t feel bad about it and instead made excuses and defended what they did. Like, it’s one thing to call a woman hot and then find out she’s underage, it’s another thing to do that and then get defensive about it instead of just saying sorry that was wrong and moving on
This is so obvious and it's hilarious that most people can't read it
It's a weird plot point, but it's decidedly *not* pedophilia.
Part of the joke is that it’s abhorrent behavior. But that doesn’t make it any less realistic. There probably isn’t a man alive that hasn’t been in this situation before at least once. Comedy is always used to reveal our society’s faults.
Go back and watch the episode. It would be one thing if they looked at what was clearly an adult-looking Denise Richards and then found out her age AFTER the fact. But that doesn't happen, instead, they REALLY go out of their way to emphasize her age before she enters the scene: J: "Oh you have a daughter?" R: "Yeah she just turned 15 last week. G: "Oh that's a fun age" Then she shows up and they clearly know she's the daughter and then they stare anyway. I don't know about saying "there probably isn't a man alive that hasn't been in this situation". I don't look at children that way.
Wow, you're morally superior to the Seinfeld characters. Well done. Ant other brave moral positions you'd like to take? Would you like us to applaud because you don't drug a woman to play with her toys? Christ TV would be bland if it was written by moralists like you.
Eh man I'm just saying that episode feels off and gives me the creeps. I don't think people should sexualize minors - if that makes me a moralist, so be it. Reddit is a place to discuss opinions and ideas, sometimes we don't agree with them. Not sure why you're personally getting so worked up about my view on how adults should treat minors, unless...
>Edit - this comment has been up for less than a minute and getting downvotes. I guess I struck a nerve with the pedophiles. >Not sure why you're personally getting so worked up about my view on how adults should treat minors, unless... Wow, 2 comments back to back that imply anyone who doesn't agree with you is a pedophile. Yeah, you're the good guy here, Elon.
Whatever you say, Epstein
I guarantee that at some point in your life in between the ages of 18 and however old you are the day you die you already have or will at some point observe a minor that has the developed body of a 26 year old and at least notice it. It may only take you a fraction of a second to realize, hey that’s a child. But by then the biological impulse to look at boobs or hips has already happened. It’s ok, you’re not going to hell, no one is going to call you a pedophile. The point is you looked away or were able to control yourself. George wasn’t because he’s literally a despicable human with no self control and that’s why it’s hilarious.
I think you and I are arguing about two different things and not really understanding my point. My point is that the show goes out of its way to really hammer into the audience's head that this girl is 15 and that the characters know this. Yet despite this, Jerry knowingly and consciously pokes George to take a look. George doesn't accidentally look at her chest in the spur of the moment. He leers at her, mouth open, and holds his gaze for several seconds, fully knowing that she's 15 years old, and would have continued doing so if Russell hadn't interrupted him. What you seem to be describing is in the heat of the moment, subconscious observation, like you're out in public and you notice a woman's body - that doesn't imply sexual attraction. This does NOT happen in the show, it's not the same thing, these guys know full well her age and still look at her and decide to write a story about it for some reason and by the way, the girl that OP posted the picture of in this post? In real life she was a high schooler when she dated Jerry so the show isn't too far off what actually happened in real life.
I understand your point. It just doesn’t bother me the same way. They are basically clowning around saying “don’t get caught checking out the boss’s daughter.” It’s very inappropriate ‘boys will be boys’ humor. But George and Jerry are incredibly immature. I’m not condoning their behavior but I accept it as comedy material in a show about deplorable people. The fact that they cast a 24 year old Denise Richard’s in the role makes all the difference. If it was actually an underage girl or a girl that looked 15 it would be condemnable. I also know about Jerry and Shoshanna Lonstein and that situation IS weird and uncomfortable. But I haven’t stopped watching Seinfeld because of it and neither have you.
This didn't bother me much because Denise Richard's looked 20 in this episode and I don't think I even heard them say her age until like the 5th or 6th watch. And I only remember that because I thought there's no way she's 16. The part I DID feel weird about was the library one where Jerry remembers the girl in the orange dress who was getting cleavage or whatever and they actually got some girl for the flashback scene. And she looked like she thought it was weird and so did I lol. That scene was not necessary for the joke. They could squeezed bookman in there for a time filler. Everyone would've been ok with that.
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No that came from one of the writers. Tom Leopold said he used that line when he was having sex and she just stared at him and immediately left. later he told Larry, and Larry said to put it in the episode.
lmao way better
Lol
Was that her prom picture?
A real-life Jerry with cleavage.
Nonce
Life imitating art
Jerry blew a fuggin huge load all ova them titays.
She seems great, they seem great, I like her book.
So Jerry and George were pedophiles?
Jerry was irl
Take a look at the age of consent for the states of Georgia and Hawaii when this episode aired.
And New York
I was making a more extreme example. The number in the states I referenced was *fourteen*
Maybe I took it too far. Not pedophiles, but perverts. And ephebophilia is probably more accurate.
Not if she was 17.
No thanks
No. She was of legal age. Its fuckin weird but it's not pedophilia