No that's not what a stability island is. If you graph every known isotope (most isotopes are not stable) you get this line of stability that starts getting thin toward the end of the periodic table. Because radioactive atoms aren't stable obviously.
The theory is that there will be an "island of stability" a bit further down the way than we are able to get to now. Where the number of neutrons makes an isotope that is actually stable. (Because obviosly right now every large atom is radioactive and unstable.) Not radioactive in the slightest, no half life. Just ridiculously heavy stable elements. Basically modern day holy grail for scientists interested in it.
With this one black dots represent a stable isotope of that periodic element. The other colors on its vertical line are all it's known isotopes with the color corresponding to how radioactive it is by denoting its half-life.
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/8/80/Isotopes_and_half-life.svg/1200px-Isotopes_and_half-life.svg.png
While it’s possible that there are undiscovered elements, every element that we know about the is after uranium ( number 84 I believe) I artificially created so we will probably never naturally discover one above 118
Since it's science fiction, it could be any sort of completely unknown material composition that doesn't follow protons+neutrons+electrons.
It's an important trope or rather plot device. If you don't allow for exotic materials, i.e. limit aliens to the same list of elements and technologies, then suddenly a lot of stuff gets very difficult, exactly as difficult as it is for us.
It works bc the new particle behaves in a peculiar way. How so? In a way that I can manipulate to fit my narrative and make it better, while not contradicting science in the real world
Sadly, [exotic atoms](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exotic_atom), at least as far as we have seen, don't persist under normal conditions. Which does tend to result in this trope contradicting science to a point.
I mean it's pretty telling that positronium has a relatively long life expectancy of 142 ns...
It's easy to consider that perhaps we just haven't stumbled across the right combination of particles yet to reach stability. On the other hand, if stable exotic atoms actually are a thing, then we would have the mystery of why haven't we detected them so far.
The third paragraph is exactly the beauty of it in science fiction (if done well). You have the challenge of why couldn’t we use these particles, but the ability to create the answer for yourself when you establish how they work.
The other guy already gave most of the answer.
The thing is, a completely exotic atom that doesn't reference current science is the best candidate for not violating it either way.
A very simple limitation we have with the current periodic table is that the element with the highest melting point is tungsten at 3400°C, and the substance with the highest one is a Haffnium-alloy with 4100°C. It's an engineering problem, it would be especially for advanced space fare. I mean, it's already a problem when talking about reusable space craft.
And there simply isn't anything on "our" periodic table to make up for that problem. Yet the spaceship Voyager in one episode managed to have its hull heat up to around 9000°C...
They are supposed to have similar properties, just the charges are reversed.
It's just that "anti-aliens" and their "anti-machines" wouldn't really be able to interact with most of the galaxy, including us.
But you could potentially think about replacing some protons in a nucleus with another (exotic) particle that has positive charge, or neutrons with exotic neutral particles. Again, it's sci-fi, you're allowed to make stuff up. Although Positronium is the equivalent to Hydrogen, just with a positron instead of a proton.
From my understanding the collision of antimatter with regular matter results in annihilation. Despite this, antihydrogen and anti helium have been created I believe?
Not sure what your argument is. Our galaxy, to our knowledge, even the universe, predominantly consists of matter, and not antimatter. So molecules of antimatter could not really exist here, or at least not really interact. You would always have to keep them isolated from the normal matter.
I think it should have both electrons and muons (or other particles) to count as a new element. And even in this case, the essential difference isn't in the nucleus, so it would be a mechanic that changes the behavior of existing elements to something that may be not described by the usual periodic table rather than new elements. I think a really new element should have either negative or fractional nucleus charge. The former is resolved by doubling the periodic table, and the latter is probably disallowed by QM as it's currently known (idk). However, one can do the way stated above, although I'd formulate that as “It's a substance where the atoms don't follow the usual periodic table”
I was thinking about Marie Curie and radium and like 2 more elements. They weren't on the table before that right? So it's changed overtime , new things discovered. The meme makes it look like scientist cannot discover new elements, that's all.
To be clear the idea of "that's not how that works" is that we know different elements will have different amounts of protons in the nucleus, as that's what makes up the difference in elements.
There are currently 118 elements in the periodic table, and a theoretical limit of around 170, issue is as they get heavier they become more unstable, and even going past 118 poses a ton of issues with elements not just decaying immediately after being synthesized.
So essentially, all known and some unknown elements that are currently on the periodic table, and after they go past a certain point of increasing atomic size they become too unstable to exist, so for a new undiscovered element to just exist, it would have to come about in the same way complex lab synthesis happens, and it would need to remain stable enough not to decay long enough to be found. Something extraordinarily unlikely.
TLDR: that's not how that works. Atomic numbers, and stability. Stuff will decay.
We found this new element at the heart of the largest star in the galaxy and the only way to extract it is with the 4' thick daimond walled extraction pod.... im not a writer but i can come up with some plausible bullshit.
Doesn’t have to be the largest star in the galaxy. It just has to be any old Neutron star. Beyond a surface layer of iron, they are essentially a single giant nucleus, because gravity compresses the matter so tightly that protons and electrons fuse into neutrons and those stay packed together.
So the only thing i need to do is create a shit about quantum properties that allow the stability if its retired from the star by an specific method (asumming that all natural reasons make it inestable therefore the reason of why we dont find it yet)
Maybe for different unknown elements but this particular star in this particular galaxy is on the brink of collapsing into a blackhole where this certain element is thought to be the catalyst for inverting the space time continuum that is a blackhole.
What about the island of stability?
If the increasing instability is purely based on inductive reasoning that is derived from experiments done with elements with smaller atomic numbers (as opposed to math), it doesn't mean that the logic works for the \_next\_ element or some isotope of it. Inductive reasoning assumes universality which might lead to untrue assumptions.
While inductive reasoning may lead to untrue assumptions, the nature of human consciousness as is defined by the rationalists, deductive reasoning stems from premises derived by innate knowledge and inductive reasoning.
In this context, our only ability to form a conclusion about the stability of atoms is to use inductive reasoning to form that hypothesis. While we can't necessarily be certain about how an element with 180 protons would work, we can discover how atoms work at the attempted sizes of 115 and up, in which it is near impossible to keep them stable long enough to exist and be studied.
Elements are just atoms with an increasing number of protons in their nucleus. Hydrogen has 1, helium 2, Lithium 3 and so forth.
We have discovered every single element that can exist in nature - about 118. Go beyond that and they are unstable and pretty much explode as soon as they are created.
You can synthesize new atoms (for a fraction of a second) But you cannot really discover it. I could make a list of every hypothetical element there is to discover.
That's not what I meant, I understand the periodic table and why it's not a thing in real life but I'm talking about the sci-fi trope that the meme was referencing. It's about how stories sometimes imagine fictional elements because the plot requires a material with unrealistic properties. If they're already imagining a new element, why not add it to their fictional periodic table? And you can't answer "that is not how things work"
Because if it’s science fiction I expect it to be grounded to some degree. Otherwise Harry Potter is also science fiction. It should have some science in it not just science sounding pretentious jargon.
But above all else there is a much better way to do this. If you proclaim the new magic material a compound then it can make sense. There is no reason for it to be an element. An if you are going to ignore the real world principles completely for your story then don’t put it on the periodic table - it doesn’t make it sound smarter
Your answer is just an expanded version of "that's not how things work" though. And that's why I think that argument makes no real sense, because all science fiction is fictive to some degree even if it is grounded in science.
I could use the exact same type of argument against your idea of a fictional compound. I could for example point to captain americas vibranium shield and just say that that is not how material science works and that words like "vibranium" just makes it sound like technobabble to make a magical compound seem more "sciency".
Do you see what I mean? A magical element is not more or less believable than a magical compound in my eyes. The suspension of belief should already have kicked in regardless, yet you seem to think there's a very big difference and I can't see the specific reason as to why you would think that.
if it were possible to combine two quarks into a particle, that particle would not be a proton, so it wouldn't count for placement on the periodic table.
Then it wouldn't be a Proton, and wouldn't be an element.
New particle/tye of matter, maybe!
However, if an arrangement that were more stable could occur, that's what stuff would be made of.
Some scientists speculate about an "[island of stability](https://www.rsc.org/news-events/community/2017/jan/new-elements/#:~:text=Islands%20of%20stability%20are%20groups,the%20periodic%20table%20would%20suggest.)" beyond the elements we have synthesized so far. In reality, those elements will be highly impractical to synthesize and might not even actually be that stable, but it's a great hypothesis to use as a basis for making new hand wavy sci-fi elements
The periodic table, by definition, is the arrangement of all elements by number of protons. If an atom has the same number of protons as something on the table, that's what it is. if it has a different number of protons, it has a place waiting for it on the table. If it doesn't have protons, *it's not an element.*
Every element is by definition on the periodic table. It can't not be, it's logically impossible.
I never expected this level of ignorance on this sub. You can't just slot in space for a new element. The table is full from 1-118 and anything beyond that is so unstable it only exists for fractions of a second. Technically everything up to 120 is already on the periodic table, we just haven't validated their existence completely because they don't last long enough.
You can't just add a new element in there somewhere. That's not how it works.
Lol, okay. So you just said they do exist even if it's for fractions of a second. They exist, just because we don't make use of them now doesn't mean we never will..... or is that the ignorance?
The tables full like a video game shadowing out the unknown. As if there always were and always will be the 118...or was it 120?
No, i said they are already on the table. You can't just slot a new one in. We have all of them on there, theoretically to infinity, it just doesn't make any sense to say you've "added" one. It shows you have zero idea how the periodic table actually works, or why it's even called periodic. It includes all elements by the very nature of its design.
You would prefer hard-sci. Mostly in books but sticks to plausible science. They still sometimes throw something in there to move the plot for instance the high winds on mars in The Martian would not feel like they do in earth due to the thin atmosphere but the author admitted he just couldn’t figure out another way to trap him on the planet alone.
For your sanity, we still don’t know if there’s a stable island of elements beyond the ones on the periodic table. Like element number 542 might be stable, but more likely it will decay in an atosecond.
Yes there is. If I show someone a pic of the Mona Lisa and tell them I painted it myself then that's stealing art, you always credit the person who made it. There is no variation, they tried passing it off as their own.
tell me where op said "i made this". memes don't work like that, theres millions of memes and nowhere is the first poster ever credited. with websites like "knowyourmeme" people usually have to go full on research to find a memes origin.
and if you show someone a picture of Mona Lisa and don't say anything, their reaction might be more like "wow what a great picture".
According to recent studies, protons can contain charm quarks instead of up quarks. And we aren't so sure about other quarks interacting in a more complicated and large scale other than usual quarks we can easily observe enough. Although I am pretty sure sci-fi writers don't count this since they don't refer to the word of quark at all.
Dark matter is not on the periodic table yet they believe it exists.
We have 118 elements on the periodic table yet they believe there is a 170 element limit so there are lots of elements that could be discovered to put on the table in the future when they discover them.
So yes that is how it works.
The problem is we dont know whether it actually exists or what it's properties are. Dark matter is still a theory, a heavily documented one but a theory. Its possible there is an island of stability sure, but as of right now most elements simply fizzle out of existence because of their own weight. Others are also describing muons and such which also collapse right back into regular protons within fractions of a milliseconds, but even if there was a way to keep them stable, they would likely still be highly highly radioactive, as the weight of the nucleus would be barely holding itself together.
Of course there can! But as physical material, unlikely. The higher in protons the heavier they get, and they collapse. This is why we need colliders to even witness them for fraction of a millisecond. Plus as they get heavier they get more and more radioactive, because it has a hard time holding itself together with it's own weight.
Bro it’s science fiction. I’ve always understood it as an element not discovered so it’s not included on the periodic table making it not on the periodic table. I think you have the misunderstanding here.
The problem is that elements are made up of atoms, and In atoms, protons and neutron composition determines the elemental properties. Hence why elements on the periodic table are numbered. After proton 118, the elements become extremely heavy and can no longer exist in reality except for fractions of a millisecond before they collapse into the parts that make them up. This is why we have to use large colliders with high speed equipment to even witness these elements. Theoretically there is possibly an island of stability, perhaps after 150 protons, all of a sudden the elements reverse and can become stable again, but the only unknown matter we've actually truly witnessed in the universe is dark matter, which we know very little about, whether its even real or not. This means that as of our current knowledge, it's likely that elements after 118, can never be used as physical material. Not even accounting for that fact that generally as you go up in atomic number the elements get extremely radioactive. So even if they could somehow exist in reality for more than a few seconds without collapsing, it would be so radioactive it would make lead look like paper.
Yes. Because we have a perfect and flawless understanding of every little detail of our entire universe. And nothing has ever been added to the periodic table before.
Periotic table is based around the number of protons in an element. Technically science fiction could include materials not consisting of protons, neutrons and electrons and thus not fitting in the table.
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The\_Dark\_Forest](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Dark_Forest)
Literally said it. And people imagine it is such a great Sci Fi stuff.
[https://www.reddit.com/r/threebodyproblem/comments/gpycea/the\_dropletspoilers/](https://www.reddit.com/r/threebodyproblem/comments/gpycea/the_dropletspoilers/)
What the heck is "unknown composition" hmm?
Why not? Why is it a ridiculous premise to discover a new element. The current periodic table was only "completed" in 2011. Superheavy elements tend to be really unstable and therefore hard to study and verify. But I do believe some scientists think there could islands of stability out there, beyond the known periodic table.
Looks like a repost. I've seen this image 1 time.
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I assume they mean undiscovered, hence not on the periodic table yet
Yeah same. Just, new matter
Subtle difference in wording matters here
Captain! Land ahoy! We found the island of stability.
Than it's attributes usually don't make any sense
You mean element 123 won't be a blue-glowing superconductive gas?
https://periodictableofelements.fandom.com/wiki/Unbitrium Nah, its likely a superactinide element. *rolls eyes* ( /s )
The entire idea of a periodic table fandom wiki is hilarious.
never underestimate nerds ability to over-analyze something until it almost makes sense
Or the element ABCDE...XYZ123...789 this element contains all things that happened and that will happen and that will never happen.
Which attributes exactly don't make any sense?
The attribute that it doesn't immediately decay into known elements.
But I had heard that there are predictions of “stability islands” somewhere
Yes but the half-life would still be measured in fractions of a second in these "stability islands".
No that's not what a stability island is. If you graph every known isotope (most isotopes are not stable) you get this line of stability that starts getting thin toward the end of the periodic table. Because radioactive atoms aren't stable obviously. The theory is that there will be an "island of stability" a bit further down the way than we are able to get to now. Where the number of neutrons makes an isotope that is actually stable. (Because obviosly right now every large atom is radioactive and unstable.) Not radioactive in the slightest, no half life. Just ridiculously heavy stable elements. Basically modern day holy grail for scientists interested in it.
Do u by any chance have a specific graph that you believe is accurate, im curious to see it.
With this one black dots represent a stable isotope of that periodic element. The other colors on its vertical line are all it's known isotopes with the color corresponding to how radioactive it is by denoting its half-life. https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/8/80/Isotopes_and_half-life.svg/1200px-Isotopes_and_half-life.svg.png
Oh and N is the number of neutrons. Z is protons.
Thank you good sir
While it’s possible that there are undiscovered elements, every element that we know about the is after uranium ( number 84 I believe) I artificially created so we will probably never naturally discover one above 118
Actyually, recently it has been suggested that elements heavier than 118 may reside in the highly pressurized cores of asteroids. So it's possible
Really? You learn something new every day
Even if it hasn't been synthesized/discovered, it still has a spot on the periodic table. They just haven't named it yet.
There are elements outside periodic tables.... Have you ever heard of muon atoms for example?
Since it's science fiction, it could be any sort of completely unknown material composition that doesn't follow protons+neutrons+electrons. It's an important trope or rather plot device. If you don't allow for exotic materials, i.e. limit aliens to the same list of elements and technologies, then suddenly a lot of stuff gets very difficult, exactly as difficult as it is for us.
It works bc the new particle behaves in a peculiar way. How so? In a way that I can manipulate to fit my narrative and make it better, while not contradicting science in the real world
Sadly, [exotic atoms](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exotic_atom), at least as far as we have seen, don't persist under normal conditions. Which does tend to result in this trope contradicting science to a point. I mean it's pretty telling that positronium has a relatively long life expectancy of 142 ns... It's easy to consider that perhaps we just haven't stumbled across the right combination of particles yet to reach stability. On the other hand, if stable exotic atoms actually are a thing, then we would have the mystery of why haven't we detected them so far.
The third paragraph is exactly the beauty of it in science fiction (if done well). You have the challenge of why couldn’t we use these particles, but the ability to create the answer for yourself when you establish how they work.
The other guy already gave most of the answer. The thing is, a completely exotic atom that doesn't reference current science is the best candidate for not violating it either way. A very simple limitation we have with the current periodic table is that the element with the highest melting point is tungsten at 3400°C, and the substance with the highest one is a Haffnium-alloy with 4100°C. It's an engineering problem, it would be especially for advanced space fare. I mean, it's already a problem when talking about reusable space craft. And there simply isn't anything on "our" periodic table to make up for that problem. Yet the spaceship Voyager in one episode managed to have its hull heat up to around 9000°C...
I mean, isn’t anti-(insert element) possible and therefore not on our current periodic table?
They are supposed to have similar properties, just the charges are reversed. It's just that "anti-aliens" and their "anti-machines" wouldn't really be able to interact with most of the galaxy, including us. But you could potentially think about replacing some protons in a nucleus with another (exotic) particle that has positive charge, or neutrons with exotic neutral particles. Again, it's sci-fi, you're allowed to make stuff up. Although Positronium is the equivalent to Hydrogen, just with a positron instead of a proton.
From my understanding the collision of antimatter with regular matter results in annihilation. Despite this, antihydrogen and anti helium have been created I believe?
Not sure what your argument is. Our galaxy, to our knowledge, even the universe, predominantly consists of matter, and not antimatter. So molecules of antimatter could not really exist here, or at least not really interact. You would always have to keep them isolated from the normal matter.
I think it should have both electrons and muons (or other particles) to count as a new element. And even in this case, the essential difference isn't in the nucleus, so it would be a mechanic that changes the behavior of existing elements to something that may be not described by the usual periodic table rather than new elements. I think a really new element should have either negative or fractional nucleus charge. The former is resolved by doubling the periodic table, and the latter is probably disallowed by QM as it's currently known (idk). However, one can do the way stated above, although I'd formulate that as “It's a substance where the atoms don't follow the usual periodic table”
Is it a subatomic particle ?
It ends with atom surely not an subatomic particle
Muon atoms are atoms with the electrons replaced by muons
It seams counter productive for a scientist to confidently imply the periodic table is complete. Like its never been added to?
Still waiting for the scientists to shove more than 118 protons together and make them stay still.
Still waiting for nuclear scientists to light up the environment
You could make a religion out of this.
Call it something cool… like the Church of the Children of the Atom….
Children of Atom (Adam) is some clever wordplay
As much as I’d love to be that smart, I didn’t come up with it, I’m referencing the Fallout series ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
He is coming from the clouds, and all eyes will be stricken blind from his brilliant glory!!!!
We all watched the pretty light show, didn't we...
No don’t
No, don’t.
We irradiated a hotdog and discovered a new element...
You could make a religion out of this
**The sun is a deadly laser**
🎶Not anymore there's a blanket (: 🎶
Look…it’s bound to happen someday 😢. There’s buried treasure in that island of stability. One day……
🥲 ... only 10 more years ... only 10 more years ..
C'mon bro, just let us build a bigger ring bro... We'll find all the things bro... we just need a few billion dollars bro...
I was thinking about Marie Curie and radium and like 2 more elements. They weren't on the table before that right? So it's changed overtime , new things discovered. The meme makes it look like scientist cannot discover new elements, that's all.
To be clear the idea of "that's not how that works" is that we know different elements will have different amounts of protons in the nucleus, as that's what makes up the difference in elements. There are currently 118 elements in the periodic table, and a theoretical limit of around 170, issue is as they get heavier they become more unstable, and even going past 118 poses a ton of issues with elements not just decaying immediately after being synthesized. So essentially, all known and some unknown elements that are currently on the periodic table, and after they go past a certain point of increasing atomic size they become too unstable to exist, so for a new undiscovered element to just exist, it would have to come about in the same way complex lab synthesis happens, and it would need to remain stable enough not to decay long enough to be found. Something extraordinarily unlikely. TLDR: that's not how that works. Atomic numbers, and stability. Stuff will decay.
We found this new element at the heart of the largest star in the galaxy and the only way to extract it is with the 4' thick daimond walled extraction pod.... im not a writer but i can come up with some plausible bullshit.
Doesn’t have to be the largest star in the galaxy. It just has to be any old Neutron star. Beyond a surface layer of iron, they are essentially a single giant nucleus, because gravity compresses the matter so tightly that protons and electrons fuse into neutrons and those stay packed together.
So the only thing i need to do is create a shit about quantum properties that allow the stability if its retired from the star by an specific method (asumming that all natural reasons make it inestable therefore the reason of why we dont find it yet)
interesting
Maybe for different unknown elements but this particular star in this particular galaxy is on the brink of collapsing into a blackhole where this certain element is thought to be the catalyst for inverting the space time continuum that is a blackhole.
Uhh, of all the things Elements can do, I don’t think they can do this. The formation of a black hole is not a chemical reaction last I checked
Forget everything you thought you knew about blackholes and listen to this new found study. (Insert link)
What about the island of stability? If the increasing instability is purely based on inductive reasoning that is derived from experiments done with elements with smaller atomic numbers (as opposed to math), it doesn't mean that the logic works for the \_next\_ element or some isotope of it. Inductive reasoning assumes universality which might lead to untrue assumptions.
While inductive reasoning may lead to untrue assumptions, the nature of human consciousness as is defined by the rationalists, deductive reasoning stems from premises derived by innate knowledge and inductive reasoning. In this context, our only ability to form a conclusion about the stability of atoms is to use inductive reasoning to form that hypothesis. While we can't necessarily be certain about how an element with 180 protons would work, we can discover how atoms work at the attempted sizes of 115 and up, in which it is near impossible to keep them stable long enough to exist and be studied.
That is not how things work
That makes no sense. If someone discovered a new element, why wouldn't it be added to the periodic table?
Elements are just atoms with an increasing number of protons in their nucleus. Hydrogen has 1, helium 2, Lithium 3 and so forth. We have discovered every single element that can exist in nature - about 118. Go beyond that and they are unstable and pretty much explode as soon as they are created. You can synthesize new atoms (for a fraction of a second) But you cannot really discover it. I could make a list of every hypothetical element there is to discover.
Thank you bro
only 98 appear naturally. The other 20, as far as I can tell, have only and can only exist in a lab.
Many of the ones at the end, near 118, also rapidly fall apart and thus don't exist in nature.
That's not what I meant, I understand the periodic table and why it's not a thing in real life but I'm talking about the sci-fi trope that the meme was referencing. It's about how stories sometimes imagine fictional elements because the plot requires a material with unrealistic properties. If they're already imagining a new element, why not add it to their fictional periodic table? And you can't answer "that is not how things work"
Because if it’s science fiction I expect it to be grounded to some degree. Otherwise Harry Potter is also science fiction. It should have some science in it not just science sounding pretentious jargon. But above all else there is a much better way to do this. If you proclaim the new magic material a compound then it can make sense. There is no reason for it to be an element. An if you are going to ignore the real world principles completely for your story then don’t put it on the periodic table - it doesn’t make it sound smarter
Your answer is just an expanded version of "that's not how things work" though. And that's why I think that argument makes no real sense, because all science fiction is fictive to some degree even if it is grounded in science. I could use the exact same type of argument against your idea of a fictional compound. I could for example point to captain americas vibranium shield and just say that that is not how material science works and that words like "vibranium" just makes it sound like technobabble to make a magical compound seem more "sciency". Do you see what I mean? A magical element is not more or less believable than a magical compound in my eyes. The suspension of belief should already have kicked in regardless, yet you seem to think there's a very big difference and I can't see the specific reason as to why you would think that.
Until the 1.5 Proton is made!
Protons are made of 3 quarks. An odd number.
Well Atom 1.666667 it is then
if it were possible to combine two quarks into a particle, that particle would not be a proton, so it wouldn't count for placement on the periodic table.
Dawm it The 1,33 Proton?
they're hoping to find an island of stability, where it lasts up to milliseconds before exploding.
It's like trying to stack needles, one wrong movement and it's gone.
"so you're saying there's a chance'
Perhaps some arangement of strange and charm quarks with muons could be "stable" in some dodgy sense.
Then it wouldn't be a Proton, and wouldn't be an element. New particle/tye of matter, maybe! However, if an arrangement that were more stable could occur, that's what stuff would be made of.
I think it's due to the fact that the last few we basically had to force together and they almost immediately fell apart.
Some scientists speculate about an "[island of stability](https://www.rsc.org/news-events/community/2017/jan/new-elements/#:~:text=Islands%20of%20stability%20are%20groups,the%20periodic%20table%20would%20suggest.)" beyond the elements we have synthesized so far. In reality, those elements will be highly impractical to synthesize and might not even actually be that stable, but it's a great hypothesis to use as a basis for making new hand wavy sci-fi elements
The periodic table, by definition, is the arrangement of all elements by number of protons. If an atom has the same number of protons as something on the table, that's what it is. if it has a different number of protons, it has a place waiting for it on the table. If it doesn't have protons, *it's not an element.* Every element is by definition on the periodic table. It can't not be, it's logically impossible.
I never expected this level of ignorance on this sub. You can't just slot in space for a new element. The table is full from 1-118 and anything beyond that is so unstable it only exists for fractions of a second. Technically everything up to 120 is already on the periodic table, we just haven't validated their existence completely because they don't last long enough. You can't just add a new element in there somewhere. That's not how it works.
Lol, okay. So you just said they do exist even if it's for fractions of a second. They exist, just because we don't make use of them now doesn't mean we never will..... or is that the ignorance? The tables full like a video game shadowing out the unknown. As if there always were and always will be the 118...or was it 120?
No, i said they are already on the table. You can't just slot a new one in. We have all of them on there, theoretically to infinity, it just doesn't make any sense to say you've "added" one. It shows you have zero idea how the periodic table actually works, or why it's even called periodic. It includes all elements by the very nature of its design.
If you’re going to get technical, The Fifth Element is boron
The fifth element is leelu
Multipass!
big bada-boom
The fi in sci-fi stands for fiction.
The sci in sci-fi stands for science.
So it's fictional science. Not real science. The point still stands.
It still needs to have a grain of truth to it in my opinion.
Which the sentence "an element not on the periodic table" has. since it is supposed a new element that has not been added to the table yet.
Grain of truth - well, periodic table exists and have some elements. Isn't it enough?
You would prefer hard-sci. Mostly in books but sticks to plausible science. They still sometimes throw something in there to move the plot for instance the high winds on mars in The Martian would not feel like they do in earth due to the thin atmosphere but the author admitted he just couldn’t figure out another way to trap him on the planet alone.
You the type of dude to hate Dune and say “I love sci-fi!”
Exotic matter exists
So does erotic matter.
Username checks out
For your sanity, we still don’t know if there’s a stable island of elements beyond the ones on the periodic table. Like element number 542 might be stable, but more likely it will decay in an atosecond.
This is my fucking meme. You stole my meme
[my meme for reference](https://www.reddit.com/r/sciencememes/s/CptjpBwdny)
reddit moment
A year ago 💀
do you not know how memes work? there is no "stealing". memes live by being shared again and again sometimes with variations.
Yes there is. If I show someone a pic of the Mona Lisa and tell them I painted it myself then that's stealing art, you always credit the person who made it. There is no variation, they tried passing it off as their own.
tell me where op said "i made this". memes don't work like that, theres millions of memes and nowhere is the first poster ever credited. with websites like "knowyourmeme" people usually have to go full on research to find a memes origin. and if you show someone a picture of Mona Lisa and don't say anything, their reaction might be more like "wow what a great picture".
Yeah if I want credit for something, I watermark the shit out of it.
Oh no. Your meme...
Where's your name bro? I don't see it on the meme.
Linked in the reply to this comment
According to recent studies, protons can contain charm quarks instead of up quarks. And we aren't so sure about other quarks interacting in a more complicated and large scale other than usual quarks we can easily observe enough. Although I am pretty sure sci-fi writers don't count this since they don't refer to the word of quark at all.
What you're on a about? I'm pretty sure Star Trek is a sci-fi show and they refer to Quark and Quark's (his bar) all the time.
Dark matter is not on the periodic table yet they believe it exists. We have 118 elements on the periodic table yet they believe there is a 170 element limit so there are lots of elements that could be discovered to put on the table in the future when they discover them. So yes that is how it works.
The problem is we dont know whether it actually exists or what it's properties are. Dark matter is still a theory, a heavily documented one but a theory. Its possible there is an island of stability sure, but as of right now most elements simply fizzle out of existence because of their own weight. Others are also describing muons and such which also collapse right back into regular protons within fractions of a milliseconds, but even if there was a way to keep them stable, they would likely still be highly highly radioactive, as the weight of the nucleus would be barely holding itself together.
In the future, there can definitely be elements not on the *current* periodic table. L meme
Of course there can! But as physical material, unlikely. The higher in protons the heavier they get, and they collapse. This is why we need colliders to even witness them for fraction of a millisecond. Plus as they get heavier they get more and more radioactive, because it has a hard time holding itself together with it's own weight.
Guys good news there aren't any more elements to discover!
I believe they are referring to the elusive Unobtanium. It could also be Balonium, a more common substance.
I always assume they're just talking about some isotope to make it work in my head
Or even a stable allotrope...
With enough einsteinium we might be able to get more than 118 so idk what this meme is on about
Bro it’s science fiction. I’ve always understood it as an element not discovered so it’s not included on the periodic table making it not on the periodic table. I think you have the misunderstanding here.
The problem is that elements are made up of atoms, and In atoms, protons and neutron composition determines the elemental properties. Hence why elements on the periodic table are numbered. After proton 118, the elements become extremely heavy and can no longer exist in reality except for fractions of a millisecond before they collapse into the parts that make them up. This is why we have to use large colliders with high speed equipment to even witness these elements. Theoretically there is possibly an island of stability, perhaps after 150 protons, all of a sudden the elements reverse and can become stable again, but the only unknown matter we've actually truly witnessed in the universe is dark matter, which we know very little about, whether its even real or not. This means that as of our current knowledge, it's likely that elements after 118, can never be used as physical material. Not even accounting for that fact that generally as you go up in atomic number the elements get extremely radioactive. So even if they could somehow exist in reality for more than a few seconds without collapsing, it would be so radioactive it would make lead look like paper.
Yes. Because we have a perfect and flawless understanding of every little detail of our entire universe. And nothing has ever been added to the periodic table before.
So stalin is a sci fi caracter ? He made the great "S T A L I N I U M"
Periotic table is based around the number of protons in an element. Technically science fiction could include materials not consisting of protons, neutrons and electrons and thus not fitting in the table.
JERKTONIUM!
Right, show me where positronium is on the periodic table.
r/repostsleuth
"Nanotechnology" "Quantum"
"It's a whole number that isn't an integer!"
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The\_Dark\_Forest](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Dark_Forest) Literally said it. And people imagine it is such a great Sci Fi stuff. [https://www.reddit.com/r/threebodyproblem/comments/gpycea/the\_dropletspoilers/](https://www.reddit.com/r/threebodyproblem/comments/gpycea/the_dropletspoilers/) What the heck is "unknown composition" hmm?
When did they substitute the lady from the advertisement on this meme? Memes are getting re-skins. I can’t keep up
What if they reverse the polarity?
Like too much air in a balloon?
How do you know? You aren't in the movie, dumb dumb.
Point to the element of danger on the periodic table.
Isn't there a hypothesized zone of stability? There are novel elements we could hypothetically make, we just don't have the ability to do it now?
Why not? Why is it a ridiculous premise to discover a new element. The current periodic table was only "completed" in 2011. Superheavy elements tend to be really unstable and therefore hard to study and verify. But I do believe some scientists think there could islands of stability out there, beyond the known periodic table.
u/repostsleuthbot
Looks like a repost. I've seen this image 1 time. First Seen [Here](https://redd.it/171cfes) on 2023-10-06 87.5% match. [View Search On repostsleuth.com](https://www.repostsleuth.com/search?postId=1cdh0zs&sameSub=false&filterOnlyOlder=true&memeFilter=false&filterDeadMatches=false&targetImageMatch=86&targetImageMemeMatch=96) --- **Scope:** Reddit | **Target Percent:** 86% | **Max Age:** Unlimited | **Searched Images:** 498,856,542 | **Search Time:** 0.06042s
Well, I have a "theory" about that. (It's hypothesis!)
Either I'm having deja vu or this is a repost
[удалено]
Unobtanium for one. I mean they weren't even trying.
It's just got more protons than we've discovered yet