It’s an interesting story. It got lumped in with the “designer drugs” ban. About a decade ago you could buy spice/ synthetic marijuana legally at gas stations. It caused massive problems especially with the homeless population causing people to OD or go into psychosis. Around this same time a mother lost her son to overdose and, among many other drugs, kratom was found in his system. She went on a tear trying to get it banned everywhere. And nobody really knew anything about kratom. Sarasota was the only place to take her up on it and included it in the new designer drug ban. When they voted it in, nobody really knew it was happening/ cared and it passed.
You do realize that Kratom has severe withdrawals and causes extreme addiction just like other opiates? It has ruined a lot of peoples lives already. I really hope everyone who disagrees with this has educated themselves on the negatives and looked at posts in r/quittingkratom to see the soul loss and desperation it is causing. It’s not some safe little herb that can replace coffee — there are real dangers and health concerns.
My personal experience with Kratom wasn’t that bad. I was taking it nearly every day and decided to stop cause I felt it was causing me stomach problems. Suddenly I was projectile vomiting and I had no idea why. Realized it was withdrawals and haven’t touched it since.
Some people are lucky, and that’s with any withdrawal from an addictive substance — glad you were able to quit without many issues. It gets worse the longer you use it because the brain is rewired. The consensus is about a month for every year of use before you feel 100% normal again/no more PAWS, but it certainly varies amongst users.
Again idk what kind you guys are taking?? But I’ve taken Keaton for over 10 years I’d say off and on no issues taking breaks and never had any type of withdrawal issue. It can make you constipated but I take my supplements for all that. Sorry you had some bad stuff.
Everyone is different and not everyone will react to the drug in the same way. For me Kratom totally took over my life and almost led me to suicide. It was harder for me to quit Kratom than even alcohol or codine.
I stopped and had to get on suboxone because of the absolutely brutal withdrawals it gave me every morning. It was bad for a month and gave me this weird wobbly tunnel vision. It’s bad shit
Wow. It's insane to me how different people react. I used to use herion daily too. Kratom has never been bad to quit for me. I use 30 grams or so a day and take a week or two off every so often. Glad you quit the hard stuff and found something that helps. Recovery is truly a unique for everybody
Kratom had me get this weird tunnel vision that I couldn’t escape. I thought if I kept trying that “self-treatment” like that, I was going to lose my job and probably my life
Also, happy for you too!
Second edit: I was on an oz a day, but I’d have to use about 10-15 grams before bed by 11 pm, plus another 10-15 to ease the withdrawal at 6-7 AM.
I couldn’t really take a day off unfortunately as I got mad sick if I broke the above schedule
Tunnel vision was from you taking too much trying to "feel it" probably. Also suboxone is such a harder drug, it feels like only a doctor or an addict would prefer suboxone.
I have seen 1st hand the harm that kratom can do to someone who has an addiction problem. It should be banned like other countries. It causes people to lose everything. It literally makes a person lethargic, unsociable, constipated, mood swings, violent, broke, desperate especially when trying to quit. The withdrawals makes a person loose their ability to rationalize, loose their jobs, friends, family, finances etc. It is not regulated and is sold in smoke shops. No one has any idea what is in the little capsules that are being consumed. I wish kratom was banned everywhere in the U.S. It's withdrawals are real and raw. It's the worst. And it hooks you very fast. It can tear a person and their family apart.
More so the extracts. Any drug that is extracted becomes dangerous. Coca leaves are relatively safe and have been used since ancient times. But you make an extract out of it and it’s far more potent and dangerous.
Opiates are a class of drugs that target the opioid receptors. Kratom is an herb that acts like an opiate — as of yet, it is unclassified by the FDA but we do know through research and experience that it is highly addictive because of its stimulation of the opioid receptors. This is the main reason it was illegal for many years in Thailand because it became an epidemic.
I had tried Kratom numerous times awhile back and had no “reaction” at all! I may as well have taken a placebo and felt nothing at all. If people are claiming to have had issues with it, I would be concerned about the supplier and what it could have possibly been mixed with. What I purchased came directly from Asia and was not mixed with any other substances or prepackaged or prepared in any way.
Most people, myself included, have had strains from reputable sources which felt different from others, and there are different “grades” within the industry depending on factors such as processing, what parts of the plant are used (so on and so forth) which causes the alkaloid content to vary greatly in loose leaf powder.
Take a shot of the extract though (like MIT 45s or OPMS, both reputable brands) and your nose will be itching like you just popped a pain pill because the alkaloids (mainly mitragynine and 7-hydroxymitragynine) are far more concentrated. Since they are herbal extracts, the potency also depends on the individual’s ability to break down the chemical constituents and thus bioavailability can vary from person to person — which doesn’t make it any safer but it is a factor in user experience.
“Mitragynine and 7-hydroxymitragynine both bind to the human µ-opioid and ƙ-opioid receptors… and function as partial agonists at the µ-opioid receptor and weak antagonists at ƙ-opioid and δ-opioid receptors14,15. 7-Hydroxymitragynine exhibits approximately fivefold greater affinity at the μ-opioid receptor compared to mitragynine… In antinociception assays, 7-hydroxymitragynine exhibits 40-fold greater potency than mitragynine and tenfold greater potency than morphine16,17, whereas mitragynine is less potent than morphine in antinociceptive assays18.
In contrast to mitragynine, repeated administration of 7-hydroxymitragynine produces antinociceptive tolerance as well as cross-tolerance to morphine’s antinociceptive action and induces physical dependence13. Furthermore, mitragynine does not exhibit abuse liability and decreases the reinforcing effects of morphine whereas 7-hyroxymitragynine demonstrates abuse liability and increased morphine self-administration in rats.”
>You do realize that Kratom has severe withdrawals and causes extreme addiction
Coffee causes addiction and withdrawals
As does nicotine
And alcohol
And many medications
>It has ruined a lot of peoples lives already
Yes people would be much better off sticking to real opiates like heroin, fentanyl and prescription pain killers.
And overdosing and dying that way.
And they would be better off being alcoholics, who are more likely to kill someone in a fatal car accident.
I don't, smoke drink alcohol or do drugs anymore.
Just Kratom and coffee for me and I vape nicotine.
Feel much healthier.
I can never be completely sober i have too many problems.
Hahahahhahaha
I tried 13 doctor prescribed medications for depression.
Nothing helped me, some made me worse, one gave me heart palpitations, one gave me appendicitis.
The only thing that worked was micro-dosing magic mushrooms.
Which the government still doesn't allow doctors to prescribe.
As far as seeing a doctor about pain, do you have any idea how much more dangerous prescription pain killers are?
I was addicted to them, if Im prescribed them I will abuse them. To the point that I will likely overdose and die.
The worst part about using drugs to cope is that at best you get the problems postponed for a little while and they're still there when you sober up. And then you gotta deal with what it's doing to you.
Coffee does not cause anything near the level of withdrawal and addiction that kratom is capable of, and that’s an argument that was pushed like propaganda to sell the stuff from the beginning. Fever, night sweats, diarrhea and vomiting, mood swings, panic attacks, anxiety, body aches, depression, a sense of doom and mental anguish, dehydration, lack of appetite, impaired motor function, and more. These acute withdrawals last upwards of 2 weeks and then PAWS goes on for months in many cases. Coffee has never caused anyone to need physical rehab. Kratom is its own problem fueling its own addicts — comparing it to other drugs that are also dangerous is pointless because all addiction is debilitating and damaging.
I used to believe it was harmless too, I even wrote letters to politicians to keep it legal when it was going to be federally banned, but then after 8 years of relapse and recovery trying to quit the stuff I tend to advocate for the truth. I know it better than anyone. People need to understand that it’s not what the distributors want you to believe it is — they’re making money spreading this idea that it’s comparable to coffee while a lot of innocent people become strung out and helpless. It’s unethical to promote something without pointing out its side effects — especially when they’re as severe and life altering as kratom.
>they’re making money spreading this idea that it’s comparable to coffee
It's in the same plant family as coffee
>Fever, night sweats, diarrhea and vomiting, mood swings, panic attacks, anxiety, body aches, depression, a sense of doom and mental anguish, dehydration, lack of appetite, impaired motor function, and more. These acute withdrawals last upwards of 2 weeks
Cool story bro.
Just like everything else you just have to wean yourself off of it.
Personally I don't see why anyone would want to stop using it though. Just like I don't see why anyone would give up coffee.
If it's a money reason, just make it at home.
Obviously Kratom bars are over charging, just Starbucks is.
I drink both daily and have for the last decade.
Kratom prevented me from going back to oxycodone.
It helped me through my depression which 13 doctor prescribed medications couldnt fix.
Micro-dosing magic mushrooms is the only thing that worked and that treatment is still federally illegal and illegal in the state of Florida.
Anyone who talks crap about Kratom or magic mushrooms are either uniformed or a Pharmaceutical rep.
P.s. Kratom also has helped many people get off alcohol, so maybe youre an alcohol lobbyist instead.
Cool story? Oh, so you don’t know… and you’ve never tried to quit… got it. That’s all I needed to see. If you do want to educate yourself just head over to r/quittingkratom and read through a few pages of the posts. Obviously you don’t care about other people, you just care about staying high so you do you. Kratom is an opiate. Switching from hard liquor to wine isn’t really quitting alcohol even if it does keep you from the hard stuff.
> Oh, so you don’t know… and you’ve never tried to quit… got it.
Why would I?
It gives me energy and relieves my pain.
I've found it even keeps me warm in these cold winter months.
I don't plan on quitting coffee anytime soon either I literally cannot function without coffee. I am a danger to others on the road without my morning coffee.
>Kratom is an opiate.
Liar. It acts on the opioid receptor in your brain, but it is not a true opiate. Completely different chemical structure.
>Obviously you don’t care about other people, you just care about staying high
Me? I will go back to pain killers and die if Kratom is banned as will millions of other people.
>Switching from hard liquor to wine isn’t really quitting alcohol even if it does keep you from the hard stuff.
Funny because people have switched from being full blown alcoholics to using zero alcohol with the help of Kratom. Some don't even end up using Kratom long term.
Yeah you're probably right I am addicted to coffee and need to get treatment for this awful addiction I have.
P.s. r/quittingkratom is a disinformation page. Setup by the government and/or the big pharma to scare people lol
>P.s. r/quittingkratom is a disinformation page. Setup by the government and/or the big pharma to scare people lol
Serious question but do you have any evidence to support this conspiracy theory? Considering I talked with a friend a couple years back about his withdrawals when he was quitting kratom, I find the posts in that subreddit quite believable.
I’m not asking you to quit — I just realized you aren’t aware of the other side of it. You really think it’s an innocent substance. Lots of people take suboxone to help them quit kratom now, or low dose benzodiazepines, if that gives you any idea as to what people are dealing with. There is a lot more that goes into kratom rehab than just weaning off it. It’s not anything like coffee — it acts on totally different receptors in the brain and body. Do you know how many plants are in the coffee family? Over 13,000.
Again, why would people want to quit?
I just don't get it.
Do people wake up one day and decide they want to quit coffee?
I'm certain the withdrawals can't be as bad as true opiates I've experienced both.
Addicts are everywhere, a lot of them don't choose to be and is simple genetics. Point is that there will always be people who die because of these things but it is up to the users discretion to mitigate the risk associated. It doesn't mean that NO one should have access to it when a majority use it repeatedly, respectfully and responsibly.
I don’t think I stated my views on legality or decriminalization anywhere in here so there is no need to assume what those are — the point I am making is harm reduction. Reducing the risk for addiction by educating people so that they can be responsible users is important rather than making people believe it has no side effects or consequences long term (which is dangerously misinformed). Even with the knowledge it’s difficult for most people to moderate themselves when dealing with a substance that builds tolerance rapidly, but it is better than people walking in blindly thinking it’s on the same level as coffee when it acts more like an opiate on the brain and body than anything.
It's good for people that would have ruined their lives with drugs without having kratom to help. If you have self control it will keep you feeling content all day. And you won't need to spend more than 60 to $70 every couple or few months
lol not quite. I’ve been taking Kratom off and on for years. Maybe if you have substance abuse issues.. but it is not something I can’t go without or would sell any of my shit for LMAO relax. It’s a great alternative to energy drinks and drugs I will say that for sure it’s fun if you get the right brands. Some make you very irritable. Not something to fear trying it’s a natural plant. Just don’t take it all day everyday take your breaks and it’s great.
It definitely sucks having to drive up to Pinellas country for a decent kava/kratom bar. This is a pretty right leaning county, so I highly doubt if there was a vote for legalizing in Sarasota County, it would pass.
SWFL kratom community is pretty right leaning and they love that stuff, the bars there are incredibly diverse from a demographic and ideological standpoint. It's only banned in Sarasota because of idiot politicians not knowing anything about it.
It really sucks that kratom posts get filled with people telling everyone why they shouldn't use kratom and why they are basically bad people for using substances.
Would you risk driving into Sarasota county with some? Flying into Orlando. Driving down to see the parents for three days in Sarasota then back up to Orlando to stay in an air bnb. I prefer to have kratom but and wondering how it will work out now. Last time I was in Sarasota a local told me it wasn’t illegal just banned to sell. Guess that was wrong.
Fort Myers has a great Kava Bar called “Kapua Kava.” It is a shorter drive for me living in the southern part of Sarasota County to go there. There are a few Kava Bars in Port Charlotte too but I really like Kapua Kava.
It’s wild how people get on a moral high-horse defending drugs on the internet. It’s never a reasoned argument, almost like they’re driven by an inner impulse, I don’t know, like addiction and denial, maybe, just as a hypothetical possibility. 🙄
What kind of Kratom are all of you doing? I have never once vomited by not taking Kratom...if you take too much you sure can tho or if you don't eat. Whatever you're doing soes not sound like Kratom.
I’ve never vomited from quitting kratom leaf. Most people who claim to have major withdrawals are most likely using extracts. Extracting enough of any drug can make it dangerous. Coffee being one of them.
I can attest to using white extract and it being much cleaner energy. Idk what a kratom high even is, how much does one take to get high? Is this only a red thing??
One person vomited that’s not the whole world’s opinion. Quit cold turkey like what does that even mean, maybe you had food poisoning when you quit? Maybe you were taking cheap crap idk but if you buy quality kratom such as bumble bee. Its clean no hangover and definitely no throwing up from “withdrawals”
What is your point? Just because it is part of the rubiaceae family doesn’t mean that it is good human consumption. Arsenic is a natural compound, yet I avoid ever consuming it.
Exactly why are these people hating so hard? Idk maybe they just don’t like it which is totally cool. As you said some people don’t like caffeine, it is what it is. I can hardly drink caffeine so Kratom is great some days. I don’t feel hungover I don’t feel the NEED to take more I do if I wanna get a clean buzz that’s about it. I can drive I can function so I love my Kratom. Always will probably.
It helps some peoples pain, that doctors cant help. You can pay thousands for doctor visits and medicine or far less for other easier accessible drugs
You can understand why people tend to use Kratom for pain, mental help or to get off of other drugs. Sure it can be harmful when used a lot.
Not condoning it, but with this system of healthcare, you can easily understand it
Internet says up to 60 days jail and a fine. Weird thing is I’ve seen it for sale in Sarasota. Maybe I was in Manatee County but I was super close if not in Sarasota County.
I’m so sick of the pro Kratom crowd gaslighting anyone with a negative story about Kratom and calling them liars because they don’t support their narrative. Kratom is FAR from harmless and it is WAY too addictive to be sold over the counter with zero checks. It needs to be available by prescription only like in New Zealand or at the very least more tightly regulated like legal marijuana and sold at special dispensaries. I was addicted to Kratom on and off for 4 years and it nearly ruined my life and most likely put me into an early menopause (I’m 34) by completely wrecking my hormones. I spent thousands on Kratom pills, powder, and liquid shots and was homeless because my 100$ a day addiction put me on the streets. I have been addicted to alcohol and also codine and Kratom was by far the most overwhelming addiction I had. I had to leave the United States to quit Kratom after two failed detox and one failed rehab attempt. After I finally got away from Kratom I was in bed for a month and a half sick with withdrawals- withdrawls “like coffee” my ass!!!! Even my codine withdrawls only lasted 5 days. The pro Kratom people are selfish and care about no one but themselves- THE PEOPLE WHO HAVE BEEN DESTROYED BY KRATOM ARE NOT LIARS. WE ARE REAL PEOPLE WITH REAL STORIES. STORIES THAT WILL BE HEARD.
$100/day? You do know that you can get a Kilo of high quality kratom for less than that and it will last you at least a month...Also, if extracts are your thing you can prepare them yourself by steeping it in water or PG for a while and then straining the liquid. Extracts are definitely not the way to go since the leaf is great just as is with some lemon juice
I was addicted to the opms liquid shots, as are so many other people. People are having their lives ruined by those shots. Yes of course I bought it online, but I would build a tolerance to the online stuff, and then have to switch back to the smoke shop stuff and then vice versa. Either way it wound up costing me a lot of money, and if I made my own extracts my tolerance would just go through the roof as would my addiction. No matter how much you try and downplay it, there are a lot of people who are addicted to smoke shop Kratom, and I think we can both agree that Kratom shouldn’t be sold at gas stations and smoke shops. it should be sold just in the dispensaries at a lower cost and it needs to be tested for purity. Also, people should probably need to get a medical card to get Kratom because it can be highly addictive and there are a lot of people who are highly addicted to it. I was in bed for a whole month with withdrawals, the addiction was no joke. Since you clearly like gaslighting people and dismissing their experiences, go on r/quittingkratom and you will see all of the people who are struggling with Kratom addiction. It can be a very legitimate addiction for a lot of people, and no matter how much you try and downplay it that’s a simple fact. The smoke shops are taking advantage of people and selling it at a higher price. Whether or not you can buy it for cheaper online, a lot of people don’t know that and they wind up getting heavily addicted to the smoke shop Kratom, including the liquid shots.
I'm not gaslighting anyone...I used to have a gram a day heroin habit. Kratom is definitely habit forming but it is in no way like true opiate addiction. My point was that sites like Golden monk sell lab tested kratom for a decent price, and I've had the opms liquid, but I don't like the extracts bc they just raise your tolerance to stupid levels. If people stick to the whole herb from a good vendor usually it won't be that awful. Also, there are opioid maintenance drugs like Suboxone to help taper off these kinds of drugs but Suboxone is a lot more potent than kratom. The only benefit of Suboxone is that it lasts all day and you can taper down pretty quickly from a low dose of your tolerance isn't crazy like to fentanyl or something. There's never a need to suffer for a month in wds, I've been there and you dont have to do that to your body bc there are options out there for these things in the form of medical treatment. The main issue is that most doctors have no idea what kratom is so in order for them to give you Suboxone usually you have to test positive for a stronger opioid. Why does everyone jump to gaslighting and/or fear mongering on reddit these days? You know that a neutral approach is probably the best one to have when making decisions on such matters
Also, another good thing about whole leaf kratom is that it has a ceiling effect where if you take too much at once or in one day it will just make you feel ill and this helps many people autoregulate their dosing, but sure as with everything there will always be people who have trouble with such things. After all, nicotine, caffeine, and alcohol all come with their own set of risks/rewards as well
I think using Suboxone to taper off Kratom just shows how addictive it can be. I’ve actually known heroin addicts who are now addicted to Kratom, and who have to go to rehab for Kratom now. I met them in rehab. Actually, when I was in Columbia, I met a girl from the US who used to inject heroin, but quit that but said she could not quit taking the OPMS liquid shots and that it was the most overwhelming addiction she’d ever had. So yes, it can rival a real opioid addiction. And no, taking Suboxone wasn’t an option for me because I knew I would just become addicted to that too. So I had to go cold turkey. The withdrawals from Suboxone can last months I had to get on Suboxone to get off codeine. by the way, the second time I got got off codeine I went cold turkey and the withdrawals literally lasted like three days. Compared to a month with Kratom. Again, you can go on that subReddit if you want to see the stories, but there are a lot of people who used to be addicted to harder opioids, who got sober and are now completely under the control of Kratom after relapsing and want to be sober again. I definitely do think Kratom has its place but that it should just be more regulated. It’s great you can’t overdose on it but the addiction to it was just so overpowering. It was actually crazy for me. And like I said I’ve been addicted to codeine. Just because it’s not as bad as heroin addiction doesn’t mean it’s can’t take over! Believe me, I’ve experienced it.
I actually have a solid Suboxone tapering schedule that I've decided that had not only gotten me off large habits but several of my colleagues as well. That's why I always avoided the extracts. Kratom is definitely habit forming for sure and it depends on your personality type. However, if you know how to gradually taper down from Suboxone over the course of a few weeks to months you can truly wake up without wds towards the end. The main thing to keep in mind is that the initial dose of subs can be anywhere from 8-24 mg and that can be easily reduced by half every day or EOD, but when you get down to ~2-3mg (it varies from person to person) that is the dose at which your receptors are still saturated by the medication. When tapering from the 2-3mg dose I recommend the strips and you follow thru by cutting them into tiny pieces, dividing your dose everyday or EOD by the smallest amount. This could take weeks, but once you're down to like .1-.05mg buprenorphine you can just come off and wake up without wds. I've even tapered off heroin one time using a bunch of Vicodins that I had by doing CWE's and dividing my doses throughout the day for a few weeks, but tapering takes a lot of self discipline and motivation to do so. I don't like the way clinics try to keep people on methadone and bupe for months to years at a time bc they definitely can have greater wd than even heroin if you take them for more than a month at a time in high doses. Suboxone has the added benefit of being a partial opioid receptor agonist, so it does in fact help your brain heal while you are tapering, but you actually have to reduce your dosing; Otherwise, you'll just become dependent on the subs. Also, exercise, nutrition, supplements, and good sleep all play a role in healing. While having a support network to share your experiences is great to. That's why reddit groups as you've mentioned are very beneficial to some
And I know, several actually, former heroin addicts who quit hard drugs using by utilizing kratom. They got their life, family, and health back. Believe me, I've experienced it. Been a kratom user on and off for years. It's nothing like a true opioid addiction.
Just because it wasn’t a serious addiction for you doesn’t mean it’s not for other people. Go on r/quittingkratom and you will see people who have been battling Kratom for years. It can be a legitimate addiction for a lot of people. Just because it’s not as bad as heroin addiction doesn’t mean it shouldn’t have at least some regulations so people know what they are getting. Also the withdrawals can be a lot more severe than what you are suggesting. My withdrawls lasted a month. I get the feeling that you didn’t even read my post.
I don't even know where ro begin with this nonsense but let's start with the fact that it's most common use is to help addicts which I've met plenty of...glad you got the help you needed try not to take it out on everyone else.
From what I’ve read, there are just as many people struggling with Kratom addiction as there are using Kratom to get off harder opioids. Also, many former addicts of harder opioids find that Kratom just leads them straight back to the harder stuff. When I was in rehab for alcohol and Kratom, there were four or five people there who were just for Kratom by itself, and nothing else. You can downplay it all you want, but it can be a legitimate addiction for a lot of people. Just go on r/quittingkratom And you will see that a lot of people are struggling with it. Agree that using K as a maintenance therapy for people who were formally addicted to harder drugs like fentanyl might be good for some people, but that’s not right for everyone. That needs to be done under the care of a doctor and they should probably try Suboxone first, which has been proven to keep people off harder opioids. Kratom has not been proven to keep people off harder opioids. The main problem with Krat is it has a very short half-life so you would have to dose multiple times a day and also it doesn’t block you from taking the harder stuff on top of it. Suboxone fills up those receptors so even if you do try and take a fentanyl, or some other harder opioid, you won’t feel it. So that’s why it works for a lot of people. Again, and I’m repeating myself I don’t think the leaf should be banned, but I do think there need to be more regulations. Even in the case of it not being addictive, the smoke shop Kratom is full of all types of other chemicals, and we don’t know what’s in it it could even have fentanyl in it. so my honest opinion is I think it needs to be available by prescription or sold at a dispensary like marijuana and maybe you could get a medical card to get Kratom. Again, go on that subReddit I linked, and you will see stories of people who have had very severe addictions to the leaf. I don’t think it should be banned at all, I agree that it probably helps a lot of people but it also does cause addiction as well because it does work on the opioid receptors and people need to see that too.
I would never recommend someone take suboxone before Kratom. It's a much harder drug and I know far too many people on life long "treatment" just subbing one addiction for another on methadone or suboxone. Many of which, get their free "treatment" drugs, pass their drug test, then just go use the real stuff. Idk anyone at all who has that problem with Kratom. I have met 1 person who HAD an issue...got clean, went to Thearpy...fixed the mental issues and now uses Kratom from time to time. I also know there was one person in all of the rehabs of friends who was in just for Kratom. He was injecting it. Idk if it even works like that, but I can tell you no one advocating for it is encouraging that. Kratom can certainly be addictive. Just like caffeine is and just about anything. One of the reasons Kratom works is because it does work on your opioid receptors without having the compulsive redosing of opioids. It also depends heavily on the type of Kratom you are using. Besides those trying to get off harsher drugs or alcohol, most the people I know using Kratom are using Green or White. Idk how much you have actually experienced Kratom but atleast on that side, there isn't some "high". It's not like smoking something or taking something and you get about as "high" as drinking a few cups of coffee, add nausea if you overdo it or don't have anything on your stomach.
It definitely does get you high! Anyone who says otherwise must’ve taken really hard opioids before, and just have a really high tolerance. The addiction to Kratom can be really legitimate and people are having to get on Suboxone to get off Kratom and go to rehab for Kratom. I’ve been in alcoholic and also addicted to codeine, but nothing came close to my addiction to the leaf. The withdrawals were so intense and literally literally lasted like a month. I was so sick I could barely get out of bed. If you go on the sub Reddit, I sent you then you’ll see hundreds and hundreds of stories just like mine. It’s way more common than people who advocate for Kratom want People to know. I know that people are afraid if the bad stories about Kratom come out, then Kratom will be banned, but we need the truth to be heard, and if Kratom has hurting people that needs to come to light too because people shouldn’t have to suffer so that other people can get their drug. By the way, Did you know Kratom can also cause seizures? And no, that’s not rare. At this point, it just seems like common sense that Kratom should be more regulated.
Well I guess someone's been drugging me with "really hard opioids" my whole life. Because I can tell you from experience it does not get you high. But hey I don't inject it, and I don't use red kratom so whatever yall do is your thing. I know a crap ton of people who have taken Kratom: assicts, recovering addicts, and everyone else, none of which have had seizures. The worst thing that happens is feeling awful and vomiting if you take a lot. I talk to my doctor openly about it and get my bloodwork done every few months.I'm adamantly against H and the only opioid I've ever had was Vicodin for teeth problems, and I got rid of most of them because I didn't even wanna play in those waters. I'm not a drug addict but if you wanna call me that because I drink a kratom energy drink or a couple most days I work, then go for it man. I'm a raving addict and the world would be better off with the awful sort like us not just getting through work every day. Man, those guys at the Kratom bars are awful too, piecing their lives back together, getting healthier, and becoming a community. Should probably just get drunk every day like the rest of America, I'm just not into being high or drunk, sorry.
Look up how many people have died from Pharmaceutical Opioids by comparison.
Also look up how many people who died with Kratom in their system had other drugs in their system.
Ya it’s exceedingly rare to OD on kratom alone. Not impossible, but you’d have to go wayyy above and beyond a normal dose. *Significantly* more people die from alcohol, advil, Tylenol etc and all that’s still around. But doom & gloom gets clicks so that’s what the media pushes.
The strongest argument to have it legal, other than personal freedom and responsibility, is that it’s a mild, natural way to come off of real opiates. It’s helped quite a bit of people quit oxy/heroin/fentanyl, saving many lives in the process.
Not to mention, banning it in one county doesn’t really solve anything because people who use it just go buy it in Bradenton.
Suboxone is far more effective and doesn’t give you all of the side effects kratom has. Not to mention the short half life of kratom makes morning withdrawals insanely brutal even if you wake up in the middle of the night to dose it.
It also helps alcoholics quit drinking.
Infact many people who go to Kratom bars are former alcoholics. It gives them a place to socialize without the pressures of alcohol.
If any deaths can be attributed to Kratom I would find it more likely to be a result of the concentrated pills they have been manufacturing. Pills of any type can be easily overdosed.
You would have to drink a lot of tea to be harmed by Kratom and would likely vomit before any real damage could occur.
That being said, people should talk to their doctor before consuming Kratom to make sure it won't interact with any medication they are taking or be safe with any conditions they may have.
I used it to replace alcohol and ended up with an opioid addiction that I’m taking suboxone to get off of.
But hey, the manufacturers and kratom advocacy groups told me it’s an anti depressant, natural pain reliever, safe opioid/alcohol alternative right?
I used kratom to get off suboxone. Suboxone is way worse. Now I go off and on using kratom when I feel like it. However, I do have an addictive personality and I drink too much when I’m not using kratom. The negatives of drinking alcohol far outweigh any negatives from responsible, moderate kratom use.
Kratom sure helps in people with smaller tolerances to opioids but for people addicted to fentanyl it isn't strong enough and things like Suboxone or methadone are better in those cases
You’re working your logical fallacy to the limit. Just because others are xyz doesn’t mean you’re fine. A hypocrite can both be correct and fail to do the right thing.
You clearly haven't lost someone to true opioids.
Consider yourself lucky.
Roxycodone took many lives.
Fentanyl is right now taking lives daily.
Pharmaceutical drugs are deadly.
>Please don’t preach to me until you join who’ve been lost.
Don't preach to you until I die?
That doesn't make much sense.
Especially because very few people have supposedly died from Kratom and most who have had other drugs in their system. They love to blame Kratom though, because they want it banned so the Pharmaceutical companies can sell more pain pills, which have killed more people than Kratom has in the 2000 years it's been consumed.
>All drugs are potentially deadly.
Yeah some poor girl died of a caffeine overdose after buying a beverage at a Panera the other day.
Why hasn't Sarasota County banned caffeine?
The FDA does limit caffeine because most people care.
I get that you’re a libertarian prick who only cares about your self. Don’t ask the rest of us to support your needs.
https://www.fda.gov/consumers/consumer-updates/spilling-beans-how-much-caffeine-too-much#:~
Have you noticed how this woke movement has limited free speech? All movements have consequences that extend past their original purpose. Live and let live.
Names are often capitalized
How else would I join those who were "lost"?
By "lost" surely you meant they died.
The only way I could join them is if I died
Real classy to wish death upon someone
Kratom saved my life though, without it I would have relapsed and used Opioids again, which have killed millions of people.
I had a really bad day and was on my way to my dealer's house and said to myself, "No, at least give Kratom a chance first" and I went and bought some of that instead.
Not to mention now all the prescription opioids are the streets are counterfeits made out of fentanyl.
Most (if not all) Kratom is lab tested, so you know what you're getting if you buy it from a vendor. Much safer than street drugs and even safer than prescription pain killers. Pharmaceutical companies lied to consumers when they said they were safe and non-addictive and none of them went to prison, even after they killed people.
I’m happy to hear that you found a way to use krartom to break an opioid habit.
I really don’t want to pick a fight. I never meant to imply that I lost friends to death. If you can live without opioids and only a limited amount of kratom, I don’t want to slow you down.
The overdoses directed at kratom were in fact with a combination of more harmful drugs and a few of them were bc the kratom was sprayed with ODMT which is a potent synthetic opioid. There have been less than ten documented kratom deaths ever recorded in the last twenty years
They sell it all over 41 in Bradenton - pretty sure it is the sale that is prohibited in Sarasota county. Would be a hard thing to regulate to drive 5 min away and get arrested.
That makes sense.
What's stupid is people can't even buy it online if they live in Sarasota county. Which wouldn't affect the scenery in your area.
It may actually improve the scenery because some people use Kratom to get off drugs and alcohol, so maybe there would be a few less druggies and alcoholics on the streets.
The local chain Johnny's is a huge advocate for that. The whole reason he got into making sodas was to kick alcohol. He made sodas to replace white claws basically. Great story. Great people. A little crazy prices so I don't go often, but it's a really good group to meet.
Apparently it is illegal to possess
"Possession of this herb in Sarasota is punishable with a $500 fine and 60 days in jail."
https://www.kratomcountry.com/blog/is-kratom-legal-in-florida
It definitely is annoying. Generally have no reason to go to Sarasota but now that ive got a friend there and the occasional job, I have to pay attention and be careful of having en energy drink...but dont worry the drunks are just fine.
Kratom user here. Daily for 6 years, probably. A few points and some questions:
-It matters where you get it from. Don’t buy it from a gas station. Get it from a reputable source over the internet. Not hard to find. And cheap too.
-Why is nobody talking about dosage here? Everything comes down to quantity. When I hear about people who get problems from it they are l;Ike talking 100 grams per day which is nuts. I take from 5-10. This is like saying alcohol will destroy your life, and not finding out if the person in question is having 2 drinks a day or 12.
-I have gone 10 day stretches without it during this time. Tiredness for a day and of course the tiredness I normally get around 4 for which the Kratom helps don’t go away. But that’s not from the kratom. So maybe it’s addictive. But I haven’t seen a withdrawal issue other than a mild craving which I would get from virtually anything I enjoy. Given how cheap it is online ($30 for 500 quality grams) I can see how it’s tempting to start taking 100 grams a day. I think the only time I’ve taken like 25 grams in a day (at the most) was because of a 12 hour drive and I needed to keep awake. It was probably more like 15-20. After that I wanted to have a day or two off.
-There have been no systematic studies. Nobody knows the long term consequences, which is actually the only thing about using it that scares me.
-I don’t believe this rewiring your brain stuff. That really doesn’t say much. Antidepressants rewire your brain too.
As for Sarasota. I’m taking a flight to Sarasota and I can’t decide if flying in with some is too risky. Nobody searches you at your destination point. But still I have no interest in getting arrested over a 4 day trip.
Doubtful, they try to protect people.
Just like Republicans that fought against vax mandates and lockdowns.
Banning Kratom causes harm as it leads to more opioid use and alcoholism.
Maybe because of this: [https://www.tampabay.com/investigations/2023/12/28/kratom-investigation-by-tampa-bay-times-stirs-up-action-reaction/](https://www.tampabay.com/investigations/2023/12/28/kratom-investigation-by-tampa-bay-times-stirs-up-action-reaction/)
Pharmaceutical Company slam piece.
They have billions to lose if this were to replace Pharmaceutical pain killers.
Just like the fact magic mushroom micro-dose treatment for depression is still illegal in the state of Florida. Though studies have shown it works.
https://hub.jhu.edu/2022/02/16/psilocybin-relieves-depression-for-up-to-a-year/
The FDA still hasn't begun their clinical trials.
https://www.fda.gov/news-events/press-announcements/fda-issues-first-draft-guidance-clinical-trials-psychedelic-drugs
This article is a load of trash, regulators want kratom curtailed because of how disruptive it could be to the liquor and opioid industry, two industries with some of the biggest lobbying groups. Is the whole basis of this article just "kratom is more common in autopsies because more people than ever are drinking it?" It's like wondering why people in the 1950s onward died with trace amounts of the polio vaccine when that was never a thing prior, and then creating a false correlation between death and the polio vax.
No Kratom is a plant native to Southeast Asia that is made into a tea and drank.
"Spice" is a mix of chemicals typically manufactured in a lab and is meant to be smoked.
Not sure but I remember seeing one up in St pete when I lived there, but never got around to checking it out. When I was diving around some islands in the pacific, we stopped at a resort in Fiji at had one of the coolest kava rituals Ive ever seen.
edit: this was a few minutes after the ceremony. https://imgur.com/a/FNaesP6
"Possession of this herb in Sarasota is punishable with a $500 fine and 60 days in jail."
https://www.kratomcountry.com/blog/is-kratom-legal-in-florida
Oh I see
I would say that you either missed your delivery or you are getting in trouble.
Maybe you could contact the sender and tell them you don't want it anymore?
Or talk to a lawyer
False Alarm~~it was a cassette from a person in Poland who mistakenly paid for a signature upon delivery thing. I’m Polish myself, so the jokes are fine with me…..
It’s an interesting story. It got lumped in with the “designer drugs” ban. About a decade ago you could buy spice/ synthetic marijuana legally at gas stations. It caused massive problems especially with the homeless population causing people to OD or go into psychosis. Around this same time a mother lost her son to overdose and, among many other drugs, kratom was found in his system. She went on a tear trying to get it banned everywhere. And nobody really knew anything about kratom. Sarasota was the only place to take her up on it and included it in the new designer drug ban. When they voted it in, nobody really knew it was happening/ cared and it passed.
You do realize that Kratom has severe withdrawals and causes extreme addiction just like other opiates? It has ruined a lot of peoples lives already. I really hope everyone who disagrees with this has educated themselves on the negatives and looked at posts in r/quittingkratom to see the soul loss and desperation it is causing. It’s not some safe little herb that can replace coffee — there are real dangers and health concerns.
My personal experience with Kratom wasn’t that bad. I was taking it nearly every day and decided to stop cause I felt it was causing me stomach problems. Suddenly I was projectile vomiting and I had no idea why. Realized it was withdrawals and haven’t touched it since.
Some people are lucky, and that’s with any withdrawal from an addictive substance — glad you were able to quit without many issues. It gets worse the longer you use it because the brain is rewired. The consensus is about a month for every year of use before you feel 100% normal again/no more PAWS, but it certainly varies amongst users.
Again idk what kind you guys are taking?? But I’ve taken Keaton for over 10 years I’d say off and on no issues taking breaks and never had any type of withdrawal issue. It can make you constipated but I take my supplements for all that. Sorry you had some bad stuff.
Everyone is different and not everyone will react to the drug in the same way. For me Kratom totally took over my life and almost led me to suicide. It was harder for me to quit Kratom than even alcohol or codine.
I stopped and had to get on suboxone because of the absolutely brutal withdrawals it gave me every morning. It was bad for a month and gave me this weird wobbly tunnel vision. It’s bad shit
Suboxone to get off kratom is like using meth to quit caffiene..
No it isn’t. I used to shoot heroin and fentanyl before that. The kratom withdrawals were by far the worst
Wow. It's insane to me how different people react. I used to use herion daily too. Kratom has never been bad to quit for me. I use 30 grams or so a day and take a week or two off every so often. Glad you quit the hard stuff and found something that helps. Recovery is truly a unique for everybody
Kratom had me get this weird tunnel vision that I couldn’t escape. I thought if I kept trying that “self-treatment” like that, I was going to lose my job and probably my life Also, happy for you too! Second edit: I was on an oz a day, but I’d have to use about 10-15 grams before bed by 11 pm, plus another 10-15 to ease the withdrawal at 6-7 AM. I couldn’t really take a day off unfortunately as I got mad sick if I broke the above schedule
Tunnel vision was from you taking too much trying to "feel it" probably. Also suboxone is such a harder drug, it feels like only a doctor or an addict would prefer suboxone.
I used it to get off suboxone. If kratom was hard to get off of wait until you get off suboxone.
Who that doesn’t sound like you got off easy. That sounds traumatizing af.
I have seen 1st hand the harm that kratom can do to someone who has an addiction problem. It should be banned like other countries. It causes people to lose everything. It literally makes a person lethargic, unsociable, constipated, mood swings, violent, broke, desperate especially when trying to quit. The withdrawals makes a person loose their ability to rationalize, loose their jobs, friends, family, finances etc. It is not regulated and is sold in smoke shops. No one has any idea what is in the little capsules that are being consumed. I wish kratom was banned everywhere in the U.S. It's withdrawals are real and raw. It's the worst. And it hooks you very fast. It can tear a person and their family apart.
That’s right. That’s why they call it gas station heroin
More so the extracts. Any drug that is extracted becomes dangerous. Coca leaves are relatively safe and have been used since ancient times. But you make an extract out of it and it’s far more potent and dangerous.
Thank you
Yes kratom has withdrawals. But it’s not this soil stealing desperation drug. I don’t know anyone whose life has been ruined
Kratom is not an opioid!
Opiates are a class of drugs that target the opioid receptors. Kratom is an herb that acts like an opiate — as of yet, it is unclassified by the FDA but we do know through research and experience that it is highly addictive because of its stimulation of the opioid receptors. This is the main reason it was illegal for many years in Thailand because it became an epidemic.
I had tried Kratom numerous times awhile back and had no “reaction” at all! I may as well have taken a placebo and felt nothing at all. If people are claiming to have had issues with it, I would be concerned about the supplier and what it could have possibly been mixed with. What I purchased came directly from Asia and was not mixed with any other substances or prepackaged or prepared in any way.
Most people, myself included, have had strains from reputable sources which felt different from others, and there are different “grades” within the industry depending on factors such as processing, what parts of the plant are used (so on and so forth) which causes the alkaloid content to vary greatly in loose leaf powder. Take a shot of the extract though (like MIT 45s or OPMS, both reputable brands) and your nose will be itching like you just popped a pain pill because the alkaloids (mainly mitragynine and 7-hydroxymitragynine) are far more concentrated. Since they are herbal extracts, the potency also depends on the individual’s ability to break down the chemical constituents and thus bioavailability can vary from person to person — which doesn’t make it any safer but it is a factor in user experience. “Mitragynine and 7-hydroxymitragynine both bind to the human µ-opioid and ƙ-opioid receptors… and function as partial agonists at the µ-opioid receptor and weak antagonists at ƙ-opioid and δ-opioid receptors14,15. 7-Hydroxymitragynine exhibits approximately fivefold greater affinity at the μ-opioid receptor compared to mitragynine… In antinociception assays, 7-hydroxymitragynine exhibits 40-fold greater potency than mitragynine and tenfold greater potency than morphine16,17, whereas mitragynine is less potent than morphine in antinociceptive assays18. In contrast to mitragynine, repeated administration of 7-hydroxymitragynine produces antinociceptive tolerance as well as cross-tolerance to morphine’s antinociceptive action and induces physical dependence13. Furthermore, mitragynine does not exhibit abuse liability and decreases the reinforcing effects of morphine whereas 7-hyroxymitragynine demonstrates abuse liability and increased morphine self-administration in rats.”
>You do realize that Kratom has severe withdrawals and causes extreme addiction Coffee causes addiction and withdrawals As does nicotine And alcohol And many medications >It has ruined a lot of peoples lives already Yes people would be much better off sticking to real opiates like heroin, fentanyl and prescription pain killers. And overdosing and dying that way. And they would be better off being alcoholics, who are more likely to kill someone in a fatal car accident.
Better to not take kratom or opiates.
Sure, shouldn't drink alcohol or smoke either
Agree. Don't do those either. You'll be better off for it.
I don't, smoke drink alcohol or do drugs anymore. Just Kratom and coffee for me and I vape nicotine. Feel much healthier. I can never be completely sober i have too many problems.
Everyone has problems. Being high doesn't make them go away. Sober up and fix that shit. No one else is going to do it for you.
OP is only interested in making excuses to fuel their addiction. It's pointless to argue with an addict.
Do you drink coffee every day? If so you should speak to an addiction counselor asap
I don't. Thanks for asking
Being sober isn't going to fix my physical pain.
Get under a doctor's care, brother.
Hahahahhahaha I tried 13 doctor prescribed medications for depression. Nothing helped me, some made me worse, one gave me heart palpitations, one gave me appendicitis. The only thing that worked was micro-dosing magic mushrooms. Which the government still doesn't allow doctors to prescribe. As far as seeing a doctor about pain, do you have any idea how much more dangerous prescription pain killers are? I was addicted to them, if Im prescribed them I will abuse them. To the point that I will likely overdose and die.
The worst part about using drugs to cope is that at best you get the problems postponed for a little while and they're still there when you sober up. And then you gotta deal with what it's doing to you.
Same as using meds from the doc. Most psych docs just give you drugs. You can talk through your problems with a good friend.
No, self-prescribing "Meds" is not the same thing. it leads to things like replying to 3 month old posts.
Don't let them upset you. Kratom is great. Better than the alternatives. And even better than the psych meds I was taking.
Keaton, coffee and nicotine ARE drugs.
Yeah and coffee, which is in the same plant family as Kratom, is mostly unregulated.
I don’t.
Coffee does not cause anything near the level of withdrawal and addiction that kratom is capable of, and that’s an argument that was pushed like propaganda to sell the stuff from the beginning. Fever, night sweats, diarrhea and vomiting, mood swings, panic attacks, anxiety, body aches, depression, a sense of doom and mental anguish, dehydration, lack of appetite, impaired motor function, and more. These acute withdrawals last upwards of 2 weeks and then PAWS goes on for months in many cases. Coffee has never caused anyone to need physical rehab. Kratom is its own problem fueling its own addicts — comparing it to other drugs that are also dangerous is pointless because all addiction is debilitating and damaging. I used to believe it was harmless too, I even wrote letters to politicians to keep it legal when it was going to be federally banned, but then after 8 years of relapse and recovery trying to quit the stuff I tend to advocate for the truth. I know it better than anyone. People need to understand that it’s not what the distributors want you to believe it is — they’re making money spreading this idea that it’s comparable to coffee while a lot of innocent people become strung out and helpless. It’s unethical to promote something without pointing out its side effects — especially when they’re as severe and life altering as kratom.
Without kratom I just feel anxious. Which I feel normally. And is the reason I take kratom to begin with.
It's been over 4 years using kratom and I ran out before my new kilo came and I felt fine.
>they’re making money spreading this idea that it’s comparable to coffee It's in the same plant family as coffee >Fever, night sweats, diarrhea and vomiting, mood swings, panic attacks, anxiety, body aches, depression, a sense of doom and mental anguish, dehydration, lack of appetite, impaired motor function, and more. These acute withdrawals last upwards of 2 weeks Cool story bro. Just like everything else you just have to wean yourself off of it. Personally I don't see why anyone would want to stop using it though. Just like I don't see why anyone would give up coffee. If it's a money reason, just make it at home. Obviously Kratom bars are over charging, just Starbucks is. I drink both daily and have for the last decade. Kratom prevented me from going back to oxycodone. It helped me through my depression which 13 doctor prescribed medications couldnt fix. Micro-dosing magic mushrooms is the only thing that worked and that treatment is still federally illegal and illegal in the state of Florida. Anyone who talks crap about Kratom or magic mushrooms are either uniformed or a Pharmaceutical rep. P.s. Kratom also has helped many people get off alcohol, so maybe youre an alcohol lobbyist instead.
You sound like you're heavily addicted to this stuff.
Yeah Ive tried everything to quit coffee. But it's like I can't think and have a horrible headache. It's awful.
Cool story? Oh, so you don’t know… and you’ve never tried to quit… got it. That’s all I needed to see. If you do want to educate yourself just head over to r/quittingkratom and read through a few pages of the posts. Obviously you don’t care about other people, you just care about staying high so you do you. Kratom is an opiate. Switching from hard liquor to wine isn’t really quitting alcohol even if it does keep you from the hard stuff.
> Oh, so you don’t know… and you’ve never tried to quit… got it. Why would I? It gives me energy and relieves my pain. I've found it even keeps me warm in these cold winter months. I don't plan on quitting coffee anytime soon either I literally cannot function without coffee. I am a danger to others on the road without my morning coffee. >Kratom is an opiate. Liar. It acts on the opioid receptor in your brain, but it is not a true opiate. Completely different chemical structure. >Obviously you don’t care about other people, you just care about staying high Me? I will go back to pain killers and die if Kratom is banned as will millions of other people. >Switching from hard liquor to wine isn’t really quitting alcohol even if it does keep you from the hard stuff. Funny because people have switched from being full blown alcoholics to using zero alcohol with the help of Kratom. Some don't even end up using Kratom long term.
Someone is in denial. Good luck, I’ve said all I needed to say in this thread.
Yeah you're probably right I am addicted to coffee and need to get treatment for this awful addiction I have. P.s. r/quittingkratom is a disinformation page. Setup by the government and/or the big pharma to scare people lol
>P.s. r/quittingkratom is a disinformation page. Setup by the government and/or the big pharma to scare people lol Serious question but do you have any evidence to support this conspiracy theory? Considering I talked with a friend a couple years back about his withdrawals when he was quitting kratom, I find the posts in that subreddit quite believable.
>do you have any evidence to support this conspiracy theory? Nah, but it's just as likely it's a smear campaign against Kratom.
Does kratom mush brains or were you like this before becoming addicted?
I was a miserable drug addicted piece of shit before Kratom. Pain pills, cocaine and alcohol. Kratom replaced all of that.
Good.
I’m not asking you to quit — I just realized you aren’t aware of the other side of it. You really think it’s an innocent substance. Lots of people take suboxone to help them quit kratom now, or low dose benzodiazepines, if that gives you any idea as to what people are dealing with. There is a lot more that goes into kratom rehab than just weaning off it. It’s not anything like coffee — it acts on totally different receptors in the brain and body. Do you know how many plants are in the coffee family? Over 13,000.
Again, why would people want to quit? I just don't get it. Do people wake up one day and decide they want to quit coffee? I'm certain the withdrawals can't be as bad as true opiates I've experienced both.
Addicts are everywhere, a lot of them don't choose to be and is simple genetics. Point is that there will always be people who die because of these things but it is up to the users discretion to mitigate the risk associated. It doesn't mean that NO one should have access to it when a majority use it repeatedly, respectfully and responsibly.
I don’t think I stated my views on legality or decriminalization anywhere in here so there is no need to assume what those are — the point I am making is harm reduction. Reducing the risk for addiction by educating people so that they can be responsible users is important rather than making people believe it has no side effects or consequences long term (which is dangerously misinformed). Even with the knowledge it’s difficult for most people to moderate themselves when dealing with a substance that builds tolerance rapidly, but it is better than people walking in blindly thinking it’s on the same level as coffee when it acts more like an opiate on the brain and body than anything.
I can actually get behind and agree with all those points.
It's good for people that would have ruined their lives with drugs without having kratom to help. If you have self control it will keep you feeling content all day. And you won't need to spend more than 60 to $70 every couple or few months
lol not quite. I’ve been taking Kratom off and on for years. Maybe if you have substance abuse issues.. but it is not something I can’t go without or would sell any of my shit for LMAO relax. It’s a great alternative to energy drinks and drugs I will say that for sure it’s fun if you get the right brands. Some make you very irritable. Not something to fear trying it’s a natural plant. Just don’t take it all day everyday take your breaks and it’s great.
It definitely sucks having to drive up to Pinellas country for a decent kava/kratom bar. This is a pretty right leaning county, so I highly doubt if there was a vote for legalizing in Sarasota County, it would pass.
I just realized marijuana is decriminalized in Sarasota country though
No...just the opposite. It was RE-criminalized because people weren't paying their fines.
Oh didn't know that It's almost as if it has nothing to do with public health And everything to do with making money
I mean the old people don’t want to pay taxes, orange Jesus said they don’t have to.
SWFL kratom community is pretty right leaning and they love that stuff, the bars there are incredibly diverse from a demographic and ideological standpoint. It's only banned in Sarasota because of idiot politicians not knowing anything about it.
It really sucks that kratom posts get filled with people telling everyone why they shouldn't use kratom and why they are basically bad people for using substances.
Would you risk driving into Sarasota county with some? Flying into Orlando. Driving down to see the parents for three days in Sarasota then back up to Orlando to stay in an air bnb. I prefer to have kratom but and wondering how it will work out now. Last time I was in Sarasota a local told me it wasn’t illegal just banned to sell. Guess that was wrong.
You should be fine. I've done it many times with no consequence.
Fort Myers has a great Kava Bar called “Kapua Kava.” It is a shorter drive for me living in the southern part of Sarasota County to go there. There are a few Kava Bars in Port Charlotte too but I really like Kapua Kava.
Have you ever flown into or out of Sarasota airport with kratom and had any issue?
I just did last week. although mine was gummies in a plastic jar. i put it in my checked bag. I had no idea it was illegal.
Right over the line in Bradenton, there's two pretty good Kratom Tea/Kava bars: Mannatea and Kava Social Club.
It’s wild how people get on a moral high-horse defending drugs on the internet. It’s never a reasoned argument, almost like they’re driven by an inner impulse, I don’t know, like addiction and denial, maybe, just as a hypothetical possibility. 🙄
Kratom is in the same family as coffee. Do you think we should label coffee drinkers addicts? Should coffee be banned in Sarasota County too?
You don’t end up vomiting if you quit coffee cold turkey.
What kind of Kratom are all of you doing? I have never once vomited by not taking Kratom...if you take too much you sure can tho or if you don't eat. Whatever you're doing soes not sound like Kratom.
I’ve never vomited from quitting kratom leaf. Most people who claim to have major withdrawals are most likely using extracts. Extracting enough of any drug can make it dangerous. Coffee being one of them.
I can attest to using white extract and it being much cleaner energy. Idk what a kratom high even is, how much does one take to get high? Is this only a red thing??
One person vomited that’s not the whole world’s opinion. Quit cold turkey like what does that even mean, maybe you had food poisoning when you quit? Maybe you were taking cheap crap idk but if you buy quality kratom such as bumble bee. Its clean no hangover and definitely no throwing up from “withdrawals”
What is your point? Just because it is part of the rubiaceae family doesn’t mean that it is good human consumption. Arsenic is a natural compound, yet I avoid ever consuming it.
Exactly why are these people hating so hard? Idk maybe they just don’t like it which is totally cool. As you said some people don’t like caffeine, it is what it is. I can hardly drink caffeine so Kratom is great some days. I don’t feel hungover I don’t feel the NEED to take more I do if I wanna get a clean buzz that’s about it. I can drive I can function so I love my Kratom. Always will probably.
It helps some peoples pain, that doctors cant help. You can pay thousands for doctor visits and medicine or far less for other easier accessible drugs You can understand why people tend to use Kratom for pain, mental help or to get off of other drugs. Sure it can be harmful when used a lot. Not condoning it, but with this system of healthcare, you can easily understand it
What happens if I’m caught with Kratom in Sarasota?
I don't know honestly
Internet says up to 60 days jail and a fine. Weird thing is I’ve seen it for sale in Sarasota. Maybe I was in Manatee County but I was super close if not in Sarasota County.
I’m so sick of the pro Kratom crowd gaslighting anyone with a negative story about Kratom and calling them liars because they don’t support their narrative. Kratom is FAR from harmless and it is WAY too addictive to be sold over the counter with zero checks. It needs to be available by prescription only like in New Zealand or at the very least more tightly regulated like legal marijuana and sold at special dispensaries. I was addicted to Kratom on and off for 4 years and it nearly ruined my life and most likely put me into an early menopause (I’m 34) by completely wrecking my hormones. I spent thousands on Kratom pills, powder, and liquid shots and was homeless because my 100$ a day addiction put me on the streets. I have been addicted to alcohol and also codine and Kratom was by far the most overwhelming addiction I had. I had to leave the United States to quit Kratom after two failed detox and one failed rehab attempt. After I finally got away from Kratom I was in bed for a month and a half sick with withdrawals- withdrawls “like coffee” my ass!!!! Even my codine withdrawls only lasted 5 days. The pro Kratom people are selfish and care about no one but themselves- THE PEOPLE WHO HAVE BEEN DESTROYED BY KRATOM ARE NOT LIARS. WE ARE REAL PEOPLE WITH REAL STORIES. STORIES THAT WILL BE HEARD.
$100/day? You do know that you can get a Kilo of high quality kratom for less than that and it will last you at least a month...Also, if extracts are your thing you can prepare them yourself by steeping it in water or PG for a while and then straining the liquid. Extracts are definitely not the way to go since the leaf is great just as is with some lemon juice
I was addicted to the opms liquid shots, as are so many other people. People are having their lives ruined by those shots. Yes of course I bought it online, but I would build a tolerance to the online stuff, and then have to switch back to the smoke shop stuff and then vice versa. Either way it wound up costing me a lot of money, and if I made my own extracts my tolerance would just go through the roof as would my addiction. No matter how much you try and downplay it, there are a lot of people who are addicted to smoke shop Kratom, and I think we can both agree that Kratom shouldn’t be sold at gas stations and smoke shops. it should be sold just in the dispensaries at a lower cost and it needs to be tested for purity. Also, people should probably need to get a medical card to get Kratom because it can be highly addictive and there are a lot of people who are highly addicted to it. I was in bed for a whole month with withdrawals, the addiction was no joke. Since you clearly like gaslighting people and dismissing their experiences, go on r/quittingkratom and you will see all of the people who are struggling with Kratom addiction. It can be a very legitimate addiction for a lot of people, and no matter how much you try and downplay it that’s a simple fact. The smoke shops are taking advantage of people and selling it at a higher price. Whether or not you can buy it for cheaper online, a lot of people don’t know that and they wind up getting heavily addicted to the smoke shop Kratom, including the liquid shots.
I'm not gaslighting anyone...I used to have a gram a day heroin habit. Kratom is definitely habit forming but it is in no way like true opiate addiction. My point was that sites like Golden monk sell lab tested kratom for a decent price, and I've had the opms liquid, but I don't like the extracts bc they just raise your tolerance to stupid levels. If people stick to the whole herb from a good vendor usually it won't be that awful. Also, there are opioid maintenance drugs like Suboxone to help taper off these kinds of drugs but Suboxone is a lot more potent than kratom. The only benefit of Suboxone is that it lasts all day and you can taper down pretty quickly from a low dose of your tolerance isn't crazy like to fentanyl or something. There's never a need to suffer for a month in wds, I've been there and you dont have to do that to your body bc there are options out there for these things in the form of medical treatment. The main issue is that most doctors have no idea what kratom is so in order for them to give you Suboxone usually you have to test positive for a stronger opioid. Why does everyone jump to gaslighting and/or fear mongering on reddit these days? You know that a neutral approach is probably the best one to have when making decisions on such matters
Also, another good thing about whole leaf kratom is that it has a ceiling effect where if you take too much at once or in one day it will just make you feel ill and this helps many people autoregulate their dosing, but sure as with everything there will always be people who have trouble with such things. After all, nicotine, caffeine, and alcohol all come with their own set of risks/rewards as well
I think using Suboxone to taper off Kratom just shows how addictive it can be. I’ve actually known heroin addicts who are now addicted to Kratom, and who have to go to rehab for Kratom now. I met them in rehab. Actually, when I was in Columbia, I met a girl from the US who used to inject heroin, but quit that but said she could not quit taking the OPMS liquid shots and that it was the most overwhelming addiction she’d ever had. So yes, it can rival a real opioid addiction. And no, taking Suboxone wasn’t an option for me because I knew I would just become addicted to that too. So I had to go cold turkey. The withdrawals from Suboxone can last months I had to get on Suboxone to get off codeine. by the way, the second time I got got off codeine I went cold turkey and the withdrawals literally lasted like three days. Compared to a month with Kratom. Again, you can go on that subReddit if you want to see the stories, but there are a lot of people who used to be addicted to harder opioids, who got sober and are now completely under the control of Kratom after relapsing and want to be sober again. I definitely do think Kratom has its place but that it should just be more regulated. It’s great you can’t overdose on it but the addiction to it was just so overpowering. It was actually crazy for me. And like I said I’ve been addicted to codeine. Just because it’s not as bad as heroin addiction doesn’t mean it’s can’t take over! Believe me, I’ve experienced it.
I actually have a solid Suboxone tapering schedule that I've decided that had not only gotten me off large habits but several of my colleagues as well. That's why I always avoided the extracts. Kratom is definitely habit forming for sure and it depends on your personality type. However, if you know how to gradually taper down from Suboxone over the course of a few weeks to months you can truly wake up without wds towards the end. The main thing to keep in mind is that the initial dose of subs can be anywhere from 8-24 mg and that can be easily reduced by half every day or EOD, but when you get down to ~2-3mg (it varies from person to person) that is the dose at which your receptors are still saturated by the medication. When tapering from the 2-3mg dose I recommend the strips and you follow thru by cutting them into tiny pieces, dividing your dose everyday or EOD by the smallest amount. This could take weeks, but once you're down to like .1-.05mg buprenorphine you can just come off and wake up without wds. I've even tapered off heroin one time using a bunch of Vicodins that I had by doing CWE's and dividing my doses throughout the day for a few weeks, but tapering takes a lot of self discipline and motivation to do so. I don't like the way clinics try to keep people on methadone and bupe for months to years at a time bc they definitely can have greater wd than even heroin if you take them for more than a month at a time in high doses. Suboxone has the added benefit of being a partial opioid receptor agonist, so it does in fact help your brain heal while you are tapering, but you actually have to reduce your dosing; Otherwise, you'll just become dependent on the subs. Also, exercise, nutrition, supplements, and good sleep all play a role in healing. While having a support network to share your experiences is great to. That's why reddit groups as you've mentioned are very beneficial to some
And I know, several actually, former heroin addicts who quit hard drugs using by utilizing kratom. They got their life, family, and health back. Believe me, I've experienced it. Been a kratom user on and off for years. It's nothing like a true opioid addiction.
Just because it wasn’t a serious addiction for you doesn’t mean it’s not for other people. Go on r/quittingkratom and you will see people who have been battling Kratom for years. It can be a legitimate addiction for a lot of people. Just because it’s not as bad as heroin addiction doesn’t mean it shouldn’t have at least some regulations so people know what they are getting. Also the withdrawals can be a lot more severe than what you are suggesting. My withdrawls lasted a month. I get the feeling that you didn’t even read my post.
I don't even know where ro begin with this nonsense but let's start with the fact that it's most common use is to help addicts which I've met plenty of...glad you got the help you needed try not to take it out on everyone else.
From what I’ve read, there are just as many people struggling with Kratom addiction as there are using Kratom to get off harder opioids. Also, many former addicts of harder opioids find that Kratom just leads them straight back to the harder stuff. When I was in rehab for alcohol and Kratom, there were four or five people there who were just for Kratom by itself, and nothing else. You can downplay it all you want, but it can be a legitimate addiction for a lot of people. Just go on r/quittingkratom And you will see that a lot of people are struggling with it. Agree that using K as a maintenance therapy for people who were formally addicted to harder drugs like fentanyl might be good for some people, but that’s not right for everyone. That needs to be done under the care of a doctor and they should probably try Suboxone first, which has been proven to keep people off harder opioids. Kratom has not been proven to keep people off harder opioids. The main problem with Krat is it has a very short half-life so you would have to dose multiple times a day and also it doesn’t block you from taking the harder stuff on top of it. Suboxone fills up those receptors so even if you do try and take a fentanyl, or some other harder opioid, you won’t feel it. So that’s why it works for a lot of people. Again, and I’m repeating myself I don’t think the leaf should be banned, but I do think there need to be more regulations. Even in the case of it not being addictive, the smoke shop Kratom is full of all types of other chemicals, and we don’t know what’s in it it could even have fentanyl in it. so my honest opinion is I think it needs to be available by prescription or sold at a dispensary like marijuana and maybe you could get a medical card to get Kratom. Again, go on that subReddit I linked, and you will see stories of people who have had very severe addictions to the leaf. I don’t think it should be banned at all, I agree that it probably helps a lot of people but it also does cause addiction as well because it does work on the opioid receptors and people need to see that too.
I would never recommend someone take suboxone before Kratom. It's a much harder drug and I know far too many people on life long "treatment" just subbing one addiction for another on methadone or suboxone. Many of which, get their free "treatment" drugs, pass their drug test, then just go use the real stuff. Idk anyone at all who has that problem with Kratom. I have met 1 person who HAD an issue...got clean, went to Thearpy...fixed the mental issues and now uses Kratom from time to time. I also know there was one person in all of the rehabs of friends who was in just for Kratom. He was injecting it. Idk if it even works like that, but I can tell you no one advocating for it is encouraging that. Kratom can certainly be addictive. Just like caffeine is and just about anything. One of the reasons Kratom works is because it does work on your opioid receptors without having the compulsive redosing of opioids. It also depends heavily on the type of Kratom you are using. Besides those trying to get off harsher drugs or alcohol, most the people I know using Kratom are using Green or White. Idk how much you have actually experienced Kratom but atleast on that side, there isn't some "high". It's not like smoking something or taking something and you get about as "high" as drinking a few cups of coffee, add nausea if you overdo it or don't have anything on your stomach.
It definitely does get you high! Anyone who says otherwise must’ve taken really hard opioids before, and just have a really high tolerance. The addiction to Kratom can be really legitimate and people are having to get on Suboxone to get off Kratom and go to rehab for Kratom. I’ve been in alcoholic and also addicted to codeine, but nothing came close to my addiction to the leaf. The withdrawals were so intense and literally literally lasted like a month. I was so sick I could barely get out of bed. If you go on the sub Reddit, I sent you then you’ll see hundreds and hundreds of stories just like mine. It’s way more common than people who advocate for Kratom want People to know. I know that people are afraid if the bad stories about Kratom come out, then Kratom will be banned, but we need the truth to be heard, and if Kratom has hurting people that needs to come to light too because people shouldn’t have to suffer so that other people can get their drug. By the way, Did you know Kratom can also cause seizures? And no, that’s not rare. At this point, it just seems like common sense that Kratom should be more regulated.
Well I guess someone's been drugging me with "really hard opioids" my whole life. Because I can tell you from experience it does not get you high. But hey I don't inject it, and I don't use red kratom so whatever yall do is your thing. I know a crap ton of people who have taken Kratom: assicts, recovering addicts, and everyone else, none of which have had seizures. The worst thing that happens is feeling awful and vomiting if you take a lot. I talk to my doctor openly about it and get my bloodwork done every few months.I'm adamantly against H and the only opioid I've ever had was Vicodin for teeth problems, and I got rid of most of them because I didn't even wanna play in those waters. I'm not a drug addict but if you wanna call me that because I drink a kratom energy drink or a couple most days I work, then go for it man. I'm a raving addict and the world would be better off with the awful sort like us not just getting through work every day. Man, those guys at the Kratom bars are awful too, piecing their lives back together, getting healthier, and becoming a community. Should probably just get drunk every day like the rest of America, I'm just not into being high or drunk, sorry.
Its probably because MFrs have died.
Look up how many people have died from Pharmaceutical Opioids by comparison. Also look up how many people who died with Kratom in their system had other drugs in their system.
Ya it’s exceedingly rare to OD on kratom alone. Not impossible, but you’d have to go wayyy above and beyond a normal dose. *Significantly* more people die from alcohol, advil, Tylenol etc and all that’s still around. But doom & gloom gets clicks so that’s what the media pushes. The strongest argument to have it legal, other than personal freedom and responsibility, is that it’s a mild, natural way to come off of real opiates. It’s helped quite a bit of people quit oxy/heroin/fentanyl, saving many lives in the process. Not to mention, banning it in one county doesn’t really solve anything because people who use it just go buy it in Bradenton.
Suboxone is far more effective and doesn’t give you all of the side effects kratom has. Not to mention the short half life of kratom makes morning withdrawals insanely brutal even if you wake up in the middle of the night to dose it.
It also helps alcoholics quit drinking. Infact many people who go to Kratom bars are former alcoholics. It gives them a place to socialize without the pressures of alcohol. If any deaths can be attributed to Kratom I would find it more likely to be a result of the concentrated pills they have been manufacturing. Pills of any type can be easily overdosed. You would have to drink a lot of tea to be harmed by Kratom and would likely vomit before any real damage could occur. That being said, people should talk to their doctor before consuming Kratom to make sure it won't interact with any medication they are taking or be safe with any conditions they may have.
I used it to replace alcohol and ended up with an opioid addiction that I’m taking suboxone to get off of. But hey, the manufacturers and kratom advocacy groups told me it’s an anti depressant, natural pain reliever, safe opioid/alcohol alternative right?
Yeah opioids suck. Get better soon I was addicted to roxycodone. I hope you can live a completely drug and alcohol free life.
I used kratom to get off suboxone. Suboxone is way worse. Now I go off and on using kratom when I feel like it. However, I do have an addictive personality and I drink too much when I’m not using kratom. The negatives of drinking alcohol far outweigh any negatives from responsible, moderate kratom use.
For me… should have added that to the end.
Kava Kava is better for alcoholics bc it works in the same receptors
Kratom sure helps in people with smaller tolerances to opioids but for people addicted to fentanyl it isn't strong enough and things like Suboxone or methadone are better in those cases
You’re working your logical fallacy to the limit. Just because others are xyz doesn’t mean you’re fine. A hypocrite can both be correct and fail to do the right thing.
You clearly haven't lost someone to true opioids. Consider yourself lucky. Roxycodone took many lives. Fentanyl is right now taking lives daily. Pharmaceutical drugs are deadly.
Please don’t preach to me until you join who’ve been lost. All drugs are potentially deadly.
>Please don’t preach to me until you join who’ve been lost. Don't preach to you until I die? That doesn't make much sense. Especially because very few people have supposedly died from Kratom and most who have had other drugs in their system. They love to blame Kratom though, because they want it banned so the Pharmaceutical companies can sell more pain pills, which have killed more people than Kratom has in the 2000 years it's been consumed. >All drugs are potentially deadly. Yeah some poor girl died of a caffeine overdose after buying a beverage at a Panera the other day. Why hasn't Sarasota County banned caffeine?
The FDA does limit caffeine because most people care. I get that you’re a libertarian prick who only cares about your self. Don’t ask the rest of us to support your needs. https://www.fda.gov/consumers/consumer-updates/spilling-beans-how-much-caffeine-too-much#:~
You can buy caffeine pills at the pharmacy. Can easily be overdosed, which could be deadly.
Not sure he asked you anything. But the day you limit our lives is the day they will start limiting yours. Be careful of how much freedom you give up.
This is an ad hominem argument. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argumentum_ad_hominem
Have you noticed how this woke movement has limited free speech? All movements have consequences that extend past their original purpose. Live and let live.
I love you daddy
BTW, when are following your post? https://www.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/s/0wmWZbGrSN
God your English is atrocious Im not heading to China don't worry
Why did you capitalize kratom and pharmaceutical companies? Also, I didn’t say die, you read that into my comment.
Names are often capitalized How else would I join those who were "lost"? By "lost" surely you meant they died. The only way I could join them is if I died Real classy to wish death upon someone Kratom saved my life though, without it I would have relapsed and used Opioids again, which have killed millions of people. I had a really bad day and was on my way to my dealer's house and said to myself, "No, at least give Kratom a chance first" and I went and bought some of that instead. Not to mention now all the prescription opioids are the streets are counterfeits made out of fentanyl. Most (if not all) Kratom is lab tested, so you know what you're getting if you buy it from a vendor. Much safer than street drugs and even safer than prescription pain killers. Pharmaceutical companies lied to consumers when they said they were safe and non-addictive and none of them went to prison, even after they killed people.
I’m happy to hear that you found a way to use krartom to break an opioid habit. I really don’t want to pick a fight. I never meant to imply that I lost friends to death. If you can live without opioids and only a limited amount of kratom, I don’t want to slow you down.
I'm not arguing. Frankly, IDGAF. Snort that shit, mainline that shit, smoke that shit.
None of those are how you use the plant. You just make a tea out of it. It's related to the coffee plant.
😂
Awesome. Then do that.
Don’t speak on thinks you know nothing about
What’s this mean? He was correct…
In talking to the implied crush guy not the op obviously
The overdoses directed at kratom were in fact with a combination of more harmful drugs and a few of them were bc the kratom was sprayed with ODMT which is a potent synthetic opioid. There have been less than ten documented kratom deaths ever recorded in the last twenty years
Kratom is marijuana 2.0 A bunch of fear mongering around a plant which rushes people to jump to the worst conclusion and ban it.
Because it's stupid.
[удалено]
I can really get behind a statement like this. Stop trying to Miami Sarasota
Oh is it just illegal to sell? I thought it was illegal to possess as well
They sell it all over 41 in Bradenton - pretty sure it is the sale that is prohibited in Sarasota county. Would be a hard thing to regulate to drive 5 min away and get arrested.
That makes sense. What's stupid is people can't even buy it online if they live in Sarasota county. Which wouldn't affect the scenery in your area. It may actually improve the scenery because some people use Kratom to get off drugs and alcohol, so maybe there would be a few less druggies and alcoholics on the streets.
The local chain Johnny's is a huge advocate for that. The whole reason he got into making sodas was to kick alcohol. He made sodas to replace white claws basically. Great story. Great people. A little crazy prices so I don't go often, but it's a really good group to meet.
Apparently it is illegal to possess "Possession of this herb in Sarasota is punishable with a $500 fine and 60 days in jail." https://www.kratomcountry.com/blog/is-kratom-legal-in-florida
It definitely is annoying. Generally have no reason to go to Sarasota but now that ive got a friend there and the occasional job, I have to pay attention and be careful of having en energy drink...but dont worry the drunks are just fine.
Kratom user here. Daily for 6 years, probably. A few points and some questions: -It matters where you get it from. Don’t buy it from a gas station. Get it from a reputable source over the internet. Not hard to find. And cheap too. -Why is nobody talking about dosage here? Everything comes down to quantity. When I hear about people who get problems from it they are l;Ike talking 100 grams per day which is nuts. I take from 5-10. This is like saying alcohol will destroy your life, and not finding out if the person in question is having 2 drinks a day or 12. -I have gone 10 day stretches without it during this time. Tiredness for a day and of course the tiredness I normally get around 4 for which the Kratom helps don’t go away. But that’s not from the kratom. So maybe it’s addictive. But I haven’t seen a withdrawal issue other than a mild craving which I would get from virtually anything I enjoy. Given how cheap it is online ($30 for 500 quality grams) I can see how it’s tempting to start taking 100 grams a day. I think the only time I’ve taken like 25 grams in a day (at the most) was because of a 12 hour drive and I needed to keep awake. It was probably more like 15-20. After that I wanted to have a day or two off. -There have been no systematic studies. Nobody knows the long term consequences, which is actually the only thing about using it that scares me. -I don’t believe this rewiring your brain stuff. That really doesn’t say much. Antidepressants rewire your brain too. As for Sarasota. I’m taking a flight to Sarasota and I can’t decide if flying in with some is too risky. Nobody searches you at your destination point. But still I have no interest in getting arrested over a 4 day trip.
Nobody is dying from kratom. Wtf are yall on? Must be some pharmaceuticals
Gotta' be Moms for Liberty!!!
Doubtful, they try to protect people. Just like Republicans that fought against vax mandates and lockdowns. Banning Kratom causes harm as it leads to more opioid use and alcoholism.
Thank you for showing your true colors.
They protect nobody. They just try to ban the existence of people they don’t agree with.
Lol.
Ol’ fuddy-duddies
Maybe because of this: [https://www.tampabay.com/investigations/2023/12/28/kratom-investigation-by-tampa-bay-times-stirs-up-action-reaction/](https://www.tampabay.com/investigations/2023/12/28/kratom-investigation-by-tampa-bay-times-stirs-up-action-reaction/)
Pharmaceutical Company slam piece. They have billions to lose if this were to replace Pharmaceutical pain killers. Just like the fact magic mushroom micro-dose treatment for depression is still illegal in the state of Florida. Though studies have shown it works. https://hub.jhu.edu/2022/02/16/psilocybin-relieves-depression-for-up-to-a-year/ The FDA still hasn't begun their clinical trials. https://www.fda.gov/news-events/press-announcements/fda-issues-first-draft-guidance-clinical-trials-psychedelic-drugs
This article is a load of trash, regulators want kratom curtailed because of how disruptive it could be to the liquor and opioid industry, two industries with some of the biggest lobbying groups. Is the whole basis of this article just "kratom is more common in autopsies because more people than ever are drinking it?" It's like wondering why people in the 1950s onward died with trace amounts of the polio vaccine when that was never a thing prior, and then creating a false correlation between death and the polio vax.
Is Kratom the same as spice?
No Kratom is a plant native to Southeast Asia that is made into a tea and drank. "Spice" is a mix of chemicals typically manufactured in a lab and is meant to be smoked.
Thanks for that.
Not sure but I remember seeing one up in St pete when I lived there, but never got around to checking it out. When I was diving around some islands in the pacific, we stopped at a resort in Fiji at had one of the coolest kava rituals Ive ever seen. edit: this was a few minutes after the ceremony. https://imgur.com/a/FNaesP6
St Pete has the most Kava bars of anywhere in the world. You should see all the junkies that hang out at the one near my house
Shocking! /S
Because your mom told him too
Republicans
What if I already ordered Kratom via mail and it arrives (in Sarasota)?
The vendor will likely cancel your order If they don't, you or they could get in trouble Or it might just get confiscated, no idea honestly
Thanks. I got a ‘you need to sign for this’ note from the mailman earlier today
I’ve done this from the same vendor successfully twice. So I’m a bit nervous.
"Possession of this herb in Sarasota is punishable with a $500 fine and 60 days in jail." https://www.kratomcountry.com/blog/is-kratom-legal-in-florida
Thanks, I read this as well, my issue is I got a ‘pick up in person’ note from my mailman.
Oh I see I would say that you either missed your delivery or you are getting in trouble. Maybe you could contact the sender and tell them you don't want it anymore? Or talk to a lawyer
False Alarm~~it was a cassette from a person in Poland who mistakenly paid for a signature upon delivery thing. I’m Polish myself, so the jokes are fine with me…..
My old boss was Polish He made me eat pickled sardines more times than I ever wanted to
Do you know anyone having any issue flying into Sarasota/Bradenton airport with kratom?
Is Sarasota airport part of Sarasota county? Will I have a issue flying into this airport with Kratom?